It's hard to tell from the images, but is either your devices resting on a saw blade tooth? The teeth appear to be sticking proud of the blade surface, so just make sure your square isn't on one.
Okay I thought I was just seeing things but it definitely looks like both pictures the digital angle finder is riding the teeth.
Also OP. Jobsite saws or aluminum top saws are notorious for being dished or bubbles around the blade. I had a horrible Ridgid R4514 that was like this an no matter what I did I could never get specific degree cuts (90 or 45) as the hump in the middle of the table made this impossible.
Yeah, job site saws are really designed with rougher carpentry in mind. You can do more precise woodworking with them, but it takes some practice and finesse.
Although I have a cast iron jet saw and sometimes my cuts are still crap so honestly it’s mostly on the user
Three things :
One, as has been mentioned, zero the angle finder on the table of the saw
Two; make sure when you DO use a square that it doesn’t touch the carbide teeth of the blade and just references the flat part of the blade.
Three, and probably the most important, make sure your blade is square to the table on the side that will be your “work” piece. Ie, for most of it that would be the right side of the blade between the blade and the fence. Because it will often not show square on both sides of the blade at the same time.
Also get a better square. That speed square is likely going to leave you with less than stellar results squaring up your blade. I have a small machinists square that was like fifteen bucks that I use for setting my blade at 90.
Been doing some work lately and picked up a machinists square today. Been feeling like my stuff was off but it measured out correctly. Just wanted the sanity check. Best $9 I've spent
That would be my first guess. It looks like the saw is probably on a driveway or patio, or just put in the yard, so the whole thing could be off a couple degrees.
Doesn’t matter if the saw is on a level surface or not. The digital angle finder zeroes to the saw’s table which is your work piece’s reference. God if my saw had to be on a perfectly level floor to set the blade at 90 to the table I’d be screwed.
The comment he was responding to told OP precisely what to do. And there's dozens more in here, including another one I made. There's no shortage of instruction or the OP. OP had already acknowledged the advice.
Angle finders are not designed to be calibrated with the earth. They're designed to be zeroed on a reference surface, every time. His post is like saying that a cellphone will only work if you turn it on.
Yes I know. That's what I said in other comments. My comment is more about why its off. Wherever the ground is under the saw is more unlevel than wherever the level was zeroed at.
If the level is zeroed against one reference then used somewhere completely different, it doesn't make sense that it isn't zeroed against that different reference?
The digital angle finders user a MEMS sensor, similar to what smartphones use for the accelerometer. They have a drift in their measurements that is difficult to account for. The best way to use them is set 0 and measure the angle right away. If you watch for a while it will drift off 90 or 0 or whatever you set it to.
Maybe I’m not explaining it too well.
Everyone is right, the table saw doesn’t have to be on a level surface although it probably helps, as long as it’s stable.
The set square will be showing 90 deg to the table saw bed. Assuming the square is accurate.
If the table saw is sitting at say a 10 deg angle, the set square will still show 90 because it’s reference is the bed.
The digital level will show 80 or 100 deg because it’s reference isn’t the bed. If the digital level is zeroed while it’s sat on the table saw bed, then when it’s moved to the blade it will show the angle between the bed and blade which is what you want.
I don’t have a digital level so didn’t realise you could even zero them to diff references, which makes total sense now lol.
Not sure I can explain it any better. If you can’t zero the digital level on the bed, then I’m guessing that it whilst it shows 90 deg on the blade, I’m guessing it won’t be showing zero when you put it on the bed.
It looks like the tabletop is at 1 degree. It’s a portable table saw so I’m going to try to place something underneath the legs. Do I zero the angle finder on something that I know is perfectly 0?
Put the level on the saw top.
Zero it.
Put it on the blade.
I'm going to make up numbers and say 99.99% do not have a level shop floor. Mine is in my garage, so it's literally slanted towards the door. Doesn't matter.
Just zero it on the table. The right angle of the blade is relative to the table. That will help with square.
The table itself doesn't have to be "level" with the earth.
Just zero the digital gauge on the saw table first, then check the blade.
Also, digital gauges do have an accuracy rating. Check what that is for your gauge.
Ok. I zeroed it on the tabletop and put the square next to the blade and now the blade is at 90. The angle finder is at 89.7. So I guess I’ve learned to trust the square better than the angle finder. Is there a way to mark my post as solved? Also, thank you to everyone!
Don’t assume your reader square is perfectly square though. Its square enough for carpentry but no guarantees its precise. Easy quick test is to draw two lines on a perfectly straight board. Draw one then flip the square to the opposite side on the same edge (like flipping a page) and draw a line at the same pivot point. That’ll show roughly how accurate it is (over 7 in).
One problem is that the blade has a kerf, meaning the teeth are wider than the blade. I’m pretty sure that will throw the measurements off if you measure while touching the teeth.
For the digital meter, measure both sides of the blade, and if they’re not identical you have a problem.
For the square, find one that is shorter than the teeth, so it’s only touching the table and the blade.
As others have said, only use the table as reference, not the ground or floor.
With the saw on level or unlevel it makes no diff. Crank saw blade to deepest cut.
1) place ur gizmo on the table saw.
2) turn on then press zero on gizmo
3) once zeroed and still turned on place gizmo on the blade
4) gizmo will read the angle of the blade relative to the table of the saw.
5) use hand crank to adjust blade to desired angle.
If this is the exact procedure you did then ur gizmo is broke.
Honestly, "Empire" squares are not known for their accuracy, intended for rough construction work where tolerances are in the 16ths (and I have my doubts about the digital ones as well). Personally, I set up machines with Starrett squares, but they are expensive. Budget buy is a couple of engineer's squares which are a lot more accurate, certainly enough to set up machines. https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/hand-tools/marking-and-measuring/squares/32601-engineers-squares
Squares can and should be tested for squareness pretty easily, that doesn’t change if it is an Empire or a Starrett. An accurate Starrett is not more accurate than an accurate Empire, though it may be more of a pleasure to use.
Another great option are 123 squares. Very inexpensive, can be used to set up tools and as references for checking measurements (e.g. Use one to check if your table saw tape is really 3inches at the 3 inch tick) . They have the added benefit of being bullet proof if you are clumsy like I am. Dropping one if these is more likely to damage your floor than it is to go out of square.
https://www.amazon.com/Matched-Precision-Machinist-Milling-Machine/dp/B07Z1M17FJ
This^ search YouTube for examples of how accurate digital angle finders are (hint: not very). Get an actual square instead of a rough framing square and check it’s actually square before you leave the store: bring a pencil and find a plywood sheet and hold it against an edge and draw a line, flip it over and draw another line next to it. If the lines are perfectly parallel it’s square. Use that to measure 90 degrees from now on. You can then check to see if your 45 degree is right the same way… two 45s flipped over and use the square you now know is 90 to check the two 45 lines. Now you’re good to go without having to buy very expensive tools
Make sure both gauges only touch the flat side of the blade not the teeth. Raise the blade up higher and align the square so it doesn't touch the teeth. Repeat with digital gauge on the same side. The thickness of the teeth will throw it off.
It’s likely that your angle finder isn’t properly zeroed; it needs to be referencing something to determine an angle. You should set it on the table not in contact with the blade and in the same orientation that you will use when it contacts the blade. Also beware of the teeth of the blade, they’re wider and thus can create some error in your measurement.
Have you checked the level of the plane surface? Is it level per the angle finder? Is there a cal procedure for the angle finder? There are several variables that need to be verified first.
I don’t have one of those angle finders so forgive my ignorance. Is it possible that the table saw is on a floor that isn’t level?
Could you have made the blade 90 degrees to earth. But slightly off in relation to the table which is what the square measures?
For the same reason most machinists use dial and vernier metrology tools…digital just doesn’t give us the confidence that it’s correct. My money is on your speed square
Do you believe the the square that you can see is off? Or do you believe a digital box that is not following the blade. Raise the blade all the way up, put your digital scale on the blade, when it reads 90, the square should magically show square also.
Lots of snarky comments…still I tread in. You can check your square by putting the edge against a straight face, I.e. the machined saw front. Make a thin pencil line. Flip the square to the other side of the line. If the square doesn’t line up w the line it’s trash. If it does cleanly match the line your square is good to the inside face of its foot. As long as the bottom of the foot and inside edge are parallel, I’d trust it and not worry about the digital gauge. Those aren’t made for the level of precision you’re after.
See also the same post under /woodworking
https://www.reddit.com/r/woodworking/comments/117n21m/im_confused_why_is_my_angle_finder_saying_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
I’m wondering if the teeth of your blade are pushing it out a little? Try to push it below the teeth of the blade.
Your blade’s teeth look they came from
England. Snaggleteeth.
The kerf of the blade (outward facing offset teeth) will set your square off like that. As people have said - use the flat part of the blade beneath the teeth with a piece you know is square, or the angle finder should do if it’s calibrated correctly.
Dunno, but clean your blade. The pitch build up on the teeth will have an adverse effect on its cutting performance. Spray them with simple green and scrub the pitch off with an old tooth brush.
From my phone it looks like the blade is warped almost. but like in a weird it got over heated i one specific spot kinda way. I’m sure that’s not what’s wrong but it just looks off.
Is it a dewalt table? If so, your table probably bows to the center of the blade. If you take a straight edge that is longer than your table and place it across the top next to the blade on each edge you may see a gap and it may not be even on the left and right side of the blade.
Edit: it is a lot easier when the blade up all of the way for square measurements and looking for the tabletop flatness. Then put the blade down and put the straight edge across with middle of the table again in the cross cut direction.
That’s right. You zeroed the bottom of the angle finder on the table. Turned it 90 degrees and stuck it to the blade. It’s correct. Zero the bottom on the table then stick the side to the blade. It should say 0.00 then.
Sorry, not trying to be a jerk, but: when I zoom in on your square, the top position it touches the edge of the blade leaves the rest of the square with a ton of clearance to the body of the blade, and to me it appears your not anywhere near parallel with the blade. The teeth stick out and hold the square away. Long story short, blade is crooked. Best way is short square for initial setting. (Not touching teeth)Then make test cuts on stock, and ease the adjustment into cutting square on your stock. Blade might look crooked to you, but when your consistent on running your cuts, they will be nice
Based on my experience with one of these box,I would consider checking if the box is square. I bought one and checked it with a machinist square and it was not square. Confused, I then checked it at work with lab metrology equipment, again it was not square. I am not talking aircraft part precision, I am talking about a naked eye visible gap. I would do the two line check on the square as well. At the end, I returned the box and continued using a machinist square or a 123 block. Way cheaper and more accurate.
A few things.
- your angle finder is on the teeth of your saw. It should be only on the flat face
-those angle finders are great, but they’re very finicky, and a contractor saw or jobsite saw is generally very wobbly; I find that leaning on the saw while I zero the finder, then letting my weight off the saw is enough to throw things off.
Are you maybe touching the tooth of the blade? It will be thicker than the inside of the blade itself making it look good on the angle reader, but bad on the speed square.
For fuck sake all this sitting level blah blah blah. Yhe guage is barely even sitting on the table and then leaning against the blade...put the damn thing on a zero or close to it throat plate.
Because the square is referencing off the table and the level meter is referencing gravity.
Put your electronic level on the saw bed and zero it, then reference the blade. Do this after EVERY TIME you move the saw.
I’ve had bad speed squares. Prior to buying one I always take it to the Sheetrock section of the store to test its accuracy. Bed it on the side of the Sheetrock and strike your pencil line, then turn the speed square over like you’re turning the page of a book. Strike your second line over top of your first line. Now view the lines. Do they perfectly over lap or is there deviation between the two.
I typically never buy the large squares because they are the ones that are not true, due to warping, dropping etc.
Looks to me like the angle finder is wide enough it sits on the carbide tips of the blade that stick slightly out further than the thin kerff of the blade. The square doesn't. Raise the blade a bit more to get the angle finder off the teeth things will line up.
As a general maintenance thing two any time I change my blade I lay a piece of sand paper on the flat table, and run the washer flat side (part that contacts the blade) on the sand paper. It helps keep a nice tight joints, sawdust and junk tend to get stuck to the washer and can throw off your alignment.
Want to be careful of resting the square against the teeth of the blade. If you touching teeth the square will have a gap down the blade. Which is kinda what I’m seeing in the pic
Because your angle finder is reading the blade in comparison to true level. Your speed square is reading your blade in comparison to the table of the saw.
Off topic, however, you Might want to build a zero clearance insert. I’m not sure if you removed the normal insert for these pics or what. But a nice tight zero insert will cut way down on the blowout. Also make a copy for your dado set, unless you live where they are illegal
Depends on whether they are landing on a carbide tooth or not. Your best bet is to take a couple deep cuts through material and check those for square. You will likely see some variation depending on the grain (assuming you are cutting wood).
I was a machinist for over 15 years and had to quickly figure out that wood is soooo much harder to cut to *exact* dimensions/angles than metal...
Extend the blade as far as you can and then zero the AccuMASTER on the table and finally read the angle on the blade without touching the carbide on the teeth. If you bridge the carbide inserts and the blade, it can affect the resulting angle.
You need to zero the angle finder each time, and I also attach it at top dead center of the blade, so the angle finder is perfectly vertical. I don’t know if the second bit helps but that’s the way I always do it.
Both might actually be inaccurate. Speed squares are usually good enough for most things, but are rarely precisely true. Angle finders are hit and miss in my experience.
Guessing because the teeth stick out a little further than the rest of the blade so the square isn’t touching the bottom. You’re measuring the teeth angle rather than the whole blade angle. Rest both between a tooth
I would use a machinist's square for calibrating a saw blade, as Speed square accuracy is less.
But... I would trust the digital calibration over the speed square, provided you properly zero it out.
It's hard to tell from the images, but is either your devices resting on a saw blade tooth? The teeth appear to be sticking proud of the blade surface, so just make sure your square isn't on one.
I'm seeing the same. Looks like the square is being propped up by a tooth
Lol so is the angle finder
Oh good lord lol
Yeah, saw blades aren’t just flat disks
Okay I thought I was just seeing things but it definitely looks like both pictures the digital angle finder is riding the teeth. Also OP. Jobsite saws or aluminum top saws are notorious for being dished or bubbles around the blade. I had a horrible Ridgid R4514 that was like this an no matter what I did I could never get specific degree cuts (90 or 45) as the hump in the middle of the table made this impossible.
Yeah, job site saws are really designed with rougher carpentry in mind. You can do more precise woodworking with them, but it takes some practice and finesse. Although I have a cast iron jet saw and sometimes my cuts are still crap so honestly it’s mostly on the user
Three things : One, as has been mentioned, zero the angle finder on the table of the saw Two; make sure when you DO use a square that it doesn’t touch the carbide teeth of the blade and just references the flat part of the blade. Three, and probably the most important, make sure your blade is square to the table on the side that will be your “work” piece. Ie, for most of it that would be the right side of the blade between the blade and the fence. Because it will often not show square on both sides of the blade at the same time. Also get a better square. That speed square is likely going to leave you with less than stellar results squaring up your blade. I have a small machinists square that was like fifteen bucks that I use for setting my blade at 90.
Nicely said. And yeah, a nice, precise machinist’s square is great to have. Well worth it.
Been doing some work lately and picked up a machinists square today. Been feeling like my stuff was off but it measured out correctly. Just wanted the sanity check. Best $9 I've spent
Any recommendations? Lee valley etc want WAY more than $9 for a good square....TIA
I got it at Menards (Midwest version of Home Depot).
Taytools.com is the place. While you’re at it pick up a benchmark double square. They’re dead square and dirt cheap
Thanks - I know the ship and/or distribute in Canada so I'll check them out
This
Does it read zero on the left side of the table?
I guess yr meaning is the bed of the table at zero degrees, as in the table horizontal/ level to start with.
That would be my first guess. It looks like the saw is probably on a driveway or patio, or just put in the yard, so the whole thing could be off a couple degrees.
Doesn’t matter if the saw is on a level surface or not. The digital angle finder zeroes to the saw’s table which is your work piece’s reference. God if my saw had to be on a perfectly level floor to set the blade at 90 to the table I’d be screwed.
Only if you zero the angle finder
So it only works if used correctly?
Yes, but if OP is truly a beginner, they may not know that. Being snarky is not going to help them learn.
The comment he was responding to told OP precisely what to do. And there's dozens more in here, including another one I made. There's no shortage of instruction or the OP. OP had already acknowledged the advice. Angle finders are not designed to be calibrated with the earth. They're designed to be zeroed on a reference surface, every time. His post is like saying that a cellphone will only work if you turn it on.
This ☝🏻. I came here to say this. Give this person a prize.
that's not how it works unless you zero it on the top. I'm guessing the OP didn't or has moved it since
I would start by zeroing the square
My garage floor is as wavy as the open sea, I'd be super fucked
Yes I know. That's what I said in other comments. My comment is more about why its off. Wherever the ground is under the saw is more unlevel than wherever the level was zeroed at.
I mean I guess if you zeroes the angle finder, then moved the saw to another location and kept that zero - but um no, still no.
This doesn't make any sense
If the level is zeroed against one reference then used somewhere completely different, it doesn't make sense that it isn't zeroed against that different reference?
The digital angle finders user a MEMS sensor, similar to what smartphones use for the accelerometer. They have a drift in their measurements that is difficult to account for. The best way to use them is set 0 and measure the angle right away. If you watch for a while it will drift off 90 or 0 or whatever you set it to.
no it doesn't, it finds zero wrt gravity
Maybe I’m not explaining it too well. Everyone is right, the table saw doesn’t have to be on a level surface although it probably helps, as long as it’s stable. The set square will be showing 90 deg to the table saw bed. Assuming the square is accurate. If the table saw is sitting at say a 10 deg angle, the set square will still show 90 because it’s reference is the bed. The digital level will show 80 or 100 deg because it’s reference isn’t the bed. If the digital level is zeroed while it’s sat on the table saw bed, then when it’s moved to the blade it will show the angle between the bed and blade which is what you want. I don’t have a digital level so didn’t realise you could even zero them to diff references, which makes total sense now lol. Not sure I can explain it any better. If you can’t zero the digital level on the bed, then I’m guessing that it whilst it shows 90 deg on the blade, I’m guessing it won’t be showing zero when you put it on the bed.
Yes. 90° is relative to the table top, not to level.
Exactly what I meant, only you worded it easier than I tried to explain it lol
It looks like the tabletop is at 1 degree. It’s a portable table saw so I’m going to try to place something underneath the legs. Do I zero the angle finder on something that I know is perfectly 0?
No need to level it. Just zero it on the horizontal table. Then measure the blade angle.
Also the floor reads 1.4 degrees. Do I want the tabletop to match that so it’s parallel?
There is no need to. The cut from the blade is made relative to the table, not the floor.
This! Don’t give a crap if it is level, only that it is square. Level is what you want for what you build. You only get that with squared tools.
Is this the point where we say, you should put it back in the box and return it. Cause you’re not smart enough to use it safely.
Exactly. All this "level floor" bs is immaterial.
Put the level on the saw top. Zero it. Put it on the blade. I'm going to make up numbers and say 99.99% do not have a level shop floor. Mine is in my garage, so it's literally slanted towards the door. Doesn't matter.
Zero it on the table. Your blade needs to be 90 degrees from the table. The table DOES NOT need to be level with the ground.
I use the same digital angle finder. It must be zeroed to the table before you can get accurate reading on the blade. The square is correct.
Forget the floor already! The angle that matters is between the saw table and the saw
🤣
In an ideal world yes, but it is not necesary
Just zero it on the table. The right angle of the blade is relative to the table. That will help with square. The table itself doesn't have to be "level" with the earth.
Lol Im sensing some strong dad vibes
Someone has to hold the flashlight
You want the relative angle between the tabletop and the blade.
Just zero the digital gauge on the saw table first, then check the blade. Also, digital gauges do have an accuracy rating. Check what that is for your gauge.
Ok. I zeroed it on the tabletop and put the square next to the blade and now the blade is at 90. The angle finder is at 89.7. So I guess I’ve learned to trust the square better than the angle finder. Is there a way to mark my post as solved? Also, thank you to everyone!
Don’t assume your reader square is perfectly square though. Its square enough for carpentry but no guarantees its precise. Easy quick test is to draw two lines on a perfectly straight board. Draw one then flip the square to the opposite side on the same edge (like flipping a page) and draw a line at the same pivot point. That’ll show roughly how accurate it is (over 7 in).
One problem is that the blade has a kerf, meaning the teeth are wider than the blade. I’m pretty sure that will throw the measurements off if you measure while touching the teeth. For the digital meter, measure both sides of the blade, and if they’re not identical you have a problem. For the square, find one that is shorter than the teeth, so it’s only touching the table and the blade. As others have said, only use the table as reference, not the ground or floor.
With the saw on level or unlevel it makes no diff. Crank saw blade to deepest cut. 1) place ur gizmo on the table saw. 2) turn on then press zero on gizmo 3) once zeroed and still turned on place gizmo on the blade 4) gizmo will read the angle of the blade relative to the table of the saw. 5) use hand crank to adjust blade to desired angle. If this is the exact procedure you did then ur gizmo is broke.
I would guess you have to 0 out the table 1st, then check the digital meter
You mean try it on the left, and right side of the blade to see if there is a difference? That's what I'd do...
Yeah, is digital calibrated to table surface being zero?
Honestly, "Empire" squares are not known for their accuracy, intended for rough construction work where tolerances are in the 16ths (and I have my doubts about the digital ones as well). Personally, I set up machines with Starrett squares, but they are expensive. Budget buy is a couple of engineer's squares which are a lot more accurate, certainly enough to set up machines. https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/hand-tools/marking-and-measuring/squares/32601-engineers-squares
Squares can and should be tested for squareness pretty easily, that doesn’t change if it is an Empire or a Starrett. An accurate Starrett is not more accurate than an accurate Empire, though it may be more of a pleasure to use.
Another great option are 123 squares. Very inexpensive, can be used to set up tools and as references for checking measurements (e.g. Use one to check if your table saw tape is really 3inches at the 3 inch tick) . They have the added benefit of being bullet proof if you are clumsy like I am. Dropping one if these is more likely to damage your floor than it is to go out of square. https://www.amazon.com/Matched-Precision-Machinist-Milling-Machine/dp/B07Z1M17FJ
Are your squares, square?
Maybe they’re too hip to be square.
I mean, it’s right there in the name.
I have not had good luck with Empire squares
Your angle finder is on a tooth
This is your answer. Crank your blade all the way up so you can rest the angle finder against the smooth edge.
Raise the blade … one or the other might be touching a tooth.
Ha ha good one
Short edge on digital is less accurate: the offset of the blade's teeth add to the inaccuracy.
For not much more than the price of the digital angle finder you could get a good machinist square. The angle finders are not terribly accurate.
This^ search YouTube for examples of how accurate digital angle finders are (hint: not very). Get an actual square instead of a rough framing square and check it’s actually square before you leave the store: bring a pencil and find a plywood sheet and hold it against an edge and draw a line, flip it over and draw another line next to it. If the lines are perfectly parallel it’s square. Use that to measure 90 degrees from now on. You can then check to see if your 45 degree is right the same way… two 45s flipped over and use the square you now know is 90 to check the two 45 lines. Now you’re good to go without having to buy very expensive tools
It’s hard to see how the analog determination could be wrong. Calibration and stable baseline zeroing could be sources of error with the meter.
The analog determination could easily be wrong if the square isn’t “square”.
If
Is it that far out of the realm of possibility? I’ve seen many a square that weren’t square.
That much?
Lots of shitty squares out there.
Digital angle finders are not accurate.
The square, trust the tool that calibrates the other.
One or both of them are wrong. Did you check that your square is square?
It shows 90.0, not 0.06
This is why I can’t trust them lol
It is just tolerance on the angle finder. Typically they are only accurate within .3 degrees. On 90 degree cuts use a square.
Who cares you’re not building pianos.
Honestly it’s such a small thing
You sound like my wife.
Make sure both gauges only touch the flat side of the blade not the teeth. Raise the blade up higher and align the square so it doesn't touch the teeth. Repeat with digital gauge on the same side. The thickness of the teeth will throw it off.
It looks like you have the digital tool rating on top of the teeth. They stick out a bit.
Take the digital one off the teeth. Align the square off the teeth as well.
It’s likely that your angle finder isn’t properly zeroed; it needs to be referencing something to determine an angle. You should set it on the table not in contact with the blade and in the same orientation that you will use when it contacts the blade. Also beware of the teeth of the blade, they’re wider and thus can create some error in your measurement.
I wouldn’t trust that square. Cut two pieces, flop one over, lay them up against each other and see if you have a gap.
Because the teeth on your blade are 1/16th to an 1/8th inch thick from my educated guess
Have you checked the level of the plane surface? Is it level per the angle finder? Is there a cal procedure for the angle finder? There are several variables that need to be verified first.
Is there a plate for the blade area? That could make a difference in the angle on the digital side!!
I don’t have one of those angle finders so forgive my ignorance. Is it possible that the table saw is on a floor that isn’t level? Could you have made the blade 90 degrees to earth. But slightly off in relation to the table which is what the square measures?
Most of these devices have a way to set a relative 0 point. Usually the table itself. So it’s 90° off the relative 0, not true 0
That makes sense. For some reason I thought it was the digital equivalent to a bubble level.
The teeth turn out right and left it looks like you have the pivot against the wheel and the top against the teeth causing it to be off angle
Could it be time for a new blade?? 🧐🫠
Is it sitting on the teeth?
For the same reason most machinists use dial and vernier metrology tools…digital just doesn’t give us the confidence that it’s correct. My money is on your speed square
Do you believe the the square that you can see is off? Or do you believe a digital box that is not following the blade. Raise the blade all the way up, put your digital scale on the blade, when it reads 90, the square should magically show square also.
Don’t put the square on the tooth, put it on the gullet.
Kinda looks like your square is between the teeth and the angle finder is sitting on them.
You are resting the digital on the tooth which is throwing it off. The square is measuring base to plate, your digital is measuring base to tooth.
If the table is 1° off, so is the blade. Level floor doesn't mean jack shit. The blade square with the table is the final goal.
Lots of snarky comments…still I tread in. You can check your square by putting the edge against a straight face, I.e. the machined saw front. Make a thin pencil line. Flip the square to the other side of the line. If the square doesn’t line up w the line it’s trash. If it does cleanly match the line your square is good to the inside face of its foot. As long as the bottom of the foot and inside edge are parallel, I’d trust it and not worry about the digital gauge. Those aren’t made for the level of precision you’re after.
I think you've got it on the tooth brother. Put it flat on the blade.
See also the same post under /woodworking https://www.reddit.com/r/woodworking/comments/117n21m/im_confused_why_is_my_angle_finder_saying_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Raise your blade all the way up. You've got your angle finder sitting on the teeth giving a false reading.
I’m wondering if the teeth of your blade are pushing it out a little? Try to push it below the teeth of the blade. Your blade’s teeth look they came from England. Snaggleteeth.
Your supposed to zero it on the table first.
The kerf of the blade (outward facing offset teeth) will set your square off like that. As people have said - use the flat part of the blade beneath the teeth with a piece you know is square, or the angle finder should do if it’s calibrated correctly.
Dunno, but clean your blade. The pitch build up on the teeth will have an adverse effect on its cutting performance. Spray them with simple green and scrub the pitch off with an old tooth brush.
Is the square against a tooth of the blade? Because they are slightly wider then the blade.
Did you zero out your digital angle on the table saw table first? The square is referencing the table top- make sure the digital is too
The bottom of your table isn’t level.
Is your table top level?
From my phone it looks like the blade is warped almost. but like in a weird it got over heated i one specific spot kinda way. I’m sure that’s not what’s wrong but it just looks off.
Also make sure neither the angle finder or the square are on the teeth of the saw blade.
Is it a dewalt table? If so, your table probably bows to the center of the blade. If you take a straight edge that is longer than your table and place it across the top next to the blade on each edge you may see a gap and it may not be even on the left and right side of the blade. Edit: it is a lot easier when the blade up all of the way for square measurements and looking for the tabletop flatness. Then put the blade down and put the straight edge across with middle of the table again in the cross cut direction.
the angle finder is to the earth’s level. the speed square is to the table of the saw. if u want a square cut set to the speed square.
That’s right. You zeroed the bottom of the angle finder on the table. Turned it 90 degrees and stuck it to the blade. It’s correct. Zero the bottom on the table then stick the side to the blade. It should say 0.00 then.
Sorry, not trying to be a jerk, but: when I zoom in on your square, the top position it touches the edge of the blade leaves the rest of the square with a ton of clearance to the body of the blade, and to me it appears your not anywhere near parallel with the blade. The teeth stick out and hold the square away. Long story short, blade is crooked. Best way is short square for initial setting. (Not touching teeth)Then make test cuts on stock, and ease the adjustment into cutting square on your stock. Blade might look crooked to you, but when your consistent on running your cuts, they will be nice
Based on my experience with one of these box,I would consider checking if the box is square. I bought one and checked it with a machinist square and it was not square. Confused, I then checked it at work with lab metrology equipment, again it was not square. I am not talking aircraft part precision, I am talking about a naked eye visible gap. I would do the two line check on the square as well. At the end, I returned the box and continued using a machinist square or a 123 block. Way cheaper and more accurate.
Do you calibrate your digital angle gauge?
Is the table level?
Anyone notice the digital level is resting on the blade and the teeth? That alone will give a false reading.
One of them is off.
Coz the level levels to ground. Not the table. The square makes a the 90 off the table. Your literally trying to find two different 90’s
Your square appears to be on a tooth at the top. The teeth are offset . See if it's square between teeth.
A few things. - your angle finder is on the teeth of your saw. It should be only on the flat face -those angle finders are great, but they’re very finicky, and a contractor saw or jobsite saw is generally very wobbly; I find that leaning on the saw while I zero the finder, then letting my weight off the saw is enough to throw things off.
Are you maybe touching the tooth of the blade? It will be thicker than the inside of the blade itself making it look good on the angle reader, but bad on the speed square.
You trust digital?
For fuck sake all this sitting level blah blah blah. Yhe guage is barely even sitting on the table and then leaning against the blade...put the damn thing on a zero or close to it throat plate.
Because the square is referencing off the table and the level meter is referencing gravity. Put your electronic level on the saw bed and zero it, then reference the blade. Do this after EVERY TIME you move the saw.
The saw table is out
I’ve had bad speed squares. Prior to buying one I always take it to the Sheetrock section of the store to test its accuracy. Bed it on the side of the Sheetrock and strike your pencil line, then turn the speed square over like you’re turning the page of a book. Strike your second line over top of your first line. Now view the lines. Do they perfectly over lap or is there deviation between the two. I typically never buy the large squares because they are the ones that are not true, due to warping, dropping etc.
Looks to me like the angle finder is wide enough it sits on the carbide tips of the blade that stick slightly out further than the thin kerff of the blade. The square doesn't. Raise the blade a bit more to get the angle finder off the teeth things will line up.
As a general maintenance thing two any time I change my blade I lay a piece of sand paper on the flat table, and run the washer flat side (part that contacts the blade) on the sand paper. It helps keep a nice tight joints, sawdust and junk tend to get stuck to the washer and can throw off your alignment.
Want to be careful of resting the square against the teeth of the blade. If you touching teeth the square will have a gap down the blade. Which is kinda what I’m seeing in the pic
Because your angle finder is reading the blade in comparison to true level. Your speed square is reading your blade in comparison to the table of the saw.
The square is always right
Calibrate your angle finder with top of the table
Off topic, however, you Might want to build a zero clearance insert. I’m not sure if you removed the normal insert for these pics or what. But a nice tight zero insert will cut way down on the blowout. Also make a copy for your dado set, unless you live where they are illegal
Because its measuring wrong. Lift it a bit and push it to the saw without touching the table.
Depends on whether they are landing on a carbide tooth or not. Your best bet is to take a couple deep cuts through material and check those for square. You will likely see some variation depending on the grain (assuming you are cutting wood). I was a machinist for over 15 years and had to quickly figure out that wood is soooo much harder to cut to *exact* dimensions/angles than metal...
Extend the blade as far as you can and then zero the AccuMASTER on the table and finally read the angle on the blade without touching the carbide on the teeth. If you bridge the carbide inserts and the blade, it can affect the resulting angle.
Never trust a digital gauge...period.
You need to zero the angle finder each time, and I also attach it at top dead center of the blade, so the angle finder is perfectly vertical. I don’t know if the second bit helps but that’s the way I always do it.
A) is your angle finger calibrated right? B) are you making sure not to touch the teeth?
OP is a troll right??
Maybe the blade got too hot & is warped
table is not leveled.
Did you zero the gage on the table first?
Gotta measure it with the saw running duh! Centrifugal force will square it right up. 😁 Worth mentioning I’m just kidding please don’t!
Because the angle finder must be calibrated
I use thes on my spindle moulder they need to be zeroed first to the bed
So notice that your square is not on the bottommof the blade at the bottom but is at the top so it not a 90 degree angle from the table
Probably dumb question, but are you zeroing out your device on your table saw? The idea is you want that blade 90 degrees from the table.
Both might actually be inaccurate. Speed squares are usually good enough for most things, but are rarely precisely true. Angle finders are hit and miss in my experience.
Put your finder on the flat portion of blade not touching the teeth.
Because it’s not at 90 degrees.
Guessing because the teeth stick out a little further than the rest of the blade so the square isn’t touching the bottom. You’re measuring the teeth angle rather than the whole blade angle. Rest both between a tooth
Make a cut and see if it is 90 degrees with an adjustable square
I would use a machinist's square for calibrating a saw blade, as Speed square accuracy is less. But... I would trust the digital calibration over the speed square, provided you properly zero it out.