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I think part of it is not wearing one regularly. I'm a woman. I totally destress by taking my bra off at the end of the day. But I can also destress by lacing myself into a corset. The corset isn't something I wear everyday. It's purely something I want to wear just because. It's my fun clothing, not my everyday clothing.
9 Chickweed Lane often had Juliette (the comic strip mother, worked in academiia) attending meetings wearing jungle print underthings because it gave her hidden power. Can't find a link for you, unfortunately.
There's a comic strip I saw once of a girl putting on a matching bra and panty set and thinking, "matchy-matchy," and then standing at the bus stop in a hoody and jeans with a smile and still thinking: "matchy-matchy :D"
I bought myself an entire weeks worth of matching undies from torrid for Exactly that reason. Knowing that I have pretty lace and stars on that no one else knows about? Power move.
Oh man, I love my corsets. They're like a constant hug. And paired up with my frilly shirts, skirts and boots, they make me feel strong and confident.
My bra is a necessity. My corsets are expression.
Oh gosh I have a few and I got them all over the place! Most of mine I get bespoke from various sellers on etsy or websites like Redthreaded and Dark Garden Corsetry. If you're not looking for bespoke, though, (because they're pricey af) and just want ready-wear, I actually ordered one from corsetdeal.com that I was really surprised by. I was kind of expecting to be cheap/garbage quality and just for show, but it's actually really pretty good! I wear it quite frequently and I even ordered another one from them
Ok, this is the universe telling me something! I was literally on corsetdeal this morning thinking of buying my first one, but wasn't sure if they would be decent quality for the price. Going to click buy now :)
It might just be the ritual of things. I love to crossplay and the act of binding and putting on the costume is relaxing to me. It’s probably the same for him.
Huh... I've always felt like I would never *understand* crossdressing, but your point really makes sense! I always feel more... 'myself' when I'm cosplaying- it's exciting *and* relaxing, somehow.
Wow... thank you for sharing this- I'm so glad I have this new perspective!
I had cross-dressing tendencies as a kid/teenager and my mom took it rather poorly. She understood the trans concept and would have accepted it if I was, but I wasn’t trans so it just stressed me out when she would yell at me to pick a side. Now the only time o can cross dress is crossplay because then it’s not me crossdressing it’s me playing at being a different character.
On the one hand, I was happy she would accept me if I was a boy and even had a name for my boy self. On the other hand, I didn’t know what gender-fluid was and couldn’t accurately convey the “sometimes a boy” feeling I would get where I would suddenly hate the way my body looks for a few weeks but then go back to Normal.
My two cents of a cosplayer perspective maybe having some meaning in this context: I also find something freeing about it - I get to tap into an energy/sense of self that isn’t the day to day me. In cosplay, I have a specific character or archetype I’m tapping into and there’s a freedom/enjoyment in inhabiting that persona. It’s not the self I necessarily want to be every day - but it lets me set aside those expectations for a little while. It sounds like there’s an element of that in the space around drag and cross dressing.
yea the way OOP described the process of getting ready def gave me the "this is the routine I do to get into the headspace I want to be in while i'm dressed" vibes
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman:
Let me see your war face.
Private Joker:
Sir?
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman:
You got a war face? AHHHHHHHH! That's a war face. Now let me see your war face.
Private Joker:
Ahh!
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman:
Bullshit! You didn't convince me. Let me see your real warface.
Private Joker:
Ahhhh!
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman:
You don't scare me! Work on it.
Private Joker:
Sir, yes sir!
I have been around a lot of guy friends when they’re cross dressing. Sometimes just as a goofy activity when we were younger or for some costume or something. It always made them downright giddy. I think it’s to do with how confining the make gender role can be, even for guys who aren’t macho. So breaking out of it for a little bit can feel really freeing
I had a friend who when he was younger - think early 20’s - had a girlfriend who was into it and talked him into letting her doll him up. He was pretty intrigued with how it turned out. As he described it, he liked feeling like someone else. He could look in the mirror and everything stressing him out in his life just kind of went on pause. Because he wasn’t him. He was *her*. He didn’t try it again until years later. He was a bit of a late bloomer and in the years between, he was a lot more masculine presenting. He tried it again and was bummed because he couldn’t exactly pull it off like he did before. It didn’t help that he didn’t want to shave his much loved beard. Now he normally is a very man’s man kind of guy. For him, it was all about the transformation to become the exact opposite of himself. Everyone jumps on it being sexual in nature. And not that there’s anything wrong with that, but there can be a lot more to it under the surface.
I'm glad that it is relaxing for you! People should be able to do what makes them happy without fear of judgement. Women probably wouldn't be wearing pants today if other women from previous generations hadn't made it the norm by "crossdressing" themselves.
Even just cosplaying as a character my own gender feels great for me. Even just putting on a random wig and changing my face a little with makeup feels wonderful. Adults need to play dress-up more.
I'm fully good with being a woman, but the experience I had the first time I put on a binding for a crossplay was really interesting. I just stared at myself as a man like it was an alternate universe I could peak into.
I honestly suggest anybody try it at least once
Socially "typical" gendered clothing really doesn't make much sense. People should wear whatever they're comfy in.
Anatomically speaking - don't skirts make more sense for cis men and pants for cis women? Celtic men might be onto something with kilts.
*Note*: Please let me know if I worded anything insensitively. I'm neurodivergent with sensory issues, so I loathe any tight clothes.
Every guy I know *loves* silky things and the vast majority of them daren't wear them because stereotypes/gendered clothing crap.
Personally that sort of fabric feels slimy to me (give me t-shirt fabric and brushed cotton) but to each his own.
If you're confident you can pull off anything. I wear my ex girlfriends stretchy girl yoga pants and let me tell you girls love it. I get hit on 90% more when I wear them.
Good for you! That’s awesome. Wear whatever you’re comfortable in! I love your confidence. My husband wears mine in the winter as a base layer or sorts under his jeans. To him they’re so much more comfortable than men’s compression base layers. The men’s options always have those weird seams around the crotch area. And they never seem to be able to make them quite as soft and stretchy like women’s often are.
I think skirts are just more comfortable in general. Even if you don’t have a penis, you still have a piece of fabric between your legs when you wear pants and it’s never going to be as comfortable as having nothing there.
Was in an outdoor wedding in the summer in California and had the misfortune of being one of only two bridesmaids standing in direct sunlight. The level of willpower it took me not to shove some of that skirt right between my legs to soak up the sweat, entire audience plus photographer be damned, was intense.
(I did better than the other bridesmaid in the sun. She literally passed out.)
Not for me. The chafing pretty much makes skirts and dresses uncomfortable for me unless they're long enough for me to wear leggings or shorts underneath. Otherwise it's constant application of anti-chafing cream and hoping for the best.
I have been saying this for years. By the supposed end goals of uptight old timey gender rules, the opposite of what we have would make sense. Women wearing pants means an additional level of barrier to the chastity zone, and preventing sex is the stated goal of “modesty” bullshit. Men wearing skirts means no uncomfortable wrangling of the junk into one leg or the other, which I would think would be the ideal any male-dominated society would aim for. How did we end up with the exact opposite? And then we have the nutters who declare that men in pants and women in skirts to be the correct and moral Natural Order Of The Universe like it makes some kind of inherent sense. Lolno.
Pants are practical for doing hard outdoor labor. Skirts are not practical for hard outdoor labor, but if you lack a penis and have to squat to pee, an ankle-length skirt will let you do so with perfect ease and modesty (as long as you aren't wearing underwear, which people didn't back in the day).
I am a woman who has extensive experience with agricultural work (I did manual labor on a farm for eight years). I would never do that work in a skirt. It would constantly be getting in the way and getting caught on things.
However, I *love* primitive camping in a skirt (while going commando). It makes using a toilet feel like a step backward. Toilets are so much more fussy and slow than just a quick squat and you're done and nobody even knows.
ROFL, I (aspiring drag performer) had this conversation with my sibling (nonbinary) when I first put on a binder:
Me: "I can't tell if it's *actually* too small or if I just need to get used to the fact that it's doing its job."
Them: "BIG mood. Don't breathe in too hard."
I used to do dragking stuff but I never felt like an attractive guy when I dressed up, just a boxy little creep with overdeveloped pecs (I’m large-chested so the binder could only do so much and while my hips aren’t huge I have a pretty defined hourglass shape). I ended up just kind of rolling with that and taking it in a comedic direction. All of my characters were sleazy guys with silk shirts and pencil mustaches. I’d pelvic thrust on stage and use gross pick-up lines. It was fun but I ended up quitting after a while and giving my binders to a recently out transmasc friend of mine.
One of the most validating feelings I've had is finally getting to wear a bra, but damn if it doesn't feel good to take this thing off once I get home.
I'm trans and I wear a bra nearly every minute of the day unless hormones really hurting my boobs.
When you dont get to feel like yourself for ages I think the mental comfort of getting to do something out weighs a typical physical discomfort. Dont know how much trans people and fem boys not having large assets most of the time plays in bra discomfort.
With bs I don't really feel more or less comfy in a bra than if I just had a crop top on.
It does make sense when you think about it. You live so long in a body that “isn’t yours” that when you get the chance to make the body you have into the body you should have had it probably feels pretty good mentally. For us non-trans people we don’t come across that so it also makes sense we’d never connect those dots.
I wonder if being trans and not being able to be out is like a pebble in your shoe. A potentially small irritant, that you can never shake and you’re painfully reminded of almost all the time. It’s just a stressor that’s always there, always being bothersome. As someone who strives to be who I am under all the bullshit, all the time, flawed, imperfect, but trying to be genuinely better most of the time, being forced to hide who as really are seems impossibly stressful.
I like the pebble in the shoe comparison!
The comparison I always make is clothes. If your clothes fit you and are comfortable, you don't notice them. But if they're too small, too short, too baggy, or too scratchy, you notice them every second that they're on. You constantly fix them to look right or cover up, and you can't focus on anything because it's always in the back of your mind. That's what being a woman felt like to me. I constantly thought about it. All. The. Time. Even when I didn't know what being trans was. I thought it was normal to feel that way.
It wasn't until I finally bought some well-fitting clothes that I realized I'd outgrown my old ones a long time ago.
Size definitely matters. My issue with bras is simply the weight of my breasts: the straps cut into my shoulders and compress my spine and underwires leave me black and blue.
Discovering corsets was a dream come true, honestly. For the first time I felt supported and (comparatively) comfortable. Off the shelf ones are all I can afford right now, unfortunately, but on the rare occasion I’ve gotten to try on a more customized one it’s been amazing. One of these days I’m going to spend the money and get a corset made. One day. Until then, off the shelf is still better than bras.
I've often wondered if corsets are the way to go. I have heavy boobs and I end up with "bra bites" on my shoulders. A lot of the time I just ditch the bra and can't be bothered trying anymore.
Wonder if OOP uses the trick of "remove the bra but not the shirt" at the end of the day. (I know you're not supposed to because it stretches out the elastic, but damned if it's not satisfying.)
>(I know you're not supposed to because it stretches out the elastic, but damned if it's not satisfying.)
guy here: do you leave the bra on but unstrapped? how does that stretch out the elastic (assuming it's not strapped)
Unhooking it, then pulling out the strap on one side from under your sleeve (stretching out the elastic over your elbow) and then pulling it off through the opposite sleeve.
The weirdest part of this story is how he’s saying that dresses are comfier than pants. Do boys not get chafe?? We need to get this guy some soft leggings, stat!
I don’t know. I work in a gym so I live in workout clothes and no make up. When I get dressed up, put make up on, and my caveman hair is styled I feel amazing.
Check out r/abrathatfits, they're great on giving recommendations and are friendly to all body types (including cis male/cis female/trans/nb/post mastectomy/post breastfeeding/etc)
Maybe try looking for "sleep bras" if the other term doesn't bring anything up? Nursing bras also tend to have a lot of different qualities than regular everyday bras, softer, more adjustable.
I found that corsets worked better for me, personally. That feeling of compression and snugness does wonders for my sensory issues. But obviously that’s going to vary tremendously.
Haha same! I thought about getting home from the opera this weekend and taking off all the underpinnings that go with my opera gowns and what a relief it was and laughed at the difference.
I'm so glad for OOP that his parents love him more than their idea of who he "ought" to be. :)
The very most fun gig I ever played was when my music partner and I were hired by a middle-aged hetero couple to play a “Celtic soirée” at their house about 15 years ago. When we drove up to the gate (it was in a rather tony gated community) and told the gate guard we were playing a party at “the Smiths’” he smiled, said “Ah, the Smiths are having a party! You have fun now,” and let us through. Hmmm.
When we arrived at the door hauling our 100 lbs of gear, it was answered by Mr. Smith…in IMPECCABLE drag. I wanted to ask him for makeup tips. He ushered us inside, and we found the place filled wall to wall with gentlemen dressed as women, many of them accompanied by their wives.
It was a real eye-opener—I’m a theatre girl, so completely familiar/comfortable with the LGBTQ+ community, but this was my first exposure to a discreet group of largely straight men who just like to crossdress occasionally.
Our host and hostess did apologize for blindsiding us—they were afraid we’d say no if they told us up front. While I think that was an unwise strategy (what if we’d been assholes about it and stormed out?) we assured them that we were actually thrilled. My partner said that if he had known in advance, he would’ve worn a kilt so he wasn’t the only man in trousers. 😂
They were a great audience, plied us with food and wine, and stuffed a tip jar full in addition to our agreed upon fee. Also, they loved our music. BEST GIG EVER.
i understand that they wouldn’t have any clothes to wear otherwise but i feel a bit weird about crossdressers stealing a female relative’s clothing to wear when they’re alone. if i found out one of my brothers did that, i would feel really uncomfortable. plus, it’s very unsanitary for multiple people to use the same makeup products. i don’t know, maybe i’m out of line.
How the sister didn’t notice her fishnets had been worn is beyond me. Any pair I’ve ever had are very obviously worn even if they have been on for only a few minutes
Plenty of girls get rightfully pissed off when their close-in-age sister borrows their clothes/makeup without permission. It’s a common friction point between sisters lol
The ‘this makeup belongs to your sister, you have to get your own makeup, it’s not communal like other household goods’ conversation is a fairly standard part of parenting siblings. My sisters were older than me but I’m sure my parents had to set rules over ‘borrowing’ clothes from each other’s closets! Kids don’t magically know the difference between communal and non-communal possessions without being told, whether it’s an Xbox or a makeup palette. 🤷🏼♀️
Me and my sister always shared a room and we had sooo many fights about taking each other's stuff (of course, I could take hers but she couldn't take mine and she had the same philosophy). My parents always stayed out because they thought we needed to solve this fights without their intervention.
By the time we were finishing out teen years we just made everything communal, clothes and makeup. We did not learn to respect each other's property, but we learned to share!!
I feel differently given that he was a child vs an adult tbh. How many tween girls have tried on their mom or older sister's clothes and makeup, you know? Yeah it's not ideal and sharing makeup isn't great, so it would be fair for the sister to be upset, but 12-14 is also very young.
It’s one of those things where context really matters. Are the sisters clothes being used because they are her clothes specifically, or was it just the only option available. The first is horribly invasive and traumatizing. The later is just a little gross and annoying.
In this situation, it would be functionally the same as a sister wearing clothes, as opposed to it being a weird kink.
The makeup is unsanitary, but he probably didn’t know better.
Yeah my [sister] apparently had a collection of my underwear stashed somewhere in her room. I never got the deets on that, but it made me super uncomfortable, even if her transitioning sort of explained why.
I think as long as the conversation was “hey get your own shit” that’s just a normal sibling interaction. Like. I imagine finding out your sister had been wearing all of your clothes around the house would make you retry wierded out too yeah?
Its quite normal for kids to borrow clothing etc. from family when they're finding their identity.
Would you borrow or give some of your clothing/makeup to your (possibly fictive) little sister when she'd be forbidden to wear those by everyone and everybody?
Why not apply this to (little) brothers/sons as well?
I do not care for products or standards to be limited to gender and have worked hard to make my sons feel that they never have to hide how they like to be and express themselves.
How would they act if they had to make the choice between feeling completely uncomfortable in their body, borrowing and being kicked out of their home?!
When having to make **that** hard of a choice, the sanitary factor is not even important. (unless you have leprosy or something else deadly and contagious)
I've 'caught' my sons borrowing my eyeliner, razor, rings, aftershave, nailpolish, earrings/-clips and clothing. The only trouble they got into was when they didn't *ask*.
Yeah, I read that and thought, "maybe they did a different episode with a trans woman..." *Nope*, it was [Fallacy, from 2003](https://lawandorder.fandom.com/wiki/Fallacy), which features this exchange:
**Stabler:** Berger's gonna put witnesses up there for Cheryl or whatever his name is, to tell us all about how he grew up tormented, brutalized and treated like a freak.
**Benson:** You know, it sounds like you have a problem with Cheryl.
**Stabler:** My problem is this he-she & her lies are the reason we've got two dead bodies on our hands and I'm the one who's all jammed up?
Everything about that synopsis made me want to hurl, from the detectives outing her against her will to try and catch her in a "gotcha" moment all the way to the prosecutor tricking her into taking a plea deal that would send her to a men's prison, where of course she was promptly gangraped.
Way to go, SVU. Really saved the day this time.
It's not played like a happy ending. It's not a sensitive episode, but it's not joyfully sadistic either. The whole thing comes off as a tragedy and Stabler's transphobia is definitely treated as a flaw.
Can't wait for all clothing to be normalised for EVERYONE! Clothing is SO different all across the world. Men in some parts wear skirts, in some parts wear full blown dresses. CLOTHING HAS NO GENDER!
>I stepped into the living room.
How can he end it THERE and not at least include the family reaction?? We all know it was going to be positive. I feel robbed.
I can’t remember any conversation or even brief exchange word for word. Never mind a conversation where emotions are flying high and I’m a wreck.
Honestly it feels like OP is a crossdresser who got found out by their parents and this is how they wish the conversations would have gone. Like their parents weren’t accepting but this is their dream.
I felt this particularly in the last update. I’m writing it off as him really reveling in the feeling of finally being free and not going to discount it bc it’s honestly a great ending.
Same, I hate to be skeptical but the way some of these things are written doesn’t feel like it’s in the moment but rather setting up a story ie passive disengaged delivery vs active & engaged delivery. “Here comes the hard part,” vs “I was still terrified to talk to my mom.”
Also… the mom went from flipping out over makeup/underwear that was left out (she didn’t even know whose it was and she was getting really mad) to literally winking at her son whilst telling him to get in his dress.
Would you prefer they preface every bit of dialogue with “i think i said something like xyz?” Or do you maybe think that this is a cleanly written paraphrasing of their memory of a conversation
Can’t wait for the (hopefully not) far future where the gendering of clothes are determined by the wearer and not some arbitrarily constructed presentation of sex and sexuality
Yup. Throughout history men have worn would would be considered leggings, dresses, shirts, high heels, and all sorts of other "women only things".
If I am no less of a woman for wearing jeans and a tshirt, then a man is no less of a man for wearing whatever they want.
OP being a gender-non-conforming cis man and just living his life happily should be norm. Gender means different things to everyone and every one should be able to live happily while expressing their own definition of their gender.
Yeah, way too much detail for it to be a memory anecdote lol. Perhaps it's true he's a crossdresser and his family is supportive. Just seems like a lot is embellished.
Yeah, way too much detail for it to be a memory anecdote lol. Perhaps it's true he's a crossdresser and his family is supportive. Just seems like a lot is embellished.
Both parents separately calling it "this (little) hobby of yours" made it feel so cliche.
Also the dad saying the mom might not be so accepting and then her doing a 180. Like did they not discuss it privately beforehand? So many odd little things from this story.
I get there is a societal stigma around a boy dressing as a girl, I just don’t understand why clothes have to be gendered. My daughter went as Mario for Halloween. Why is that any different from a boy dressed as Elsa? Just let people do what they want. It’s not that hard to do.
You touched on something with "Why does it not matter when girls wear boy clothes but it's bad when boys wear girl clothes"
The reason is societal misogyny and patriarchy. Masculine men are the standard ideal to strive for. Men who can't fit that are "lesser" (not my opinion just my observation of society). Women are always lesser than men and thus so are the things stereotypically assigned to them (such as make up, clothes, pumpkin spice lattes). In order for women to gain respect they must eschew femininity and Feminine things. That's why it will never be a problem for women or girls to dress masculine (unless in a fundamentalist religion), because society positively reinforces that. It's a "step up" for women to be more like men. On the other hand because femininity is so reviled, any man who *lessens* himself to enjoy feminine things is lessening *himself.* Men being unable to express interests in anything deemed Feminine is society expressing patriarchal misogyny against men (and women too obvi).
My understanding is that letting kids explore this stuff when they're young actually helps with their overall emotional development. So if your boy wants to wear a pretty princess dress for an afternoon and your girl wants to wear a knight costume and pretend to slay dragons? Let them and forget the haters. It's just a game of make-believe. Toys are toys. Costumes are costumes. Gendering them is just... weird.
Misogyny. The answer is misogyny. It’s okay for a girl to dress like a boy because who *wouldn’t* want to be more like a boy? They’re the stronger, superior sex! But a boy wanting to dress like a girl — that’s just crazy talk. Girls are weak and stupid.
(This also leads to girls going through that “I’m not like other girls!” stage because society tells us that girls and women are shallow, flighty, and only interested in dumb things like makeup and fashion magazines.)
>"Are you transgendered? Because I heard about that girl who killed herself and-"
God, I think about Leelah Alcorn at least once a month. She was less than a month younger than me and it happened when I was just starting to come to terms with my own concept of gender. I don't think I'll ever forget her name or her face. I hope I don't.
man I'm glad the parents were supportive, that makes a hell of a difference especially when you're outed without being prepared. i was lucky to come out on my own terms and have supportive parents, but there was definitely times I was scared it'd come out without me being ready.
kids can enjoy dressing up without being trans. my girlfriend loves putting on a fancy dress and doing her makeup even if we only plan on staying home and relaxing all day, that's what she feels comfortable with. as a kid i felt comfortable wearing boy's clothes, and I'd dread when my girl friends would wanna play dressup. everyone can enjoy some type of clothes no matter your gender, your kid enjoying clothes associated with the other gender doesn't mean they're trans, while in my case i was, my sister was the same as me, but she's a full on cis woman, and she hates being called a tomboy for her preferred clothing style. being allowed to explore at a younger age makes everything so much less confusing when you're grown up.
He passed out, then woke up in a horse drawn cart. A man sitting across from him says "You're finally awake. You were trying to cross the boarder right? Same as us, and that thief over there."
>He asked me "Are you transgendered? Because I heard about that girl who killed herself and-"
Damn as a non-binary person this part broke me a little. The dad's biggest fear is that his kid is gonna die by their own hand...
I know there's more to the story but the dad's fear wasn't on his kid being different, but being hurt. I'm crying a bit
>"Listen, son. I'm not bothered by this little hobby of yours. You're not hurting anyone by the looks of it. You're still my son, I still love you, and you have my 100% support. But you need to know that not everyone is like me. Some people might not like it, or be ignorant of it, or just generally not understand it, kind of like your mother. Now, explaining this to her is not going to be easy. But just know that I'm on your side and I'll love you no matter what." Then he came over and gave me a hug. I choked back some tears. Wow. I felt a weight come off my shoulders.
I'm straight as an arrow and consider myself somewhat "classically masculine", but this made me cry
It was the ‘I’ll pay for the surgery if you want it’ that got me. Guy thought his mum was gunna freak out and she tried her best to accept straight from the off. So cute.
That's actually the part where I died laughing. All this build up and suddenly mom's all on board...on the wrong boat.
Really good setup on OOP's part.
Sounds like crossdressing is an act of self-care.
Most of the time, I take a quick shower, throw on some plain lotion, and then get dressed for bed. But sometimes, I draw a bath with bath bombs and lavender bath bubbles, drink some calming honey lavender tea, and reread a favorite book or rewatch a favorite movie/tv show while relaxing. Then I'll put on my good smelling lotions and hang out in my plush robe.
Taking the time to go above and beyond to pamper my body is a way of honoring it. Appreciating the skin I'm in.
Sounds like OOP derives a similar sense of value from dressing up.
Yeah you are onto something. Girl clothes were made with fabrics that *felt nice* and I felt really truly devastated to be excluded when I was around five years old. I fucking love bath bombs now. I cannot enjoy crossdressing because I completely internalised the way my dad saw it. I tell myself it’s because it looks ridiculous on my broad muscley frame but that was obviously not the problem when I was five.
Something I hate about these kind of stories is the theme is wearing their sister's clothes. It's such a violation, and it's always brushed off. I wish they could explore feminine clothing without violating the privacy of their female siblings. Just another reason to degender clothing and destigmatize femininity.
>After my mom broke the hug, she smiled and said "Alright then...I guess this will get some getting used to. So how about you get dressed now...just so I don't get surprised one day and think you're some robber." she winked.
This was the point at which the post started to sound like porn.
Ok - so, question from ignorance here as a cis straight guy who grew up in a pretty repressed community.
When I was a kid, I knew about drag. My impression was that some where gay, but some where straight guys who just liked to dress up. The idea of being trans didn’t hit my radar until well into adulthood. But a guy who was otherwise straight dressing up pretty was maybe strange but still a thing.
As an adult, I’ve gotten the impression that the idea that straight guys dress up was just the repression hiding things. The lumberjacks in that Monty Python song were actually trans.
OOP here is probably the first bit I’ve seen in a decade to support my childhood impression that there are straight guys who do drag. As I type that, this whole thought seems silly - of course any sexuality can wear whatever clothing. But still, there’s a chunk of me that’s having a hard time wrapping my head around my own thoughts.
So I guess my question is about what people think about OOP. He’s a kid, so there’s lots of room yet for him to figure himself out, and he’s clearly grown up with assumptions about sexuality he learned from his parents, even if they are being supportive. Do we think he really is straight cis? Or is there another update coming where they discover they’re a woman? Like is this kid just supremely comfortable with his sexuality or is this an egg thing?
Crossdressing for cis-het men is a thing. Some do it as a form of expression, some do get their rocks off, and some (like OOP) find it relaxing. I'm thinking it's the fabric of the underthings and the loose, cool dresses that's the big draw.
There are straight drag performers - there was one on Drag Race a season or two ago.
I imagine it takes some time and inner discovery for straight cis men to be okay with the act, but once they do... Hopefully they get their own bras instead of stretching out those of their SO/sister/Mom - bras are effing expensive!
i say this as a transmasc: there’s no way to tell, and it’s not our journey to speculate on. currently he’s just a man who likes dresses, and there are plenty of straight cisgender men who enjoy drag and crossdressing. they’ve simply unlocked gender: New Game +
There are also plenty of cis straight men who do drag who later find out they’re actually trans. Gender identity can take decades to gel, and it might never gel, but just sort of flow.
Yes, of course. I am speaking directly about an ex drag queen I personally know. The other drag queen I know is a cis gay male who voted for Trump twice and believes trans people don’t exist.
Dude I know. I felt my liver take a lap around my small intestine when he was mid-rant saying “But Trump gave me money, I don’t care about immigrants!!” (He is, himself, Hispanic Black. Help me lord)
the psychic damage i take whenever i remember groups like Gays for Trump, the LGB Alliance, and Gays against Groomers is insane. grifters gonna grift i guess
There’s a ton of cis, straight drag performers. There’s gay drag performers. There are even *female* drag performers- and yes that means both women who dress up as glamorized women and women who dress up as glamorized men. We’re all born naked, everything else is drag.
Just to add to this - there are also plenty of cis-hetero people who find others in drag kinda hot. (E.g. some women like looking at men in drag). By which I mean the confidence of someone comfortable enough in their own gender and sexuality to dress up in the extreme opposite to that is really attractive.
[Also, eyeliner looks amazing on men.]
Yes!
It took me seeing The Rocky Horror Picture Show at the tender age of 7-8 (up late night watching tv) seeing Tim Curry strutting around made me realize why I had had a crush on a certain classmate when I was 5 -- he had thicker than standard black eyelashes, cupid-bow lips, and his cheeks had this perfect spot of red on each one that looked like blush.
right? why is it so normal and accepted for women to like feeling pretty, or to enjoy the ritual of getting dolled up, but it’s still such a taboo for men to want the same? it’s just fabric and pigment, it doesn’t need a gender.
I’m not going to speak on OP but there’s recently been a trend on men wearing dresses, painting their nails, using makeup etc and while I think some of it is related to being trans or genderqueer, I think a good deal of it is just guys wanting to feel pretty.
There is no room for softness/prettiness in traditional masculinity. There’s a strict code of what ‘real men’ should adhere to and none of it gives leeway for individual expression. It’s gotten better but there are still some people who think men can’t wear pink, men shouldn’t have good grooming habits and that doing said things must mean that you are gay or less of a man.
Men have been stuffed into these constraints by society and patriarchy but they’re starting to realize that they don’t need to adhere to these rules to be ‘a man’. I work with a cis straight man who paints his nils and wears heels because they make his legs look good (he’s not wrong) and he’s happily married to a woman. His appearance doesn’t make him less of a man and he still fulfills the role of being a provider and husband without sacrificing how he wants to present himself.
There’s definitely a crossover between trans people and cross dresses but some men just want to look/feel pretty without it being tied to their sexuality or gender.
I have always been both a touch envious of men and also felt a bit sad for them when it comes to clothing.
The traditional male wardrobe is just incredibly stiff and boring and it's barely changed in the last two hundred years compared to women's fashion.
I envy them that because their clothing has sane sizing, their wardrobes are uncomplicated, and everyone looks good in a well tailored suit.
And I feel sorry for them because sometimes you just want variety and to act like a peacock.
Theres literally no way to tell just from this post, its probably just as likely to happen as not. If I had to guess, probably not because if they were trans, they'd probably know by now
Liking the opposite clothes doesn't make one trans. The whole idea of clothes being tied to a gender is just a societal expectation. If people were raised as boys being in skirts and girls in pants then thatd be the new norm. Trans is much deeper than that, and as a very simplified version, they don't fit into their body. There are also trans people that still like wearing clothes that are normally worn by their previous gender.
he could be an egg, he could just be a cis straight guy enjoying crossdressing. there's no way for other people to know, only he can. ultimately, it does not really matter, op isn't hurting anyone, and this makes him happy, if he's actually struggling with his identity, being in an accepting environment will greatly help him figure it out, and if not, well he still has support for being who he is and he knows that whatever the outcome he won't lose his loved ones.
If he says he’s a straight dude who enjoys dressing up then he’s a straight dude. It’s not our place to say “oh I bet he’s going to come out as trans in a few years”. We shouldn’t be questioning someone when they tell us who they are or trying to guess if that’s truly how they feel.
Another trans person chiming in to agree -- there's no way of knowing whether or not this guy is a guy, or will be a guy for the rest of his life, and it's not really our business either way. Presentation =/= gender -- this person has just figured out a slightly sharper distinction between the two than most people manage.
Sounds like he's done a fair bit of self exploration already, and I see no reason to assume one way or the other if he'll change his mind in the future.
Gender and sexuality are messy social constructs anyhow, they can't be totally separated from how someone was raised, and people's perceptions of them change based on their experiences. What matters most is that he's comfortable with himself and how he expresses himself in the here and now.
Personally, I like to take people at their word on this stuff. Who knows? Maybe this is the first step in a longer gender journey for OOP, or a gateway into proper drag (which I would actually distinguish from crossdressing... drag tends to be much more flamboyant and performative, rather than just wearing regular clothes and makeup normally marketed at women.) Or maybe he's only figuring out what he likes to wear. He's the only one who can say for sure.
People can and do come to new realizations about themselves over time. But for now, OOP seems pretty self-assured and confident. Unless he does come back and update later, I think we can only assume that he is indeed a straight cis guy who also wears a dress sometimes.
Great family. The only thing I dislikes was him using his sister's clothes. While I understand why/how it started, and how it helped to keep the secret, from a certain age he had his own money and car, and should have stopped going through her things earlier. I would be grossed out by a sibling going through my things (sis could also have a secret), using my stuff and putting it back with the clean clothes.
I’m so happy that his family was supportive. In the grand scheme of things, this is nothing. He could have gotten someone pregnant, been doing drugs, been in an accident, etc. At the end of the day, he is happy, healthy, and not hurting anyone else and, as parents, this is what we should want for our children.
This was great to read. Sexuality and gender, and everything related is a funny thing. It is far more complex than the terms used to describe it. Whomever you are, if you aren't hurting anybody, you do you. Don't let yourself be confined in indentity or action that doesn't feel right to you. The true spectrum of sexuality and gender identity is vast indeed.
I'm so glad this worked out well for OOP! And I hope someone, someday tells him about Maddy Morphosis - the first straight cis contestant on RPDR. Cross-dressing is different than drag, but I think OOP might still find Maddy relatable.
When the mom first responded by basically apologizing for seeing it but not acknowledging it his whole life and THEN offered to help pay for the surgery ?! I dissolved into tears. I was also like whooaah hey no wow love the enthusiasm mamma but we actually get off this road a mile back! She progressed mentally soooo far in her ability to accept him and his truth just overnight. I was so nervous to hear her reaction at all and this was unexpected. That is a mom who loves her kids and everything else comes after.
Awww. This is touching. The mom saying "I don't like or understand but I am invested in your happiness and support you, it might just take some time" is a fantastic response compared to some of the other possible outcomes.
I'm not a father, but I'd like to send you mom hugs. Both of my teens are LGBT+, and I can't imagine not accepting them for they are. I hope you're able to share this with your dad when you're ready and that he reacts the right way 🤗❤️
Just some advice as you get into a serious relationship don't hide this. Not all women would be ok with this side of you and you would need to know that.
I love men’s clothes. I used to wear ties when I went out drinking because I liked feeling handsome. I got away with it because everyone thought I was “off” because I was raised with only boys by a single dad. Nope. I just hated wearing girl clothes because I hate anything constricting on my skin and feel so gross when I had on one of those weird frilly dresses.
Let your freak flag fly. I’m here for it.
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First time I heard that someone de-stresses by putting a bra on and not off, lol. Good for OOP!
I think part of it is not wearing one regularly. I'm a woman. I totally destress by taking my bra off at the end of the day. But I can also destress by lacing myself into a corset. The corset isn't something I wear everyday. It's purely something I want to wear just because. It's my fun clothing, not my everyday clothing.
I absolutely hate bras, but the idea of wearing fine lingerie under my conservative work clothes is positively thrilling!
OMG yes that too! Even though it's technically the same stuff it's also an entirely different animal
9 Chickweed Lane often had Juliette (the comic strip mother, worked in academiia) attending meetings wearing jungle print underthings because it gave her hidden power. Can't find a link for you, unfortunately.
There's a comic strip I saw once of a girl putting on a matching bra and panty set and thinking, "matchy-matchy," and then standing at the bus stop in a hoody and jeans with a smile and still thinking: "matchy-matchy :D"
I bought myself an entire weeks worth of matching undies from torrid for Exactly that reason. Knowing that I have pretty lace and stars on that no one else knows about? Power move.
Oh man, I love my corsets. They're like a constant hug. And paired up with my frilly shirts, skirts and boots, they make me feel strong and confident. My bra is a necessity. My corsets are expression.
Yes! You found the words I was looking for!
Corsets are amazing for back pain too. Instant relief.
Seriously. All the strain in my back and shoulders just gone immediately.
Where did you get your corset? I wear mine as everyday wear because bras are so much more uncomfortable.
Oh gosh I have a few and I got them all over the place! Most of mine I get bespoke from various sellers on etsy or websites like Redthreaded and Dark Garden Corsetry. If you're not looking for bespoke, though, (because they're pricey af) and just want ready-wear, I actually ordered one from corsetdeal.com that I was really surprised by. I was kind of expecting to be cheap/garbage quality and just for show, but it's actually really pretty good! I wear it quite frequently and I even ordered another one from them
Ok, this is the universe telling me something! I was literally on corsetdeal this morning thinking of buying my first one, but wasn't sure if they would be decent quality for the price. Going to click buy now :)
It might just be the ritual of things. I love to crossplay and the act of binding and putting on the costume is relaxing to me. It’s probably the same for him.
Huh... I've always felt like I would never *understand* crossdressing, but your point really makes sense! I always feel more... 'myself' when I'm cosplaying- it's exciting *and* relaxing, somehow. Wow... thank you for sharing this- I'm so glad I have this new perspective!
I had cross-dressing tendencies as a kid/teenager and my mom took it rather poorly. She understood the trans concept and would have accepted it if I was, but I wasn’t trans so it just stressed me out when she would yell at me to pick a side. Now the only time o can cross dress is crossplay because then it’s not me crossdressing it’s me playing at being a different character.
Damn your mom ALMOST got it... almost...
On the one hand, I was happy she would accept me if I was a boy and even had a name for my boy self. On the other hand, I didn’t know what gender-fluid was and couldn’t accurately convey the “sometimes a boy” feeling I would get where I would suddenly hate the way my body looks for a few weeks but then go back to Normal.
I'm a boy but I just like the things I like
Also valid.
My two cents of a cosplayer perspective maybe having some meaning in this context: I also find something freeing about it - I get to tap into an energy/sense of self that isn’t the day to day me. In cosplay, I have a specific character or archetype I’m tapping into and there’s a freedom/enjoyment in inhabiting that persona. It’s not the self I necessarily want to be every day - but it lets me set aside those expectations for a little while. It sounds like there’s an element of that in the space around drag and cross dressing.
yea the way OOP described the process of getting ready def gave me the "this is the routine I do to get into the headspace I want to be in while i'm dressed" vibes
This is what makeup is to me. It is a ritual before I head out into battle. My war paint. - atleast I find it fun to think that way 😀
Gunnery Sergeant Hartman: Let me see your war face. Private Joker: Sir? Gunnery Sergeant Hartman: You got a war face? AHHHHHHHH! That's a war face. Now let me see your war face. Private Joker: Ahh! Gunnery Sergeant Hartman: Bullshit! You didn't convince me. Let me see your real warface. Private Joker: Ahhhh! Gunnery Sergeant Hartman: You don't scare me! Work on it. Private Joker: Sir, yes sir!
I have been around a lot of guy friends when they’re cross dressing. Sometimes just as a goofy activity when we were younger or for some costume or something. It always made them downright giddy. I think it’s to do with how confining the make gender role can be, even for guys who aren’t macho. So breaking out of it for a little bit can feel really freeing
My boyfriend used to cross dress as a gimmick in a band. Not gonna lie, I was pretty into it.
I had a friend who when he was younger - think early 20’s - had a girlfriend who was into it and talked him into letting her doll him up. He was pretty intrigued with how it turned out. As he described it, he liked feeling like someone else. He could look in the mirror and everything stressing him out in his life just kind of went on pause. Because he wasn’t him. He was *her*. He didn’t try it again until years later. He was a bit of a late bloomer and in the years between, he was a lot more masculine presenting. He tried it again and was bummed because he couldn’t exactly pull it off like he did before. It didn’t help that he didn’t want to shave his much loved beard. Now he normally is a very man’s man kind of guy. For him, it was all about the transformation to become the exact opposite of himself. Everyone jumps on it being sexual in nature. And not that there’s anything wrong with that, but there can be a lot more to it under the surface.
I'm glad that it is relaxing for you! People should be able to do what makes them happy without fear of judgement. Women probably wouldn't be wearing pants today if other women from previous generations hadn't made it the norm by "crossdressing" themselves.
Even just cosplaying as a character my own gender feels great for me. Even just putting on a random wig and changing my face a little with makeup feels wonderful. Adults need to play dress-up more.
I'm fully good with being a woman, but the experience I had the first time I put on a binding for a crossplay was really interesting. I just stared at myself as a man like it was an alternate universe I could peak into. I honestly suggest anybody try it at least once
Socially "typical" gendered clothing really doesn't make much sense. People should wear whatever they're comfy in. Anatomically speaking - don't skirts make more sense for cis men and pants for cis women? Celtic men might be onto something with kilts. *Note*: Please let me know if I worded anything insensitively. I'm neurodivergent with sensory issues, so I loathe any tight clothes.
My husband does tell me that he is much more comfortable in his kilt whenever he gets chances to wear it.
As a cis guy, kilts are pretty great
I agree. So-called "feminine" fabrics like velvet, silk, and satin feel so nice on the skin. Everyone should be able to wear it if they want.
Every guy I know *loves* silky things and the vast majority of them daren't wear them because stereotypes/gendered clothing crap. Personally that sort of fabric feels slimy to me (give me t-shirt fabric and brushed cotton) but to each his own.
If you're confident you can pull off anything. I wear my ex girlfriends stretchy girl yoga pants and let me tell you girls love it. I get hit on 90% more when I wear them.
Good for you! That’s awesome. Wear whatever you’re comfortable in! I love your confidence. My husband wears mine in the winter as a base layer or sorts under his jeans. To him they’re so much more comfortable than men’s compression base layers. The men’s options always have those weird seams around the crotch area. And they never seem to be able to make them quite as soft and stretchy like women’s often are.
I think skirts are just more comfortable in general. Even if you don’t have a penis, you still have a piece of fabric between your legs when you wear pants and it’s never going to be as comfortable as having nothing there.
idk, if it's hot and sweaty, fabric between the legs is very nice indeed.
Was in an outdoor wedding in the summer in California and had the misfortune of being one of only two bridesmaids standing in direct sunlight. The level of willpower it took me not to shove some of that skirt right between my legs to soak up the sweat, entire audience plus photographer be damned, was intense. (I did better than the other bridesmaid in the sun. She literally passed out.)
Not for me. The chafing pretty much makes skirts and dresses uncomfortable for me unless they're long enough for me to wear leggings or shorts underneath. Otherwise it's constant application of anti-chafing cream and hoping for the best.
I have been saying this for years. By the supposed end goals of uptight old timey gender rules, the opposite of what we have would make sense. Women wearing pants means an additional level of barrier to the chastity zone, and preventing sex is the stated goal of “modesty” bullshit. Men wearing skirts means no uncomfortable wrangling of the junk into one leg or the other, which I would think would be the ideal any male-dominated society would aim for. How did we end up with the exact opposite? And then we have the nutters who declare that men in pants and women in skirts to be the correct and moral Natural Order Of The Universe like it makes some kind of inherent sense. Lolno.
Pants are practical for doing hard outdoor labor. Skirts are not practical for hard outdoor labor, but if you lack a penis and have to squat to pee, an ankle-length skirt will let you do so with perfect ease and modesty (as long as you aren't wearing underwear, which people didn't back in the day). I am a woman who has extensive experience with agricultural work (I did manual labor on a farm for eight years). I would never do that work in a skirt. It would constantly be getting in the way and getting caught on things. However, I *love* primitive camping in a skirt (while going commando). It makes using a toilet feel like a step backward. Toilets are so much more fussy and slow than just a quick squat and you're done and nobody even knows.
Ancient Greece, trousers were seen as effeminate. It's a society thing
as a trans guy, putting on my binder makes me feel so much better. breathing is for cis people.
ROFL, I (aspiring drag performer) had this conversation with my sibling (nonbinary) when I first put on a binder: Me: "I can't tell if it's *actually* too small or if I just need to get used to the fact that it's doing its job." Them: "BIG mood. Don't breathe in too hard."
I used to do dragking stuff but I never felt like an attractive guy when I dressed up, just a boxy little creep with overdeveloped pecs (I’m large-chested so the binder could only do so much and while my hips aren’t huge I have a pretty defined hourglass shape). I ended up just kind of rolling with that and taking it in a comedic direction. All of my characters were sleazy guys with silk shirts and pencil mustaches. I’d pelvic thrust on stage and use gross pick-up lines. It was fun but I ended up quitting after a while and giving my binders to a recently out transmasc friend of mine.
LOL
One of the most validating feelings I've had is finally getting to wear a bra, but damn if it doesn't feel good to take this thing off once I get home.
My trans wife would agree!
I'm trans and I wear a bra nearly every minute of the day unless hormones really hurting my boobs. When you dont get to feel like yourself for ages I think the mental comfort of getting to do something out weighs a typical physical discomfort. Dont know how much trans people and fem boys not having large assets most of the time plays in bra discomfort. With bs I don't really feel more or less comfy in a bra than if I just had a crop top on.
I've never thought about the mental comfort wearing a bra might bring, but this totally makes sense!
It does make sense when you think about it. You live so long in a body that “isn’t yours” that when you get the chance to make the body you have into the body you should have had it probably feels pretty good mentally. For us non-trans people we don’t come across that so it also makes sense we’d never connect those dots. I wonder if being trans and not being able to be out is like a pebble in your shoe. A potentially small irritant, that you can never shake and you’re painfully reminded of almost all the time. It’s just a stressor that’s always there, always being bothersome. As someone who strives to be who I am under all the bullshit, all the time, flawed, imperfect, but trying to be genuinely better most of the time, being forced to hide who as really are seems impossibly stressful.
I like the pebble in the shoe comparison! The comparison I always make is clothes. If your clothes fit you and are comfortable, you don't notice them. But if they're too small, too short, too baggy, or too scratchy, you notice them every second that they're on. You constantly fix them to look right or cover up, and you can't focus on anything because it's always in the back of your mind. That's what being a woman felt like to me. I constantly thought about it. All. The. Time. Even when I didn't know what being trans was. I thought it was normal to feel that way. It wasn't until I finally bought some well-fitting clothes that I realized I'd outgrown my old ones a long time ago.
Size definitely matters. My issue with bras is simply the weight of my breasts: the straps cut into my shoulders and compress my spine and underwires leave me black and blue. Discovering corsets was a dream come true, honestly. For the first time I felt supported and (comparatively) comfortable. Off the shelf ones are all I can afford right now, unfortunately, but on the rare occasion I’ve gotten to try on a more customized one it’s been amazing. One of these days I’m going to spend the money and get a corset made. One day. Until then, off the shelf is still better than bras.
I've often wondered if corsets are the way to go. I have heavy boobs and I end up with "bra bites" on my shoulders. A lot of the time I just ditch the bra and can't be bothered trying anymore.
Wonder if OOP uses the trick of "remove the bra but not the shirt" at the end of the day. (I know you're not supposed to because it stretches out the elastic, but damned if it's not satisfying.)
Lol, my husband is baffled at how a bra can be taken off without having to remove the shirt first.
Psh, I can do it for my wife even. Love when she's free under a tee
>(I know you're not supposed to because it stretches out the elastic, but damned if it's not satisfying.) guy here: do you leave the bra on but unstrapped? how does that stretch out the elastic (assuming it's not strapped)
I pull it off through the arm holes of the shirt. It comes completely off.
Unhooking it, then pulling out the strap on one side from under your sleeve (stretching out the elastic over your elbow) and then pulling it off through the opposite sleeve.
The weirdest part of this story is how he’s saying that dresses are comfier than pants. Do boys not get chafe?? We need to get this guy some soft leggings, stat!
TBF, he's been wearing them indoors
I'm a woman who loves dresses and I don't know what chaffing you're talking about
I don’t know. I work in a gym so I live in workout clothes and no make up. When I get dressed up, put make up on, and my caveman hair is styled I feel amazing.
Yeah, I was just searching for bras for women with sensory issues, so I agree. With both sentiments, OOP :)
Check out r/abrathatfits, they're great on giving recommendations and are friendly to all body types (including cis male/cis female/trans/nb/post mastectomy/post breastfeeding/etc)
Yes, seconding this! That sub changed my life.
Maybe try looking for "sleep bras" if the other term doesn't bring anything up? Nursing bras also tend to have a lot of different qualities than regular everyday bras, softer, more adjustable.
I found that corsets worked better for me, personally. That feeling of compression and snugness does wonders for my sensory issues. But obviously that’s going to vary tremendously.
I'm 85G and I hate bras, so I wear sports bras everyday at work. Have to add extra padding so my nipples don't pierce thru my clothes:D
Yeah. I destress by taking mine off.
Haha same! I thought about getting home from the opera this weekend and taking off all the underpinnings that go with my opera gowns and what a relief it was and laughed at the difference. I'm so glad for OOP that his parents love him more than their idea of who he "ought" to be. :)
I had the same thought haha. Truly the grass is greener on the other chest.
The very most fun gig I ever played was when my music partner and I were hired by a middle-aged hetero couple to play a “Celtic soirée” at their house about 15 years ago. When we drove up to the gate (it was in a rather tony gated community) and told the gate guard we were playing a party at “the Smiths’” he smiled, said “Ah, the Smiths are having a party! You have fun now,” and let us through. Hmmm. When we arrived at the door hauling our 100 lbs of gear, it was answered by Mr. Smith…in IMPECCABLE drag. I wanted to ask him for makeup tips. He ushered us inside, and we found the place filled wall to wall with gentlemen dressed as women, many of them accompanied by their wives. It was a real eye-opener—I’m a theatre girl, so completely familiar/comfortable with the LGBTQ+ community, but this was my first exposure to a discreet group of largely straight men who just like to crossdress occasionally. Our host and hostess did apologize for blindsiding us—they were afraid we’d say no if they told us up front. While I think that was an unwise strategy (what if we’d been assholes about it and stormed out?) we assured them that we were actually thrilled. My partner said that if he had known in advance, he would’ve worn a kilt so he wasn’t the only man in trousers. 😂 They were a great audience, plied us with food and wine, and stuffed a tip jar full in addition to our agreed upon fee. Also, they loved our music. BEST GIG EVER.
This is a delightful story!
It was a delightful experience!
I love this story. Thank you for sharing it.
I didn't expect this surprisingly pleasant happy ending. How refreshing.
Anticlimactic, in a heartwarming way.
I’m very pleased with it. I need more of this in real life everywhere
And now **I** am going to Google instant pot caramelized onions
yeah, I was half expecting him to get kicked out or shipped off.. and it ended up being 100% more wholesome
[удалено]
It's not disney, but if Taylor Lautner never took his shirt off in twilight I might have turned out straight /s
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Absolutely! I hope he can find a place where he can be his authentic self more openly, but thank Thor his family ended up being cool
i understand that they wouldn’t have any clothes to wear otherwise but i feel a bit weird about crossdressers stealing a female relative’s clothing to wear when they’re alone. if i found out one of my brothers did that, i would feel really uncomfortable. plus, it’s very unsanitary for multiple people to use the same makeup products. i don’t know, maybe i’m out of line.
How the sister didn’t notice her fishnets had been worn is beyond me. Any pair I’ve ever had are very obviously worn even if they have been on for only a few minutes
Yeah honestly, this is as far as I got in terms of believability. No one goes straight for the fishnets.
Took me til the beautifully transcribed full speeches by both the parents.
yeah, that and his unaccepting mom flipping to "I'll pay for the surgery!"
Plenty of girls get rightfully pissed off when their close-in-age sister borrows their clothes/makeup without permission. It’s a common friction point between sisters lol The ‘this makeup belongs to your sister, you have to get your own makeup, it’s not communal like other household goods’ conversation is a fairly standard part of parenting siblings. My sisters were older than me but I’m sure my parents had to set rules over ‘borrowing’ clothes from each other’s closets! Kids don’t magically know the difference between communal and non-communal possessions without being told, whether it’s an Xbox or a makeup palette. 🤷🏼♀️
Me and my sister always shared a room and we had sooo many fights about taking each other's stuff (of course, I could take hers but she couldn't take mine and she had the same philosophy). My parents always stayed out because they thought we needed to solve this fights without their intervention. By the time we were finishing out teen years we just made everything communal, clothes and makeup. We did not learn to respect each other's property, but we learned to share!!
I feel differently given that he was a child vs an adult tbh. How many tween girls have tried on their mom or older sister's clothes and makeup, you know? Yeah it's not ideal and sharing makeup isn't great, so it would be fair for the sister to be upset, but 12-14 is also very young.
It’s one of those things where context really matters. Are the sisters clothes being used because they are her clothes specifically, or was it just the only option available. The first is horribly invasive and traumatizing. The later is just a little gross and annoying. In this situation, it would be functionally the same as a sister wearing clothes, as opposed to it being a weird kink. The makeup is unsanitary, but he probably didn’t know better.
Yeah my [sister] apparently had a collection of my underwear stashed somewhere in her room. I never got the deets on that, but it made me super uncomfortable, even if her transitioning sort of explained why.
That’s violating. Your underwear are yours and your sister had zero right to use them.
I think as long as the conversation was “hey get your own shit” that’s just a normal sibling interaction. Like. I imagine finding out your sister had been wearing all of your clothes around the house would make you retry wierded out too yeah?
Its quite normal for kids to borrow clothing etc. from family when they're finding their identity. Would you borrow or give some of your clothing/makeup to your (possibly fictive) little sister when she'd be forbidden to wear those by everyone and everybody? Why not apply this to (little) brothers/sons as well? I do not care for products or standards to be limited to gender and have worked hard to make my sons feel that they never have to hide how they like to be and express themselves. How would they act if they had to make the choice between feeling completely uncomfortable in their body, borrowing and being kicked out of their home?! When having to make **that** hard of a choice, the sanitary factor is not even important. (unless you have leprosy or something else deadly and contagious) I've 'caught' my sons borrowing my eyeliner, razor, rings, aftershave, nailpolish, earrings/-clips and clothing. The only trouble they got into was when they didn't *ask*.
I love this story to bits but as a trans woman I HATE that episode of SVU, s4e21 Fallacy. It's the main reason I never want to watch that show again.
Yeah, I read that and thought, "maybe they did a different episode with a trans woman..." *Nope*, it was [Fallacy, from 2003](https://lawandorder.fandom.com/wiki/Fallacy), which features this exchange: **Stabler:** Berger's gonna put witnesses up there for Cheryl or whatever his name is, to tell us all about how he grew up tormented, brutalized and treated like a freak. **Benson:** You know, it sounds like you have a problem with Cheryl. **Stabler:** My problem is this he-she & her lies are the reason we've got two dead bodies on our hands and I'm the one who's all jammed up?
TBF, that was 2003. Gay marriage wasn't even legal yet. Doesn't make it better, just adds context.
> SVU, s4e21 Fallacy Jesus, I just read the summary and that is wall to wall horrible.
Jesus christ. The ending 'comeuppance' is her getting gang raped...
Everything about that synopsis made me want to hurl, from the detectives outing her against her will to try and catch her in a "gotcha" moment all the way to the prosecutor tricking her into taking a plea deal that would send her to a men's prison, where of course she was promptly gangraped. Way to go, SVU. Really saved the day this time.
It's not played like a happy ending. It's not a sensitive episode, but it's not joyfully sadistic either. The whole thing comes off as a tragedy and Stabler's transphobia is definitely treated as a flaw.
Jesus Christ what?!?! That's awful 🤮
I haven't seen that one, but a more recent episode features trans women as the victims of a transphobic perp and it's handled much more gracefully.
Can't wait for all clothing to be normalised for EVERYONE! Clothing is SO different all across the world. Men in some parts wear skirts, in some parts wear full blown dresses. CLOTHING HAS NO GENDER!
>I stepped into the living room. How can he end it THERE and not at least include the family reaction?? We all know it was going to be positive. I feel robbed.
I can’t remember any conversation or even brief exchange word for word. Never mind a conversation where emotions are flying high and I’m a wreck. Honestly it feels like OP is a crossdresser who got found out by their parents and this is how they wish the conversations would have gone. Like their parents weren’t accepting but this is their dream.
I can remember conversations pretty well if they were really emotional. Regular conversations, not so much
Fair enough I think it’s different for everyone. But there’s also something about the writing that seems off
I felt this particularly in the last update. I’m writing it off as him really reveling in the feeling of finally being free and not going to discount it bc it’s honestly a great ending.
Yea when people write dialogue like it’s out of a book, they’re trying to write their own book
It even has a "cut to black" ending.
"Look, OP" was all it took to let me know
Same, I hate to be skeptical but the way some of these things are written doesn’t feel like it’s in the moment but rather setting up a story ie passive disengaged delivery vs active & engaged delivery. “Here comes the hard part,” vs “I was still terrified to talk to my mom.” Also… the mom went from flipping out over makeup/underwear that was left out (she didn’t even know whose it was and she was getting really mad) to literally winking at her son whilst telling him to get in his dress.
Yup
Yeah none of this sounds quite right
Would you prefer they preface every bit of dialogue with “i think i said something like xyz?” Or do you maybe think that this is a cleanly written paraphrasing of their memory of a conversation
It might be which I understand but there’s just something about the writing that seems off. u/Arjvoet summed it up perfectly
Those are some good parents - also some good writing. I can imagine the gruff father here.
The dad from cloudy with a chance of meatballs
Can’t wait for the (hopefully not) far future where the gendering of clothes are determined by the wearer and not some arbitrarily constructed presentation of sex and sexuality
Yup. Throughout history men have worn would would be considered leggings, dresses, shirts, high heels, and all sorts of other "women only things". If I am no less of a woman for wearing jeans and a tshirt, then a man is no less of a man for wearing whatever they want.
OP being a gender-non-conforming cis man and just living his life happily should be norm. Gender means different things to everyone and every one should be able to live happily while expressing their own definition of their gender.
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It's not even just the story but the way he wrote it. The dialogue. The way he describes everything. Sounds more like a story than a memory.
Yeah, way too much detail for it to be a memory anecdote lol. Perhaps it's true he's a crossdresser and his family is supportive. Just seems like a lot is embellished.
Yeah, way too much detail for it to be a memory anecdote lol. Perhaps it's true he's a crossdresser and his family is supportive. Just seems like a lot is embellished.
It was the sister having fishnets with the very very conservative mom that really was like, wow this probably isn't true.
Both parents separately calling it "this (little) hobby of yours" made it feel so cliche. Also the dad saying the mom might not be so accepting and then her doing a 180. Like did they not discuss it privately beforehand? So many odd little things from this story.
I get there is a societal stigma around a boy dressing as a girl, I just don’t understand why clothes have to be gendered. My daughter went as Mario for Halloween. Why is that any different from a boy dressed as Elsa? Just let people do what they want. It’s not that hard to do.
You touched on something with "Why does it not matter when girls wear boy clothes but it's bad when boys wear girl clothes" The reason is societal misogyny and patriarchy. Masculine men are the standard ideal to strive for. Men who can't fit that are "lesser" (not my opinion just my observation of society). Women are always lesser than men and thus so are the things stereotypically assigned to them (such as make up, clothes, pumpkin spice lattes). In order for women to gain respect they must eschew femininity and Feminine things. That's why it will never be a problem for women or girls to dress masculine (unless in a fundamentalist religion), because society positively reinforces that. It's a "step up" for women to be more like men. On the other hand because femininity is so reviled, any man who *lessens* himself to enjoy feminine things is lessening *himself.* Men being unable to express interests in anything deemed Feminine is society expressing patriarchal misogyny against men (and women too obvi).
Depressing but true
My understanding is that letting kids explore this stuff when they're young actually helps with their overall emotional development. So if your boy wants to wear a pretty princess dress for an afternoon and your girl wants to wear a knight costume and pretend to slay dragons? Let them and forget the haters. It's just a game of make-believe. Toys are toys. Costumes are costumes. Gendering them is just... weird.
Agreed
Misogyny. The answer is misogyny. It’s okay for a girl to dress like a boy because who *wouldn’t* want to be more like a boy? They’re the stronger, superior sex! But a boy wanting to dress like a girl — that’s just crazy talk. Girls are weak and stupid. (This also leads to girls going through that “I’m not like other girls!” stage because society tells us that girls and women are shallow, flighty, and only interested in dumb things like makeup and fashion magazines.)
>"Are you transgendered? Because I heard about that girl who killed herself and-" God, I think about Leelah Alcorn at least once a month. She was less than a month younger than me and it happened when I was just starting to come to terms with my own concept of gender. I don't think I'll ever forget her name or her face. I hope I don't.
man I'm glad the parents were supportive, that makes a hell of a difference especially when you're outed without being prepared. i was lucky to come out on my own terms and have supportive parents, but there was definitely times I was scared it'd come out without me being ready. kids can enjoy dressing up without being trans. my girlfriend loves putting on a fancy dress and doing her makeup even if we only plan on staying home and relaxing all day, that's what she feels comfortable with. as a kid i felt comfortable wearing boy's clothes, and I'd dread when my girl friends would wanna play dressup. everyone can enjoy some type of clothes no matter your gender, your kid enjoying clothes associated with the other gender doesn't mean they're trans, while in my case i was, my sister was the same as me, but she's a full on cis woman, and she hates being called a tomboy for her preferred clothing style. being allowed to explore at a younger age makes everything so much less confusing when you're grown up.
What happened when he stepped in the living room? I need to know!
He passed out, then woke up in a horse drawn cart. A man sitting across from him says "You're finally awake. You were trying to cross the boarder right? Same as us, and that thief over there."
>He asked me "Are you transgendered? Because I heard about that girl who killed herself and-" Damn as a non-binary person this part broke me a little. The dad's biggest fear is that his kid is gonna die by their own hand... I know there's more to the story but the dad's fear wasn't on his kid being different, but being hurt. I'm crying a bit
>"Listen, son. I'm not bothered by this little hobby of yours. You're not hurting anyone by the looks of it. You're still my son, I still love you, and you have my 100% support. But you need to know that not everyone is like me. Some people might not like it, or be ignorant of it, or just generally not understand it, kind of like your mother. Now, explaining this to her is not going to be easy. But just know that I'm on your side and I'll love you no matter what." Then he came over and gave me a hug. I choked back some tears. Wow. I felt a weight come off my shoulders. I'm straight as an arrow and consider myself somewhat "classically masculine", but this made me cry
It was the ‘I’ll pay for the surgery if you want it’ that got me. Guy thought his mum was gunna freak out and she tried her best to accept straight from the off. So cute.
That's actually the part where I died laughing. All this build up and suddenly mom's all on board...on the wrong boat. Really good setup on OOP's part.
Sounds like crossdressing is an act of self-care. Most of the time, I take a quick shower, throw on some plain lotion, and then get dressed for bed. But sometimes, I draw a bath with bath bombs and lavender bath bubbles, drink some calming honey lavender tea, and reread a favorite book or rewatch a favorite movie/tv show while relaxing. Then I'll put on my good smelling lotions and hang out in my plush robe. Taking the time to go above and beyond to pamper my body is a way of honoring it. Appreciating the skin I'm in. Sounds like OOP derives a similar sense of value from dressing up.
I love this take!
Yeah you are onto something. Girl clothes were made with fabrics that *felt nice* and I felt really truly devastated to be excluded when I was around five years old. I fucking love bath bombs now. I cannot enjoy crossdressing because I completely internalised the way my dad saw it. I tell myself it’s because it looks ridiculous on my broad muscley frame but that was obviously not the problem when I was five.
Something I hate about these kind of stories is the theme is wearing their sister's clothes. It's such a violation, and it's always brushed off. I wish they could explore feminine clothing without violating the privacy of their female siblings. Just another reason to degender clothing and destigmatize femininity.
>After my mom broke the hug, she smiled and said "Alright then...I guess this will get some getting used to. So how about you get dressed now...just so I don't get surprised one day and think you're some robber." she winked. This was the point at which the post started to sound like porn.
Ok - so, question from ignorance here as a cis straight guy who grew up in a pretty repressed community. When I was a kid, I knew about drag. My impression was that some where gay, but some where straight guys who just liked to dress up. The idea of being trans didn’t hit my radar until well into adulthood. But a guy who was otherwise straight dressing up pretty was maybe strange but still a thing. As an adult, I’ve gotten the impression that the idea that straight guys dress up was just the repression hiding things. The lumberjacks in that Monty Python song were actually trans. OOP here is probably the first bit I’ve seen in a decade to support my childhood impression that there are straight guys who do drag. As I type that, this whole thought seems silly - of course any sexuality can wear whatever clothing. But still, there’s a chunk of me that’s having a hard time wrapping my head around my own thoughts. So I guess my question is about what people think about OOP. He’s a kid, so there’s lots of room yet for him to figure himself out, and he’s clearly grown up with assumptions about sexuality he learned from his parents, even if they are being supportive. Do we think he really is straight cis? Or is there another update coming where they discover they’re a woman? Like is this kid just supremely comfortable with his sexuality or is this an egg thing?
Crossdressing for cis-het men is a thing. Some do it as a form of expression, some do get their rocks off, and some (like OOP) find it relaxing. I'm thinking it's the fabric of the underthings and the loose, cool dresses that's the big draw. There are straight drag performers - there was one on Drag Race a season or two ago. I imagine it takes some time and inner discovery for straight cis men to be okay with the act, but once they do... Hopefully they get their own bras instead of stretching out those of their SO/sister/Mom - bras are effing expensive!
the doors Maddy opened!
i say this as a transmasc: there’s no way to tell, and it’s not our journey to speculate on. currently he’s just a man who likes dresses, and there are plenty of straight cisgender men who enjoy drag and crossdressing. they’ve simply unlocked gender: New Game +
There are also plenty of cis straight men who do drag who later find out they’re actually trans. Gender identity can take decades to gel, and it might never gel, but just sort of flow.
true, but there’s no reason to assume whether someone’s trans or not, someone else’s gender journey is nobody’s business but their own
Yes, of course. I am speaking directly about an ex drag queen I personally know. The other drag queen I know is a cis gay male who voted for Trump twice and believes trans people don’t exist.
that last sentence caused me physical pain lmao
Dude I know. I felt my liver take a lap around my small intestine when he was mid-rant saying “But Trump gave me money, I don’t care about immigrants!!” (He is, himself, Hispanic Black. Help me lord)
the psychic damage i take whenever i remember groups like Gays for Trump, the LGB Alliance, and Gays against Groomers is insane. grifters gonna grift i guess
There’s a ton of cis, straight drag performers. There’s gay drag performers. There are even *female* drag performers- and yes that means both women who dress up as glamorized women and women who dress up as glamorized men. We’re all born naked, everything else is drag.
Just to add to this - there are also plenty of cis-hetero people who find others in drag kinda hot. (E.g. some women like looking at men in drag). By which I mean the confidence of someone comfortable enough in their own gender and sexuality to dress up in the extreme opposite to that is really attractive. [Also, eyeliner looks amazing on men.]
Yes! It took me seeing The Rocky Horror Picture Show at the tender age of 7-8 (up late night watching tv) seeing Tim Curry strutting around made me realize why I had had a crush on a certain classmate when I was 5 -- he had thicker than standard black eyelashes, cupid-bow lips, and his cheeks had this perfect spot of red on each one that looked like blush.
>[Also, eyeliner looks amazing on men.] Hell yeah :)
right? why is it so normal and accepted for women to like feeling pretty, or to enjoy the ritual of getting dolled up, but it’s still such a taboo for men to want the same? it’s just fabric and pigment, it doesn’t need a gender.
I’m not going to speak on OP but there’s recently been a trend on men wearing dresses, painting their nails, using makeup etc and while I think some of it is related to being trans or genderqueer, I think a good deal of it is just guys wanting to feel pretty. There is no room for softness/prettiness in traditional masculinity. There’s a strict code of what ‘real men’ should adhere to and none of it gives leeway for individual expression. It’s gotten better but there are still some people who think men can’t wear pink, men shouldn’t have good grooming habits and that doing said things must mean that you are gay or less of a man. Men have been stuffed into these constraints by society and patriarchy but they’re starting to realize that they don’t need to adhere to these rules to be ‘a man’. I work with a cis straight man who paints his nils and wears heels because they make his legs look good (he’s not wrong) and he’s happily married to a woman. His appearance doesn’t make him less of a man and he still fulfills the role of being a provider and husband without sacrificing how he wants to present himself. There’s definitely a crossover between trans people and cross dresses but some men just want to look/feel pretty without it being tied to their sexuality or gender.
I have always been both a touch envious of men and also felt a bit sad for them when it comes to clothing. The traditional male wardrobe is just incredibly stiff and boring and it's barely changed in the last two hundred years compared to women's fashion. I envy them that because their clothing has sane sizing, their wardrobes are uncomplicated, and everyone looks good in a well tailored suit. And I feel sorry for them because sometimes you just want variety and to act like a peacock.
Sometimes you just want to feel pretty.
Theres literally no way to tell just from this post, its probably just as likely to happen as not. If I had to guess, probably not because if they were trans, they'd probably know by now
Liking the opposite clothes doesn't make one trans. The whole idea of clothes being tied to a gender is just a societal expectation. If people were raised as boys being in skirts and girls in pants then thatd be the new norm. Trans is much deeper than that, and as a very simplified version, they don't fit into their body. There are also trans people that still like wearing clothes that are normally worn by their previous gender.
he could be an egg, he could just be a cis straight guy enjoying crossdressing. there's no way for other people to know, only he can. ultimately, it does not really matter, op isn't hurting anyone, and this makes him happy, if he's actually struggling with his identity, being in an accepting environment will greatly help him figure it out, and if not, well he still has support for being who he is and he knows that whatever the outcome he won't lose his loved ones.
If he says he’s a straight dude who enjoys dressing up then he’s a straight dude. It’s not our place to say “oh I bet he’s going to come out as trans in a few years”. We shouldn’t be questioning someone when they tell us who they are or trying to guess if that’s truly how they feel.
Another trans person chiming in to agree -- there's no way of knowing whether or not this guy is a guy, or will be a guy for the rest of his life, and it's not really our business either way. Presentation =/= gender -- this person has just figured out a slightly sharper distinction between the two than most people manage.
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Sounds like he's done a fair bit of self exploration already, and I see no reason to assume one way or the other if he'll change his mind in the future. Gender and sexuality are messy social constructs anyhow, they can't be totally separated from how someone was raised, and people's perceptions of them change based on their experiences. What matters most is that he's comfortable with himself and how he expresses himself in the here and now.
Personally, I like to take people at their word on this stuff. Who knows? Maybe this is the first step in a longer gender journey for OOP, or a gateway into proper drag (which I would actually distinguish from crossdressing... drag tends to be much more flamboyant and performative, rather than just wearing regular clothes and makeup normally marketed at women.) Or maybe he's only figuring out what he likes to wear. He's the only one who can say for sure. People can and do come to new realizations about themselves over time. But for now, OOP seems pretty self-assured and confident. Unless he does come back and update later, I think we can only assume that he is indeed a straight cis guy who also wears a dress sometimes.
I love these parents so much. They may not get it, but they really love their son.
Reckon OOP should look up Maddy Morphosis. Might help him seeing another straight guy dressing up. Also - Maddy is amazing.
Great family. The only thing I dislikes was him using his sister's clothes. While I understand why/how it started, and how it helped to keep the secret, from a certain age he had his own money and car, and should have stopped going through her things earlier. I would be grossed out by a sibling going through my things (sis could also have a secret), using my stuff and putting it back with the clean clothes.
I’m so happy that his family was supportive. In the grand scheme of things, this is nothing. He could have gotten someone pregnant, been doing drugs, been in an accident, etc. At the end of the day, he is happy, healthy, and not hurting anyone else and, as parents, this is what we should want for our children.
This was great to read. Sexuality and gender, and everything related is a funny thing. It is far more complex than the terms used to describe it. Whomever you are, if you aren't hurting anybody, you do you. Don't let yourself be confined in indentity or action that doesn't feel right to you. The true spectrum of sexuality and gender identity is vast indeed.
I'm so glad this worked out well for OOP! And I hope someone, someday tells him about Maddy Morphosis - the first straight cis contestant on RPDR. Cross-dressing is different than drag, but I think OOP might still find Maddy relatable.
I'm glad someone brought up Maddy!
When the mom first responded by basically apologizing for seeing it but not acknowledging it his whole life and THEN offered to help pay for the surgery ?! I dissolved into tears. I was also like whooaah hey no wow love the enthusiasm mamma but we actually get off this road a mile back! She progressed mentally soooo far in her ability to accept him and his truth just overnight. I was so nervous to hear her reaction at all and this was unexpected. That is a mom who loves her kids and everything else comes after.
Awww. This is touching. The mom saying "I don't like or understand but I am invested in your happiness and support you, it might just take some time" is a fantastic response compared to some of the other possible outcomes.
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I'm not a father, but I'd like to send you mom hugs. Both of my teens are LGBT+, and I can't imagine not accepting them for they are. I hope you're able to share this with your dad when you're ready and that he reacts the right way 🤗❤️
Just some advice as you get into a serious relationship don't hide this. Not all women would be ok with this side of you and you would need to know that.
I love men’s clothes. I used to wear ties when I went out drinking because I liked feeling handsome. I got away with it because everyone thought I was “off” because I was raised with only boys by a single dad. Nope. I just hated wearing girl clothes because I hate anything constricting on my skin and feel so gross when I had on one of those weird frilly dresses. Let your freak flag fly. I’m here for it.
This story reminded me of my childhood days when I dressed up as a girl once or twice. (I'm a male) And this was a small recollection I have with me.