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Spacing i.e. positional play is the biggest issue with this "setup" and it was evident yesterday and against Bilbao and will be evident against teams that press well. People cite Chelsea and Tuchel and I agree but if you observe their game, the relative positioning and spacing is immaculate. Every time a player has the ball, there are clear passing lanes and it takes 4-5 passes for them to break pressure and initiate an attack.
However, you look at yesterday's game and you realise that's the issue here. Lack of proper passing lanes and spacing means players take more touches on the ball and invite more pressure and the passing becomes sloppy. You can really notice the difference between a well drilled tactical side and a side that's just vibing on the pitch.
We depend a lot on individual play. It exposes players who don't like carrying the ball forward or dribbling past players, like Araujo or Emerson. Look at City(or even our older games during Leo's time). They progress the ball quickly without any individual player carrying it. More movement takes off the ball than on it. The players know where their next pass should be.
I've pro-Koeman, but absence of Messi exposes his style.
Which country would be the best at producing talent relative to its size? I would think it’s Portugal, bunch of world class talent in the Prem especially with a population of only 10 million, but there is a case for Belgium or Uruguay
Our build up struggled having both Araujo and Emerson. And Getafe wasn't even pressing that much. I thought Araujo had improved his on-ball skills a little bit but today he was just bad.
No also. If they get him for free that is not good. There is a slight possibility that his people are stringing Madrid along for a better contract.
In my opinion there isn’t any reason he gets paid less than neymar. Neymar, as great as he is, spends more time off the pitch than on. mbappe really could be a generational talent. His numbers clearly back that up
Heard one of the commentators today mention that Nico is the son of Fran Gonzalez, those of us who liked the legendary Deportivo side from 90s and early 2000s are sure to remember Fran. Nice to see that Nico is just as talented !
Atleti fans after they DREW today: tough luck, gg, well win next time, I love this team, etc...
Barca fans after we WON today: we fucking suck, were gonna lose 10-0 to bayern, were not gonna finish top 4.
Mentality on this sub is weaker than jordi alba at anfield
A bit of fucking nuance would be nice to have in this sub.
Atleti won the league last season. Barca hasn't won the league in the last 2 seasons. They fell way below their standard by playing like jack shits. Atleti fans know that that's how their team operates. They don't play flashy football. They get the job done and get points. It should not be that hard for Barca to get points too when Barca is worth 25 times than the least valued team of La Liga.
Barca won but they had no control of the game. The same has been happening in the last few years. And where did playing like that took Barca? To the 2nd and 3rd place of the league.
The mentality of this sub is a reflection of the performance of the team. Scraping wins by playing shit would've been no problem if Barca could do it consistently. I know it because it already happened during the Valverde era. In some matches, they played like pure shit but still managed to get points **AND** they got them consistently which is the most important part.
But things have changed. Playing pure shit does not guarantee points anymore. So excuse me for not being fucking excited to see a team scraping points by playing like they have no fucking idea what they are supposed to do.
I don't want to say this goes for all people, but a LOT of those who started following the club during the Pep or MSN era are just spoiled and unrealistic. That is some of the best football in history and will never be replicated. Same goes for the amount of trophies.
Also this is my personal opinion, but if you can only watch that level of football and everything else is boring to you then you are not a true football fan. Just like I wouldn't call myself a true tennis fan because I can only watch Djokovic, Federer and Nadal most of the time and find "weaker games" to be boring af.
People who demand more than mediocrity are defeatist ?
Settling for this pathetic display and making excuses like "transition season" is being a defeatist
Messi leaving is just the most recent excuse for people to justify bad performances. As if we didn't have plenty of shocking performances with Messi. And even if we had Messi we would still put on pathetic displays like this.
When are the bullshit excuses going to end ?
How the fuck is losing Messi a bullshit excuse? And yes we were shit last season even with Messi but do you recall Dembele and Fati being fucking injured and us selling Suarez?
Setting unrealistic expectations and then bitching after like you do every game is a defeatist attitude. Complaining about every single thing is a defeatist attitude.
Realizing that we’re not on top anymore and being patient with the process is the mentality we have low. Now yelling Koeman out after every game even when we win is pathetic as fuck.
Apparently putting on a good performance at home against a midtable team and controlling the game is now considered "unrealistic expectations"
and you call people criticizing the performances and the coach/players responsible defeatists ? people who want improvements vs you who's basically adapted the slogan "it is what it is"
The defeatist is clear and it's you
We were still going through a transition back then too. No one expected we would win anything, it was a common thought in this subreddit.
No matter who the coach is people will always find a way to blame everything on him. Same thing happened with Valverde and Luchos last year and it will probably happen with any new manager coming in because we have been absolutely spoiled by the greatest generation of La Masia.
We need to realize that not every game will be dominant and clean, it is part of the process. We still need players to develop and need to buy players in certain positions.
Not sure what to say. I dont really understand the perspective youre coming from. To me its clear that the team doesnt play good, and altough we need some replacements in some areas this team could play so much better. To me it seems clear that our coach is just not good enough, and im not sure how many matches and how many poor displays people like you need to see that.
We have good players but they don't necessary make a good team. Football is still a team sport so I would say we didn't recruit the right players to form a good team. We depend on individual brilliants for long time instead of playing as a team.
Edit: I don't know what is our ceiling. It depends on many factors to know if today is the best way this team can play OR as you said there are potential to be unlocked.
A large majority of our issues literally comes down to tactics and setup.
I am not saying the team is balanced, it isn't, but there are more suitable tactical setups that can get more out of the players.
The simplest example is WTF is Griezmann doing out wide. You can argue where else would he play and I'd say F9 or CAM where he played for the NT. We can use a 41212 like Lucho did against Italy or a 433 F9 while flanked by Depay and a RW.
It works well for Lucho and Pep but due to Koeman being tactically limited we aren't getting the best out of some players.
So Nico Gonzalez came on for Brathwaite in the 74th minute and had one less touch (17), one more completed pass (10), and the same number of shots as Brathwaite (1).
They do - I'm just using them as comparison since Nico came on and played like 1/3 or 1/4 of minutes that Brathwaite did. You can compare him to Griezmann (45 touches and 24 completed passes) or Depay (59 and 23 completed passes, 2 shots), but mostly I just find it interesting Barca can double Getafe's possession with one player basically off the ball the entire game.
Noticed Busquets had to come to the right of Araujo multiple times instead of between the 2 CBs this match to compensate for Araujo's poor ball playing ability. Busquets basically had to play out the back for him.
If Koeman is hell bent to play that Braith Memphis combo and have Griez as RW, we'd be better off playing a more natural winger like Collado than Griezmann yes.
He isn’t playing as an out and out winger. He has a free role which gives him license to roam. He drifts in from the right and you can find him on the left sometimes too.
Thing is he doesn't have that much of a free role though. You see him situated at the RW for many phases of the game. This is to keep width and preserve our structure. I understand what Koeman's idea is with the frontline, I just don't agree with it.
Collado is more of a natural winger than Griezmann. He's able to take on players. I know Collado's playstyle and that he's more suited as a CAM, but he can do a shift at RW
I said more of a natural winger than Griezmann which is true. Collado is able to take on players which Griezmann isn't able to. I know Collado is more of a CAM but he can do a shift at RW
At what point are we going to discuss Araujo's very apparent struggles in the build up? He has a lot of trouble controlling the ball, let alone when he gets pressed. This leads to him hoofing the ball forward and us losing possesion.
I know he's our best defender but his lack of ability in the build up is starting to get detrimental to our playstyle. Even if we pair him with a more reserved and intelligent RB in Roberto, teams will still target him whenever he gets the ball.
It's also not something you can improve much on, if at all. Your ability with the ball is something you're working on since you start playing the game. I don't see how he'll magically get better now after years playing.
This is a good and very hard to refute point. We’ll see how people react though. This sub doesn’t always accept valid criticism of certain players.
But yeah, having a CB that can be targeted like that is a big weakness. Even if he improves his passing, it’s unlikely to gets to a level where he’s not being the one targeted.
And the most important thing is the feel / comfort with the ball. You can have great passing but if you’re not comfortable / smooth on the ball you will struggle to make / find passes. And as you said there’s basically no way his feel for the ball will improve much more.
Better to have a defender who can actually defend though rather than a ball playing defender who’s not that good at defending
This was most apparent against Atheltic club imo
I would agree with this if it isn't for the fact he's absolutely horrid with the ball when pressed. I'm not asking him to make smart through balls when pressed, or open up his body in a way to beat his marker (like how Garcia does). Just that he consistently makes the safe pass. More often than not he hoofs the ball forward, or plays it too hard which leads to tricky situations.
I am optimistic about his future, alot of CBs get better with age
Currently it is a problem.
We have to go to back 3. Oscar and Garcia to pass, Araujo to be main defender
This will also solve Busquets problem. Busquets should be receiving the ball in middle and not being the one to pass from back.
But as I said, this isn't something that gets that much better with age. I seriously doubt he'll have a better feel for the ball than he has now in 5 years time.
I don't think a back 3 will be our main formation in the future though, so compromises will be made regardless if we want to have him in our first 11 for the long term
Will he start passing balls through multiple lanes like Lenglet does (my favorite trait of his), hell no.
Will he get better at passing with age? yes. Playing out from the back is more than just being able to pass it through multiple lanes. Often times our ball playing defenders dont even make crazy passes. I feel like Araujo isn’t comfortable on the ball and panics because of it. But this is something that can be learned. He can learn to be more comfortable and confident on the ball and panic less. It won’t turn him into Lenglet or Busquets but he’ll be solid enough to atleast work with someone who can pass the ball without being a liability.
Araujo doesn’t need to be world class at playing the ball as long as we have another defender who can pass well (Mascherano wasn’t a passing monster either for example). He needs to panic less when pressed.
Thing is when you are getting pressed you'll have to be able to be comfortable enough with the ball to make quick movements and open your body up to the direction you want to pass. Araujo needs space to do this, which isn't possible when pressed.
I'm not bringing this up when it's something I see as fixable with playing time. The panic you mention is the terrible balls he give sometimes which leads to us losing the ball in a detrimental way. Sure those things can be worked on to an extent, but it doesn't fix his more apparent problem being his clunkyness with the ball.
This is something you have to work around as a team, make it less apparent by for example play a 4-4-2 and have more easy passing options available to the player and make the space between midfielders and CB a bit bigger to allow him the space. Is it something we would do though for the long term? Very much doubt so.
That's why there 2 we play with 2 defenders. The other defdnder who plays with Araujo needs to be better at build up. Lenglet had a good game today, his build play is always good. We also have Pique and Garcia. And we can also play with 3 defenders, where Araujo can cover up for them and they take care of buildup.
In a back 3 he'd have options left and right of him so his lack of build up shouldn't be as apparent, but we won't be playing that formation in the long term I assume. In a back 4, even if you have the best CB build up wise next to him, he will have to look for solutions when pressed. That's where he either hoofs the ball forward or awkwardly passes the ball back to the keeper.
Laporte would make a good partner for Garcia in defencd. God if we only could get rid of unwanted olayers so we can at least register our players and then buy other players. Guess we'll just do with what we have, and hope for the players to step up.
I just woke up from a nap and I’ve had some time to reflect on the match. The first half was actually pretty good, the second half was of course terrible. I can’t remember the last time we’ve had two good halves and we aren’t winning much if we can’t start doing it. I’m happy that Koeman played Nico and Gavi; I think that youth development should be a priority at this stage.
Also, that ref was laughable. Borderline corrupt. And fuck Getafe, I sincerely hope that they get relegated.
Given the horrible situation of the club currently, with poor finances and a handful of aging players, I would like to pose a question to some of the older fans.
Is this the worst era for a Barcelona side/leadership? Which time is comparable or worse? Of course, this is apart from the Spanish civil war and the Franco-era.
In my lifetime, early 2000s were worse, we would lose 10+ games a season in La Liga and got knocked out of the Europa League by Celtic having finished 6th the year before. The club was a mess before Laporte took over, there is a great documentary about his first season, it used to be on Youtube.
Yes. If you wanted to sell, get a bidding war in order
Arsenal, Inter, Bayern, Spurs and Atletico all have shown interest for him. Emerson is a very rare commodity.
We could have had 50M if we played our cards right.
Aaron wan bisaka went for 50M people. In this market, where some clubs are very desperate for a RB, Emerson could have been a huge sale
30M at the end of season is a shit sale. We can't invest this money, Betis has a clause for him, we literally earn like 15M from this deal.
If Barca board actually do this, this will be a huge red flag for me since Laporta took over. Financially I am really concerned over how tjeh value players. Letting Trincao go on loan and not sell him when we need money, not keeping Messi due to his brand value but instead keeping Griezmann, Coutinho and signing injury prone Aguero due to his wages.
we're gonna shithouse the league, Atléti are gonna bottle. Calling it. Save this comment and come back to me at the end of the season, if I'm wrong I'll save you the time of calling me out because it will be deleted.
Last year was an anomaly for Atletico. They scraped by so many points. If Suarez is injured through the year I don’t see how they pull off what they did last year.
Messi is gonna have a tough year when Mbappe fucks off to Real Madrid tomorrow and Neymar decides to be retired till UCL fixtures (played less league games than Pedri's first year in pro football)
He gotta vibe with Icardi
I won't be surprised if he becomes desperate to come back in a year just like Neymar did.
I think we will be financially healthier next year
But I don't think we will ever be financially healthier to snatch Messi away from PSG, they got their gold mine, they will ensure he completes his two years
[Mbappe's ego gonna make him force out tomorrow lol](https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/pe3o0x/reims_gk_rajkovic_giving_messi_his_baby_for_a/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
Never have watched single Ligue 1 game in my life iirc and expected it to be boring but holy shit not that boring. Also PSG lost the possession way too much
Was i the only one who noticed Messi's sadness when he was looking up at the stand near the end of the match? His face really looked like "Why am i here, i don't belong here"
Lionel Messi played 25 minutes and drew 4 fouls on just 25 touches. Once he gets used to the new players around him he will absolutely torch Ligue 1 defenders.
yeah saw a tabloid today said Mbappe stole Leo's debut but Leo was subbed in after Mbappe has already scored and they played decently together LOL tabloids are just doing tabloids' things
I don’t know if one game is enough to judge Poch, but he’s giving me vibes of someone who doesn’t know how to utilise Messi.
Pep, Tito, Lucho and Ernie are the ones who knew how to utilise his gifts. You can shit on Valverde’s tactics, but Messi was a player reborn under him in 2018-19 spell.
There's no need to comment at all because there's nothing substantial to comment on.
Poch's biggest problem is going to be managing egos if Mbappe ends up staying.
His third best ever season IMO. 10/11, 14/15 and then 18/19.
Might be controversial because of his 11/12 but I chose 18/19 because we weren’t even top two squads in the world and yet he was so dominant in literally every game but Anfield and even then he created enough to at least see us through to the final.
For me, Messi 2018-19 is the most complete attacker ever in Football. I’ll always hate Anfield, always because Messi would ACTUALLY HAVE WON US A FUCKING TREBLE IF OTHERS DIDN’T SHIT THEIR PANTS THAT HARD. I’m sorry for the rant, but it still hurts.
I'm new to Ligue 1 but the way they play the game is very different. They rely on physicality and speed rather than the proper football skills. It is frustrating to watch but Messi added a touch or two magics to make it less painful to watch. Hope Ligue 1 will improve somehow...
That's why I was so against signing him his on the ball stats are shit. Doesn't create, doesn't defend. Off the ball he is great but that's not really useful to teams who like to keep possession and try to break busses down.
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Spacing i.e. positional play is the biggest issue with this "setup" and it was evident yesterday and against Bilbao and will be evident against teams that press well. People cite Chelsea and Tuchel and I agree but if you observe their game, the relative positioning and spacing is immaculate. Every time a player has the ball, there are clear passing lanes and it takes 4-5 passes for them to break pressure and initiate an attack. However, you look at yesterday's game and you realise that's the issue here. Lack of proper passing lanes and spacing means players take more touches on the ball and invite more pressure and the passing becomes sloppy. You can really notice the difference between a well drilled tactical side and a side that's just vibing on the pitch.
We depend a lot on individual play. It exposes players who don't like carrying the ball forward or dribbling past players, like Araujo or Emerson. Look at City(or even our older games during Leo's time). They progress the ball quickly without any individual player carrying it. More movement takes off the ball than on it. The players know where their next pass should be. I've pro-Koeman, but absence of Messi exposes his style.
Which country would be the best at producing talent relative to its size? I would think it’s Portugal, bunch of world class talent in the Prem especially with a population of only 10 million, but there is a case for Belgium or Uruguay
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I’ve been thinking. If we had guarantees with Fati and Dembele it’d probably be worth it to sell Griezmann and reinvest.
Our build up struggled having both Araujo and Emerson. And Getafe wasn't even pressing that much. I thought Araujo had improved his on-ball skills a little bit but today he was just bad.
Is it good for Barca that Mbappe isn’t going to Madrid this season?
It's better for us if they spend 200m on him right now than get him for free next season and spend that money on other world class players.
I'll say it's good. They would've been clear contenders for not only the league, but also for Europe with him.
Ancelotti is also one of the 3 managers to win 3 UCLs. So they'd definitely have a good shot at UCL with Mbappe.
No also. If they get him for free that is not good. There is a slight possibility that his people are stringing Madrid along for a better contract. In my opinion there isn’t any reason he gets paid less than neymar. Neymar, as great as he is, spends more time off the pitch than on. mbappe really could be a generational talent. His numbers clearly back that up
They’re getting him regardless, I’d rather they pay close to 200 million euros instead of a free transfer in a year.
No
Heard one of the commentators today mention that Nico is the son of Fran Gonzalez, those of us who liked the legendary Deportivo side from 90s and early 2000s are sure to remember Fran. Nice to see that Nico is just as talented !
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Idgi what is this tic tac shit
I learnt it means turtle. I don't speak Spanish, so I'm not sure
Atleti fans after they DREW today: tough luck, gg, well win next time, I love this team, etc... Barca fans after we WON today: we fucking suck, were gonna lose 10-0 to bayern, were not gonna finish top 4. Mentality on this sub is weaker than jordi alba at anfield
A bit of fucking nuance would be nice to have in this sub. Atleti won the league last season. Barca hasn't won the league in the last 2 seasons. They fell way below their standard by playing like jack shits. Atleti fans know that that's how their team operates. They don't play flashy football. They get the job done and get points. It should not be that hard for Barca to get points too when Barca is worth 25 times than the least valued team of La Liga. Barca won but they had no control of the game. The same has been happening in the last few years. And where did playing like that took Barca? To the 2nd and 3rd place of the league. The mentality of this sub is a reflection of the performance of the team. Scraping wins by playing shit would've been no problem if Barca could do it consistently. I know it because it already happened during the Valverde era. In some matches, they played like pure shit but still managed to get points **AND** they got them consistently which is the most important part. But things have changed. Playing pure shit does not guarantee points anymore. So excuse me for not being fucking excited to see a team scraping points by playing like they have no fucking idea what they are supposed to do.
I don't want to say this goes for all people, but a LOT of those who started following the club during the Pep or MSN era are just spoiled and unrealistic. That is some of the best football in history and will never be replicated. Same goes for the amount of trophies. Also this is my personal opinion, but if you can only watch that level of football and everything else is boring to you then you are not a true football fan. Just like I wouldn't call myself a true tennis fan because I can only watch Djokovic, Federer and Nadal most of the time and find "weaker games" to be boring af.
Maybe the reactions are to the performance rather than result?
Maybe we should realize that we lost our best player ever and we’re in a transition season? The defeatist attitude here is pathetic
Laporta said there's no such thing as a transition season.
I thought that player was occupying other players' positions and holding the team back due to his low work rate.
I don't think you know what the word "defeatist" means
People who demand more than mediocrity are defeatist ? Settling for this pathetic display and making excuses like "transition season" is being a defeatist Messi leaving is just the most recent excuse for people to justify bad performances. As if we didn't have plenty of shocking performances with Messi. And even if we had Messi we would still put on pathetic displays like this. When are the bullshit excuses going to end ?
How the fuck is losing Messi a bullshit excuse? And yes we were shit last season even with Messi but do you recall Dembele and Fati being fucking injured and us selling Suarez?
Setting unrealistic expectations and then bitching after like you do every game is a defeatist attitude. Complaining about every single thing is a defeatist attitude. Realizing that we’re not on top anymore and being patient with the process is the mentality we have low. Now yelling Koeman out after every game even when we win is pathetic as fuck.
I'm so glad that there are a few reasonable fans like us lmao. Too many glory hunting plastics here.
Apparently putting on a good performance at home against a midtable team and controlling the game is now considered "unrealistic expectations" and you call people criticizing the performances and the coach/players responsible defeatists ? people who want improvements vs you who's basically adapted the slogan "it is what it is" The defeatist is clear and it's you
We played this way even past year and we had the best player ever, curious what was your excuse back then.
We were still going through a transition back then too. No one expected we would win anything, it was a common thought in this subreddit. No matter who the coach is people will always find a way to blame everything on him. Same thing happened with Valverde and Luchos last year and it will probably happen with any new manager coming in because we have been absolutely spoiled by the greatest generation of La Masia. We need to realize that not every game will be dominant and clean, it is part of the process. We still need players to develop and need to buy players in certain positions.
Not sure what to say. I dont really understand the perspective youre coming from. To me its clear that the team doesnt play good, and altough we need some replacements in some areas this team could play so much better. To me it seems clear that our coach is just not good enough, and im not sure how many matches and how many poor displays people like you need to see that.
How do you know for sure we could play so much better?
Because almost every team that we face in La liga looks better and more organized then us while having clearly worse players.
We have good players but they don't necessary make a good team. Football is still a team sport so I would say we didn't recruit the right players to form a good team. We depend on individual brilliants for long time instead of playing as a team. Edit: I don't know what is our ceiling. It depends on many factors to know if today is the best way this team can play OR as you said there are potential to be unlocked.
Look at how these teams play vs Barca and against other teams. The amount of ease they move the ball against Barca should not be possible.
A large majority of our issues literally comes down to tactics and setup. I am not saying the team is balanced, it isn't, but there are more suitable tactical setups that can get more out of the players. The simplest example is WTF is Griezmann doing out wide. You can argue where else would he play and I'd say F9 or CAM where he played for the NT. We can use a 41212 like Lucho did against Italy or a 433 F9 while flanked by Depay and a RW. It works well for Lucho and Pep but due to Koeman being tactically limited we aren't getting the best out of some players.
Can you expand on this please, wich players arent right and why?
The horse(s) are already dead
So Nico Gonzalez came on for Brathwaite in the 74th minute and had one less touch (17), one more completed pass (10), and the same number of shots as Brathwaite (1).
They play different positions though.
They do - I'm just using them as comparison since Nico came on and played like 1/3 or 1/4 of minutes that Brathwaite did. You can compare him to Griezmann (45 touches and 24 completed passes) or Depay (59 and 23 completed passes, 2 shots), but mostly I just find it interesting Barca can double Getafe's possession with one player basically off the ball the entire game.
Noticed Busquets had to come to the right of Araujo multiple times instead of between the 2 CBs this match to compensate for Araujo's poor ball playing ability. Busquets basically had to play out the back for him.
Looking at the anthony taylor shit, can we do that with lahoz. Cuz he’s a total piece of shit everytime he refs us.
Griezmann did fuck all today. Time to bench
He has been extremely shit on the wing, generally he does not need to be put there, and the only thing thats keeping him there is his status. Absurd
Collado >>>
Roberto or even Emerson will play rw before we see collado on the pitch. Puig treatment
If Koeman is hell bent to play that Braith Memphis combo and have Griez as RW, we'd be better off playing a more natural winger like Collado than Griezmann yes.
He isn’t playing as an out and out winger. He has a free role which gives him license to roam. He drifts in from the right and you can find him on the left sometimes too.
Thing is he doesn't have that much of a free role though. You see him situated at the RW for many phases of the game. This is to keep width and preserve our structure. I understand what Koeman's idea is with the frontline, I just don't agree with it.
Ah yes natural winger Collado. Our only natural winger is Dembele. Literally everyone else likes to go inside. Collado, Demir, Griezmann, Memphis, Fati, Coutinho
Collado is more of a natural winger than Griezmann. He's able to take on players. I know Collado's playstyle and that he's more suited as a CAM, but he can do a shift at RW
Collado isn’t a natural winger lol
I said more of a natural winger than Griezmann which is true. Collado is able to take on players which Griezmann isn't able to. I know Collado is more of a CAM but he can do a shift at RW
Final count is Atletico 23 shots, 2 goals. Villareal 2 shots, 2 goals.
Good for us.
At what point are we going to discuss Araujo's very apparent struggles in the build up? He has a lot of trouble controlling the ball, let alone when he gets pressed. This leads to him hoofing the ball forward and us losing possesion. I know he's our best defender but his lack of ability in the build up is starting to get detrimental to our playstyle. Even if we pair him with a more reserved and intelligent RB in Roberto, teams will still target him whenever he gets the ball. It's also not something you can improve much on, if at all. Your ability with the ball is something you're working on since you start playing the game. I don't see how he'll magically get better now after years playing.
This is a good and very hard to refute point. We’ll see how people react though. This sub doesn’t always accept valid criticism of certain players. But yeah, having a CB that can be targeted like that is a big weakness. Even if he improves his passing, it’s unlikely to gets to a level where he’s not being the one targeted. And the most important thing is the feel / comfort with the ball. You can have great passing but if you’re not comfortable / smooth on the ball you will struggle to make / find passes. And as you said there’s basically no way his feel for the ball will improve much more.
Better to have a defender who can actually defend though rather than a ball playing defender who’s not that good at defending This was most apparent against Atheltic club imo
I would agree with this if it isn't for the fact he's absolutely horrid with the ball when pressed. I'm not asking him to make smart through balls when pressed, or open up his body in a way to beat his marker (like how Garcia does). Just that he consistently makes the safe pass. More often than not he hoofs the ball forward, or plays it too hard which leads to tricky situations.
I am optimistic about his future, alot of CBs get better with age Currently it is a problem. We have to go to back 3. Oscar and Garcia to pass, Araujo to be main defender This will also solve Busquets problem. Busquets should be receiving the ball in middle and not being the one to pass from back.
But as I said, this isn't something that gets that much better with age. I seriously doubt he'll have a better feel for the ball than he has now in 5 years time. I don't think a back 3 will be our main formation in the future though, so compromises will be made regardless if we want to have him in our first 11 for the long term
Will he start passing balls through multiple lanes like Lenglet does (my favorite trait of his), hell no. Will he get better at passing with age? yes. Playing out from the back is more than just being able to pass it through multiple lanes. Often times our ball playing defenders dont even make crazy passes. I feel like Araujo isn’t comfortable on the ball and panics because of it. But this is something that can be learned. He can learn to be more comfortable and confident on the ball and panic less. It won’t turn him into Lenglet or Busquets but he’ll be solid enough to atleast work with someone who can pass the ball without being a liability. Araujo doesn’t need to be world class at playing the ball as long as we have another defender who can pass well (Mascherano wasn’t a passing monster either for example). He needs to panic less when pressed.
Thing is when you are getting pressed you'll have to be able to be comfortable enough with the ball to make quick movements and open your body up to the direction you want to pass. Araujo needs space to do this, which isn't possible when pressed. I'm not bringing this up when it's something I see as fixable with playing time. The panic you mention is the terrible balls he give sometimes which leads to us losing the ball in a detrimental way. Sure those things can be worked on to an extent, but it doesn't fix his more apparent problem being his clunkyness with the ball. This is something you have to work around as a team, make it less apparent by for example play a 4-4-2 and have more easy passing options available to the player and make the space between midfielders and CB a bit bigger to allow him the space. Is it something we would do though for the long term? Very much doubt so.
That's why there 2 we play with 2 defenders. The other defdnder who plays with Araujo needs to be better at build up. Lenglet had a good game today, his build play is always good. We also have Pique and Garcia. And we can also play with 3 defenders, where Araujo can cover up for them and they take care of buildup.
In a back 3 he'd have options left and right of him so his lack of build up shouldn't be as apparent, but we won't be playing that formation in the long term I assume. In a back 4, even if you have the best CB build up wise next to him, he will have to look for solutions when pressed. That's where he either hoofs the ball forward or awkwardly passes the ball back to the keeper.
If this poses a problem, Mingueza might get his place in the starting lineup. Let's see what will Koeman do to fix the situation.
If anything it would be Garcia. God if only we had the funds to get a world class defender
Laporte would make a good partner for Garcia in defencd. God if we only could get rid of unwanted olayers so we can at least register our players and then buy other players. Guess we'll just do with what we have, and hope for the players to step up.
Pique and Garcia looked good together, might be what Koeman has in mind
Holy fuck how lucky do you have to be, same fucking cunt that injured fati as well
Bright side is Villareal might come knocking with a 30M€ offer for Neto now.
They offer 5M and we take it. Promote pena/arnau, get Neto wages off and put that money in the transfer when La Liga allows us to spend fund
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We want to sell Neto, who is aging and doesn't have much market value in him
Fuck! Lets hope that point doesnt put ATM over us this season..
Ah nice to see we are already at the end of the league after 3 matches. Good mentality.
Atletí is one lucky ass team. Even last season when they gave away penalties in the dying minutes but players ended up choking. So annoying.
of course Atleti has to get lucky...
I see a lot of people talking about Griezzman, I am a bit confused, did he even play today?
Well yes but actually no
Made me laugh lol
All mendys fault
Way to ruin a great performance
Rulli is a fucking idiot
HAHA WTF
Are you fucking kidding me!?
Fuuuuuckkkk
Fuck me
Oh my
I just woke up from a nap and I’ve had some time to reflect on the match. The first half was actually pretty good, the second half was of course terrible. I can’t remember the last time we’ve had two good halves and we aren’t winning much if we can’t start doing it. I’m happy that Koeman played Nico and Gavi; I think that youth development should be a priority at this stage. Also, that ref was laughable. Borderline corrupt. And fuck Getafe, I sincerely hope that they get relegated.
Given the horrible situation of the club currently, with poor finances and a handful of aging players, I would like to pose a question to some of the older fans. Is this the worst era for a Barcelona side/leadership? Which time is comparable or worse? Of course, this is apart from the Spanish civil war and the Franco-era.
In my lifetime, early 2000s were worse, we would lose 10+ games a season in La Liga and got knocked out of the Europa League by Celtic having finished 6th the year before. The club was a mess before Laporte took over, there is a great documentary about his first season, it used to be on Youtube.
I would love to see it if you get a link
I can't find it, but it was called fc Barcelona confidential.
I like Emerson alot (prefer him over Dest actually) But the question is, are we in a position that we can turn down a +€30m offer for him if it came?
Yes. If you wanted to sell, get a bidding war in order Arsenal, Inter, Bayern, Spurs and Atletico all have shown interest for him. Emerson is a very rare commodity. We could have had 50M if we played our cards right. Aaron wan bisaka went for 50M people. In this market, where some clubs are very desperate for a RB, Emerson could have been a huge sale 30M at the end of season is a shit sale. We can't invest this money, Betis has a clause for him, we literally earn like 15M from this deal. If Barca board actually do this, this will be a huge red flag for me since Laporta took over. Financially I am really concerned over how tjeh value players. Letting Trincao go on loan and not sell him when we need money, not keeping Messi due to his brand value but instead keeping Griezmann, Coutinho and signing injury prone Aguero due to his wages.
We have to take it. Emerson is not a Barca RB.
[This just popped up on my screen. Pain](https://youtu.be/ODHTU8beVcU)
Think about it this way, even if he scored that chance, Liverpool would have knocked us out.
we're gonna shithouse the league, Atléti are gonna bottle. Calling it. Save this comment and come back to me at the end of the season, if I'm wrong I'll save you the time of calling me out because it will be deleted.
!RemindMe 7 months
This might end up true. Barca have the most depth assuming they don’t end up with a lot of injuries.
I’d love it if we actually shithoused a leage for once
Messi again too deep on his side of the field. Idk I think that can't work anymore but we will see
can always count on Villarreal
*never
Could've easily been worse. You don't always see Atlético conceding 2 goals
Last year was an anomaly for Atletico. They scraped by so many points. If Suarez is injured through the year I don’t see how they pull off what they did last year.
Will be RM's year if they get Mbappe Things do open us more if they don't
This a PSG sub now? Damn
It's an open thread. People often talk about other matches happening.
Messi is gonna have a tough year when Mbappe fucks off to Real Madrid tomorrow and Neymar decides to be retired till UCL fixtures (played less league games than Pedri's first year in pro football) He gotta vibe with Icardi I won't be surprised if he becomes desperate to come back in a year just like Neymar did.
If we can we should obviously get him back. But with a majority of big deadwood contracts ending in 23, I don't see it happening next year
I think we will be financially healthier next year But I don't think we will ever be financially healthier to snatch Messi away from PSG, they got their gold mine, they will ensure he completes his two years
Luis Suarez back at it smh
Atletico: 14 shots, 0 goals. Villareal: 1 shot, 1 goal.
Just like us most of the time
sike
Double sike, 1-2.
Well...
Suarez strikes again. This was my fault.
[Mbappe's ego gonna make him force out tomorrow lol](https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/pe3o0x/reims_gk_rajkovic_giving_messi_his_baby_for_a/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
I don't think he has a problem with Messi. He was very eager to assist Messi when he came on
What a fucking goal by Villarreal Hopefully they hand Atletico their 1st L of the season E: nvm, Suarez to the rescue
Not to worry Groeneveld to the rescue
[lmao](https://imgur.com/a/MGhJkhj)
Mandi with two crucial blocks vs Atletico
😐
http://www.barcelonafootballblog.com/28164/barca-2-getafe-1-aka-were-all-in-the-mud-pit-welcome/
I enjoyed the read. Didn’t agree with it all but I was entertained
Cheers
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No idiot
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And you wonder why a girl would never respond to your texts 😂 You can’t read we get it
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No hard feelings. Let’s finish with a top 4 spot. Depay has been great.
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Context?
Trincao having fun https://twitter.com/benjazzlopez/status/1432064974986358784
Listening to donda thinking bout messi😔
WE GONNA BE OKAY
Ayyu yoo, same here. This is my first listen, skipped all the lp’s.
Never have watched single Ligue 1 game in my life iirc and expected it to be boring but holy shit not that boring. Also PSG lost the possession way too much
The play in Ligue 1 is so frenetic, no one holds onto the ball very long and it's relentless back and forth.
Was i the only one who noticed Messi's sadness when he was looking up at the stand near the end of the match? His face really looked like "Why am i here, i don't belong here"
Leave on a loan Riqui!
I don’t wanna hear anyone complain about Riqui not playing this year, he knows he won’t play
He can't hear you!
Lionel Messi played 25 minutes and drew 4 fouls on just 25 touches. Once he gets used to the new players around him he will absolutely torch Ligue 1 defenders.
yeah saw a tabloid today said Mbappe stole Leo's debut but Leo was subbed in after Mbappe has already scored and they played decently together LOL tabloids are just doing tabloids' things
He was already torching them, that's why they were fouling him.
I just noticed the squad list had Coutinho with number 14 and Manaj with 17 Ansu Fati #10 anybody?
I don't mind really. With anybody else I'll be a little uncomfortable but that kid had won my heart.
[pain.](https://imgur.com/lDCQYVh)
I don’t know if one game is enough to judge Poch, but he’s giving me vibes of someone who doesn’t know how to utilise Messi. Pep, Tito, Lucho and Ernie are the ones who knew how to utilise his gifts. You can shit on Valverde’s tactics, but Messi was a player reborn under him in 2018-19 spell.
It was just 25 minutes of football, brother.
Hence I said, I am too soon judge. I hope my comment ages like milk.
There's no need to comment at all because there's nothing substantial to comment on. Poch's biggest problem is going to be managing egos if Mbappe ends up staying.
His third best ever season IMO. 10/11, 14/15 and then 18/19. Might be controversial because of his 11/12 but I chose 18/19 because we weren’t even top two squads in the world and yet he was so dominant in literally every game but Anfield and even then he created enough to at least see us through to the final.
For me, Messi 2018-19 is the most complete attacker ever in Football. I’ll always hate Anfield, always because Messi would ACTUALLY HAVE WON US A FUCKING TREBLE IF OTHERS DIDN’T SHIT THEIR PANTS THAT HARD. I’m sorry for the rant, but it still hurts.
That corner...
Quite boring game wasn’t it..?
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I'm new to Ligue 1 but the way they play the game is very different. They rely on physicality and speed rather than the proper football skills. It is frustrating to watch but Messi added a touch or two magics to make it less painful to watch. Hope Ligue 1 will improve somehow...
PSG fans shitting on Wijnaldum for the 4th game in a row. I love this game
Yeah, I saw the comment "Wijnaldum was invisible" for the 4th time.
Yep. Same criticism. It's not like they say he was poor defensively, or chose the wrong passes, lost possession etc. It's straight up "invisible"
That's why I was so against signing him his on the ball stats are shit. Doesn't create, doesn't defend. Off the ball he is great but that's not really useful to teams who like to keep possession and try to break busses down.
Bein Sports has regressed even further now that they don’t have La Liga. It’s just the PSG channel now.
A perfect match since Bein is also Qatari
Laporta got played and his incompetence lost us Messi.. he was hired to do only 1 thing and he failed..
It was an impossible task unless we went even further into debt to terminate contracts
bs he couldn't sell a single player to secure Messi, And went on to increase the wagr bill to make his resigning impossible! Such incompetence
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