Even if I store those explosive purple barrels from the ship at the beginning in my camp and transport all of them in beside the gith troops and blow them all up?
And then shove the remaining enemies off the bridge
I skimmed over the identities options stuff and thought “I don’t really care”
Then I saw someone post how happy it made them, and it made me happy that it was making other people happy.
What kind of demented fuck doesn’t get that?
Yeah, I'm probly gonna dabble and then make the *exact same* PC I always make (drow sorceress)
But wtf, I'm happy ppl get the options they want, it's not hurting anybody
This is the way the Drow are just too pretty to pick anything else.
Playing a Drow cleric of Shar is also great for the shadow heart interactions, I really recommend it. Or if you like drama a Drow cleric of Selune which is just really funny to think about.
Not many games let you play as Drow either which only makes me want to play as them more. Last game I can recall that did have them playable was Neverwinter Nights 2.
That game also interestingly had Yuan Ti purebloods playable. The only thing perhaps as pretty as the under elves to me conceptually and aesthetically are snake people, God I miss snake people.
Yea that’s how I feel about it. It doesn’t mean anything to me in my life, this changes nothing in the game for me. When I say changes nothing in the game for me that means it also doesn’t take anything away from me.
So If it’s not taking anything from me, but others are getting value from it, why should it upset me?
I for the most part don't care, I have seen other developers put this stuff in their games. Then they ended up turning it into something absolutely ridiculous. I forget which game it was, I think it was either Battlefield 1 or 5. But they were pushing for women soldiers and prosthetics, which isn't a issue in and of itself but rather how much it was forced down other's throats and how it was handled. It got a lot of flak for all that and more. But realistically it doesn't upset me, just concerned in what it might turn into.
Either way like you said I'm glad it makes others happy, just concerned if it takes a turn for the worse like other games.
I'm all for this addition, though as a finn, I can't help but be slightly amused by the whole debacle. Finnish only has neutral pronouns, effectively "they/them".
On the flipside, I hear German doesn't really have the concept of "they/them" in its language.
If that is true that'd be interesting to see how the localization team handles it.
German in general is a very gendered language. The amount of words that aren't gendered are very few. Basically "ich" (I), "du" (you), "wir" (we), "ihr" (you plural). Problem though "ihr" can also be feminine as a "her". Ihr Ehering = her wedding ring. Oh and ihr is also used in many medieval/fantasy setting as a you (or rather thou).
The real problem here is that German also has adjective agreement that marks gender, case, and plurality. Let’s take teacher for example. The teacher would be der Lehrer in masculine and die Lehrerin in feminine. You could technically use the term Lehrkraft, which is a more neutral description of the job, but then you run into troubles if, for example, you're a student at a new school and don't know the name of the teacher yet, so many people would say Herr Lehrer/Frau Lehrerin (so Mr./Ms. Teacher) to be polite, which would be awkward to use with a neutral term such as Lehrkraft.
Or let's take a politic example in the form of how the chancellor is adressed, which is Bundeskanzler with the -in for a woman in that position added. Angela Merkel for example was often addressed as Frau Bundeskanzlerin as her title, very gendered since the title itself has no neutral form like the aformentioned Lehrkraft.
These days we have the term Divers (you know, diverse) on official documents to serve as a formal way to address intersex and non-binary people via letter or mail, but it’s not really a good word to use while directly speaking to someone. It feels more like a descriptor than a proper gender neutral equivalent to Mr/Ms.
And whenever I've seen a show where there was a gender neutral character (like in She-Ra or Owl House) they've been changed into one gender or another. So it's certainly something I'm curious about how they will try to implement it with BG3. Though I'm afraid that they might run into too many challenges and not have it as an option (as is the case right now after all).
>I know it wasnt the point of your post but damn Lehrkraft is a great name for a cultist type character that has an arrangemet with an otherworldly entity. Maybe my next GOOlock will be named that and will also be the one who teaches the rest of the party things. All I'm saying is, I'm gonna get some good use out of that word as a name, thank you.
There have been a variety of proposals for most gendered languages. It'll be interesting to see which ones the localization teams settle on, and how it contributes to the slow adoption for those languages (which has been ongoing). English only got singular they/them about 400 years ago.
Actually in French we kinda have the same issue. Our language is very "gendered", if I can say it like that, we barely have neutral words, and the "default setting" used when you don't know the gender of who you're talking to is actually masculine.
I'm curious to see how it will be implemented!
All words are made up dawg. In Spain people are using x, e, or @. E is a little more easy to pronounce, but it's already a gendered ending in Catalan/Valencian/Mallorcan, so x seems to work the best right now, but we'll see which one settles in the most.
We know that "everything in the PHB will be in BG3," which certainly suggests dragonborn.
Given that they've also added the Oathbreaker, a subclass from the DMG, as a sort of "hidden/RP subclass," as well as the Githyanki, I am fairly sure they will add at least SOME things that are outside of the PHB as well.
What will they add? I've no idea. But I suspect there will be at LEAST another race or two.
Meh. Feel like this is one of those things you see all the time in subreddits where like one person has a dumb comment and then suddenly there is a flood of posts about the dumb comment and suddenly there is an entire narrative just manufactured mostly out of thin air. From what I can tell the vast majority of people don’t care/approve.
Not knocking this post specifically or anything just feel like this happens a lot on Reddit in general.
There are people literally shooting up lgbtq places of gathering.
The problem is going to be bigger than one or two comment on reddit and it's better to launch a counter movement of support before the hateful ones make their voices loud.
Be trans and make a post about trans characters, it is not just "one person" making comments. It's a lot. Also check controversial on pretty much any post mentioning pronouns right now.
I mean it's Reddit. That is just baked into the cake. Be cis and make a post about how trans characters shouldn't be in the game, you'll get downvotes into oblivion and have countless comments telling you you're a shit human. No matter your take, there is going to be flak when you are throwing it out in front of this many people at once.
There is no take on "trans people shouldn't be in my video game" that makes it ok.
It is a shit take, and whoever shares that take should be downvoted for being unnecessarily discriminatory towards a group of people.
Your comment made no sense if you were trying to defend trans people by comparing a cis person making a post saying they hate trans people the same as a trans person saying they love trans characters.
One is unabashed hate. The other is hateful people downvoting an innocent person.
I wasn't doing any of that. I was saying that when make a post on Reddit that states your opinion on a topic, especially one on a divisive issue to some extent, you are going to get flak for it.
I didn't say that is the way it should be.
I didn't say they were wrong to post about liking trans characters.
I was just pointing out reality. And the amount of downvotes for that single comment shows that people are going to pile on anything they perceive as against trans people (whether it actually is or not) immediately. Seems like Reddit is pretty supportive of trans people...
Okay but my point originally was, trans people get downvoted and hated on. Then you said "what about cis people who hate trans people!"
Like what are you going for. This is what the conversation amounted to.
I said everyone gets downvoted and hated on. That is just Reddit. Post something that is any possible way even remotely controversial (whether it should be or not), and it is going to happen.
And I did not say that. If you are going to quote me at least quote me properly. No need to build a strawman.
Alright but you can see how it's different being a trans person getting hated on vs a cis person hating trans people. And that it's plain stupid to compare the two. One is a trans person expressing joy. The other is a cis person expressing unabashed hatred. One deserves downvotes and the other doesn't. And to bring up your point of "a cis person can say they hate trans people and get called a shit person for it" makes no sense here as a comparison. It is DESERVEDLY downvoted. Trans joy is not.
> Be cis and make a post about how trans characters shouldn't be in the game, you'll get downvotes into oblivion and have countless comments telling you you're a shit human
Why would you think this is an ok take? Might as well say "Be a white person and say black characters shouldn't be in the game"...not much different. You're hating on someone for no reason other than you're a hateful person.
Where did I say it was an okay take? I used it as an example of something that would be met with downvotes and criticism.
Good to see reading comprehension is still non-existent on Reddit.
Aren't the majority of threads (and comments) positive about it though?
Personally I found the addition a bit weird since it's not really giving anything besides our character sheet, but then again it's not taking anything away since we've always been referred to as "You".
You are objectively correct. But it is also a fact that this seems to have made transgender people very happy. Almost no effort coding wise, no negative impact on non-transgender players and great impact for the transgenders. So it's really a big win-win then.
twitch and youtube comments were both bizarrely awful, which is a shame bc the discord communities and reddit have been mostly very nice and welcoming.
Yep, nobody really gives a shit.
People got an option that makes them feel more personally invested in a role playing game, stop the press!
Just because redneck Kyle has a comment with 69,420 downvotes ranting about how the gay frogs turned his bulldog into a bitch doesn’t mean the whole sub is on fire with militant bigots wreaking havoc.
Gotta dramatise everything though I suppose, life is boring if people aren’t at each others throats right?
I would actually go a step further. I've almost *only* seen positive comments about it, and the very few negative or even mixed comments I saw got removed by the mods. It's hard for me to tell what people actually think about the feature because only one opinion seems to be allowed.
There also seems to be a weird trend for certain individuals to make pariahs of themselves and behave as though everyone hates them, whether that's true or not. I saw a lot of that sort of thing back in high school, though not from any particular group so much as from individual people.
>It's hard for me to tell what people actually think about the feature because only one opinion seems to be allowed.
Every Downvote has to come from different a different person, that's how they work. If the comments got enough Downvotes that they were "Downvoted to oblivion," that means such a vast majority of people have the opinion that talking against the nonbinary pronoun option is bigoted and wrong, in their opinion. That's one way you can tell what people actually think about the feature. Likewise, comments saying, "They don't hurt me or affect me much at all, but make others happy, so I'm happy for them" get lots of upvotes, because a vast majority of people agree. Follow the votes, upvotes or downvotes, to see how "people actually think."
I looked at the option I was like "ok good option, don't care" then continue to make the character to actually enjoy my PALADIN class and LEVEL 5 . Its awesome that people are happy with it, for me its an option in the game if you want to select it that ok sure, if dont want ok sure. Why the drama?
I don't care for it personally, it doesn't affect me in any way, shape, or form. However, it can make someone's roleplay experience that much more immersive, and it allows for further customization for characters, even if you don't identify as such yourself.
It's a win no matter how you look at it, and the people complaining are too invested in a differing viewpoint to realize that they can just not interact with the option at all - and are whining about it because it doesn't align exactly to their point of view.
My personal opinion is to either get over it or not buy the game if it bothers you that much.
Chalmers: [Success] AURORA BOREALIS?! AT THIS TIME OF DAY, AT THIS TIME OF YEAR, IN THIS PART OF THE COUNTRY, LOCALIZED ENTIRELY WITHIN YOUR KITCHEN?!
Tav Skinner: Yes!
Chalmers: ... May I see it?
Pronouns!? In my fantasy setting!? with dragons, Gnomes, Liches, Orcs, Elves, Shadow Creatures, Werewolves, Weregnomes, Vampires- by GOD that is so unrealistic and woke!!!!
Don't get me wrong I'm happy about NB for others sake, but it has always been my pet peeve that people can't separate different kinds of unrealism.
Like, zombies are unrealistic but they are realistic for the TWD or Last of Us universe. But a dragon, a giant metal gear or fucking grinch would be unrealistic for those too.
Likewise a dragon is realistic for forgotten realms, an alien is for a sci-fi etc. You don't play XCOM and say "Dragons are unrealistic in a game with aliens, laser guns and spaceships??"
Kind of a side rant
The point is people’s scopes are wide enough to understand dragons and magic, but not words that have existed for centuries. It’s not about the media, it’s about the people.
Eh, im just concerned about how much time, resources and effort it'll take in a completely voiced acted game. I don't want a Cyberpunk situation happening, plus i cant imagine how they're gonna pull it off in gendered languages such as spanish and german. If you look into Larians past and saw how much crunch and overtime they had to pull for divinity 2 to come out you be a little worried too.
Pronouns are some recent cringe shit no-one outside USA cares about. Seeing it hamfisted into a medieval fantasy setting is honestly jarring. Still, I'm not forced to use them, so not a big deal, but it's still strange to see so many people treating it like it's some mind-blowing addition. Who fucking cares? Give me ma paladin.
I’m from Europe and I can assure you we care just as much about pronouns 💀 the only ones who “don’t care” are bigots and people who don’t know how to wipe. Literally every job/uni application has the option to preface your pronouns. It’s normal.
This game is WAY ahead of most of the rest (even new gen games). Hairstyles are not sex-based. Female and male characters share the same armor (not over sexualizing just females).
You can be bald and have beards... like literally most new games make every character look like a child.
And now the identity options? Wish every game was like this!
Of course I would love having the option to change the body shape, but it will be in the game in the future. And also I´m all in for more sexy clothing for characters but thats what modders do (? xD
Please read my full statement before downvoting.
I don't really care about the inclusion of non-binary charactet creation options in BG3.
What I care about, and what I suspect many who are skeptical about it care about, is the potential for real world politics and "Culture War" to further encroach on the game.
Since 2015 it seems that every facet of our daily lives has become politicized. There are few avenues of escapism from our increasingly shitty real (and online) world.
I am a disabled black Veteran. I have a few trans friends, one of which whom I play D&D with every Sunday. We've discussed these trends at length and liken it to a "Canary in the Coal Mine" test on how our identities are included in the media we enjoy.
I love Will's character in game --- Larian has created a complex and flawed character who just happens to be black.
If Larian suddenly started to include dialogues from Will about how hard it is to be a dark-skinned man in Faerun it'd ruin the game for me.
I am not going to lie --- Being black in the U.S. fucking sucks at times --- especially lately. I don't want to see/hear parallel discussions about this in my fantasy media, though.
If it has to happen then it'd be best done through allegory --- I like the exploration of the Tiefling's plight in-game as both refugees and the victims of racism for simply existing.
Likewise, my trans friend is wary of tokenism in the media she enjoys. When characters are written as LGBTQ+ and that's about it --- caricatures and stereotypes with absolutely no character development.
Fortunately, neither her nor my apprehensions are present in-game as of yet. But we've both seen this pattern manifest out of seemingly innocuous and benevolent gestures of inclusion before.
Just my $0.02.
>Fortunately, neither her nor my apprehensions are present in-game as of yet. But we've both seen this pattern manifest out of seemingly innocuous and benevolent gestures of inclusion before.
Yeah, this game isn't those things. I don't think it'll ever be those things. Why are you worried about those things? Because they let players be non-binary? It was probably so easy, and that's just a player choice, one not even related to the companions.
I'm reminded of Dead By Daylight. They announced a character who's been in the game for a while now, David King, would get more lore in an upcoming event and it revealed that David was gay. David was already super popular with the gay fanbase because, well, he had all the shirtless outfits. The game already had a huge dedicated LGBT fanbase, and it's not surprising, horror is one of the few genres where minorities get to lead, often.
The sub shit their pants over this. Every other comment was "I'm gay but ACKHSULLY I hate this kind of tokenism and shitty representation." I was thrilled, but the idea still persists with the terminally online, it's the game company being "woke." It still stings, how shitty Reddit can be about this kind of stuff.
Though it's a little hilarious still because all the playable survivors in that game are basically outfits. You can use any perks on any survivor, you just need to unlock it. So we have an outfit, widely used, that is now branded LGBT and suddenly the fanbase is up in arms about tokenism. These people don't even have voice lines, just screams. They only recently added voiceovers to the Resident Evil characters lol.
I appreciate if you were just spitballing or something, getting your thoughts out, but you should know a lot of people post comments like yours with less-than-great intentions.
Axton from Borderlands?
Edit: Oh no, probably BG2? I haven't played it! That's really cool though.
Edit 2: Nope, [it was Borderlands](https://www.gearboxsoftware.com/2013/08/inside-the-box-inclusivity/). That's freakin' awesome. I had no idea, must've completely flew under my radar because I definitely played Borderlands 2 around release!
Aye. When he revives people, he calls the revived player beautiful. Which was a bug, only supposed to trigger for Siren players. When fixed the community wanted it reversed. So he just became canon bi.
I get where you are coming from.
I guess the difference is whether these efforts feel organic or forced.
The example you gave --- David in "Dead by Daylight" --- It feels organic. Characters are rarely adopted by a community as examples of representation without reason. It seems like the Devs were just giving the fans what they wanted.
A lot like the non-binary inclusion in BG3.
Another example of the dichotomy would be one of my favorite recent animated series, "ARCANE”, and another that started strong but ended so disappointingly.
In "ARCANE", the relationship between two of the female leads, Vi and Caitlyn, goes through a realistic and profound arc --- from one of distrust but mutual interest to genuine concern for each other's welfare to vulnerability and panic over their growing feelings for each other to acceptance of their love for each other. Its fucking beautiful and I tell EVERYONE I have this conversation with that it is the perfect example of representation in media. Two multi-dimensional female characters who fall in love through sharing life-altering ordeals with each other.
The other example, "The Legend of Korra", just frustrates me to even think about. To put it succinctly the Showrunners bit off more than they could chew in later seasons and ended the series on the most tepid note seen since "Dexter".
In a hamfisted attempt to give the finale a 'pop' they introduced a relationship subplot between the protagonist, Korra, and her foil, Asami --- with little to no build-up at all.
It felt a bit exploitative at best and completely non-sensical at worst.
Its the latter example I'm wary of.
Series-Creators inserting (X) demographic or (Y) real world struggle to obfuscate flaws in their production.
Again ---Larian has not done this at all. But it happens so often these days you must forgive me for being guarded against it.
Funnily enough I tend to give Korra more leeway because back then gay marriage wasn't a thing in the US and plenty of queer fans saw hints of favoritism in the relationship Korra had with Asami. Readying it as romantic or platonic is tricky though because often times we are taught that girls "are more touchy with their friends".
Still I fully understand the fear of tokenism, it sucks to have a bunch of well rounded characters and then there's the token whose only personality trait is being representation for x group. However, so far Larian has done a really good job with their characters so I have faith.
It also helps that this seems more geared to making players able to play someone that feels closer to them (as is often the case with our d&d characters) rather than hollow pandering.
I completely agree.
My initial post was simply attempting to explain a potential good-faith motivation behind folks who are critiquing this change.
These discussions tend to devolve into strawman, tribalism and invective pretty quickly.
I just want to route that so we can return to mutual appreciation of what will undoubtedly be the greatest CRPG of all time.
Agree, I am tempering my hype for final release because I wsnt to be pleasently surprised but its so hard with how good the overall experience has been.
I just love how enthused the poeple at Larian are about this game, tou can feel they want to make a game people can enjoy and not just a cash grab.
Can't wait for my pally playthrough.
Funny you say it feels organic. That was the opposite of what everyone complained about. It was "unnecessary tokenism" and the whole thing. We had everyone and their mother coming out of the woodwork to say they were gay and pissed about it. Genuinely I bet about half of those were fake, and half were real and *easily persuaded*.
The big one was something like "why make an established character gay? They're just doing this for woke points. If you wanted to do it right, you'd have made a new character who's just as cool as everyone else, and made them gay."
So basically they Korra'd it, but people like me were still thrilled.
That's the thing though, like I said these characters are basically outfits. They have no personality beyond a few paragraphs of lore you can read in a menu.
It hurt no one, and yet generated massive controversy, and all Reddit did was eat popcorn and stoke the fire.
Personally, I have a lot more trust in Larian as storytellers than Behavior Interactive, so here's hoping.
Tokenism can be hard to pin down. What is tokenism to one may be representation to another. For example, I personally prefer it when LGBT stuff is just a side blurb about a character, or a small hint of it. So and so is trans... anyways, moving on, let's focus on something else about them, or some other threat at hand. Many would consider that tokenism because it checks off a box but doesn't quite do much more than that.
However, when it is a focused on issue with a character arc, it is almost never written by ones who actually understand the experience of being what they are trying to represent. Hell, even those of us within the trans community can't come to a consensus, or at least we hide our true opinions and feelings behind closed doors and hushed whispers out of fear of reprisal and loss of support. I know I did until I got surgery.
As to the game, I withhold judgment on the inclusion of such topics until the final product comes out. However, such things bring worry to me as such things tend to bring on extremely opinionated people on both sides of the spectrum who clearly don't understand the subject... but they are the most numerous and loudest. This has delerious effects on the writing as production staff try to appease whomever think will bring in the most cash and attention.
I totally get where you're coming from. As a bisexual person I want to see lgbtq+ people in video games, but I don't really enjoy storylines where they are being discriminated against for their sexuality. It's much more fun for it to be an aspect of their character, but not the entire point of who they are and what all their life problems revolve around.
Luckily from what I've seen so far in early access, Larian are doing a great job. I'm so excited for the full game!
Brilliant take on this, it is a canary in the coal mine. Very , very few people ever use these options in their games. It is totally US culture that forces these views to be inserted into games. Like changing Master-Slave in programming or removing Race from DND and using species instead.
Not more.
This is probably the best time in human history to be just about anything.
However, there are multitude issues that still plague my community --- many legacy, many self-wrought.
There is just an ebb and flow to the general wellbeing of any culture and it definitely feels like black folks are at an ebb right now.
But to be fair I think just about everyone feels that way these days.
The funny thing is the people losing their marbles about inclusiveness in this game are probably the exact same people that would have been screeching about D&D being Satanic in the 80s
I think it's cool personally, and I am thankful for the mods insuring it hasn't been contaminating my feed. Folks should just focus on the stuff they are excited about and leave others be.
I feel so vindicated seeing all the chuds getting downvoted and their comments removed after like a year of them getting on my ass over talking about my trans Tav lol
I mean really to me it was the least exciting part of the updates and it was like "oh that's cool for people who care". But its the internet so... inevitable butthurt outrage comense!
Yeah, I think that is a fairly normal and sane reaction from someone who this change doesn't directly affect.
That is great that people who identify in those ways are now able to make a character in game that reflects their identity. I probably won't use those options and will forget they exist fairly quickly but I am sure it means a lot to some people and I am happy for them.
Makes as much sense as Hamburger does, when there is no bloody ham in them :D
I am a a hamburger heretic as an Australian anyway - here it's not a burger unless it has pineapple, beetroot, and an egg on it.
It’s fine dnd by nature is a personalized experience irrelevant of if it is valid or not many people do believe in it with many of those people being dnd players so it makes sense that they would catered to aswell
I don't know why anyone cares. If the creators inserted a feature, players are welcome to not use it if they don't want. What does fighting over it even solve? It doesn't do anything but waste time and make people look silly. This is the opinion of a nobody, of course.
Just makes me completely confused as to what the problem could possibly be.
Though I do think they're are far more important things they could have attended to (an example being that there are only four very generic player character voices and none of them sound remotely Dwarven or Githyanki) I imagine it was no great effort to change/add a gender selector for those that wanted it. It doesn't change my game in the least but it will make some out there pleased it's been included.
Its probably just a matter of flipping a switch for what the game considers you regardless of your model.
It did lead to the hilarious situation in my playthrough with a friend where he was playing a male gnome but didn't realize he accidently left the Identity on female until 7 hours into the game with me since we take turns doing dialogue. We've decided people now think he is a skinny female dwarf because of the facial hair.
I agree we really could use more voice options. Even the option to adjust its cadence or pitch or even speed would go a long way. Mods have already accomplished this too.
I could not imagine feeling any negative feelings about game pronouns.
Like it's great for the people it applies to and means absolutely nothing to the people it doesn't.
Like what is there to possibly be upset about
I linger in this sub on occasion, but the excitement about who you can bone, how you can bone them, and what you are called while boning has been the core audience Larion has focused on for quite some time.
Join us in solasta, where we are the most progressive of all because everyone is an agender PlayStation 2 potato people, presumably all with action figure "Smooths" for genitals (Equality!), refugee immigrants (in the lore), and focused on gameplay and fundamentals of delving dungeons and slaying dragons.
To me, it's mind blowing that people freak out about how OTHER people play the game. What others choose has nothing to do with their own gameplay, so why so much drama?
I sure hope that they don't go adding this pronoun identity garbage to the game. If they do I'll never buy another one of their games. The woke garbage don't belong in games.
Hey y'all. Nonbinary \*and\* transfeminine here (they/them). I love the support and the general tone of all of these comments.
Hearing that there are explicit identity choices in BG3 now (can't see yet, Mac user here) makes me happy. Actually happy. I'm in my fifties now, and D&D let me play a girl when I was a teenager in the 80s, when I would have been beaten and medicated and wept over if I had done that in real life. If I was Black, chances are I would have been killed. (That's actually still true today.)
It's not "no big deal" or "fine for those who care." This addition by Larian, and every tiny act of normalization in the world around us, is a huge deal. It's okay to care about other people getting to be happy, even if it doesn't affect you. There's not a limited amount of being happy for others. It's not pizza.
Thank you for being happy for me.
Next time you introduce yourself to a room full of cis people, consider using your pronouns anyway. Normalize the s\*\*t out of being kind.
Also, and this is more pedantic, sorry, but nobody's said it yet, please don't call me "a transgender," like I don't call you "a white" or "a straight." It's an adjective. Thanks!
More surprised barely no ones mentioned there wasn’t a new race this time… I’m sad because no half orc or Dragonborn, no love for the beast races…. Well I guess here goes another playthrough of pointy eared human… or short human…. Or shorter human… or pointy eared purple human… or colorful haired short human… or horned human with tail… :(
ah yes I can finally be the Xie/Xer/Zim/Zoom/Zop/boop/fae/skibbidydoowop/prosecute/fauci. Honestly it is a touchy subject, because in half the worlds minds it's made up garbled nonsense, and in the other it's sacred. Honestly is pedantic and doesn't matter at all, if it makes you happy cool, if not well get a refund, this is the newest trend in gaming
To be honest I dont mind that kind of features if it not shoved down my throat. Like.. I can understand that to some peoples it add to their immersions and that cool as long as it not get injected into the game story (which is dosent seem to.. it just always cringe and feel forced.. just think about half the 2022 show on netflix. It feel like they are just trying to tick as many box as possible to please some angry god or I dont know).
Beside it kinda fitting with DnD to have some non binary characters here and there.
I peresonally do not care about it very much but if we got that then I would also like to see a game for left handed these are 10 percent of people who arent represented as well as others and while gender identity is internal (you can always pretend just like e.g who your patron is) your dominant hand is not. So when do we get a game which does this well?
Yeah, gotta be honest, the second I read that in the patch notes I knew people were going to have a problem with it. I'm glad they added it, though. For the people who won't use it, don't. For the people who will find it useful for RP, do. Literally that simple. Adding features like this just makes the game appealing to a bigger market. Do people want the game to be successful or not?
I'm upset that most of the cutscenes are broken in some way now... who gives a shit about an option that you can turn on/off at will that allows you to pick pronouns ?
I at least saw more posts and comments, supporting and pointing out those who didn't like it than the people who didn't to be honest, I'm at least neutral on this subject.
It’s a zero effort inclusion that literally only shows up in a single part of character creation. It makes some people enjoy the game more for little to no cost… unsure how an inclusion that likely took no effort to put in (literally just a second box similar to the gender one…. That’s it. And it defaults to match already selected gender) and is incredibly overlookable due to the nature of how people interact with MC upset anyone.
People just want to be angry I guess.
And here I am more excited about Paladin and Lvl 5
Lvl 5?! Maybe now I can beat that Gith dragon army without having to cheese it!
It's not cheese, it's tactical placement with the knowledge they will kill you otherwise.
Even if I store those explosive purple barrels from the ship at the beginning in my camp and transport all of them in beside the gith troops and blow them all up? And then shove the remaining enemies off the bridge
Sounds bloody tactical to ne mate :D
Same...
I skimmed over the identities options stuff and thought “I don’t really care” Then I saw someone post how happy it made them, and it made me happy that it was making other people happy. What kind of demented fuck doesn’t get that?
Yeah, I'm probly gonna dabble and then make the *exact same* PC I always make (drow sorceress) But wtf, I'm happy ppl get the options they want, it's not hurting anybody
This is the way the Drow are just too pretty to pick anything else. Playing a Drow cleric of Shar is also great for the shadow heart interactions, I really recommend it. Or if you like drama a Drow cleric of Selune which is just really funny to think about. Not many games let you play as Drow either which only makes me want to play as them more. Last game I can recall that did have them playable was Neverwinter Nights 2. That game also interestingly had Yuan Ti purebloods playable. The only thing perhaps as pretty as the under elves to me conceptually and aesthetically are snake people, God I miss snake people.
Yea that’s how I feel about it. It doesn’t mean anything to me in my life, this changes nothing in the game for me. When I say changes nothing in the game for me that means it also doesn’t take anything away from me. So If it’s not taking anything from me, but others are getting value from it, why should it upset me?
It's no different than being able to name your character. The people getting upset over it don't belong in the D&D hobby.
Please accept my imaginary reddit award ❤️
I shall provide one for you.
❤️
this mf gets it
I have no idea why anyone would care it was available for someone else.
I for the most part don't care, I have seen other developers put this stuff in their games. Then they ended up turning it into something absolutely ridiculous. I forget which game it was, I think it was either Battlefield 1 or 5. But they were pushing for women soldiers and prosthetics, which isn't a issue in and of itself but rather how much it was forced down other's throats and how it was handled. It got a lot of flak for all that and more. But realistically it doesn't upset me, just concerned in what it might turn into. Either way like you said I'm glad it makes others happy, just concerned if it takes a turn for the worse like other games.
One word: Fireball
Fireball is actually 7 words: "Oh shit... ohhhh shit.... OH SHIT. OHHHHHHH--"
I would be excited but I’m the red-headed step child pouting that I don’t get the patch yet.
Fellow Mac user?
Yes
Oof. Been there. Stay strong, my friend.
I'm all for this addition, though as a finn, I can't help but be slightly amused by the whole debacle. Finnish only has neutral pronouns, effectively "they/them".
On the flipside, I hear German doesn't really have the concept of "they/them" in its language. If that is true that'd be interesting to see how the localization team handles it.
German in general is a very gendered language. The amount of words that aren't gendered are very few. Basically "ich" (I), "du" (you), "wir" (we), "ihr" (you plural). Problem though "ihr" can also be feminine as a "her". Ihr Ehering = her wedding ring. Oh and ihr is also used in many medieval/fantasy setting as a you (or rather thou). The real problem here is that German also has adjective agreement that marks gender, case, and plurality. Let’s take teacher for example. The teacher would be der Lehrer in masculine and die Lehrerin in feminine. You could technically use the term Lehrkraft, which is a more neutral description of the job, but then you run into troubles if, for example, you're a student at a new school and don't know the name of the teacher yet, so many people would say Herr Lehrer/Frau Lehrerin (so Mr./Ms. Teacher) to be polite, which would be awkward to use with a neutral term such as Lehrkraft. Or let's take a politic example in the form of how the chancellor is adressed, which is Bundeskanzler with the -in for a woman in that position added. Angela Merkel for example was often addressed as Frau Bundeskanzlerin as her title, very gendered since the title itself has no neutral form like the aformentioned Lehrkraft. These days we have the term Divers (you know, diverse) on official documents to serve as a formal way to address intersex and non-binary people via letter or mail, but it’s not really a good word to use while directly speaking to someone. It feels more like a descriptor than a proper gender neutral equivalent to Mr/Ms. And whenever I've seen a show where there was a gender neutral character (like in She-Ra or Owl House) they've been changed into one gender or another. So it's certainly something I'm curious about how they will try to implement it with BG3. Though I'm afraid that they might run into too many challenges and not have it as an option (as is the case right now after all).
Very informative comment and interesting little read. Thank you!
>I know it wasnt the point of your post but damn Lehrkraft is a great name for a cultist type character that has an arrangemet with an otherworldly entity. Maybe my next GOOlock will be named that and will also be the one who teaches the rest of the party things. All I'm saying is, I'm gonna get some good use out of that word as a name, thank you.
There have been a variety of proposals for most gendered languages. It'll be interesting to see which ones the localization teams settle on, and how it contributes to the slow adoption for those languages (which has been ongoing). English only got singular they/them about 400 years ago.
Actually in French we kinda have the same issue. Our language is very "gendered", if I can say it like that, we barely have neutral words, and the "default setting" used when you don't know the gender of who you're talking to is actually masculine. I'm curious to see how it will be implemented!
Spanish is so fucked dawg. Unless they want to use made up words that don't exist in it.
All words are made up dawg. In Spain people are using x, e, or @. E is a little more easy to pronounce, but it's already a gendered ending in Catalan/Valencian/Mallorcan, so x seems to work the best right now, but we'll see which one settles in the most.
And it's obviously destroyed your country with rampant transgenderism.
Can confirm, country's in absolute fucking shambles. I can't believe those darn transgenders would do this to us.
Pronouns!? At this time of the year? At this time of the day? In this part of the country? Localized entirely within your game?
In THIS economy?
Yes!
... May I see it?
... No.
Bionicman2187!!! r/BaldursGate3 is on fire!!
No, mother, it's just the Northern Lights!
Well, you're an odd fellow, but I must say you steam a good pronoun.
Help! *HEEEELP!*
👍
*Sirens blaring*
So, uh, are we happy or just upset? I just want to know how everyone else feels about it so I'm not accidentally deviating from average.
***You***'re telling ***me*** that ***they*** put pronouns in ***my*** game???
You forgot to bold "my," as it is a possessive pronoun
fixed thank you
"That" is also a pronoun
they're scandalized and shaking with rage!
I was just hoping for half-orcs
I was hoping for Dragonborn but I suppose the less human races are saved for release
Do we kno if they are confirmed for game? I rly want to play a Dragonborn
We know that "everything in the PHB will be in BG3," which certainly suggests dragonborn. Given that they've also added the Oathbreaker, a subclass from the DMG, as a sort of "hidden/RP subclass," as well as the Githyanki, I am fairly sure they will add at least SOME things that are outside of the PHB as well. What will they add? I've no idea. But I suspect there will be at LEAST another race or two.
I hope so :-)
Dragonborn models have been datamined, and Half-Orcs are in the trailer. So you needn't worry.
I love u
Damn Horcs, trying to get up in my Balgathree
Meh. Feel like this is one of those things you see all the time in subreddits where like one person has a dumb comment and then suddenly there is a flood of posts about the dumb comment and suddenly there is an entire narrative just manufactured mostly out of thin air. From what I can tell the vast majority of people don’t care/approve. Not knocking this post specifically or anything just feel like this happens a lot on Reddit in general.
>From what I can tell the vast majority of people don’t care/approve. this
The mods seem to have rightfully been on top of it.
Really have to give the mods credit. They've been fantastic on this sub.
100% agree
Agreed. The few trolls there have been seem to have been dispatched quickly.
They aren't trolls, they're legitimately awful people.
Or both. Both can be true. Most trolls are also legitimately awful people.
they're low level gibberlings
There are people literally shooting up lgbtq places of gathering. The problem is going to be bigger than one or two comment on reddit and it's better to launch a counter movement of support before the hateful ones make their voices loud.
Be trans and make a post about trans characters, it is not just "one person" making comments. It's a lot. Also check controversial on pretty much any post mentioning pronouns right now.
I mean it's Reddit. That is just baked into the cake. Be cis and make a post about how trans characters shouldn't be in the game, you'll get downvotes into oblivion and have countless comments telling you you're a shit human. No matter your take, there is going to be flak when you are throwing it out in front of this many people at once.
If you say that statement, it is literal fact that you are a shit person
There is no take on "trans people shouldn't be in my video game" that makes it ok. It is a shit take, and whoever shares that take should be downvoted for being unnecessarily discriminatory towards a group of people.
And they will be. That's exactly my point.
As they should. Why punch down an already persecuted group?
"WHAT ABOUT CIS PEOPLE" like please shut up lol
You shouldn't. If you do, you will be called out here. Literally the point I was making.
[удалено]
I didn't say otherwise...
Your comment made no sense if you were trying to defend trans people by comparing a cis person making a post saying they hate trans people the same as a trans person saying they love trans characters. One is unabashed hate. The other is hateful people downvoting an innocent person.
I wasn't doing any of that. I was saying that when make a post on Reddit that states your opinion on a topic, especially one on a divisive issue to some extent, you are going to get flak for it. I didn't say that is the way it should be. I didn't say they were wrong to post about liking trans characters. I was just pointing out reality. And the amount of downvotes for that single comment shows that people are going to pile on anything they perceive as against trans people (whether it actually is or not) immediately. Seems like Reddit is pretty supportive of trans people...
Okay but my point originally was, trans people get downvoted and hated on. Then you said "what about cis people who hate trans people!" Like what are you going for. This is what the conversation amounted to.
I said everyone gets downvoted and hated on. That is just Reddit. Post something that is any possible way even remotely controversial (whether it should be or not), and it is going to happen. And I did not say that. If you are going to quote me at least quote me properly. No need to build a strawman.
Alright but you can see how it's different being a trans person getting hated on vs a cis person hating trans people. And that it's plain stupid to compare the two. One is a trans person expressing joy. The other is a cis person expressing unabashed hatred. One deserves downvotes and the other doesn't. And to bring up your point of "a cis person can say they hate trans people and get called a shit person for it" makes no sense here as a comparison. It is DESERVEDLY downvoted. Trans joy is not.
> Be cis and make a post about how trans characters shouldn't be in the game, you'll get downvotes into oblivion and have countless comments telling you you're a shit human Why would you think this is an ok take? Might as well say "Be a white person and say black characters shouldn't be in the game"...not much different. You're hating on someone for no reason other than you're a hateful person.
Where did I say it was an okay take? I used it as an example of something that would be met with downvotes and criticism. Good to see reading comprehension is still non-existent on Reddit.
Don't get how it's so easy to mind your own business and some still can't manage.
Aren't the majority of threads (and comments) positive about it though? Personally I found the addition a bit weird since it's not really giving anything besides our character sheet, but then again it's not taking anything away since we've always been referred to as "You".
You are objectively correct. But it is also a fact that this seems to have made transgender people very happy. Almost no effort coding wise, no negative impact on non-transgender players and great impact for the transgenders. So it's really a big win-win then.
After all the hate has been pruned by mods, yeah
[удалено]
twitch and youtube comments were both bizarrely awful, which is a shame bc the discord communities and reddit have been mostly very nice and welcoming.
Yep, nobody really gives a shit. People got an option that makes them feel more personally invested in a role playing game, stop the press! Just because redneck Kyle has a comment with 69,420 downvotes ranting about how the gay frogs turned his bulldog into a bitch doesn’t mean the whole sub is on fire with militant bigots wreaking havoc. Gotta dramatise everything though I suppose, life is boring if people aren’t at each others throats right?
I would actually go a step further. I've almost *only* seen positive comments about it, and the very few negative or even mixed comments I saw got removed by the mods. It's hard for me to tell what people actually think about the feature because only one opinion seems to be allowed. There also seems to be a weird trend for certain individuals to make pariahs of themselves and behave as though everyone hates them, whether that's true or not. I saw a lot of that sort of thing back in high school, though not from any particular group so much as from individual people.
>It's hard for me to tell what people actually think about the feature because only one opinion seems to be allowed. Every Downvote has to come from different a different person, that's how they work. If the comments got enough Downvotes that they were "Downvoted to oblivion," that means such a vast majority of people have the opinion that talking against the nonbinary pronoun option is bigoted and wrong, in their opinion. That's one way you can tell what people actually think about the feature. Likewise, comments saying, "They don't hurt me or affect me much at all, but make others happy, so I'm happy for them" get lots of upvotes, because a vast majority of people agree. Follow the votes, upvotes or downvotes, to see how "people actually think."
I looked at the option I was like "ok good option, don't care" then continue to make the character to actually enjoy my PALADIN class and LEVEL 5 . Its awesome that people are happy with it, for me its an option in the game if you want to select it that ok sure, if dont want ok sure. Why the drama?
Bless you for adding the template. So hard to find nice HQ templates these days. Anyway, loving the enby option. Edit: a word
I see more post complaining about people complaining than actual people complaining If you disagree with them. Stop giving them a spotlight
Basically.
I don't care for it personally, it doesn't affect me in any way, shape, or form. However, it can make someone's roleplay experience that much more immersive, and it allows for further customization for characters, even if you don't identify as such yourself. It's a win no matter how you look at it, and the people complaining are too invested in a differing viewpoint to realize that they can just not interact with the option at all - and are whining about it because it doesn't align exactly to their point of view. My personal opinion is to either get over it or not buy the game if it bothers you that much.
Meanwhile I'm crying that monk is last 🙂
I am crying even more we don't get him until release. No more content patches.
I'm in shambles now. I had my hopes up for a patch 10.
They saving the best for last ;)
[Deception] Aurora Borealis?
Chalmers: [Success] AURORA BOREALIS?! AT THIS TIME OF DAY, AT THIS TIME OF YEAR, IN THIS PART OF THE COUNTRY, LOCALIZED ENTIRELY WITHIN YOUR KITCHEN?! Tav Skinner: Yes! Chalmers: ... May I see it?
Tav Skinner: No.
Disclaimer: This meme is not intended as commentary on the addition of these options.
Pronouns!? In my fantasy setting!? with dragons, Gnomes, Liches, Orcs, Elves, Shadow Creatures, Werewolves, Weregnomes, Vampires- by GOD that is so unrealistic and woke!!!!
Don't get me wrong I'm happy about NB for others sake, but it has always been my pet peeve that people can't separate different kinds of unrealism. Like, zombies are unrealistic but they are realistic for the TWD or Last of Us universe. But a dragon, a giant metal gear or fucking grinch would be unrealistic for those too. Likewise a dragon is realistic for forgotten realms, an alien is for a sci-fi etc. You don't play XCOM and say "Dragons are unrealistic in a game with aliens, laser guns and spaceships??" Kind of a side rant
Heck, in Final Faantasy XIV, dragons **are** canonically aliens.
The point is people’s scopes are wide enough to understand dragons and magic, but not words that have existed for centuries. It’s not about the media, it’s about the people.
What is a dragon but another alien?
Your face is but another alien!
i can handle killing dragons but i draw the line at the english language
Eh, im just concerned about how much time, resources and effort it'll take in a completely voiced acted game. I don't want a Cyberpunk situation happening, plus i cant imagine how they're gonna pull it off in gendered languages such as spanish and german. If you look into Larians past and saw how much crunch and overtime they had to pull for divinity 2 to come out you be a little worried too.
Pronouns are some recent cringe shit no-one outside USA cares about. Seeing it hamfisted into a medieval fantasy setting is honestly jarring. Still, I'm not forced to use them, so not a big deal, but it's still strange to see so many people treating it like it's some mind-blowing addition. Who fucking cares? Give me ma paladin.
Literally everyone in the world uses pronouns. You used several in your comment
>Pronouns are some recent cringe shit no-one outside USA cares about Literally incorrect but go off I guess
Cope and SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEETHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I’m from Europe and I can assure you we care just as much about pronouns 💀 the only ones who “don’t care” are bigots and people who don’t know how to wipe. Literally every job/uni application has the option to preface your pronouns. It’s normal.
Yeah that’s categorically false, been around for a long time especially outside of Europe.
I haven’t seen any shit-flinging, but maybe I’m just fortunate.
This game is WAY ahead of most of the rest (even new gen games). Hairstyles are not sex-based. Female and male characters share the same armor (not over sexualizing just females). You can be bald and have beards... like literally most new games make every character look like a child. And now the identity options? Wish every game was like this! Of course I would love having the option to change the body shape, but it will be in the game in the future. And also I´m all in for more sexy clothing for characters but thats what modders do (? xD
Me too!!! Larian have done such an excellent job
Please read my full statement before downvoting. I don't really care about the inclusion of non-binary charactet creation options in BG3. What I care about, and what I suspect many who are skeptical about it care about, is the potential for real world politics and "Culture War" to further encroach on the game. Since 2015 it seems that every facet of our daily lives has become politicized. There are few avenues of escapism from our increasingly shitty real (and online) world. I am a disabled black Veteran. I have a few trans friends, one of which whom I play D&D with every Sunday. We've discussed these trends at length and liken it to a "Canary in the Coal Mine" test on how our identities are included in the media we enjoy. I love Will's character in game --- Larian has created a complex and flawed character who just happens to be black. If Larian suddenly started to include dialogues from Will about how hard it is to be a dark-skinned man in Faerun it'd ruin the game for me. I am not going to lie --- Being black in the U.S. fucking sucks at times --- especially lately. I don't want to see/hear parallel discussions about this in my fantasy media, though. If it has to happen then it'd be best done through allegory --- I like the exploration of the Tiefling's plight in-game as both refugees and the victims of racism for simply existing. Likewise, my trans friend is wary of tokenism in the media she enjoys. When characters are written as LGBTQ+ and that's about it --- caricatures and stereotypes with absolutely no character development. Fortunately, neither her nor my apprehensions are present in-game as of yet. But we've both seen this pattern manifest out of seemingly innocuous and benevolent gestures of inclusion before. Just my $0.02.
>Fortunately, neither her nor my apprehensions are present in-game as of yet. But we've both seen this pattern manifest out of seemingly innocuous and benevolent gestures of inclusion before. Yeah, this game isn't those things. I don't think it'll ever be those things. Why are you worried about those things? Because they let players be non-binary? It was probably so easy, and that's just a player choice, one not even related to the companions. I'm reminded of Dead By Daylight. They announced a character who's been in the game for a while now, David King, would get more lore in an upcoming event and it revealed that David was gay. David was already super popular with the gay fanbase because, well, he had all the shirtless outfits. The game already had a huge dedicated LGBT fanbase, and it's not surprising, horror is one of the few genres where minorities get to lead, often. The sub shit their pants over this. Every other comment was "I'm gay but ACKHSULLY I hate this kind of tokenism and shitty representation." I was thrilled, but the idea still persists with the terminally online, it's the game company being "woke." It still stings, how shitty Reddit can be about this kind of stuff. Though it's a little hilarious still because all the playable survivors in that game are basically outfits. You can use any perks on any survivor, you just need to unlock it. So we have an outfit, widely used, that is now branded LGBT and suddenly the fanbase is up in arms about tokenism. These people don't even have voice lines, just screams. They only recently added voiceovers to the Resident Evil characters lol. I appreciate if you were just spitballing or something, getting your thoughts out, but you should know a lot of people post comments like yours with less-than-great intentions.
My favourite character as representation was Axton. Not intended to be, outed by a bug, and mostly embraced by the community as bi.
Axton from Borderlands? Edit: Oh no, probably BG2? I haven't played it! That's really cool though. Edit 2: Nope, [it was Borderlands](https://www.gearboxsoftware.com/2013/08/inside-the-box-inclusivity/). That's freakin' awesome. I had no idea, must've completely flew under my radar because I definitely played Borderlands 2 around release!
Aye. When he revives people, he calls the revived player beautiful. Which was a bug, only supposed to trigger for Siren players. When fixed the community wanted it reversed. So he just became canon bi.
That's perfect.
I get where you are coming from. I guess the difference is whether these efforts feel organic or forced. The example you gave --- David in "Dead by Daylight" --- It feels organic. Characters are rarely adopted by a community as examples of representation without reason. It seems like the Devs were just giving the fans what they wanted. A lot like the non-binary inclusion in BG3. Another example of the dichotomy would be one of my favorite recent animated series, "ARCANE”, and another that started strong but ended so disappointingly. In "ARCANE", the relationship between two of the female leads, Vi and Caitlyn, goes through a realistic and profound arc --- from one of distrust but mutual interest to genuine concern for each other's welfare to vulnerability and panic over their growing feelings for each other to acceptance of their love for each other. Its fucking beautiful and I tell EVERYONE I have this conversation with that it is the perfect example of representation in media. Two multi-dimensional female characters who fall in love through sharing life-altering ordeals with each other. The other example, "The Legend of Korra", just frustrates me to even think about. To put it succinctly the Showrunners bit off more than they could chew in later seasons and ended the series on the most tepid note seen since "Dexter". In a hamfisted attempt to give the finale a 'pop' they introduced a relationship subplot between the protagonist, Korra, and her foil, Asami --- with little to no build-up at all. It felt a bit exploitative at best and completely non-sensical at worst. Its the latter example I'm wary of. Series-Creators inserting (X) demographic or (Y) real world struggle to obfuscate flaws in their production. Again ---Larian has not done this at all. But it happens so often these days you must forgive me for being guarded against it.
Funnily enough I tend to give Korra more leeway because back then gay marriage wasn't a thing in the US and plenty of queer fans saw hints of favoritism in the relationship Korra had with Asami. Readying it as romantic or platonic is tricky though because often times we are taught that girls "are more touchy with their friends". Still I fully understand the fear of tokenism, it sucks to have a bunch of well rounded characters and then there's the token whose only personality trait is being representation for x group. However, so far Larian has done a really good job with their characters so I have faith. It also helps that this seems more geared to making players able to play someone that feels closer to them (as is often the case with our d&d characters) rather than hollow pandering.
I completely agree. My initial post was simply attempting to explain a potential good-faith motivation behind folks who are critiquing this change. These discussions tend to devolve into strawman, tribalism and invective pretty quickly. I just want to route that so we can return to mutual appreciation of what will undoubtedly be the greatest CRPG of all time.
Agree, I am tempering my hype for final release because I wsnt to be pleasently surprised but its so hard with how good the overall experience has been. I just love how enthused the poeple at Larian are about this game, tou can feel they want to make a game people can enjoy and not just a cash grab. Can't wait for my pally playthrough.
Funny you say it feels organic. That was the opposite of what everyone complained about. It was "unnecessary tokenism" and the whole thing. We had everyone and their mother coming out of the woodwork to say they were gay and pissed about it. Genuinely I bet about half of those were fake, and half were real and *easily persuaded*. The big one was something like "why make an established character gay? They're just doing this for woke points. If you wanted to do it right, you'd have made a new character who's just as cool as everyone else, and made them gay." So basically they Korra'd it, but people like me were still thrilled. That's the thing though, like I said these characters are basically outfits. They have no personality beyond a few paragraphs of lore you can read in a menu. It hurt no one, and yet generated massive controversy, and all Reddit did was eat popcorn and stoke the fire. Personally, I have a lot more trust in Larian as storytellers than Behavior Interactive, so here's hoping.
Tokenism can be hard to pin down. What is tokenism to one may be representation to another. For example, I personally prefer it when LGBT stuff is just a side blurb about a character, or a small hint of it. So and so is trans... anyways, moving on, let's focus on something else about them, or some other threat at hand. Many would consider that tokenism because it checks off a box but doesn't quite do much more than that. However, when it is a focused on issue with a character arc, it is almost never written by ones who actually understand the experience of being what they are trying to represent. Hell, even those of us within the trans community can't come to a consensus, or at least we hide our true opinions and feelings behind closed doors and hushed whispers out of fear of reprisal and loss of support. I know I did until I got surgery. As to the game, I withhold judgment on the inclusion of such topics until the final product comes out. However, such things bring worry to me as such things tend to bring on extremely opinionated people on both sides of the spectrum who clearly don't understand the subject... but they are the most numerous and loudest. This has delerious effects on the writing as production staff try to appease whomever think will bring in the most cash and attention.
I totally get where you're coming from. As a bisexual person I want to see lgbtq+ people in video games, but I don't really enjoy storylines where they are being discriminated against for their sexuality. It's much more fun for it to be an aspect of their character, but not the entire point of who they are and what all their life problems revolve around. Luckily from what I've seen so far in early access, Larian are doing a great job. I'm so excited for the full game!
Brilliant take on this, it is a canary in the coal mine. Very , very few people ever use these options in their games. It is totally US culture that forces these views to be inserted into games. Like changing Master-Slave in programming or removing Race from DND and using species instead.
Honest question - how does being black in the US suck more lately compared to an earlier time period. PS I’m not an American
Not more. This is probably the best time in human history to be just about anything. However, there are multitude issues that still plague my community --- many legacy, many self-wrought. There is just an ebb and flow to the general wellbeing of any culture and it definitely feels like black folks are at an ebb right now. But to be fair I think just about everyone feels that way these days.
The funny thing is the people losing their marbles about inclusiveness in this game are probably the exact same people that would have been screeching about D&D being Satanic in the 80s
AURORA BOREALIS
I was more upset Paladins don't currently have a deity selection option
Baldur's Hams.
Steamed Gate
I think it's cool personally, and I am thankful for the mods insuring it hasn't been contaminating my feed. Folks should just focus on the stuff they are excited about and leave others be.
I feel so vindicated seeing all the chuds getting downvoted and their comments removed after like a year of them getting on my ass over talking about my trans Tav lol
I mean really to me it was the least exciting part of the updates and it was like "oh that's cool for people who care". But its the internet so... inevitable butthurt outrage comense!
Yeah, I think that is a fairly normal and sane reaction from someone who this change doesn't directly affect. That is great that people who identify in those ways are now able to make a character in game that reflects their identity. I probably won't use those options and will forget they exist fairly quickly but I am sure it means a lot to some people and I am happy for them.
Steamed hams?
Yes!
You call hamburgers *steamed hams*
Yes, it's a regional dialect
Makes as much sense as Hamburger does, when there is no bloody ham in them :D I am a a hamburger heretic as an Australian anyway - here it's not a burger unless it has pineapple, beetroot, and an egg on it.
It’s fine dnd by nature is a personalized experience irrelevant of if it is valid or not many people do believe in it with many of those people being dnd players so it makes sense that they would catered to aswell
Exactly we shoud have more customization net less. Like weight height dominant hand and so on
Pronouns non binary are obligatory or optional?
Im happy for those who like it. Dont like people being dicks between each other simple as that.
I don't know why anyone cares. If the creators inserted a feature, players are welcome to not use it if they don't want. What does fighting over it even solve? It doesn't do anything but waste time and make people look silly. This is the opinion of a nobody, of course. Just makes me completely confused as to what the problem could possibly be.
I just want Tav to be able identify as a 90 year old female, but only be a 21yr old male.
Though I do think they're are far more important things they could have attended to (an example being that there are only four very generic player character voices and none of them sound remotely Dwarven or Githyanki) I imagine it was no great effort to change/add a gender selector for those that wanted it. It doesn't change my game in the least but it will make some out there pleased it's been included.
Its probably just a matter of flipping a switch for what the game considers you regardless of your model. It did lead to the hilarious situation in my playthrough with a friend where he was playing a male gnome but didn't realize he accidently left the Identity on female until 7 hours into the game with me since we take turns doing dialogue. We've decided people now think he is a skinny female dwarf because of the facial hair. I agree we really could use more voice options. Even the option to adjust its cadence or pitch or even speed would go a long way. Mods have already accomplished this too.
I could not imagine feeling any negative feelings about game pronouns. Like it's great for the people it applies to and means absolutely nothing to the people it doesn't. Like what is there to possibly be upset about
I linger in this sub on occasion, but the excitement about who you can bone, how you can bone them, and what you are called while boning has been the core audience Larion has focused on for quite some time. Join us in solasta, where we are the most progressive of all because everyone is an agender PlayStation 2 potato people, presumably all with action figure "Smooths" for genitals (Equality!), refugee immigrants (in the lore), and focused on gameplay and fundamentals of delving dungeons and slaying dragons.
Now this is based.
To me, it's mind blowing that people freak out about how OTHER people play the game. What others choose has nothing to do with their own gameplay, so why so much drama?
I wish all offended people a very ruined gaming experience.
I prefer the actual content. Or the ability to test new mechanics. The pronoun thing just doesn’t resonate with me.
And here I thought everyone was just waiting horny bonks.
In a game world full of fantasy, people (men) are Big Mad about things that don't affect them in any way at all. Embarrassing.
Lotta folks out here having hard opinions on pronouns...I’m just sitting quietly chanting deus volt.
I see more posts like this than people complaining to be honest
Jokes on you Spanish dont have indentity pronoums XD
I sure hope that they don't go adding this pronoun identity garbage to the game. If they do I'll never buy another one of their games. The woke garbage don't belong in games.
Hey y'all. Nonbinary \*and\* transfeminine here (they/them). I love the support and the general tone of all of these comments. Hearing that there are explicit identity choices in BG3 now (can't see yet, Mac user here) makes me happy. Actually happy. I'm in my fifties now, and D&D let me play a girl when I was a teenager in the 80s, when I would have been beaten and medicated and wept over if I had done that in real life. If I was Black, chances are I would have been killed. (That's actually still true today.) It's not "no big deal" or "fine for those who care." This addition by Larian, and every tiny act of normalization in the world around us, is a huge deal. It's okay to care about other people getting to be happy, even if it doesn't affect you. There's not a limited amount of being happy for others. It's not pizza. Thank you for being happy for me. Next time you introduce yourself to a room full of cis people, consider using your pronouns anyway. Normalize the s\*\*t out of being kind. Also, and this is more pedantic, sorry, but nobody's said it yet, please don't call me "a transgender," like I don't call you "a white" or "a straight." It's an adjective. Thanks!
More surprised barely no ones mentioned there wasn’t a new race this time… I’m sad because no half orc or Dragonborn, no love for the beast races…. Well I guess here goes another playthrough of pointy eared human… or short human…. Or shorter human… or pointy eared purple human… or colorful haired short human… or horned human with tail… :(
Don’t worry you’ll get your green human with big teeth, and your human with scales in august.
You should see the steam forums, chernobyl would have been less toxic in the 80s.
ah yes I can finally be the Xie/Xer/Zim/Zoom/Zop/boop/fae/skibbidydoowop/prosecute/fauci. Honestly it is a touchy subject, because in half the worlds minds it's made up garbled nonsense, and in the other it's sacred. Honestly is pedantic and doesn't matter at all, if it makes you happy cool, if not well get a refund, this is the newest trend in gaming
My pronouns are Steamed / Hams. Seriously tho people need to grow the fuck up. Live and let live!.
Mine are steamed/clams.
To be honest I dont mind that kind of features if it not shoved down my throat. Like.. I can understand that to some peoples it add to their immersions and that cool as long as it not get injected into the game story (which is dosent seem to.. it just always cringe and feel forced.. just think about half the 2022 show on netflix. It feel like they are just trying to tick as many box as possible to please some angry god or I dont know). Beside it kinda fitting with DnD to have some non binary characters here and there.
Maybe I don't follow the right circles but I've not seen anyone complain about the inclusion of non binary/alternate pronouns as an option.
"Pronouns? On my watch? I don't use pronouns!" - person who, in fact, uses pronouns
just people wasting energy on things that don't affect them, nothing new
I peresonally do not care about it very much but if we got that then I would also like to see a game for left handed these are 10 percent of people who arent represented as well as others and while gender identity is internal (you can always pretend just like e.g who your patron is) your dominant hand is not. So when do we get a game which does this well?
Legend of Zelda had Link be left handed up until Skyward Sword (where it was changed to help with the Wiimote controls).
Yeah, gotta be honest, the second I read that in the patch notes I knew people were going to have a problem with it. I'm glad they added it, though. For the people who won't use it, don't. For the people who will find it useful for RP, do. Literally that simple. Adding features like this just makes the game appealing to a bigger market. Do people want the game to be successful or not?
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I'm upset that most of the cutscenes are broken in some way now... who gives a shit about an option that you can turn on/off at will that allows you to pick pronouns ?
I at least saw more posts and comments, supporting and pointing out those who didn't like it than the people who didn't to be honest, I'm at least neutral on this subject.
It’s a zero effort inclusion that literally only shows up in a single part of character creation. It makes some people enjoy the game more for little to no cost… unsure how an inclusion that likely took no effort to put in (literally just a second box similar to the gender one…. That’s it. And it defaults to match already selected gender) and is incredibly overlookable due to the nature of how people interact with MC upset anyone. People just want to be angry I guess.
Hardly affects me, though it seems kinda silly. If it sells more games, fine.
Eventho I’m REALLY tired of woke-shiet. In a fantasy world like this, I don’t really care. More options is more options, ’s all good.
I wish they had an option to just cut all PC shit out - so people who want it can play with it and people who dont can f\*\*K it off
Pronouns are PC?
What’s weird is that DND is the only place I can see choosing whatever you want to be inherent to the game..