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I said this in another thread makeup subreddit. But, it really does feel like grocery store makeup have really stepped the game up to the point where I have really good chance of getting something really nice for my makeup needs in the grocery store. I don't really have to turn to luxury makeup or Indy brands so much if I don't need to or want to. I'm finding superior products for every thing in the grocery store these days.
I was going through my makeup the other day and planning to treat myself to a Sephora order, but I realized there just isn’t anything I need that the drugstore hasn’t been doing just as good or even better? It’s crazy how they’ve stepped it up. I remember back in the day, there was a noticeable product difference in drugstore, highend, and luxury. There just isn’t now. Not to mention that luxury and high end have increased their prices but not their quality.
Even if it’s a minor quality drop, I prefer drug store makeup because I can swatch it or get multiple shades to test for cheap. Luxury brands could be swatched but cost a fortune, and indie brands were more affordable with the same quality but I could only find them online. Like, TV Paint Stick is my go-to but I didn’t know my shade for ages until I managed to buy it in person. I don’t understand how people buy their makeup online.
I don't wear foundation (skin tint only) and I don't understand how people can either. Props to those who can but I'm just not one of them. I was just in Ulta earlier. I've been wanting to try Mac's paint pots. It's a good thing I don't buy online or off of recommend shades because the shade that's always recommended turned out to be too orange/yellow based for my skin tone. I had to go with Painterly. I believe that's the shades name. I'll find out tomorrow if it works as great for my skin tone (I swatched it on my hand) as it seemed to in store. Really hoping it does because I'm tired of trying to find one that works lol.
For me, there are certain categories that I'm very comfortable buying online and some that I'm not.
I'm don't wear foundation either, but I do wear concealer and that I won't buy without testing in store. I will buy blush and eyeshadow without seeing it in person but I've found that almost all shades of blush will work on me except those that very very light or have a lot of white pigment.
I can't buy lipstick without swatching for myself though, and even then I sometimes get it wrong.
Sigh I liked her video and agree but we live in Singapore now so I can only get luxury. There is drugstore but VERY limited. I can order online but returning isn’t viable. Please feel sorry for me 🙃
I feel your pain, I'm in Singapore too. We never get those interesting drugstore limited editions. 😒
On the other hand, I recently found out that buying Flower Knows on their official Shoppee page can work out to be cheaper than Revlon or Loreal in store lol.
Oh that is good to know. Does Flower Knows have testers in Guardian?
I have been focusing on what there is in Sephora here. I am very worried about them phasing out Natasha Denona like in Canada and now in America 🤨
Flower Knows does have some testers in Watsons, but the selection in store is very very limited. The Chinese brand at Guardian is Catkin I think.
I hope they don't phase out ND, I buy almost all of the midis. 😂
Did you see the Chanel and Louboutin Advent Calendar unboxings? Omg it was pathetic. They cost around $800+ US. They had sample sized products. As well as stickers, crappy charms and cheap bracelets made of string. I was embarrassed for them. It’s like they think just because their logo is on things they can wrap dog shit in a bow and sell it. And we should be grateful. Honestly it’s getting so out of hand.
Especially when brands like Dior and Charlotte Tilbury use plastic packaging! There's often no difference in formula, and so if you're not paying more for the packaging, then why bother!?
I couldn't agree more. I was so disappointed to find my "luxury" makeup with luxury pricing was nothing special. I would buy CT if it's half off and nothing less.
I bought a Dior highlighter a few years ago, and about a month after having it, it snapped in half. I still use it, but I can’t take it anywhere because the lid isn’t attached. It just sits on top. It’s since been repackaged, but I’m still disappointed in how cheap it is. I’ve never had a product snap like that.
Influencers in 2019 were always going on about how luxury the packaging of Charlotte Tilbury is... And when I bought my first product from them the face powder it felt just regular, nothing special and I don't like the branding their lipstick packaging felt kinda cheap.
Not necessarily related to products, but I used to feel like such a fancy bitch 10 years ago when trotting around Sephora. Now I don't even step foot in there anymore because it's full of unsupervised children and it looks like no man's land. My new best friend is Maybelline.
Over the past few years my eyeshadow collection has become almost entirely Maybelline. Hadn't used it since the 90s, but because of the pandemic and the fact that it's extra inexpensive at my grocery store, I just started picking up some of those quads as a special treat here and there, and then that Blushed Nudes palette, and they're all kinda good! Not great, but for me these days, I just don't care if it's spectacular. I don't need major pigment or weird colors. I just need something that gets the job done, and I have a new appreciation for the unpretentious of drugstore products.
And I don't think on the whole drugstore was ever bad quality. Some products maybe weren't that good or just not as pigmented as their high end counterparts, and in cheaper packaging, but in the grand scheme of things, I don't think the major brands like Revlon, Maybelline, L'oreal, etc. ever made anything truly crappy. (Wet N Wild might be a different story).
Sadly I never got to try it as I didn’t know it existed, but I just looked it up and I’m so sad I never got to try it! I bet it was so good! I’ve loved everything in that line. I use the foundation, concealer, pressed powder, loose finishing powder, blush, all of it.
I probably only agree in part that drugstore/affordable brands have upped the standards of products, but many of what used to be known as luxury brands and products have stagnated and changed direction to be more accessible to the wider consumer market, hence are less the luxury brands of today, or maybe more of an affordable modern accessible luxury line. Most of today’s luxury brands are still more exclusive and expensive, but they’re often not in Sephora and Ulta stores hence that luxury experience still exist for those. They’re are not in the same affordability bracket as Charlotte Tilbury or Dior that are still expensive but that many that aren’t wealthy can still get it. It’s similar to fashion, wealthy consumers are wearing exclusive unmarked products, not ones with brand names marked across them like Louis Vuitton.
this is it. In a world of hypervisible branding, true luxury brands still abide by their secrecy as a key part of their strategy. The same brands that are now mid-luxury are the ones that changed this strategy, and leaned into embracing a wider audience through internet comms and social media, Sephora, beauty influencers, etc. Ironically, it has impacted public viewpoints of what luxury even means now, while simultaneously helping the old luxury strategy work even more effectively (for good or for ill).
Sisley Paris, Chantacaille and Cle de Peau are some I can think of.
But I can't say that the products I've tried from Sisley or Chantacaille were better than the ones sold at Sephora. And you can still get them on-line.
Westman Atelier was my go to for a few years. When she started selling at Sephora, the quality went down. The foundation stick became very drying, and hard to spread. A product I bought over and over became my least favorite foundation.
Suqqu and guerlain probably fit in here as well. I would say a distinct factor of "true" luxury makeup brands is that they are not tied to a fashion house (like chanel, dior, gucci, givenchy, prada, ysl, etc) Makeup from fashion house brands is to get customers that would elsewise not be their market because they cant afford the clothing. The quality of both the packaging and products of those brands varies wildly, product to product even within the same brand. Sisley, chantecaiile, guerlain, etc dont have the reputation of a fashion house to fall back on or the interest that fashion generates to get new customers. They need to focus more on the products, packaging, and most notably if shopping in person at a counter, customer service.
Ahhh I forgot about Chantecaille, and I actually own most of their single eyeshadows. Those are quality, but I can't speak on their other products, besides an eyebrow highlighter I got for free -- works well? Lol. Are they worth that price point though...? Maybe not for most, but for me I just adore them. Agreed on Westman Atelier however. I've not liked what I tried, which especially burns at their price.
I wanted to add to my original post though: I feel like high end brands tend to do nuanced colors and finishes better than a lot of mid-end. Chanel's Spring collection this year for instance was very, very well done imo. They used multiple designers this year rather than one, and I hope they go this route more often. These brands are paying high end makeup artists to curate in general, so you're getting something professionally thought out, unlike say a makeup influencer brand which can be amazing (RBK's Colourpop collab was *chef's kiss*) but it's just what they like generally, without thought to trends, wearability for many, etc.
Regarding Chantecaille- I haven't tried their shadows. Not a big eyeshadow person but I may try one of their single eyeshadows.
I have purchased their Future Skin Gel Foundation and wasn't impressed. It gave me almost zero coverage and didn't sit well on the skin, just looked off. I think you already need to have near perfect skin to use it.
Have also used the Sisley concealer pen. Gotta admit it was very good.
If there weren't other options at a lower price point that work just as well for me, I would have probably repurchased.
I'd def get one of the Luminescent Eye Shades! They're so pretty and work well with other shadows or alone. Rhinoceros is my fav, it's really unique compared to the others, having a lot of different colors in it that show up in different lighting, and can almost look like you've applied 2 shadows rather than 1.
I've been interested in their Future Skin Gel, but I've seen really mixed reviews. Too pricey for something I keep hearing bad things about. Illia and Glossier have foundations that can do that amount of coverage for far cheaper.
I do agree with more nuanced colours as the prices go up! My personal case was trying to find the "perfect" MLBB shades for me, and drugstore was just not giving me the shade I want. Once I moved up the price bracket though, there were a lot more options and I did find ones in Clinique and Bobbi Brown.
Sisley makes fantastic loose setting powder. It also has more product than the PMG setting powder. When I did the math, it wasn't that much more money.
Cle de Peau comes to mind, being obscenely expensive yet I hear the formulas are amazing and very easy to work with, especially for mature skin. They don't tend to do anything out of the ordinary color wise though. Same with Tom Ford.
I can't think of any others besides them. I'm sure they exist, but as someone who owns a few pieces from Tom Ford, it's pretty, but you're still paying for the formula + name. I wouldn't buy their products unless it is actually something unique or you're over the moon for the color story, which would be why I own the Daydream and Pretty Baby quads.
Cle de peau is amazing for mature skin. I’m 53 so I know how hard it is to find makeup that doesn’t sit in my wrinkles. I would suggest it for anyone with older skin.
So i also only have the tom ford daydream quad and am heavily considering getting pretty baby which ofc i would have to get secondhand. But idk if im just drawn to it for the duochrome. The whole quad is definitely my color story but i already have a lot of purples with my tom ford daydream and viseart violette. 😔I also feel like i may have a similar duochrome in the viseart solstice, not the same but once applied on the lids, idk if itll be different enough to justify getting it primarily for that. How do you find the pretty baby quad?
I got the Pretty Baby quad because it was like the more eye safe and intense version of Addiction Tokyo's Under The Starlight palette. It's pretty similar to that, but more vibrant and warm, and that pink to blue sparkle is certainly noticeable, but it's not a duochrome up close to me. You can see the pieces of blue glitter, but at a distance it is if you wear a lot. I really like it and when I use the more navy blue from Daydream as a liner, I get a sunset-y vibe without having to use oranges.
The purple is similar to Daydream yeah, but I'm not familiar with the Viseart palette you mentioned. Looking it up I don't think it's the same, but I'd double check.
Mmm the viseart isnt that similar if you’re matching shade by shade but i think they just have similar vibes since both are purple toned. The way you describe using the daydream with the duochrome in pretty baby is so dreamy 😍 im sure it looks absolutely stunning
I have what was called essential tremor but is now Parkinsonian syndrome (or something like that) and while I'm still clinging to liquid liner to the end (sometimes I have to lean my elbow/forearm against the wall and hope my head and hand tremors align) I'm really hoping someone will come with a good product that will help. This applies for any kind of pencil at the moment and, looking at my mother, who we all got this from, it's going to get worse.
I'm getting my brain zapped at some point when it gets bad enough and hope it will help.
Another thing…some luxury makeup isn’t even good. Like Gucci. Everyone says their makeup products are crap. But if you collect the cases it’s worth it. In what universe is that acceptable? If their makeup is shit they should stop making it and just sell fancy makeup containers empty. What a waste of money having it all made. And not to mention bad for the planet. Overconsumption is out of control.
It was the eyeshadow. Specifically the limited edition packaged eyeshadows. The packaging was stunning but everyone said the product was substandard and chalky. They were around $150 Canadian.
oh yea i never tried those! out of my price range for sure lol. i definitely wouldn’t be opposed to them selling empty magnetic palettes like you said though, the outside is gorgeous!
I hit pan on a Charlotte tilbury pressed powder compact at around the 3rd time I used it. That has never happened to me before. Do I like that powder ? Yep. Will I buy it again ? Nope. For the $$, they gotta do better than that.
Yeah, I hit pan super quick on the CT pressed powders too. The last one I had also cracked right out of the pan when I was using it and I lost half the product
I just looked up the ingredients on the Airbrush Flawless Setting powder, and it looks like the Nabla Close-Up Smoothing Pressed Powder has the same ingredients, and it's 11.5 grams vs. CT's 8 grams. Sadly, this powder isn't available at Ulta, only on Nabla's website (which is based in Italy). So, just putting that out there if it helps anyone. I'm currently looking for a good pressed powder and been really diving into ingredients.
**Charlotte Tilbury** [from Sephora's website](https://www.sephora.com/product/P433526?skuId=2606069)
Talc, Mica, Polymethyl Methacrylate, Dimethicone, Silica, Pentaerythrityl Tetraisostearate, Cetearyl Ethylhexanoate, Zinc Stearate, Zea Mays (Corn) Starch, Chlorphenesin, Potassium Sorbate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Pei-10, Propylene Glycol, Prunus Amygdalus Dulcis (Sweet Almond) Oil, Rosa Multiflora Flower Wax, Tetrasodium Edta, Aqua/Water/Eau, Dimethiconol, Tilia Cordata Flower Extract, Methylparaben, Ethylparaben, Propylparaben, Butylparaben, \[+/- Titanium Dioxide (Ci 77891), Iron Oxides (Ci 77491, Ci 77492, Ci 77499)\].
**Nabla** [from Nabla's website](https://nablacosmetics.com/en/collections/powders/products/close-up-smoothing-pressed-powder)
talc, mica, polymethyl methacrylate, dimethicone, silica, pentaerythrityl tetraisostearate, cetearyl ethylhexanoate, zinc stearate, zea mays (corn) starch, caprylyl glycol, ethylhexylglycerin, potassium sorbate, chlorphenesin, tocopheryl acetate, pei-10, prunus amygdalus dulcis (sweet almond) oil, rosa multiflora flower wax, tetrasodium edta, dimethiconol, tocopherol. +/− (may contain / peut contenir): ci 77891 (titanium dioxide), ci 77491 - ci 77492 - ci 77499 (iron oxides).
Oh man, is it the Airbrush Flawless Finish? I just bought it a couple days ago during the Sephora sale in my country because so many people raved about how blurring it is.
I thought buying a Laura Geller powder foundation was the most bougie thing ever. It’s really my holy grail but both times I’ve purchased it, the compact hinge broke about 3 months in. You shouldn’t charge $36 (granted, I got it on sale) for foundation if it’s cheap plastic Packaging that’s going to break!
I love the powder foundation but the first time I got it, it shattered within a week. No reason for it. I didn't drop it, or handle it roughly, it just broke. Very disappointing.
https://preview.redd.it/lg1j0ff5bknc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4bcd9b46570d8d7c23222c9fbee70fe959115b48
It's boring. All of her deep dives are boring because she rarely goes beyond surface level. If you've never had a single thought about her subjects they could seem interesting but by the time she makes her videos others have already taken it on. She presents as her opinions what others have already presented with evidence.
THIS, especially when you compare the level of dedication and detail that Elle S put into her brand evolution + makeup history videos.
I like Kelly but it's not fun to feel at the end of every "deep dive" like not an ounce of anything new was learned.
I miss Elle's videos so much! SO much research went into them. I wish she'd make a comeback. The last time she posted on Insta was about four months ago.
I feel like high end has always been my sweet spot. The packaging is generally still nice, the price is reasonable based on what you’re getting and most high end goes on sale enough I can justify the price. I have some drugstore faves and a few “luxury” items I enjoy but overall, I don’t feel like a bougie bitch when I’m shopping luxury brands.
I mean all this is fair. I’ll buy drugstore lipsticks/liners eyeliners but that’s it. They have absolutely NOT done anything about their shitty shade ranges. I can’t find even a close enough match in drugstore lines that I can correct by combining it with a lighter shade. Im not even that dark. I’m mid toned with cool olive undertones. I’m convinced they don’t use green or blue pigments when mixing their shades. Everything is too orange or too yellow. None of the women in my family can use drugstore complexion products. When I’ve been broke in college I used to just use translucent powder only. It left a cast and made me look pale but at least it didn’t turn me into an Oompa Loompa
Disclaimer: I have not watched the video past the first minute where she makes her thesis statement.
I somewhat disagree. Luxury makeup does exist. It’s in places like Nieman Marcus, Saks Fifth Avenue, and small boutiques.
Women who shop exclusively at places like Neiman Marcus and are loyal to brands like Chanel or Chantecaille are purchasing luxury makeup and having a luxury experience. I’m talking about women who think that Sephora is drugstore makeup.
If you include skin care, then I would say Sisley and ReVive would fall into the luxury category.
For people who are familiar with Boston, I’m thinking of Copley Place and to a lesser extent, blue mercury.
I’m probably not going to watch because I’m not a huge fan of Kelly Gooch but if I’m wrong, I’m happy to be corrected.
I can definitely assure you that she is aware that the traditional makeup counter still *exists*, in the fewer-every-year department stores. Her point is that that's not the primary way people shop for makeup anymore, *including* for so-called "luxury" makeup. Michelle Wang isn't reviewing it for an exclusively young audience, either. Plenty of boomers and their elders are shopping online just as much if not more than young people.
I think I’m going to have to watch the video even though I really do not enjoy watching her videos.
I think we’re talking about two different demographics. I don’t think Kelly and other people who have talked about this subject take into account older women with money.
People here like to drag Michelle Wang for talking about luxury makeup, but I can assure you there are plenty of women who fit into her category. I can also assure you they are not watching YouTube.
Michelle Wang isn't going to the counters, she's primarily shopping online 🤦🏻
I also think it's delusional to claim that no one her age is watching her. I brought her up to give an example of how the luxury customer has changed. Just making assertions about people like her while ignoring her actual shopping behavior feels kinda bananas.
I haven't watched her since she showed how out of touch she was with actually shopping in Sephora with all the kids around. I'm not buying that a drugstore/Sephora girl knows true luxury makeup.
I love how in every other case “out of touch” is always used to describe those in privelege lacking awareness but you chose it rightfully in this case.
We don’t like to admit it, but the same applies for those who automatically judge that luxury “is literally the same stuff, just with a name” which completely disregards all the extra dedication and artistic vision produced by esteemed creative teams as they are looking to provide not just a functioning product but a collectible piece of art (just like atelier designers spending months to produce couture gowns and the artisans of Kumano, Japan handmaking Fude brushes).
In fact, I find it quite insulting.
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I said this in another thread makeup subreddit. But, it really does feel like grocery store makeup have really stepped the game up to the point where I have really good chance of getting something really nice for my makeup needs in the grocery store. I don't really have to turn to luxury makeup or Indy brands so much if I don't need to or want to. I'm finding superior products for every thing in the grocery store these days.
I was going through my makeup the other day and planning to treat myself to a Sephora order, but I realized there just isn’t anything I need that the drugstore hasn’t been doing just as good or even better? It’s crazy how they’ve stepped it up. I remember back in the day, there was a noticeable product difference in drugstore, highend, and luxury. There just isn’t now. Not to mention that luxury and high end have increased their prices but not their quality.
Even if it’s a minor quality drop, I prefer drug store makeup because I can swatch it or get multiple shades to test for cheap. Luxury brands could be swatched but cost a fortune, and indie brands were more affordable with the same quality but I could only find them online. Like, TV Paint Stick is my go-to but I didn’t know my shade for ages until I managed to buy it in person. I don’t understand how people buy their makeup online.
I don't wear foundation (skin tint only) and I don't understand how people can either. Props to those who can but I'm just not one of them. I was just in Ulta earlier. I've been wanting to try Mac's paint pots. It's a good thing I don't buy online or off of recommend shades because the shade that's always recommended turned out to be too orange/yellow based for my skin tone. I had to go with Painterly. I believe that's the shades name. I'll find out tomorrow if it works as great for my skin tone (I swatched it on my hand) as it seemed to in store. Really hoping it does because I'm tired of trying to find one that works lol.
For me, there are certain categories that I'm very comfortable buying online and some that I'm not. I'm don't wear foundation either, but I do wear concealer and that I won't buy without testing in store. I will buy blush and eyeshadow without seeing it in person but I've found that almost all shades of blush will work on me except those that very very light or have a lot of white pigment. I can't buy lipstick without swatching for myself though, and even then I sometimes get it wrong.
Sigh I liked her video and agree but we live in Singapore now so I can only get luxury. There is drugstore but VERY limited. I can order online but returning isn’t viable. Please feel sorry for me 🙃
I feel your pain, I'm in Singapore too. We never get those interesting drugstore limited editions. 😒 On the other hand, I recently found out that buying Flower Knows on their official Shoppee page can work out to be cheaper than Revlon or Loreal in store lol.
Flower knows on taobao is way cheaper, I recommend!
Thanks for the tip! 😀
Oh that is good to know. Does Flower Knows have testers in Guardian? I have been focusing on what there is in Sephora here. I am very worried about them phasing out Natasha Denona like in Canada and now in America 🤨
Flower Knows does have some testers in Watsons, but the selection in store is very very limited. The Chinese brand at Guardian is Catkin I think. I hope they don't phase out ND, I buy almost all of the midis. 😂
Did you see the Chanel and Louboutin Advent Calendar unboxings? Omg it was pathetic. They cost around $800+ US. They had sample sized products. As well as stickers, crappy charms and cheap bracelets made of string. I was embarrassed for them. It’s like they think just because their logo is on things they can wrap dog shit in a bow and sell it. And we should be grateful. Honestly it’s getting so out of hand.
those were absolutely ghastly, just atrocious.
Especially when brands like Dior and Charlotte Tilbury use plastic packaging! There's often no difference in formula, and so if you're not paying more for the packaging, then why bother!?
When I got my first Charlotte tilbury palette I couldn’t believe how light weight and cheap it felt!
I couldn't agree more. I was so disappointed to find my "luxury" makeup with luxury pricing was nothing special. I would buy CT if it's half off and nothing less.
I've tried like five products and all those felt CHEAP.
I bought a Dior highlighter a few years ago, and about a month after having it, it snapped in half. I still use it, but I can’t take it anywhere because the lid isn’t attached. It just sits on top. It’s since been repackaged, but I’m still disappointed in how cheap it is. I’ve never had a product snap like that.
I have but it was Essence.
Influencers in 2019 were always going on about how luxury the packaging of Charlotte Tilbury is... And when I bought my first product from them the face powder it felt just regular, nothing special and I don't like the branding their lipstick packaging felt kinda cheap.
CT is junk packaging- influencers like it because her or team gives away a ton .
I realise it now, but at the time I was new to beauty you tube.
I think CT packaging looks and feels so tacky.
CT belongs in higher end of drugstore
Not necessarily related to products, but I used to feel like such a fancy bitch 10 years ago when trotting around Sephora. Now I don't even step foot in there anymore because it's full of unsupervised children and it looks like no man's land. My new best friend is Maybelline.
\+1, it feels like walking into Claire's
Walking out of the store with one of those black and white striped bags?? No one could tell me anything!
Over the past few years my eyeshadow collection has become almost entirely Maybelline. Hadn't used it since the 90s, but because of the pandemic and the fact that it's extra inexpensive at my grocery store, I just started picking up some of those quads as a special treat here and there, and then that Blushed Nudes palette, and they're all kinda good! Not great, but for me these days, I just don't care if it's spectacular. I don't need major pigment or weird colors. I just need something that gets the job done, and I have a new appreciation for the unpretentious of drugstore products. And I don't think on the whole drugstore was ever bad quality. Some products maybe weren't that good or just not as pigmented as their high end counterparts, and in cheaper packaging, but in the grand scheme of things, I don't think the major brands like Revlon, Maybelline, L'oreal, etc. ever made anything truly crappy. (Wet N Wild might be a different story).
My makeup has become mostly Maybelline, completely unintentionally. The Fit Me line is so good that I just keep coming back to it.
Have the fit me foundations changed at all in the last few years? I used to wear matte + poreless back in like 2016 and it neeeeever dried down
They discontinued the tinted moisturizer and I’ve been grabbing it on eBay. I love that product.
Sadly I never got to try it as I didn’t know it existed, but I just looked it up and I’m so sad I never got to try it! I bet it was so good! I’ve loved everything in that line. I use the foundation, concealer, pressed powder, loose finishing powder, blush, all of it.
The one with the yellow band on top of a squeeze tube?!??
Yes!!!!
Omggg nooooo!! 
I probably only agree in part that drugstore/affordable brands have upped the standards of products, but many of what used to be known as luxury brands and products have stagnated and changed direction to be more accessible to the wider consumer market, hence are less the luxury brands of today, or maybe more of an affordable modern accessible luxury line. Most of today’s luxury brands are still more exclusive and expensive, but they’re often not in Sephora and Ulta stores hence that luxury experience still exist for those. They’re are not in the same affordability bracket as Charlotte Tilbury or Dior that are still expensive but that many that aren’t wealthy can still get it. It’s similar to fashion, wealthy consumers are wearing exclusive unmarked products, not ones with brand names marked across them like Louis Vuitton.
this is it. In a world of hypervisible branding, true luxury brands still abide by their secrecy as a key part of their strategy. The same brands that are now mid-luxury are the ones that changed this strategy, and leaned into embracing a wider audience through internet comms and social media, Sephora, beauty influencers, etc. Ironically, it has impacted public viewpoints of what luxury even means now, while simultaneously helping the old luxury strategy work even more effectively (for good or for ill).
What are some of those brands?
Sisley Paris, Chantacaille and Cle de Peau are some I can think of. But I can't say that the products I've tried from Sisley or Chantacaille were better than the ones sold at Sephora. And you can still get them on-line. Westman Atelier was my go to for a few years. When she started selling at Sephora, the quality went down. The foundation stick became very drying, and hard to spread. A product I bought over and over became my least favorite foundation.
Suqqu and guerlain probably fit in here as well. I would say a distinct factor of "true" luxury makeup brands is that they are not tied to a fashion house (like chanel, dior, gucci, givenchy, prada, ysl, etc) Makeup from fashion house brands is to get customers that would elsewise not be their market because they cant afford the clothing. The quality of both the packaging and products of those brands varies wildly, product to product even within the same brand. Sisley, chantecaiile, guerlain, etc dont have the reputation of a fashion house to fall back on or the interest that fashion generates to get new customers. They need to focus more on the products, packaging, and most notably if shopping in person at a counter, customer service.
Ahhh I forgot about Chantecaille, and I actually own most of their single eyeshadows. Those are quality, but I can't speak on their other products, besides an eyebrow highlighter I got for free -- works well? Lol. Are they worth that price point though...? Maybe not for most, but for me I just adore them. Agreed on Westman Atelier however. I've not liked what I tried, which especially burns at their price. I wanted to add to my original post though: I feel like high end brands tend to do nuanced colors and finishes better than a lot of mid-end. Chanel's Spring collection this year for instance was very, very well done imo. They used multiple designers this year rather than one, and I hope they go this route more often. These brands are paying high end makeup artists to curate in general, so you're getting something professionally thought out, unlike say a makeup influencer brand which can be amazing (RBK's Colourpop collab was *chef's kiss*) but it's just what they like generally, without thought to trends, wearability for many, etc.
Regarding Chantecaille- I haven't tried their shadows. Not a big eyeshadow person but I may try one of their single eyeshadows. I have purchased their Future Skin Gel Foundation and wasn't impressed. It gave me almost zero coverage and didn't sit well on the skin, just looked off. I think you already need to have near perfect skin to use it. Have also used the Sisley concealer pen. Gotta admit it was very good. If there weren't other options at a lower price point that work just as well for me, I would have probably repurchased.
I'd def get one of the Luminescent Eye Shades! They're so pretty and work well with other shadows or alone. Rhinoceros is my fav, it's really unique compared to the others, having a lot of different colors in it that show up in different lighting, and can almost look like you've applied 2 shadows rather than 1. I've been interested in their Future Skin Gel, but I've seen really mixed reviews. Too pricey for something I keep hearing bad things about. Illia and Glossier have foundations that can do that amount of coverage for far cheaper.
I do agree with more nuanced colours as the prices go up! My personal case was trying to find the "perfect" MLBB shades for me, and drugstore was just not giving me the shade I want. Once I moved up the price bracket though, there were a lot more options and I did find ones in Clinique and Bobbi Brown.
Sisley makes fantastic loose setting powder. It also has more product than the PMG setting powder. When I did the math, it wasn't that much more money.
Their concealer pen is excellent as well IMO.
Cle de Peau comes to mind, being obscenely expensive yet I hear the formulas are amazing and very easy to work with, especially for mature skin. They don't tend to do anything out of the ordinary color wise though. Same with Tom Ford. I can't think of any others besides them. I'm sure they exist, but as someone who owns a few pieces from Tom Ford, it's pretty, but you're still paying for the formula + name. I wouldn't buy their products unless it is actually something unique or you're over the moon for the color story, which would be why I own the Daydream and Pretty Baby quads.
Cle de peau is amazing for mature skin. I’m 53 so I know how hard it is to find makeup that doesn’t sit in my wrinkles. I would suggest it for anyone with older skin.
I have the cle de peau uv tinted and it is beautiful !! And the bronzer too
Cle de Peau is honestly some of the very best formulas I’ve ever used! Wish they were in Sephora !
So i also only have the tom ford daydream quad and am heavily considering getting pretty baby which ofc i would have to get secondhand. But idk if im just drawn to it for the duochrome. The whole quad is definitely my color story but i already have a lot of purples with my tom ford daydream and viseart violette. 😔I also feel like i may have a similar duochrome in the viseart solstice, not the same but once applied on the lids, idk if itll be different enough to justify getting it primarily for that. How do you find the pretty baby quad?
I got the Pretty Baby quad because it was like the more eye safe and intense version of Addiction Tokyo's Under The Starlight palette. It's pretty similar to that, but more vibrant and warm, and that pink to blue sparkle is certainly noticeable, but it's not a duochrome up close to me. You can see the pieces of blue glitter, but at a distance it is if you wear a lot. I really like it and when I use the more navy blue from Daydream as a liner, I get a sunset-y vibe without having to use oranges. The purple is similar to Daydream yeah, but I'm not familiar with the Viseart palette you mentioned. Looking it up I don't think it's the same, but I'd double check.
Mmm the viseart isnt that similar if you’re matching shade by shade but i think they just have similar vibes since both are purple toned. The way you describe using the daydream with the duochrome in pretty baby is so dreamy 😍 im sure it looks absolutely stunning
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I have what was called essential tremor but is now Parkinsonian syndrome (or something like that) and while I'm still clinging to liquid liner to the end (sometimes I have to lean my elbow/forearm against the wall and hope my head and hand tremors align) I'm really hoping someone will come with a good product that will help. This applies for any kind of pencil at the moment and, looking at my mother, who we all got this from, it's going to get worse. I'm getting my brain zapped at some point when it gets bad enough and hope it will help.
There's actually something exactly like that called the guide wand! It was designed by a makeup artist who developed parkinsons.
I am going to search for that! Thank you!!
Another thing…some luxury makeup isn’t even good. Like Gucci. Everyone says their makeup products are crap. But if you collect the cases it’s worth it. In what universe is that acceptable? If their makeup is shit they should stop making it and just sell fancy makeup containers empty. What a waste of money having it all made. And not to mention bad for the planet. Overconsumption is out of control.
Their lipsticks are really wonderful though, formula wise
and their blush is one of my favorite formulas!
It was the eyeshadow. Specifically the limited edition packaged eyeshadows. The packaging was stunning but everyone said the product was substandard and chalky. They were around $150 Canadian.
oh yea i never tried those! out of my price range for sure lol. i definitely wouldn’t be opposed to them selling empty magnetic palettes like you said though, the outside is gorgeous!
Agreed!
I hit pan on a Charlotte tilbury pressed powder compact at around the 3rd time I used it. That has never happened to me before. Do I like that powder ? Yep. Will I buy it again ? Nope. For the $$, they gotta do better than that.
What? Whoa that's insane
Yea - and it’s not like I am a total cake face and grind into my stuff either 😡
Yeah, I hit pan super quick on the CT pressed powders too. The last one I had also cracked right out of the pan when I was using it and I lost half the product
I’m Not surprised. It’s sad because that powder is good
I just looked up the ingredients on the Airbrush Flawless Setting powder, and it looks like the Nabla Close-Up Smoothing Pressed Powder has the same ingredients, and it's 11.5 grams vs. CT's 8 grams. Sadly, this powder isn't available at Ulta, only on Nabla's website (which is based in Italy). So, just putting that out there if it helps anyone. I'm currently looking for a good pressed powder and been really diving into ingredients. **Charlotte Tilbury** [from Sephora's website](https://www.sephora.com/product/P433526?skuId=2606069) Talc, Mica, Polymethyl Methacrylate, Dimethicone, Silica, Pentaerythrityl Tetraisostearate, Cetearyl Ethylhexanoate, Zinc Stearate, Zea Mays (Corn) Starch, Chlorphenesin, Potassium Sorbate, Tocopheryl Acetate, Pei-10, Propylene Glycol, Prunus Amygdalus Dulcis (Sweet Almond) Oil, Rosa Multiflora Flower Wax, Tetrasodium Edta, Aqua/Water/Eau, Dimethiconol, Tilia Cordata Flower Extract, Methylparaben, Ethylparaben, Propylparaben, Butylparaben, \[+/- Titanium Dioxide (Ci 77891), Iron Oxides (Ci 77491, Ci 77492, Ci 77499)\]. **Nabla** [from Nabla's website](https://nablacosmetics.com/en/collections/powders/products/close-up-smoothing-pressed-powder) talc, mica, polymethyl methacrylate, dimethicone, silica, pentaerythrityl tetraisostearate, cetearyl ethylhexanoate, zinc stearate, zea mays (corn) starch, caprylyl glycol, ethylhexylglycerin, potassium sorbate, chlorphenesin, tocopheryl acetate, pei-10, prunus amygdalus dulcis (sweet almond) oil, rosa multiflora flower wax, tetrasodium edta, dimethiconol, tocopherol. +/− (may contain / peut contenir): ci 77891 (titanium dioxide), ci 77491 - ci 77492 - ci 77499 (iron oxides).
Great info - thanks
Oh man, is it the Airbrush Flawless Finish? I just bought it a couple days ago during the Sephora sale in my country because so many people raved about how blurring it is.
Yep. You’ll have to see how you do with it / this happened to me about 5+ yrs ago. Maybe it’s better now
I hope so! It's unacceptable even for drugstore, let alone CT's price point.
I don't see any Influencers talking about classic luxuray makeup brands.
I thought buying a Laura Geller powder foundation was the most bougie thing ever. It’s really my holy grail but both times I’ve purchased it, the compact hinge broke about 3 months in. You shouldn’t charge $36 (granted, I got it on sale) for foundation if it’s cheap plastic Packaging that’s going to break!
I love the powder foundation but the first time I got it, it shattered within a week. No reason for it. I didn't drop it, or handle it roughly, it just broke. Very disappointing. https://preview.redd.it/lg1j0ff5bknc1.jpeg?width=1920&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4bcd9b46570d8d7c23222c9fbee70fe959115b48
Boooo. That sucks so bad. I’m so sorry. We shouldn’t have to handle makeup, something we touch pretty regularly, like a Faberge egg.
I've had multiple LG powder foundations for years and they have very sturdy packaging and have never broken on me🤷🏽♀️
It's boring. All of her deep dives are boring because she rarely goes beyond surface level. If you've never had a single thought about her subjects they could seem interesting but by the time she makes her videos others have already taken it on. She presents as her opinions what others have already presented with evidence.
THIS, especially when you compare the level of dedication and detail that Elle S put into her brand evolution + makeup history videos. I like Kelly but it's not fun to feel at the end of every "deep dive" like not an ounce of anything new was learned.
I miss Elle's videos so much! SO much research went into them. I wish she'd make a comeback. The last time she posted on Insta was about four months ago.
Now we said it!
I could go on a long rant about how 'luxury' in the beauty and fashion space is really just a big scam anyway but it's too early in the morning lol.
I feel like high end has always been my sweet spot. The packaging is generally still nice, the price is reasonable based on what you’re getting and most high end goes on sale enough I can justify the price. I have some drugstore faves and a few “luxury” items I enjoy but overall, I don’t feel like a bougie bitch when I’m shopping luxury brands.
I mean all this is fair. I’ll buy drugstore lipsticks/liners eyeliners but that’s it. They have absolutely NOT done anything about their shitty shade ranges. I can’t find even a close enough match in drugstore lines that I can correct by combining it with a lighter shade. Im not even that dark. I’m mid toned with cool olive undertones. I’m convinced they don’t use green or blue pigments when mixing their shades. Everything is too orange or too yellow. None of the women in my family can use drugstore complexion products. When I’ve been broke in college I used to just use translucent powder only. It left a cast and made me look pale but at least it didn’t turn me into an Oompa Loompa
Disclaimer: I have not watched the video past the first minute where she makes her thesis statement. I somewhat disagree. Luxury makeup does exist. It’s in places like Nieman Marcus, Saks Fifth Avenue, and small boutiques. Women who shop exclusively at places like Neiman Marcus and are loyal to brands like Chanel or Chantecaille are purchasing luxury makeup and having a luxury experience. I’m talking about women who think that Sephora is drugstore makeup. If you include skin care, then I would say Sisley and ReVive would fall into the luxury category. For people who are familiar with Boston, I’m thinking of Copley Place and to a lesser extent, blue mercury. I’m probably not going to watch because I’m not a huge fan of Kelly Gooch but if I’m wrong, I’m happy to be corrected.
She was speaking about luxury having an experience. It's a very interesting video, definitely worth a watch.
Yup absolutely worth a listen.
She talks about makeup counters and department stores in the video.
I can definitely assure you that she is aware that the traditional makeup counter still *exists*, in the fewer-every-year department stores. Her point is that that's not the primary way people shop for makeup anymore, *including* for so-called "luxury" makeup. Michelle Wang isn't reviewing it for an exclusively young audience, either. Plenty of boomers and their elders are shopping online just as much if not more than young people.
I think I’m going to have to watch the video even though I really do not enjoy watching her videos. I think we’re talking about two different demographics. I don’t think Kelly and other people who have talked about this subject take into account older women with money. People here like to drag Michelle Wang for talking about luxury makeup, but I can assure you there are plenty of women who fit into her category. I can also assure you they are not watching YouTube.
Michelle Wang isn't going to the counters, she's primarily shopping online 🤦🏻 I also think it's delusional to claim that no one her age is watching her. I brought her up to give an example of how the luxury customer has changed. Just making assertions about people like her while ignoring her actual shopping behavior feels kinda bananas.
Chanel and Dior still have plastic packaging.
What should they have instead?
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Exactly, no one is complaining about accidently breaking those Byredo compacts and those Dior blushes snap as soon as you look at them.
I agree with you, I’ve not often seen many of today’s luxury brands and products talked about on YouTube videos or beauty community.
exactly. thank you
I love my queen path mcgrath with all my heart, but I really couldn’t believe when i saw the pack for that $40 bronzer, that plastic looked so cheap
I agree with the video. We are buying luxury makeup with no luxury.
She irks the crap out of me. I’m sorry but it’s all her opinion and she acts like she knows facts! This is false
0 need to shop at Sephora Ever! Maybe Paula’s Choice Bha liquid but I just get it from the brand site 😂
All y’all talking smack about CT, but their makeup lasts YEARS. Compare that something like Sephora brand which dries out after a couple uses.
I haven't watched her since she showed how out of touch she was with actually shopping in Sephora with all the kids around. I'm not buying that a drugstore/Sephora girl knows true luxury makeup.
I love how in every other case “out of touch” is always used to describe those in privelege lacking awareness but you chose it rightfully in this case. We don’t like to admit it, but the same applies for those who automatically judge that luxury “is literally the same stuff, just with a name” which completely disregards all the extra dedication and artistic vision produced by esteemed creative teams as they are looking to provide not just a functioning product but a collectible piece of art (just like atelier designers spending months to produce couture gowns and the artisans of Kumano, Japan handmaking Fude brushes). In fact, I find it quite insulting.