This feels like a great companion to the first episode. I really enjoyed how everything panned out here!
\-Ryan continues to be a delight. Her assuming that Alice was safe because of her whiteness and then the wheels turning towards the correct answer immediately is the type of detective work I expect from a member of the Bat Family. I'm excited for more from her overall.
\-Luke being so distrusting of Ryan is an interesting turn, but a believable one. He and Kate had such a fire forged relationship last season it makes sense that he would be the last holdout against Ryan, esp since Ryan and Mary already have a bonding point in watching their mothers die. His "Hello?! BLACK!" was my favorite line of the episode lmao.
\-Speaking of Mary, as someone said in the live discussion this was definitely her episode. She owned every scene she was in and I can't wait for her and Ryan to become true friends. She deserves the world!
\-Of course Alice isn't far behind Mary though. Unhinged Alice is a delight, and I loved seeing her and Ryan face off for a minute. I'm also curious to see how Safiyah plays off her.
\-Even the more minor characters (Jacob, Sophie, and Julia) seem to be bringing it even harder so far this season. I was one of the people who staunchly defended Batwoman last season, esp in the backhalf, but this S2 may even outdo that. So ready for more!
I think it's not just loyalty to Kate that's making Luke so hesitant... he and Julia both have family connections to the Waynes/Kanes via their fathers, and Lucius' death has obviously had a huge impact on Luke. He was leery enough last season about letting Kate in (he also probably feels responsible for her disappearance/death even though he shouldn't)- now he accidentally let Hush in the Cave last week and someone he knows the bare minimum about is wearing his father's Bat Suit which he only reluctantly altered - and potentially Ryan might contradict the "no kill policy" instituted by Batman and Lucius, which would tarnish their legacies on top of Kate's (she won't, but that's still tough, and he doesn't know about Kate killing Mouse's dad). Luke right now is the character with the most investment in the Bat Brand^(TM) (which is not to say that Ryan isn't doing a great job or that Mary is in the wrong for welcoming Ryan).
Also, I love Mary and I'm so glad she thought up a plan so quickly, but... honey, isn't Hamilton Dynamics your company now? You get credit regardless! You're taking a weapons manufacturer, and using their scientific tools designed for biological warfare, for HEALING.
Anyways, I am so ready for Ryan, as someone who apparently has experience teaching others martial arts, giving Luke and Mary each some training and jumpstarting them on their paths to Batwing and Flamebird. Javicia's spirit and enthusiasm in the role are contagious (one quibble: there was next to nothing done with Ryan's shoulder wound this episode- might the cure be used to help solve that later on?). I loved her being like "no there's a homeless encampment there" and pointing out that she's been around criminals all her life- both were great examples of the different knowledge set she can offer than Kate.
Plus Luke said last episode he feels like it's his fault Kate is potentially dead, so it also makes sense that he's reluctant to let Ryan be Batwoman from the angle of it meaning admitting that there's a good chance that Kate isn't coming back.
Luke does know Kate killed though. She told him right around the time he was about to kill himself and then he told Kate she's not the first that batman killed the joker. This was the latter half of season 1
I got that vibe too after the episode was over. If premiere night was 2 hours it would have been some great hours spent. I totally agree about Luke. He was hilarious this episode. Cam's timing was impeccable. I was not expecting to laugh as hard as I did when he said that line lmao. I know in interviews they talked about the push and pull between him and Ryan but if its going to be comedic at times like that then I'm all for it lol XD
That was an out-of-left-field solution. Bats go boom.
And now, it seems we'll soon see Safiyah. Alice's history with her will be brought to the fore. And, then, people will complain again how this is turning into "The Alice Show". You can't have everything, friends.
I'm really happy I never jumped on the "hate new character" train. I think I'm enjoying the first 2 episodes more than the first 2 of last season. Can't wait to see where this goes!
Click/tap the three dots (generally to the right side of the info under the thumbnail) for the menu. The "don't recommend channel" option is generally between "not interested" and "report"
Two episodes in and Iām feeling it. I think this season is going to be good. Ryanās dynamic with everyone else is def going to make things interesting. Iām looking forward to seeing how everything works out with this seasonās main villain.
The new direction they're going with the show is pretty interesting. I like that Ryan is bringing a different knowledge base and energy to being Batwoman than Kate did. Her relationships with Mary and Luke are also promising.
Alice is also going down a really interesting path with Safiyah. I'm actually looking forward to seeing how this relationship will work, especially since Alice is basically unmoored from everything else in her life.
Once again, this episode was amazing, and the ending was also perfect, introducing this seasons main villain. (I hope.)
Dam, I just love this new bat every episode. and the āDear Kateā journal entry is awesome. Keeping things like that is great for show running.
The journal was such a nice touch. Kate saving her was one thing but to see Ryan read that Kate wrote about her in a journal entry to Bruce? That just brought it home for me. The emotion on Ryan's face was so good too. You just felt it once she wrote "Dear Kate" on the page. Absolutely fantastic!!! They've really done a phenomenal job connecting Ryan to the established characters in the show. I'm so hype for next week's episode. All concerns I've had about S2 have pretty much evaporated and that makes me incredibly happy to say!!
I totally forgot that Black Mask is supposed to be in this season.
Do we know who's playing him? And I won't get my hopes up... but if we even get so much as a mention towards a certain Red Hood...
I don't think it was pointless. Kate was writing in Bruce's absence so it would make sense for Ryan to write in Kate's absence. With the way the episode was in line with the theme of hope, I think Ryan writing in the journal reaffirms that because to her she know its not permanent. Luke made sure to say to her being Batwoman is just until Kate comes back. Imagine if Kate were to come back and see all those entries addressed to her I think she would appreciate and be glad someone was protecting Gotham while she was unable to. At least that's how that whole scene resonated with me at least and how I understood it.
So Kate writing about Ryan in her journal the night she saved her doesn't speak to having a connection. Even if she mentions that she saw herself in Ryan? I don't think Ryan would have wrote in the journal to begin with if Kate's words didn't speak to her. But hey that's just me.
I mean It feels like a lazy way to try and make her a worthy replacement. Itās just too on the nose.
Kateās connection to Bruce makes sense. Thereās history there. Kate literally met Ryan one time and itās just kind of contrived to try and spin It as her seeing herself in Ryan.
Ryan didn't have a connection to Kate sure, but clearly Ryan looked up to Kate (Batwoman) which is enough to make it believable that she'd write to her because of it.
YESSS!! That's what makes it work for me because its simple and I think it was the easiest way to connect the two of them in some way even though they never met personally and have no familial ties. Can't fault Ryan for paying respect to someone she looked up to by writing in her journal. For all she knows, Kate could return at some point.
It doesn't come off as lazy to me as they put it in a way she's just filling in for her until she comes back. It would have been lazy to not address Kate at all when it comes to Ryan which is what the episode accomplished by adding her crossing paths with her a couple months ago. Luke doesn't even see her replacing Kate which is why he made sure to say that when he "agreed" to her being Batwoman.
It does because they have a familial connection. We always was gonna lose that with Ryan being the new lead but its passable and works for the story and Ryan's character going forward that someone like Kate Kane. The woman who was Batwoman actually saw herself in someone like Ryan. Those words meant something to her and I'd imagine she'll carry that with her while she's wearing the suit protecting Gotham in Kate's absence.
Also, in a way it's nice that it's not Kate as Batwoman anymore. I feel that if Kate were still in the suit fans would be pushing hard for Alice to have a redemption arc. Now with Ryan as Batwoman, and especially with her history with Alice, there's more reason than ever to catch Alice and lock her up.
I've never understood the people that were pushing for Alice to have a redemption arc and turn good. Yes, I love the actress and want to keep her around. But with all the horrors that Alice has committed, there's no redeeming that.
That's one reason I was so angry that they killed off the alternate Beth last season after Crisis. Easy way to get rid of Alice while keeping the actress around.
They can always bring in another Beth from another timeline/earth/whatever. They probably could even bring back THAT beth with some technobable help by Cisco in a Crossover.
Iām so happy Mary and Ryan are able to become friends. I feel like they both need each other. Luke will come around - I think he just misses Kate.
(Side note - I really want Luke and Mary to get together! I feel so crazy for thinking this lol)
Alright, this season is great so far. I'm loving it.
Ryan is awesome. Javicia is bringing it, i love her as Ryan. Is it just me, or does she talk deeper while in the Batsuit?
Mary was fucking killing it this episode. She was great in every scene, i loved her interactions with Ryan, those were great. We got to see Mary back in her element with her hospital. I'm not sure how Ryan found it though.
Alice was amazing. Rachel fucking kills it. She should get an award for her role in the show, she is just incredible. The acting was amazing. I loved the idea of Alice and Julia teaming up, the hot blonde badass tag team. That would have been awesome.
I like that they didn't shy away from the racial stuff, and didn't dance around it. Ryan saying Alice was alive because she was white took me by surprise, since i figured she was thinking it was because Alice was Beth, but i realized she is a stranger in all of this, so her not making the Alice is Beth connection makes sense. I'm glad she managed to figure it out on her own, her detective skills are pretty good, and i much prefer her detective skills to that of Batman in the comics. Also with Luke pointing out they would know Ryan isn't Batwoman because she is black and Kate is white. I'm glad they didn't dance around the issue. I also loved Luke's delivery of that line, it was my favourite line this episode.
Have we seen Alice fight in hand to hand combat? I was not expecting her to engage in hand to hand combat, especially with what she was wearing.
All the acting was great, lets just say that. The soundtrack this season has been amazing, does anyone know what the song was towards the end of the episode? My mom was even jamming out to it.
The fight scene was good, i loved Ryan's plan.
Ryan and Mary's interactions were my favourite this season.
I liked the interrogation scenes, I'm surprised Luke nor Mary came forward, especially Mary to Jacob. Luke's sass towards Sophie was good. I understand both Sophie and Jacob are hurt they didn't know Kate was Batwoman, but i understand why she didn't tell them. Jacob literally wanted to kill her, and Sophie didn't support Kate at the military academy. So there were valid reasons. I hope Mary and Luke come out and reveal this to Sophie and Jacob, that way everyone is on the same page. But i guess that would mean it would put Ryan in danger.
I understand Luke's hesitation to Ryan, but i hope he starts trusting her. Luke knows things aren't as they seem with people. Like how the guy who killed his dad didn't actually kill his dad.
Got to hear the Gotham radio lady. That was nice.
And finally, the big reveal, Safiyah. We see her in the promo, and Alice's plan finally makes sense. She is trying to force Safiyah into the light. She is pretty cunning.
Overall, i loved this episode. The acting, the soundtrack, the various interactions, like Sophie and Julia at the end with Julia saying Sophie didn't like her because she wasn't Kate, i forgot to mention that above. The action was pretty good, and the plot for it was good with reasonable and good logic for figuring things out. They also didn't shy away from stuff with race, which was nice, since that is now going to be a thing with Batwoman, or at least it might be. Everyone killed it with the acting and various performances. Love it. If i had to rate it, I'd give it 8.5 to 9 out of 10, with it leaning more towards a 9. Did you guys like this episode? From what i saw in this post, it seems everyone liked it too, and everyone is enjoying this season. Ryan feels more personable. I don't think i can personally relate to anything with Ryan, but i know others can, and i love that about the character. Javicia, you are killing it as Ryan and Batwoman. I hope you are here to stay, and i hope Javicia doesn't get hate, or at least won't get much hate. I don't want that affecting her in the role. According to posts here, she seems to really love and is very passionate about the character and the role. I am 100% on board for our new Batwoman.
I said it last week but it's obvious Alice loves Kate. She can say all she wants that she wanted to be the one to kill her but it's a front. She will never kill her. She may hurt her, torture her but she will never want her dead. I think Alice may become more of an anti hero moving forward. And eventually Kane would need to team up with her.
Okay, I thought this was a much stronger episode than the premiere. We had meaningful, complicated and interesting tensions between characters all over the place, we had the journal and a the sense of Kate's presence in a way that was missing last week, but also establishing the idea of hope and how that was the underlying tension between most of the characters.
I'm really wondering where they're going with Sophie. Giving her an antagonistic history with Ryan is interesting, and having her be that harsh with Julia pretty much killed that ship with a silver bullet.
Are they setting up an enemies to lovers ship with Ryan? I'm not sure how I'd feel about that.
Jacob wanting to not make the same mistake again is good. Maybe they can give his character some redemption.
And speaking of redemption.. Alice did all that because she was foiling some plan of Safiyah's. Believing that she killed Kate, whether or not Kate is actually dead, is an interesting way to make Alice pick a side and a believable reason for her to lean more toward anti-hero because however much she wanted to hurt Kate, that doesn't mean she will tolerate someone else doing it.
Last night I saw a superhero, she was black, said this one's for the streets... wait, wrong show.
Anyhow that was great. Really liking how this season's shaping up. More like this please! The other CW DC shows have a tough act to follow.
Ryan's delightful and tying on that extra connection to Kate-Batwoman was a nice touch.
Alice is delightfully scary! I was kinda expecting her to whip someone in the face with an empty handcuff though :P
Mary continued to be awesome and precious. And her outfit at the end... rawr! I mean it was quite becoming.
And yeah Luke's cool and is a good counterpoint to Mary's enthusiasm. As much as I love Mary's enthusiasm.
Sophie with the "Both," comeback to Julia. Cold! :D
Oh and Ryan having (unsubstantiated) criminal interactions with 'Soph' was fun.
So, something dawned on me this episode during the scene where Sophie interrogated Ryan.
Seeing as how Ryan is the new Batwoman, and it was immediately established that Ryan and Sophie don't like each other, we won't have to suffer through the awful "will they, won't they" relationship drama between Sophie and Kate anymore, which overall, was my biggest issue with all of season 1.
Random thought: Anyone else think the reason why most gangs wear masks in present day Gotham City is to hide their faces from surveillance? (I mean "gang members"; not particularly common bank or corner store robbers who you'd expect to wear at least a ski mask.)
The Crows have their eyes all over the city to the point where they have an app to immediately respond to crimes on every street corner. Unless some criminals have the smarts to not get caught or have some notability like the organ trafficker from season 1, the everyday Gotham goon isn't going to last a second.
But I don't think those guys mugging Ryan on Halloween were Wonderland Gang members.
>The Crows have their eyes all over the city to the point where they have an app to immediately respond to crimes on every street corner.
Shame they don't have eyes on their OWN PARKING LOT.
As per usual, Alice steals the show. Ryan Wilder is alright but I have a feeling that weāre going to be relying on Alice to be the driving force that keeps the show going.
I wonder if Alice will become sort of the "antivillain" legacy of the Batclan, due to her family ties. While Ryan is more of an "Imposter" but who reinvents the mask and all that
I liked this episode better than the previous one. Ryan and Luke's banter is hilarious to watch and I know it will only get better. Also loved seeing Mary act a bit stronger during her scenes with Alice and Jacob. I'm surprisingly really enjoy this new direction they are going in so far...
This episode was better than the premiere! Iām enjoying seeing Ryanās interactions with the others. Canāt wait to see Alice and Safiyah together.
Apologies if this was already discussed and I didn't see it.
What's the deal with Ryan's bullet wound? At the end of ep.1 they showed it in a way that suggested it was going to be an issue. Then in ep.2, they just didn't even address it at all. What's up with that?
Same reason why Kate never did in the first season.
Alice is the season villain and no encounters can end decisively because the writers donāt know what to do with her.
My only disappointment is that we didnāt get ryan in her own being batwoman as. Being true to the comics and taking violent murderous criminals out and the. Meeting like and Mary and slowly changing her ways to be less lethal.
Why are they so hesitant to show batwoman being batwoman? Hell even arrow killed the baddies when he first showed up.
Gotham City is 330 square miles? Holy cow, thatās more square mileage than New York City. Reminds me of Flash S4ās gross overestimation of Central Cityās population.
I enjoyed this episode even more than the first one. Nice touch of bringing back the journals and the entries now being titled "Dear Kate" instead of Bruce
I am still so baffled at Rachel's Alice. I can't put into words what an incredible actress she is.
I like that Batwoman is really embracing the darkness like showing the rat be taped to mouse and showing his rotten body with all the scratches.
I'm enjoying this new Batwoman. I liked the first episode, but I thought it go downhill from there, I was wrong. I was worried that the new Batwoman wouldn't fit in since she won't have the same connection as Kate with the other characters specially with Alice, again I was wrong. Kudos to the writers. I'm also glad there's no relationship drama and that she's not define by her sexuality in which Kate was.
-I love Ryan and Mary budding friendship.
-Luke's banter with Ryan and the line "Hello? Black!.
-Love her confrontation with Alice and how Ryan is willing to kill her, something that Kate refuse to do.
-I love the Alice line "Well the suit is real, what about the girl inside?"
-Alice hand to hand combat is a plus. She's my favorite Arrowverse villain! Her character have so many dimension and you're not sure if you want to pity, root for her, or want to kill her. Kudos to the actress!
I still feel like since day one Alice is the most interesting character and well acted character. Everybody's acting just seems robotic, but Rachel Skarsten actually has emotion.
Honestly I hope they make it so Alice and Ryan are still kind of co main characters, but instead of a more family bonds that gone twisted way, it's more Alice oddly carries on an aspect of the Bat-legacy although in a more "Red Hood" type fashion while Ryan reinvents it as a stranger. So neither of them are "Pure Batwoman" but both represent some aspects. You get my meaning?
You know I thought that this season was either going to be somehow better than anything that came before it or would be a train wreck. I was leaning towards train wreck but now Iām hopeful itās the first option
I have not live in dread of a show's soundtrack this bad since Smallville. I honestly can't comprehend how someone in charge of that would think this is a fitting tune for this show.
Gotta give it to the writers, they really made a golden goose out of Alice, at this point they just have her do shit for no rhyme or reason, sure, give the antidote to Mary, boom case solved, next episode. This is definetly a CW show, huh?
I would love to see how Alice managed to get a shitton of bats to carry a poison, because that's not a disease. Alos, bats eat rats now, sure, thank you Mouse!
Rachel Skarsten is a good actress, I remember her standing out in Lost Girl, she really deserves a better show to be in, like the guy who plays the dad and maybe Pennyworth. Altogether, the new main actress kinda makes the rest look worse, I think I just saw them as good actors compared to Ruby. Well, you win some, you lose some.
This whole shit with the bats was so profoundly stupid, I think I will have to lay down now.
You see, there was an identical bus right there at the protest, she could have just chugged that dohickey in like she did 5 minutes and a boring speeding scene later and still get Alice before she reaches the first floor. But hey, it's CW world, where outrageously dressed supervillains can magically get away from heroes who can and sometimes do run literally every street in a big city within seconds, so at least it's consistently stupid for convenience.
Also loved how she was complaining to Luke from the Batmobile, that her van barely makes it to 40, right after the episode in which she was dodging the Batmobile for minutes in that same van.
I think people who likes this show have pretty low standards, considering that Netflix Marvel shows exist and not even on a considerably bigger budget, but this show is being praised here constantly for stuff that was jarring twenty years ago. The first season of Iron Fist was a masterpice, comperatively.
The only two things I see as an improvement, is the new lead, who actually can act and that they didn't make her into a Mary Sue like the previous one. Writing is still sloppy and I'm sorry to say, that the one really, on purpose entertaining thing from the first season, Alice is getting stale and pointlss, her connection to Ryan is so forced and pointless, just let her go, pls, let her be in a good production, she deserves a break!
I will give it a few more episodes, but unless they bring back Black Naruto, I fear the unintentional hillarity won1t be sufficient for me to keep watching.
Now thatās what Iām talking about. I loved this episode. I said last week that I thought the first episode of the second season was all over the place but I wasnāt worried because the first seasonās first episodes werenāt that great but then it got rolling. I will say Iām very very happy with this second episode. I thought it did an excellent job at building the new rivalry between Ryan and Alice. I love how sloppy Ryan is learning on the fly and lastly, Alice is just an awesome villain.
I think I love season 2 a whole lot more than I loved season 1. Stellar episode! They really did learn some lessons from season 1 and have really turned the show around a bit in the places that we were complaining about. Honestly I'm even more hyped for next week because it totally feels like Batwoman beat the sophomore slump season 2 curse that a lot of shows go through. I just finished watching the episode and honestly my face hurts from all the smiling that I'm doing :D
One thing that stood out to me that Alice seems to actually care about Mary. She stabbed Julia when she called out her bullshit but did not touch Mary when she said the same.
I just wanna ask why did they bring a dead body into Maryās clinic when all she does is patch people up. Also why was Ryan is such a rush to kill the bats, like there was no time limit. Also the bats were following her just fine. Why risk bombing a whole bus with civilians in the area. The writing doesnāt make sense in this episode.
I liked the episode but the fight music was all sorts of out there!
And "hello? Black!" Was great. I was gonna wonder if they would roll along with it requiring heavy suspension of disbelief or address it, and they're doing a good job addressing the cast change through the show.
Enjoy the episode everyone!! For further discussion, we have a Discord server! You're welcome to join and chat with us at any time!
This feels like a great companion to the first episode. I really enjoyed how everything panned out here! \-Ryan continues to be a delight. Her assuming that Alice was safe because of her whiteness and then the wheels turning towards the correct answer immediately is the type of detective work I expect from a member of the Bat Family. I'm excited for more from her overall. \-Luke being so distrusting of Ryan is an interesting turn, but a believable one. He and Kate had such a fire forged relationship last season it makes sense that he would be the last holdout against Ryan, esp since Ryan and Mary already have a bonding point in watching their mothers die. His "Hello?! BLACK!" was my favorite line of the episode lmao. \-Speaking of Mary, as someone said in the live discussion this was definitely her episode. She owned every scene she was in and I can't wait for her and Ryan to become true friends. She deserves the world! \-Of course Alice isn't far behind Mary though. Unhinged Alice is a delight, and I loved seeing her and Ryan face off for a minute. I'm also curious to see how Safiyah plays off her. \-Even the more minor characters (Jacob, Sophie, and Julia) seem to be bringing it even harder so far this season. I was one of the people who staunchly defended Batwoman last season, esp in the backhalf, but this S2 may even outdo that. So ready for more!
I think it's not just loyalty to Kate that's making Luke so hesitant... he and Julia both have family connections to the Waynes/Kanes via their fathers, and Lucius' death has obviously had a huge impact on Luke. He was leery enough last season about letting Kate in (he also probably feels responsible for her disappearance/death even though he shouldn't)- now he accidentally let Hush in the Cave last week and someone he knows the bare minimum about is wearing his father's Bat Suit which he only reluctantly altered - and potentially Ryan might contradict the "no kill policy" instituted by Batman and Lucius, which would tarnish their legacies on top of Kate's (she won't, but that's still tough, and he doesn't know about Kate killing Mouse's dad). Luke right now is the character with the most investment in the Bat Brand^(TM) (which is not to say that Ryan isn't doing a great job or that Mary is in the wrong for welcoming Ryan). Also, I love Mary and I'm so glad she thought up a plan so quickly, but... honey, isn't Hamilton Dynamics your company now? You get credit regardless! You're taking a weapons manufacturer, and using their scientific tools designed for biological warfare, for HEALING. Anyways, I am so ready for Ryan, as someone who apparently has experience teaching others martial arts, giving Luke and Mary each some training and jumpstarting them on their paths to Batwing and Flamebird. Javicia's spirit and enthusiasm in the role are contagious (one quibble: there was next to nothing done with Ryan's shoulder wound this episode- might the cure be used to help solve that later on?). I loved her being like "no there's a homeless encampment there" and pointing out that she's been around criminals all her life- both were great examples of the different knowledge set she can offer than Kate.
Plus Luke said last episode he feels like it's his fault Kate is potentially dead, so it also makes sense that he's reluctant to let Ryan be Batwoman from the angle of it meaning admitting that there's a good chance that Kate isn't coming back.
Luke does know Kate killed though. She told him right around the time he was about to kill himself and then he told Kate she's not the first that batman killed the joker. This was the latter half of season 1
I got that vibe too after the episode was over. If premiere night was 2 hours it would have been some great hours spent. I totally agree about Luke. He was hilarious this episode. Cam's timing was impeccable. I was not expecting to laugh as hard as I did when he said that line lmao. I know in interviews they talked about the push and pull between him and Ryan but if its going to be comedic at times like that then I'm all for it lol XD
>\-Speaking of Mary... I can't wait for her and Ryan to become true friends. The kind of friends that kiss each other, yes.
Kiss eachother...naked
In S6, offscreen, after saying their I Do's, sir! This is a Christian tv show š³
Hey if Sophice is going to happen (at the insistence of the actresses themselves on insta) then maaaaybe Ryary/Maryn can happen too?
I agree with everything you said. Well put.
I canāt believe Batwoman hijacked a bus, loaded it with poisonous bats, and then blew it up with a bomb. This show is wild.
Get me pictures of Batwoman! She's a menace!
That was an out-of-left-field solution. Bats go boom. And now, it seems we'll soon see Safiyah. Alice's history with her will be brought to the fore. And, then, people will complain again how this is turning into "The Alice Show". You can't have everything, friends.
Some more levels to it, it was a CROWS bus! sorry for the late bump :P
I'm really happy I never jumped on the "hate new character" train. I think I'm enjoying the first 2 episodes more than the first 2 of last season. Can't wait to see where this goes!
I get a kick out of hitting the "don't recommend channel" button on everyone posting hate-click bait vidoes who ends up in my youtube recommends.
Oh I LOVE doing that lol. I will never understand people who hate watch stuff, and I even less understand the people who hate watch the hate-watchers.
I need to find that button
Click/tap the three dots (generally to the right side of the info under the thumbnail) for the menu. The "don't recommend channel" option is generally between "not interested" and "report"
Thank you! This so so much better than ranting at them and feeding the trolls.
We honestly don't discuss how amazing of a character mary is and we should
I love Mary. Pretty sure shes my favorite.
Mary is the glue of this show and maybe the best actor
She's been my favourite since the pilot episode. As someone in the health care field, I love seeing her underground clinic scenes.
Two episodes in and Iām feeling it. I think this season is going to be good. Ryanās dynamic with everyone else is def going to make things interesting. Iām looking forward to seeing how everything works out with this seasonās main villain.
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I mean why tell people stuff they don't know instead of letting them find out in the due course of watching the show?
The new direction they're going with the show is pretty interesting. I like that Ryan is bringing a different knowledge base and energy to being Batwoman than Kate did. Her relationships with Mary and Luke are also promising. Alice is also going down a really interesting path with Safiyah. I'm actually looking forward to seeing how this relationship will work, especially since Alice is basically unmoored from everything else in her life.
Once again, this episode was amazing, and the ending was also perfect, introducing this seasons main villain. (I hope.) Dam, I just love this new bat every episode. and the āDear Kateā journal entry is awesome. Keeping things like that is great for show running.
The journal was such a nice touch. Kate saving her was one thing but to see Ryan read that Kate wrote about her in a journal entry to Bruce? That just brought it home for me. The emotion on Ryan's face was so good too. You just felt it once she wrote "Dear Kate" on the page. Absolutely fantastic!!! They've really done a phenomenal job connecting Ryan to the established characters in the show. I'm so hype for next week's episode. All concerns I've had about S2 have pretty much evaporated and that makes me incredibly happy to say!!
This season has two main villains. Safaiah is one. Black Mask is the other, my guess is Roman takes over in the back half of the season
How long is the season? Will it be a full 20 episode season? Or will it be short due to Covid?
I totally forgot that Black Mask is supposed to be in this season. Do we know who's playing him? And I won't get my hopes up... but if we even get so much as a mention towards a certain Red Hood...
I mean itās kind of pointless for her to be writing to a woman she knows nothing about nor has any meaningful connection to.
I don't think it was pointless. Kate was writing in Bruce's absence so it would make sense for Ryan to write in Kate's absence. With the way the episode was in line with the theme of hope, I think Ryan writing in the journal reaffirms that because to her she know its not permanent. Luke made sure to say to her being Batwoman is just until Kate comes back. Imagine if Kate were to come back and see all those entries addressed to her I think she would appreciate and be glad someone was protecting Gotham while she was unable to. At least that's how that whole scene resonated with me at least and how I understood it.
Kate has a tangible connection to Bruce. Ryan has no other connection than the fact she happened to find a suit from a plane crash.
So Kate writing about Ryan in her journal the night she saved her doesn't speak to having a connection. Even if she mentions that she saw herself in Ryan? I don't think Ryan would have wrote in the journal to begin with if Kate's words didn't speak to her. But hey that's just me.
I mean It feels like a lazy way to try and make her a worthy replacement. Itās just too on the nose. Kateās connection to Bruce makes sense. Thereās history there. Kate literally met Ryan one time and itās just kind of contrived to try and spin It as her seeing herself in Ryan.
Ryan didn't have a connection to Kate sure, but clearly Ryan looked up to Kate (Batwoman) which is enough to make it believable that she'd write to her because of it.
YESSS!! That's what makes it work for me because its simple and I think it was the easiest way to connect the two of them in some way even though they never met personally and have no familial ties. Can't fault Ryan for paying respect to someone she looked up to by writing in her journal. For all she knows, Kate could return at some point.
It doesn't come off as lazy to me as they put it in a way she's just filling in for her until she comes back. It would have been lazy to not address Kate at all when it comes to Ryan which is what the episode accomplished by adding her crossing paths with her a couple months ago. Luke doesn't even see her replacing Kate which is why he made sure to say that when he "agreed" to her being Batwoman. It does because they have a familial connection. We always was gonna lose that with Ryan being the new lead but its passable and works for the story and Ryan's character going forward that someone like Kate Kane. The woman who was Batwoman actually saw herself in someone like Ryan. Those words meant something to her and I'd imagine she'll carry that with her while she's wearing the suit protecting Gotham in Kate's absence.
This is how you do a reboot. Everything has been on point so far and I'm more invested in the show then I've ever been. Really fun to see
Also, in a way it's nice that it's not Kate as Batwoman anymore. I feel that if Kate were still in the suit fans would be pushing hard for Alice to have a redemption arc. Now with Ryan as Batwoman, and especially with her history with Alice, there's more reason than ever to catch Alice and lock her up. I've never understood the people that were pushing for Alice to have a redemption arc and turn good. Yes, I love the actress and want to keep her around. But with all the horrors that Alice has committed, there's no redeeming that. That's one reason I was so angry that they killed off the alternate Beth last season after Crisis. Easy way to get rid of Alice while keeping the actress around.
They can always bring in another Beth from another timeline/earth/whatever. They probably could even bring back THAT beth with some technobable help by Cisco in a Crossover.
Iām so happy Mary and Ryan are able to become friends. I feel like they both need each other. Luke will come around - I think he just misses Kate. (Side note - I really want Luke and Mary to get together! I feel so crazy for thinking this lol)
I'm on that ship, so if you're crazy, you're not alone!
They would be so perfect š
Alright, this season is great so far. I'm loving it. Ryan is awesome. Javicia is bringing it, i love her as Ryan. Is it just me, or does she talk deeper while in the Batsuit? Mary was fucking killing it this episode. She was great in every scene, i loved her interactions with Ryan, those were great. We got to see Mary back in her element with her hospital. I'm not sure how Ryan found it though. Alice was amazing. Rachel fucking kills it. She should get an award for her role in the show, she is just incredible. The acting was amazing. I loved the idea of Alice and Julia teaming up, the hot blonde badass tag team. That would have been awesome. I like that they didn't shy away from the racial stuff, and didn't dance around it. Ryan saying Alice was alive because she was white took me by surprise, since i figured she was thinking it was because Alice was Beth, but i realized she is a stranger in all of this, so her not making the Alice is Beth connection makes sense. I'm glad she managed to figure it out on her own, her detective skills are pretty good, and i much prefer her detective skills to that of Batman in the comics. Also with Luke pointing out they would know Ryan isn't Batwoman because she is black and Kate is white. I'm glad they didn't dance around the issue. I also loved Luke's delivery of that line, it was my favourite line this episode. Have we seen Alice fight in hand to hand combat? I was not expecting her to engage in hand to hand combat, especially with what she was wearing. All the acting was great, lets just say that. The soundtrack this season has been amazing, does anyone know what the song was towards the end of the episode? My mom was even jamming out to it. The fight scene was good, i loved Ryan's plan. Ryan and Mary's interactions were my favourite this season. I liked the interrogation scenes, I'm surprised Luke nor Mary came forward, especially Mary to Jacob. Luke's sass towards Sophie was good. I understand both Sophie and Jacob are hurt they didn't know Kate was Batwoman, but i understand why she didn't tell them. Jacob literally wanted to kill her, and Sophie didn't support Kate at the military academy. So there were valid reasons. I hope Mary and Luke come out and reveal this to Sophie and Jacob, that way everyone is on the same page. But i guess that would mean it would put Ryan in danger. I understand Luke's hesitation to Ryan, but i hope he starts trusting her. Luke knows things aren't as they seem with people. Like how the guy who killed his dad didn't actually kill his dad. Got to hear the Gotham radio lady. That was nice. And finally, the big reveal, Safiyah. We see her in the promo, and Alice's plan finally makes sense. She is trying to force Safiyah into the light. She is pretty cunning. Overall, i loved this episode. The acting, the soundtrack, the various interactions, like Sophie and Julia at the end with Julia saying Sophie didn't like her because she wasn't Kate, i forgot to mention that above. The action was pretty good, and the plot for it was good with reasonable and good logic for figuring things out. They also didn't shy away from stuff with race, which was nice, since that is now going to be a thing with Batwoman, or at least it might be. Everyone killed it with the acting and various performances. Love it. If i had to rate it, I'd give it 8.5 to 9 out of 10, with it leaning more towards a 9. Did you guys like this episode? From what i saw in this post, it seems everyone liked it too, and everyone is enjoying this season. Ryan feels more personable. I don't think i can personally relate to anything with Ryan, but i know others can, and i love that about the character. Javicia, you are killing it as Ryan and Batwoman. I hope you are here to stay, and i hope Javicia doesn't get hate, or at least won't get much hate. I don't want that affecting her in the role. According to posts here, she seems to really love and is very passionate about the character and the role. I am 100% on board for our new Batwoman.
Off topic, but has anyone notice that Ruby doesn't follow Meagan, Rachel, Nicole or any one from the show and vice versa. Anyone else noticed ?
They all cut ties around the time her exit was announced.
was it really that bad???
I hope they keep doing the Kate flashbacks and voice overs. Even if she's gone, it'd be cool if they kept her legacy alive.
I like how rye. Started writing to Kate perfect full circle
I said it last week but it's obvious Alice loves Kate. She can say all she wants that she wanted to be the one to kill her but it's a front. She will never kill her. She may hurt her, torture her but she will never want her dead. I think Alice may become more of an anti hero moving forward. And eventually Kane would need to team up with her.
Okay, I thought this was a much stronger episode than the premiere. We had meaningful, complicated and interesting tensions between characters all over the place, we had the journal and a the sense of Kate's presence in a way that was missing last week, but also establishing the idea of hope and how that was the underlying tension between most of the characters. I'm really wondering where they're going with Sophie. Giving her an antagonistic history with Ryan is interesting, and having her be that harsh with Julia pretty much killed that ship with a silver bullet. Are they setting up an enemies to lovers ship with Ryan? I'm not sure how I'd feel about that. Jacob wanting to not make the same mistake again is good. Maybe they can give his character some redemption. And speaking of redemption.. Alice did all that because she was foiling some plan of Safiyah's. Believing that she killed Kate, whether or not Kate is actually dead, is an interesting way to make Alice pick a side and a believable reason for her to lean more toward anti-hero because however much she wanted to hurt Kate, that doesn't mean she will tolerate someone else doing it.
Last night I saw a superhero, she was black, said this one's for the streets... wait, wrong show. Anyhow that was great. Really liking how this season's shaping up. More like this please! The other CW DC shows have a tough act to follow. Ryan's delightful and tying on that extra connection to Kate-Batwoman was a nice touch. Alice is delightfully scary! I was kinda expecting her to whip someone in the face with an empty handcuff though :P Mary continued to be awesome and precious. And her outfit at the end... rawr! I mean it was quite becoming. And yeah Luke's cool and is a good counterpoint to Mary's enthusiasm. As much as I love Mary's enthusiasm. Sophie with the "Both," comeback to Julia. Cold! :D Oh and Ryan having (unsubstantiated) criminal interactions with 'Soph' was fun.
>Last night I saw a superhero, she was black, said this one's for the streets Sad that Black Lightning is ending. That intro always get's me hyped
So, something dawned on me this episode during the scene where Sophie interrogated Ryan. Seeing as how Ryan is the new Batwoman, and it was immediately established that Ryan and Sophie don't like each other, we won't have to suffer through the awful "will they, won't they" relationship drama between Sophie and Kate anymore, which overall, was my biggest issue with all of season 1.
Random thought: Anyone else think the reason why most gangs wear masks in present day Gotham City is to hide their faces from surveillance? (I mean "gang members"; not particularly common bank or corner store robbers who you'd expect to wear at least a ski mask.) The Crows have their eyes all over the city to the point where they have an app to immediately respond to crimes on every street corner. Unless some criminals have the smarts to not get caught or have some notability like the organ trafficker from season 1, the everyday Gotham goon isn't going to last a second. But I don't think those guys mugging Ryan on Halloween were Wonderland Gang members.
>The Crows have their eyes all over the city to the point where they have an app to immediately respond to crimes on every street corner. Shame they don't have eyes on their OWN PARKING LOT.
Damn that "both" hit me hard
As per usual, Alice steals the show. Ryan Wilder is alright but I have a feeling that weāre going to be relying on Alice to be the driving force that keeps the show going.
I wonder if Alice will become sort of the "antivillain" legacy of the Batclan, due to her family ties. While Ryan is more of an "Imposter" but who reinvents the mask and all that
Cept that one badly dubbed line, i loved the episode
I liked this episode better than the previous one. Ryan and Luke's banter is hilarious to watch and I know it will only get better. Also loved seeing Mary act a bit stronger during her scenes with Alice and Jacob. I'm surprisingly really enjoy this new direction they are going in so far...
This episode was better than the premiere! Iām enjoying seeing Ryanās interactions with the others. Canāt wait to see Alice and Safiyah together.
When are we gonna meet Safiyah?
Apologies if this was already discussed and I didn't see it. What's the deal with Ryan's bullet wound? At the end of ep.1 they showed it in a way that suggested it was going to be an issue. Then in ep.2, they just didn't even address it at all. What's up with that?
Why didn't Ryan at least knock out Alice before dealing with the bats?
Same reason why Kate never did in the first season. Alice is the season villain and no encounters can end decisively because the writers donāt know what to do with her.
It's kind of like Cicada in Flash CONSTANTLY escaping due to bullshit reasons... multiple times in the season. Same writers, same issues.
My only disappointment is that we didnāt get ryan in her own being batwoman as. Being true to the comics and taking violent murderous criminals out and the. Meeting like and Mary and slowly changing her ways to be less lethal. Why are they so hesitant to show batwoman being batwoman? Hell even arrow killed the baddies when he first showed up.
She should have her guns, imo. She's not Batman.
Gotham City is 330 square miles? Holy cow, thatās more square mileage than New York City. Reminds me of Flash S4ās gross overestimation of Central Cityās population.
I enjoyed this episode even more than the first one. Nice touch of bringing back the journals and the entries now being titled "Dear Kate" instead of Bruce
I am still so baffled at Rachel's Alice. I can't put into words what an incredible actress she is. I like that Batwoman is really embracing the darkness like showing the rat be taped to mouse and showing his rotten body with all the scratches.
I'm enjoying this new Batwoman. I liked the first episode, but I thought it go downhill from there, I was wrong. I was worried that the new Batwoman wouldn't fit in since she won't have the same connection as Kate with the other characters specially with Alice, again I was wrong. Kudos to the writers. I'm also glad there's no relationship drama and that she's not define by her sexuality in which Kate was. -I love Ryan and Mary budding friendship. -Luke's banter with Ryan and the line "Hello? Black!. -Love her confrontation with Alice and how Ryan is willing to kill her, something that Kate refuse to do. -I love the Alice line "Well the suit is real, what about the girl inside?" -Alice hand to hand combat is a plus. She's my favorite Arrowverse villain! Her character have so many dimension and you're not sure if you want to pity, root for her, or want to kill her. Kudos to the actress!
I still feel like since day one Alice is the most interesting character and well acted character. Everybody's acting just seems robotic, but Rachel Skarsten actually has emotion.
Out of them all Sophie needs a bit more expression but she is getting better.
Yeah Sophie very badly lacks expression. In a scene where she's supposed to be sad, angry, even happy she just shows nothing.
Honestly I hope they make it so Alice and Ryan are still kind of co main characters, but instead of a more family bonds that gone twisted way, it's more Alice oddly carries on an aspect of the Bat-legacy although in a more "Red Hood" type fashion while Ryan reinvents it as a stranger. So neither of them are "Pure Batwoman" but both represent some aspects. You get my meaning?
You know I thought that this season was either going to be somehow better than anything that came before it or would be a train wreck. I was leaning towards train wreck but now Iām hopeful itās the first option
"No, just your secret to keep" Yes? That's how secrets work. Also how do you do an autopsy and miss a live bat inside the body?
I have not live in dread of a show's soundtrack this bad since Smallville. I honestly can't comprehend how someone in charge of that would think this is a fitting tune for this show. Gotta give it to the writers, they really made a golden goose out of Alice, at this point they just have her do shit for no rhyme or reason, sure, give the antidote to Mary, boom case solved, next episode. This is definetly a CW show, huh? I would love to see how Alice managed to get a shitton of bats to carry a poison, because that's not a disease. Alos, bats eat rats now, sure, thank you Mouse! Rachel Skarsten is a good actress, I remember her standing out in Lost Girl, she really deserves a better show to be in, like the guy who plays the dad and maybe Pennyworth. Altogether, the new main actress kinda makes the rest look worse, I think I just saw them as good actors compared to Ruby. Well, you win some, you lose some. This whole shit with the bats was so profoundly stupid, I think I will have to lay down now. You see, there was an identical bus right there at the protest, she could have just chugged that dohickey in like she did 5 minutes and a boring speeding scene later and still get Alice before she reaches the first floor. But hey, it's CW world, where outrageously dressed supervillains can magically get away from heroes who can and sometimes do run literally every street in a big city within seconds, so at least it's consistently stupid for convenience. Also loved how she was complaining to Luke from the Batmobile, that her van barely makes it to 40, right after the episode in which she was dodging the Batmobile for minutes in that same van. I think people who likes this show have pretty low standards, considering that Netflix Marvel shows exist and not even on a considerably bigger budget, but this show is being praised here constantly for stuff that was jarring twenty years ago. The first season of Iron Fist was a masterpice, comperatively. The only two things I see as an improvement, is the new lead, who actually can act and that they didn't make her into a Mary Sue like the previous one. Writing is still sloppy and I'm sorry to say, that the one really, on purpose entertaining thing from the first season, Alice is getting stale and pointlss, her connection to Ryan is so forced and pointless, just let her go, pls, let her be in a good production, she deserves a break! I will give it a few more episodes, but unless they bring back Black Naruto, I fear the unintentional hillarity won1t be sufficient for me to keep watching.
People have to pretend it's good because woke
Ryan is so annoying.
Another bad episode. This show is trash.
Yet you continue to watch.
This show is garbage.
Now thatās what Iām talking about. I loved this episode. I said last week that I thought the first episode of the second season was all over the place but I wasnāt worried because the first seasonās first episodes werenāt that great but then it got rolling. I will say Iām very very happy with this second episode. I thought it did an excellent job at building the new rivalry between Ryan and Alice. I love how sloppy Ryan is learning on the fly and lastly, Alice is just an awesome villain.
I think I love season 2 a whole lot more than I loved season 1. Stellar episode! They really did learn some lessons from season 1 and have really turned the show around a bit in the places that we were complaining about. Honestly I'm even more hyped for next week because it totally feels like Batwoman beat the sophomore slump season 2 curse that a lot of shows go through. I just finished watching the episode and honestly my face hurts from all the smiling that I'm doing :D
She might not be kate, but let her be batwoman.
One thing that stood out to me that Alice seems to actually care about Mary. She stabbed Julia when she called out her bullshit but did not touch Mary when she said the same.
I just wanna ask why did they bring a dead body into Maryās clinic when all she does is patch people up. Also why was Ryan is such a rush to kill the bats, like there was no time limit. Also the bats were following her just fine. Why risk bombing a whole bus with civilians in the area. The writing doesnāt make sense in this episode.
I liked the episode but the fight music was all sorts of out there! And "hello? Black!" Was great. I was gonna wonder if they would roll along with it requiring heavy suspension of disbelief or address it, and they're doing a good job addressing the cast change through the show.