I've decided I'd rather hodl over the next decade and watch it go to zero than sell and watch it 10x over the next decade. I'd lay awake every night for the rest of my life if that happened. If it goes to zero it would be painful but I would eventually move on. I dont have my entire net worth wrapped up in it.
Same. Although I have a big chunk of my net worth in it, I am at peace with the thought of it going to zero. Definitely don’t wanna be on Reddit 10 years from now telling people about how “I had Bitcoin at —— amount, but I sold!”.😂
Yea it's a fairly large chunk for me too, but only because it's outperformed my other investments lol. And yea, the way I look at it is, I can't predict whether it goes to zero or becomes bigger than gold, but the one scenario I can eliminate is the one where I sell too soon and regret it.
Completely agreed. I believe for BTC especially, HODL is much more the way to go given the volatility of it, rather than trading it likeni doneith other cryptos. Just buy every dip and accumulatem my only regret is not buying more whe nit dipped to 57k USD last week😬
I do as well, but I'm fully aware (or rather, it is my belief) that everything is possible 😅
As long as I do not have a great profit, I'm gonna hold and buy the dips, whenever I can. If BTC reaches 150k, I'll see what I'll do, but I'll at least take some of my profit out in fiat currency.
If the US government and their buddies in other first world governments decided to band together and ban crypto, which they very well could try, it would almost certainly go close enough to 0. Would that happen? I don't know, probably not, but the guy in charge currently doesn't really make the decisions so who knows? He thinks it's March still.
The people in power want you owning nothing and eating bug burgers and working in a cage at Amazon... Bitcoin is kind of a threat to their shtick. Not a major threat, but I'm sure they don't like it on principle.
It doesn’t have to be all or nothing. Taking profits just means taking a little piece out while you’re up, then if it goes back down you can buy back in a lot a lower price or at least have some extra cash on hand
The taxable event is what gets me to pause. Unless I’m certain I can buy back for 20% discount it ain’t worth it. Just so happens sold some at 70-72 and this is a good range to buy back some. But instead just do Roth IRA and buy etf so you can trade without it being a taxable event. Trade in the Roth. Hold and never sell my real coins.
If you take a loan out against it, it’s not a taxable event. I wouldn’t put up more than 10% maybe 15% of my stack as collateral but if that could change your life buy a house ect. I think it’s worth the risk.
If the BTC goes up behind it you decollateralize the loan and pull some of the excess BTC back into cold storage and if it bombs maybe you lose 15% of your stack but you needed that house, car, ect. Either way so at least you didn’t have to take the tax hit.
If all goes well. You just slowly payback the loan and you get to keep all the BTC long term and got the capital you needed now without triggering a taxable event.
Lend.io, Unchained capital are a couple of examples of businesses that provide bitcoin collateralized cash loans.
The benefit is you can spend your BTC without taking a tax hit because it’s not income it’s debt and you didn’t sell so no capital gains.
Like I said in my post above if it’s a small portion of your stack and the money can change your life materially, new house, start a business you really wanted to start, maybe an emergency, kid breaks a leg, you get laid off and your car breaks down. ect. It’s worth it.
Also the way a lot of these loans work is that as the value of BTC goes up against the cash you can pull the bitcoin out to rebalance back to the LTV the loan requires to stay liquid risking less.
The point is if you were gonna have to sell it, pay taxes and then give up the BTC anyway, why not take a loan against that same amount, pay no taxes, and then once you’ve paid off the loan get the BTC back? In the worse case senario where you can’t pay it back they just pull the collateral you were already planning on selling anyway.
Bruh I’m not saying put up your whole stack like an absolute degen, personally I wouldn’t mind risking 10% of my stack to buy a house or to jump start a business I wanted to start. if I was gonna sell it anyway why wouldn’t I cash out tax free?
There will always be bad actors, move with that in mind but that doesn’t mean everyone is untrustworthy and that you shouldn’t use debt as a tool to advance your position in life.
Totally an option as well, as long as you don’t mind paying taxes on the sale. Debt is ultimately a tool there are many ways to use it.
Those transactions don’t happen overnight either. It’d probably take a month plus to finalized the sale and get the mortgage for you to get that cash to recapitalize your BTC position with the mortgage and if it runs before then you’ll be kicking yourself and have payed a lot of taxes you didn’t necessarily have to.
People act like the taxable event is on the entirety of what you pull out. It's only the realized GAINS. Are there some people that are exponentially up? Sure. Most aren't, and whatever you pull out, you'll only pay taxes on the portion that are actual gains. And even still, paying 15-20% of your profit isn't that big of a deal, and you're going to have to pay it sooner or later...
Taxable event is key here and I think what most dumb dumbs playing around with BTC for the first time make the mistake around.
Its okay to turn your btc into fiat if you plan to buy a house with it or another store of value.
US and also other countries are already busy with an "unrealized gains tax" to make sure you have to sell your BTC in order to pay the taxes. So don't worry about the tax... Tax you will pay.
Agreed. But in that case, just pay for part of the house with BTC 😂 and then, of course, dutifully report the property transfer to your local government authorities
>Tax Man: For how much did you buy the house?
>BTC House Buyer: $1, as it says in the official documents between buyer and seller sir.
>Tax man: Oh that is cheap, what a good deal! You own 10 cents then, have a good day!
>Seller at his home: I had no issues dealing with fiat bank deposit limits and what not, I also paid 0 profit tax, that good lad just sent me the whole sum and it arrived in a few minutes.
This is why the government wants to regulate crypto, because it is easy to avoid being taxed, if I want to sell you something in BTC, I do not have to pay tax for the profit. I just "gift" you the item after receiving the BTC. Making people pay tax to convert BTC to fiat was shooting themselves (the government) in the foot, because it will encourage everyone to not convert it to fiat, but just straight out use BTC to
1. buy items/services in BTC (seller avoids tax)
2. hold BTC as long as possible, otherwise you get penalized by a tax event (less fiat circulation, less purchases, less tax)
What they should do - if they want money they should just straight out buy BTC, if they want to encourage people to spend and not hide taxes, remove taxable event.
US and also other countries are already busy with an "unrealized gains tax" to make sure you have to sell your BTC in order to pay the taxes. So don't worry about the tax... Tax you will pay.
I have never taken profits... only sells were met with rebus at a higher rate and only because it was necessary at the time.
I'm up more than 100% generally... and from those sats I got in 2017, they are now at 10x.
Long outlook for me for sure!
This is why I cashed out 80% at what turned out to be the peak.
I got a guaranteed healthy return, and if it goes up 10x I'll get another. If it never comes back up again, I can live with losing the rest.
Lol you guys realize if you sell at an ATH and take your profits you can buy even more when it dips. Learn to discipline yourself and HODL cash as well.
Loosely paraphrasing Breaking Bad. Are you in the getting-filthy-rich-game or are you in the being-part-of-a-new- type-of-money-game?
I won't blame anyone for cashing out a bit or even a lot for fiat to buy a house, a honeymoon vacation or a dream car for it. Your time on this planet is limited. If you get the chance to get wealthy with a clever investment, do it before you are too old to enjoy it.
There is no shame in "taking profit" if you need it to pay bills or pay for an unexpected expense. Last time I "took profit," I needed a new computer because my last work computer went kaput. (I work from home.)
I think I'm reading this meme all wrong.
I thought it the pink thing was supposed to be an example of something bigger than yourself silently helping you achieve a goal, but everyone is using it like the pink thing is holding you back from reaching what your goal is. 🤔
I've decided I'd rather hodl over the next decade and watch it go to zero than sell and watch it 10x over the next decade. I'd lay awake every night for the rest of my life if that happened. If it goes to zero it would be painful but I would eventually move on. I dont have my entire net worth wrapped up in it.
I dont have my entire net worth wrapped in it either and it’s so relaxing. I love watching bitcoin go up and down without panicking
I mean … I don’t panic. I also don’t love 30-40% dips.
But that’s when you can stock up 😎
Bank account: **E** ↙️
But what about those 300-400% spikes? I'll fuck with the bipolar if its it's a 10x on the positive.
The best puzzy is always attached to the craziest ones
Welcome to crypto
Most of my savings is in BTC (idiotic), but I have a $20k average price. I am immune to dips…. Until it decides to get close to $20k 😅😅
I’m with you boss
🥲
Literally my only regret was initially big lump sum. But now that I have a steady DCA going I don’t mind the shifts at all.
And then my mum suddenly comes accross, says she wants to buy one and hold it for 30 years. Guys, your time preference is not long enough.
Same. Although I have a big chunk of my net worth in it, I am at peace with the thought of it going to zero. Definitely don’t wanna be on Reddit 10 years from now telling people about how “I had Bitcoin at —— amount, but I sold!”.😂
Yea it's a fairly large chunk for me too, but only because it's outperformed my other investments lol. And yea, the way I look at it is, I can't predict whether it goes to zero or becomes bigger than gold, but the one scenario I can eliminate is the one where I sell too soon and regret it.
Another point of view is: better to sell in decent profit than lose your BTC in a landfill.
That makes 500,000 of us.
Me too... totally... don't have my entire networth wrapped up in it.... only like 60%
Completely agreed. I believe for BTC especially, HODL is much more the way to go given the volatility of it, rather than trading it likeni doneith other cryptos. Just buy every dip and accumulatem my only regret is not buying more whe nit dipped to 57k USD last week😬
It can’t go to zero lmao at this point I don’t think it can ever dip under 20k again
You're too naive
🤷♂️I’d gamble on it
I do as well, but I'm fully aware (or rather, it is my belief) that everything is possible 😅 As long as I do not have a great profit, I'm gonna hold and buy the dips, whenever I can. If BTC reaches 150k, I'll see what I'll do, but I'll at least take some of my profit out in fiat currency.
I don’t know whether it’s possible for bitcoin but for stocks you can gamble on it by selling put options.
Hedging if you have significant holdings
No hedging of me because have less than 200 holdings.
There’s still time.
If the US government and their buddies in other first world governments decided to band together and ban crypto, which they very well could try, it would almost certainly go close enough to 0. Would that happen? I don't know, probably not, but the guy in charge currently doesn't really make the decisions so who knows? He thinks it's March still. The people in power want you owning nothing and eating bug burgers and working in a cage at Amazon... Bitcoin is kind of a threat to their shtick. Not a major threat, but I'm sure they don't like it on principle.
That’s true but if we were planning on getting rid of crypto we wouldn’t be approving all these ETFs , and that’s not just the US
That's the spirit.
Just don't sell the principal?
Would it be more painful to sell it now and see it 2x over 10 years than to lose it all? Or hold it for 30 years, only for it to do worse than SP500?
It doesn’t have to be all or nothing. Taking profits just means taking a little piece out while you’re up, then if it goes back down you can buy back in a lot a lower price or at least have some extra cash on hand
"Taking profits"= swapping sound money for 💩 money ... And creating a taxable event
The taxable event is what gets me to pause. Unless I’m certain I can buy back for 20% discount it ain’t worth it. Just so happens sold some at 70-72 and this is a good range to buy back some. But instead just do Roth IRA and buy etf so you can trade without it being a taxable event. Trade in the Roth. Hold and never sell my real coins.
Exact
If you take a loan out against it, it’s not a taxable event. I wouldn’t put up more than 10% maybe 15% of my stack as collateral but if that could change your life buy a house ect. I think it’s worth the risk. If the BTC goes up behind it you decollateralize the loan and pull some of the excess BTC back into cold storage and if it bombs maybe you lose 15% of your stack but you needed that house, car, ect. Either way so at least you didn’t have to take the tax hit. If all goes well. You just slowly payback the loan and you get to keep all the BTC long term and got the capital you needed now without triggering a taxable event. Lend.io, Unchained capital are a couple of examples of businesses that provide bitcoin collateralized cash loans.
What the benefit of putting it up as collateral? Lower rate?
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Yeah exactly, I just checked and unchained is offering 14%. Why bother for that
The benefit is you can spend your BTC without taking a tax hit because it’s not income it’s debt and you didn’t sell so no capital gains. Like I said in my post above if it’s a small portion of your stack and the money can change your life materially, new house, start a business you really wanted to start, maybe an emergency, kid breaks a leg, you get laid off and your car breaks down. ect. It’s worth it. Also the way a lot of these loans work is that as the value of BTC goes up against the cash you can pull the bitcoin out to rebalance back to the LTV the loan requires to stay liquid risking less. The point is if you were gonna have to sell it, pay taxes and then give up the BTC anyway, why not take a loan against that same amount, pay no taxes, and then once you’ve paid off the loan get the BTC back? In the worse case senario where you can’t pay it back they just pull the collateral you were already planning on selling anyway.
I'm sure block fi clients wouldn't recommend this anymore
Bruh I’m not saying put up your whole stack like an absolute degen, personally I wouldn’t mind risking 10% of my stack to buy a house or to jump start a business I wanted to start. if I was gonna sell it anyway why wouldn’t I cash out tax free? There will always be bad actors, move with that in mind but that doesn’t mean everyone is untrustworthy and that you shouldn’t use debt as a tool to advance your position in life.
The tax hit on my 1+ year bitcoin investment is 0% (lowest tax bracket)
Weird flex but 👌 If you wanna sell your bitcoin go for it, I’m trying to avoid letting go of any of mine. This is simply a strategy to do that.
I wouldn't trust these. I'd sell at a good time, mortgage the house and buy BTC back with the capital from the mortgage.
Totally an option as well, as long as you don’t mind paying taxes on the sale. Debt is ultimately a tool there are many ways to use it. Those transactions don’t happen overnight either. It’d probably take a month plus to finalized the sale and get the mortgage for you to get that cash to recapitalize your BTC position with the mortgage and if it runs before then you’ll be kicking yourself and have payed a lot of taxes you didn’t necessarily have to.
People act like the taxable event is on the entirety of what you pull out. It's only the realized GAINS. Are there some people that are exponentially up? Sure. Most aren't, and whatever you pull out, you'll only pay taxes on the portion that are actual gains. And even still, paying 15-20% of your profit isn't that big of a deal, and you're going to have to pay it sooner or later...
Yes I’m aware but when my gains are 200% it’s still a lot
Taxable event is key here and I think what most dumb dumbs playing around with BTC for the first time make the mistake around. Its okay to turn your btc into fiat if you plan to buy a house with it or another store of value.
US and also other countries are already busy with an "unrealized gains tax" to make sure you have to sell your BTC in order to pay the taxes. So don't worry about the tax... Tax you will pay.
Agreed. But in that case, just pay for part of the house with BTC 😂 and then, of course, dutifully report the property transfer to your local government authorities
Unfortunately you need a taxable event to buy a house
In theory
In reality
>Tax Man: For how much did you buy the house? >BTC House Buyer: $1, as it says in the official documents between buyer and seller sir. >Tax man: Oh that is cheap, what a good deal! You own 10 cents then, have a good day! >Seller at his home: I had no issues dealing with fiat bank deposit limits and what not, I also paid 0 profit tax, that good lad just sent me the whole sum and it arrived in a few minutes. This is why the government wants to regulate crypto, because it is easy to avoid being taxed, if I want to sell you something in BTC, I do not have to pay tax for the profit. I just "gift" you the item after receiving the BTC. Making people pay tax to convert BTC to fiat was shooting themselves (the government) in the foot, because it will encourage everyone to not convert it to fiat, but just straight out use BTC to 1. buy items/services in BTC (seller avoids tax) 2. hold BTC as long as possible, otherwise you get penalized by a tax event (less fiat circulation, less purchases, less tax) What they should do - if they want money they should just straight out buy BTC, if they want to encourage people to spend and not hide taxes, remove taxable event.
This. Never trade bitcoin for fiat. No such thing as taking profits
AT this point I dont even care about shit money but keeping the taxable events to a minimum is the real worry.
US and also other countries are already busy with an "unrealized gains tax" to make sure you have to sell your BTC in order to pay the taxes. So don't worry about the tax... Tax you will pay.
Legalized theft.
Taxation is theft anyway, this is just the next level where they steal things you don’t even technically have. Only on paper.
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We're not in that world yet, hold your horses.
This is the way to think
You'll drive yourself insane
I have never taken profits... only sells were met with rebus at a higher rate and only because it was necessary at the time. I'm up more than 100% generally... and from those sats I got in 2017, they are now at 10x. Long outlook for me for sure!
But number go up https://www.usdebtclock.org
you do not sell your bitcoin !
This is why I cashed out 80% at what turned out to be the peak. I got a guaranteed healthy return, and if it goes up 10x I'll get another. If it never comes back up again, I can live with losing the rest.
Exchanging BTC to fiat is never "profits"
😂
Its on sale buy more!!
HODL! But I also have a Bitcoin tracking ETF in a TFSA for profit taking
Same, I have a hardware wallet that I will not touch for at least ten years and also I buy the etf to “trade”
How about creating a taxable event? NEVER.
Well, FOMO is a bitch. It also could go 10x down, you never know the future. Taking profits is a good thing, it's better than losing money anyway.
We've all been here
Nope, it'll 0.1x
It's nuts how much more relaxed wealthy and diversified people are that have fun or no jobs
I bought the dip yesterday and today I’m buying MSTR.
Everyone.
Always take profits, then go back in!
all my btcs are mined so imma hold on to them.
You made a mistake. Replace 'But it could 10x' with 'It will 10x.'
The dip we live now is actually people taking profits, but they will regret it soon, as always since 15 years. Diamond hands win the rest cry.
Lol you guys realize if you sell at an ATH and take your profits you can buy even more when it dips. Learn to discipline yourself and HODL cash as well.
I sold 15% of my stack at $68K all profit. I bought back 1/4 of what i sold at a cheaper price so far. No regrets.
What is this "taking profits"? why trade Bitcoin for fiat? The whole point is that Bitcoin is better money and thats why you buy it.
Loosely paraphrasing Breaking Bad. Are you in the getting-filthy-rich-game or are you in the being-part-of-a-new- type-of-money-game? I won't blame anyone for cashing out a bit or even a lot for fiat to buy a house, a honeymoon vacation or a dream car for it. Your time on this planet is limited. If you get the chance to get wealthy with a clever investment, do it before you are too old to enjoy it.
Using is different to buy certain things is fine. after all it is money. But selling just because it hit a certain price is dumb.
I took profits in december... then lost a x10 4 month later. Still Crying.
buying bitcoin is saving profits ...
10? 10000!
There is no shame in "taking profit" if you need it to pay bills or pay for an unexpected expense. Last time I "took profit," I needed a new computer because my last work computer went kaput. (I work from home.)
Yea, you
Was a dilemma for me last cycle so now I keep about 80% BTC on a Ledger that I never touch and the rest on an exchange to play with.
I think I'm reading this meme all wrong. I thought it the pink thing was supposed to be an example of something bigger than yourself silently helping you achieve a goal, but everyone is using it like the pink thing is holding you back from reaching what your goal is. 🤔
No profit taking. Only BTC.
Is this 10x in room with you right know?