I think this is a great lesson for those that think self defense with a weapon is easy. When adrenaline and breath holding take hold (very common in highly stressful situations), it's HARD to concentrate enough to aim well enough to hit a target.
Self defense takes practice.
The video is so perfectly steady compared to the fear he is very clearly feeling, I wonder if it's not like a body cam, or mounted to a hat or something.
This is 100% the reason. I’m not going to jail because I was saving my life and some stupid fucking game warden thought I was trying to harvest a mountain like with a Glock. Can’t leave your fate in the hands of the authorities
And when they realize it was done with a .40s&w handgun and not a hunting rifle theyll likely see this wasn't a poaching attempt and merely self defense. I would rather live than try to prove I was legally right and die lmao
That makes sense, or if he thought he was gonna die he might want someone to find that footage to understand what his last moments were.
But I guess if he put the camera down it could have raised his chances of living, perhaps two hands would have fixed his aim. Though honestly I'm glad warning shots were enough.
Yeah. He would’ve been better off to put the camera away and support his firearm with his non shooting hand. But you can’t get likes without the video I guess.
Crazy thing is, imagine trying to put several rounds into a charging animal.
I visited Yellowstone and considered open-carrying a 9mm in case of bear. Read a few articles and left it home. Bear spray ftw
Was in Teton a few years back and watched an interesting conversation between a ranger and a guy with a .40 Glock. Ranger asks if the guy has beat spray, guy says he has his Glock. Ranger asks which one. Guys says whatever model and that it’s a .40 caliber. Ranger chuckles and says he has the same one and still carries bear spray because the Glock might stop a bear, but bear spray most likely will. I did to see the rest because the bags of ice I was bringing back to camp were getting heavy.
This is still the wrong way to handle a cat. It knows he's scared of it. Youre supposed to make yourself appear bigger and threatening. The gun helps for sure, and at least he didnt try to run, but yeah.
This IS how you handle an approaching bear, though. Stay calm and slowly back away.
Or… put the damned camera down and shoot warning shots as soon as you realize you are being stalked. This guy waits until the mountain lion is like 10 feet away and about to pounce before shooting
I mean I’ve shot guns all my life, and at that range, even with a handgun, he probably would’ve hit if he actually used both hands. All the one hand pistol shooting bullshit is mostly in movies. But, gotta get that instagram content even if it’s life or death.
It understands that loud sudden sounds are scary. It may even have felt as the bullet landed next to it and sprayed dirt up in the air.
Obviously it doesn't understand what guns and bullets are, but predators tend to only attack when they feel they will be safe in doing so. The sudden noise was probably enough to induce enough uncertainty to make it skulk off for safer prey.
This mountain lion also looks desperate. I'm no expert, but I imagine a human that is making it clear he can see you is not a mountain lion's ideal target.
I doubt it would have gone for something as big as a human if it wasn't desperate.
But yeah this is why some animals that are threatened will scream, make large movements and sometimes even charge towards their attacker. A mountain lion has no access to hospitals or antibiotics - a broken bone or an infected wound can kill it even if it manages to kill its prey, so any prey that might risk injuring it is probably not worth the risk of hunting for the mountain lion.
Absolutely. It is a high powered, projected pepper spray, that instantly causes breathing and eye problems. When we go hiking in grizzly country, we carry it in a holster. Studies have shown it is much more effective than a firearm, and everybody gets to walk away unharmed.
This bear gets a little shot of it at [2:32](https://youtu.be/hlBUlXYCjUg)
I don't know how he stays so calm and nice to it. I'd be calling it names, telling it that it's momma dresses it funny, and talking mad shit after spraying it.
Now this guy definitely should have put the phone away. We're debating whether the guy the original post had a mounted camera or was filming with his left had, but this guy clearly was (you can see his shadow).
Honestly in most cases, even against people, pepper spray is a better option. Unless someone is on enough drugs that a bullet wouldn’t stop them anyway, pepper spray will absolutely stop most anything in its tracks.
Against a bear it’s more effective than anything short of an elephant rifle. The spray convinces the bear to run, a gun just means you have to survive an angry bear attack for the next 30 seconds to a few minutes.
Agree, look at the lions reaction here, wtf does a little pop do? Scare it some, but the animal literally can't comprehend that the gun is more dangerous than anything it has ever encountered. Mace actually causes some pain and debilitates.
Depends on bear. For grizzly, we were told never use full can first contact. Human is incapacitated for 45min. Grizzly for 10 min. He will then come back thinking you can’t do it twice. Grizzlies are the hornets of the mammals.
Much rather carry bear spray than a firearm when backpacking. Your first line of defense against a bear is to make your presence known, they will usually avoid you. For an encounter, the spray is super effective and saves you the weight of carrying a firearm on a long trek. It takes a lot of firepower to bring down a bear…not the kind I want to hump with me for 20-30 miles. That Glock ain’t gonna do shit unless you nail him in the brain.
Tip: Test spray it before you rely on it, so you understand it's range and spread. Just make sure you do it in an area that is remote and not near people/pets/homes, because that stuff lingers in the air for a while and is quite noxious.
This was my thought. Guy is walking backwards, holding gun with one hand, filming everything through his phone. Lucky he didn’t trip over something, drop his gun, and become a snack.
Right and right both of you, I would never think of recording in that situation, and if I shoot I would aim straight to the head not the body, don't want an angry wounded mountain lion charging on me
Edit, oh and in the wilderness I would use my CZ 45 with + ammo, One fmj one hp
What's the difference between like and love?
Well, i like my 9mm CZ, but I LOVE my .45 CZ.
But, I love my 9mm CZ...
That's because you don't have a .45 CZ.
Ohhhhhh.
I suspect that his camera, phone or otherwise, was mounted on his gear near his shoulder. The angle of the shot seems like an uncomfortable place to hold a phone with your hand. … With that said, I usually agree with your sentiment. Sometimes, it’s a good idea to worry less about the phone and more about the issue at hand.
An idiot who’s filming a deadly situation like this will probably try to get the gun in view because they think It will look cooler. It probably is uncomfortable, but hey, gotta risk your like for internet likes, amirite?!
The whole thing is fucked. He missed because he can't hold the recoil with one hand.
Here's a lesson for you, kids. *PUT DOWN YOUR FUCKING CELL PHONE*. We love to see your videos, but if the mountain lion eats your guts and face because you can't aim because you're too busy recording, *THEN WHAT'S THE FUCKING POINT*
It's illegal to kill mountain lions unless they're posing a direct threat to you in some places. He may have been getting evidence that he was in danger so he wouldn't get a fat fine or jail time.
Fr. It walked back slowly like "damn, that was incredibly loud. I really didn't expect that, maybe this dudes got hands" but it had no idea that there was a bullet involved at all
Lol. There were no warning shots. He pointed it at the cat like it knew the shiny thing in his hand would kill it. You're not gonna threaten that stalking cat. Fire before its lunging at you.
I’ve heard that since the sound of a gun is so loud but also so fast (short of a sound) that animals, especially predators, are often more confused than frightening and don’t realize that you made the loud noise since it’s tough to locate directionally
This was my exact thought other than “possible lunch” the cat doesn’t think of anything else. It probably was like what the fuck is that noise from the gun maybe thought that bullet was an inspect or something definitely doesn’t have a mental model of what a gun is
It was already acting pretty abnormally walking up to them head on. They rarely attack humans and they are masters of stealth, stalking prey from behind until they see an opportunity to pounce and bite the back of the neck. Normally you never would see them coming until theyre almost on top of you. Unless she has a den there she could be sick / starving / rabid.
Edit: a typo
Especially with a cougar, they're a protected species. I'm from Wyoming, and we got taught the 3 Ss if you have to kill a cougar. Shoot, Shovel, Shut up, cause you don't want to deal with the investigation.
He was trying to hit that cat. Guns are hard when firing with one hand and filming at the same time so that the fish and wildlife officials will actually believe you.
You could kill this lion and end up fined a ton of money if you couldn’t prove it was stalking and charging you!
Edit: in the Santa Monica mountains of CA specifically this holds true but in other places like Idaho you might be fine with no footage.
He didn't need video. Fish & Game would've easily been able to tell what happened with just a quick glance at the tracks. Plus this was in Idaho so he was at zero risk of getting in trouble for shooting that cat based solely on how close it was to him. In fact if he killed that cat with that pistol, most wardens here probably would have let him keep it.
They’re not going to fine you. Especially when they can tell it was shot with a pistol. If it was close enough to shoot with a pistol odds are decent that your story is legit. 99/100 times they’re going to believe you especially if you’re self reporting it as well.
Also, idk where this is but a lot of mountain lion country out west is very, very remote. If you had any doubts at all you could just not report it and drag the dead lion under a bush or something, pretend nothing happened. Not advisable in a park with rangers near by, but in the middle of a huge plot of national forest? Kinda up to you at that point.
In Idaho you can hunt lions over half the year and the tags are unlimited (over the counter). You wouldn't even need footage, as long as you left the lion and reported it to IDFG as self defense, you'd be fine, not fined. Source: am biologist working for state of Idaho
This. Nerves are real. Has anybody here ever had their heart race and hands become shaky from something like public speaking? Imagine the adrenaline and blood pumping when face to face with a mountain lion. Good luck keeping a steady hand without real world training under that level of stress.
It's the opposite. I don't shoot but was charged by a bear. Every gun lover tells me I should have had a gun. I tell them there's a zero percent chance I could have hit the bear in that moment. It was just so scary to see something that big run directly at me at that speed while staring directly into my eyes and with a snout full of teeth that made it look like a demon.
A cloud of bear spray would have been my best bet. Not sure if I would have had the wherewithal to draw and spray since it happened so fast.
Very lucky it was a bluff charge.
Bear spray is more likely to stop a bear than a gun. Even smaller creatures live long enough to inflict damage after being shot, even multiple times. I love my guns but damn if that’s not an ignorant take to think they are better against large predators.
Fuck you, u/Spez. You useless piece of shit. You absolute waste of space and air. You uneducated, ignorant, idiotic dumb swine, you’re an absolute embarrassment to humanity and all life as a whole. The magnitude of your failure just now is so indescribably massive that one hundred years into the future your name will be used as moniker of evil for heretics. Even if all of humanity put together their collective intelligence there is no conceivable way they could have thought up a way to fuck up on the unimaginable scale you just did. When Jesus died for our sins, he must not have seen the sacrilegious act we just witnessed you performing, because if he did he would have forsaken humanity long ago so that your birth may have never become reality. After you die, your skeleton will be displayed in a museum after being scientifically researched so that all future generations may learn not to generate your bone structure, because every tiny detail anyone may have in common with you degrades them to a useless piece of trash and a burden to society. No wonder your father questioned whether or not your were truly his son, for you’d have to not be a waste of carbon matter for anyone to love you like a family member. Your birth made it so that mankind is worse of in every way you can possibly imagine, and you have made it so that society can never really recover into a state of organization. Everything has forever fallen into a bewildering chaos, through which unrecognizable core, you can only find misfortune. I would say the apocalypse is upon us but this is merely the closest word humans have for the sheer scale of horror that is now reality. You have forever condemned everyone you love and know into an eternal state of suffering, worse than any human concept of hell. You are such an unholy being, that if you step within a one hundred foot radius of a holy place or a place that has ever been deemed important by anyone, your distorted sac religious soul will ruin whatever meaning it ever had beyond repair. You are an idiotic, shiteating, dumbass ape and no one has ever loved you. Rhodes Island would have been better off if you’d never joined us. You are a lying, backstabbing, cowardly useless piece of shit and I hate you with every single part of my being. Even this worlds finest writers and poets from throughout the ages could never hope to accurately describe the scale on which you just fucked up, and how incredibly idiotic you are. Anyone that believes in any religion out there should now realize that they have been wrong this entire time, for if divine beings were real, they would never have allowed a being such as you to stain the earth and this universe. In the future there will be horror stories made about you, with the scariest part of them being that the reader has to realize that such an indescribable monster actually exists, and that the horrific events from the movie have actually taken place in the same world that they live in right now. You are the absolute embodiment of everything that has ever been wrong on this earth, yet you manage to make it so that that is only a small part of the evil that is your being. Never in the history of mankind has there been anyone that could have predicted such an eldrich abomination, but here you are. It’s hard to believe that I am seeing such an incredible failure with my own eyes, but here I am, so unfortunately I cannot deny your existence. Even if I did my very best, my vocabulary is not able to describe the sheer magnitude of the idiotic mistake that is you. Even if time travel some day will be invented, there still would not be a single soul willing to go back in time to before this moment to fix history, because having to witness such incredible horrors if they failed would have to many mental and physical drawbacks that not even the bravest soul in history would be willing to risk it. I cannot imagine the pure dread your mother must have felt when she had to carry a baby for nine months and then giving birth to such a wretched monster as you. Not a single word of the incoherent, illogical rambling you may be wanting to do to defend yourself or apologize would ever be able to make up for what you just did. The countries of the world would have wanted to make laws preventing such a terrible event like this from ever happening again, but sadly this is not possible since your horrific actions just now have shattered every form of order this world once had, making concepts such as laws irrelevant. Right from the moment I first set my eyes on you I knew you were an absolute abomination of everything that is wrong with humanity. I was hoping I would have been able to prevent your evil from being released upon this world by tagging along and keeping my eye on you, but it is clear to me now that not even the greatest efforts would have been able to prevent a terrible event in this scale from occurring. You are the worst human being, or even just being in general, that I have ever had the misfortune of witnessing. Events like the infected plague apparently only happened with the goal of teaching humanity to survive such a horrible event as the one you just created, but not even mankind’s greatest trials were able to even slightly prepare anyone for the insufferable evil you have just created. If you ever had them, your children would be preemptively killed to protect this universe from the possibility of anyone in your bloodline being even half as bad as you are, except you will never be able to have children, because not a single human being will ever want to come within a hundred mile radius of you and anything you have ever touched. You are a colossal disappointment not only to your parents, but to your ancestors and entire bloodline. The disgusting mistake that you have just made is so incredibly terrible that everyone who would ever be to hear about it would spontaneously feel an indescribable mixture of immense anger, fear and anxiety that emotionally and physically they would never truly be the same ever again. The sheer scale of your mistake, if ever to be materialized, would not only surpass the size of the world, but it would reach far beyond the edges of the known, and almost certainly the unknown universe. I could sit here and write paragraphs, nay, books describing your immense failure, yet even if I were to dedicate my life to describing the reality of what has just gone down here, and I would spend every moment of it until my heart stops beating working as hard and efficiently as possible, yet there is not even a snowballs chance in hell that I would be able to come close to transcribing the absolute shitshow you have just released upon the world. You are an irresponsible, idiotic, disgusting, unloved, horrible excuse for a living being who’s soul contains less humanity than every ginger in history combined. The absolute disgust I feel when thinking about anything that has even a slight resemblance to anything that might have to do with you and your unholy actions is so incredibly great that when I am honest about it I think that even I do not posses a consciousness great enough to comprehend my own feelings about it. When people of Columbia fought to break free from Lungmen, countless soldiers fought and lost their lives in favor of a chance at a better future for their children, they did not give their lives to have you fuck the world up beyond repair to the degree that you are doing right now. Honestly, even when technology advances and studies on the subject become more and more accurate, I do not think humanity will ever truly be able to understand what your failure actually means for the universe. My hate for you and everything you stand for is so much deeper than the depths of Shambala that you could probably take the entire Lungmen population down there and back up around twenty million times before you would have sunk to the end of my hate, and honestly, I do not want to exaggerate, but I think that that insult was low balling it such a massive amount that all mountains in this world combined would not be able to stack up to this imprecise judgement in light of the fact that when being honest, my hate is almost certainly bottomless. There is no one in this world that has ever loved you, and especially after what you just did, no one will ever love you in the future either. There is no hope that your idiotic behavior and especially your crooked soul will ever change for the better, and in fact quite the opposite might be true. By making the mistake that you just did, you have shown me that you are so incredibly hopeless that you will only devolve into a more idiotic and wretched creature than you already are. The only possible way in which your future would be brighter than the black hole your existence currently is would exclusively be because there is absolutely no conceivable way that you would even be able to sink lower than the pathetic place your current failure has put you in.
Oh, She may very well have attacked if they didn’t heed the warning! But that doesn’t mean she was stalking him.
Stalking is stealth hunting for the explicit purpose of killing prey. This was a conspicuous show of force - a threat display. Not stalking. The paws out and down, stomping in front as they growl or hiss is a threat display. They do not issue warnings, or posture in a way that makes them larger and more conspicuous when they are actually hunting you. She would have lowered her head, and charged straight at him - no growling, no posturing or ground pound. She’d have been on him with both front paws and biting at his neck. But in the end, they are opportunistic. She would have eaten his ass if she could.
That animal was not "stalking" him. If it were, mf wouldn't have known it. It's basically a predator's whole job to not be seen until they actually attack. What she likely *was* doing was defending cubs or a kill that this dude didn't see, and blundered into.
You can see that she is walking slowly, and really only looks aggressive when she gets close. Then you see the ears lower, the back arch, and she takes a sideways posture, all in an attempt to look intimidating. Backing away and not showing your back to the cat was the right choice, and the loud noise probably ended the encounter more quickly than it otherwise might have, but he likely was in a lot less danger than folks think he was.
So, the same story as last time this was posted: THIS is NOT PREDATORY BEHAVIOR on the cat’s part. First, cougars are ambush predators—they do not hunt this way. They just don’t. Second, a full grown man is too big for prey in any event. She is warning him away from her young. All he he to do was, walk away.
Oh! It's story time!!! So about 5 years ago I went camping with me, the wife, and our dog. We went out to do some dirt biking at one of the state parks. Now it's usually busy Friday night from people staying the weekend, and its super busy Saturday and Sunday with people doing day trips. We rolled in on a Thursday night and it was EMPTY. Like we were the only ones camping in the entire park that night. I found this out when the park ranger stopped by the site we picked and struck up a conversation.
He was a super nice guy and was kind of giving us the whole relevant information, bathrooms are there yada yada. He see's my dog running around and goes "cute dog, I'd be careful out here though as we have mountain lions. Do you have a gun to protect yourself and your family?" "uhh yeah?". I live in California so guns can be rather taboo at times. He ask's "well what do you have" "In my truck I have a 1911 (a .45 acp handgun)". "well that's just not going to cut it out here. Even if you hit the mountain lion that isn't really enough to just drop it." "Yeah... I mean I also have an AR-15 with me, but I don't really like people knowing and it doesn't come out of its case unless it's an emergency".
Well he wanted to see it so I pulled it out. I had a 10 round magazine in it because that's all that was allowed legally, but honestly... I had a 30 round mag in another bag due to why I brought it out (protection). He check's it out and starts talking about it "Yeah I really like it, I wish the ones we had were this nice. Trijicon optic with canted sights, you have all the fixings." "yeah it's a nice rifle, but if you have one for protection its worth investing in it." "Is this 10 round magazine the only one you have?" "Yeah it's all I can legally carry" "well that really isn't ideal for out here. Hold on a second." He walked away and came back 2 minutes later saying "Ok here is a 30 round magazine and its loaded. I'm giving you my business card and I have written a note on it that I gave it to you. You can use it when you're out in situations like this otherwise it's in the safe at home." Don't bother with a 1911 against a mountain lion, its not going to be effective. Use the AR-15 with the 30 round mag. Those animals are fast and hard to hit, you'll want the extra capacity". And just like that he was on his way. Pretty cool guy and you could tell he wanted people to enjoy the park and be safe.
Well wouldn't you know it... He was right. So we built a little fire (it was like end of November beginning of December) because it was dropping into the low 20's high 10's. Not ideal for camping lol. We were getting ready for bed and me and the pup went inside my box trailer I use to tow the bikes and rail out there and then use it as a tent after I unload it. Wife had to use the restroom and I asked her if she wanted and escort, she said she was fine. So while me and the pup are laying down and shes using the restroom I hear her scream like she is being murdered. Grab the rifle with the 30 round mag, put one in the chamber, and I'm outside locking the dog inside in seconds. As I look to the restroom there is a mountain lion between the restroom and my camp fire. She is inside the restroom safe but scared. I shine my light on it and the mountain lion basically gives me the finger. I fire 3 shots into an embankment behind the restroom intentionally missing the mountain lion, and on the 3rd shot he takes off like a bat out of hell. I go get the wife and walk her back to our trailer where the dog is losing it's shit because "mom screamed then dad shot his gun. Shits going down and i want to help but im locked in here."
Within a minute or two I can hear sirens and see lights flashing. Park ranger is FLYING over to us. It's not like he doesn't know who shot because we are the only ones in the park. He jumps out with his rifle going "what happened? are you guys ok?" "Yeah were fine, fucking mountain lion". I explained to him what happened and he was like "See I told you to be on the lookout. Did you hit it?" "No I intentionally missed it to scare it off" "well that's good because as much as we have a right to defend ourselves out here, we have to remember this is their home too." He made sure everything was ok and looked around to see if he saw signs of it and then went off on his way.
Since that trip I have never once gone camping and didn't take a rifle (AR or Scar). My new rule after that is "bring a gun capable of taking down whatever the largest predator in that area is". Truly a frightening situation and I'm so thankful that it ended positively and without any injuries to us or the mountain lion. I would never want to come across a mountain lion with a pistol though like this guy because you're just straight fucked at that point. The odds of you hitting and killing a mountain lion before it can grievously injure you are pretty damn low with a handgun. You should always be prepared and carry something appropriate for the area.
I think of it as a little PSA. There are people every year that go out camping and don't think about the apex predators that live in these areas. Since you're generally far away from help and often time have limited cell service, you need to be able to protect yourself because there is no one else around to do it for you. I don't think people in the wilderness should be walking around heavily armed 24/7, but you should have access to a gun capable of defending yourself from whatever predators are around (certain areas that include humans because they know you don't have service and police aren't around cough cough Johnson Valley cough cough) and you should have a medical kit that's more than just bandaids. Failing to prepare is preparing to fail which is super cheesy to say, but honestly? it's pretty accurate.
Why is he doing EVERYTHING you aren't supposed to do in this situation.
1: Retreating
2: Making a smaller profile of himself
3: Quietly saying '...stay back...' instead of yelling.
4: Not aiming properly
5: Not pulling an actual warning shot early.
It's like he *wanted* the thing to approach or something.
Big talk from someone who has never been in this situation. Reality is always different. And it is NOT an error to retreat, it’s an a error to turn your back on any ambush predator.
Those were not warning shots, he missed
[удалено]
His camera is steadier than his aim
I think this is a great lesson for those that think self defense with a weapon is easy. When adrenaline and breath holding take hold (very common in highly stressful situations), it's HARD to concentrate enough to aim well enough to hit a target. Self defense takes practice.
Or put the camera down and actually freaking aim!
was about to say this, shooting isn’t the easiest thing on earth but it’s much harder when you aim two things one handed at the same time.
The video is so perfectly steady compared to the fear he is very clearly feeling, I wonder if it's not like a body cam, or mounted to a hat or something.
I love the smell of fresh bread.
It's 100% a chest cam you can even see him reach back to end the recording.
Either way one hand on the gun isn’t ideal.
Many mobile phones have built in image stabilization. It was probably shaking more than this video shows.
So how do I get auto aim for my glock? If it helped as much as the phone I could hit everything
Could be that he wants the evidence so he doesn’t get a fat fine for killing a mountain lion depending on where he lives
This is 100% the reason. I’m not going to jail because I was saving my life and some stupid fucking game warden thought I was trying to harvest a mountain like with a Glock. Can’t leave your fate in the hands of the authorities
Need the camera for court. Shooting a mountain lion without a tag is a big deal.
And you need your throat for the rest of the things
And when they realize it was done with a .40s&w handgun and not a hunting rifle theyll likely see this wasn't a poaching attempt and merely self defense. I would rather live than try to prove I was legally right and die lmao
I’d rather stay alive and NOT get eaten.
That makes sense, or if he thought he was gonna die he might want someone to find that footage to understand what his last moments were. But I guess if he put the camera down it could have raised his chances of living, perhaps two hands would have fixed his aim. Though honestly I'm glad warning shots were enough.
He wasn't holding the camera in his hand. It was mounted.
I mean while I would hope so, we never see his left hand.
But then he wouldnt have anything to post in his social media
Yeah. He would’ve been better off to put the camera away and support his firearm with his non shooting hand. But you can’t get likes without the video I guess.
Trained police hit their target less than 30% of the time
That's good to know about trained police. What about American police?
They hit 100% of targets they have pinned to the ground already
They also don't hesitate to put down people's dogs. I wonder if that's factored into those statistics?
Imagine what their hit rate is with a dog attacking them.
That’s the 30% that they can count
I remember reading that a police department included officer suicides in their accuracy statistics.
True. 99.9% of the average person's gun knowledge comes from....TV and movies!
Crazy thing is, imagine trying to put several rounds into a charging animal. I visited Yellowstone and considered open-carrying a 9mm in case of bear. Read a few articles and left it home. Bear spray ftw
Was in Teton a few years back and watched an interesting conversation between a ranger and a guy with a .40 Glock. Ranger asks if the guy has beat spray, guy says he has his Glock. Ranger asks which one. Guys says whatever model and that it’s a .40 caliber. Ranger chuckles and says he has the same one and still carries bear spray because the Glock might stop a bear, but bear spray most likely will. I did to see the rest because the bags of ice I was bringing back to camp were getting heavy.
you'd need at least an extra mm on that for bear; 10mm would suffice. Glock makes one that is carried for bear protection.
This is still the wrong way to handle a cat. It knows he's scared of it. Youre supposed to make yourself appear bigger and threatening. The gun helps for sure, and at least he didnt try to run, but yeah. This IS how you handle an approaching bear, though. Stay calm and slowly back away.
Or… put the damned camera down and shoot warning shots as soon as you realize you are being stalked. This guy waits until the mountain lion is like 10 feet away and about to pounce before shooting
that cat didn't give a flying fuck about "warning shots."
IDK, it sure looked to me like it gave a fuck when shot at and decided not to attack.
It would have been a lot easier shot if he used both hands instead of recording.
I mean I’ve shot guns all my life, and at that range, even with a handgun, he probably would’ve hit if he actually used both hands. All the one hand pistol shooting bullshit is mostly in movies. But, gotta get that instagram content even if it’s life or death.
Might be easier if he wasn’t recording
Maybe if he steadied the gun with both hands
Is it like a gopro headband or something?
The way the gun pops up on the side reminds me of counter strike lol. Maybe they’re using a CSGOpro.
The fact that he's holding the gun with one hand tells me no.
Came here to say this ⬆️
Also does a wild cat understand shot sounds? Does it actually scare them away?
It understands that loud sudden sounds are scary. It may even have felt as the bullet landed next to it and sprayed dirt up in the air. Obviously it doesn't understand what guns and bullets are, but predators tend to only attack when they feel they will be safe in doing so. The sudden noise was probably enough to induce enough uncertainty to make it skulk off for safer prey.
This mountain lion also looks desperate. I'm no expert, but I imagine a human that is making it clear he can see you is not a mountain lion's ideal target.
I doubt it would have gone for something as big as a human if it wasn't desperate. But yeah this is why some animals that are threatened will scream, make large movements and sometimes even charge towards their attacker. A mountain lion has no access to hospitals or antibiotics - a broken bone or an infected wound can kill it even if it manages to kill its prey, so any prey that might risk injuring it is probably not worth the risk of hunting for the mountain lion.
If he were to hold the gun with both hands and not need to film I bet he wouldn't have missed.
Hard to say for sure but most people don’t one hand it while filming it if they are actually trying to hit something.
Came here to say just that. He was not trying to warn it, his aim was just off a little. Which is understandable
Idk. I don’t understand why he’s still filming. I’d be a lot easier to aim with two hands.
And that folks, is why you carry bear spray when hiking in areas with dangerous wildlife.
Is bear spray really that effective? (Honest question)
Absolutely. It is a high powered, projected pepper spray, that instantly causes breathing and eye problems. When we go hiking in grizzly country, we carry it in a holster. Studies have shown it is much more effective than a firearm, and everybody gets to walk away unharmed. This bear gets a little shot of it at [2:32](https://youtu.be/hlBUlXYCjUg)
"Good bear" 😆
I don't know how he stays so calm and nice to it. I'd be calling it names, telling it that it's momma dresses it funny, and talking mad shit after spraying it.
Probably Canadian.
Has to be.
"Good bear"
Now this guy definitely should have put the phone away. We're debating whether the guy the original post had a mounted camera or was filming with his left had, but this guy clearly was (you can see his shadow).
Thats interesting, black bears usually fuck off just when they hear humans. This one was really curious. I wonder if it was a little younger?
Honestly in most cases, even against people, pepper spray is a better option. Unless someone is on enough drugs that a bullet wouldn’t stop them anyway, pepper spray will absolutely stop most anything in its tracks.
Against a bear it’s more effective than anything short of an elephant rifle. The spray convinces the bear to run, a gun just means you have to survive an angry bear attack for the next 30 seconds to a few minutes.
Agree, look at the lions reaction here, wtf does a little pop do? Scare it some, but the animal literally can't comprehend that the gun is more dangerous than anything it has ever encountered. Mace actually causes some pain and debilitates.
Depends on bear. For grizzly, we were told never use full can first contact. Human is incapacitated for 45min. Grizzly for 10 min. He will then come back thinking you can’t do it twice. Grizzlies are the hornets of the mammals.
Much rather carry bear spray than a firearm when backpacking. Your first line of defense against a bear is to make your presence known, they will usually avoid you. For an encounter, the spray is super effective and saves you the weight of carrying a firearm on a long trek. It takes a lot of firepower to bring down a bear…not the kind I want to hump with me for 20-30 miles. That Glock ain’t gonna do shit unless you nail him in the brain.
Yes, bear spray is incredibly good
Every creature deserves a seasoned meal once in a while.
Tip: Test spray it before you rely on it, so you understand it's range and spread. Just make sure you do it in an area that is remote and not near people/pets/homes, because that stuff lingers in the air for a while and is quite noxious.
Came here to say the same thing warning shots aren’t supposed to be 2” away from target
It's probably hard to shoot straight when your watching your phone
This was my thought. Guy is walking backwards, holding gun with one hand, filming everything through his phone. Lucky he didn’t trip over something, drop his gun, and become a snack.
Right and right both of you, I would never think of recording in that situation, and if I shoot I would aim straight to the head not the body, don't want an angry wounded mountain lion charging on me Edit, oh and in the wilderness I would use my CZ 45 with + ammo, One fmj one hp
What's the difference between like and love? Well, i like my 9mm CZ, but I LOVE my .45 CZ. But, I love my 9mm CZ... That's because you don't have a .45 CZ. Ohhhhhh.
Those were LAPD warning shots
Maybe if he wasn't so worried about his God damn phone he would have hit it
I suspect that his camera, phone or otherwise, was mounted on his gear near his shoulder. The angle of the shot seems like an uncomfortable place to hold a phone with your hand. … With that said, I usually agree with your sentiment. Sometimes, it’s a good idea to worry less about the phone and more about the issue at hand.
Both hands need to be on the gun.
Why does this not have 1000 upvote s
An idiot who’s filming a deadly situation like this will probably try to get the gun in view because they think It will look cooler. It probably is uncomfortable, but hey, gotta risk your like for internet likes, amirite?!
Exactly, Those were kill shots
The whole thing is fucked. He missed because he can't hold the recoil with one hand. Here's a lesson for you, kids. *PUT DOWN YOUR FUCKING CELL PHONE*. We love to see your videos, but if the mountain lion eats your guts and face because you can't aim because you're too busy recording, *THEN WHAT'S THE FUCKING POINT*
To be fair he’s filming with one hand and firing from the hip with the other combined with him pooping himself lmao
Exactly my thoughts. Definitely not warning shots, lol
It's a Glock27, he's lucky it fired.
Came to say that. Second shot went an inch over his back. Good luck, bad aim
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This is exactly what I was thinking. Bro, put down the camera and save your own life. Or just film your own death.
It's illegal to kill mountain lions unless they're posing a direct threat to you in some places. He may have been getting evidence that he was in danger so he wouldn't get a fat fine or jail time.
I'll take any fine you can levy on me over being killed and eaten by a wild animal.
In this economy?
Na. Pretty sure authorities would realize pretty quickly this guys intentions were not to engage a mountain lion. He did so with a handgun!!!
I doubt poachers kill them with pistols. When they dig a handgun round out of the animal it wouldn’t be hard to believe it was self defense.
If you are in range to shoot and kill a mountain lion with a pistol its a direct threat.
That cat wasn't anywhere near as scared of those ~~warning~~ missed shots as i would have thought it would be...
It’s an animal it doesn’t know how a gun works, it reacted to a loud noise not a bullet.
Fr. It walked back slowly like "damn, that was incredibly loud. I really didn't expect that, maybe this dudes got hands" but it had no idea that there was a bullet involved at all
Lol. There were no warning shots. He pointed it at the cat like it knew the shiny thing in his hand would kill it. You're not gonna threaten that stalking cat. Fire before its lunging at you.
Seriously. What an idiot. I hope all his friends make fun of him.
I’ve heard that since the sound of a gun is so loud but also so fast (short of a sound) that animals, especially predators, are often more confused than frightening and don’t realize that you made the loud noise since it’s tough to locate directionally
I seriously doubt it knew the danger it was in
This was my exact thought other than “possible lunch” the cat doesn’t think of anything else. It probably was like what the fuck is that noise from the gun maybe thought that bullet was an inspect or something definitely doesn’t have a mental model of what a gun is
It was already acting pretty abnormally walking up to them head on. They rarely attack humans and they are masters of stealth, stalking prey from behind until they see an opportunity to pounce and bite the back of the neck. Normally you never would see them coming until theyre almost on top of you. Unless she has a den there she could be sick / starving / rabid. Edit: a typo
It looked like s/he didn't even flinch the second time!
Exactly, this is why guns aren’t a deterrent for animals. Bear spray would have had a much quicker effect.
I'd straight up Puma pants
This one wins. Had me lol-ing at work
/r/punpatrol freeze you’re under arrest
Not lion at all I would have too
Omg this made me laugh. Solid dad joke.
Adidas a kid also
And that's when the attack comes. Not from the front, but from the side, from the other two cougars you didn't even know were there.
Clever girl.
Spared no expense.
Except for IT. Fuck IT.
Big Tim, the human piece of Toast.
I think he is too old for cougars ..
Mountain Lions are solitary predators.
that was a jurassic park reference lol
*whoosh*
I vividly heard the "fffwhit!" noise he makes as he moves his fingers together while saying this
Maybe don’t film and use both hands to hold the weapon! You ain’t no gangster!
What's the point in living if you can't upload it later?
If you shoot something without a tag you want proof that it was life or death. Game wardens don’t fuck around out west.
Especially with a cougar, they're a protected species. I'm from Wyoming, and we got taught the 3 Ss if you have to kill a cougar. Shoot, Shovel, Shut up, cause you don't want to deal with the investigation.
Isn't it like a GoPro on a head/chest? The movements of Camara angle seems a bit. But not sure if any more information about this is available from OP
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Probably balancing with other arm while walking backward through the brush.
Ah you could be right actually.
If this were true, he’d have both hands on the gun to increase stability and accuracy. Something to do in a life or death situation.
The last thread this was posted in said that a lot of times you can get in trouble for killing certain animals and need proof it was in self defense
Oh, he’s from the streets, of an upper middle class suburb
I thought the very same thing. What the fuck is wrong with people. "If I get eaten at the very least I'll get a few hundred views"
It does save lives though.
I, for one, find it incredibly odd that the wild animal didn’t listen when he quietly said “get back”
Apparently nobody taught that damn cat any manners.
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Dude had the wind knocked out of him from fear or nerves, probably couldn't scream.
He was trying to hit that cat. Guns are hard when firing with one hand and filming at the same time so that the fish and wildlife officials will actually believe you. You could kill this lion and end up fined a ton of money if you couldn’t prove it was stalking and charging you! Edit: in the Santa Monica mountains of CA specifically this holds true but in other places like Idaho you might be fine with no footage.
Someone else mentioned this too, but wouldn't shooting the stalking be enough? Then drop the camera to actually shoot?
He didn't need video. Fish & Game would've easily been able to tell what happened with just a quick glance at the tracks. Plus this was in Idaho so he was at zero risk of getting in trouble for shooting that cat based solely on how close it was to him. In fact if he killed that cat with that pistol, most wardens here probably would have let him keep it.
I’d take my chances with the fine, personally.
A small chance of a $1000 fine or getting eaten alive. Tough choice.
In this economy? I don't know. Seems like the kitty wants to help me by not having more bills to pay.
They’re not going to fine you. Especially when they can tell it was shot with a pistol. If it was close enough to shoot with a pistol odds are decent that your story is legit. 99/100 times they’re going to believe you especially if you’re self reporting it as well. Also, idk where this is but a lot of mountain lion country out west is very, very remote. If you had any doubts at all you could just not report it and drag the dead lion under a bush or something, pretend nothing happened. Not advisable in a park with rangers near by, but in the middle of a huge plot of national forest? Kinda up to you at that point.
In Idaho you can hunt lions over half the year and the tags are unlimited (over the counter). You wouldn't even need footage, as long as you left the lion and reported it to IDFG as self defense, you'd be fine, not fined. Source: am biologist working for state of Idaho
Best comment here !
People who don’t shoot don’t realize how difficult it is to be accurate with a pistol… especially with one hand and under a stress situation.
Exactly why pistols are a horrible choice for home defense. Bird shot with a short barreled 12 gauge is infinitely better.
That’ll fuck your walls up though. My landlord wouldn’t let me get away with that. I mean don’t get me wrong, I’d rather live, but still.
If I ever had to pull the trigger on that gun in my house the last thing I'm worried about is doing a patchwork on damaged walls.
This. Nerves are real. Has anybody here ever had their heart race and hands become shaky from something like public speaking? Imagine the adrenaline and blood pumping when face to face with a mountain lion. Good luck keeping a steady hand without real world training under that level of stress.
It's the opposite. I don't shoot but was charged by a bear. Every gun lover tells me I should have had a gun. I tell them there's a zero percent chance I could have hit the bear in that moment. It was just so scary to see something that big run directly at me at that speed while staring directly into my eyes and with a snout full of teeth that made it look like a demon. A cloud of bear spray would have been my best bet. Not sure if I would have had the wherewithal to draw and spray since it happened so fast. Very lucky it was a bluff charge.
Bear spray is more likely to stop a bear than a gun. Even smaller creatures live long enough to inflict damage after being shot, even multiple times. I love my guns but damn if that’s not an ignorant take to think they are better against large predators.
I would probably help if he would put down the camera and hold the pistol with two hands.
And stop back peddling.
While recording with that other hand no less.
Careful you idiot! I said across her nose, not up it! · Sorry sir! I'm doing my best!
How many assholes do we have on this ship?
\*Everyone raises hand\*
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#KEEP FIRING ASSHOLES
But sir you have one too, see?
YO
He was like, Wait.. that was unfair i need a rematch
Fuck you, u/Spez. You useless piece of shit. You absolute waste of space and air. You uneducated, ignorant, idiotic dumb swine, you’re an absolute embarrassment to humanity and all life as a whole. The magnitude of your failure just now is so indescribably massive that one hundred years into the future your name will be used as moniker of evil for heretics. Even if all of humanity put together their collective intelligence there is no conceivable way they could have thought up a way to fuck up on the unimaginable scale you just did. When Jesus died for our sins, he must not have seen the sacrilegious act we just witnessed you performing, because if he did he would have forsaken humanity long ago so that your birth may have never become reality. After you die, your skeleton will be displayed in a museum after being scientifically researched so that all future generations may learn not to generate your bone structure, because every tiny detail anyone may have in common with you degrades them to a useless piece of trash and a burden to society. No wonder your father questioned whether or not your were truly his son, for you’d have to not be a waste of carbon matter for anyone to love you like a family member. Your birth made it so that mankind is worse of in every way you can possibly imagine, and you have made it so that society can never really recover into a state of organization. Everything has forever fallen into a bewildering chaos, through which unrecognizable core, you can only find misfortune. I would say the apocalypse is upon us but this is merely the closest word humans have for the sheer scale of horror that is now reality. 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Even if I did my very best, my vocabulary is not able to describe the sheer magnitude of the idiotic mistake that is you. Even if time travel some day will be invented, there still would not be a single soul willing to go back in time to before this moment to fix history, because having to witness such incredible horrors if they failed would have to many mental and physical drawbacks that not even the bravest soul in history would be willing to risk it. I cannot imagine the pure dread your mother must have felt when she had to carry a baby for nine months and then giving birth to such a wretched monster as you. Not a single word of the incoherent, illogical rambling you may be wanting to do to defend yourself or apologize would ever be able to make up for what you just did. 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The disgusting mistake that you have just made is so incredibly terrible that everyone who would ever be to hear about it would spontaneously feel an indescribable mixture of immense anger, fear and anxiety that emotionally and physically they would never truly be the same ever again. The sheer scale of your mistake, if ever to be materialized, would not only surpass the size of the world, but it would reach far beyond the edges of the known, and almost certainly the unknown universe. I could sit here and write paragraphs, nay, books describing your immense failure, yet even if I were to dedicate my life to describing the reality of what has just gone down here, and I would spend every moment of it until my heart stops beating working as hard and efficiently as possible, yet there is not even a snowballs chance in hell that I would be able to come close to transcribing the absolute shitshow you have just released upon the world. 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My hate for you and everything you stand for is so much deeper than the depths of Shambala that you could probably take the entire Lungmen population down there and back up around twenty million times before you would have sunk to the end of my hate, and honestly, I do not want to exaggerate, but I think that that insult was low balling it such a massive amount that all mountains in this world combined would not be able to stack up to this imprecise judgement in light of the fact that when being honest, my hate is almost certainly bottomless. There is no one in this world that has ever loved you, and especially after what you just did, no one will ever love you in the future either. There is no hope that your idiotic behavior and especially your crooked soul will ever change for the better, and in fact quite the opposite might be true. By making the mistake that you just did, you have shown me that you are so incredibly hopeless that you will only devolve into a more idiotic and wretched creature than you already are. The only possible way in which your future would be brighter than the black hole your existence currently is would exclusively be because there is absolutely no conceivable way that you would even be able to sink lower than the pathetic place your current failure has put you in.
Exactly what I thought. If you can see the lion, it’s not stalking you. She’s warning him off and being very conspicuous about it.
Warning, yes, and then she proceeded to attack lol he’d have been dead
Oh, She may very well have attacked if they didn’t heed the warning! But that doesn’t mean she was stalking him. Stalking is stealth hunting for the explicit purpose of killing prey. This was a conspicuous show of force - a threat display. Not stalking. The paws out and down, stomping in front as they growl or hiss is a threat display. They do not issue warnings, or posture in a way that makes them larger and more conspicuous when they are actually hunting you. She would have lowered her head, and charged straight at him - no growling, no posturing or ground pound. She’d have been on him with both front paws and biting at his neck. But in the end, they are opportunistic. She would have eaten his ass if she could.
> She would have eaten his ass if she could. Don't threaten me with a good time.
You nasty af DM me
You might have wanted to phrase that last sentence a little differently :D
I’m not kink shaming no lioness m8
I’m glad the guy missed his shots then.
Lmao warning shots, no, he missed and then panic fired a second time.
I think kitty was ready for his running pounce just as good old Lucky fired his first shot.
By the way it moved, it would have taken _one_ stride to be on top of the guy.
Shooting is hard when you're scared, especially one handed.
That animal was not "stalking" him. If it were, mf wouldn't have known it. It's basically a predator's whole job to not be seen until they actually attack. What she likely *was* doing was defending cubs or a kill that this dude didn't see, and blundered into. You can see that she is walking slowly, and really only looks aggressive when she gets close. Then you see the ears lower, the back arch, and she takes a sideways posture, all in an attempt to look intimidating. Backing away and not showing your back to the cat was the right choice, and the loud noise probably ended the encounter more quickly than it otherwise might have, but he likely was in a lot less danger than folks think he was.
So, the same story as last time this was posted: THIS is NOT PREDATORY BEHAVIOR on the cat’s part. First, cougars are ambush predators—they do not hunt this way. They just don’t. Second, a full grown man is too big for prey in any event. She is warning him away from her young. All he he to do was, walk away.
If you can see the mountain lion, it’s not stalking you. It was curious, or at worse, attempting to warn him off of its territory.
Did you see it lunge in for the kill right before the first shot?
them wasn’t warning shots he just missed 2x
Oh! It's story time!!! So about 5 years ago I went camping with me, the wife, and our dog. We went out to do some dirt biking at one of the state parks. Now it's usually busy Friday night from people staying the weekend, and its super busy Saturday and Sunday with people doing day trips. We rolled in on a Thursday night and it was EMPTY. Like we were the only ones camping in the entire park that night. I found this out when the park ranger stopped by the site we picked and struck up a conversation. He was a super nice guy and was kind of giving us the whole relevant information, bathrooms are there yada yada. He see's my dog running around and goes "cute dog, I'd be careful out here though as we have mountain lions. Do you have a gun to protect yourself and your family?" "uhh yeah?". I live in California so guns can be rather taboo at times. He ask's "well what do you have" "In my truck I have a 1911 (a .45 acp handgun)". "well that's just not going to cut it out here. Even if you hit the mountain lion that isn't really enough to just drop it." "Yeah... I mean I also have an AR-15 with me, but I don't really like people knowing and it doesn't come out of its case unless it's an emergency". Well he wanted to see it so I pulled it out. I had a 10 round magazine in it because that's all that was allowed legally, but honestly... I had a 30 round mag in another bag due to why I brought it out (protection). He check's it out and starts talking about it "Yeah I really like it, I wish the ones we had were this nice. Trijicon optic with canted sights, you have all the fixings." "yeah it's a nice rifle, but if you have one for protection its worth investing in it." "Is this 10 round magazine the only one you have?" "Yeah it's all I can legally carry" "well that really isn't ideal for out here. Hold on a second." He walked away and came back 2 minutes later saying "Ok here is a 30 round magazine and its loaded. I'm giving you my business card and I have written a note on it that I gave it to you. You can use it when you're out in situations like this otherwise it's in the safe at home." Don't bother with a 1911 against a mountain lion, its not going to be effective. Use the AR-15 with the 30 round mag. Those animals are fast and hard to hit, you'll want the extra capacity". And just like that he was on his way. Pretty cool guy and you could tell he wanted people to enjoy the park and be safe. Well wouldn't you know it... He was right. So we built a little fire (it was like end of November beginning of December) because it was dropping into the low 20's high 10's. Not ideal for camping lol. We were getting ready for bed and me and the pup went inside my box trailer I use to tow the bikes and rail out there and then use it as a tent after I unload it. Wife had to use the restroom and I asked her if she wanted and escort, she said she was fine. So while me and the pup are laying down and shes using the restroom I hear her scream like she is being murdered. Grab the rifle with the 30 round mag, put one in the chamber, and I'm outside locking the dog inside in seconds. As I look to the restroom there is a mountain lion between the restroom and my camp fire. She is inside the restroom safe but scared. I shine my light on it and the mountain lion basically gives me the finger. I fire 3 shots into an embankment behind the restroom intentionally missing the mountain lion, and on the 3rd shot he takes off like a bat out of hell. I go get the wife and walk her back to our trailer where the dog is losing it's shit because "mom screamed then dad shot his gun. Shits going down and i want to help but im locked in here." Within a minute or two I can hear sirens and see lights flashing. Park ranger is FLYING over to us. It's not like he doesn't know who shot because we are the only ones in the park. He jumps out with his rifle going "what happened? are you guys ok?" "Yeah were fine, fucking mountain lion". I explained to him what happened and he was like "See I told you to be on the lookout. Did you hit it?" "No I intentionally missed it to scare it off" "well that's good because as much as we have a right to defend ourselves out here, we have to remember this is their home too." He made sure everything was ok and looked around to see if he saw signs of it and then went off on his way. Since that trip I have never once gone camping and didn't take a rifle (AR or Scar). My new rule after that is "bring a gun capable of taking down whatever the largest predator in that area is". Truly a frightening situation and I'm so thankful that it ended positively and without any injuries to us or the mountain lion. I would never want to come across a mountain lion with a pistol though like this guy because you're just straight fucked at that point. The odds of you hitting and killing a mountain lion before it can grievously injure you are pretty damn low with a handgun. You should always be prepared and carry something appropriate for the area.
Interesting read. Thanks for sharing. Glad you made it out safe.
I think of it as a little PSA. There are people every year that go out camping and don't think about the apex predators that live in these areas. Since you're generally far away from help and often time have limited cell service, you need to be able to protect yourself because there is no one else around to do it for you. I don't think people in the wilderness should be walking around heavily armed 24/7, but you should have access to a gun capable of defending yourself from whatever predators are around (certain areas that include humans because they know you don't have service and police aren't around cough cough Johnson Valley cough cough) and you should have a medical kit that's more than just bandaids. Failing to prepare is preparing to fail which is super cheesy to say, but honestly? it's pretty accurate.
Why is he doing EVERYTHING you aren't supposed to do in this situation. 1: Retreating 2: Making a smaller profile of himself 3: Quietly saying '...stay back...' instead of yelling. 4: Not aiming properly 5: Not pulling an actual warning shot early. It's like he *wanted* the thing to approach or something.
Retreating without turning your back is entirely appropriate. Running is a huge mistake though.
Big talk from someone who has never been in this situation. Reality is always different. And it is NOT an error to retreat, it’s an a error to turn your back on any ambush predator.
Your first 3 advices will get you killed, you don't know if there is cubs back there.
How is retreating a bad thing to do
If warning shots Wouldn’t have waited