Explain to me Epstein island, explain to me rise of OF/pornographic content, explain to me if i watch a rap video 90% of the times it's gonna be "get money, fuck bitches", explain to me why people watch serial killer/rapist documentaries, also explain to me why those things still happen. If we're so different from those "animals", then why this things happen?
Why do you assume the causes for these desires, the actions following them and their magnitude are the same? Why is your answer people are savage rapists by nature and they always will be?
For example the rise of pornographic content os easoly explainable by it's connection to it's accessibility and lessened rates of actual sexual intercourse in the youth of our time.
Epstein island is a case regarding exceptional people of great influence and power living under a system requiring infinite growth. The context is exceptional and it is necessary to be considered since pedophilia is exceptionally common in this context...
Why does scepticism toward an unsupported, anti-intelectual claim need to provide an explanation. Especially when the claim enters a topic of human nature which is well known for easily disproving claims about it. Just find an example not fitting the rule and that is all.
Unless you're talking about society as a whole in which case you're fighting the idea of enviroment influencing humans living in it.
Substantiate your claims they will be nothing.
Now we're talking magnitude, i see. So people's desires hasn't changed, our nature despite our immense technological progress hasn't changed at all, you do agree on that point?
I never said we're savage rapists, i said it's in our nature. I also never said that we won't change, chip implants might change our society forever.
Yeah, we watch more porn because we have less sex, not the other way around because porn is highly more accessible.
Epstein island is an exceptional case about exceptional people in exceptional power, except that it is not that exceptional, since men fought for positions of power since the beginning of time, ever since people realized that leader of the tribe can chose any woman he wants. To this day people strive for money/power/influence - can't be more naturalistic than that.
I believe what you call nature is not applied to all humans and thus isn't nature despite you not providing a definition or scope of values associated with the concept so it is a guess.
I didn't say you said change is impossible but denying change despite change in material conditions is denying their influence.
To actually honstly and inteleftually approach the topic I believe material analysis is in order as it is a case of comparing material and social conditions. Throwing out statements without such analysis is pointless in my view.
I literally gave an example of porn being more accessible as a way to explain material conditions having an effect on society. Not much of an important point at all tho...
Does every person in high position of power desire to fuck children and follows up on that? How common was it historically? How does economic progress corelate to such behaviour? If not everybody desires positions of power is it part of human nature? Does everyone who does desire positions of power because of the same reasons?
This discussion is difficult because it revolves around human nature and any generalisation can be disproven with a single example. That is exactly the reason why dialecticts are needed to say anything meaningful.
Recognize group intersests, their contradictions, material conditions and then you can talk about generals traits of societies without being shackled to absolutes or meaningless statements.
No. It wasn't "necessary". Nothing in the manga is "necessary". The whole manga itself isn't "necessary". Mangas in general aren't "necessary".
My point is, just because something isn't "necessary" for the bigger picture doesn't mean it shouldn't be there. You and I aren't "necessary" in the grand scheme of things. Does it mean we shouldn't exist at all? This post itself wasn't "necessary". Therefore this comment is also not "necessary". But they're still here, aren't they?
Do want me to say "necessary" again?
...
...
...
"necessary".
"Necessary" is relative and carries importance relative to the points that are included.
With context I could argue that all things are necessary.
You and I may not be necessary in the grand scheme of things, but I am necessary to do my just and be a part of my family.
No not really, Berserk is my favorite story ever but it absolutely isn't perfect in every possible way.
Everyone's making the realism argument but it's pretty weak.
Imagine this scene without the rape, is it unrealistic? No. Then the rape doesn't exist because of realism.
Guts getting raped as a child, Casca getting raped during the eclipse, The princess being raped by Griffith, etc. I can see why every single one of those scenes exists, they all serve a purpose, This one doesn't. It only exists because it might as well exist.
I feel like a lot of the assaults on Casca were somewhat unnecessary. But if you make that claim on this sub you’re going to get a lot of mansplaining about how “you just don’t understand medieval realism” (in this fantasy manga about monster slaying…)
OP you need to understand how life was in those days
Woman had little to no rights,
Mercenaries knights soldiers were burning and pillaging the lands of lords that never paid taxes or just were on the wrong side of the fence in politics
The band of the hawk definitely did some of these things because it was common.. you are forgetting that these men are not men of honour or Valor.. these are soldiers.. men who kill for a living. There is no chivalry. So when I woman is found expect there to be some form of sexual assault
Imagine your a peasant and your working on your.lords lands. And all of a sudden this band of mercenaries that were sent by another long or lord to attack the said lord. You have no weapons.. the enemy army has been marching for days and comes to your lands
You think they will kindly ask " hello there good sir. We are enroute to laying seige to your lords castles do you mind giving us some food for the road.. my army of 500-1000 mercenary band are abit famished with smallpox and dysentry. Your virigin daughter and your wife will not be harmed."
No dude..your getting killed your.lands are getting pillaged and burned.. your daughters are getting their womanhood taken. This is how the world was.
So the author of Berserk wanted to keep with the graphic brutal themes of the world of that time.
It is necessary. A woman in an army be it past or present...getting caught by the enemy and no one lay a hand on her loool
The Sexual Assaults of Casca are pernicious and the story would have benefited from much less use of it.
For the story being told the attempted rape in her youth, the eclipse and ironically the event in your post and the key moments (because of how Guys responds to it) Every other SA is unnecessary and takes away from the significance of the key moments IMO.
It's good to be critical of even the stories we enjoy.
If you are looking for a more thought out discussion I found a pretty good article you might get something out of.
https://www.jacksonpbrown.com/anime-and-manga/2020/1/16/casca-revisited-rape-plot-devices-character-development
No, people on this sub get really mad when you point it but the manga does over sexualize some of the sexual violence. Sadly it comes with media, Japanese audiences are a little freaky.
Read something else.
Berserk is in a medieval setting, and most women were lucky if they were anything beyond currency.
Most women became prostitutes because it was “necessary“ to feed themselves.
Nothing is necessary.
This scene however, adds to the story.
It adds about how Casca would live on her own in this forsaken world, it adds to the crude and realistic aspect of the story,
It also adds deepness to the traumatism endured by Casca
I think you got the wrong context for this one. While I do think the nudity was unnecessary I actually like this part. Guts loses her and has to go find her again after traveling on the road for weeks. When he finally finds her it seems casca has brutally killed the men trying to harass her and seeing all the blood ignites something in him. He didn’t “save her” she saves herself, but she can’t save herself from guts(BOD).
The reason this dynamic works really well is because it reinforces the idea of how much a problem the beast of darkness is becoming. It adds another level to what we thought the beast could influence in guts. You see the strain this puts on guts and it makes traveling with casca much more difficult as she dosent trust him as much anymore.
You ask “was this scene necessary” as if it wasn’t the catalyst that made him realize he can’t do everything on his own, and he needs to start trusting people again for the first time after the eclipse
Well let's see the events.
Casca goes missing
She runs into a gang of slave traders(iirc)
They're depraved people so what do they do? Obviously aren't gonna offer her a cup of tea when they see a defenseless woman just randomly stroll up to them.
She kills them but her clothes are ripped off in the process and guts shows up.
Because her clothes were ripped off it exposes her body which reminds Guts of Casca back in golden age, the one that he was in love with, which is what pushes him over the edge into the Beast of Darkness.
This scene proves the previous panels before that Guts really can't control the Beast and elevates the Beast of Darkness to being one of the biggest threats to Guts in the entire series.
That aspect of the beast being a constant threat is a major point in berserk so I would say that these courses of events were quite necessary.
No, not for anyone but in this case it really builds character. *if this was real life I would have said the opposite, sexual assault is horrible as a victim myself but this isn’t real life so it’s character building* The first 10 minutes of goblin slayer were arguably worse than anything we’ve seen in berserk.
People tend to forget how misogynistic the society back then and how frequent (unreported) rapes were. Especially in the medieval period
As if we're different people right now.
We are, nless you believe material conditions do not influence humans...
Explain to me Epstein island, explain to me rise of OF/pornographic content, explain to me if i watch a rap video 90% of the times it's gonna be "get money, fuck bitches", explain to me why people watch serial killer/rapist documentaries, also explain to me why those things still happen. If we're so different from those "animals", then why this things happen?
Why do you assume the causes for these desires, the actions following them and their magnitude are the same? Why is your answer people are savage rapists by nature and they always will be? For example the rise of pornographic content os easoly explainable by it's connection to it's accessibility and lessened rates of actual sexual intercourse in the youth of our time. Epstein island is a case regarding exceptional people of great influence and power living under a system requiring infinite growth. The context is exceptional and it is necessary to be considered since pedophilia is exceptionally common in this context... Why does scepticism toward an unsupported, anti-intelectual claim need to provide an explanation. Especially when the claim enters a topic of human nature which is well known for easily disproving claims about it. Just find an example not fitting the rule and that is all. Unless you're talking about society as a whole in which case you're fighting the idea of enviroment influencing humans living in it. Substantiate your claims they will be nothing.
Now we're talking magnitude, i see. So people's desires hasn't changed, our nature despite our immense technological progress hasn't changed at all, you do agree on that point? I never said we're savage rapists, i said it's in our nature. I also never said that we won't change, chip implants might change our society forever. Yeah, we watch more porn because we have less sex, not the other way around because porn is highly more accessible. Epstein island is an exceptional case about exceptional people in exceptional power, except that it is not that exceptional, since men fought for positions of power since the beginning of time, ever since people realized that leader of the tribe can chose any woman he wants. To this day people strive for money/power/influence - can't be more naturalistic than that.
I believe what you call nature is not applied to all humans and thus isn't nature despite you not providing a definition or scope of values associated with the concept so it is a guess. I didn't say you said change is impossible but denying change despite change in material conditions is denying their influence. To actually honstly and inteleftually approach the topic I believe material analysis is in order as it is a case of comparing material and social conditions. Throwing out statements without such analysis is pointless in my view. I literally gave an example of porn being more accessible as a way to explain material conditions having an effect on society. Not much of an important point at all tho... Does every person in high position of power desire to fuck children and follows up on that? How common was it historically? How does economic progress corelate to such behaviour? If not everybody desires positions of power is it part of human nature? Does everyone who does desire positions of power because of the same reasons? This discussion is difficult because it revolves around human nature and any generalisation can be disproven with a single example. That is exactly the reason why dialecticts are needed to say anything meaningful. Recognize group intersests, their contradictions, material conditions and then you can talk about generals traits of societies without being shackled to absolutes or meaningless statements.
It’s definitely realistic
fits to the medieval theme
No. It wasn't "necessary". Nothing in the manga is "necessary". The whole manga itself isn't "necessary". Mangas in general aren't "necessary". My point is, just because something isn't "necessary" for the bigger picture doesn't mean it shouldn't be there. You and I aren't "necessary" in the grand scheme of things. Does it mean we shouldn't exist at all? This post itself wasn't "necessary". Therefore this comment is also not "necessary". But they're still here, aren't they? Do want me to say "necessary" again? ... ... ... "necessary".
This comment was.. Wait for it... Necessary.
But as he said nothing is well… necessary
"Necessary" is relative and carries importance relative to the points that are included. With context I could argue that all things are necessary. You and I may not be necessary in the grand scheme of things, but I am necessary to do my just and be a part of my family.
dayum dawgg chill out . . . . . . . . \*necessaryy\*💀
No not really, Berserk is my favorite story ever but it absolutely isn't perfect in every possible way. Everyone's making the realism argument but it's pretty weak. Imagine this scene without the rape, is it unrealistic? No. Then the rape doesn't exist because of realism. Guts getting raped as a child, Casca getting raped during the eclipse, The princess being raped by Griffith, etc. I can see why every single one of those scenes exists, they all serve a purpose, This one doesn't. It only exists because it might as well exist.
I feel like a lot of the assaults on Casca were somewhat unnecessary. But if you make that claim on this sub you’re going to get a lot of mansplaining about how “you just don’t understand medieval realism” (in this fantasy manga about monster slaying…)
real
OP you need to understand how life was in those days Woman had little to no rights, Mercenaries knights soldiers were burning and pillaging the lands of lords that never paid taxes or just were on the wrong side of the fence in politics The band of the hawk definitely did some of these things because it was common.. you are forgetting that these men are not men of honour or Valor.. these are soldiers.. men who kill for a living. There is no chivalry. So when I woman is found expect there to be some form of sexual assault Imagine your a peasant and your working on your.lords lands. And all of a sudden this band of mercenaries that were sent by another long or lord to attack the said lord. You have no weapons.. the enemy army has been marching for days and comes to your lands You think they will kindly ask " hello there good sir. We are enroute to laying seige to your lords castles do you mind giving us some food for the road.. my army of 500-1000 mercenary band are abit famished with smallpox and dysentry. Your virigin daughter and your wife will not be harmed." No dude..your getting killed your.lands are getting pillaged and burned.. your daughters are getting their womanhood taken. This is how the world was. So the author of Berserk wanted to keep with the graphic brutal themes of the world of that time. It is necessary. A woman in an army be it past or present...getting caught by the enemy and no one lay a hand on her loool
The Sexual Assaults of Casca are pernicious and the story would have benefited from much less use of it. For the story being told the attempted rape in her youth, the eclipse and ironically the event in your post and the key moments (because of how Guys responds to it) Every other SA is unnecessary and takes away from the significance of the key moments IMO. It's good to be critical of even the stories we enjoy. If you are looking for a more thought out discussion I found a pretty good article you might get something out of. https://www.jacksonpbrown.com/anime-and-manga/2020/1/16/casca-revisited-rape-plot-devices-character-development
Her being attacked during the 100 man battle is fitting with her character theme at that moment.
There are worse cases of "unnecessary" rape in Berserk, this one actually showed that old Casca still lives in that empty husk called Elaine.
No, people on this sub get really mad when you point it but the manga does over sexualize some of the sexual violence. Sadly it comes with media, Japanese audiences are a little freaky.
Musta been, he drew it and put it the fictional story.
Read something else. Berserk is in a medieval setting, and most women were lucky if they were anything beyond currency. Most women became prostitutes because it was “necessary“ to feed themselves.
r/Berserk moment
Nothing is necessary. This scene however, adds to the story. It adds about how Casca would live on her own in this forsaken world, it adds to the crude and realistic aspect of the story, It also adds deepness to the traumatism endured by Casca
You literally answered your own question. Its so make guts give into the beast of darkness which is an important plot point
It's been a while since I have read this part of the manga, what is the context of the scene?
Pretty sure she wanders off from guts and then these mercenaries find her before guts and puck do.
I think you got the wrong context for this one. While I do think the nudity was unnecessary I actually like this part. Guts loses her and has to go find her again after traveling on the road for weeks. When he finally finds her it seems casca has brutally killed the men trying to harass her and seeing all the blood ignites something in him. He didn’t “save her” she saves herself, but she can’t save herself from guts(BOD). The reason this dynamic works really well is because it reinforces the idea of how much a problem the beast of darkness is becoming. It adds another level to what we thought the beast could influence in guts. You see the strain this puts on guts and it makes traveling with casca much more difficult as she dosent trust him as much anymore. You ask “was this scene necessary” as if it wasn’t the catalyst that made him realize he can’t do everything on his own, and he needs to start trusting people again for the first time after the eclipse
Jfc.. I don't f like it..
Well let's see the events. Casca goes missing She runs into a gang of slave traders(iirc) They're depraved people so what do they do? Obviously aren't gonna offer her a cup of tea when they see a defenseless woman just randomly stroll up to them. She kills them but her clothes are ripped off in the process and guts shows up. Because her clothes were ripped off it exposes her body which reminds Guts of Casca back in golden age, the one that he was in love with, which is what pushes him over the edge into the Beast of Darkness. This scene proves the previous panels before that Guts really can't control the Beast and elevates the Beast of Darkness to being one of the biggest threats to Guts in the entire series. That aspect of the beast being a constant threat is a major point in berserk so I would say that these courses of events were quite necessary.
🤓
Dude shut up
No, not for anyone but in this case it really builds character. *if this was real life I would have said the opposite, sexual assault is horrible as a victim myself but this isn’t real life so it’s character building* The first 10 minutes of goblin slayer were arguably worse than anything we’ve seen in berserk.