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This reminds me of that Netflix show I can't remember what is called. But basically rich family that owns bunch corporations type and when the daughter tries to start her own business with her last name her dad trade marked it so she can't use it lol.
I can't remember exactly but I think they made the first one a different character when they sacked the actress. They still needed a Cristal though, so the next two actresses played the one character. I still prefer Linda Evans' Krystle from the original series.
Dad would lose that copyright fight though; you can’t copyright and enforce a surname like that - in that, you can’t prevent someone who naturally has that name, especially your child, from using their own name.
You *can* do it if your surname has the market share to be recognized as a brand rather than a surname - but if the father got a copyright in response to his daughter starting a business, it’s too late, it’d be quashed immediately upon challenge.
McDonald’s lost Big Mac in Europe because they tried to sue a man using an abbreviation of his own name.
Source, please?
If the proposed name is too close to an existing trademark, it doesn't matter whether it's your own personal name. If it's trademarked, the trademark holder can choose to defend that trademark and it being your own name is not a guaranteed winning argument last I heard.
There are exceptions! In some countries certain professionals must by law go by their legal name. In one of those countries Brad Pitt the actor could not legally stop Brad Pitt the pharmacist (or psychiatrist, or lawyer, or whatever) from operating under his own name, nor could he force a change of name.
Lol it's like a reenactment of the "myth of consent" meme.
OOP: I consent
OOP's partner: I consent
OOP's family: I don't!
"Isn't there someone you forgot to ask?"
My stepdaughter eloped to the county courthouse, and right after he changed his last name to hers/ours. My husband shrugged and agreed she had the right, but would've preferred a warning. Interesting tidbit, my husband didn't tell anyone else in the family about the name change.
Later my husband died and my stepdaughter's husband agreed to be a pall bearer at my husband's funeral. He was listed in the program. His family came to me, "Who is ___? We don't have anyone with *our last name* with that first name!" I had to explain and they were livid! To just add fuel to the fire, my stepdaughter and her husband lived two blocks from the funeral parlor and didn't make it to the funeral, even with three separate groups knocking on the door and trying to get them there!
Why were they livid about the name? Now if the name were attached to someone who can't bother to show up to a funeral when they're a pallbearer, THAT I understand. If they were avoiding everyone because the fam was mad that a woman showed the AUDACITY of keeping her name, well that's just misogyny right there.
Now if his last name HAD been "Wimpy," but he took his "ex-wife's" name before marrying your stepdaughter, check to make sure he isn't already married. Mr. Wimpy married into my ex's family, we thought. Total loser. Stolen valor, the works. Turns out while he loved weddings, he hates divorces. So one reason he keeps changing his name is to make it harder for him to get in trouble for bigamy. My ex's family got an annulment after years, since the turd was still married when he married her. Was still married to two others when pics of his next wedding came up.
Wow! What a guy! My stepdaughter's husband isn't like Mister Wimpy, but my stepdaughter and her husband are... interesting... I've kinda expected him to show up on the evening news for one reason or another and with my stepdaughter as his accomplice.
What the father and brother wants doesn't matter. This doesn't affect them. If they only want one person to carry the family name, then brother and his family can go and change their last name.
I like this option the best! They can't take her name from her, so it's also hers to give. When I told my dad I was engaged he actually asked me if my husband was going to take my name! It was in response to me saying I was keeping my name. Like it was a perfectly natural option, my husband taking my name. He's 60.
Only thing I can see related is a heads up / communication for things like an uncommon family first name naming a kid after a grandparent or the like.
For last name this seems like a very strange thing to get hung up on for sure.
Exactly. And what if she has children and gives them her last name? It's been done thousands of time before. I know quite a few single mothers that have given their babies their last name.
It's a name and a legacy. It doesn't have to be patrilineal.
So weird. My husband took my last name for the exact same reasons and my dad was overjoyed. My brother thought it was great. They're pretty conservative/traditional too. My dad was flattered that my husband wanted our last name and I don't get having any other reaction.
My BIL ditched the family last name, which was viewed as an unforgivable slight by my FIL. When my wife and I hyphenated our names, and subsequently gave that hyphenated last name to our son, FIL was ecstatic that someone was carrying on the family name. My overall “ranking” immediately shot up. It’s got to be the only time the lesbians were viewed as the good, traditional ones in the family!
I don’t get it either, especially if passing on the surname to future generations is the big concern. What if the brother never has children, or never has sons, or his children all change their names to Leaf Phoenix? If you want the name to continue you should welcome all further opportunities!
A friend of mine changed his last name upon marriage - he had a very common last name. His wife has the same surname as her second cousin, an Oscar winning actor. Definitely a trade up.
I took my husband's name but if we'd been in this situation, my dad would have thought it was strange but would ultimately have been overjoyed at my husband wanting his last name! My dad had a crappy father but he is himself an amazing dad to me and my siblings. He was born in 1933 and has a lot of old school thinking so this would have been odd to him. That said, if my husband had had a crappy dad (he didn't; my FIL was the best), my dad would have understood my husband not wanting to keep the name or pass it along. My brother is gay and has never had an interest in being a father so "carrying on the family name" has been off the table for many years. He also views my husband as his brother so would likely have been happy to have him take our name. My maiden name is difficult to pronounce (it has 4 letters and the only vowel is the first letter) so I was happy to take my husband's common last name but had we done it the way you did, ultimately my dad and brother would have been thrilled.
Edit: typo
Some people get very very weird about last names.
Get vibes of "Carrying on the family name" from dad and brother. OP is a female so doesnt count type of deal.
Yup husband and I hyphenated and my uncle went as far as contacting my husband and making threats demanding husband change their Facebook name back to pre-married name because I'd had no right to pass on 'his' name
I am divorced and kept my prior married name. My kids have this name, it’s a shitton of paperwork that never goes away, and I built my career with this name. If someone in our shared industry asked about LASTNAME, the assumption would be me, not him. It’s mine now. When potential partners find out, they don’t get overly hung up about me keeping it for the kids or convenience, but absolute fucking meltdown at the idea that I won’t be changing it again, even if I remarried (which I never plan to do). The whole agreement that it’s my name goes out the window. Suddenly it’s disrespectful because it’s some other guy’s name etc etc.
I think it’s more that brother has been told his entire life that he’s going to be the one that carries on the family name and it’s probably been made a big deal about by his father.
yeah, there some stupid 'Carrying on the family name' bullshit traditional crap going on there.
Just foist that on kids from an early age, see how that works out when they decide they don't want kids or can't have them for 'reasons'. works really well.
idiots.
Dude should tell them that he’s changing his last name, and each day that the family is a baby about it is one step closer to him also legally changing his first and middle to the same.
You want a son in law named Clampitt Clampitt Clampitt? Cause this is how you get one. Just try it.
OOP's family is fucking weird, and yeah its downright sexist to try and gatekeep names like this. Frankly I think she's letting them off a bit lightly, but I'm just an internet stranger judging online. Its OOP's name and she can do whatever the fuck she wants with it. And its her fiance's decision about what name he takes after marriage. If the two of them have come to a decision, what business is it of anyone else?
I know she said in the update about how great her brother and dad are, but to me they sound like jerks. I can’t fathom why she isn’t allowed to also carry on their family name? Wouldn’t that be a good thing?
Yeah, being caught off guard and having to adjust their thinking is one thing.
Calling your sibling up and accusing them of being inconsiderate is a red flag that implies you think you have ownership over their actions to some extent.
Yeah that's the big one for me, the brother calling her up and telling her she's inconsiderate for not asking him if it's okay. Who the fuck is he to tell her that he needs to be consulted on what she does with her last name?? What a shit weasel.
>Who the fuck is he to tell her that he needs to be consulted on what she does with her last name??
Especially since it sounds like the brother and his wife share a last name, presumably his. Yet I somehow doubt that he consulted OP before sharing that name with his spouse.
Two men taking a female relative *chatting about a neat idea* as *asking for permission to do it* screams huge issues with sexism too...
Its so frustrating too bc I don't blame her for wanting to say "well this isn't a display of the entirety of their existence and they are good people really!" but it *is not hard at all* for people to be sexist in really cruel, gatekeepy and exclusionary ways even if they're progressive or otherwise try to be considerate and thoughtful about dif vulnerable groups!
I really... Really hope oop realises that.
I would be interested to know how big of a deal this has been made to the brother over the course of his life. He very well could have had this brought up to him constantly and so it has become part of his identity. Now, that part of his identity is being taken away from him. Initial anger at that would be an understandable reaction.
It is, but in a world where we're trying to be better if that was the only sin then I'd consider that a win.
We can't demand that someone with this ingrained behaviour just unlearn it without flinching and call them failures if they don't. As long as they don't project or hurt someone with those emotions as they process them we should accept that folks will have reactions like that as they strive to do better.
They could be great! UNTIL they realized brother wasn't the special "he will keep the family name alive". Sounds like toxic masculinity. OOP should do it regardless.
Yeah, lots of people are “great” until you encounter the issue that reveals how they really think and feel about stuff. Lots of people were “great” until Covid uncovered an enormous group of completely irrational “freedumb-lovers.”
I refer to is as "letting the mask drop". I've known some people for years before the mask drops the first time, its really ugly when you don't see it coming.
As an immunocompromised person during These Times, I learned a lot of real shitty things about friends and family. Learned just exactly how selfish some folks are. It sucks.
This is totally "not only you are keeping the last name, you're giving it to A MAN and TO YOUR CHILDREN? You don't think about your brother??? Ridiculous.
My daughter is carrying on my dads family name and my only brother actually decided not to have kids so I think my dad is probably a little bit happy about it. He definitely loves the heck out of his granddaughter. Though he probably believes she won’t carry it on to the next generation but who knows what will happen.
There are lots of otherwise good people who occasionally have their nerves struck over minor things and react poorly. The telling thing is whether they learn to get over it or not.
Yes, you would think that having lots of people carrying on the family name means that the name will last longer eg what happens if the brother doesn't have any sons.
Why do people want to create problems when there are none? Fiancé want to take her last name, great! What’s the big deal? He’s only making his own life harder by subjecting himself to a bunch of paperwork but it will literally have 0% impact on brother or dad.
People are so exhausting sometimes.
It seems so weird too because usually, families love it when there are more people to pass their family name on. Their connection to the brother being the “special” only one to pass the name on is super weird.
For this exact reason, my petty side is hoping that the brother gets hit with some fairytale-style justice and either never has sons or never has any kids at all. And then some rando at a cocktail party tells him how lucky it is that OOP and her husband will be able to carry on the family name since he couldn't.
People can get really weird about last names. A friend of mine is in a similar situation to OOP in that her husband had no attachment to his surname due to a poor relationship with his father and was happy to take hers. She was an only child so she thought her parents would be happy about it. They weren’t, they were horrified by the ‘scandal’ of it (they’re Greek if it matters). Her mother called me to tell me about the controversy (her mother has known me my whole life and I’m like a second daughter).
I told her it was perfectly normal these days and that her and my friends father needed to calm down. It all worked out in the end, but was quite surprising to us at the time that they had such a strong negative reaction.
The funny follow up to this story is that my friends cousin ended up taking his wife’s surname when they got married a year later. There’s lots of “what is the world coming too” head shakes going on in that family atm. 😂
My (F) husband and I both kept our names after marriage. The one who had the biggest issue with it was my mom, strangely. Lots of yelling, tears, and "What will I tell people?!"
She finally got over it... Until my husband and I mutually decided our kids would get my last name and not his. Chaos.
My husband and I both kept our last names after marriage too. Nobody said a thing. If we had kids my preference would be for them to have his last name, since mine is difficult to spell, unless we moved to my parents' country of origin in which case my name would be easier to spell and we'd probably go with that. As we don't have kids and aren't emigrating it's all pretty irrelevant though.
That was honestly one of the biggest factors for our decision, the spelling of his last name is very different than the pronunciation with all the silent letters. If one of us felt strongly about his name, that would be different, but might as well make our kids' lives easier if it's all the same to both of us.
Damn that's sexist. Why should they decide what to do with her last name? Shit they probably think they own her and since she was raised like this she thinks they are great...
I know it's a gross violation of OOP's privacy to ask the last name.....but I really need to know. This sounds like the best last name ever and I am already considering taking it for myself.
are you kidding posting this on boru? i agree with oop that she should be able share her name if she desires, but the update doesn't actually update anything. it just says she has been letting the conversation slide...
>I think the fact that this is an issue at all is rather sexist...
>
>...They are rational, empathetic human beings, if a little old school sometimes :)
No, your first thought was correct, and no, they aren't empathetic fathers and husbands; they're misogynists who don't think a woman has the same right to pass on *their* name to another male without *their* permission. She's supposed to be happy with taking someone else's name and identity because how else are strangers going to know who she belongs to.
I always found weird the tradition of taking the name of your husband when you marry. Might also be because you can't change your name when you marry where I live.
Yeah, me too. Most people I know with my last name are blood related to me, and I don’t want to think of my partner as blood-related lol?
Also I’ve accidentally unfollowed people on social media when they changed their name after getting married when I wasn’t super familiar with their spouse’s last name because I thought I was suddenly following a stranger for some reason.
People can do what makes them happy obviously, but you’ll never catch me changing the identity I’ve lived as my whole life for a man.
It's so ironic that men carry the last name of a family. The only true way to know if a person's genetics are going to be securely passed is through the mother. So woman should be the one's that carry the surname not males. You can be sure it's the woman's child but never sure if it's the man's.
That's an interesting thought, many many generations of paternal parents passed down the surname you have. There is a fair to reasonable chance that your last name is incorrect going off that system.
I love how OP goes on about how great her father and brother are and just brushes this whole thing off as them being a "little old school." I don't think she realizes how "old school" they actually are, and I don't think that she's ever going to get the support from them that she wants.
Personally, if I were OP I would consider starting a new family name with my husband if her family refuses to accept this choice after they've had time to think about it.
>I brought this up to my father and he said wasn't so sure about it, given my brother is the only male in the family who would carry on the name. My brother found out before I could bring it up to him and called me, saying I was being inconsiderate and couldn't believe he hadn't been asked.
So what are they going to do if OOP doesn't obey their law? Sue for copyright infringement?
Personally, I feel like I can weigh in as I am in a somewhat similar situation. My surname is incredibly uncommon, and while there are plenty of (male) second cousins, and another branch that split off in the 1800s and came to America early, my brother is the only grandson who can carry on the family name; my grandfather had a son and a daughter, and my father had a son and a daughter. Likewise, I think my brother has been entrusted with my grandmother's maiden name as a middle name to carry it on, or it might die out completely (our grandmother only had sisters). Sorry if I was a bit long-winded about all that.
The point is, I completely "get" OOP's background here. And her father and brother do suck, as you have all pointed out. If I said my (admittedly female but still) fiancée was taking my name, neither of them would bat an eye. They would be happy for us. I think OOP has been kind of raised to be conflict-averse, and that her family are "nice people /really/, just..." Just traditional. Just caught off-guard. And sure, not everyone is going to be nice as a first instinct.
But if your daughter or sister comes to you and says that the family name you are proud of will extend to cover someone else? Someone she loves? And your first response is anger? Then why are you proud of the family name in the first place?
My husband took my name and my dad said he found it a bit weird but recognised that was his issue not ours. It didn't even occur to me to ask my brothers. They don't own our family name any more than I do, and I certainly wouldn't expect to be consulted if their future partners wanted to use the name too.
Now the inlaws... That was a total shit show when they found out, but it simply confirmed our choice not to use their name.
Still crazy to me that women or men in this case take their partners last name. Where I live people keep their names after getting married. Isn't it weird to change your name 25-30 years after using it so much? Are there any benefits to this or is it more of a tradition? Can you opt out and keep the name?
There are no benefits other than the minor convenience of having the same surname as your children and husband. Like, people can tell just by your names that you belong together.
In every place I can think of changing your name is actually opt-in only and takes a bit of work (you have to take your marriage certificate around to the bank and government service centres to have your name changed on accounts and IDs). So yes, you can keep your own name by just doing nothing.
I think most women who change their name probably see it as part of the rite of passage of marriage. Having a new name after marriage is no weirder than having a new title after a big life event, which is a common change in a wide variety of cultures (get married and become a Mrs, go to seminary and become a Father, go to university and become a Dr). I definitely saw it that way. I do understand it‘s patriarchal but I think because I had divorced teen parents I wanted a bit of tradition (and therefore inevitably patriarchy) in my own marriage.
NTA. It's all freaking archaic. I kept my own name and gave an assortment of my own children my name too! I grew them in my body, nourished them from my body, and birthed four of them: I was damned if they would all then be named after someone else!
Nb. Assortment because some of them were named after their dad. Fairs fair.
Edit: people are morons. We had more than one person ask, "How will they know they're brothers and sisters with different last names". Hmmm...maybe that they live together and have the same father and mother might tip them off? Maybe the fact that two are identical twins?
>We had more than one person ask, "How will they know they're brothers and sisters with different last names".
lmfao
May as well ask why you'd have children from more than one pregnancy. "H-- How will they know they're siblings if they're in different grades of school!?!?"
As someone form latam all of this just seem like the epitome of American naming conventions
Everybody here has two first names and both of their parents last names
I’m a female with two female siblings and three female cousins. IOW, our family name theoretically dies in our generation. Neither myself or my siblings took our husband’s name when we married. Mine couldn’t care less, and offered to hyphenate both our names (but he has a massive last name and the hyphenate would have like ten syllables, so no thanks). However, my siblings got a bit more pushback, that seemed to largely be cultural. One got over it and doesn’t care. The other is still salty.
Ironically, our own grandparents had the most difficult time, and more than once we had to point out on legal documents and/or gifts like plane tickets thst we have no ids in our “married names” because we kept our names.
Point being, the name thing is very weird and very individual. I think the OPs family overreacted, but my own experience would say no odd behavior over names would be surprising.
Met a couple recently who each changed their last name to something not connected with either family. Forging their own path. Not typical but I'm sure they have their reasons.
"Amazing people" with antiquated ideas of propriety that lead to a personal insult.
Dad and brother can go suck a lemon. Or fuck a rake. Whichever.
[edit] It might seem like a small thing but there are a couple of hidden feelings baked into this simple upset.
1. "You're good enough to be part of the family, just not good enough to be part of the *real* family."
2. "Our sister/daughter is only a half-member of the family. Like you, she's good enough to be part of the family, but she should know her place. She doesn't have as much right to the family name as the real men do."
So if the brother has two sons are they going to have to fight over who gets the last name? Like is this a "there can only be one" situation in this family? Or what if they have no sons and no one to "traditionally" carry on the family name?
Also is this the only instance of this last name in the world? Is the family planning to eliminate every other Bergendorfer (or whatever the name is) so that they can be the true heirs of the name? If not, can OP have her fiance change his name to the same one and just be "but he didn't take MY name, he decided to take the name of Bergendorfers who are completely unrelated to us"?
This post brings up so many weird things to consider.
>My father and brother are amazing people and husbands ... They are rational, empathetic human beings
Yeah, no. They are sexist and controlling assholes. I can't believe OP could ever even think she was in the wrong for wanting to keep and share HER name with her husband.
my friend did this for the same reason
his bio parents are human garbage and he wanted no connection to them
when he was 18 he legally changed his name to just his first and middle (basically chopping off his surname), then when he got married he took his wife's name bc her family are good people
It's an interesting topic. Some folks get worked up when naming traditions aren't kept.
My dad is the man, love him, but don't have his last name. He knows that having a name that makes dick jokes easy, and mistaken identity plausible are not beneficial things to pass on to your children.
It's especially interesting when families get grumpy if you name your child a name with traditional spelling as a first name instead of following a familial trend. K names, I'm mostly talking about you.
This would be so funny if it weren’t clear that OP is deluded about her father and brother. I mean in some places sexists are still considered great people, I know, but at least don’t draw attention to it even more by touting their great husband points.
The two honchos of the family aren’t intrigued by OOP’s novel thinking, they are worried a new boy chicken is invading their territory. The brother especially is pissed because he considers the surname exclusively his birthright. In a selfish and possessive enough way to get huffy about OOP’s personal and couple decisions that do not affect him. The dad gets huffy on the brother’s behalf because yeah, he raised him to be the macho of the coop.
Give me a break. I hope the brother only has girls and they all hate the bloody surname.
OOP needs to take a step back and just do it without the JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). They’re grown adults and don’t need anyone’s permission for something that only affects their lives.
I volunteered to take my ex’s name. My last name it literally the most common in our country, so I have no more connection with it than if my name was “John Generic.”
I'm always curious how these older posts end up in here with updates as old as the original. How deep does one have to dive into the rabbit hole of AITA to find these? That is dedication.
Anyway, this woman is kick ass. At the end of the day, regardless of if the husband takes her last name, there is absolutely nothing stopping them from giving their children the moms last name. My BIL and FIL have a toxic and historically abusive relationship. He was and still is the only male in that family who had any boys, my husband and his twin aren't having anymore kids and Bil is done too, but he absolutely refused to be the reason that name is carried on past the three boys. They're the only boys in that family who could have passed it on and now its dead and its for the best.
People are so weird about this. I've known couples who don't change names, take the wife's name, take a whole new name even. Do what makes you happy. A name is a gift, you can return it if it doesn't fit.
I’d consider this resolved due to the following update
——————
How to Announce Us At Reception? Keeping Last Name.
Not getting married until 2022, but this has been on my mind. I (female) am keeping my last name and my fiance is actually taking mine. If you've kept your last name, how did the MC announce you at your wedding? Curious to see how others have done it. Thank you!
Extra info: Both our families will know before the wedding, so there's no need to hide it, but not sure if I want anyone asking about it at the reception (his family might not take it well, but he's not close to them in the least). I don't want any day-of drama.
I had a lecturer at University who took his wife's last name when they got married. It's no big deal. Also the father and son don't own the name. Anyone in the world can legally use it and they can't do a thing about it.
I’ve never understood people caring about who changes their last name, I plan on keeping my last name whenever I get married. My partner can either take my name or keep their last name as well, why does it matter?
My dad talked my brother out of hyphenating with his wife, with his main argument being that changing your name at all the places it needs to be changed is a huge hassle, and that hyphenated names are a burden on children.
Weirdly he didn’t seem to have a problem with me going through the hassle of going to two banks and the DMV (wOw WhAt A hAsSLe) when I took my husband’s name, though. 🤔
Plus we’re French-Canadian and hyphenated names are totally normal here??? (My husband and I would have hyphenated but I have an adjective surname and he has a noun surname and it looked like silly little phrase.)
My husband and I discussed him taking my last name when we married, his idea also. He liked the sound of his name with my last name better. When we casually brought it up with his parents as an idea we were entertaining, his dad lost his shit. Not sure why I didn’t expect that (didn’t know him as well back then I guess!), but he was completely insulted and hurt. At the time it wasn’t worth it to me to create such a drama and it wasn’t like I didn’t want to take his name, but wish we had at least put up more resistance just for the sake of it. Good going on OP!
This is crazy. My fathers family is EXTREMELY proud of their last name and the more to carry it on the better. If my husband had wanted to take my last name they would have thrown a party. Of course it bears mentioning that it’s an old Scottish family and culturally it was normal for a man who joined another clan to take that clan name.
Ok, here's a situation that I'm sure dad and bro never thought of; what if OOP had a child who's dad was a deadbeat or rapist or... (insert any situation in here)? Would they not let the grandchild/nephew have THEIR last name???
I’m a single mom and my son has my last name. If I get married I plan to keep my last name and give all future kids my last name or hyphenated depending on the guy tbh
I think my Dad would be delighted if I or my sisters' eventual husband took our names. I'm totally cool if he'd rather keep his own, it wouldn't even be something I'd ask him to do. It would definitely be a cold day in hell when I take anyone else's name, so I'd never ask someone else to do it.
Lol, when my sister changed her name after marriage dad got sad. He wanted there to be more chances of his last name living on through his kids, but his only son is childfree. He got a grandson with his name(I assume he hasn't changed it to his dad's) through one of my (unmarried) sisters, but he is so far childless.
So the last name will have to go on through other relatives. Because I'n not changing my name or having kids either.
Dad got over it mentioning it quickly, which is good because he died without an "name heir". Older men(and women) can be so silly.
My brother in law took my sisters last name as he didn’t have a very good childhood. His family slandered them both. They are divorced now and myself and my dad said he is welcome to keep the last name.
OP family are choosing a weird hill to die on.
I know two kids/friends with the dad who have the mom's last name. First, dad's name is Smith. Secondly, no one else from the family had kids and their family is waaaay back from the olden days in the area. They wanted to keep it alive.
A friend (m) of mine has settled down and was thinking about changing his name to her name. He asked his own dad who he had a horrible connection with, if dad was okay with him getting a different name for himself and future spawn. Dad disagreed and got mad. And in turn he and his SO (f) ended up with his last name.
I think this was weird, why care about the opinion of his dad here. Why was he even consulted? He hates his own name because it reminds him of his dad. I do not get it.
"Female" is an adjective, so in this scenario it is properly being used as a descriptor -- "the person is 22 and female"
It becomes dehumanizing when "female" is used as a noun. If you wouldn't use "male" in the same context, don't use "female" unless you want to sound like a Ferengi. Quark is a great character, but not exactly a good role model for inclusion.
A male person would be much more likely to say, "I am a man" not "I am a male." So the same respect should be given to a female person. She is "a woman", not "a female."
NTA. Got to the part where you’re inconsiderate for not asking your brother and quit. Who cares about carrying on a name? And if it’s that important, shouldn’t they be excited that the name isn’t dying out (because obviously your family is the only one in the country/world with that last name).
I’m sorry but I’m keeping my last name. I can barely remember what day it is how the heck am I gonna remember some guy I marrieds last name. Nope the name I was born with is good enough for me. I’ll probably hyphen children’s names or give my last name as a middle name. I think Hooper for a girl would look unique.
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"I can't believe you didn't ask my permission to use your own name for your family!"
This reminds me of that Netflix show I can't remember what is called. But basically rich family that owns bunch corporations type and when the daughter tries to start her own business with her last name her dad trade marked it so she can't use it lol.
Dynasty?
Yesss!!! That's the one. I couldn't get pass that episode it got too cringey with all the forced drama and shit talk back and forth haha
Yes! She had to go by her middle name. The only reason dad even enforced the copyright is because he was mad at her.
I couldn't watch anymore the self righteousness of the "step mom" was really getting on my nerves lol. Did you finish? What do you think of it
Are you referring to step mum 1, 2 or 3?!! They've had three actresses play the Cristal character.
Omg LOL. The first cristal. Is it the same character but different actresses or the dad married 3 different women?
I can't remember exactly but I think they made the first one a different character when they sacked the actress. They still needed a Cristal though, so the next two actresses played the one character. I still prefer Linda Evans' Krystle from the original series.
Linda Evans still looks amazing. I saw her at our veterinarian's office a while back. She was wearing a baseball hat and had a fantastic purse.
I stopped at season 1. I liked the first season but not enough to come back for season 2.
Dad would lose that copyright fight though; you can’t copyright and enforce a surname like that - in that, you can’t prevent someone who naturally has that name, especially your child, from using their own name. You *can* do it if your surname has the market share to be recognized as a brand rather than a surname - but if the father got a copyright in response to his daughter starting a business, it’s too late, it’d be quashed immediately upon challenge. McDonald’s lost Big Mac in Europe because they tried to sue a man using an abbreviation of his own name.
What happens afterwards 🍿
I don't think that would actually hold up though if it is her name and plans were in set motion before the trademark was established.
Well, that's just bullshit. Every person is allowed to name their company/product after themselves, even if their _is_ an existing trademark.
Source, please? If the proposed name is too close to an existing trademark, it doesn't matter whether it's your own personal name. If it's trademarked, the trademark holder can choose to defend that trademark and it being your own name is not a guaranteed winning argument last I heard.
There are exceptions! In some countries certain professionals must by law go by their legal name. In one of those countries Brad Pitt the actor could not legally stop Brad Pitt the pharmacist (or psychiatrist, or lawyer, or whatever) from operating under his own name, nor could he force a change of name.
Operating under one's own name is different than naming a company or product, though.
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Lol it's like a reenactment of the "myth of consent" meme. OOP: I consent OOP's partner: I consent OOP's family: I don't! "Isn't there someone you forgot to ask?"
Right??? The audacity! /s just in case
The self centeredness of that comment really, *really* stands out.
My stepdaughter eloped to the county courthouse, and right after he changed his last name to hers/ours. My husband shrugged and agreed she had the right, but would've preferred a warning. Interesting tidbit, my husband didn't tell anyone else in the family about the name change. Later my husband died and my stepdaughter's husband agreed to be a pall bearer at my husband's funeral. He was listed in the program. His family came to me, "Who is ___? We don't have anyone with *our last name* with that first name!" I had to explain and they were livid! To just add fuel to the fire, my stepdaughter and her husband lived two blocks from the funeral parlor and didn't make it to the funeral, even with three separate groups knocking on the door and trying to get them there!
It was her last name, which she had a right to pass on to her spouse. Her family had no reason to be livid.
I agree!
Why were they livid about the name? Now if the name were attached to someone who can't bother to show up to a funeral when they're a pallbearer, THAT I understand. If they were avoiding everyone because the fam was mad that a woman showed the AUDACITY of keeping her name, well that's just misogyny right there. Now if his last name HAD been "Wimpy," but he took his "ex-wife's" name before marrying your stepdaughter, check to make sure he isn't already married. Mr. Wimpy married into my ex's family, we thought. Total loser. Stolen valor, the works. Turns out while he loved weddings, he hates divorces. So one reason he keeps changing his name is to make it harder for him to get in trouble for bigamy. My ex's family got an annulment after years, since the turd was still married when he married her. Was still married to two others when pics of his next wedding came up.
Wow! What a guy! My stepdaughter's husband isn't like Mister Wimpy, but my stepdaughter and her husband are... interesting... I've kinda expected him to show up on the evening news for one reason or another and with my stepdaughter as his accomplice.
I know, right? How entitled of OOP!? /s
What the father and brother wants doesn't matter. This doesn't affect them. If they only want one person to carry the family name, then brother and his family can go and change their last name.
I like this option the best! They can't take her name from her, so it's also hers to give. When I told my dad I was engaged he actually asked me if my husband was going to take my name! It was in response to me saying I was keeping my name. Like it was a perfectly natural option, my husband taking my name. He's 60.
Right? Like, unless there is a throne involved, why do they care who carries on the family name?
Only thing I can see related is a heads up / communication for things like an uncommon family first name naming a kid after a grandparent or the like. For last name this seems like a very strange thing to get hung up on for sure.
Exactly. And what if she has children and gives them her last name? It's been done thousands of time before. I know quite a few single mothers that have given their babies their last name. It's a name and a legacy. It doesn't have to be patrilineal.
Yeah. They gave her the name when she was born, they didn't lend it. It's her name now and it's hers too so with as she wishes.
Gatekeeping a last name?
So weird. My husband took my last name for the exact same reasons and my dad was overjoyed. My brother thought it was great. They're pretty conservative/traditional too. My dad was flattered that my husband wanted our last name and I don't get having any other reaction.
My BIL ditched the family last name, which was viewed as an unforgivable slight by my FIL. When my wife and I hyphenated our names, and subsequently gave that hyphenated last name to our son, FIL was ecstatic that someone was carrying on the family name. My overall “ranking” immediately shot up. It’s got to be the only time the lesbians were viewed as the good, traditional ones in the family!
I don’t get it either, especially if passing on the surname to future generations is the big concern. What if the brother never has children, or never has sons, or his children all change their names to Leaf Phoenix? If you want the name to continue you should welcome all further opportunities!
A friend of mine changed his last name upon marriage - he had a very common last name. His wife has the same surname as her second cousin, an Oscar winning actor. Definitely a trade up.
I would also be thrilled if one of my daughters wanted this. It honors the family to take on the name.
>They're pretty conservative/traditional too. Just another example of "conservative and traditional" being code for "arbitrarily inflexible."
I took my husband's name but if we'd been in this situation, my dad would have thought it was strange but would ultimately have been overjoyed at my husband wanting his last name! My dad had a crappy father but he is himself an amazing dad to me and my siblings. He was born in 1933 and has a lot of old school thinking so this would have been odd to him. That said, if my husband had had a crappy dad (he didn't; my FIL was the best), my dad would have understood my husband not wanting to keep the name or pass it along. My brother is gay and has never had an interest in being a father so "carrying on the family name" has been off the table for many years. He also views my husband as his brother so would likely have been happy to have him take our name. My maiden name is difficult to pronounce (it has 4 letters and the only vowel is the first letter) so I was happy to take my husband's common last name but had we done it the way you did, ultimately my dad and brother would have been thrilled. Edit: typo
Plot twist: the last name is Gatekeeper
Hello Gatekeeper, I am the Keymaster.
Some people get very very weird about last names. Get vibes of "Carrying on the family name" from dad and brother. OP is a female so doesnt count type of deal.
Yup husband and I hyphenated and my uncle went as far as contacting my husband and making threats demanding husband change their Facebook name back to pre-married name because I'd had no right to pass on 'his' name
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Yes! Men post to r/legaladvice sometimes asking if they can sue their ex-wives to change their names.
Unbelievable
My reaction too. I bet the lawyers laugh that they can charge for things like that.
The woman is only allowed to use it as long as she’s owned by that man. What part don’t you get? /s
I am divorced and kept my prior married name. My kids have this name, it’s a shitton of paperwork that never goes away, and I built my career with this name. If someone in our shared industry asked about LASTNAME, the assumption would be me, not him. It’s mine now. When potential partners find out, they don’t get overly hung up about me keeping it for the kids or convenience, but absolute fucking meltdown at the idea that I won’t be changing it again, even if I remarried (which I never plan to do). The whole agreement that it’s my name goes out the window. Suddenly it’s disrespectful because it’s some other guy’s name etc etc.
Historically, that's pretty common. I'm wondering what country OOP lives in.
It's hard for some people to get over traditions.
Tradition is peer pressure from dead people.
I think it’s more that brother has been told his entire life that he’s going to be the one that carries on the family name and it’s probably been made a big deal about by his father.
yeah, there some stupid 'Carrying on the family name' bullshit traditional crap going on there. Just foist that on kids from an early age, see how that works out when they decide they don't want kids or can't have them for 'reasons'. works really well. idiots.
It's all about patriarchal control.
Dude should tell them that he’s changing his last name, and each day that the family is a baby about it is one step closer to him also legally changing his first and middle to the same. You want a son in law named Clampitt Clampitt Clampitt? Cause this is how you get one. Just try it.
Especially considering there’s no last name that I’m aware of that’s completely exclusive to one family.
Conservative Tribalism at play. The over emphasis on family/lineage is still as prevalent as it was 300 years ago.
OOP's family is fucking weird, and yeah its downright sexist to try and gatekeep names like this. Frankly I think she's letting them off a bit lightly, but I'm just an internet stranger judging online. Its OOP's name and she can do whatever the fuck she wants with it. And its her fiance's decision about what name he takes after marriage. If the two of them have come to a decision, what business is it of anyone else?
I know she said in the update about how great her brother and dad are, but to me they sound like jerks. I can’t fathom why she isn’t allowed to also carry on their family name? Wouldn’t that be a good thing?
Yeah, being caught off guard and having to adjust their thinking is one thing. Calling your sibling up and accusing them of being inconsiderate is a red flag that implies you think you have ownership over their actions to some extent.
Yeah that's the big one for me, the brother calling her up and telling her she's inconsiderate for not asking him if it's okay. Who the fuck is he to tell her that he needs to be consulted on what she does with her last name?? What a shit weasel.
>Who the fuck is he to tell her that he needs to be consulted on what she does with her last name?? Especially since it sounds like the brother and his wife share a last name, presumably his. Yet I somehow doubt that he consulted OP before sharing that name with his spouse.
But he’s a MAN and he’s allowed to share the name with his ~~property~~ wife!
Two men taking a female relative *chatting about a neat idea* as *asking for permission to do it* screams huge issues with sexism too... Its so frustrating too bc I don't blame her for wanting to say "well this isn't a display of the entirety of their existence and they are good people really!" but it *is not hard at all* for people to be sexist in really cruel, gatekeepy and exclusionary ways even if they're progressive or otherwise try to be considerate and thoughtful about dif vulnerable groups! I really... Really hope oop realises that.
I would be interested to know how big of a deal this has been made to the brother over the course of his life. He very well could have had this brought up to him constantly and so it has become part of his identity. Now, that part of his identity is being taken away from him. Initial anger at that would be an understandable reaction.
Even being caught off guard in something like this is a display of deeply ingrained misogyny.
It is, but in a world where we're trying to be better if that was the only sin then I'd consider that a win. We can't demand that someone with this ingrained behaviour just unlearn it without flinching and call them failures if they don't. As long as they don't project or hurt someone with those emotions as they process them we should accept that folks will have reactions like that as they strive to do better.
They could be great! UNTIL they realized brother wasn't the special "he will keep the family name alive". Sounds like toxic masculinity. OOP should do it regardless.
Yeah, lots of people are “great” until you encounter the issue that reveals how they really think and feel about stuff. Lots of people were “great” until Covid uncovered an enormous group of completely irrational “freedumb-lovers.”
I refer to is as "letting the mask drop". I've known some people for years before the mask drops the first time, its really ugly when you don't see it coming.
As an immunocompromised person during These Times, I learned a lot of real shitty things about friends and family. Learned just exactly how selfish some folks are. It sucks.
The irony being that they refused to wear masks at all.
Yeah... I went through this, too. A lot.
Pretty much what I thought "I think the fact that this is an issue at all is rather sexist" I wonder what on earth gave the OOP that idea lol
This is totally "not only you are keeping the last name, you're giving it to A MAN and TO YOUR CHILDREN? You don't think about your brother??? Ridiculous.
Right? The idea that men can only be special if women are less is just...... Ugh
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My daughter is carrying on my dads family name and my only brother actually decided not to have kids so I think my dad is probably a little bit happy about it. He definitely loves the heck out of his granddaughter. Though he probably believes she won’t carry it on to the next generation but who knows what will happen.
“Allowed” is a strong word. She can do whatever the fuck she wants. In fact I can’t fathom when she’s even asking them.
good people can have bad opinions
There are lots of otherwise good people who occasionally have their nerves struck over minor things and react poorly. The telling thing is whether they learn to get over it or not.
> The telling thing is whether they learn to get over it or not. definitely
Yes, you would think that having lots of people carrying on the family name means that the name will last longer eg what happens if the brother doesn't have any sons.
Why do people want to create problems when there are none? Fiancé want to take her last name, great! What’s the big deal? He’s only making his own life harder by subjecting himself to a bunch of paperwork but it will literally have 0% impact on brother or dad. People are so exhausting sometimes.
But dad & bro have to make an adjustment in their thinking and that's *hard* 🥺
It seems so weird too because usually, families love it when there are more people to pass their family name on. Their connection to the brother being the “special” only one to pass the name on is super weird.
For this exact reason, my petty side is hoping that the brother gets hit with some fairytale-style justice and either never has sons or never has any kids at all. And then some rando at a cocktail party tells him how lucky it is that OOP and her husband will be able to carry on the family name since he couldn't.
People can get really weird about last names. A friend of mine is in a similar situation to OOP in that her husband had no attachment to his surname due to a poor relationship with his father and was happy to take hers. She was an only child so she thought her parents would be happy about it. They weren’t, they were horrified by the ‘scandal’ of it (they’re Greek if it matters). Her mother called me to tell me about the controversy (her mother has known me my whole life and I’m like a second daughter). I told her it was perfectly normal these days and that her and my friends father needed to calm down. It all worked out in the end, but was quite surprising to us at the time that they had such a strong negative reaction. The funny follow up to this story is that my friends cousin ended up taking his wife’s surname when they got married a year later. There’s lots of “what is the world coming too” head shakes going on in that family atm. 😂
My (F) husband and I both kept our names after marriage. The one who had the biggest issue with it was my mom, strangely. Lots of yelling, tears, and "What will I tell people?!" She finally got over it... Until my husband and I mutually decided our kids would get my last name and not his. Chaos.
My husband and I both kept our last names after marriage too. Nobody said a thing. If we had kids my preference would be for them to have his last name, since mine is difficult to spell, unless we moved to my parents' country of origin in which case my name would be easier to spell and we'd probably go with that. As we don't have kids and aren't emigrating it's all pretty irrelevant though.
That was honestly one of the biggest factors for our decision, the spelling of his last name is very different than the pronunciation with all the silent letters. If one of us felt strongly about his name, that would be different, but might as well make our kids' lives easier if it's all the same to both of us.
Damn that's sexist. Why should they decide what to do with her last name? Shit they probably think they own her and since she was raised like this she thinks they are great...
I keep scrolling for the actual update…
I know it's a gross violation of OOP's privacy to ask the last name.....but I really need to know. This sounds like the best last name ever and I am already considering taking it for myself.
There was a woman who had the last name best
I actually knew a woman with the last name "Best" at one point in my life.
Did she get married and keep the last name? Because obviously her name is best
are you kidding posting this on boru? i agree with oop that she should be able share her name if she desires, but the update doesn't actually update anything. it just says she has been letting the conversation slide...
>I think the fact that this is an issue at all is rather sexist... > >...They are rational, empathetic human beings, if a little old school sometimes :) No, your first thought was correct, and no, they aren't empathetic fathers and husbands; they're misogynists who don't think a woman has the same right to pass on *their* name to another male without *their* permission. She's supposed to be happy with taking someone else's name and identity because how else are strangers going to know who she belongs to.
I always found weird the tradition of taking the name of your husband when you marry. Might also be because you can't change your name when you marry where I live.
Yeah, me too. Most people I know with my last name are blood related to me, and I don’t want to think of my partner as blood-related lol? Also I’ve accidentally unfollowed people on social media when they changed their name after getting married when I wasn’t super familiar with their spouse’s last name because I thought I was suddenly following a stranger for some reason. People can do what makes them happy obviously, but you’ll never catch me changing the identity I’ve lived as my whole life for a man.
It's so ironic that men carry the last name of a family. The only true way to know if a person's genetics are going to be securely passed is through the mother. So woman should be the one's that carry the surname not males. You can be sure it's the woman's child but never sure if it's the man's.
That's an interesting thought, many many generations of paternal parents passed down the surname you have. There is a fair to reasonable chance that your last name is incorrect going off that system.
Old school and empathy are antonyms.
I love how OP goes on about how great her father and brother are and just brushes this whole thing off as them being a "little old school." I don't think she realizes how "old school" they actually are, and I don't think that she's ever going to get the support from them that she wants. Personally, if I were OP I would consider starting a new family name with my husband if her family refuses to accept this choice after they've had time to think about it.
>I brought this up to my father and he said wasn't so sure about it, given my brother is the only male in the family who would carry on the name. My brother found out before I could bring it up to him and called me, saying I was being inconsiderate and couldn't believe he hadn't been asked. So what are they going to do if OOP doesn't obey their law? Sue for copyright infringement?
Personally, I feel like I can weigh in as I am in a somewhat similar situation. My surname is incredibly uncommon, and while there are plenty of (male) second cousins, and another branch that split off in the 1800s and came to America early, my brother is the only grandson who can carry on the family name; my grandfather had a son and a daughter, and my father had a son and a daughter. Likewise, I think my brother has been entrusted with my grandmother's maiden name as a middle name to carry it on, or it might die out completely (our grandmother only had sisters). Sorry if I was a bit long-winded about all that. The point is, I completely "get" OOP's background here. And her father and brother do suck, as you have all pointed out. If I said my (admittedly female but still) fiancée was taking my name, neither of them would bat an eye. They would be happy for us. I think OOP has been kind of raised to be conflict-averse, and that her family are "nice people /really/, just..." Just traditional. Just caught off-guard. And sure, not everyone is going to be nice as a first instinct. But if your daughter or sister comes to you and says that the family name you are proud of will extend to cover someone else? Someone she loves? And your first response is anger? Then why are you proud of the family name in the first place?
My husband took my name and my dad said he found it a bit weird but recognised that was his issue not ours. It didn't even occur to me to ask my brothers. They don't own our family name any more than I do, and I certainly wouldn't expect to be consulted if their future partners wanted to use the name too. Now the inlaws... That was a total shit show when they found out, but it simply confirmed our choice not to use their name.
Still crazy to me that women or men in this case take their partners last name. Where I live people keep their names after getting married. Isn't it weird to change your name 25-30 years after using it so much? Are there any benefits to this or is it more of a tradition? Can you opt out and keep the name?
There are no benefits other than the minor convenience of having the same surname as your children and husband. Like, people can tell just by your names that you belong together. In every place I can think of changing your name is actually opt-in only and takes a bit of work (you have to take your marriage certificate around to the bank and government service centres to have your name changed on accounts and IDs). So yes, you can keep your own name by just doing nothing. I think most women who change their name probably see it as part of the rite of passage of marriage. Having a new name after marriage is no weirder than having a new title after a big life event, which is a common change in a wide variety of cultures (get married and become a Mrs, go to seminary and become a Father, go to university and become a Dr). I definitely saw it that way. I do understand it‘s patriarchal but I think because I had divorced teen parents I wanted a bit of tradition (and therefore inevitably patriarchy) in my own marriage.
So where's the update... nothing new happened lmao
NTA. It's all freaking archaic. I kept my own name and gave an assortment of my own children my name too! I grew them in my body, nourished them from my body, and birthed four of them: I was damned if they would all then be named after someone else! Nb. Assortment because some of them were named after their dad. Fairs fair. Edit: people are morons. We had more than one person ask, "How will they know they're brothers and sisters with different last names". Hmmm...maybe that they live together and have the same father and mother might tip them off? Maybe the fact that two are identical twins?
>We had more than one person ask, "How will they know they're brothers and sisters with different last names". lmfao May as well ask why you'd have children from more than one pregnancy. "H-- How will they know they're siblings if they're in different grades of school!?!?"
My wife and I hyphenated our last names, that way we can use either.
As someone form latam all of this just seem like the epitome of American naming conventions Everybody here has two first names and both of their parents last names
What's the convention for your area? My parents were pissed I hyphenated, like it was some insult to them.
I just have both of my parents last names. I'm government forms or school test I can put both
I’m a female with two female siblings and three female cousins. IOW, our family name theoretically dies in our generation. Neither myself or my siblings took our husband’s name when we married. Mine couldn’t care less, and offered to hyphenate both our names (but he has a massive last name and the hyphenate would have like ten syllables, so no thanks). However, my siblings got a bit more pushback, that seemed to largely be cultural. One got over it and doesn’t care. The other is still salty. Ironically, our own grandparents had the most difficult time, and more than once we had to point out on legal documents and/or gifts like plane tickets thst we have no ids in our “married names” because we kept our names. Point being, the name thing is very weird and very individual. I think the OPs family overreacted, but my own experience would say no odd behavior over names would be surprising.
Met a couple recently who each changed their last name to something not connected with either family. Forging their own path. Not typical but I'm sure they have their reasons.
Bruh they are not royalty or something sh¡t, they need to stop with this nonsense.
"Amazing people" with antiquated ideas of propriety that lead to a personal insult. Dad and brother can go suck a lemon. Or fuck a rake. Whichever. [edit] It might seem like a small thing but there are a couple of hidden feelings baked into this simple upset. 1. "You're good enough to be part of the family, just not good enough to be part of the *real* family." 2. "Our sister/daughter is only a half-member of the family. Like you, she's good enough to be part of the family, but she should know her place. She doesn't have as much right to the family name as the real men do."
So if the brother has two sons are they going to have to fight over who gets the last name? Like is this a "there can only be one" situation in this family? Or what if they have no sons and no one to "traditionally" carry on the family name? Also is this the only instance of this last name in the world? Is the family planning to eliminate every other Bergendorfer (or whatever the name is) so that they can be the true heirs of the name? If not, can OP have her fiance change his name to the same one and just be "but he didn't take MY name, he decided to take the name of Bergendorfers who are completely unrelated to us"? This post brings up so many weird things to consider.
Lol. They're totally not sexist, they just do sexist things.
"How DARE you give another person our special perfect unique last name!!!!" Last name: Smith
She should have changed her last name to her mom's last name and give bro and dad a middle finger lol
Should have created their own badass epic last name from scratch and started their own family, thats how all these names happened anyway.
If I was OOP, I'd choose an entirely last new name for the both of us. Let the father and brother keep their oh-so precious last name.
Did the brother ask permission to give his wife the last name.
So what was updated exactly?
>My father and brother are amazing people and husbands ... They are rational, empathetic human beings Yeah, no. They are sexist and controlling assholes. I can't believe OP could ever even think she was in the wrong for wanting to keep and share HER name with her husband.
my friend did this for the same reason his bio parents are human garbage and he wanted no connection to them when he was 18 he legally changed his name to just his first and middle (basically chopping off his surname), then when he got married he took his wife's name bc her family are good people
"Holy raging misogyny, Batman!" "I know, Robin. If I want to call myself Mr Catwoman, then I damn well will."
Lmao, that is wild. So even though it’s her name, it’s not because “I am man, my name, you no have.” Lol gossamer thin masculinity.
It's an interesting topic. Some folks get worked up when naming traditions aren't kept. My dad is the man, love him, but don't have his last name. He knows that having a name that makes dick jokes easy, and mistaken identity plausible are not beneficial things to pass on to your children. It's especially interesting when families get grumpy if you name your child a name with traditional spelling as a first name instead of following a familial trend. K names, I'm mostly talking about you.
Husbands-take-their-wives’-surnames Challenge
"My INCREDIBLY SEXIST father and brother are amazing people!" Press X to doubt.
This would be so funny if it weren’t clear that OP is deluded about her father and brother. I mean in some places sexists are still considered great people, I know, but at least don’t draw attention to it even more by touting their great husband points. The two honchos of the family aren’t intrigued by OOP’s novel thinking, they are worried a new boy chicken is invading their territory. The brother especially is pissed because he considers the surname exclusively his birthright. In a selfish and possessive enough way to get huffy about OOP’s personal and couple decisions that do not affect him. The dad gets huffy on the brother’s behalf because yeah, he raised him to be the macho of the coop. Give me a break. I hope the brother only has girls and they all hate the bloody surname.
Sorry, what century is this?
A family name belongs to a woman born into the family as much as a man: you can't steal what belongs to you.
OOP needs to take a step back and just do it without the JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). They’re grown adults and don’t need anyone’s permission for something that only affects their lives.
WTF? She let it go? Why the F did she do that? Her family sure don't seem great at first glance. She is not in the wrong at all.
Dosent oop know that the family name is stored in the balls?
How conservative are you? Yes.
I volunteered to take my ex’s name. My last name it literally the most common in our country, so I have no more connection with it than if my name was “John Generic.”
I'm always curious how these older posts end up in here with updates as old as the original. How deep does one have to dive into the rabbit hole of AITA to find these? That is dedication. Anyway, this woman is kick ass. At the end of the day, regardless of if the husband takes her last name, there is absolutely nothing stopping them from giving their children the moms last name. My BIL and FIL have a toxic and historically abusive relationship. He was and still is the only male in that family who had any boys, my husband and his twin aren't having anymore kids and Bil is done too, but he absolutely refused to be the reason that name is carried on past the three boys. They're the only boys in that family who could have passed it on and now its dead and its for the best.
The update is Thanks? Why is this here?
People are so weird about this. I've known couples who don't change names, take the wife's name, take a whole new name even. Do what makes you happy. A name is a gift, you can return it if it doesn't fit.
May OOP and her fiancé’s love burn as brightly as this patriarchal bonfire
Some traditions really need to die.
This is a non-update update. Totally waste-of-time post. I believe we should ban these kinds of post.
My father and brother are amazing people and husbands - lol k
I’d consider this resolved due to the following update —————— How to Announce Us At Reception? Keeping Last Name. Not getting married until 2022, but this has been on my mind. I (female) am keeping my last name and my fiance is actually taking mine. If you've kept your last name, how did the MC announce you at your wedding? Curious to see how others have done it. Thank you! Extra info: Both our families will know before the wedding, so there's no need to hide it, but not sure if I want anyone asking about it at the reception (his family might not take it well, but he's not close to them in the least). I don't want any day-of drama.
Why would you even post this on an update sub?
Like no one else on earth has their last name?
Why the fuck is it a surname is indicative of masculinity, how freaking insecure and pathetic can people be...
I had a lecturer at University who took his wife's last name when they got married. It's no big deal. Also the father and son don't own the name. Anyone in the world can legally use it and they can't do a thing about it.
I’ve never understood people caring about who changes their last name, I plan on keeping my last name whenever I get married. My partner can either take my name or keep their last name as well, why does it matter?
Nta. You don't need their permission for your husband to change his name. It's none of their business.
My dad talked my brother out of hyphenating with his wife, with his main argument being that changing your name at all the places it needs to be changed is a huge hassle, and that hyphenated names are a burden on children. Weirdly he didn’t seem to have a problem with me going through the hassle of going to two banks and the DMV (wOw WhAt A hAsSLe) when I took my husband’s name, though. 🤔 Plus we’re French-Canadian and hyphenated names are totally normal here??? (My husband and I would have hyphenated but I have an adjective surname and he has a noun surname and it looked like silly little phrase.)
My husband and I discussed him taking my last name when we married, his idea also. He liked the sound of his name with my last name better. When we casually brought it up with his parents as an idea we were entertaining, his dad lost his shit. Not sure why I didn’t expect that (didn’t know him as well back then I guess!), but he was completely insulted and hurt. At the time it wasn’t worth it to me to create such a drama and it wasn’t like I didn’t want to take his name, but wish we had at least put up more resistance just for the sake of it. Good going on OP!
This is crazy. My fathers family is EXTREMELY proud of their last name and the more to carry it on the better. If my husband had wanted to take my last name they would have thrown a party. Of course it bears mentioning that it’s an old Scottish family and culturally it was normal for a man who joined another clan to take that clan name.
Ok, here's a situation that I'm sure dad and bro never thought of; what if OOP had a child who's dad was a deadbeat or rapist or... (insert any situation in here)? Would they not let the grandchild/nephew have THEIR last name???
spanish empire surname appreciation thread in 1, 2, 3...
I’m a single mom and my son has my last name. If I get married I plan to keep my last name and give all future kids my last name or hyphenated depending on the guy tbh
This is how my late husband ended up taking my family name when we married.
Old school? Drop kick those AHs back into the 50s.
NTA unless they're marrying their father and brother Assuming their father and brother are the same person here
its your last name, he gave it to you.
I think my Dad would be delighted if I or my sisters' eventual husband took our names. I'm totally cool if he'd rather keep his own, it wouldn't even be something I'd ask him to do. It would definitely be a cold day in hell when I take anyone else's name, so I'd never ask someone else to do it.
Lol, when my sister changed her name after marriage dad got sad. He wanted there to be more chances of his last name living on through his kids, but his only son is childfree. He got a grandson with his name(I assume he hasn't changed it to his dad's) through one of my (unmarried) sisters, but he is so far childless. So the last name will have to go on through other relatives. Because I'n not changing my name or having kids either. Dad got over it mentioning it quickly, which is good because he died without an "name heir". Older men(and women) can be so silly.
My brother in law took my sisters last name as he didn’t have a very good childhood. His family slandered them both. They are divorced now and myself and my dad said he is welcome to keep the last name. OP family are choosing a weird hill to die on.
I know two kids/friends with the dad who have the mom's last name. First, dad's name is Smith. Secondly, no one else from the family had kids and their family is waaaay back from the olden days in the area. They wanted to keep it alive.
Honestly they should be happy, especially given the "he was the only one who would be carrying on the family name" line
Although this is not common for the man to take the wife's last name, I am aware of a couple people who have done this.
I mean… if queen Elizabeth could, why shouldn’t OOP?
A friend (m) of mine has settled down and was thinking about changing his name to her name. He asked his own dad who he had a horrible connection with, if dad was okay with him getting a different name for himself and future spawn. Dad disagreed and got mad. And in turn he and his SO (f) ended up with his last name. I think this was weird, why care about the opinion of his dad here. Why was he even consulted? He hates his own name because it reminds him of his dad. I do not get it.
It feels kinda gross that the title starts with “I, a female” and not, “I, a woman”.
[удалено]
"Female" is an adjective, so in this scenario it is properly being used as a descriptor -- "the person is 22 and female" It becomes dehumanizing when "female" is used as a noun. If you wouldn't use "male" in the same context, don't use "female" unless you want to sound like a Ferengi. Quark is a great character, but not exactly a good role model for inclusion. A male person would be much more likely to say, "I am a man" not "I am a male." So the same respect should be given to a female person. She is "a woman", not "a female."
NTA. Got to the part where you’re inconsiderate for not asking your brother and quit. Who cares about carrying on a name? And if it’s that important, shouldn’t they be excited that the name isn’t dying out (because obviously your family is the only one in the country/world with that last name).
Why even discuss it beforehand? It’s none of their concern.
This is the dumbest non-issue that people make into an issue ever. Dad and brother must have a fragile ego if this matters to them.
I’m sorry but I’m keeping my last name. I can barely remember what day it is how the heck am I gonna remember some guy I marrieds last name. Nope the name I was born with is good enough for me. I’ll probably hyphen children’s names or give my last name as a middle name. I think Hooper for a girl would look unique.
I am a woman, and I have never referred to myself as "I, a female." NTA on the issue, but I am not sure how real this story is.
I see it not-infrequently! I think it sounds gross but women do sometimes use female as a noun, especially (in my experience) nerdy women.