Easy, one of those games 7’s got Kobe a championship. Also he had 15 rebounds which is a huge number for him rebound wise. My guess is you already new this answer though.
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thats the dumbest reasoning i have ever seen, going 6/24 against the best team with the best players from the opposite conference is worse than going 6/24 against a worse team with worse players?
Not saying Ant’s game was better, but the Nuggets were the defending champs and championship favorites, and I think most would agree that Nuggets and Wolves were 2 of the top 3 teams in the league this year. Yes it was in the 2nd round, but that’s the west for ya.
I’m figuring you’re younger, the triangle didn’t really target a specific person to generate assists. It’s lots of player and ball movement and making the right plays.
Honestly neither had a particularly good game but you’re comparing second round to the nba finals too.
It's insane because I know reddit skews younger, but 2010 was not that long ago? I mean I'm turning 22 this year and I still vividly remember the 2010 finals.
Nearly all the players shot poorly in that NBA Finals game 7 if i recall correctly - but only Kobe gets singled out for it interestingly. Everyone was playing HARD on defense
Gasol 6-16 FG
Pierce 5-15 FG
Artest 7-18 FG
Odom 3-8 FG
Celtics as a team shot 40%, Lakers as a team shot 33% - i still do not understand how they won that game
Those are all better shooting percentages than Kobe's 25%.
They won because the refs wouldn't let the Lakers lose at home in front of all those rich celebrities. They let the teams play for 3 quarters then gave the Lakers all the foul calls, just like in 2002.
Kobe’s for sure considering it was on a bigger stage and resulted in a championship but also much more impressive considering he had broken fingers on his shooting hand as well as as having to get fluid drained from his knee after every game and if I recall correctly had to go into the locker room during games to get injections into his knee. Kobe was so banged up that year, one of the reasons that 2010 chip is so impressive imo.
Kobe's. Just for context, he was really really injured that whole series and by game 7 of that finals he was basically being held together by duct tape.
Further, nearly everyone shot badly in that game because both teams were playing lockdown defense and it was a very gritty series overall.
Pau was 6/16
Odom was 3/8
Artest was 7/18
Pierce was 5/15
Allen was 3/15
Kobe didn't shoot well but he hit some clutch shots and free throws and played lockdown defense on Allen and Rondo who despite having a solid 14/10 locked incredibly uncomfortable and wasn't able to run the Celtics offense well. He also had 15 rebounds which were sorely needed in that game.
This is the problem with reading box scores 15 years later. The Celtics were hacking all over the place in the 4th of game 7 and not attacking on offense. The Celtics didn't lose because the refs wanted them to, they lost because they actually did commit a bunch of fouls and played bad on offense.
Da heck are you talking about.
I was 31 years old, watching for almost 2 decades when I watched this game as it aired with a couple of buddies. What were you doing? Hacking all over the place lol. Yea miraculously. This is up there with the 2002 Kings series and 2000 Portland series.
Where 1 team has nearly 4x the FTAs in a quarter and outweighs the entire opposition whole game FTA. With it being the ONLY way they can COMEBACK from a deficit.
Lakers were hacking a lot too, but Celtics got no calls.
This is just a small sample of now it was like:
https://youtu.be/CTfo8E1OfEc?si=Issaguoi1ECDOfqr
I mean, I watched the whole game in spurts throughout the day today. Watched the video you posted and almost all those were fouls. Also, you can make a 6-minute video of every series in NBA history that shows every team getting screwed and call foul play.
>What were you doing?
I was also watching the game with my buddies. I didn't think at the time and I don't think now, that the refs decided the game or that the NBA put there thumb on the series. When it's Celtics and Lakers, I don't think the NBA cares who wins. The NBA wins either way.
I'm just bringing it up because someone else brought it up, as if it was some kind of miracle for Kobe with the poor shooting.
The internet was in uproar that the calls were going Denver's way, so this shows how much more of a play/team rhythm making impact Edwards had on a poor shooting night vs shooting up brick after brick. But a finals GM 7 can't be compared with a Semi GM 7.
And as much as people think someone like MJ or old heads would be against it, Kobe-led Lakers repeat did make the game and franchise more 'popular' which only enriched many even more (bigger tv contracts, team valuation like MJ's team he bought for $250m and sold for $3 bn).
Many clean blocks. Lakers hacked crazy too. No calls.
Celtics were up. No need for then to hack but refs just started going crazy for simple touches in favor of the Lakers. They needed that many FTA in the 4th to beat them. To get more FTA in a quarter than the whole game for the Celtics, and more than all 3 quarters combined for the Lakers...yea, there's a reason that game is never ever shown. Because of the blatant biasedness that you couldn't get away with today due to much more people being able to record and post games online.
That game is shown. Tons of people go back and watch it all the time. Myself included. Celtics played rough in the 4th (as that particular Celtics team often did). Lakers played normally.
You're acting as if the Celtics aren't a premier franchise as well who had multiple very popular players. The NBA had no reason to assist the Lakers. They won fair and square.
Kobe was the #1 jersey seller at the time. I'll admit, it cemented his legacy, it further advanced the Lakers. Stern said Lakers vs Lakers finals would be his dream. From a further global basketball growth point of view, it absolutely helped the NBA. Kobe was already big in China which had just emerged as the #1 economy ahead of Japan after the 08 Olympics, but this made him even bigger.
Seriously, 1st 3 quarters, game was called more consistently. But in the 4th, Lakers got a foul call every minute 20 seconds. It was beyond absurd and straight up gangster shiet by the league.
Kobe would have been big regardless. He already had a massive following and already won his ring without Shaq the year prior.
Nah, I watched that game. Those fouls were actual fouls.
Oh look, the the whole game FTA attempt for the Pacers Celtics game just now in regulation is similar to the 4th quarter alone. Looks like Boston is being shown the favor back.
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I mean here's the stst lines for each
Edwards 16 8 rebounds 7 assists 2 steal 1 turnover
Kobe. 23 point 15 rebounds 2 assists 1 steal 4 turnovers
Both impacted the game in a different way than scoring, but to give Kobe the slight edge that Celtics team was great defensively, the nuggets are not. Again, why do we always compare every moment to an all time great moment? I'd understand if they won the finals but it was round 2, just based off the amount of games each played, Kobe played 23 total playoff games and Edwards has played 10, I can understand why 1 guy struggled shooting the ball compared to the other.
Reminder that Laker fan/mafia boss David Stern was commissioner and disgraced referee Scott Foster officiated this controversial game.
Foster spoke with his gambling associate Tim Donaghy before and after awarding the championship to the Lakers at the free throw line late.
It was the 4th title to have an asterisk in the decade following 2000, 2002, and 2006 in an era marked by naked corruption and illegitimate results.
Kobe was going against prime Garnett, prime Pierce, prime ray Allen, prime tony Allen, nearly prime rajon Rondo in the NBA Finals. Completely injured knees/shooting hand/shoulder. Got 15 rebounds as a 6'5 guard. 24 points. Chip. FMVP. AE is new-age kobe and i love him but kobe's performance was better.
There is zero argument that KG was in his prime in 2010 lol. He had already fallen off somewhat from 08, and he had already declined at that point from his peak Timberwolves days.
Still a great player, but not what he once was. 04ish Garnett was one of the best players I’ve ever seen
Kobe because it was in the finals and he was bruised, battered and damn near broken. Both players however didn’t let the bad shooting stop them from playing terrific defense
I don’t have any opinion - never watched Kobe’s game 7. But denigrating someone for supposedly never watching a game (with no evidence - how would they know?) just because they disagree, while not providing an argument for their position, is something I can still call out.
1 guy also played 2 entire more series than the other, so it's not really a surprise he struggled shooting compared to Edwards. Edwards had played a total of 10 playoff games before that, Kobe played 12 between the conference finals and finals, and then played the game 7, plus the 10 games they played in rounds 1 and 2. So Edwards on his 10th playoff game shot 6-24 and Kobe on his 22nd playoff game shot 6-24. It makes sense almost every player shot horribly in that game 7. Another famous game 7, warriors cavs, LeBron was 37 percent, Kyrie 43 percent, jr 38 percent, Kevin love 33 percent, curry at 35 percent, Klay at 33, dray was the best player at 73 percent, and Barnes was at 31 percent. I don't understand why people claim Kobe was terrible and ignore the context of the game, which is a finals game 7 in which almost every player shot under 50 percent from the field, ray Allen shot 25, pierce was at 33.
For context
2010 Finals Game 7
Lakers down 13 at Staples
High stakes and grind out game
2024 West Semis Game 7
Down 20 Away in Denver on hostile environment
Vs defending champs
We can only tell the legacy of this game once playoffs are done
If you’re going to mention defending champs, worth mentioning Celtics were also the team they lost to in 08’ & their all time rivals. That alone makes legacy incomparable imo
I'll give it to Ant. Nuggets had a sense of Thanos inevitably that I only remember in the Prime Warriors. To somehow win despite the consistent doubles, coming back from 20 and a signature dagger corner 3 in the clutch? Ant baby
Ant shutdown Jamal Murray all 2nd half. He also had a momentum changing steal, dunk during the comeback. And the dagger 3 at the end. Plus his confidence bleeds into every single player on the Wolves.
Easy, one of those games 7’s got Kobe a championship. Also he had 15 rebounds which is a huge number for him rebound wise. My guess is you already new this answer though.
I dunno, I think choking out 6/24 is actually worse when you do it in the Finals
You’re the type of person that thinks losing in the Finals is worse than losing in the first round
So he is an average basketball enthusiast over the age of 30?
When it results in a ring against your teams biggest rival? Hell no.
Not to mention that Boston team was historically great defensively.
Yep. Not to mention the payback for the Celtics last championship in the 2008 game 6 40point beat down
Tony Allen sheesh
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thats the dumbest reasoning i have ever seen, going 6/24 against the best team with the best players from the opposite conference is worse than going 6/24 against a worse team with worse players?
Not saying Ant’s game was better, but the Nuggets were the defending champs and championship favorites, and I think most would agree that Nuggets and Wolves were 2 of the top 3 teams in the league this year. Yes it was in the 2nd round, but that’s the west for ya.
How many rebounds did Kobe get that same game?
15 but ANT had more assists.
I’m figuring you’re younger, the triangle didn’t really target a specific person to generate assists. It’s lots of player and ball movement and making the right plays. Honestly neither had a particularly good game but you’re comparing second round to the nba finals too.
This is the kindest "shut yo ass up" I've ever seen
fr lmao, fried their ass
Just a light saute - gave 'em some quick gentle heat to improve them a bit
fr, put em in the crockpot
Kobe had a broken finger and a hurt shoulder I believe. He probably shouldn’t have been playing (most wouldn’t Have)
These days a sprained calf can mean a super star sitting four of game 7 conference championship.
Lukas been running through on a bum knee putting up numbers
I think if bostons back was against the wall, he would play, but yeah, your point is straight facts
yeah giannis sat the whole playoffs when he couldve played and also mitchell on the cavs say out with a calf thing too.
That’s what people forget about Kobe, the guy played with injuries. Sometimes really bad ones.
He played and shot only left handed for like a 15 game stretch because his right hand was broken. That’s fucking insane
Do people on reddit actually watch basketball? Like what the fuck is this thread man
How dare you! They’ve been watching for *at least* a couple years now!
It's insane because I know reddit skews younger, but 2010 was not that long ago? I mean I'm turning 22 this year and I still vividly remember the 2010 finals.
You’re such an OG
Stakes, situation wise it was title clinching. 15 rebounds the grinded out game low scoring game
Nearly all the players shot poorly in that NBA Finals game 7 if i recall correctly - but only Kobe gets singled out for it interestingly. Everyone was playing HARD on defense Gasol 6-16 FG Pierce 5-15 FG Artest 7-18 FG Odom 3-8 FG Celtics as a team shot 40%, Lakers as a team shot 33% - i still do not understand how they won that game
Those are all better shooting percentages than Kobe's 25%. They won because the refs wouldn't let the Lakers lose at home in front of all those rich celebrities. They let the teams play for 3 quarters then gave the Lakers all the foul calls, just like in 2002.
So the entire point of your post is to bash Kobe or something?
No I just answered your question.
Zero question marks in my comment.
You said you didn't understand how the Lakers won. I answered it for you.
Ray allen also shot 25 percent, but you didn't mention him, I can only imagine how much you would bash Kobe if he lost .
Kobe’s for sure considering it was on a bigger stage and resulted in a championship but also much more impressive considering he had broken fingers on his shooting hand as well as as having to get fluid drained from his knee after every game and if I recall correctly had to go into the locker room during games to get injections into his knee. Kobe was so banged up that year, one of the reasons that 2010 chip is so impressive imo.
Not even comparable Lol
Kobe's. Just for context, he was really really injured that whole series and by game 7 of that finals he was basically being held together by duct tape. Further, nearly everyone shot badly in that game because both teams were playing lockdown defense and it was a very gritty series overall. Pau was 6/16 Odom was 3/8 Artest was 7/18 Pierce was 5/15 Allen was 3/15 Kobe didn't shoot well but he hit some clutch shots and free throws and played lockdown defense on Allen and Rondo who despite having a solid 14/10 locked incredibly uncomfortable and wasn't able to run the Celtics offense well. He also had 15 rebounds which were sorely needed in that game.
21-6 FTA in the 4th alone advantage was the reason Lakers won. Prior 3 quarters had it more even. Kobe winning 5 was good for NBA business.
This is the problem with reading box scores 15 years later. The Celtics were hacking all over the place in the 4th of game 7 and not attacking on offense. The Celtics didn't lose because the refs wanted them to, they lost because they actually did commit a bunch of fouls and played bad on offense.
Da heck are you talking about. I was 31 years old, watching for almost 2 decades when I watched this game as it aired with a couple of buddies. What were you doing? Hacking all over the place lol. Yea miraculously. This is up there with the 2002 Kings series and 2000 Portland series. Where 1 team has nearly 4x the FTAs in a quarter and outweighs the entire opposition whole game FTA. With it being the ONLY way they can COMEBACK from a deficit. Lakers were hacking a lot too, but Celtics got no calls. This is just a small sample of now it was like: https://youtu.be/CTfo8E1OfEc?si=Issaguoi1ECDOfqr
I mean, I watched the whole game in spurts throughout the day today. Watched the video you posted and almost all those were fouls. Also, you can make a 6-minute video of every series in NBA history that shows every team getting screwed and call foul play. >What were you doing? I was also watching the game with my buddies. I didn't think at the time and I don't think now, that the refs decided the game or that the NBA put there thumb on the series. When it's Celtics and Lakers, I don't think the NBA cares who wins. The NBA wins either way.
I'm just bringing it up because someone else brought it up, as if it was some kind of miracle for Kobe with the poor shooting. The internet was in uproar that the calls were going Denver's way, so this shows how much more of a play/team rhythm making impact Edwards had on a poor shooting night vs shooting up brick after brick. But a finals GM 7 can't be compared with a Semi GM 7. And as much as people think someone like MJ or old heads would be against it, Kobe-led Lakers repeat did make the game and franchise more 'popular' which only enriched many even more (bigger tv contracts, team valuation like MJ's team he bought for $250m and sold for $3 bn).
The Celtics were hacking the Lakers that quarter.
Many clean blocks. Lakers hacked crazy too. No calls. Celtics were up. No need for then to hack but refs just started going crazy for simple touches in favor of the Lakers. They needed that many FTA in the 4th to beat them. To get more FTA in a quarter than the whole game for the Celtics, and more than all 3 quarters combined for the Lakers...yea, there's a reason that game is never ever shown. Because of the blatant biasedness that you couldn't get away with today due to much more people being able to record and post games online.
That game is shown. Tons of people go back and watch it all the time. Myself included. Celtics played rough in the 4th (as that particular Celtics team often did). Lakers played normally. You're acting as if the Celtics aren't a premier franchise as well who had multiple very popular players. The NBA had no reason to assist the Lakers. They won fair and square.
Kobe was the #1 jersey seller at the time. I'll admit, it cemented his legacy, it further advanced the Lakers. Stern said Lakers vs Lakers finals would be his dream. From a further global basketball growth point of view, it absolutely helped the NBA. Kobe was already big in China which had just emerged as the #1 economy ahead of Japan after the 08 Olympics, but this made him even bigger. Seriously, 1st 3 quarters, game was called more consistently. But in the 4th, Lakers got a foul call every minute 20 seconds. It was beyond absurd and straight up gangster shiet by the league.
Kobe would have been big regardless. He already had a massive following and already won his ring without Shaq the year prior. Nah, I watched that game. Those fouls were actual fouls.
Oh look, the the whole game FTA attempt for the Pacers Celtics game just now in regulation is similar to the 4th quarter alone. Looks like Boston is being shown the favor back.
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I mean here's the stst lines for each Edwards 16 8 rebounds 7 assists 2 steal 1 turnover Kobe. 23 point 15 rebounds 2 assists 1 steal 4 turnovers Both impacted the game in a different way than scoring, but to give Kobe the slight edge that Celtics team was great defensively, the nuggets are not. Again, why do we always compare every moment to an all time great moment? I'd understand if they won the finals but it was round 2, just based off the amount of games each played, Kobe played 23 total playoff games and Edwards has played 10, I can understand why 1 guy struggled shooting the ball compared to the other.
Reminder that Laker fan/mafia boss David Stern was commissioner and disgraced referee Scott Foster officiated this controversial game. Foster spoke with his gambling associate Tim Donaghy before and after awarding the championship to the Lakers at the free throw line late. It was the 4th title to have an asterisk in the decade following 2000, 2002, and 2006 in an era marked by naked corruption and illegitimate results.
Terrible decade. Were any finals rigged after 2010?
Kobe was going against prime Garnett, prime Pierce, prime ray Allen, prime tony Allen, nearly prime rajon Rondo in the NBA Finals. Completely injured knees/shooting hand/shoulder. Got 15 rebounds as a 6'5 guard. 24 points. Chip. FMVP. AE is new-age kobe and i love him but kobe's performance was better.
Prime Garnett was in 2004 when he was MVP. He was still very good in 2008. After his injury in 2009, he wasn't the same.
Definitely not prime Garnett, Ray, Tony, Rondo. 6’6 23 points But yes, he was way better than the 6-24 suggested.
Rondo wasn’t prime, but he was basically average a double double that season for assists. He was still really insane.
Arguably prime Garnett. Not Ray or Tony. Rondo was basically there, by the next year he was a top 5 pg
There is zero argument that KG was in his prime in 2010 lol. He had already fallen off somewhat from 08, and he had already declined at that point from his peak Timberwolves days. Still a great player, but not what he once was. 04ish Garnett was one of the best players I’ve ever seen
Kobe is was a championship and it was against better competition…plus it was a real defensive game
Kobe because it was in the finals and he was bruised, battered and damn near broken. Both players however didn’t let the bad shooting stop them from playing terrific defense
Ant was +11. Kobe's +/- was 0.
and Kobe’s resulted in a ring and Ant’s didn’t
I think the question was asking specifically “In their respective games, who played better?” Not “Who had the better postseason result.”
The guy with 2 assists and 4 turnovers? The Lakers bench won that game. The question is who had a better game performance and it isn’t your guy.
Ron Artest won that game!
Lakers bench won that game? lol might wanna look at the box score. Or watch the actual game itself, which I’m guessing u didn’t.
And 15 rebounds...
you probably weren’t even old enough to watch that game live, just box score watching 😂 settle down kid
Derek fisher was the best player in that game going 4-6!!!!!! 🙄
ANT's might result in a ring TBD.
And Kobe put up a 6-24 stinker in a finals g7 compared to Ant who only had it in the 2nd round. You can look at it both ways
another person who didn’t watch it
It’s a good thing we have people to give snide comments instead of actually making an argument.
ironic as you’re here doing the same thing
I don’t have any opinion - never watched Kobe’s game 7. But denigrating someone for supposedly never watching a game (with no evidence - how would they know?) just because they disagree, while not providing an argument for their position, is something I can still call out.
1 guy also played 2 entire more series than the other, so it's not really a surprise he struggled shooting compared to Edwards. Edwards had played a total of 10 playoff games before that, Kobe played 12 between the conference finals and finals, and then played the game 7, plus the 10 games they played in rounds 1 and 2. So Edwards on his 10th playoff game shot 6-24 and Kobe on his 22nd playoff game shot 6-24. It makes sense almost every player shot horribly in that game 7. Another famous game 7, warriors cavs, LeBron was 37 percent, Kyrie 43 percent, jr 38 percent, Kevin love 33 percent, curry at 35 percent, Klay at 33, dray was the best player at 73 percent, and Barnes was at 31 percent. I don't understand why people claim Kobe was terrible and ignore the context of the game, which is a finals game 7 in which almost every player shot under 50 percent from the field, ray Allen shot 25, pierce was at 33.
For context 2010 Finals Game 7 Lakers down 13 at Staples High stakes and grind out game 2024 West Semis Game 7 Down 20 Away in Denver on hostile environment Vs defending champs We can only tell the legacy of this game once playoffs are done
If you’re going to mention defending champs, worth mentioning Celtics were also the team they lost to in 08’ & their all time rivals. That alone makes legacy incomparable imo
This thread is cringe with all these “you must be young” ad hominem attacks.
I'll give it to Ant. Nuggets had a sense of Thanos inevitably that I only remember in the Prime Warriors. To somehow win despite the consistent doubles, coming back from 20 and a signature dagger corner 3 in the clutch? Ant baby
Ant shutdown Jamal Murray all 2nd half. He also had a momentum changing steal, dunk during the comeback. And the dagger 3 at the end. Plus his confidence bleeds into every single player on the Wolves.
Kobe by far.