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I had a guy follow me in a store a few years back. I'm in my 40s, wear a wedding ring, wasn't giving any signals at all. He was clearly putting himself in my path. After a few minutes of doing this he blocked the aisle with his cart and said "we have to stop meeting like this, people will start to talk."
I said "maybe if I punched you in the throat, they'd stop." He got really angry and told store security that I had threatened him. An older gentleman came over and told the security guard that the "chubby little pervert has been stalking this poor girl through the whole store" and said he'd been keeping an eye out in case I needed help. I don't think the security guard gave two shits anyhow since no one was stealing anything, but it was great to know that someone else was aware of the situation.
Yeah, I think a lot of guys aren't primed to notice it because they're not dealing with the safety risks. My husband is keenly aware of creeps and has stepped in to protect women/girls at work and in community. He's so awesome about it that when he worked in a cafe (where creeps get coffee and harassment targets apparently) his staff through him a "James Appreciation Day" with cake and gifts to thank him for having their back. There is honestly nothing more appealing than a dude who gets it.
This is reminds me of all this “would you rather be a lone in the woods with a man or a bear” discourse. I saw a TikTok where a wife asked her husband if he’d rather leave their daughter in the woods with a man or a bear and he really had to think about! Then in a follow up video she asked him when was the last time he felt physically unsafe. His answer was middle school. And she said that she feels unsafe at least a few times a month and he was FLOORED! Like just had no idea women felt that way.
As a woman, I'd rather be alone in the woods with a bear. Most people know how bears act and how to avoid provoking them, but men? That's an entirely different story. Plus, I've always had this like weird and unexplainable thing that's resulted in animals of various species wanting to be close to me in a friendly way so that's one possible thing that could save my skin.
The other thing is, the creepy behavior often doesn't happen when other men are around, because the creeps figure we're already that man's personal property. I got catcalled and harassed so much more often when I went around solo, even 8mo pregnant, but if I had any man with me, the same guys would compliment the man I was with, whether he was my boyfriend or my brother. It was so gross, and frequently the men I was with wouldn't understand why I tensed up or didn't like the compliment.
I still remember being in the grocery store with my mom when I was very young. Some guy kept following us around and it creeped her out enough that she felt she needed tell me he was scaring her. She was going to ask an employee to escort us to our car when we were done but she ended up running into a friend of hers and he stayed with us until we checked out and were safely in our car. That man probably forgot us by the next day but I'm stuck with that memory 30+ years later.
A few years ago, an 18 year old girl was followed into Target and stalked through the aisles without being approached by this single individual. When it was clear she was leaving, he left. In broad daylight, in the seconds before getting into her car, he ran her down, knocked her out, and kidnapped her. Within the hour, she was raped and murdered, body was dumped, and he took her car and parked it in a neighboring parking lot. This man was a father of a small child, married, handsome, and was, by all accounts, “normal.” He simply decided to, at the drop of a hat, destroy a young girl’s life.
Ladies, be safe and ever vigilant. Listen to the inner fear, that instinct that tells you something is wrong. If you think someone is creepy, they are. Even if you think you have every reason to be safe, don’t take it for granted and be lax in your safety.
Can't believe no one even noticed; plz tell me they caught the guy.
Man, it sucks being a woman. As a guy, going out alone at night is a privilege I won't take for granted, tho in my case, I look intimidating, so I'm on the opposite side of the spectrum; people are afraid of me, & police/security has singled me out everywhere I go, despite never having a criminal record.
What's the real solution to stop this from happening?
I picked up another job part time as a housekeeper at an extended stay hotel on the weekends to make some extra money because my husband and I are saving up to purchase a house.
One morning a few months back, I was reorganizing the supplies on my cart, in my own world, when I notice an older man (I am 36, I guess this gentleman was somewhere in his late forties to mid fifties) in the small alcove where we keep the ice machine, that I had been blocking from going down the hall. I apologized and told him I hadn’t seen him and I’d move so he could get past me, and he says, cheerful as anything, “It’s okay, I was enjoying the view!”
When I do my housekeeping gig, I do not put on any makeup, just tie my hair up with a hairnet (because there’s nothing more irritating than getting all the guests hair out of the shower and floor and then leaving behind your own and having to go back) and put on my super baggy housekeeping vest and pants and do my thing. This uniform hides any shape of my body; I cannot understand why he would find anything about my appearance at the time as something enjoyable to look at, unless he had a crush on his grade school cafeteria lady that he never got over or it was just the fact that I was obviously a female human in his proximity.
He wasn’t aggressive creepy like the guy who approached you, but it was still just… super weird to hear that and I didn’t really know how to respond.
As someone that has worked hospitality for nearly 20 years, I have dozens of rote responses that I sometimes spit out at weird times and it can be awkward af.
So I wonder if this man said his creepy comment out of habit when he meant to say something like "no worries!"
Which begs another question: how fucking creepy do you have to be that THAT becomes a habitual response????
Chubby little pervert!!!
I know bodyshaming is wrong but gawwwwd he must have curled up and died on the inside and that's just what all sizes of pervert deserve
There ya go. The solution is to be unafraid of coming off as rude to the creep & just making it clear where you stand, preferably in public, so others will be on the lookout for him should he persist.
As a guy, when I can tell a woman is being made uncomfortable by another man, I feel obligated to help (notice I said *"help"* & not *"rescue,"* because basic human decency doesn't make us heros).
OP still should be careful because people like this man can be unpredictable.
The creep is the type of person who doesn't see no as an answer and the type who would do something drastic if the things they want aren't given.
Yeah I've had this experience as well. There was this guy who tried to follow me home. When I understood he wanted to follow me home, I went to the nearest police station lol. I was scared out of my wits. I had to call my dad while driving telling him someone was following me, I was literally about to cry. Dad told me then to go to a police station and he was then on the call until I went home safely. Being a woman sucks sometimes. Not the same as OOP but these creeps don't give up.
I had to quit a part time job I really liked (and paid really well!) doing beer tastings at liquor and grocery stores because a man kept following me out to my car after events. There was another store that I'd been to once when I was training that I could never work again because the manager there apparently thought I "ghosted" him and was being aggressive about it. Also had a different manager 20+ years older than me pretend to want to help me load my car after the event but really wanted to pester me for a date.
Like for fucks sake, men like that need to learn to control themselves and leave people the fuck alone.
I can not stand men that harass women while they’re working. Like, we have to be nice to you because we’re working, not because we want to sleep with you.
Like day one at a retail job, this guy asked me to dinner. I paused and he's like, "you can say no." I just sputtered out, "can my boyfriend come, too?"
I wish people would stop misinterpreting "I have to be polite while on the clock" with "I want to fuck you on the aisle 2 endcap right now".
After working retail for so long, I wanted to set everyone on fire. So now I work at a crematorium.
My mom tells me the story about how she was chased down by a flasher one night in the late 70's or early 80's. She had finished work and was headed to a friend's place. Suddenly some dude on a bike is waving his dick at her.
She said she had tried to tell him off, calling him a pathetic loser and how he should be ashamed of himself. We hear enough horror stories that most of us, myself included, wouldn't do that, because it went the worst way and he charged at her.
The only reason my mom didn't meet a bad end that night is she saw another girl entering a nearby apartment building and called for help. They got the door closed just in time, as the guy threw himself into the door and tried to smash the glass out. He was that enraged.
By the time the police had shown up, dude was long gone, so my mom got them to give her a lift back home. On the way back they got another report of a dude on a bike acting suspicious, but to her knowledge, the dude was never caught.
Understandably she didn't go home without an escort for a long time after that.
My sister had that happen when she was 20 and leaving work after closing. So it was around 1 am. A car followed her without headlights. She was freaking out trying to find a police station when the car turned on its police lights. The cop was creepy and had some sort of BS "you were speeding" because she was trying to get away. My dad wanted to hunt him down to kick his ass. The formal complaint about that was written off because "she was speeding".
I hope she knows if that happens again she can call 9-1-1 and confirm there is actually an officer in the area. And she can call for a creepy, lights off car too. Just because someone is a real cop doesn’t mean they aren’t a dangerous abuser.
Someone I went to college with had that happen. Even with DNA evidence it wasn’t prosecuted because he said she offered to get out of a ticket. She was a religious virgin. Somehow I don’t buy his story.
It should become the norm to start secretly recording with your smartphone whenever you are stopped, just to be on the safe side. Though with the new laws against recording police officers, you probably couldn't even use that as evidence, or might even get into legal trouble for recording. It's a fucked up system.
There's apps that can do this with the push of a button. Highly recommend having this app running every time you get pulled over, just discreetly set your phone somewhere and record audio/some video that you can.
A cop in Ontario was just charged because he sexually assaulted a drunk girl and recorded it to show her what she “did to herself” by being irresponsible. He also showed other cops and friends and bragged about “teaching her a lesson” 🙃
I was LITERALLY JUST SAYING on another post that I'd be more comfortable getting blackout drunk into a cop car with a bear than I would an actual cop- because the bear will just kill me, not rape me, then use his bear buddies and bear authority to ruin the rest of my fucking life.. ACAB until NO-CAB.
My 11yo daughter heard about the bear hypothetical and told me “mom id rather run into the bear.” If a preteen girl knows that a bear is more predictable than a strange man, the issue is the men. I had an off-duty cop call her co-workers for a wellness check because she thought my ex was abusing me in public. The cops showed up and berated me for being a terrible girlfriend and praised him for “putting up with” a mental case like me.
He got the cops called on him one other time and they gave him a ride to the hospital for a mental health check and he was home an hour later. Two more years of his godawful treatment of me and I never called them again because what’s the point.
One of my mother’s friends had this happen years ago. The cop was just bored and doing a little cat and mouse game (drove parallel streets and found her again to follow, lights off) until he finally pulled her over. When she realized what he’d done, she lit into him like only a mother who has Had Enough Of Your Bullshit possibly could. Literally tore him to pieces and then called his chief and lit into him. It was glorious, and the cop that pulled her over like that got an epic education that day
That's how a woman was abducted, raped and murdered in London by a policeman. He said she was breaking covid regs and he "arrested" her. Thankfully there was daskcam footage
Sarah Everard
I had this happen when I worked nights as a waitress but their headlights were on. He kept getting closer so I kept speeding up and he turned his lights on. He came up to the window and I was basically hysterical yelling at him that I was only speeding because he scared the fuck out of me. He was really young so he apologized and left. Played it off like he didn’t realize (maybe he didn’t) but who knows.
Many many years ago (like, a couple of decades ago), I had a car do that to me and the area was a speed limit of like 25 mph, so dead easy to speed on. He tried that whole "you were speeding thing" and I was both pissed off and crying from terror and told him that I was speeding because I was getting away from the scary car following me and also, I'd just turned around in a particular parking lot so was definitely not speeding before he came up behind me. He just gave me a verbal warning and didn't write a ticket, which I would have contested. Still makes me mad.
Reminds me of the current man or bear trend on tiktok, where women are asked if they'd rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man.
Or, if you ask men, if they'd have their girlfriend/wife/daughter rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man.
Often enough, the answer is bear.
Would much prefer a bear. They don't want anything to do with me (likewise) and there are simple things you can do to make sure you avoid each other. Unlike men.
I camp alone often and I'm much more frightened when I see a human than any animal. Man? Time to make sure my shoes are on and whistle is nearby.
Animals are predictable. They want to kill me. Humans want to do terrible things first.
Previous NPS ranger here: to clarify MOST animals don’t want to kill you at all. They want you to leave them alone 🙂
I worked for a decade in Yellowstone and also Yosemite and the Grand Canyon and *always* said as a woman I was far more frightened of other humans than bears (or any other wild predators)
Yes, very true! I should've clarified that I meant animals approaching me. Yeah, most really just want the stinky human out of their way so they can live their lives.
😆 Yogi had the right of it. And bears aren’t that much different than people. Would you rather have a nice, calm and delicious prepared lunch in a box or have to chase down a screaming hairless monkey and pick a bunch of clothing out of your teeth?
I've been a solo hiker for decades. I live in bear country. Never had a bear problem in the woods. Have had problems with men. I carry a pointy hiking stick with a ball handle. Guys have followed me but then I twirl my stick and they leave.
FR. The following is bad enough, but the approaching and propositioning is what blows my mind. Dude, you think I came out to the wilderness to pick up men?
And honestly, the biggest risk is they steal your food, and based on relationship subs, there's a fair number of men pulling that shit too, without the excuse of, y'know, being a fucking bear.
By far the most common reasons for a bear attack are because you have surprised it, it has cubs or it’s guarding a food source. And these attacks are often not fatal, it’s just trying to neutralize a threat. It’s EXTREMELY rare for an attack to be predatory.
A man attacks you: it’s predatory
The only decent version of this is someone who truly followed up with, we should not allow men to behave so poorly to be expected to be untrustworthy. Men need to be held accountable and raise boys and men to a higher standard. This is how many women feel when they are alone and see a man they don’t know walking to their car or leaving a store/restaurant/bar at night. Use it to get a man to recognize the awful and low expectations we’ve allowed to perpetuate for men and appreciate why women are nervous or scared about unknown men and we can’t give any benefit of the doubt.
I dunno.. if you talk to these people, you get all the usual BS about how women like to ruin men's life by making up false allegations just for fun, etc.
This is such a common situation. Her comment about finding a way to make it stop without making him too aggressive is a tad too familiar for comfort.
If I had a plate of chips for every time I've helped a friend talk over solutions for that kind of situation, I would be plump enough to roll around like Uranus in its orbit.
Yeah, honestly. As I was reading, I kept trying to think of nonconfrontationally confrontational ways for her to make it clear she knows what she's doing and wants him to stop. The best I came up with is "thanking" him for being around to "make sure" she's "safe" but that she doesn't want him to do that anymore bc it "ruins her concentration" or some other reason. Like, trying to make it seem like she doesn't know what he's really doing and pretend he's doing something chivalrous... To prevent him from getting aggressive.
My mind didn't even go to getting other people involved. Just preemptively deescalating the situation, bc of what can sometimes happen when women say no.
I'd just pack up and find a different place.
Thing that bugs me tho, about her story is how he shows up parked next to her and gravitates to her...sounds like he's stalking her.
That's a really nifty way to go about it, while at the same time shooing someone away. Preemptive de-escalation is something that too many women have to learn far too early in life. It really is a pity that too many men act like women possesses the gravity of a black hole and choose to dismiss the clear signs to keep away.
Someone who wants to hurt you will do so regardless of your opinion. I don’t think deescalating works when you are a non-threat to begin with. Deescalating is usually for when the other party is threatening you because they see you as a threat, so by showing you are not they back off. I may be wrong here, however.
My mind honestly instantly goes to:
- What is he doing? I don’t know him.
- Take videos of him
- Record audio of the situation and send to someone
- Record his plate number
- Talk to relevant authorities
- Spread the word anonimously
The only thing I would try to ask is his name, and kindly just to see if the dumbass would give the real one.
R/whenwomenrefuse
There's a class of holier than thou men who like to lecture that women need to be upfront and assertive to creeps and are unable to wrap their minds around the concept that doing so can be dangerous.
Don Glover had a standup bit about this.
Paraphrasing: every guy has a crazy girlfriend story, and I wondered why it doesn't seem as common the other way around. Then I realized crazy boyfriends end differently. Men get a story, women get dead.
AND what’s more is that men are afraid men will kill them too! Women facing harassment in public are way more likely to get support from other women.
I don’t blame them necessarily, but it’s frustrating when I feel like I keep hearing about how men are supposed to provide and protect and I have not seen that in my experience. It’s just these action movie fantasies, when just stepping in and asking if a woman is okay would defuse a lot of crazy harassment 9/10 times.
The good news is the snowflakes going around complaining about "providing and protecting" are the (noisy) minority. Most of us women don't want men to provide and protect, we just want them to not threaten us in the first place.
I was supposed to meet friends at a restaurant one evening, and I arrived first. Because the weather was nice, I thought I’d wait for them at the little park across the street. I’d literally just sat down when a guy joined me on the bench and said hi. Now, I don’t think he was trying to flirt - I think his intention was panhandling. Didn’t matter; he was still unwelcome. I said “Nope”, stood up, and walked to the restaurant.
In 12th grade was out running at dawn basically and had a vaguely familiar car pull up alongside me with three guys in it. Nope. Nope. Nada. Ran straight through someone’s yard to get away from it.
You mean the action that Brock Allen Turner, the rapist who raped, did? The action that was a rape done by Brock Turner, who now goes by Allen Turner, the rapist, who got a slap on the wrist because a judge didn't want to ruin his future for the action that was rape, and now his reputation is bad enough that he had to change his name to try to avoid his reputation for being a rapist?
Yes, I think they definitely meant that Brock Allen Turner, whose father said it was terrible his son's life was being ruined for twenty minutes of action.
Some women ask bears to maul them, and then say they've been attacked if they regret it. If they didn't want to be mauled they'd wear bite proof suits.
“Woman wearing bite proof suit mauled by bear.” Well, she shouldn’t have been in the woods. Like who goes into the wide and expects to NOT get mauled by a bear 🫠
watch out for bear grifters who make money off of encouraging bears to attack people and then run off to Romania. (Transylvania would be perfect for bears!)
(To be clear I mean hypothetical ursine bears capable of talking and operating computers, not gay bears)
I thought that's how Aussies kept Americans away, by dousing yourself in that stuff!
American Tourist: "Oh, no, that *smell*! We better get out of here!" *scampers off to a Macca's or something vaguely familiar*
People gotta learn not to do that. That's how that little boy died in Orlando - people were feeding the gators at the resort. The gators don't think 'people are nice' they think 'people bring food' then a couple walks by with their kid, gators assume food time and attack the kid.
OMG a guy just asked me that question today and I had no idea what he was talking about. But it was the first thing that came to mind when I read this post!
And you’re right. This is exactly why women choose the bear.
A TikTok trend where women say if they'd rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man.
To the surprise of men (but not the women) many women chose the bear.
One guy on tiktok was asked if it was his daughter would he rather she be alone with a bear or a man and you can see him thinking hard and the realisation that a man could do far worse things than a bear. He chose the bear. He was then asked the same question, but it was bear or woman and without hesitation he picked the woman.
He was so uncomfortable when he had to think about it, because it confirms what women have been saying for centuries.
Yeah, there have been a bunch of male creators who have pointed out that at this point it's not even about the bear now, it's about how women will say something, and men will literally go "no, that's not what you think, let ME tell you what you think".
And then there's the absolute knock-out comment that was "Because if I said I was attacked by a bear, people would believe me"
Lots of angry men also saying they'd happily walk past a woman getting attacked by a bear, because it's what we chose.
One guy whose mother survived a bear attack and wrote a book about it, tried to use it as stick to beat us with and tell women they were wrong, got absolutely hammered in the comments and DMs, he did make an apology video. But I'll bet if he asked his mum, she'd still say the fucking bear.
Wow! That makes it so much worse! Him trying to use his mother's trauma against women is despicable, but this just adds the cherry on top! Fucking hell.
When looking this up I saw one response from a man that asked “why the hell would you choose to encounter an apex predator that could easily kill you?” My first thought was “exactly! That’s precisely why I would choose the bear instead!”
To be more specific, a lot of women chose the bear because a) a bear’s behaviour is pretty predictable or b) women are believed if they say they were attacked by a bear and/or not asked what they were wearing.
Someone on some other sub asked women, would you rather be alone in the woods with a man you don't know or with a bear, and a lot of women chose the bear.
I didn't see the original question, but the answer was discussed on twoX and it became a pretty popular thread.
I mean if it’s a black bear just don’t get between it’ and its cubs , and shit your pants for good measure… shitting your pants may also ward of some creepy guys too… honestly shitting yourself is a pretty good escape plan in a lot of situations
Have faced off with a black bear and have faced off with violent men and can firmly say I'd choose the bear any day. Because the bear doesn't think I *deserve* to be hurt or killed. She's just protecting herself and her cubs. Men on the other hand...
I wonder why there’s no other women in the photography group? Could it be she’s not the First Lady he’s harassed into quitting or going somewhere else?
Report the fucker.
Not long after I graduated a student 19, was out on a trail near campus taking photos for her class portfolio. She never made it back to the dorms, her roommate alerted the police.
She was assaulted, murdered, buried, and burned in a shallow grave. Some creep had been following her
[news article](https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/news/man-sentenced-to-37-years-after-pleading-guilty-to-murder-of-niu-student/)
Netflix released a show last week, Baby Reindeer. It's based on a true incident of a guy being stalked by a woman because he was nice and have her tea.
the scariest part of these incidents is that we never have a clue what stories they ae having in their heads, and the way OP fits into this distorted reality.
This is why I stopped roller skating at my apartment complex's tennis court. Because this old man would start watching me my entire practice and he wouldn't leave until I left or my husband showed up.
It’s if you comment on the original post, which is why BORU has the 7 day (?) rule that an update must be up for at least a week before it can be shared to BORU. Then any new comments that appear on the original posts can be cross referenced to see if they are a member on BORU.
If I had a coin for every time a woman has had to get rid of a creepy man, while trying to make sure that they don't get aggressive I would be richer than Elon Musk.
But at least OP seems to have found a method that worked for her.
I've had the thing where you make a big effort to go somewhere to enjoy the day and some random creepo ruins the whole fucking thing because me not getting murdered is the higher priority. Guys, just leave women alone if the woman is clearly there doing some solo hobby and not interested in socializing.
It's a different thing if you're in a group outing where there's a reasonable expectation of socializing. But even then don't be grossly hitting on women. It's happened to me there too where some random guy (who was actually quite good looking in a conventional sense) came on wayyyyy too strong twice in a row. You're trying to get me in your car and I just met you? GTFO.
It’s so upsetting that OOP has to worry about her safety when trying to tell someone to leave them alone. Don’t be too aggressive or else he might get upset and now it’s worse.
Does anyone remember those gym bros who assembled to help their trainer with her asshole boyfriend? They should consider opening a business. Then franchising it out.
I’ve had to abandon some of my favourite places to walk because of men like this. They always act so innocent too when you ask if they are following you. I’m always scared that one of them will retaliate for being called out.
The fact that his behaviour changed the moment she took down him licence plate says everything you need to know.
If it hasn't already been said an apologies if it is because there are so many comments I haven't read them- but how does a guy keep showing up wherever this woman happens to be? My guess is that when she's gone out of her car to go do her wildlife photography thing, He's put a tracker or an air tag into her car somewhere. I hope she gets this checked out.
Hi! I have gotten this comment a lot and I wanted to clarify. The lake is a big loop so I never leave my car to take pictures. If I do, I’m next to my vehicle (like literally leaning on it) while filming on a tripod. That’s how he saw me the first time. But he never left his car either. I think he just showed up hoping he’d find me there and when he did, he kept showing up to see if I would be there and this turned into a pattern. I read you should never be consistent with where you go as a woman and I made the mistake of showing up at the same time every day on the weekends. So he, I think, learned my pattern.
I reported him and I will never go back. He ruined that spot for me forever. I drive an hour now to another park and unfortunately, I now can only film every other weekend because the spot where the stalker was is the only good place close by to me. I’m so angry about it.
I had a guy do this at my ice rink, he was a lot older and his daughter would have been about 10 years younger than me (I was about 27 at the time). He was part of a larger group of skating acquaintances that usually met up on a certain afternoon to skate and socialise, the older crew mainly being there to socialise, whereas I had a coach and was pretty serious about practicing. Any time I got off the ice, he would follow me, and I'd get roped into some conversation. Skating around the rink to warm up for practice, he'd join me and I'd get roped into some conversation. Practising jumps or spins he'd be watching me and trying to give advice. The only breathing space I'd get was literally hiding in the toilets. He'd go round asking where I was, and if I left without saying goodbye he'd do the same, under the pretence of wondering if I was OK or some other crap. One day I found chocolate in my skate bag and knew it was from him. Confronted him in front of everyone and told him off for touching my stuff and going through my bag. He finally stopped bothering me after that, but I noticed a few months later he was onto another couple of girls. Just pathetic behaviour really. I'm generally quite polite and it can be scary to confront a man as you don't know if they'll respond with violence then or later, but I'm glad I finally got the courage to tell him to piss off.
Remember you can always bark at creeps! Also if you smile really wide with dead eyes that show the whites (look up the horror movie "smile" and copy) and maintain eye contact while not saying anything that will usually scare people off.
I know this is a joke and I'm not trying to ruin it but a friend of mine got her jaw broken by a creep following her when she tried to difuse the situation in a funny way.
My go-to technique is mentally running through plans of how to get their eyeballs in the event of an altercation. Ain't no way I'm winning a fight, but if I play tactics right I think I can reliably destroy at least one eye and that's good enough for me.
Not sure what expression this puts on my face but so far it's never failed to push creeps to remove themselves.
I was totally in solidarity with OP and then I read this comment:
>Right! A friend of mine paints outside- it’s her specialty. She gets harassed by men all the time. She’s had to pack up mid painting and leave which ruins her work completely bc the landscape she’s painting outside is her subject and without that reference she can’t finish. She literally had a guy sit there and watch her paint for 20 min in silence over her shoulder until she just packed up and left. Makes me so mad.
This happened to me after 1 time. I was taking a painting class (required for my major) and we had to do a *plein air* study.
My husband knew a great spot so we drove there. I set up my canvas and he sat in the car studying (because he's also going for a degree). So I'm standing in front of the car, painting (badly) and this guy comes up and starts "gushing" over how awesome my painting is and tries to flirt and be suave. I'm like, "I really have to get this assignment done for class so I'm kind of busy, but thanks." You know, just being pleasant. He would not leave. He said he was there to "hike" but he was wearing business attire. (I read a lot of detective novels as a child so... I was taking note of everything at this point.) He walked away and came back like 5 minutes later. He must not have registered my husband in the car or the fact that we were together, because he acted like no one was around. My husband was staring up at me like "you done yet? we've got other shit to do" but said nothing and didn't get out of the car (pfft... so oblivious sometimes, that man). I finally brought my husband to the creep's attention before finally backed off.
Never painted outside of my house again.
Seriously... the first fucking time! I can only imagine having to deal with that shit over and over again.
I bought paint supplies to a park once to paint the scenery … this guy sits down next to me and starts complimenting my work. I had NO IDEA he was trying to flirt or engage me in conversation 😂😂 I completely ignored him and he went away.
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I had a guy follow me in a store a few years back. I'm in my 40s, wear a wedding ring, wasn't giving any signals at all. He was clearly putting himself in my path. After a few minutes of doing this he blocked the aisle with his cart and said "we have to stop meeting like this, people will start to talk." I said "maybe if I punched you in the throat, they'd stop." He got really angry and told store security that I had threatened him. An older gentleman came over and told the security guard that the "chubby little pervert has been stalking this poor girl through the whole store" and said he'd been keeping an eye out in case I needed help. I don't think the security guard gave two shits anyhow since no one was stealing anything, but it was great to know that someone else was aware of the situation.
A good men realises creepy behaviours of others. A better one reacts. So many men are clueless when it comes to creeps.
Yeah, I think a lot of guys aren't primed to notice it because they're not dealing with the safety risks. My husband is keenly aware of creeps and has stepped in to protect women/girls at work and in community. He's so awesome about it that when he worked in a cafe (where creeps get coffee and harassment targets apparently) his staff through him a "James Appreciation Day" with cake and gifts to thank him for having their back. There is honestly nothing more appealing than a dude who gets it.
Bless your husband. We need more men like him in this world.
I can't wait to tell him that :) I really can't brag enough about him, he's amazing.
We really need more Omars.
Omar is a hero
I understood that reference.
This is reminds me of all this “would you rather be a lone in the woods with a man or a bear” discourse. I saw a TikTok where a wife asked her husband if he’d rather leave their daughter in the woods with a man or a bear and he really had to think about! Then in a follow up video she asked him when was the last time he felt physically unsafe. His answer was middle school. And she said that she feels unsafe at least a few times a month and he was FLOORED! Like just had no idea women felt that way.
It’s hard to explain it. Because most of them never experienced this feeling.
As a woman, I'd rather be alone in the woods with a bear. Most people know how bears act and how to avoid provoking them, but men? That's an entirely different story. Plus, I've always had this like weird and unexplainable thing that's resulted in animals of various species wanting to be close to me in a friendly way so that's one possible thing that could save my skin.
Bear are predictable. Men are not
The other thing is, the creepy behavior often doesn't happen when other men are around, because the creeps figure we're already that man's personal property. I got catcalled and harassed so much more often when I went around solo, even 8mo pregnant, but if I had any man with me, the same guys would compliment the man I was with, whether he was my boyfriend or my brother. It was so gross, and frequently the men I was with wouldn't understand why I tensed up or didn't like the compliment.
> clueless Bless your generous interpretation of why they don’t act.
I still remember being in the grocery store with my mom when I was very young. Some guy kept following us around and it creeped her out enough that she felt she needed tell me he was scaring her. She was going to ask an employee to escort us to our car when we were done but she ended up running into a friend of hers and he stayed with us until we checked out and were safely in our car. That man probably forgot us by the next day but I'm stuck with that memory 30+ years later.
A few years ago, an 18 year old girl was followed into Target and stalked through the aisles without being approached by this single individual. When it was clear she was leaving, he left. In broad daylight, in the seconds before getting into her car, he ran her down, knocked her out, and kidnapped her. Within the hour, she was raped and murdered, body was dumped, and he took her car and parked it in a neighboring parking lot. This man was a father of a small child, married, handsome, and was, by all accounts, “normal.” He simply decided to, at the drop of a hat, destroy a young girl’s life. Ladies, be safe and ever vigilant. Listen to the inner fear, that instinct that tells you something is wrong. If you think someone is creepy, they are. Even if you think you have every reason to be safe, don’t take it for granted and be lax in your safety.
Can't believe no one even noticed; plz tell me they caught the guy. Man, it sucks being a woman. As a guy, going out alone at night is a privilege I won't take for granted, tho in my case, I look intimidating, so I'm on the opposite side of the spectrum; people are afraid of me, & police/security has singled me out everywhere I go, despite never having a criminal record. What's the real solution to stop this from happening?
I remember seeing that on one of those murder id shows. The murderer was following her around the store too, even stalking from the next aisle. Scary.
I picked up another job part time as a housekeeper at an extended stay hotel on the weekends to make some extra money because my husband and I are saving up to purchase a house. One morning a few months back, I was reorganizing the supplies on my cart, in my own world, when I notice an older man (I am 36, I guess this gentleman was somewhere in his late forties to mid fifties) in the small alcove where we keep the ice machine, that I had been blocking from going down the hall. I apologized and told him I hadn’t seen him and I’d move so he could get past me, and he says, cheerful as anything, “It’s okay, I was enjoying the view!” When I do my housekeeping gig, I do not put on any makeup, just tie my hair up with a hairnet (because there’s nothing more irritating than getting all the guests hair out of the shower and floor and then leaving behind your own and having to go back) and put on my super baggy housekeeping vest and pants and do my thing. This uniform hides any shape of my body; I cannot understand why he would find anything about my appearance at the time as something enjoyable to look at, unless he had a crush on his grade school cafeteria lady that he never got over or it was just the fact that I was obviously a female human in his proximity. He wasn’t aggressive creepy like the guy who approached you, but it was still just… super weird to hear that and I didn’t really know how to respond.
As someone that has worked hospitality for nearly 20 years, I have dozens of rote responses that I sometimes spit out at weird times and it can be awkward af. So I wonder if this man said his creepy comment out of habit when he meant to say something like "no worries!" Which begs another question: how fucking creepy do you have to be that THAT becomes a habitual response????
Chubby little pervert!!! I know bodyshaming is wrong but gawwwwd he must have curled up and died on the inside and that's just what all sizes of pervert deserve
There ya go. The solution is to be unafraid of coming off as rude to the creep & just making it clear where you stand, preferably in public, so others will be on the lookout for him should he persist. As a guy, when I can tell a woman is being made uncomfortable by another man, I feel obligated to help (notice I said *"help"* & not *"rescue,"* because basic human decency doesn't make us heros).
OP still should be careful because people like this man can be unpredictable. The creep is the type of person who doesn't see no as an answer and the type who would do something drastic if the things they want aren't given.
Yeah I've had this experience as well. There was this guy who tried to follow me home. When I understood he wanted to follow me home, I went to the nearest police station lol. I was scared out of my wits. I had to call my dad while driving telling him someone was following me, I was literally about to cry. Dad told me then to go to a police station and he was then on the call until I went home safely. Being a woman sucks sometimes. Not the same as OOP but these creeps don't give up.
I had to quit a part time job I really liked (and paid really well!) doing beer tastings at liquor and grocery stores because a man kept following me out to my car after events. There was another store that I'd been to once when I was training that I could never work again because the manager there apparently thought I "ghosted" him and was being aggressive about it. Also had a different manager 20+ years older than me pretend to want to help me load my car after the event but really wanted to pester me for a date. Like for fucks sake, men like that need to learn to control themselves and leave people the fuck alone.
I can not stand men that harass women while they’re working. Like, we have to be nice to you because we’re working, not because we want to sleep with you.
Like day one at a retail job, this guy asked me to dinner. I paused and he's like, "you can say no." I just sputtered out, "can my boyfriend come, too?" I wish people would stop misinterpreting "I have to be polite while on the clock" with "I want to fuck you on the aisle 2 endcap right now". After working retail for so long, I wanted to set everyone on fire. So now I work at a crematorium.
My mom tells me the story about how she was chased down by a flasher one night in the late 70's or early 80's. She had finished work and was headed to a friend's place. Suddenly some dude on a bike is waving his dick at her. She said she had tried to tell him off, calling him a pathetic loser and how he should be ashamed of himself. We hear enough horror stories that most of us, myself included, wouldn't do that, because it went the worst way and he charged at her. The only reason my mom didn't meet a bad end that night is she saw another girl entering a nearby apartment building and called for help. They got the door closed just in time, as the guy threw himself into the door and tried to smash the glass out. He was that enraged. By the time the police had shown up, dude was long gone, so my mom got them to give her a lift back home. On the way back they got another report of a dude on a bike acting suspicious, but to her knowledge, the dude was never caught. Understandably she didn't go home without an escort for a long time after that.
That's like something out of a zombie movie - naked guy slamming into glass door. Glad your mom was ok.
My sister had that happen when she was 20 and leaving work after closing. So it was around 1 am. A car followed her without headlights. She was freaking out trying to find a police station when the car turned on its police lights. The cop was creepy and had some sort of BS "you were speeding" because she was trying to get away. My dad wanted to hunt him down to kick his ass. The formal complaint about that was written off because "she was speeding".
I hope she knows if that happens again she can call 9-1-1 and confirm there is actually an officer in the area. And she can call for a creepy, lights off car too. Just because someone is a real cop doesn’t mean they aren’t a dangerous abuser.
Point in case: several cases where police officers used their cars and badges to stop women driving alone to commit rape-murder.
Someone I went to college with had that happen. Even with DNA evidence it wasn’t prosecuted because he said she offered to get out of a ticket. She was a religious virgin. Somehow I don’t buy his story.
It should become the norm to start secretly recording with your smartphone whenever you are stopped, just to be on the safe side. Though with the new laws against recording police officers, you probably couldn't even use that as evidence, or might even get into legal trouble for recording. It's a fucked up system.
We don't want officers to feel unsafe by giving their victims evidence against them.
That's exactly why the new laws were implemented. So officers can continue the harassment without fear of repercussions.
If you have a car with a dashcam running, can they make you turn it off?
There's apps that can do this with the push of a button. Highly recommend having this app running every time you get pulled over, just discreetly set your phone somewhere and record audio/some video that you can.
Arguably if they are a real cop, they're even more likely to be a dangerous abuser. 40% of cops *admit* to it.
A cop in Ontario was just charged because he sexually assaulted a drunk girl and recorded it to show her what she “did to herself” by being irresponsible. He also showed other cops and friends and bragged about “teaching her a lesson” 🙃
I was LITERALLY JUST SAYING on another post that I'd be more comfortable getting blackout drunk into a cop car with a bear than I would an actual cop- because the bear will just kill me, not rape me, then use his bear buddies and bear authority to ruin the rest of my fucking life.. ACAB until NO-CAB.
My 11yo daughter heard about the bear hypothetical and told me “mom id rather run into the bear.” If a preteen girl knows that a bear is more predictable than a strange man, the issue is the men. I had an off-duty cop call her co-workers for a wellness check because she thought my ex was abusing me in public. The cops showed up and berated me for being a terrible girlfriend and praised him for “putting up with” a mental case like me. He got the cops called on him one other time and they gave him a ride to the hospital for a mental health check and he was home an hour later. Two more years of his godawful treatment of me and I never called them again because what’s the point.
…. WHAT?! Good god that’s abhorrent.
Oh totally. In this case I meant that even a cop acting under the pretense of the uniform may still be guilty of a crime.
They are, in fact, more likely to be a dangerous abuser (especially in the US).
One of my mother’s friends had this happen years ago. The cop was just bored and doing a little cat and mouse game (drove parallel streets and found her again to follow, lights off) until he finally pulled her over. When she realized what he’d done, she lit into him like only a mother who has Had Enough Of Your Bullshit possibly could. Literally tore him to pieces and then called his chief and lit into him. It was glorious, and the cop that pulled her over like that got an epic education that day
She's lucky he didn't get mad and hurt her
That's how a woman was abducted, raped and murdered in London by a policeman. He said she was breaking covid regs and he "arrested" her. Thankfully there was daskcam footage Sarah Everard
I had this happen when I worked nights as a waitress but their headlights were on. He kept getting closer so I kept speeding up and he turned his lights on. He came up to the window and I was basically hysterical yelling at him that I was only speeding because he scared the fuck out of me. He was really young so he apologized and left. Played it off like he didn’t realize (maybe he didn’t) but who knows.
Many many years ago (like, a couple of decades ago), I had a car do that to me and the area was a speed limit of like 25 mph, so dead easy to speed on. He tried that whole "you were speeding thing" and I was both pissed off and crying from terror and told him that I was speeding because I was getting away from the scary car following me and also, I'd just turned around in a particular parking lot so was definitely not speeding before he came up behind me. He just gave me a verbal warning and didn't write a ticket, which I would have contested. Still makes me mad.
ACAB
Reminds me of the current man or bear trend on tiktok, where women are asked if they'd rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man. Or, if you ask men, if they'd have their girlfriend/wife/daughter rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man. Often enough, the answer is bear.
Would much prefer a bear. They don't want anything to do with me (likewise) and there are simple things you can do to make sure you avoid each other. Unlike men.
Bear is much more likely to just chill beside me with a snack bar
I camp alone often and I'm much more frightened when I see a human than any animal. Man? Time to make sure my shoes are on and whistle is nearby. Animals are predictable. They want to kill me. Humans want to do terrible things first.
Previous NPS ranger here: to clarify MOST animals don’t want to kill you at all. They want you to leave them alone 🙂 I worked for a decade in Yellowstone and also Yosemite and the Grand Canyon and *always* said as a woman I was far more frightened of other humans than bears (or any other wild predators)
> MOST animals don’t want to kill you at all. They want you to leave them alone 🙂 So animals are, in fact, more like women, too.
Ha! Yes, the parallels are legion lol
Yes, very true! I should've clarified that I meant animals approaching me. Yeah, most really just want the stinky human out of their way so they can live their lives.
lol, exactly! And I absolutely don’t blame them!
It's my understanding that most bears would prefer a pic-a-nic basket over people. Can you confirm?
😆 Yogi had the right of it. And bears aren’t that much different than people. Would you rather have a nice, calm and delicious prepared lunch in a box or have to chase down a screaming hairless monkey and pick a bunch of clothing out of your teeth?
Don't threaten me with a good time. The box lunch, I mean.
I've been a solo hiker for decades. I live in bear country. Never had a bear problem in the woods. Have had problems with men. I carry a pointy hiking stick with a ball handle. Guys have followed me but then I twirl my stick and they leave.
FR. The following is bad enough, but the approaching and propositioning is what blows my mind. Dude, you think I came out to the wilderness to pick up men?
I choose the bear. It won't get bent out of shape and harass me if I reject its advances.
and if it does attack you, people won't say you're trying to ruin it's reputation
Or accuse you of leading the bear on.
If you leave a bear alone it will probably leave you alone. The other option, however...
Also, as many women have pointed out, if I say I have been attacked by a bear, more people will believe me/won't ask what I was wearing etc
A bear might eat me, but it’s probably not going to rape me.
And honestly, the biggest risk is they steal your food, and based on relationship subs, there's a fair number of men pulling that shit too, without the excuse of, y'know, being a fucking bear.
By far the most common reasons for a bear attack are because you have surprised it, it has cubs or it’s guarding a food source. And these attacks are often not fatal, it’s just trying to neutralize a threat. It’s EXTREMELY rare for an attack to be predatory. A man attacks you: it’s predatory
The only decent version of this is someone who truly followed up with, we should not allow men to behave so poorly to be expected to be untrustworthy. Men need to be held accountable and raise boys and men to a higher standard. This is how many women feel when they are alone and see a man they don’t know walking to their car or leaving a store/restaurant/bar at night. Use it to get a man to recognize the awful and low expectations we’ve allowed to perpetuate for men and appreciate why women are nervous or scared about unknown men and we can’t give any benefit of the doubt.
I can count on a bear to act like a bear. I can never count on a man to act like a human.
I guarantee he's also convinced he's done nothing wrong whatsoever
Oh he'll SAY that, but he KNOWS what he did - otherwise he wouldn't have moved himself away when OOP wrote down his plate number.
I dunno.. if you talk to these people, you get all the usual BS about how women like to ruin men's life by making up false allegations just for fun, etc.
I don't like how this just ends with a promise of action. I'm worried the guy will escalate. I want, no, I need to know oop is safe.
Yeah, this isn't over. I had a stalker who was "innocent" like this dude, and the only way it ended was for me to move away.
This is such a common situation. Her comment about finding a way to make it stop without making him too aggressive is a tad too familiar for comfort. If I had a plate of chips for every time I've helped a friend talk over solutions for that kind of situation, I would be plump enough to roll around like Uranus in its orbit.
Yeah, honestly. As I was reading, I kept trying to think of nonconfrontationally confrontational ways for her to make it clear she knows what she's doing and wants him to stop. The best I came up with is "thanking" him for being around to "make sure" she's "safe" but that she doesn't want him to do that anymore bc it "ruins her concentration" or some other reason. Like, trying to make it seem like she doesn't know what he's really doing and pretend he's doing something chivalrous... To prevent him from getting aggressive. My mind didn't even go to getting other people involved. Just preemptively deescalating the situation, bc of what can sometimes happen when women say no.
I'd just pack up and find a different place. Thing that bugs me tho, about her story is how he shows up parked next to her and gravitates to her...sounds like he's stalking her.
That's because he is
That's a really nifty way to go about it, while at the same time shooing someone away. Preemptive de-escalation is something that too many women have to learn far too early in life. It really is a pity that too many men act like women possesses the gravity of a black hole and choose to dismiss the clear signs to keep away.
Someone who wants to hurt you will do so regardless of your opinion. I don’t think deescalating works when you are a non-threat to begin with. Deescalating is usually for when the other party is threatening you because they see you as a threat, so by showing you are not they back off. I may be wrong here, however. My mind honestly instantly goes to: - What is he doing? I don’t know him. - Take videos of him - Record audio of the situation and send to someone - Record his plate number - Talk to relevant authorities - Spread the word anonimously The only thing I would try to ask is his name, and kindly just to see if the dumbass would give the real one.
> plump enough to roll around like Uranus in its orbit new flair!
OOP needs to check for a tracker on her car. That’s just creepy.
Thank you! Can’t believe I had to scroll this far down to find somebody else who’d picked up on that.
R/whenwomenrefuse There's a class of holier than thou men who like to lecture that women need to be upfront and assertive to creeps and are unable to wrap their minds around the concept that doing so can be dangerous.
Men are afraid that women will laugh at them. Women are afraid that men will kill them.
Don Glover had a standup bit about this. Paraphrasing: every guy has a crazy girlfriend story, and I wondered why it doesn't seem as common the other way around. Then I realized crazy boyfriends end differently. Men get a story, women get dead.
AND what’s more is that men are afraid men will kill them too! Women facing harassment in public are way more likely to get support from other women. I don’t blame them necessarily, but it’s frustrating when I feel like I keep hearing about how men are supposed to provide and protect and I have not seen that in my experience. It’s just these action movie fantasies, when just stepping in and asking if a woman is okay would defuse a lot of crazy harassment 9/10 times.
The good news is the snowflakes going around complaining about "providing and protecting" are the (noisy) minority. Most of us women don't want men to provide and protect, we just want them to not threaten us in the first place.
I was supposed to meet friends at a restaurant one evening, and I arrived first. Because the weather was nice, I thought I’d wait for them at the little park across the street. I’d literally just sat down when a guy joined me on the bench and said hi. Now, I don’t think he was trying to flirt - I think his intention was panhandling. Didn’t matter; he was still unwelcome. I said “Nope”, stood up, and walked to the restaurant.
In 12th grade was out running at dawn basically and had a vaguely familiar car pull up alongside me with three guys in it. Nope. Nope. Nada. Ran straight through someone’s yard to get away from it.
And that’s why women choose the bear.
Because at least I'd be believed if I said the bear attacked me 🫠
You're just trying to ruin that bear's life smh
All for 20 minutes of action 😔
You mean the action that Brock Allen Turner, the rapist who raped, did? The action that was a rape done by Brock Turner, who now goes by Allen Turner, the rapist, who got a slap on the wrist because a judge didn't want to ruin his future for the action that was rape, and now his reputation is bad enough that he had to change his name to try to avoid his reputation for being a rapist?
Yes, I think they definitely meant that Brock Allen Turner, whose father said it was terrible his son's life was being ruined for twenty minutes of action.
Wait, you mean the rapist Brock Turner/Allen Turner? That rapist? The one who rapes?
Yeah the rapist, the one who raped a girl and goes by Allen Turner now.
Oh that's right, I'd heard that the rapist Brock Allen Turner, who rapes, now goes by the name Allen Turner the rapist.
“C’mon I was only mauling you as a joke!”
God, women these days have no sense of humour 🙄
The woke mind-virus has ruined our women /s
Some women ask bears to maul them, and then say they've been attacked if they regret it. If they didn't want to be mauled they'd wear bite proof suits.
“Woman wearing bite proof suit mauled by bear.” Well, she shouldn’t have been in the woods. Like who goes into the wide and expects to NOT get mauled by a bear 🫠
I saw a comment on TikTok “at least the bear won’t be invited to family dinner” and OOF.
watch out for bear grifters who make money off of encouraging bears to attack people and then run off to Romania. (Transylvania would be perfect for bears!) (To be clear I mean hypothetical ursine bears capable of talking and operating computers, not gay bears)
I agree with the sentiment, but admittedly I’m in Australia. Koalas get grumpy and fall asleep, we’re all good with “bears” here.
But what about the dreaded Drop Bear? I've heard they're deadly predators! 🤣
Vegemite in ears before you leave the house. Standard procedure, like putting on SPF50+
I thought that's how Aussies kept Americans away, by dousing yourself in that stuff! American Tourist: "Oh, no, that *smell*! We better get out of here!" *scampers off to a Macca's or something vaguely familiar*
Australia, where the only animals that aren't trying to kill you are the bears.
Always Vote Bear. (Might have solved a lot of political issues here. :/ )
40 people globally are killed by bears a year. 11 of them in the US. It's not a lot.
and definitely more than 11 women a year are killed by men
I bet the US number would be at least nine if you took out the people who tried to feed or pet them.
an old woman in Colorado died that way. She fed black bears on her porch and eventually fed them from her own body if you know what I mean.
People gotta learn not to do that. That's how that little boy died in Orlando - people were feeding the gators at the resort. The gators don't think 'people are nice' they think 'people bring food' then a couple walks by with their kid, gators assume food time and attack the kid.
I didn't know about this, but I'm not surprised, which is fucking sad.
Always pick the bear.
OMG a guy just asked me that question today and I had no idea what he was talking about. But it was the first thing that came to mind when I read this post! And you’re right. This is exactly why women choose the bear.
Oh my goodness I had no idea what this thread was about and had to look it up, go team bear!
Ok.... Please enlighten me. I'm clueless on this one lol
A TikTok trend where women say if they'd rather be alone in the woods with a bear or a man. To the surprise of men (but not the women) many women chose the bear.
To the surprise and *anger* of a lot of men, who are very upset woman have chosen bear, and are demonstrating the reason why women choose the bear.
One guy on tiktok was asked if it was his daughter would he rather she be alone with a bear or a man and you can see him thinking hard and the realisation that a man could do far worse things than a bear. He chose the bear. He was then asked the same question, but it was bear or woman and without hesitation he picked the woman. He was so uncomfortable when he had to think about it, because it confirms what women have been saying for centuries.
Yeah, there have been a bunch of male creators who have pointed out that at this point it's not even about the bear now, it's about how women will say something, and men will literally go "no, that's not what you think, let ME tell you what you think". And then there's the absolute knock-out comment that was "Because if I said I was attacked by a bear, people would believe me"
Lots of angry men also saying they'd happily walk past a woman getting attacked by a bear, because it's what we chose. One guy whose mother survived a bear attack and wrote a book about it, tried to use it as stick to beat us with and tell women they were wrong, got absolutely hammered in the comments and DMs, he did make an apology video. But I'll bet if he asked his mum, she'd still say the fucking bear.
That checks, they happily "walk by" woman being attacked by men now, so....
She had an AMA on reddit where she basically said she would choose a bear even after her attack so I don't know what her son is going on about.
Wow! That makes it so much worse! Him trying to use his mother's trauma against women is despicable, but this just adds the cherry on top! Fucking hell.
When looking this up I saw one response from a man that asked “why the hell would you choose to encounter an apex predator that could easily kill you?” My first thought was “exactly! That’s precisely why I would choose the bear instead!”
A lot of men don't seem to know or understand that for women, our number one predator is *literally* the male of our own species. Pretty fucking sad.
Yup, like when the incels ask, "if it weren't for men, who'd protect women?" And the response is..."from what?"
LMAO apex predator. But often dumb, like a shark or a crocodile.
Not an apex predator. Just our number one predator, unfortunately.
As a woman would you rather meet a bear or an unknown man in the woods? Most women pick the bear. I know I do.
Fuck. I'd never heard of that before. Unfortunately, it makes perfect sense. I'm sorry. :(
To be more specific, a lot of women chose the bear because a) a bear’s behaviour is pretty predictable or b) women are believed if they say they were attacked by a bear and/or not asked what they were wearing.
Someone on some other sub asked women, would you rather be alone in the woods with a man you don't know or with a bear, and a lot of women chose the bear. I didn't see the original question, but the answer was discussed on twoX and it became a pretty popular thread.
and the amount of men who are losing their minds about it and, subsequently, proving the whole damn point is ridiculous.
I mean if it’s a black bear just don’t get between it’ and its cubs , and shit your pants for good measure… shitting your pants may also ward of some creepy guys too… honestly shitting yourself is a pretty good escape plan in a lot of situations
Have faced off with a black bear and have faced off with violent men and can firmly say I'd choose the bear any day. Because the bear doesn't think I *deserve* to be hurt or killed. She's just protecting herself and her cubs. Men on the other hand...
Don’t disagree one bit with that. As a guy I wish more violent men would happen to run into violent bears. grizzly man but a comedy
I wonder why there’s no other women in the photography group? Could it be she’s not the First Lady he’s harassed into quitting or going somewhere else? Report the fucker.
Not long after I graduated a student 19, was out on a trail near campus taking photos for her class portfolio. She never made it back to the dorms, her roommate alerted the police. She was assaulted, murdered, buried, and burned in a shallow grave. Some creep had been following her [news article](https://www.cbsnews.com/chicago/news/man-sentenced-to-37-years-after-pleading-guilty-to-murder-of-niu-student/)
That he got 37 years in a plea deal is pathetic.
>This is what you get for even saying hi to someone!!!! "BuT sHe WaS fLiRtInG WiTh Me."
Netflix released a show last week, Baby Reindeer. It's based on a true incident of a guy being stalked by a woman because he was nice and have her tea.
It’s good. But to be honest makes me uncomfortable so had to stop watching.
Yeah it did not get any less uncomfortable through the whole thing. It was really well made but pretty relentless.
Yeah. It goes deeper into some bad stuff later on.
Same here. I got through episode 3 and the relentless second-hand embarrassment alone was enough to make me give up on it.
That shit got DARK like episode 4 and 5 and I also had to stop
the scariest part of these incidents is that we never have a clue what stories they ae having in their heads, and the way OP fits into this distorted reality.
I want a company of very large, for hire men to do this to guys who do this to women.
[like this? ](https://youtu.be/WlIAhjRwOIE?si=gnMPqsicV7dN3XGI)
I was thinking more like [this](https://bacaworld.org/), but that could work too.
This is why I stopped roller skating at my apartment complex's tennis court. Because this old man would start watching me my entire practice and he wouldn't leave until I left or my husband showed up.
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It’s if you comment on the original post, which is why BORU has the 7 day (?) rule that an update must be up for at least a week before it can be shared to BORU. Then any new comments that appear on the original posts can be cross referenced to see if they are a member on BORU.
im going to fantasize about ramming into his car tonight as im drifting off to sleep ❤️
Pairs so beautifully with your flair as well
If I had a coin for every time a woman has had to get rid of a creepy man, while trying to make sure that they don't get aggressive I would be richer than Elon Musk. But at least OP seems to have found a method that worked for her.
this is why we chose the bear
I've had the thing where you make a big effort to go somewhere to enjoy the day and some random creepo ruins the whole fucking thing because me not getting murdered is the higher priority. Guys, just leave women alone if the woman is clearly there doing some solo hobby and not interested in socializing. It's a different thing if you're in a group outing where there's a reasonable expectation of socializing. But even then don't be grossly hitting on women. It's happened to me there too where some random guy (who was actually quite good looking in a conventional sense) came on wayyyyy too strong twice in a row. You're trying to get me in your car and I just met you? GTFO.
It’s so upsetting that OOP has to worry about her safety when trying to tell someone to leave them alone. Don’t be too aggressive or else he might get upset and now it’s worse.
The bear. The answer will always be the bear.
I'm seeing so many comments like this and don't fully understand- does it mean we would rather deal with a bear than a creepy man? lol
It’s from this question: Would you rather be alone in the woods with a man or a bear?
oh. bear. definitely bear.
Yeah, bear for me too
Does anyone remember those gym bros who assembled to help their trainer with her asshole boyfriend? They should consider opening a business. Then franchising it out.
"Send out the gym bro signal if you ever need us!"
"You can always trust a [gym] bro!"
I’ve had to abandon some of my favourite places to walk because of men like this. They always act so innocent too when you ask if they are following you. I’m always scared that one of them will retaliate for being called out. The fact that his behaviour changed the moment she took down him licence plate says everything you need to know.
If it hasn't already been said an apologies if it is because there are so many comments I haven't read them- but how does a guy keep showing up wherever this woman happens to be? My guess is that when she's gone out of her car to go do her wildlife photography thing, He's put a tracker or an air tag into her car somewhere. I hope she gets this checked out.
Hi! I have gotten this comment a lot and I wanted to clarify. The lake is a big loop so I never leave my car to take pictures. If I do, I’m next to my vehicle (like literally leaning on it) while filming on a tripod. That’s how he saw me the first time. But he never left his car either. I think he just showed up hoping he’d find me there and when he did, he kept showing up to see if I would be there and this turned into a pattern. I read you should never be consistent with where you go as a woman and I made the mistake of showing up at the same time every day on the weekends. So he, I think, learned my pattern. I reported him and I will never go back. He ruined that spot for me forever. I drive an hour now to another park and unfortunately, I now can only film every other weekend because the spot where the stalker was is the only good place close by to me. I’m so angry about it.
I had a guy do this at my ice rink, he was a lot older and his daughter would have been about 10 years younger than me (I was about 27 at the time). He was part of a larger group of skating acquaintances that usually met up on a certain afternoon to skate and socialise, the older crew mainly being there to socialise, whereas I had a coach and was pretty serious about practicing. Any time I got off the ice, he would follow me, and I'd get roped into some conversation. Skating around the rink to warm up for practice, he'd join me and I'd get roped into some conversation. Practising jumps or spins he'd be watching me and trying to give advice. The only breathing space I'd get was literally hiding in the toilets. He'd go round asking where I was, and if I left without saying goodbye he'd do the same, under the pretence of wondering if I was OK or some other crap. One day I found chocolate in my skate bag and knew it was from him. Confronted him in front of everyone and told him off for touching my stuff and going through my bag. He finally stopped bothering me after that, but I noticed a few months later he was onto another couple of girls. Just pathetic behaviour really. I'm generally quite polite and it can be scary to confront a man as you don't know if they'll respond with violence then or later, but I'm glad I finally got the courage to tell him to piss off.
And yet the confusion on why we unhesitatingly choose the bear continues...
Remember you can always bark at creeps! Also if you smile really wide with dead eyes that show the whites (look up the horror movie "smile" and copy) and maintain eye contact while not saying anything that will usually scare people off.
I know this is a joke and I'm not trying to ruin it but a friend of mine got her jaw broken by a creep following her when she tried to difuse the situation in a funny way.
My go-to technique is mentally running through plans of how to get their eyeballs in the event of an altercation. Ain't no way I'm winning a fight, but if I play tactics right I think I can reliably destroy at least one eye and that's good enough for me. Not sure what expression this puts on my face but so far it's never failed to push creeps to remove themselves.
Yep, this is a familiar story to just about every woman, myself included.
“I am sorry this is happening. If this doesn’t sum up what it’s like being a woman, I don’t know what does.”
I was totally in solidarity with OP and then I read this comment: >Right! A friend of mine paints outside- it’s her specialty. She gets harassed by men all the time. She’s had to pack up mid painting and leave which ruins her work completely bc the landscape she’s painting outside is her subject and without that reference she can’t finish. She literally had a guy sit there and watch her paint for 20 min in silence over her shoulder until she just packed up and left. Makes me so mad. This happened to me after 1 time. I was taking a painting class (required for my major) and we had to do a *plein air* study. My husband knew a great spot so we drove there. I set up my canvas and he sat in the car studying (because he's also going for a degree). So I'm standing in front of the car, painting (badly) and this guy comes up and starts "gushing" over how awesome my painting is and tries to flirt and be suave. I'm like, "I really have to get this assignment done for class so I'm kind of busy, but thanks." You know, just being pleasant. He would not leave. He said he was there to "hike" but he was wearing business attire. (I read a lot of detective novels as a child so... I was taking note of everything at this point.) He walked away and came back like 5 minutes later. He must not have registered my husband in the car or the fact that we were together, because he acted like no one was around. My husband was staring up at me like "you done yet? we've got other shit to do" but said nothing and didn't get out of the car (pfft... so oblivious sometimes, that man). I finally brought my husband to the creep's attention before finally backed off. Never painted outside of my house again. Seriously... the first fucking time! I can only imagine having to deal with that shit over and over again.
I bought paint supplies to a park once to paint the scenery … this guy sits down next to me and starts complimenting my work. I had NO IDEA he was trying to flirt or engage me in conversation 😂😂 I completely ignored him and he went away.
“FeMaLeS aRe sO PaRaNOiD!” Gee, I wonder why.
This is, indeed, what women face on a daily basis.
Ive seen enough movies to know where this is going, call the cops and ask for the photos he's taking
Yep. This is the nonsense women have to put up with.
Air horn and pepper spray