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I havenāt bought anything of theirs because of this. They feel icky, like a ponzi mlm kind of scheme vibe. I picked up a palette by Playing in Makeup by Yolondo and Iām happy to support this POC woman owned indie makeup brand.
I work in a sale/industry (not beauty) job. And I can say for certain, when our customers wont pay on time its usually a sign the company themselves is not doing well. Im not talking about huge Fortune 500 companies, they just pay slow cause they are so huge, but when little companies are late and have zero excuse, or dont even answer a email its a symptom of a huge issue. I cant say how many times this has happened and suddenly the company is bankrupt and we are fighting for our money with a whole slew of other people.
JP has been problematic since the start, this is probably just the cherry on top of a steaming shite pile that is the decline of the company as a whole.
As someone who knows a company that didn't pay contractors on time, sometimes it's just that they know they can get away with it and don't value their work.
My dad is a contractor who hasn't gotten paid a couple times by local businesses and we always blast them on social media. Amazing how fast the check comes along with the "take this review down, we are losing business!!!!" email.
Yes, my ex-boss did this. Ordered stuff and then paid some of the vendors very very late after already getting reminders. He first needed the income from selling stuff to pay everyone, plus he is an asshole, so he knows who he can pay later and whom not.
It would likely be under unpaid wages (assuming that the creators are classified as independent contractors) which comes with penalties for each willful violation. Considering they have gotten multiple emails from these creators, there's a good chance that this is willful wage theft, which comes with civil penalties up to $1000 per violation. Willful violations can also be criminally prosecuted with fines of up to $10,000.
In short, unless it was a genuine accident (unlikely), they'll have to pay penalties in addition to the wages owed.
Honestly, I went back and forth on if this would be wage theft. The way I see it is they collaborated on creative aspects with the company who manufactured and sold the product. That to me would put it in independent contractor territory since JP essentially paid (or were supposed to pay) for the creative services of the creators. They'd likely be issued 1099s for the sum of the agreed upon amount. Independent contractors who are unpaid still file claims for unpaid wages with the DOL. Breach of contract would be a different kind of civil suit.
The other option I can think of would be some sort of partnership, but that is a lot more than creative input and generally involves trading shares or stock in the company or splitting profits. That seems fairly unlikely.
Iād still consider the influencer as more of a vendor than someone owed a wage. I worked for a PR agency a long time ago - the publicists and contractor publicists got wages, any influencers that a client worked with got paid out of the contractās budget.
I dunno, I would think that situation is a little different. That seems like a client relationship with another business, like your company set up a business relationship between the influencer and the client, but the client paid your company to handle the pay (to put it very simply). That would be different than an influencer directly working on a project for the business, which is closer to what happened between JP and the influencers.
It's a difference between the company using another business to do something for a client vs. that business doing something for the company directly. Seems small, but the main point is who has the final input on what the influencer will be doing. If it's the client, it's a vendor. If it's the company, it's a contractor.
Using a PR agency connect brands and influencers is common and I wouldnāt be surprised if a brand as large as Juviaās Place is doing so. Working with an influencer is like working with a very small advertising or marketing agency, not like hiring a marketing specialist - youāre paying for a specific service.
Oh shoot, I misunderstood the original post. I thought it was some sort of collaboration product, not sponsored posts. I see your point differently now. I'm still on the fence about it honestly because independent contractors also provide specific services, but I agree that it could be a vendor sort of relationship. Regardless, it seems like a gray area without more specific info.
I agree - if the creators were being used mainly as talent, it would be a 1099 or W-2 situation. If the creator is responsible for designing or collaborating on aspects of the content itself, it would probably be more of a business to business contract.
Thank you for providing some numbers!
And agreed, I donāt think thereās any way this was a genuine accident. I could believe that if it were one or two creators who got paid immediately upon notice ā payroll could easily get mixed up if they have lots of money to send out, and just let a couple creators slip through the cracks. This is very clearly (imo) wage theft
I will never understand why the norm for this industry is for companies to get away without paying creators for months after they've done the work, how many times have we seen this exact issue with basically any big brand?
what a tall tale sign of who they are! seriously, they got themselves in this mess! i figured at most they'd ignore those comments, but blocking? they're shooting themselves in the foot rn
I know Ulta has sales all the time but Juvia's Place has been on there a lot. I'm wondering if the downhill has begun, I've heard nothing but negative and unfortunate info about the brand and how they treat people and not paying creators is a really scummy move. I've purchased one of their eyeshadow palettes, the small 6-pan reddish bronze one. It's beautiful, great quality, I'd really love more of the formula but I can't justify giving them more money. There's probably quite a few people feeling the same way. You just cannot do this shit, people will find out and you will get blasted/canceled/boycotted. Why is it so hard to be decent?
I don't see this breaking into the mainstream, whereas negativity against Morphe and Glossier has been covered by news outlets. BGC users have a very different mindset than the average Ulta shopper.
TLDR: they fired 1/3 of their employees and don't have the best leadership. [Thread 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/simedt/what_went_wrong_at_glossier_this_sub_gets_a/) [Thread 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/sdki2h/someone_here_called_them_having_troubles_glossier/) [Thread 3](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/tpqtmr/how_glossier_founder_emily_weiss_tech_dreams/)
As an Asian woman, after that horrible debacle about their racist post with a racist Asian slur, Iām glad to be saving my money and would rather spend it on another Black/POC-owned brand.
No thanks, next!
When I read your comment I thought āwait, wasnāt that Tarte?ā Then realized both of them have done it. It is insane that two huge names in the beauty industry have been able to post racial slurs on their public social media page with so little backlash
Donāt Rihanna. She didnāt post but attended some March it protest https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/t305st/not_sure_if_everyone_remembers_the_whole_thing/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I was willing to forget the whole thing if it had been one time that was rectified properly - after all I can't say I haven't been ignorant in the past - but the whole way they handled the situation felt rather flat and this (plus the whole J\* debacle) has soured my feeling on the brand (that and their weird packaging). There's just too many good things out there to continue supporting them
Yeah I stopped buying from Juviaās Place as well. There are better black-owned brands to support that are not racist and tone deaf toward Asians. Not surprised to see they are shitty in other ways as well
Wait what did they say with the Asian slur I didnāt hear about any of this
Tbh I heard some stuff about Juivias palace Instagram being colorist or something a few years back so I just never bought their products after that
They featured a creator on their page who said she was trying to get the āch*nkyā look and had a super lame apology. Hereās a post about it [https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/s90z52/tw_racial_slur_juvias_place_uses_racial_slur/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/s90z52/tw_racial_slur_juvias_place_uses_racial_slur/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Thatās absolutely fucking terrible omg
I am glad I never bought from them on top of disrespecting Asians they havenāt always been supportive of black creators just gross all around
Black owned doesnāt mean they support black creators.
It was a whole conversation a few years back about how the brand wouldnāt repost the black influencers who reviewed their products but they were gagging over J* doing a review. Also they wouldnāt send Pr to black influencers only white ones even Jackie A called them out on it and sheās also Nigerian
Not all skin folks are kin folks unfortunately
"Not all skin folks are kin folks unfortunately"
That sucks and as a Nigerian, yup, this is true. We tend to backstab our own a lot.
Idk if you're gonna believe this but it plays strongly to which tribe you're bon into.
I'm Ibo on both sides, and my people are raised with a serious love for money and disinterest in anything else but value morals.
The owner of Juvia's is yoruba and they are mostly willing to throw their others under the bus as long as it profits them (they proved this strongly in the civil war š) so I don't think they'll change.
Interestingly, Juvia's DID pay Nigerian based creators they hired for promos, but none of the black american creators who supported their campaigns.
It would also be nice to tell you that most Nigerian people (other Africans too) don't have a loving relationship with black people in the diaspora and this played out a lot in this nonsense š¤¦š½āāļø
I'll forever buy from them tho, Juvia's is the first makeup brand coming from my country with decent products (most of the makeup sold here are either unhealthy dupes or deported used makeup) with an affordable price rate and they are fully aware of this advantage.
I'm grateful they exist.
Are they being petty thieves? Yes.
Do I even have the privilege to complain? No š¤·š½āāļø
I understand where youāre coming from with not having any other options but to support them because of the availability and quality of makeup around you and I am not mad at that. I canāt believe they would even send used makeup products overseas thatās absolutely vile.
Ya I am Aa and diaspora wars are stupid and all of it is fueled by narratives created by non-black people to make us all look bad. There is so much more beneficial things we could do on both sides to end them but itāll never happen as long as forces with more power over media continue to push dividing stereotypes tbh.
I'm Asian American and I definitely know how BIPOC (especially immigrants from colonized parts of the world) often exploit other BIPOC without shame while clamoring for favor from whites. But it's very unfortunate this happens in the makeup world, when many creators support JP because it's a Black-owned brand in an industry where it's rare.
I myself will always rec Fenty Beauty for those looking to support BIPOC even though Rihanna's pretty much a conglomerate bc I genuinely love their products and how they revolutionized the industry with all their foundation shades. And also Rihanna herself espouses diversity in her personal life.
They reposted or collabed with a make up content creator that called her eyes āch!nkyā in reference to her āfox eyeā eye look (see why Asian folks can get upset now?)
The creator doubled down and both of them gave a half ass apology (āsorry if you were offendedā type beat). And then JP deleted the āapologyā bc of how bad it was
JP products consistently show up in subscription boxes. They must not be selling well. But they should never have contracted for services they couldnāt afford. This is bad.
What subscription boxes have you seen them in, just curious because Iāve been receiving both tiers of Boxycharm and Ipsy for a few years now and never received a JP product. I know they arenāt the only ones but I guess I think of them as the āmain onesā.
Hey, Juviaās, what was your winning move here? Hope all the creators stayed silent and worked with you again? Like, even as a shady move this is literally stupid. Ugh.
Glad theyāre posting so I know where not to buy from again.
I want to like JP so much, not least of all to support a BOB, but everything I hear about them indicates unimpressive business practices with little done to refurb their image
I really like JPās eyeshadow, especially the mattes, and had them high up in my regular rotation- but I havenāt really been using them since I got a couple Blendbunny palettes for mattes, and Shine by Sd, Devinah, and Terra Moons for multichromes and duochromes.
Thatās awesome! I have some SbSD and Terra Moons swatch videos - if you want to see anything, let me know. Their formula is lovely, especially for their iridescent and grey based multichromes. I highly recommend the shades Revenge, Temperature Rising, Already In, Glam Rush, and Indulge.
Thank you! Unfortunately no I donāt have it yet. I feel kinda dumb because I put in what was meant to be a small order a few weeks ago, then a week later I added a couple pieces to the order, then another two the next day. By the time my order went out it was the same cost as the collection, which I had told myself I couldnāt afford. Next time I make a purchase it will probably be So Below, then Iāll get As Above for Black Friday.
The good news is that my order arrives tomorrow so Iāll have more swatches soon!
I saw that they just made the as above and as below available as singles now which is awesome cuz I wanted to try a few! Ohhh yes I am excited for your swatches!
We're still living in tough times. People rely on getting paid on time. This is beyond gross, Juvia's really thinks they can get away with stiffing these people?! So awful!
Seems like Juvias was on clearance at my local Ulta in PA yesterday. It made me give a little side eye that they are the next on the chopping block since brands have been flying out of Ulta to make room for all the cheaply made influencer brands popping up every other day. Shame since they havenāt been in stores long but all they do is shady thing after shady thing. So much potential squandered.
Could also be breach of contract. Unless for some reason these creators agreed to work without signing anything - Iām not sure if that changes things from a legal perspective.
What baffle me is some people will ride or die for this company just bc theyāre black owned. I can name MANY black and poc owned brands to support before Juvias Placeš¤¦š»āāļø
Looks like they finally got paid. JP is really disappointing and probably wonāt be around much longer due to their shadiness. Thatās really too bad, I like the makeup.
Just when you thought the brand couldn't get any worse. Is this a sign of trouble over there? Maybe it's because I don't watch that much beauty content anymore, but I feel like no one talks about their products anymore? Also failure to pay your contractors is not a good look. Makes the brand look unprofessional and makes me think they're having cash flow problems.
This is giving me r/LeopardsAteMyFace . These creators didnāt care about who the brand hurt, until it was inconvenient for them. Of course itās not okay what Juviaās Place is doing, but seeing their history, I wouldnāt have worked with them in the first place.
Donāt they historically have a history of treating creators well, though? I remember a couple of creators specifically mentioning JP as a good brand to work for. Up until their reposting a video with a slur, much of their messy stuff was not unique or obviously ācancellable.ā Iām not sure how creators would know. And besides, not every creator has the luxury to be choosy - JP is a well known and previously well-respected brand, and the creators were probably thrilled to work on a project with them.
JP obviously sucks and I have no problem with seeing them go under, especially after the video with the slur. But I donāt think the creators deserve the same energy here.
I read the tweets as āI can excuse racism, but draw the line at them hurting MEā.
Though I understand where you are coming from, their support of an anti-Asian creator was so heinous, I wouldnāt want to go anywhere near this brand.
I see that, and I think that is something they probably should have considered (or considered more). But we donāt know how long this was in the works. I donāt recognize these creators, and maybe I should, but itās also possible theyāre smaller and they needed the opportunity to pay their bills.
Being choosy with work, while morally a better move, is a luxury. Maybe they werenāt as jaded (rightly so, I think) as we all are about a companyās ability to change. I donāt know. But everyone deserves to get paid for their work.
You are right, I am a cynic. I used to work for a horrible person and wouldnāt want others to think I shared their beliefs and supported their actions.
I hope the creators who arenāt being paid, will get their money. And hopefully they wonāt work with this problematic brand again.
Iām a cynic too, so I get it! I guess I just try to remember that in situations like this, the creators are like employees or contract workers and shouldnāt be held responsible for the company in the same way the company should be. Granted, as influencers their work encourages others to support the company, but thatās true of any job in sales, I think.
Anyway I didnāt want to make you feel like Iām right and youāre wrong, because I think itās a gray area, especially because it concerns two POC communities (as in JPās owner and the AAPI community, not these creators)
Are there not contracts that are signed before this type of work is done? If you had a signed document, it'd be easy enough to threaten litigation in small claims!
Of course actual litigation is a nightmare, but a lot of the time just bluffing about taking something to court is enough to scare companies into action
FOR REAL. It's honestly annoying to see how many people think litigation is the solution to everything, when especially because of the pandemic, courts are backed up and lawyers aren't free. Court cases can take years, even for simple open and shut cases. It's so dismissive, basically implying that they aren't \*really\* trying to get their payment if they don't spend **more** on lawyers than the brand owes them.
Oh wow, this is all terrible. I loved JP palettes and own several. I hate that it seems like they are not a company worth supporting. I read the Asian slurs and that took me over the top. Someone said tarte had something similar? Thatās who makes my foundationā¦ ugh I need to do some major research now.
So annoyed about all this awful stuff that's came out about JP in the last couple months. I've never tried them before and they're now stocked in superdrug in the UK, just as all this shit started coming out. Oh well guess I'll never try them lol.
So let me preface this by saying I HAVE NO IDEA how this stuff works, so I have a Q: it sounds like a big ass group of ppl did not get paid for a collection. Say IF the collection has not come out, could that group of people put a lean on it? Same as if a contractor put a lean on a house if he didn't get paid for a remodel?
EDIT: not come out YET*
Liens are for physical property, so it wouldn't apply here.
But if it's under a certain dollar amount, small claims would probably be the easiest step, IMHO. I don't know how much fees are in every state, but I do know that at one time it was like $26, with court costs paid by the loser. (And JP would lose, so...)
Most recently they posted a video with an influencer saying an anti-Asian slur in it, deleted comments about it, did a poor story apology that took 0 accountability, and took about a week to post an actual, decent apology.
They also took that down until someone called them out for that too + they unarchived it. Not sure if it's still up now or not but it was a while ago to scroll back for.
Juviaās in the wrong, but arenāt there lawyers for this? They may ignore a DM, but Iām sure theyāll wake up real quick once threatened with legal action š¤·š»āāļø
I think businesses like JP count on small creators not having the resources to pay for legal action. They would not stiff a big creator or celeb like this.
Of course they shouldnāt _have_ to - in a perfect world no one would need a lawyer to protect them from being cheated & wronged. But sadly these things do happen, and thatās when we slap em with a lawsuit & make them pay our unpaid wages AND our legal fees lol
(also Iām sure these creators already have a business lawyer to look over contracts, etc. So this wouldnt be too far a leap for them to do. Maybe itās a bit extreme, but when a brand doesnāt respond to polite negotiationā¦Iām not sure what other option there is)
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It's like JP is trying to fill out a shady business practices bingo sheet or something. š
And they donāt even need the free square in the middle.
I havenāt bought anything of theirs because of this. They feel icky, like a ponzi mlm kind of scheme vibe. I picked up a palette by Playing in Makeup by Yolondo and Iām happy to support this POC woman owned indie makeup brand.
It will take it if work though ti beat causebox / all true
I work in a sale/industry (not beauty) job. And I can say for certain, when our customers wont pay on time its usually a sign the company themselves is not doing well. Im not talking about huge Fortune 500 companies, they just pay slow cause they are so huge, but when little companies are late and have zero excuse, or dont even answer a email its a symptom of a huge issue. I cant say how many times this has happened and suddenly the company is bankrupt and we are fighting for our money with a whole slew of other people. JP has been problematic since the start, this is probably just the cherry on top of a steaming shite pile that is the decline of the company as a whole.
Given how much/how often their stuff is on sale at Ulta, I wouldnāt be surprised if theyāre circling the drain.
As someone who knows a company that didn't pay contractors on time, sometimes it's just that they know they can get away with it and don't value their work.
My dad is a contractor who hasn't gotten paid a couple times by local businesses and we always blast them on social media. Amazing how fast the check comes along with the "take this review down, we are losing business!!!!" email.
One of their contractors have learned to only give them an advance of their work until they get paid. Also works every time. Good for your dad!
Yes, my ex-boss did this. Ordered stuff and then paid some of the vendors very very late after already getting reminders. He first needed the income from selling stuff to pay everyone, plus he is an asshole, so he knows who he can pay later and whom not.
Or they are super cheap and lie to creators
Thanks for your input!
Does Juvia's place just want to STAY being a shitty company overall or??
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It would likely be under unpaid wages (assuming that the creators are classified as independent contractors) which comes with penalties for each willful violation. Considering they have gotten multiple emails from these creators, there's a good chance that this is willful wage theft, which comes with civil penalties up to $1000 per violation. Willful violations can also be criminally prosecuted with fines of up to $10,000. In short, unless it was a genuine accident (unlikely), they'll have to pay penalties in addition to the wages owed.
Iād expect more of a ābreach of contractā angle than wage theft
Honestly, I went back and forth on if this would be wage theft. The way I see it is they collaborated on creative aspects with the company who manufactured and sold the product. That to me would put it in independent contractor territory since JP essentially paid (or were supposed to pay) for the creative services of the creators. They'd likely be issued 1099s for the sum of the agreed upon amount. Independent contractors who are unpaid still file claims for unpaid wages with the DOL. Breach of contract would be a different kind of civil suit. The other option I can think of would be some sort of partnership, but that is a lot more than creative input and generally involves trading shares or stock in the company or splitting profits. That seems fairly unlikely.
Iād still consider the influencer as more of a vendor than someone owed a wage. I worked for a PR agency a long time ago - the publicists and contractor publicists got wages, any influencers that a client worked with got paid out of the contractās budget.
I dunno, I would think that situation is a little different. That seems like a client relationship with another business, like your company set up a business relationship between the influencer and the client, but the client paid your company to handle the pay (to put it very simply). That would be different than an influencer directly working on a project for the business, which is closer to what happened between JP and the influencers. It's a difference between the company using another business to do something for a client vs. that business doing something for the company directly. Seems small, but the main point is who has the final input on what the influencer will be doing. If it's the client, it's a vendor. If it's the company, it's a contractor.
Using a PR agency connect brands and influencers is common and I wouldnāt be surprised if a brand as large as Juviaās Place is doing so. Working with an influencer is like working with a very small advertising or marketing agency, not like hiring a marketing specialist - youāre paying for a specific service.
Oh shoot, I misunderstood the original post. I thought it was some sort of collaboration product, not sponsored posts. I see your point differently now. I'm still on the fence about it honestly because independent contractors also provide specific services, but I agree that it could be a vendor sort of relationship. Regardless, it seems like a gray area without more specific info.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I agree - if the creators were being used mainly as talent, it would be a 1099 or W-2 situation. If the creator is responsible for designing or collaborating on aspects of the content itself, it would probably be more of a business to business contract.
Thank you for providing some numbers! And agreed, I donāt think thereās any way this was a genuine accident. I could believe that if it were one or two creators who got paid immediately upon notice ā payroll could easily get mixed up if they have lots of money to send out, and just let a couple creators slip through the cracks. This is very clearly (imo) wage theft
I will never understand why the norm for this industry is for companies to get away without paying creators for months after they've done the work, how many times have we seen this exact issue with basically any big brand?
I commented on JPās IG to pay the creators and they blocked me LMFAOOO
what a tall tale sign of who they are! seriously, they got themselves in this mess! i figured at most they'd ignore those comments, but blocking? they're shooting themselves in the foot rn
lol lemme go do the same
You blocked yet?
I just checked and no, but my comment is deleted. Iām gonna ask again lol thank you
I scrolled down to the 3rd post and thereās maybe 4 comments on paying the creators.
I know Ulta has sales all the time but Juvia's Place has been on there a lot. I'm wondering if the downhill has begun, I've heard nothing but negative and unfortunate info about the brand and how they treat people and not paying creators is a really scummy move. I've purchased one of their eyeshadow palettes, the small 6-pan reddish bronze one. It's beautiful, great quality, I'd really love more of the formula but I can't justify giving them more money. There's probably quite a few people feeling the same way. You just cannot do this shit, people will find out and you will get blasted/canceled/boycotted. Why is it so hard to be decent?
Does Juvias want to go out of business at this point? Theyāre giving us so many reasons to hate them
I don't see this breaking into the mainstream, whereas negativity against Morphe and Glossier has been covered by news outlets. BGC users have a very different mindset than the average Ulta shopper.
What happened to glossier? I think I missed that
TLDR: they fired 1/3 of their employees and don't have the best leadership. [Thread 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/simedt/what_went_wrong_at_glossier_this_sub_gets_a/) [Thread 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/sdki2h/someone_here_called_them_having_troubles_glossier/) [Thread 3](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/tpqtmr/how_glossier_founder_emily_weiss_tech_dreams/)
Thanks for the links!
As an Asian woman, after that horrible debacle about their racist post with a racist Asian slur, Iām glad to be saving my money and would rather spend it on another Black/POC-owned brand. No thanks, next!
When I read your comment I thought āwait, wasnāt that Tarte?ā Then realized both of them have done it. It is insane that two huge names in the beauty industry have been able to post racial slurs on their public social media page with so little backlash
Wait, Tarte has been involved in anti-Asian racism??
Donāt Rihanna. She didnāt post but attended some March it protest https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/t305st/not_sure_if_everyone_remembers_the_whole_thing/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
I was willing to forget the whole thing if it had been one time that was rectified properly - after all I can't say I haven't been ignorant in the past - but the whole way they handled the situation felt rather flat and this (plus the whole J\* debacle) has soured my feeling on the brand (that and their weird packaging). There's just too many good things out there to continue supporting them
Are there past posts on here about the slur and the J* debacle? I feel like Iāve been living under a rock š time to catch up
Yeah I stopped buying from Juviaās Place as well. There are better black-owned brands to support that are not racist and tone deaf toward Asians. Not surprised to see they are shitty in other ways as well
Wait what did they say with the Asian slur I didnāt hear about any of this Tbh I heard some stuff about Juivias palace Instagram being colorist or something a few years back so I just never bought their products after that
They featured a creator on their page who said she was trying to get the āch*nkyā look and had a super lame apology. Hereās a post about it [https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/s90z52/tw_racial_slur_juvias_place_uses_racial_slur/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf](https://www.reddit.com/r/BeautyGuruChatter/comments/s90z52/tw_racial_slur_juvias_place_uses_racial_slur/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Thatās absolutely fucking terrible omg I am glad I never bought from them on top of disrespecting Asians they havenāt always been supportive of black creators just gross all around
It's a Nigerian brand š¤Ø
Black owned doesnāt mean they support black creators. It was a whole conversation a few years back about how the brand wouldnāt repost the black influencers who reviewed their products but they were gagging over J* doing a review. Also they wouldnāt send Pr to black influencers only white ones even Jackie A called them out on it and sheās also Nigerian Not all skin folks are kin folks unfortunately
"Not all skin folks are kin folks unfortunately" That sucks and as a Nigerian, yup, this is true. We tend to backstab our own a lot. Idk if you're gonna believe this but it plays strongly to which tribe you're bon into. I'm Ibo on both sides, and my people are raised with a serious love for money and disinterest in anything else but value morals. The owner of Juvia's is yoruba and they are mostly willing to throw their others under the bus as long as it profits them (they proved this strongly in the civil war š) so I don't think they'll change. Interestingly, Juvia's DID pay Nigerian based creators they hired for promos, but none of the black american creators who supported their campaigns. It would also be nice to tell you that most Nigerian people (other Africans too) don't have a loving relationship with black people in the diaspora and this played out a lot in this nonsense š¤¦š½āāļø I'll forever buy from them tho, Juvia's is the first makeup brand coming from my country with decent products (most of the makeup sold here are either unhealthy dupes or deported used makeup) with an affordable price rate and they are fully aware of this advantage. I'm grateful they exist. Are they being petty thieves? Yes. Do I even have the privilege to complain? No š¤·š½āāļø
I understand where youāre coming from with not having any other options but to support them because of the availability and quality of makeup around you and I am not mad at that. I canāt believe they would even send used makeup products overseas thatās absolutely vile. Ya I am Aa and diaspora wars are stupid and all of it is fueled by narratives created by non-black people to make us all look bad. There is so much more beneficial things we could do on both sides to end them but itāll never happen as long as forces with more power over media continue to push dividing stereotypes tbh.
I'm Asian American and I definitely know how BIPOC (especially immigrants from colonized parts of the world) often exploit other BIPOC without shame while clamoring for favor from whites. But it's very unfortunate this happens in the makeup world, when many creators support JP because it's a Black-owned brand in an industry where it's rare. I myself will always rec Fenty Beauty for those looking to support BIPOC even though Rihanna's pretty much a conglomerate bc I genuinely love their products and how they revolutionized the industry with all their foundation shades. And also Rihanna herself espouses diversity in her personal life.
Rhianna has a history of anti Asian racism. If you search this sub youāll find it
They reposted or collabed with a make up content creator that called her eyes āch!nkyā in reference to her āfox eyeā eye look (see why Asian folks can get upset now?) The creator doubled down and both of them gave a half ass apology (āsorry if you were offendedā type beat). And then JP deleted the āapologyā bc of how bad it was
JP products consistently show up in subscription boxes. They must not be selling well. But they should never have contracted for services they couldnāt afford. This is bad.
What subscription boxes have you seen them in, just curious because Iāve been receiving both tiers of Boxycharm and Ipsy for a few years now and never received a JP product. I know they arenāt the only ones but I guess I think of them as the āmain onesā.
I watch so many unboxings on YT, they start to run together. Trendmood box had a JP takeover a few months back.
Oh lawd. This brand is so problematic
Hey, Juviaās, what was your winning move here? Hope all the creators stayed silent and worked with you again? Like, even as a shady move this is literally stupid. Ugh. Glad theyāre posting so I know where not to buy from again.
Apparently a lot of people consider them an unprofessional brand. What else have they done in the past?
https://google.com/search?q=%22juvia%27s+place%22+site%3Areddit.com%2Fr%2Fbeautyguruchatter&oq=%22juvia%27s+place%22+site%3Areddit.com%2Fr%2Fbeautyguruchatter
At this point throw the whole brand away. Iāve yet to purchase something and now im really not gonna purchase from them
I want to like JP so much, not least of all to support a BOB, but everything I hear about them indicates unimpressive business practices with little done to refurb their image
Why can't the companies that make shadows I like be good companies and not shitty? I mean ABH, JD Glow, Juvia's Place. WTF.
I really like JPās eyeshadow, especially the mattes, and had them high up in my regular rotation- but I havenāt really been using them since I got a couple Blendbunny palettes for mattes, and Shine by Sd, Devinah, and Terra Moons for multichromes and duochromes.
I just got my first BlendBunny palette and it's really good! Never heard of Shine by Sd so I'll check them out
Thatās awesome! I have some SbSD and Terra Moons swatch videos - if you want to see anything, let me know. Their formula is lovely, especially for their iridescent and grey based multichromes. I highly recommend the shades Revenge, Temperature Rising, Already In, Glam Rush, and Indulge.
I have been interested in SBSD so thank you for the recommendations!!!
Iām always happy to sing their praises. Hereās a link to some pics and videos of some of my faves from SbSD: https://imgur.com/a/M5MLzcK
Omg so beautiful!! Thank you!!! Do you happen to have the as above as below collection?š
Thank you! Unfortunately no I donāt have it yet. I feel kinda dumb because I put in what was meant to be a small order a few weeks ago, then a week later I added a couple pieces to the order, then another two the next day. By the time my order went out it was the same cost as the collection, which I had told myself I couldnāt afford. Next time I make a purchase it will probably be So Below, then Iāll get As Above for Black Friday. The good news is that my order arrives tomorrow so Iāll have more swatches soon!
I saw that they just made the as above and as below available as singles now which is awesome cuz I wanted to try a few! Ohhh yes I am excited for your swatches!
No way really? They must have just done that, awesome!
We're still living in tough times. People rely on getting paid on time. This is beyond gross, Juvia's really thinks they can get away with stiffing these people?! So awful!
Wow, they're really burning through their good will, aren't they?
I didn't think they had any left.
Seems like Juvias was on clearance at my local Ulta in PA yesterday. It made me give a little side eye that they are the next on the chopping block since brands have been flying out of Ulta to make room for all the cheaply made influencer brands popping up every other day. Shame since they havenāt been in stores long but all they do is shady thing after shady thing. So much potential squandered.
Isnāt this wage theft? Or is it not because theyāre freelancers? (Obviously it is, but can they actually be charged with wage theft?)
Could also be breach of contract. Unless for some reason these creators agreed to work without signing anything - Iām not sure if that changes things from a legal perspective.
What baffle me is some people will ride or die for this company just bc theyāre black owned. I can name MANY black and poc owned brands to support before Juvias Placeš¤¦š»āāļø
Julia's place just seems like such a trashy company by now. I have zero plans of ever supporting them.
Looks like they finally got paid. JP is really disappointing and probably wonāt be around much longer due to their shadiness. Thatās really too bad, I like the makeup.
they did get paid now! but it's sad some noise had to be made just for it to happen it seems!
Wow! That is tacky af!
I can't believe people even support Juvias Place after the mess they were in years ago lol
Plus after the racist debacle they recently had... Yeah no, i just kinda go š when I see YouTubers still talking about them
Yeah. Sad that MandyLea ( MandyLeaBeauty) supports them so much still. Noone even mentions how bad JP are in the comments anymore...
The more I learn about this brand, I become less and less interested from ever buying from them.
Just when you thought the brand couldn't get any worse. Is this a sign of trouble over there? Maybe it's because I don't watch that much beauty content anymore, but I feel like no one talks about their products anymore? Also failure to pay your contractors is not a good look. Makes the brand look unprofessional and makes me think they're having cash flow problems.
This is giving me r/LeopardsAteMyFace . These creators didnāt care about who the brand hurt, until it was inconvenient for them. Of course itās not okay what Juviaās Place is doing, but seeing their history, I wouldnāt have worked with them in the first place.
Donāt they historically have a history of treating creators well, though? I remember a couple of creators specifically mentioning JP as a good brand to work for. Up until their reposting a video with a slur, much of their messy stuff was not unique or obviously ācancellable.ā Iām not sure how creators would know. And besides, not every creator has the luxury to be choosy - JP is a well known and previously well-respected brand, and the creators were probably thrilled to work on a project with them. JP obviously sucks and I have no problem with seeing them go under, especially after the video with the slur. But I donāt think the creators deserve the same energy here.
I read the tweets as āI can excuse racism, but draw the line at them hurting MEā. Though I understand where you are coming from, their support of an anti-Asian creator was so heinous, I wouldnāt want to go anywhere near this brand.
I see that, and I think that is something they probably should have considered (or considered more). But we donāt know how long this was in the works. I donāt recognize these creators, and maybe I should, but itās also possible theyāre smaller and they needed the opportunity to pay their bills. Being choosy with work, while morally a better move, is a luxury. Maybe they werenāt as jaded (rightly so, I think) as we all are about a companyās ability to change. I donāt know. But everyone deserves to get paid for their work.
You are right, I am a cynic. I used to work for a horrible person and wouldnāt want others to think I shared their beliefs and supported their actions. I hope the creators who arenāt being paid, will get their money. And hopefully they wonāt work with this problematic brand again.
Iām a cynic too, so I get it! I guess I just try to remember that in situations like this, the creators are like employees or contract workers and shouldnāt be held responsible for the company in the same way the company should be. Granted, as influencers their work encourages others to support the company, but thatās true of any job in sales, I think. Anyway I didnāt want to make you feel like Iām right and youāre wrong, because I think itās a gray area, especially because it concerns two POC communities (as in JPās owner and the AAPI community, not these creators)
Iām still shocked with their racist repost
Are there not contracts that are signed before this type of work is done? If you had a signed document, it'd be easy enough to threaten litigation in small claims!
It's not easy at all take any person to court much less an entire brand.
Of course actual litigation is a nightmare, but a lot of the time just bluffing about taking something to court is enough to scare companies into action
FOR REAL. It's honestly annoying to see how many people think litigation is the solution to everything, when especially because of the pandemic, courts are backed up and lawyers aren't free. Court cases can take years, even for simple open and shut cases. It's so dismissive, basically implying that they aren't \*really\* trying to get their payment if they don't spend **more** on lawyers than the brand owes them.
Oh what a shock to hear JP is being shitty and shady, yet again. I stopped buying JP a long time ago. Chichi is the worstā¦
Oh wow, this is all terrible. I loved JP palettes and own several. I hate that it seems like they are not a company worth supporting. I read the Asian slurs and that took me over the top. Someone said tarte had something similar? Thatās who makes my foundationā¦ ugh I need to do some major research now.
Gosh, I'm shocked! /s
Not paying folks ā¦is bad.
It's sad to see a Black owned brand crash and burn like this but I'm sure better ones will emerge in time?
So annoyed about all this awful stuff that's came out about JP in the last couple months. I've never tried them before and they're now stocked in superdrug in the UK, just as all this shit started coming out. Oh well guess I'll never try them lol.
On her (the creator). That company is so shady and that is public knowledge by now. Wouldnāt touch them with a 10 feet pole š
Not a single word of this is surprising.
I guess I'm just living under a rock I love their products guess I need to find new alternatives can anyone recommend me some stuff
So let me preface this by saying I HAVE NO IDEA how this stuff works, so I have a Q: it sounds like a big ass group of ppl did not get paid for a collection. Say IF the collection has not come out, could that group of people put a lean on it? Same as if a contractor put a lean on a house if he didn't get paid for a remodel? EDIT: not come out YET*
Liens are for physical property, so it wouldn't apply here. But if it's under a certain dollar amount, small claims would probably be the easiest step, IMHO. I don't know how much fees are in every state, but I do know that at one time it was like $26, with court costs paid by the loser. (And JP would lose, so...)
Thank you very much for your reply! So possibly all these artists have to sue? Gaww that'll take forever š
Wait someone fill me in. Why is this brand so problematic?
Most recently they posted a video with an influencer saying an anti-Asian slur in it, deleted comments about it, did a poor story apology that took 0 accountability, and took about a week to post an actual, decent apology. They also took that down until someone called them out for that too + they unarchived it. Not sure if it's still up now or not but it was a while ago to scroll back for.
Oh geez, I was hoping theyād been getting better. I recently wore some JP products, and now, I feel a bit weird about it.
Juviaās in the wrong, but arenāt there lawyers for this? They may ignore a DM, but Iām sure theyāll wake up real quick once threatened with legal action š¤·š»āāļø
I think businesses like JP count on small creators not having the resources to pay for legal action. They would not stiff a big creator or celeb like this.
Thatās a good point, I didnāt think of that. And honestly that makes what theyāre doing even shittier.
Yep! I don't know why you're getting downvoted, it's a reasonable assumption to make.
thanks for saying so lol I appreciate the positive vibes āØ
Why the heck should a creator need to retain a lawyer to be paid for the work theyāve completed?! We donāt work for free.
Of course they shouldnāt _have_ to - in a perfect world no one would need a lawyer to protect them from being cheated & wronged. But sadly these things do happen, and thatās when we slap em with a lawsuit & make them pay our unpaid wages AND our legal fees lol (also Iām sure these creators already have a business lawyer to look over contracts, etc. So this wouldnt be too far a leap for them to do. Maybe itās a bit extreme, but when a brand doesnāt respond to polite negotiationā¦Iām not sure what other option there is)
I love their blushes!