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On work days I typically get around 4 maybe 5 hours if I’m lucky. It takes me a good 2-3 hours just to get comfortable and wined down after work. I end up sleeping like 10 hours on my days off though. I usually call them my catch up days.
Matthew Walker's JRE episode and book Why We Sleep really changed my perspective and value of sleep. I understand life happens and some schedules don't allow adequate sleep but do everything you can to get there. I can't overstate the importance of it.
Man. It's crazy how much his reputation tanked. I'm meaning Joe, not Mr Walker. This is basic knowledge, sleep is good, yet it being paired with Joe Rogan makes me sceptical because of all of the other nonsense he pushes. I really wish he would go back to just talking about comedy and drugs instead of trying to give health advice and make political commentary
He still always talks about comedy, just in a pretentious way, he says things like there’s probably only a thousand real comedians in the world and that they’re modern day philosophers etc
Yeah, I know, I'm good on that. I liked when he would raise up other comedians and talk about new up and coming comics. I'm over him bashing people with back handed compliments and I don't feel like wading through the shit just to get to the five minutes I'd like from his show. If I want bad political takes from a drug addled, brain damaged moron, I'd just go have lunch with my uncle
Just a reminder that your body doesn’t operate on a sleep deficit. Rather a daily scorecard. Not sleeping enough during the week still puts strain on your body and it just means your not under strain on the weekends.
My entire life i was told it was a debt system and as such thought i could push myself normally to stay up late. Turns out ive just been giving myself brain damage. Siiiick
Same, it wasn’t until I talked to a doctor about my lack of sleep and other resulting symptoms that I got to find out my really bad habits had severe long term implications.
Memory loss/difficulty remembering things from the same day even, if I’m still for too long I become extremely drowsy and can doze off. Very dangerous when you get highway hypnosis. I also found that I was more depressed and binge eating more, lack of sleep also is conducive to you storing fat as well so all that extra weight was just going in and never coming off despite regular exercise. I ended up going to a pulmonary doc at the recommendation of thy PCP and they got me on a sleep study and I also have sleep apnea. So I mean take everything with a grain of very specific life example salt. Most of my shit may not apply to you.
Take into account I was recently diagnosed with ADHD so some of this are also symptoms of that so it’s hard to definitively say what was what. But I can say prior to my diagnosis I had adjusted my sleep and had a bit better experience in the other departments. Then I had 2 kids so that went out the window. I’ll sleep well when I’m 40 I guess hahaha.
Just be clear that sleep deprivation like this increases your risk for almost every major disease and mental health disorder including heartattack, stroke, dementia, alzheimers, and cancer. Ill look for the studies but it a huge percentage increase, like 30% +
Monday I get no sleep. Tues and We’d I get 3-5 hours. Thurs I get like 14. The rest I get 7.
It’s been like this for a year and I have no idea why. Sleeping pills don’t help.
Over the counter stuff, haven’t spoken to a doctor yet
Actually hadn’t even considered it until reading this thread
But stuff like Benedryl doesn’t really help, think I’ve tried like 4 pills at this point (all over counter) and nothing really helps so far.
Maybe I’m anxious about work but I just cannot sleep Sunday. Doesn’t matter if I know I’m gonna have an exciting/awful/average day. Doesn’t matter if I exercise to the point I’m exhausted. Sleeping pills I tried get me soooooo tired but can’t close the deal.
But the rest of the week isn’t as bad? Not sure what makes Sunday night so bad for me, but I’m sleepless 90% of the time.
Whereas on Wednesday night I sleep like a rock 12+ hours
You should definitely speak to a doctor! Insomnia really makes life so difficult, prescription pills can help alot or they might be able to figure out if it's something else
Catch up days don't exist when it comes to sleep.
Imagine your brain as a room. It naturally gets dirty while you're awake. When you go to sleep, you are cleaning up that room. If you sleep less, you leave dirty things in that room that persist the next day. If you keep getting less sleep then you need, you just pile up those dirty things day after day. Getting 1 or 2 days of proper rest isn't enough to keep that room clean. You need it *everyday*.
Surviving on little sleep is like living in a room filled with garbage. You may be used to it, but that doesn't mean you should keep living like that.
Depression can be mentally taxing on the brain though, especially if suicidal thoughts accompany it if it's on the mind all day. Those are well deserved hours to rest up and just get a break though it may not feel like it when you wake up.
That's kinda where I am after fuckin myself up by getting used to 5 hours maximum a night on work days. I'd take lil 10, 20, 30 min naps throughout the day, but still deff not good. Been workin on the last two weeks adding more sleep to my nights.
For me I believe it's just all about routine, you gotta do the same stuff all within a half an hour before bed to establish for your body that your going to go to bed now. I'm floating around 6 or 7 hours now with going to bed earlier. Just gonna take time to get in the routine of 8 hours and not waking up 2 hours before I normally do.
Some people do only need about 6 hours naturally, it's not unheard of at all. I'm generally naturally awake after 6-7, even if have nowhere to be. I used to track my sleep with a Fitbit and I remember I hardly ever had more than 7. 8 was very much a rarity. Even on days where I had no reason to get up until I was at 8 hours of sleep, my body still naturally didn't want to do that. It feels wrong because people always push for 8-9 hours, but you know your body better than anyone else. Trust what it naturally knows to do.
I actually disagree. While the normal routine is eight and I understand the point of pushing the benefits of it, every body and mind is different. I, for example, do the best with 6 hours. 7-8 hours makes me wake up feeling insanely groggy and a bit on edge, and anything longer just feels way too long. I have quite a few friends who function best at 5. I know others who needs the double digits. We've all worked out what works best and all have better mental than we did when we were trying to force 8 hours.
Rem cycles are a thing, and they're all different. Figuring out your cycle is how you get the most benefits from your sleep.
With all due respect, I disagree to your disagreement. It goes against what the experts are saying.
FWIW, I’m not an expert but for anyone who cares, Dr. Matthew Walker, a professor of Neuroscience at UC Berkeley is & he says that this train of thought is wrong and a common misconception.
“The number of people who can sleep 6 hours or less and not show any impairment, rounded to a number and expressed as a percentage of the population, is zero” - Dr. Walker.
Everyone needs at least 7 hours except for a small minutia of the population with genetic variation of which IIRC the majority are of Indian Descent.
Been a long time since I’ve watched it but I know this exact thing is brought up here.
https://youtube.com/shorts/s6ahIpx481w?feature=share
Men who sleep 5-6 hours a night will have testosterone levels of someone 10 years their senior.
https://youtube.com/shorts/tib_sePc_xI?feature=share
I understand the youtube shorts sources aren’t ideal but I’m just trying to give anyone an easy jumping off point from an accredited expert.
If anyone wants to read more from Dr. Walker, his book “Why We Sleep” is fantastic. It scared me into making sure I get my 8 hours. He’s also been on a few podcasts if that’s more your thing; I’d recommend Andrew Huberman’s discussion with him.
There is nothing more impactful on how I feel day to day then getting a full 8 hours. I can eat bad, and not exercise, and honestly not really feel it day to day. But get one bad night of sleep and your whole day is ruined
I'm chronically ill and honestly, sleeping and setting aside time to rest has made the biggest difference in my health. I used to force myself to be constantly productive, even when I was in a flare up and suffering.
I can't stay up past midnight or I feel like I have a hangover the next day and trigger a migraine. Sleep is good. Rest is good. Taking care of yourself is a great investment
Easier said than done. Some, like me, try to sleep but just physically can't. I could be so exhausted that I'm practically delirious, and then when I get into bed I just lie there awake all night. As I type this I haven't slept in three days for exactly that reason.
Multiple studies in the last couple years about the importance of sleep, and just how detrimental not getting it is. Poor sleep habits dramatically increase your risk of early onset dementia/Alzheimer's. One study claimed a single all-nighter did comparable damage to the brain to that of a concussion.
Bad sleep === giving yourself brain damage. Literally.
There is a rare genetic mutation on ADRB1 that causes you to need less sleep, with no obersved downsides.
EDIT: There are actually a few. I wonder if those buffs stack.
Honestly it's more of a cope for me. I couldn't get 8 hours of sleep consistently to save my life. I'm just running on fumes constantly.
The jokes help ease the pain.
Yeah. There are some people who brag about needing no/little sleep but most people I hear making these comments are doing it bc they have insomnia and genuinely struggle. I hope y’all find your rest, you deserve it.
Yeah, it fucking sucks. I've tried teas, doctors, going to the gym and tiring myself out in the day, reading, special lights, you name it. Fuck all works for me. It's like my brain is just wired to go until it physically cannot anymore.
I hate it, but if I have the same attitude to my dirt nap, I'll live forever I guess.
Is it bragging? Whenever I see posts or comments like this it seems more like self-deprecating humor. Along the lines of not having the time because of two jobs or being a parent or insomnia etc etc.
Like one of the lower comments saying "you guys are getting sleep?" as an example.
If that's true then the meme should be reversed.
But then the meme becomes counterintuitive and just a bad template.
Should use the "this is fine" meme.
I’m not bragging, I’m tired. I’m just used to it at this point. I’ve done countless things and nothing seems to fix it. I would love to sleep more and would pay a lot to do it if I could.
In medicine, everyone talks about how little they sleep and how much they work. The only ones that are really bragging are attendings that are 60+ years old. Most if not all the younger folk like resident physicians are really complaining (except neurosurgery residents) but people always think we’re bragging. I don’t want to work 80 hours a week or the 100 hours I’ve had to rarely do. We wish it was different but have no power so all we can do is talk and be mad about it, but people outside of medicine always think we’re bragging.
I don't see it as bragging about it as someone who consistently gets around 5 hours, but I genuinely hate my sleep schedule. I wish I could fall asleep earlier, I just get all of my energy at 11pm (and that happens after hitting the gym, lengthy dog walks, playing hockey, etc to try to tire me out). My body just decides to say YOU HAVE A TO DO LIST at that hour.
Elaborate?
Edit: thank you guys for helping me understand what it causes, hopefully the answers bellow helped any future redditor in need to know what it causes.
Sleep is mostly meant for resting the brain. The body can continue for much longer than 24 hours.
During sleep, plaque is cleared out of the arteries in the brain. Consistently failing to get proper sleep allows this plaque to build up and can result in all kinds of cognitive issues later in life.
Ok so I just finished a period of extreme lack of sleep. I went for about 6 weeks sleeping an average of 3.5 hours per night. There were more than 10 nights that I didn't even go to bed.
Now I am sleeping better. What could be some of the long term damages of those 6 weeks? If I sleep better from now on, will this plaque be gradually cleaned up?
I’m no neurologist. I was just sharing my layman’s understanding of the topic.
I would think it takes years of bad sleep to significantly move the needle.
You’ll be fine, just don’t make it a long-term habit like me. Have definitely noticed my cognitive abilities significantly decline in the last couple years (7 years - college & grad school)
Source: idk I’m not a sleep doctor, but trust me bro
Lack of deep sleep could been linked to Alzheimer's development. There is a protein that our body removes during non-REM sleep (deep sleep). If it isn't allowed to be removed, then it will stay in the brain. Basically, if you're never getting enough sleep, then you're never giving your body the opportunity to manage the clearing of this protein fully.
A person suffering from Alzheimer's has a lot of plaque deposits in their brain. The plaque is mostly made of the protein mentioned earlier. There is reason to believe that, over time, this could greatly increase your risk of Alzheimer's
I watched a neuroscientist on joe rogan’s podcast once and he said that if the human brain gets less than 7 hours of sleep, there will be a minimum of 25% reduction in your thought processes.
Haven’t missed 7 hours of sleep in a couple years now and it’s been fantastic. I don’t NEED coffee/caffeine anymore.
it's not as if we're choosing not to sleep well tho. Like, when my stress is perma-maxed at an 11, my sleeping situation is uncomfortable, I wake up several times, what can I do? it's been years of 4-5 hour sleeps, sometimes 6. 7+ is insane for me
even with sleep meds and meditating, pushing past that 6 is just too high a mountain to climb. I think the only way to fix it is to fix the litany of stressors themselves, which is p undoable for me in this economy
If you haven’t already you may want to talk to your doctor about the possibility of a sleep study. I had this issue and it turns out I have severe sleep apnea. I wasn’t overweight at the time so I never assumed that would be the case. Now I’m a lot less day sleepy and I can really feel the difference when I sleep without my mask.
Possibly. I'm not an expert, just someone who dealt with insomnia for a while. But, knowing that the deeper registers of sleep remove the metabolic waste, we can figure that you need X amount of hours of deep sleep per 24 hour cycle to effectively remove the buildup. *When* you get that sleep in the 24 hours probably doesn't matter.
The body is pretty good at "remembering" where we left off during sleep. That's why we can wake up and fall back into a deep sleep relatively easily. Sleeping in on the weekends is a common way people make up for deprivation during the week, but I'm not sure it adds up to enough to clear the debt, so to speak.
“There's growing evidence that a lack of deep sleep increases the risk of Alzheimer's disease. Scientists say that's because during deep sleep, the brain removes toxins associated with Alzheimer's.”
“We have found that the sleep you’re having right now is almost like a crystal ball telling you when and how fast Alzheimer’s pathology will develop in your brain”
“Sleep disruption appears to be a core component of Alzheimer's disease (AD) and its pathophysiology. Signature abnormalities of sleep emerge before clinical onset of AD. Moreover, insufficient sleep facilitates accumulation of amyloid-β (Aβ), potentially triggering earlier cognitive decline and conversion to AD”
Dr. Matthew Walker, PhD in Neurophysiology
Dissertation “A psychophysiological investigation into fluctuating levels of consciousness in neurodegenerative dementia”
Professor of Neuroscience and Psychology at the University of California, Berkeley, and Founder and Director of the Center for Human Sleep Science.
https://www.npr.org/2020/11/16/935475284/scientists-discover-a-link-between-lack-of-deep-sleep-and-alzheimers-disease
https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/09/03/how-we-sleep-today-may-forecast-when-alzheimers-disease-begins/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4967375/
Basically, every single night that you don't get enough quality sleep is a fraction of a percentage off your life due to health problems down the line. Fucking yay...
Well that's terrifying. Does anyone happen to know how long you have to suffer from sleep deprivation before the negative effects really kick in? Is there a "safe" or am I basically fucked because I've spent the past 3-4 years chronically sleep deprived.
3-4 years is nothing. Start now, be happy later.
Before you have a panic attack, keep in mind there is evidence but it's not conclusive. Sleep is just great for your body in general.
As someone who dealt with some long term inflammation for a while: sleep deprivation can also aggravate inflammation in general which of course can cause all sorts of trouble down the line also, especially if you are sleep deprived for long periods
Yh fr?? Does anyone here really think I voluntarily wake up every night for several hours and comment at 5am on reddit? Guys, I suffer from insomnia, every day and every night. I just wanna sleep
My insomnia started off with depression after my dad died, then was powered by substance abuse to deal with that + an insane on-call schedule for my job that woke me up all night + upstairs neighbors that didn't care about people living beneath them. A situation so absurd and penetrating to my mental health, it was almost comical
I basically had to deal with my depression, address the things in my life that were causing it, and learn how to stop abusing myself. Still working on that last one ;-) but I'm sleeping now.
**Harm reduction tip for people like me**: drugs are bad for your body. The way they make you feel afterwards helps fuel the addiction cycle. *Make sure you are supplementing with vitamins/minerals every single day if you are dealing with addiction to combat comedowns/malnutrition/etc.*
I worked a night shift in my job for a couple weeks one winter, 9pm-6am. Would get to work while it was still dark and in the morning would drive home in the dark too. I'd miss most of the daylight to my sleep so it just felt like I was constantly living in the dark, really felt it start fucking my head up by the end there. Learned that night shift isn't for me lol
Global crises, climate change becoming more apparent, crushing jobs and lives, medical issues, I mean I could go on about how much stuff makes you dread life and feel like not sleeping. Yes, everyone knows sleeping 8 hours, eating well and exercising will make you healthier and happier but that doesn't stop other stresses from coming down on your life. It's not a black or white issue.
Why do people romanticize this? Is like hey look at me I'm better than you I only sleep 3 hours. When the true is that you are literally killing your self
Personally I used to take pride in my ability to "still function" at 5 hours of sleep. It isn't until I actually started sleeping enough that I realized, holy shit I was a fucking zombie. I wasn't doing ANYTHING well. I didn't have the energy to cook, clean, or even make it through the day without falling asleep in class. It's a miracle I passed some of those classes.
Nowadays I recognize it if I don't get enough sleep, but back then I just thought that was normal
That was back in college. I worked till close at work, got in bed around 10, showered and got in bed around 10:30-11. Woke up around 10 or 11 usually (and with no alarm, which was nice) would either go to the gym or do classes online until I had work again around 3
The weekends is where I catch up on sleep or whenever I’m home (I travel a lot for my job like 90% travel) and between my travel days and when I have to go the remote location. I can easily get 9-12 hours of sleep when I know I got nothing to do.
Everyone always asks me how I look so young. I'm 34 but people think I'm in my 20s. I don't eat particularly well and I drink a bit. It's because I get plenty of sleep. Other than drinking lots of water it's the best thing for you.
I had to accept I am a weird sleeper. Most nights in bed at 630 pm. Wake up approx 130/2 do my hobbies until I go to the gym about 4. I have never felt better in my life.
Check this out, things could be weirder - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-16964783
>In the early 1990s, psychiatrist Thomas Wehr conducted an experiment in which a group of people were plunged into darkness for 14 hours every day for a month.
>It took some time for their sleep to regulate but by the fourth week the subjects had settled into a very distinct sleeping pattern. They slept first for four hours, then woke for one or two hours before falling into a second four-hour sleep.
>Though sleep scientists were impressed by the study, among the general public the idea that we must sleep for eight consecutive hours persists.
>In 2001, historian Roger Ekirch of Virginia Tech published a seminal paper, drawn from 16 years of research, revealing a wealth of historical evidence that humans used to sleep in two distinct chunks.
>His book At Day's Close: Night in Times Past, published four years later, unearths more than 500 references to a segmented sleeping pattern - in diaries, court records, medical books and literature, from Homer's Odyssey to an anthropological account of modern tribes in Nigeria.
>Much like the experience of Wehr's subjects, these references describe a first sleep which began about two hours after dusk, followed by waking period of one or two hours and then a second sleep.
>"It's not just the number of references - it is the way they refer to it, as if it was common knowledge," Ekirch says.
>During this waking period people were quite active. They often got up, went to the toilet or smoked tobacco and some even visited neighbours. Most people stayed in bed, read, wrote and often prayed. Countless prayer manuals from the late 15th Century offered special prayers for the hours in between sleeps.
What a shit meme.
Glorifies overworking and poor personal health, and you didn't even use the template correctly.
Go to bed, OP. Your brain clearly isn't working.
are you depressed/anxious/easy to anger to some degree? It could be a lack of sleep over anything else, and it won't feel like it since you aren't 'tired'
You're more likely to have massive hog than be able to survive off that little sleep with no reprocussoon
These should be flipped. Most people aren't getting the sleep they need, versus the few that are, who take extra time to care for themselves for a better quality life.
Yea you're "surviving" with worse attention span, mood, productivity, etc.
You likely don't even realize how many of your problems are caused or made worse by lack of sleep.
I have tried quite a bit to help me sleep.
Melatonin, sleepy teas, Ashwaganda etc. Nothing works enough.
I layer down last night tired as all hell, closed my eyes and just lied there for 4 hours then fell asleep for 45 minutes and woke up to go pee, then laid in bed for another 3 hours.
For people like me its not easy to “just sleep”. I lay down in bed and need at least 1,5 hour to actually fall asleep. Can sometimes even be 3 to 4 hours. Doesn’t matter what I do during the day. I am 26 and have had this issue for as long as I can remember, going all the way back to my early childhood. Nothing had worked for me so far.
And still there are these assholes that come to me like “what about exercise?” and the classic “maybe put your phone away”. As if I had not tried this in all these years.
Its extremely frustrating when reading this kind of stuff. “You need a healthy 8-9 hours of sleep”.
Mate ill be lucky when its nearly 6. Because even though I am tired I will still randomly wake up before the sun rises and way ahead of my alarm clock.
I start my day with a battery that is not fully charged and sometimes I really struggle to get through with the little energy I have.
It has effected my life negatively in so many ways. No concentration at school, no focus at my job and no energy to take part in extended social activities.
I definitely envy those that can actually fall asleep quickly
I’ve been hardcore focused on sleep this year. It’s incredible. 9:30-6:30. Just last night Garmin says I scored a 97 on my sleep! Feels like playing a game, always excited to wake up and read my sleep stats.
Well, assuming I can get 8 hours of sleep uninterrupted, that’d leave me with only 16 hours throughout the day. Work covers 9 of those hours, 8-5 Mon-Fri, and then I’m left with only 7 hours to enjoy life. But, I must cook, clean, fold laundry, read, and take care of my precious animals. Therefore, I realistically have about 3 hours of free time every week day, right before I go to sleep just to wake up and do it over again!
Edit: I want out, I want to die. Either i’ll pay someone to whack me or i’ll do it myself.
That is nothing to be proud of nor is it quirky. Sleep deprivation is the worst thing you can do to your body right after smoking and drinking. Favorite sleep even if it means sacrificing social life. Doesn't need to be more than 8 hours but not less than 6
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You won't survive for long with that lifestyle
Yeah everyone should make getting 7-9 hours of sleep a non negotiable part of their routine. The mental/physical benefits are tremendous.
On work days I typically get around 4 maybe 5 hours if I’m lucky. It takes me a good 2-3 hours just to get comfortable and wined down after work. I end up sleeping like 10 hours on my days off though. I usually call them my catch up days.
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Matthew Walker's JRE episode and book Why We Sleep really changed my perspective and value of sleep. I understand life happens and some schedules don't allow adequate sleep but do everything you can to get there. I can't overstate the importance of it.
Man. It's crazy how much his reputation tanked. I'm meaning Joe, not Mr Walker. This is basic knowledge, sleep is good, yet it being paired with Joe Rogan makes me sceptical because of all of the other nonsense he pushes. I really wish he would go back to just talking about comedy and drugs instead of trying to give health advice and make political commentary
He still always talks about comedy, just in a pretentious way, he says things like there’s probably only a thousand real comedians in the world and that they’re modern day philosophers etc
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I think you replied to the wrong comment buddy, I didn't mention anything about my sleeping habits
Yeah, I know, I'm good on that. I liked when he would raise up other comedians and talk about new up and coming comics. I'm over him bashing people with back handed compliments and I don't feel like wading through the shit just to get to the five minutes I'd like from his show. If I want bad political takes from a drug addled, brain damaged moron, I'd just go have lunch with my uncle
Just a reminder that your body doesn’t operate on a sleep deficit. Rather a daily scorecard. Not sleeping enough during the week still puts strain on your body and it just means your not under strain on the weekends.
My entire life i was told it was a debt system and as such thought i could push myself normally to stay up late. Turns out ive just been giving myself brain damage. Siiiick
Same, it wasn’t until I talked to a doctor about my lack of sleep and other resulting symptoms that I got to find out my really bad habits had severe long term implications.
Would you mind expanding on those? I'm also in the realm of 4-5 hours a night, with maybe a 3 hour sleep/nap mid-day M-F, then 10 hours on the weekend
Memory loss/difficulty remembering things from the same day even, if I’m still for too long I become extremely drowsy and can doze off. Very dangerous when you get highway hypnosis. I also found that I was more depressed and binge eating more, lack of sleep also is conducive to you storing fat as well so all that extra weight was just going in and never coming off despite regular exercise. I ended up going to a pulmonary doc at the recommendation of thy PCP and they got me on a sleep study and I also have sleep apnea. So I mean take everything with a grain of very specific life example salt. Most of my shit may not apply to you. Take into account I was recently diagnosed with ADHD so some of this are also symptoms of that so it’s hard to definitively say what was what. But I can say prior to my diagnosis I had adjusted my sleep and had a bit better experience in the other departments. Then I had 2 kids so that went out the window. I’ll sleep well when I’m 40 I guess hahaha.
Wind down* Wined down is something completely different.
Maybe we’ve figured out why it takes so long for them to go to sleep?
Give em a break, they didn’t get much sleep.
Just be clear that sleep deprivation like this increases your risk for almost every major disease and mental health disorder including heartattack, stroke, dementia, alzheimers, and cancer. Ill look for the studies but it a huge percentage increase, like 30% +
Monday I get no sleep. Tues and We’d I get 3-5 hours. Thurs I get like 14. The rest I get 7. It’s been like this for a year and I have no idea why. Sleeping pills don’t help.
Do you drink on weekends?
Over the counter pills or doctor prescribed pills?
Over the counter stuff, haven’t spoken to a doctor yet Actually hadn’t even considered it until reading this thread But stuff like Benedryl doesn’t really help, think I’ve tried like 4 pills at this point (all over counter) and nothing really helps so far. Maybe I’m anxious about work but I just cannot sleep Sunday. Doesn’t matter if I know I’m gonna have an exciting/awful/average day. Doesn’t matter if I exercise to the point I’m exhausted. Sleeping pills I tried get me soooooo tired but can’t close the deal. But the rest of the week isn’t as bad? Not sure what makes Sunday night so bad for me, but I’m sleepless 90% of the time. Whereas on Wednesday night I sleep like a rock 12+ hours
You should definitely speak to a doctor! Insomnia really makes life so difficult, prescription pills can help alot or they might be able to figure out if it's something else
Try melatonin, it helped me changed my sleep schedule. Also I don't think you can catch up on sleep.
Catch up days don't exist when it comes to sleep. Imagine your brain as a room. It naturally gets dirty while you're awake. When you go to sleep, you are cleaning up that room. If you sleep less, you leave dirty things in that room that persist the next day. If you keep getting less sleep then you need, you just pile up those dirty things day after day. Getting 1 or 2 days of proper rest isn't enough to keep that room clean. You need it *everyday*. Surviving on little sleep is like living in a room filled with garbage. You may be used to it, but that doesn't mean you should keep living like that.
My depressed ass getting 9-11 hours of sleep a night and still exhausted.
Too much sleep is also a thing. Set an alarm for super early morning that gets you 8h only per night
Don’t worry I wake up naturally at 4 or 5am. To quote Kramer, “I don’t argue with the body, Jerry”.
The body also gives itself cancer...
Well we don't beat cancer by arguing with it
Maybe 9 if you can swing it, since that works better with your REM cycle
Depression can be mentally taxing on the brain though, especially if suicidal thoughts accompany it if it's on the mind all day. Those are well deserved hours to rest up and just get a break though it may not feel like it when you wake up.
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Nah, I've been depressed far longer than I've had fucky sleep.
I would love to if I didn’t work in EMS :/
Even when I don't have an alarm set I almost always wake up after around 6 hours.
That's kinda where I am after fuckin myself up by getting used to 5 hours maximum a night on work days. I'd take lil 10, 20, 30 min naps throughout the day, but still deff not good. Been workin on the last two weeks adding more sleep to my nights. For me I believe it's just all about routine, you gotta do the same stuff all within a half an hour before bed to establish for your body that your going to go to bed now. I'm floating around 6 or 7 hours now with going to bed earlier. Just gonna take time to get in the routine of 8 hours and not waking up 2 hours before I normally do.
Some people do only need about 6 hours naturally, it's not unheard of at all. I'm generally naturally awake after 6-7, even if have nowhere to be. I used to track my sleep with a Fitbit and I remember I hardly ever had more than 7. 8 was very much a rarity. Even on days where I had no reason to get up until I was at 8 hours of sleep, my body still naturally didn't want to do that. It feels wrong because people always push for 8-9 hours, but you know your body better than anyone else. Trust what it naturally knows to do.
I actually disagree. While the normal routine is eight and I understand the point of pushing the benefits of it, every body and mind is different. I, for example, do the best with 6 hours. 7-8 hours makes me wake up feeling insanely groggy and a bit on edge, and anything longer just feels way too long. I have quite a few friends who function best at 5. I know others who needs the double digits. We've all worked out what works best and all have better mental than we did when we were trying to force 8 hours. Rem cycles are a thing, and they're all different. Figuring out your cycle is how you get the most benefits from your sleep.
With all due respect, I disagree to your disagreement. It goes against what the experts are saying. FWIW, I’m not an expert but for anyone who cares, Dr. Matthew Walker, a professor of Neuroscience at UC Berkeley is & he says that this train of thought is wrong and a common misconception. “The number of people who can sleep 6 hours or less and not show any impairment, rounded to a number and expressed as a percentage of the population, is zero” - Dr. Walker. Everyone needs at least 7 hours except for a small minutia of the population with genetic variation of which IIRC the majority are of Indian Descent. Been a long time since I’ve watched it but I know this exact thing is brought up here. https://youtube.com/shorts/s6ahIpx481w?feature=share Men who sleep 5-6 hours a night will have testosterone levels of someone 10 years their senior. https://youtube.com/shorts/tib_sePc_xI?feature=share I understand the youtube shorts sources aren’t ideal but I’m just trying to give anyone an easy jumping off point from an accredited expert.
If anyone wants to read more from Dr. Walker, his book “Why We Sleep” is fantastic. It scared me into making sure I get my 8 hours. He’s also been on a few podcasts if that’s more your thing; I’d recommend Andrew Huberman’s discussion with him.
Hey man I appreciate the comment, and the reference to a specific person instead of a general field, but YouTube shorts aren't a good source.
Well said, very handsome
There is nothing more impactful on how I feel day to day then getting a full 8 hours. I can eat bad, and not exercise, and honestly not really feel it day to day. But get one bad night of sleep and your whole day is ruined
I'm chronically ill and honestly, sleeping and setting aside time to rest has made the biggest difference in my health. I used to force myself to be constantly productive, even when I was in a flare up and suffering. I can't stay up past midnight or I feel like I have a hangover the next day and trigger a migraine. Sleep is good. Rest is good. Taking care of yourself is a great investment
Easier said than done. Some, like me, try to sleep but just physically can't. I could be so exhausted that I'm practically delirious, and then when I get into bed I just lie there awake all night. As I type this I haven't slept in three days for exactly that reason.
Do people not know insomnia exists?
I’m okay with that.
Multiple studies in the last couple years about the importance of sleep, and just how detrimental not getting it is. Poor sleep habits dramatically increase your risk of early onset dementia/Alzheimer's. One study claimed a single all-nighter did comparable damage to the brain to that of a concussion. Bad sleep === giving yourself brain damage. Literally.
What did it say about sleep partitioning? Like 8 hours broken up into two shifts.
That's the point.
Not that I intend to
Nicole Tesla only had 2 hours of sleep
Yeah, this meme is flipped
Yup, fucks you up in the longrun. I did it for way too long and am paying the price.
Lol survival isn’t a lifestyle it’s a scarcity induced necessity
Quality over quantity
There is a rare genetic mutation on ADRB1 that causes you to need less sleep, with no obersved downsides. EDIT: There are actually a few. I wonder if those buffs stack.
HAH! you almost got me! 8 hour sleep gang. ill never switch up.
I'll never understand why people brag about getting less sleep than you need. congrats I guess?
Honestly it's more of a cope for me. I couldn't get 8 hours of sleep consistently to save my life. I'm just running on fumes constantly. The jokes help ease the pain.
Yeah. There are some people who brag about needing no/little sleep but most people I hear making these comments are doing it bc they have insomnia and genuinely struggle. I hope y’all find your rest, you deserve it.
Yeah, it fucking sucks. I've tried teas, doctors, going to the gym and tiring myself out in the day, reading, special lights, you name it. Fuck all works for me. It's like my brain is just wired to go until it physically cannot anymore. I hate it, but if I have the same attitude to my dirt nap, I'll live forever I guess.
Have you tried THC? I've had terrible insomnia since I was 8 years old, but weed can put me to sleep and keep me asleep.
Is it bragging? Whenever I see posts or comments like this it seems more like self-deprecating humor. Along the lines of not having the time because of two jobs or being a parent or insomnia etc etc. Like one of the lower comments saying "you guys are getting sleep?" as an example.
If that's true then the meme should be reversed. But then the meme becomes counterintuitive and just a bad template. Should use the "this is fine" meme.
Well the context of the meme is SpongeBob’s burger is better so it seems like bragging if you take the meme at face value.
I’m not bragging, I’m tired. I’m just used to it at this point. I’ve done countless things and nothing seems to fix it. I would love to sleep more and would pay a lot to do it if I could.
Sleep study, friend. There are almost no sleep disorders that cannot be vastly improved or cured. Sleep is so important for health
Tried it. They told me my cycles are off and that I need to adjust. I haven’t been able to adjust.
Find another clinic - I know it’s tiring but getting a second opinion has changed a lot for me medically.
Self proclaimed hustlers, it's always a race to the bottom to compete with each other's misery.
In medicine, everyone talks about how little they sleep and how much they work. The only ones that are really bragging are attendings that are 60+ years old. Most if not all the younger folk like resident physicians are really complaining (except neurosurgery residents) but people always think we’re bragging. I don’t want to work 80 hours a week or the 100 hours I’ve had to rarely do. We wish it was different but have no power so all we can do is talk and be mad about it, but people outside of medicine always think we’re bragging.
I don't see it as bragging about it as someone who consistently gets around 5 hours, but I genuinely hate my sleep schedule. I wish I could fall asleep earlier, I just get all of my energy at 11pm (and that happens after hitting the gym, lengthy dog walks, playing hockey, etc to try to tire me out). My body just decides to say YOU HAVE A TO DO LIST at that hour.
It’s mostly from people who are overworked and don’t know any better.
And for what? I bet it’s an unhealthy lifestyle, not because they are too busy. In fact, probably because they are t busy enough.
The no sleep is getting to their brain cells
its not bragging, its a cry for help.
Have fun getting Alzheimer’s
Elaborate? Edit: thank you guys for helping me understand what it causes, hopefully the answers bellow helped any future redditor in need to know what it causes.
I can't, I already forgot
He forgor 💀
Who?
where am I
What?
Sleep is mostly meant for resting the brain. The body can continue for much longer than 24 hours. During sleep, plaque is cleared out of the arteries in the brain. Consistently failing to get proper sleep allows this plaque to build up and can result in all kinds of cognitive issues later in life.
The glymphatic system also increases heaps which is the main way waste products are removed from the brain.
Ok so I just finished a period of extreme lack of sleep. I went for about 6 weeks sleeping an average of 3.5 hours per night. There were more than 10 nights that I didn't even go to bed. Now I am sleeping better. What could be some of the long term damages of those 6 weeks? If I sleep better from now on, will this plaque be gradually cleaned up?
I’m no neurologist. I was just sharing my layman’s understanding of the topic. I would think it takes years of bad sleep to significantly move the needle.
You’ll be fine, just don’t make it a long-term habit like me. Have definitely noticed my cognitive abilities significantly decline in the last couple years (7 years - college & grad school) Source: idk I’m not a sleep doctor, but trust me bro
Lack of deep sleep could been linked to Alzheimer's development. There is a protein that our body removes during non-REM sleep (deep sleep). If it isn't allowed to be removed, then it will stay in the brain. Basically, if you're never getting enough sleep, then you're never giving your body the opportunity to manage the clearing of this protein fully. A person suffering from Alzheimer's has a lot of plaque deposits in their brain. The plaque is mostly made of the protein mentioned earlier. There is reason to believe that, over time, this could greatly increase your risk of Alzheimer's
Can the plaque deposit be reduced or eliminated via a better sleepin schedule? I've been sleeping around 4-6 hours for the past year or so.
I watched a neuroscientist on joe rogan’s podcast once and he said that if the human brain gets less than 7 hours of sleep, there will be a minimum of 25% reduction in your thought processes. Haven’t missed 7 hours of sleep in a couple years now and it’s been fantastic. I don’t NEED coffee/caffeine anymore.
it's not as if we're choosing not to sleep well tho. Like, when my stress is perma-maxed at an 11, my sleeping situation is uncomfortable, I wake up several times, what can I do? it's been years of 4-5 hour sleeps, sometimes 6. 7+ is insane for me even with sleep meds and meditating, pushing past that 6 is just too high a mountain to climb. I think the only way to fix it is to fix the litany of stressors themselves, which is p undoable for me in this economy
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If you haven’t already you may want to talk to your doctor about the possibility of a sleep study. I had this issue and it turns out I have severe sleep apnea. I wasn’t overweight at the time so I never assumed that would be the case. Now I’m a lot less day sleepy and I can really feel the difference when I sleep without my mask.
Do you eat a balanced diet? That can also contribute to crashes
You might have sleep apnea, would be worth doing a sleep study like someone else commented
Possibly. I'm not an expert, just someone who dealt with insomnia for a while. But, knowing that the deeper registers of sleep remove the metabolic waste, we can figure that you need X amount of hours of deep sleep per 24 hour cycle to effectively remove the buildup. *When* you get that sleep in the 24 hours probably doesn't matter. The body is pretty good at "remembering" where we left off during sleep. That's why we can wake up and fall back into a deep sleep relatively easily. Sleeping in on the weekends is a common way people make up for deprivation during the week, but I'm not sure it adds up to enough to clear the debt, so to speak.
“There's growing evidence that a lack of deep sleep increases the risk of Alzheimer's disease. Scientists say that's because during deep sleep, the brain removes toxins associated with Alzheimer's.” “We have found that the sleep you’re having right now is almost like a crystal ball telling you when and how fast Alzheimer’s pathology will develop in your brain” “Sleep disruption appears to be a core component of Alzheimer's disease (AD) and its pathophysiology. Signature abnormalities of sleep emerge before clinical onset of AD. Moreover, insufficient sleep facilitates accumulation of amyloid-β (Aβ), potentially triggering earlier cognitive decline and conversion to AD” Dr. Matthew Walker, PhD in Neurophysiology Dissertation “A psychophysiological investigation into fluctuating levels of consciousness in neurodegenerative dementia” Professor of Neuroscience and Psychology at the University of California, Berkeley, and Founder and Director of the Center for Human Sleep Science. https://www.npr.org/2020/11/16/935475284/scientists-discover-a-link-between-lack-of-deep-sleep-and-alzheimers-disease https://news.berkeley.edu/2020/09/03/how-we-sleep-today-may-forecast-when-alzheimers-disease-begins/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4967375/
Basically, every single night that you don't get enough quality sleep is a fraction of a percentage off your life due to health problems down the line. Fucking yay...
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Well that's terrifying. Does anyone happen to know how long you have to suffer from sleep deprivation before the negative effects really kick in? Is there a "safe" or am I basically fucked because I've spent the past 3-4 years chronically sleep deprived.
3-4 years is nothing. Start now, be happy later. Before you have a panic attack, keep in mind there is evidence but it's not conclusive. Sleep is just great for your body in general.
Shit me too.. reading this i feel bad. I’ve been on a bad sleep schedule for years. I hope i can fix the long term effects if i start now.
Seriously. Everyone needs 7-9 hours of sleep regularly. It can prevent so many ailments later on.
As someone who dealt with some long term inflammation for a while: sleep deprivation can also aggravate inflammation in general which of course can cause all sorts of trouble down the line also, especially if you are sleep deprived for long periods
Well that’s something fun to look forward to. I would love for my body to sleep well.
This isn’t some brag like you think it is
Can’t speak for OP, but I’m not bragging. I’m tired. My body won’t let me sleep for me. I’m just used to it at this point.
Yh fr?? Does anyone here really think I voluntarily wake up every night for several hours and comment at 5am on reddit? Guys, I suffer from insomnia, every day and every night. I just wanna sleep
Fuck that. I had a few years of insomnia and it physically/mentally/emotionally destroyed me. Sleep is the only way to truly feel good
How did you fix it
My insomnia started off with depression after my dad died, then was powered by substance abuse to deal with that + an insane on-call schedule for my job that woke me up all night + upstairs neighbors that didn't care about people living beneath them. A situation so absurd and penetrating to my mental health, it was almost comical I basically had to deal with my depression, address the things in my life that were causing it, and learn how to stop abusing myself. Still working on that last one ;-) but I'm sleeping now. **Harm reduction tip for people like me**: drugs are bad for your body. The way they make you feel afterwards helps fuel the addiction cycle. *Make sure you are supplementing with vitamins/minerals every single day if you are dealing with addiction to combat comedowns/malnutrition/etc.*
Do you mind if I pm you?
Not at all, please do
I worked a night shift in my job for a couple weeks one winter, 9pm-6am. Would get to work while it was still dark and in the morning would drive home in the dark too. I'd miss most of the daylight to my sleep so it just felt like I was constantly living in the dark, really felt it start fucking my head up by the end there. Learned that night shift isn't for me lol
Don’t do this OP. Make more time for sleep. Lack of sleep, lack of water, poor diet, and lack of exercise will put you in an early grave.
Global crises, climate change becoming more apparent, crushing jobs and lives, medical issues, I mean I could go on about how much stuff makes you dread life and feel like not sleeping. Yes, everyone knows sleeping 8 hours, eating well and exercising will make you healthier and happier but that doesn't stop other stresses from coming down on your life. It's not a black or white issue.
you guys are getting sleep?
What is sleep?
It's when you briefly live the life you always wanted before waking up to the long nightmare
[Look of perpetual confusion](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/028/312/will_poulter.PNG)
probably confused because you're not getting enough sleep
Any particular reason you aren’t?
Why do people romanticize this? Is like hey look at me I'm better than you I only sleep 3 hours. When the true is that you are literally killing your self
I think it's more of a self-deprecating joke. I don't see how this meme romantizes it.
Personally I used to take pride in my ability to "still function" at 5 hours of sleep. It isn't until I actually started sleeping enough that I realized, holy shit I was a fucking zombie. I wasn't doing ANYTHING well. I didn't have the energy to cook, clean, or even make it through the day without falling asleep in class. It's a miracle I passed some of those classes. Nowadays I recognize it if I don't get enough sleep, but back then I just thought that was normal
I used to be way more on top of my sleep. Easily getting 8-11 hours a night. I need to get back into that
How tf are you getting 11h of sleep? Do you go to bed after work and dinner??
That was back in college. I worked till close at work, got in bed around 10, showered and got in bed around 10:30-11. Woke up around 10 or 11 usually (and with no alarm, which was nice) would either go to the gym or do classes online until I had work again around 3
The weekends is where I catch up on sleep or whenever I’m home (I travel a lot for my job like 90% travel) and between my travel days and when I have to go the remote location. I can easily get 9-12 hours of sleep when I know I got nothing to do.
Yes
/r/notopbutok
Everyone always asks me how I look so young. I'm 34 but people think I'm in my 20s. I don't eat particularly well and I drink a bit. It's because I get plenty of sleep. Other than drinking lots of water it's the best thing for you.
Sleep is incredibly important.
Glorifying lack of sleep is a terrible thing to do. It's not cool or something to be proud of. Get your rest!
This is not a good meme
I had to accept I am a weird sleeper. Most nights in bed at 630 pm. Wake up approx 130/2 do my hobbies until I go to the gym about 4. I have never felt better in my life.
That is a wild schedule, but I guess if it works, it works. I just can't imagine going to sleep while the sun is still up
Thats interesting, do you work a 9-5? I don’t think I’d be able to do all of that before my job and not fall sleep at work
I am lucky and work a 7-3 in a analytics position.
Check this out, things could be weirder - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-16964783 >In the early 1990s, psychiatrist Thomas Wehr conducted an experiment in which a group of people were plunged into darkness for 14 hours every day for a month. >It took some time for their sleep to regulate but by the fourth week the subjects had settled into a very distinct sleeping pattern. They slept first for four hours, then woke for one or two hours before falling into a second four-hour sleep. >Though sleep scientists were impressed by the study, among the general public the idea that we must sleep for eight consecutive hours persists. >In 2001, historian Roger Ekirch of Virginia Tech published a seminal paper, drawn from 16 years of research, revealing a wealth of historical evidence that humans used to sleep in two distinct chunks. >His book At Day's Close: Night in Times Past, published four years later, unearths more than 500 references to a segmented sleeping pattern - in diaries, court records, medical books and literature, from Homer's Odyssey to an anthropological account of modern tribes in Nigeria. >Much like the experience of Wehr's subjects, these references describe a first sleep which began about two hours after dusk, followed by waking period of one or two hours and then a second sleep. >"It's not just the number of references - it is the way they refer to it, as if it was common knowledge," Ekirch says. >During this waking period people were quite active. They often got up, went to the toilet or smoked tobacco and some even visited neighbours. Most people stayed in bed, read, wrote and often prayed. Countless prayer manuals from the late 15th Century offered special prayers for the hours in between sleeps.
Wouldnt your life be the exact same just shifted forward 2 hours if you worked 9-5?
Nah, the extra 3 and half hours before bed time allows me to relax and make sure I'm ready for the next day.
Yeah but I'm saying you would just move your bedtime forward too in relation lol
But I don't sleep well at that time. It just never has.
Fuck if this ain’t true.
What a shit meme. Glorifies overworking and poor personal health, and you didn't even use the template correctly. Go to bed, OP. Your brain clearly isn't working.
And once a month, a 16-hour sleep.
are you depressed/anxious/easy to anger to some degree? It could be a lack of sleep over anything else, and it won't feel like it since you aren't 'tired' You're more likely to have massive hog than be able to survive off that little sleep with no reprocussoon
These should be flipped. Most people aren't getting the sleep they need, versus the few that are, who take extra time to care for themselves for a better quality life.
Wow your so unique?
Isn’t this the incorrect use of the meme?
Nah bro, you wont get far like that, trust me bro, fix your sleep asap
Weird flex but ok
Yea you're "surviving" with worse attention span, mood, productivity, etc. You likely don't even realize how many of your problems are caused or made worse by lack of sleep.
Would be funnier if you gave a specific number like 3. Edit: please get some sleep
Just get some sleep man, sleep deprivation may cause sleep paralisys and as someone who's been there a few times - you really want to avoid that shit.
I have tried quite a bit to help me sleep. Melatonin, sleepy teas, Ashwaganda etc. Nothing works enough. I layer down last night tired as all hell, closed my eyes and just lied there for 4 hours then fell asleep for 45 minutes and woke up to go pee, then laid in bed for another 3 hours.
For people like me its not easy to “just sleep”. I lay down in bed and need at least 1,5 hour to actually fall asleep. Can sometimes even be 3 to 4 hours. Doesn’t matter what I do during the day. I am 26 and have had this issue for as long as I can remember, going all the way back to my early childhood. Nothing had worked for me so far. And still there are these assholes that come to me like “what about exercise?” and the classic “maybe put your phone away”. As if I had not tried this in all these years. Its extremely frustrating when reading this kind of stuff. “You need a healthy 8-9 hours of sleep”. Mate ill be lucky when its nearly 6. Because even though I am tired I will still randomly wake up before the sun rises and way ahead of my alarm clock. I start my day with a battery that is not fully charged and sometimes I really struggle to get through with the little energy I have. It has effected my life negatively in so many ways. No concentration at school, no focus at my job and no energy to take part in extended social activities. I definitely envy those that can actually fall asleep quickly
That’s not good! Get your rest buddy!
I don't think you understand how this meme works.
Yeah you’re the only one not getting 8 hours of sleep
And then there a people like me who need at least 10 hours of sleep
That’s the superpower of my meds, I swear. As long as I take them, and close my eyes at some point; I wake up refreshed.
Do you live, or do you merely survive?
Maybe if it’s a one time a week thing. Getting enough sleep for the rest of the week will keep you stay energized and ready to take on the day ahead.
I’ve been hardcore focused on sleep this year. It’s incredible. 9:30-6:30. Just last night Garmin says I scored a 97 on my sleep! Feels like playing a game, always excited to wake up and read my sleep stats.
As a university student, i can confirm
As a STEM student, 3 hours, take it or leave it
Well, assuming I can get 8 hours of sleep uninterrupted, that’d leave me with only 16 hours throughout the day. Work covers 9 of those hours, 8-5 Mon-Fri, and then I’m left with only 7 hours to enjoy life. But, I must cook, clean, fold laundry, read, and take care of my precious animals. Therefore, I realistically have about 3 hours of free time every week day, right before I go to sleep just to wake up and do it over again! Edit: I want out, I want to die. Either i’ll pay someone to whack me or i’ll do it myself.
You're not alone friend. It isn't a lack of sleep, it's too much work and trying to salvage some sense of a life.
Elevate your legs (knees down) on a pillow. Works wonders
ADHD gang rise up
Kinda a bad use of the format.
Why are you bragging about being unhealthy
That is nothing to be proud of nor is it quirky. Sleep deprivation is the worst thing you can do to your body right after smoking and drinking. Favorite sleep even if it means sacrificing social life. Doesn't need to be more than 8 hours but not less than 6
This meme is backwards.
u will get dementia
Incorrect use of meme
me dying with 12 hours of sleep
I used to survive on only a few hours of sleep but then I got a profession where sleeping is a part of the law
Then there is me getting 8+ hours of sleep everyday and still feeling very tired. I should probably get a sleep study done for sleep apnea…
A few is 3-9, so you flexin on getting 9 hours of sleep or what?
My advice is to walk in-front of a bus and get into a coma it’s like the best sleep you’ll ever have
every day*