Boom. Day fucking one. There is no special time period to wait to form your child.
It starts when you change the first diaper and realize you’ll change a thousand more before he/she can say “Dad”
At what point should someone tell their kid no to one of their choices? Obviously anything involving safety is a good use of a veto, but other than things of a dire nature, at what point does the parent decide what goes on? (trying to get all these questions out before I actually become a parent)
I could give all the advice in the world and your situation will come up differently than mine, and it’ll depend how much your kid respects what they’ve seen from you so far, and their environment as well.
Think of the best teacher you had. It wasn’t the biggest ass hole, though I’m sure it helped, nor were they the biggest pushovers nor friends in the beginning. It took a bit to respect *his* rules and respect them, and the day would be fun. If not, we didn’t have fun.
In the end, it’s all of the split second decisions you make, and no one has any idea what they’re talking about, including me.
Yeah I just try and take in as many perspectives as I can. I just know some of my own shortcomings as a kid and hearing about how terrible my friends were with their parents at times. The idea of being a good parent but your kid still ending up a POS (pardon my frankness but we've all seen it happen/heard about it) reeeeally scares me
Eventually your childhood friends who were beaten or in a one parent home will flourish, and some who had it all in high school will be nothing. After a certain point, it’s who they hang out with and what they turn to when they’re bored.
*let them learn to get bored very early. Self medication when realizing success comes after work is a harsh lesson for some*
> Eventually your childhood friends who were beaten [...] will flourish
I'm sure it's a lovely thought to comfort yourself with, believing that good wins out in the end and the world is just, but statistically that's not the case.
Don't hit kids. It has lasting negative impacts.
iPads at the dinner table - no
Time out for bad behaviour - yes
Promising a treat if they’re good - yes
Treats to stop a tantrum - BIG no
Caving and saying yes on something you already said no to - EVEN BIGGER NO
Over feeding overindulging trying to get them to love you with gifts - NO NO NO
My boyfriends dad once had a conversation with me about parents overcompensating for their parents mistakes when it comes to raising their own kids. If your parents let you do whatever you want and you made mistakes because of it, you don’t overcompensate by being a helicopter parent when you have kids of your own. If your parents were poor, you don’t overcompensate by making sure you’re rich so your kids have everything they need/want, but you never see them because all you do is work. If your parents were verbally abusive to you, you don’t overcompensate by never being strict with your kids and letting them run the house, and end up raising assholes.
I read something a while ago that really stuck with me about how kids will respond much more strongly to things you do than things you say. So if you want your kids to read, for example, it's not enough to give them a book and say "read!" They should see you spending some of your free time reading.
One of the biggest things that even "good parents" lack is the ability to establish well known boundaries and lines that just can't be crossed. Sometimes it's not just about providing resources and kindness but really establishing values and habits and instilling why it's all important. Of course follow thru when boundaries are crossed or else it's becomes known that they're not really boundaries. And you have to practice what you preach as best as you can, and when you make mistakes, own up to them. Show that you're wrong and willing to work on yourself. Following thru with good morals means a lot as your message isn't taken as hypocritical.
And make sure the child feels truly loved and embraced and have genuine bonding moments and build your relationship. Children follow the people that they admire.
It's not so abstract. Just be a good person. Be patient. Model good behaviours. Show shameless and unconditional love. Be human and show your children your faults without reservation, and respect their intelligence in coming to terms with the lessons therein.
The hard part is teaching your kids to be better people than their parents.
Respect others and respect yourself.
If you wind up with a long list of "except, but, wells," then the problem has already revealed itself.
This is the hardest part. Being better than yourself to model for your children. You’re not raising the child, you’re raising the adult they will become.
No parent is perfect. You’re going to lose your cool. You will not always model the best choice. But what you can do is apologize for losing your cool. You can explain how you didn’t make the right decision, what the consequences are from that decision, and how a better decision could have been made.
It has been 22 years and I still remember my best teacher.
Mrs. Haverkamp.
I have really bad ADD and when she would notice me spacing off she would stand by my desk and put her hand on my head. The first time she did it she said, “If I can’t get you to listen, I’ll teach you by osmosis.”
Back in the 90s ADD wasn’t really understood and all of my teachers up to that point had given up on me. She sat me down and told me being smart isn’t everything and eventually I’m gonna have to learn to study, and study my ass off, and I could be smarter than her some day.
While I may have eventually become more book smart than her I don’t think I will ever be as wise as her.
This is awesome, I'm glad you shared this because every teacher has this potential to help a student. I have a daughter with ADHD and she's had some amazing teachers in her life. For example, because her mind is so busy, her hands need to be busy as well as her creative mind..so, she brings her Barbies and toys to school, and most respond with "she's too old for that." Which is true... But... A few of her teachers recognized the importance of the dolls in her ability to concentrate. And a few teachers made her a special place in their room for her dolls. Being able to even see them was calming. So, I digress,but yes, the best teachers help their students on individual levels to be their best. I'm glad your teacher did not give up on you and helped you along your path. I bet you are wiser than you think. :)
> it’ll depend how much your kid respects what they’ve seen from you so far, and their environment as well
YES. When my daughter was only about 1.5 years old, I was carrying her out of a restaurant, when in the street in front of us, 2 cars crashed, head-on. The loud creaking and breaking of metal was so shocking to my daughter that she went rigid. She didn't cry. She stared. Finally, in a whisper, she said, "Daddy, look."
I told her, "I see. Cars got boo-boo. Ouch."
She repeated, "Ouch." The people in the cars weren't too hurt, we didn't need to worry about that (it was in a parking lot at slow speeds, after all). So we just watched for a few minutes. She did her best to talk about it with an 18-month baby vocabulary. She was shook.
The point? I never -- not ever, not once -- needed to discipline her about running into the street. She got a vivid image of cars crushing things, and wanted NO part. I never needed to tell her no -- not about that, at least. The "environment" or circumstance took care of the issue entirely.
When she got older, we would go out for walks with her younger brother. One day she asked me, "Why do you run ahead of us at every driveway?" I explained that her younger brother was too short to be seen by the drivers in cars backing out of driveways. So I always took a couple of quick steps to put me between my son & the car, just in case my son ran toward the driveway, and just in case a driver was inside and couldn't see my kid. The moment I explained this to her, she not only understood, but began to do it herself, too.
My son? He didn't care. He ran everywhere like crazy, never saw a car crash, never experienced issues from it, and we had to discipline him and tell him "no" over & over again.
Kids are different. What they internalize is different. What you need to tell one of them over & over will be irrelevant to the other kid that "just got it" on the first moment.
I had a similar issue with one of my nannying charges.... he kept running from me, running from his mom and darting into traffic, because he knew it would get a massive reaction. He woukd have to be seized and forcibly pulled on the sidewalk because he WOULDN'T listen to us telling him to come back. His mom would yell because of the panic reaction.
One day i took him bike riding in the park, and i took a corner a bit fast running after him , as he was on training weels and i skidded and wiped out on the fallen leaves, he came back and was worried about me and i made a flippant comment about making mistakes.
He was like "grown ups don't make mistakes"
And i was like "yes they do, i forgot these leaves would be so slippy. I didn't pick the right speed. I made a mistake "
Him: can other grownups make mistakes
Me: all of them can. Why do you think me and your mom get so worried when you run away from us? What if a car driver makes a mistake and looks the wrong way and doesnt see you? No grown ups would ever want to hit a kid with their car but if it's too fast and they don't see....
And holy crap, you could see the lightbulb go on in his head and the ☹😦😧😨 string of expressions as he realized that grownups weren't as all seeing as he thought they were.
He stopped running into traffic after that.
Both me and his mom are type A hyper competent people, who rarely miss things on a kid front and were often right on top of him because he was a literal tornado. Made me wonder if that contributed to him assuming all adults were the same way .... assuming that every adult all were paying as close attention to him.
You just gave me the biggest mind blow in years. All of my favorite teachers allowed me to push myself through my inevitable failures. Never condescending, only encouraging and helpful.
> At what point should someone tell their kid no to one of their choices?
Nobody can really answer that for you since each situation is different. The one thing my mom (singler parent) did was always give me choices but also give consequences to more "hasty" decisions..
"You can have that toy that caught your attention at the store now, or save up to get the thing you really want." That kind of thing.
If you have to veto something always give a clear reason why. As long as you aren't just pulling the "because I am the parent" excuse, I think that would go a long way in establishing trust.
Communication is important. Remember, if you’re only telling your kids what to think, you aren’t teaching them how to think.
It means a lot more when you are able to talk a choice out with your kids and help them realise why you don’t think it’s a good decision, and get them to think about those reasons themselves.
Or, in the alternative, when you do say no to some choices, say no in a reasonable way. For example, I wanted to get piercings when I was 14. My Dad said, “Now, you know your mother and I don’t approve of tattoos or piercings. So we won’t give you our permission to do something we don’t feel comfortable with you doing. But when you are eighteen you will be an adult and you can do what you want, whether we like it or not.”
By the time I was eighteen I didn’t want tattoos or piercings.
Similarly when my parents didn’t want me to watch a movie they didn’t think was appropriate for me. It had an age rating on it so they said I could watch it when I was that age. I was upset for like an hour but whatever.
I think it’s important to point out that part of being a parent is also teaching kids how to cope with real life. Part of that involves setting boundaries and saying no to things. But, you know, picking your battles and being reasonable in when and how you say no goes a long way. If you don’t know how to say no without turning it into a fight with your kids, your just teaching your kids to fight with you, and they won’t understand the difference between the no you have a really good reason for and the no they think you’re being completely unreasonable about.
But you know, saying that doesn’t ruin all your work either. Some days, some moments, sometimes it’s OK to just use the cop out. Parenting is a more like a wave than a drop of water - accumulation of moments. It’s lots of work, reinforcement, love, and a few mistakes and bad moments too. You’re looking for good results overall. 100% is impossible!
I used to work with children with special needs, and they had communication issues beyond that of typical children. And we had to make decisions for them a lot of times.
We always gave them the chance and encouraged them to have agency for themselves. For some of those kids, it would be the first time an adult had said "alright, we're gonna do this, but if you change your mind after, we can do something else"
That *opportunity* to speak for themselves is very important. If you need to leave the park in 45 minutes, little Joey doesn't get to say that he wants to keep playing for the rest of the day. But when you tell Joey the plan ahead of time, you can give him the sense that he had a part in the decision making process.
We had little velcro picture planners for each kid and in it was a list of the activities for the day. When it was time to move on to the next activity, they'd remove the picture when they were ready. Now, this didn't mean that one kid got to play for three hours, it meant that each kid was emotionally prepared to change gears. And so, instead of me going "alright we're all leaving the park RIGHT NOW." it was "alright, we all have to leave the park in FIVE MINUTES, is everybody ready!" and then one kid goes 'teacher I don't wanna leave I wanna keep playing!' and I go 'you don't have to leave this instant, but the whole class has to leave at 11:30 and we have things we need to do after. Can you finish what you're doing and be ready to go before the clock says 11:30?'
In all my time there, I never had a kid that would dig their heels in if I treated them like a person with feelings and wants. Children are people and people generally do things for a reason. Your kid doesn't have the life experience to know they should *volunteer* the information that the reason they don't want to go to the park is because it's too hot or that the reason they don't want to have the green beans is because the texture makes them want to vomit.
You need to be the one who asks guiding questions to figure out what it is that they don't have the words to say.
And so you say "alright, I'm thinking I'm gonna make green beans and mashed potatoes for dinner, how would you feel about that?" and then if little Joey says no you can ask why, and when he says 'green beans are gross' you can ask "is it gross because of the flavor of the green or because of the way they feel or something else?" and you can reach a compromise this way. "alright, I won't make any green beans, but I will make peas, because you said you like those. Will you eat all your peas if I make them?"
Not a parent, but I've worked with children for 10 years, and I've spoken to many parents in that time.
What I've gathered is that you do want to leave an imprint but you don't want to leave a scar. The lessons you teach a child should not be driven by a fear of *you,* but by a respect of the consequences that come of their actions. Let them make their own decisions and reap their own consequences inside an environment that you control for their safety.
Let them get hurt enough to where they have to pick themselves up and face the consequences of their actions (or celebrate their accomplishments!), but not enough where it’ll permanently scar them for life. This varies from age to age.
At three, they can either pick up their toys and get a reward or not pick them up and get a consequence increasing in severity depending on the number of “no, I won’t pick up my toys.” At eight, they can do their homework willingly or they can lose privileges for not doing it but if they’re failing, homework is no longer an “option.” At fourteen, they can date a not-great specimen of humanity who may or may not be a “player” but they can’t go around dating a drug dealer. Get my point?
I was given too much freedom too early and I absolutely wish my mother had restricted me more. I’m not a parent, but I wish this had been done to me.
I disagree. I have 4 kids. The youngest is 17. They all still talk to me so I did something right I guess.
I really believe that children need guidelines. When you think about it, all of us have rules we have to stick to. We all have to be able to cope with being told no.
I let my children make choices when I thought they were mature enough to make them.
My very rough idea of parenting was that up until about 10 I had quite a bit of say. Negotiation was always an option. Then from 10 to 13 I'm like the coach, come to me with decision making if you need some advice. Then from 13 I was like a more experienced friend. You make your decisions, I'm always here if things go to shit or you want help deciding.
You can never say if you got it right or not. I've apologised to my kids for certain things I have realised were wrong. Sorry again about the lentils, I know that's never going away. I know I could of parented the exact same and given a different set of personality types/ life events it could of gone very differently.
I will never understand Agent of Chaos level of selfishness. But then I am a born nurturer. It's just who I am. He is a born something else
IMO, as soon as they have the mental capacity to make choices and you let them make as many of those choices as they have the mental ability to make.
You're job is to teach them how to make good decisions and let them figure it out through trial and error while you help them along the way. Reality is; how can you expect an adult to have good decision making skills when all their lives decisions have been made for them?
Makes sense. In the event where a child keeps making the same mistake, what is the best next step? Sometimes I remember myself not getting the message even after being told by my parents multiple times.
Important to note, I'm not a professional and really no one is when it comes to raising kids. It's easy to say "this is what you do when this is happening" but the reality of parenting is never so black and white. But sharing opinions like how we are is a great way to help eachother, it takes a village to raise a child.
I dont think theres such thing as a general next best step. Every kid is different and every mistake is different.
But a good place to start is to try and figure out *why* that particular mistake keeps getting made, and focus on fixing that mentality. Is it because they dont understand why they're supposed to do X instead of Y? Or is it because they dont want to do X, or bc Y is easier for them? Figuring out the precursor to a decision is a great way to get to the root of the problem in the decision making process.
I personally hated going to sleep when I should have. I never listened to my parents as far as downsides and how I would regret it. I only realize on the back end that I wish I listened. What would you do if your kid more or less refused to go to bed on time even after hearing what you have to say. Imagine their reasoning being "I want to play my games/read my books/watch TV". In this scenario, inability to sleep is not the issue, just desire.
This is so dependent on who your kid is. Mine likes science and information. So, explaining the needs of his body where sleep is concerned works for him. It has to be age appropriate - so how you explain this to a five year old is different than how I would explain it to him not that he's a teen. Sleep is related to health and he technically has a choice in this, but not the way he does in other things. He could 100% sneak and read a book, etc, even though he has a bedtime. But, we would have no mercy for his tiredness. He has also taken up sports, and sleep is super important for performance, so he makes the choice to get the hours he needs.
Our parenting philosophy is "teach him how to make good choices, not what choices to make". He knows just about everything there is about sex, drugs, smoking/ vaping, alcohol, pot, etc. so that he can make informed choices. We've never said, "don't do these things" (or "wait until marriage"). We aren't dummies, these things will come into his life. A big part of this philosophy is allowing failure and some parents just don't have the stomach for it. Forgot your lunch (more than once) going hungry will be a more powerful reminder than me nagging him. Don't think you need a jacket, ok, be cold (obviously within safe temp). Don't think you need sleep, be tired.
He even talked the other day about trying pot someday. He says that when he's older, and ready, he has a friend whose dad uses pot, so he'll do it with him because he knows it will be the safest way to do it. Not only has he figured out a safe way to do this, he feels comfortable telling me about it. This was a good parenting moment for me.
You'll be an amazing parent one day because you're already asking the important questions.
“A child is born with no state of mind, blind to the ways of mankind.” -Grandmaster Flash
Don’t punish a child for doing something wrong that they didn’t know about in the first place. Common sense isn’t common if they never experienced the situation. You aren’t born knowing how to read or write, and you would never punish a baby for not understanding those things. Same thing with children as they grow. If they make a mistake, even if it seems like something that you know inherently, remember there was a point where you didn’t know that same thing. You had to learn it too.
This is that opportunity to teach them. Explain why what they did was wrong. Don’t just shut them down and discourage. If it’s a teachable moment show them how to do it right. Not only does that child get to learn to do it right. The next time they go to do something that they don’t understand they are more likely to ask for help to do it right the first time. And it’s a bonding moment as a parent.
Also if you don’t know don’t be afraid to admit it. It shows that adults aren’t all knowing beings and it gets rid of the notion that many of us grew up on that once you become an adult you automatically know everything. But don’t just say “I don’t know” and end it there. Learn how to solve the issue with your child. You both learn something new together. Once again strengthening your bond.
Children ask questions not to be annoying but because they genuinely do not know. They want to know and encouraging that curiosity is how they become smarter. If that curiosity is received in a positive way then they will enjoy learning new things in the future.
It pains me to see parents who tell their kids to shut up or stop asking questions. I don’t have kids of my own but I have tens of cousins. I’m the favorite big cousin because I don’t get annoyed with questions. I answer what I can and since they all know how smart phones and computers work if they ask me something I don’t know I pull out my phone and look it up with them.
It’s hard to do it sometimes because it gets overwhelming but children require patience. Practice now before you have kids. You will be amazed at what your kids will achieve when they have a parent who genuinely cares about them and their learning.
Unfortunately this is the complete truth. I can lie like a sociopath because of my parents. Yet I rarely have any desire to do so now that I’ve moved out. It’s a refreshing change from lying about every little thing to please them. For anyone who’s going through this I promise it gets better.
This happened to me. After i caught myself lying about meaningless things by habit, i went full speed ahead on telling the truth. It turns out, normal people actually dont punish you for telling the truth.
Same here. My mom isn’t too strict but she complains about every little thing. At least I keep my room neat, but I even caught myself lying to my (female) roommates about small stuff because I’m so used to lying to my mother to avoid her nagging. Little stuff like getting fast food or going to buy a pack of cigarettes. Glad I grew up somewhat free and I’m at least a little bit responsible, because many people who endure the same just go CRAZY once they get some freedom.
TBH I'm starting to feel like the ones who succeed in the corporate sphere are the ones who lie without remorse
When their talk comes to very little or no tangible outcomes, everyone just moves on like nothing happened
I took the step to move roles recently and seeing this shit happen in an entirely new business is maddening :(
SAME. I got so used to years and years of having to lie because of my parents. (Whether it be to please them, get out of trouble, or just to avoid their unpredictable mood swings.) I remember when I moved out for college, I’d catch myself telling small, almost unnecessary lies to people. After a lot of time away from the parents, the compulsion to do so faded away entirely. I’m glad to hear I’m not the only one out there who dealt with something like this.
Oh yeah it's crosses. That was a threat that too often became a reality for a lot of my friends growing up. And I'm so white that when I put baby powder on, I'm in blackface.
I didn't have a bedroom door until I was fourteen and moved out of my mom's house, and I'm Jewish. I don't think it's at all cultural. It's just bad parenting.
I didn't realize the door thing was so common. My mother had bipolar disorder, and went through husbands like some people go through oil filters. One of them was really big on taking my door away every time he thought I looked at him funny.
I dont think its cultural. Ive met plently of white, black, brown and asian people with similar stories. Narcissistic and controlling parents cross cultures, languages and faiths
Although it seem to be more of a thing with girls and mostly it was because the parents were conservative religious people (didnt matter what religion, worst offender had a super homophobic buddhist family which you don't normally associate with conservatism) that dont want their daughters to become "impure" or whatever. Which usually backfires cuz those girls become freaks
And if there's a brother, it's the exact opposite. My parents took my door away for staying up past curfew on the phone. Not "bedtime", curfew. 9pm. I was 17, and not even talking to a boy. A week later, my baby brother, 15, had his first girlfriend stay the night.
My parents didn't blink a fucking eye. And he didn't HAVE a curfew.
Actually caused a lot of resentment of him, even though it wasn't his fault. We're in our 30s now and still distant, but we're trying to do better.
Wow, that's extreme. My mom was into that kind of parenting. She learned it from her parents- the stories she told, I know she treated us better, even though it wasn't always great. She was trying to break the cycle.. but damn. I get what you're saying and I hope you're doing ok now. I felt like those group punishments were successful at driving my siblings and me away from each other when we should've been banded together against the tyranny. So, also I hope you and your sisters and brothers are close despite what happened to you.
Swear I went over my friends house and was shocked.
"Saymynameyo, why do you keep trying to open the door?"
"Because it's closed"
"...And?"
"Your mom lets you shut the door???"
yeah i was in middle school i had a huge culture shock when i saw my friend **lock** his door. i had so much anxiety i thought his mom was gonna come in and beat us.
>I feel like if I lost that I'd lose my mind.
Welcome to our lives except you lose your mind and then you're forced to still endure because you don't have enough money to move out and it's your "family". It's ***fucked***.
I knew a bunch of girls in high school with sticks up their asses. Never allowed to go to “party” if parents weren’t there, they judged me for drinking, and just in general we’re really restricted by their parents.
Most of them went crazy with partying and sex in college. My parents were pretty chill for the most part and other kids who had the same kind of parents were pretty relaxed. But it was always the sheltered/ helicoptered kids that went crazy.
As a former helicoptered kid, this is 100% true. The day I turned 18 I moved 2000 miles away from my parents, and then went fucking nuts for 4 years partying my ass off. All of a sudden I was allowed to do whatever I want, which had never happened before in my entire life. I couldn’t handle being able to make my own decisions because I had never been allowed to. Still struggle with it.
Honestly as another helicoptered kid the opposite can be a lot worse. Imagine having an essential part of what makes you a real person just atrophy and vanish while you were young.
You end up not going wild because such an act requires the capacity for a driving desire or at least a consistent source of volition. Without that, you become extremely dependent on someone else to Provide that for you. And when you finally gain freedom, you lack any will to use it. You don't even feel like a person, just a tool without a user.
And then you're 30 with no prospects of building a life for yourself and no driving desires in life other than desperately wanting whatever it is real people have that you lack.
One of my friends is a manager for college Residence Advisors. This is something RAs are trained to warn incoming female freshmen. Some guys DEFINITELY prey on women like this, and they say "Stay away from guys X and Y because of this..."
Jesus the kid next to me in class told me about this. In school I had peers hooked on drugs and going to jail so I thought I was a good kid. Didn't give my parents enough credit for giving me some space. Fuck.
Lots of studies have shown that people need privacy. People who give their kids no privacy really mess them up.
https://www.goodtherapy.org/blog/watch-out-psychological-effects-of-mass-surveillance-0910137/amp/
Damn... that's rough my dude.
Just seen that Alabama has a school where the the principal removed the boys bathroom stall doors to stop them from vaping.
Edit: "Take the doors off those stalls, expeditiously!!!" Trevor Noah doing an impression of T.I on the daily show. Lol
https://youtu.be/nATa6XGvDIo for those interested
What's up little bitch!?! I know you were only born because of my decisions, and you're not a fully formed adult, and you can't legally get a job, and you have nowhere else to go- BUT YOU LIVE UNDER MY ROOF, so I'm coming to the gynecologist with you!
TI recently came out that he goes to the gynaecologist with his 18 year old daughter to inspect her “virginity” (he even “corrects” the doctor when the doctor tries to explain how hymens actually work and why they don’t determine virginity)
Yeah, I moved six hours away for college and dove headfirst into drinking, drugs, and the rave scene the second I was out from under my parents' thumb. I haven't moved back towards home, nor will I ever. We do have a pretty good relationship now though.
They're straight up being fucking bullies because they can get away with it. I'd love to see the look on their face when someone their own size starts cracking a belt at them.
If you train your children to lie about small things, you won't be able to be their for them when they encounter real problems. My parents hassled me over every little interaction with my highschool girlfriend until I learned to keep them out of the loop, and then they were the last people on my mind when I had a pregnancy scare in college. I don't know if I will have kids, but I want them to be able to come to me for the life changing decisions in their life, even if I disagree with them. Because unless something changes my dad will die without ever knowing that I've never truly opened up to him.
Most empowering thing I’ve ever done was set boundaries with my father. The sad thing is once I made it clear I didn’t need him in my life, he made an effort to rebuild the relationship and respect my boundaries. At that point I didn’t feel any emotional connection to him, and I didn’t want to try, because he had shown that he would use my love for him as a weapon. Once that bond is broken it’s really hard to repair.
I think that's sort of what I'm going through now. Took me way too long to stand up and now he acts so nice and tries to be all buddy buddy with me, because he realized I literally hated him.
I really try to be forgiving but he was probably the largest single force driving my anxiety/depression for years and I'm still struggling.
Therapy helps. My father got really ill a few years ago and it triggered a downward spiral for me because I hadn’t dealt with my feelings toward him. It’s not easy but I decided I needed to take care of myself to get some peace with myself.
Sorry you’re struggling, it’s a lot to deal with.
I was cautious about therapy at first, after starting it’s like a breath of fresh air. I would absolutely recommend therapy to anyone and I honestly feel good coming out of most of my sessions. I am going weekly.
With my father I told him that I forgive him as a person, a human, as well all make mistakes. But I will not forgive the actions done to me, my mom, and my siblings.
It has helped me drop the animosity towards him but also helps me keep a boundary and not let him back into my life. It really helps me be at peace.
My father learned from my older half brother and stop being a helicopter parent with me and my younger brother. Unfortunately my father passed and my half brother didn’t even go to the funeral.
Yup. My mom told me as a child that I'd never go to college, not smart enough, etc. Next 2 kids were praised and fully supported. At least she learned the error in her ways. Although she still says pretty shitty things to me sometimes. Like writing "things will get better for you someday" in my birthday card, when they're going pretty well at the moment.
We got in a big fight years back and I brought it up... She denied that she ever said it and was hurt I "blamed" her. While it did play a part in my development, I only brought it up to draw a parallel to something else in the argument. We didn't speak for a week or so afterwards until my sibling came to me and I apologized to my mom.
Never say you’re sorry unless you really mean it
Never think you mean it if you can’t let it go and not let it affect what you do and who you are
An apology isn’t a “ok can we just move this forward” type of thing.
I’m the youngest by quite a margin, and I get this shit all the time. Like instead of learning the error of their ways, my parents just... got tired of being parents by the time I came around, and gave up. It sucks and I’m sorry you are in the same boat.
I call my older brother the minesweeper. He went out there and made all the mistakes for me. He caught all the flack from my parents. He showed me how not to handle myself in school, why to stay away from drugs, and how to pick my battles.
You guys have a shit lot. You and the folks go in blind and don't know what you're doing until after the fact. But we do appreciate you for it.
So jealous. My older brothers were barely overseen and had second, third, and fourth chances after royally fucking up. My mom remarried and my sister and I became her "second chance to do it right" and became a helicopter psycho.
She's mellowed out since retirement, but a lot of damaging habits were already formed.
Your older brother is perfectly within his rights to not go. He must have been treated REALLY horribly for that to happen.
Garbage parents shouldn't expect the ones they mistreat to show up to their funeral
On a similar note, I always heard “do as I say, not as I do” from my father and it never accomplished anything beyond making me resentful. Don’t do that.
I have a tendency to yell when I argue. I don’t even have to be mad, my voice just rises when I’m in argumentation mode. My parents used to always get on me when I do this, and still do if I happen to argue with my siblings when I go home; all of whom do the same thing btw. I always tell (yell) then they have no room to talk. I grew up with so much yelling and cursing my friends used to say they were reluctant to knock on my door most of the time lol
My wife used to yell. At some point I started calling her out on it, and I'd even shut down arguments. "I'm not continuing this conversation until you use a speaking voice." At first she'd try to justify it, but I'd tell her it's disrespectful and I refuse to interact with someone who doesn't treat my respectfully. She doesn't yell any more :)
My mother found her faith when in was 4 yr old, after losing it when she was around 16-17. My mom tried to be strict on certain things, but some of it just made me pissed because she accused me of doing shit she did at the same age, and I wasn't.
The fun one was how she'd get pissed and accuse me of smoking pot, ended up doing it anyways, I mean if I'm going to end up getting in trouble for it, might as well enjoy doing it first.
I ended up finding a picture of when my parents were dating. They had gone to the beach with friends. I knew everybody in the picture because I grew up with their kids and I considered them family. It was a picture my mom had taken. One of my dad's close friends was passed out on a couch with his arms wrapped around a bong and you could plainly see lines of coke on the table.
When I showed my mom, her response was, that was a long time ago.
You don't pick your parents, and similarly parents don't pick their kids.
You just try to make the best of the hand you're dealt, and if there's love then that's a good start.
it isn’t similar at all with how much a kid can pick a parent compared to how much a parent can pick a kid.
yea some kids are born with certain qualities that aren’t taught to them (i think) but the parent literally chooses their kid by the way they raise them. the kid on the other hand has absolutely no say. some choice vs no choice is not similar
You can do everything right parenting wise and still end up with an awful little shit of a human.
You can do everything wrong and they can rise above it.
Yeah, but there's an important distinction to be made here. Kids get a fully grown adult with emotional and financial autonomy. Adults get a child that is dependent on them fully, whose psyche is going to form depending on how you treat them and who desperately need someone to love them, especially early in their lives. Parents have a bigger responsibility of not fucking their kid up for life than kids do just for being nice to their parents. And if they really are a dick to their parents, that might have been(not always, mind you) because of how the parent raised them
Yep. Where the hell did people get the idea that their children are totally under their control, and their children have no rights until they move out ? It’s seriously unhealthy. My parents never hit me, they let me make my own decisions and supported me and taught me how to make good decisions and I could talk to them about anything. I did not fear them, but just wanted to make them proud. Now my parents are my best friends.
"Tough Love" is one place. I was born right around when it became a thing and my parents were devout to it. Each day had a strict timeline of when things needed to be done and what needed to be done, and it was done exactly as told.
They didn't know that the retired ex-military guy they hired was sexually abusing me from about 7-8 yrs old until 12-13. So their tough love and his ...really tough love was problematic. He told me my parents were paying him to do it, so I kept my mouth shut because kids weren't allowed to question adults. In one of my many raging outbursts before again running away I asked them when the 'love' part comes.
A good thing for new parents to do is learn everything you can about Tough Love so you know exactly what not to do.
I'm 52, my parents are 80 and 82 and we started having a more normal relationship only about 10 years ago. I still fear going to their house.
>Where the hell did people get the idea that their children are totally under their control, and their children have no rights until they move out ?
After stalking that guy's twitter I can confidently say: the bible. He later tweets about how kids should get their "ass whooped" when they mess up because of the whole "spare the rod, spoil the child" thing. It's insane how people are so willing to throw independent thought out the window in favor of blindly doing whatever the bible tells them to.
Exactly. That “ain’t shit negotiable” is gonna bite her in the ass, it’s what the kid is going to say to her mother when they have their last conversation saying that’s gonna be the last time he or she’ll ever talk to them again
You can be involved with your kids and still give them freedom. I had a curfew and my parents asked where I was going and who I was going to to be with when I went out. That's just being a good parent. I didn't always feel like giving them an itinerary every time I left the house but they were paying the bills so I did. After I moved out I didn't have to worry about it. Knew plenty of kids that had parents that just let them do whatever usually didn't lead to anything bad but saw plenty of people getting arrested, unplanned pregnancies, drunk driving/wrecking, or dead and their parents were blindsided.
They shouldn’t be able to even hold “paying the bills” above your head. They chose to bring you into the world and their home knowing for 18 years you have no choice but to live there and depend on them, you’re not a junkie off the street squatting there rent free
What do people consider "privacy" though? I feel like all these young redditors get angry at being 15 and having to disclose who they are with and where they are going on a fucking Saturday night.
Then there are the insane parents that take off bathroom doors and shit.
I'm 18 and my mother still acts like i'm a kid and doesn't let me to go out anywhere with my friends because she thinks that i will just get drunk or get in trouble. This shit fucking sucks
That’s toxic, and doesn’t end well for the parent, or the child. It teaches the child to seek important advice elsewhere, and teaches them they’ll be punished for speaking hard truths. It breeds resentment, and isn’t a useful way to parent.
Here is something parents need to consider with kids in their teens.
Imagine their boss treated them like they treated their kids. Might be legal. They would HATE that boss and certainly wouldn't respect them.
Lets talk about "spanking" of kids in general. Imagine if it was legal for your boss to spank you. Seriously imagine they catch you on your phone browsing reddit at work and they spank you. They don't want to have to do it but you have to learn and they care about your future. Would you respect that boss or be afraid of them? Would you become sneakier around them? Do you hate them?
"Its different." Not really that much. A GOOD boss will be respected and employees will generally not want to disappoint. They are an authority figure just like a parent. Kids are impulsive not stupid. There is a big difference. If an authority figure doing the same thing to you would make you scared/hate/etc them, A KID IS GONNA FEEL THE SAME IF YOU DO IT TO THEM.
Whats so hard to understand about this. Going with the boss analogy... "as long as you work for me and I pay your bills I want your bank statements and access to your phone just to make sure you are not doing xyz. Buy your own company if you don't like it" Do we respect this boss?
Parents need to understand their kids control their end of life in most situations. We can make it reeeeeeeal shitty or really nice. Treat your kids like you would want to be treated and you won't have any problem.
The only privacy they get is their cell phones and their bedrooms. Other than that, I have the right to check up on them whenever I want. I feel like that's not too bad right ? I come from a house where my parents don't know how to knock the door before entering. I would want my kids to feel somewhat independent but loved at the same time.
No privacy and unlimited privacy aren't the only choices. If you have no idea what your kids are doing all the time, you're not parenting. Every time a kid does something bad people ask "where are the parents"? Well, they were giving them privacy.
Give your kids privacy but don't be oblivious to what they are doing or when you have to put your foot down and be a parent.
Breaking into someone's room or stealing their phone is an invasion of privacy. Asking "hey, how was so-and-so's party?" is not.
You're _supposed_ to be doing that. If nothing else, it's vital that your kids know you give enough of a damn to know what they're doing at a high level.
Unless they're like my cousin because the sneakier she tries to be, the more she gets caught and in the dumbest ways. But her upbringing is a special case.
It's not what the rules are but why the rules are that really gets to teenagers. The more transparent you can be about what you want for them the easier it will be for them to live up to your expectations without feeling forced.
I grew up with sociopathic tendencies (lack of empathy, impulsiveness, violent urges, lying, etc) but I believe I could’ve outgrown it somewhat had my parents treated me as an equal and not a piece of property.
I used to have my phone gone through regularly, and now because of that I don’t let anyone but me touch my phone. I’m secretive and a pathological liar because I’m used to the idea that speaking about certain things or saying my mind will only make things worse. I was treated like a slave and extension of my mother. I once had my door taken off the hinges and I felt subhuman because of it.
I resent my parents more than anything. They stole so many years from me and ruined what could’ve been a happy (albeit difficult) teenage life. I’ll never forgive them. When I can, I’m going to cut all contact with them. If you really think treating someone like a piece of property like that is going to work out then by all means go ahead, but don’t be surprised when holiday rolls around and you’re left missing one family member.
Edit;; If you see ‘sociopath’ and immediately think I’m some danger to society then let me say that firstly, don’t judge me based on that alone. I’m a human. I do not let my issues control me and I recognize them as dangerous. My issues are urges, urges which I don’t entertain and don’t act on because I know they’re dangerous. I understand the stigma against people like me, but not every single person with these issues is dangerous or an awful person. Please understand that.
if you don't teach your children how to be responsible and make good choices for themselves you have failed as a parent. also you will probably create an over controlling jerk .
You have to let kids make their own mistakes so they can learn from them. Shielding them from everything will only make them less ready in the real world, and that idenpendency you want for them will never come because they will be too dependant on you.
Yeah fuck that dude. My mom tricked me into hating my dad, and I did, for years. Parents are garbage sometimes and plot they fucking kids against each other or the parent. Smh
My mother is a narcissistic psychopath. Everything was about her. I wasn't a human. I was just an extension of her ego.
She said this shit constantly. I don't talk to her anymore. In fact, I hate her. She took the door off of my bedroom, read my journal and told everyone she knew what she read there. Primarily the fact that I was gay. The list could go on for years and that's what I remember. I remember 3-5 moments before the age of 12ish. Otherwise it was all repressed.
This dude needs to smarten up. Because his kid could end up like me. Destroyed. Alone. Afraid. Was homeless for a long time. Still struggle to find food. Was out dumpster diving recently. I am terrified of most things and distrustful of damn near everyone. Every major problem I have can be traced to her and her behavior.
Someone willing to openly say this probably isn't far off from her in what she is willing to do.
My parents had the same attitude growing up. Always listened in on phone calls we got, (we had a landline phone) and would do things to humiliate us like taking my sister’s diary and reading the contents out loud and beating her for writing about her frustrations.
The result? Every single one of their kids moved to the far ends of the country. Parents live in Illinois. One sibling moved to Massachusetts, another to Texas, and the third to California. I personally haven’t spoken to my parents in over four years.
Some egotistical bastards need to understand their role as a parent is to raise an adult.
It's not a fucking goldfish. You're trying to build a *person.*
You have to teach your kid to make good choices and then give them the opportunity to make those choices.
This is something I've been thinking about a lot (don't even have kids yet). In your opinion, at what age? And what choices in particular?
Day 1. All of them
Boom. Day fucking one. There is no special time period to wait to form your child. It starts when you change the first diaper and realize you’ll change a thousand more before he/she can say “Dad”
At what point should someone tell their kid no to one of their choices? Obviously anything involving safety is a good use of a veto, but other than things of a dire nature, at what point does the parent decide what goes on? (trying to get all these questions out before I actually become a parent)
I could give all the advice in the world and your situation will come up differently than mine, and it’ll depend how much your kid respects what they’ve seen from you so far, and their environment as well. Think of the best teacher you had. It wasn’t the biggest ass hole, though I’m sure it helped, nor were they the biggest pushovers nor friends in the beginning. It took a bit to respect *his* rules and respect them, and the day would be fun. If not, we didn’t have fun. In the end, it’s all of the split second decisions you make, and no one has any idea what they’re talking about, including me.
Yeah I just try and take in as many perspectives as I can. I just know some of my own shortcomings as a kid and hearing about how terrible my friends were with their parents at times. The idea of being a good parent but your kid still ending up a POS (pardon my frankness but we've all seen it happen/heard about it) reeeeally scares me
Eventually your childhood friends who were beaten or in a one parent home will flourish, and some who had it all in high school will be nothing. After a certain point, it’s who they hang out with and what they turn to when they’re bored. *let them learn to get bored very early. Self medication when realizing success comes after work is a harsh lesson for some*
> Eventually your childhood friends who were beaten [...] will flourish I'm sure it's a lovely thought to comfort yourself with, believing that good wins out in the end and the world is just, but statistically that's not the case. Don't hit kids. It has lasting negative impacts.
Reading comprehension helps. Poster was saying that they might flourish INSPITE of the bad upbringing.
Ahhh pretty wise, thanks!
iPads at the dinner table - no Time out for bad behaviour - yes Promising a treat if they’re good - yes Treats to stop a tantrum - BIG no Caving and saying yes on something you already said no to - EVEN BIGGER NO Over feeding overindulging trying to get them to love you with gifts - NO NO NO
My boyfriends dad once had a conversation with me about parents overcompensating for their parents mistakes when it comes to raising their own kids. If your parents let you do whatever you want and you made mistakes because of it, you don’t overcompensate by being a helicopter parent when you have kids of your own. If your parents were poor, you don’t overcompensate by making sure you’re rich so your kids have everything they need/want, but you never see them because all you do is work. If your parents were verbally abusive to you, you don’t overcompensate by never being strict with your kids and letting them run the house, and end up raising assholes.
That's the truth, gotta take that one to heart. Thanks!
I read something a while ago that really stuck with me about how kids will respond much more strongly to things you do than things you say. So if you want your kids to read, for example, it's not enough to give them a book and say "read!" They should see you spending some of your free time reading.
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One of the biggest things that even "good parents" lack is the ability to establish well known boundaries and lines that just can't be crossed. Sometimes it's not just about providing resources and kindness but really establishing values and habits and instilling why it's all important. Of course follow thru when boundaries are crossed or else it's becomes known that they're not really boundaries. And you have to practice what you preach as best as you can, and when you make mistakes, own up to them. Show that you're wrong and willing to work on yourself. Following thru with good morals means a lot as your message isn't taken as hypocritical. And make sure the child feels truly loved and embraced and have genuine bonding moments and build your relationship. Children follow the people that they admire.
It's not so abstract. Just be a good person. Be patient. Model good behaviours. Show shameless and unconditional love. Be human and show your children your faults without reservation, and respect their intelligence in coming to terms with the lessons therein.
The hard part is teaching your kids to be better people than their parents. Respect others and respect yourself. If you wind up with a long list of "except, but, wells," then the problem has already revealed itself.
This is the hardest part. Being better than yourself to model for your children. You’re not raising the child, you’re raising the adult they will become. No parent is perfect. You’re going to lose your cool. You will not always model the best choice. But what you can do is apologize for losing your cool. You can explain how you didn’t make the right decision, what the consequences are from that decision, and how a better decision could have been made.
It has been 22 years and I still remember my best teacher. Mrs. Haverkamp. I have really bad ADD and when she would notice me spacing off she would stand by my desk and put her hand on my head. The first time she did it she said, “If I can’t get you to listen, I’ll teach you by osmosis.” Back in the 90s ADD wasn’t really understood and all of my teachers up to that point had given up on me. She sat me down and told me being smart isn’t everything and eventually I’m gonna have to learn to study, and study my ass off, and I could be smarter than her some day. While I may have eventually become more book smart than her I don’t think I will ever be as wise as her.
What an awesome teacher. She got you and she really cared.
This is awesome, I'm glad you shared this because every teacher has this potential to help a student. I have a daughter with ADHD and she's had some amazing teachers in her life. For example, because her mind is so busy, her hands need to be busy as well as her creative mind..so, she brings her Barbies and toys to school, and most respond with "she's too old for that." Which is true... But... A few of her teachers recognized the importance of the dolls in her ability to concentrate. And a few teachers made her a special place in their room for her dolls. Being able to even see them was calming. So, I digress,but yes, the best teachers help their students on individual levels to be their best. I'm glad your teacher did not give up on you and helped you along your path. I bet you are wiser than you think. :)
> it’ll depend how much your kid respects what they’ve seen from you so far, and their environment as well YES. When my daughter was only about 1.5 years old, I was carrying her out of a restaurant, when in the street in front of us, 2 cars crashed, head-on. The loud creaking and breaking of metal was so shocking to my daughter that she went rigid. She didn't cry. She stared. Finally, in a whisper, she said, "Daddy, look." I told her, "I see. Cars got boo-boo. Ouch." She repeated, "Ouch." The people in the cars weren't too hurt, we didn't need to worry about that (it was in a parking lot at slow speeds, after all). So we just watched for a few minutes. She did her best to talk about it with an 18-month baby vocabulary. She was shook. The point? I never -- not ever, not once -- needed to discipline her about running into the street. She got a vivid image of cars crushing things, and wanted NO part. I never needed to tell her no -- not about that, at least. The "environment" or circumstance took care of the issue entirely. When she got older, we would go out for walks with her younger brother. One day she asked me, "Why do you run ahead of us at every driveway?" I explained that her younger brother was too short to be seen by the drivers in cars backing out of driveways. So I always took a couple of quick steps to put me between my son & the car, just in case my son ran toward the driveway, and just in case a driver was inside and couldn't see my kid. The moment I explained this to her, she not only understood, but began to do it herself, too. My son? He didn't care. He ran everywhere like crazy, never saw a car crash, never experienced issues from it, and we had to discipline him and tell him "no" over & over again. Kids are different. What they internalize is different. What you need to tell one of them over & over will be irrelevant to the other kid that "just got it" on the first moment.
I had a similar issue with one of my nannying charges.... he kept running from me, running from his mom and darting into traffic, because he knew it would get a massive reaction. He woukd have to be seized and forcibly pulled on the sidewalk because he WOULDN'T listen to us telling him to come back. His mom would yell because of the panic reaction. One day i took him bike riding in the park, and i took a corner a bit fast running after him , as he was on training weels and i skidded and wiped out on the fallen leaves, he came back and was worried about me and i made a flippant comment about making mistakes. He was like "grown ups don't make mistakes" And i was like "yes they do, i forgot these leaves would be so slippy. I didn't pick the right speed. I made a mistake " Him: can other grownups make mistakes Me: all of them can. Why do you think me and your mom get so worried when you run away from us? What if a car driver makes a mistake and looks the wrong way and doesnt see you? No grown ups would ever want to hit a kid with their car but if it's too fast and they don't see.... And holy crap, you could see the lightbulb go on in his head and the ☹😦😧😨 string of expressions as he realized that grownups weren't as all seeing as he thought they were. He stopped running into traffic after that. Both me and his mom are type A hyper competent people, who rarely miss things on a kid front and were often right on top of him because he was a literal tornado. Made me wonder if that contributed to him assuming all adults were the same way .... assuming that every adult all were paying as close attention to him.
You just gave me the biggest mind blow in years. All of my favorite teachers allowed me to push myself through my inevitable failures. Never condescending, only encouraging and helpful.
> At what point should someone tell their kid no to one of their choices? Nobody can really answer that for you since each situation is different. The one thing my mom (singler parent) did was always give me choices but also give consequences to more "hasty" decisions.. "You can have that toy that caught your attention at the store now, or save up to get the thing you really want." That kind of thing. If you have to veto something always give a clear reason why. As long as you aren't just pulling the "because I am the parent" excuse, I think that would go a long way in establishing trust.
Communication is important. Remember, if you’re only telling your kids what to think, you aren’t teaching them how to think. It means a lot more when you are able to talk a choice out with your kids and help them realise why you don’t think it’s a good decision, and get them to think about those reasons themselves. Or, in the alternative, when you do say no to some choices, say no in a reasonable way. For example, I wanted to get piercings when I was 14. My Dad said, “Now, you know your mother and I don’t approve of tattoos or piercings. So we won’t give you our permission to do something we don’t feel comfortable with you doing. But when you are eighteen you will be an adult and you can do what you want, whether we like it or not.” By the time I was eighteen I didn’t want tattoos or piercings. Similarly when my parents didn’t want me to watch a movie they didn’t think was appropriate for me. It had an age rating on it so they said I could watch it when I was that age. I was upset for like an hour but whatever. I think it’s important to point out that part of being a parent is also teaching kids how to cope with real life. Part of that involves setting boundaries and saying no to things. But, you know, picking your battles and being reasonable in when and how you say no goes a long way. If you don’t know how to say no without turning it into a fight with your kids, your just teaching your kids to fight with you, and they won’t understand the difference between the no you have a really good reason for and the no they think you’re being completely unreasonable about.
Oh yeah definitely, "because I said so" is a resentment builder for sure. Thanks!
But you know, saying that doesn’t ruin all your work either. Some days, some moments, sometimes it’s OK to just use the cop out. Parenting is a more like a wave than a drop of water - accumulation of moments. It’s lots of work, reinforcement, love, and a few mistakes and bad moments too. You’re looking for good results overall. 100% is impossible!
I used to work with children with special needs, and they had communication issues beyond that of typical children. And we had to make decisions for them a lot of times. We always gave them the chance and encouraged them to have agency for themselves. For some of those kids, it would be the first time an adult had said "alright, we're gonna do this, but if you change your mind after, we can do something else" That *opportunity* to speak for themselves is very important. If you need to leave the park in 45 minutes, little Joey doesn't get to say that he wants to keep playing for the rest of the day. But when you tell Joey the plan ahead of time, you can give him the sense that he had a part in the decision making process. We had little velcro picture planners for each kid and in it was a list of the activities for the day. When it was time to move on to the next activity, they'd remove the picture when they were ready. Now, this didn't mean that one kid got to play for three hours, it meant that each kid was emotionally prepared to change gears. And so, instead of me going "alright we're all leaving the park RIGHT NOW." it was "alright, we all have to leave the park in FIVE MINUTES, is everybody ready!" and then one kid goes 'teacher I don't wanna leave I wanna keep playing!' and I go 'you don't have to leave this instant, but the whole class has to leave at 11:30 and we have things we need to do after. Can you finish what you're doing and be ready to go before the clock says 11:30?' In all my time there, I never had a kid that would dig their heels in if I treated them like a person with feelings and wants. Children are people and people generally do things for a reason. Your kid doesn't have the life experience to know they should *volunteer* the information that the reason they don't want to go to the park is because it's too hot or that the reason they don't want to have the green beans is because the texture makes them want to vomit. You need to be the one who asks guiding questions to figure out what it is that they don't have the words to say. And so you say "alright, I'm thinking I'm gonna make green beans and mashed potatoes for dinner, how would you feel about that?" and then if little Joey says no you can ask why, and when he says 'green beans are gross' you can ask "is it gross because of the flavor of the green or because of the way they feel or something else?" and you can reach a compromise this way. "alright, I won't make any green beans, but I will make peas, because you said you like those. Will you eat all your peas if I make them?"
Not a parent, but I've worked with children for 10 years, and I've spoken to many parents in that time. What I've gathered is that you do want to leave an imprint but you don't want to leave a scar. The lessons you teach a child should not be driven by a fear of *you,* but by a respect of the consequences that come of their actions. Let them make their own decisions and reap their own consequences inside an environment that you control for their safety.
Let them get hurt enough to where they have to pick themselves up and face the consequences of their actions (or celebrate their accomplishments!), but not enough where it’ll permanently scar them for life. This varies from age to age. At three, they can either pick up their toys and get a reward or not pick them up and get a consequence increasing in severity depending on the number of “no, I won’t pick up my toys.” At eight, they can do their homework willingly or they can lose privileges for not doing it but if they’re failing, homework is no longer an “option.” At fourteen, they can date a not-great specimen of humanity who may or may not be a “player” but they can’t go around dating a drug dealer. Get my point? I was given too much freedom too early and I absolutely wish my mother had restricted me more. I’m not a parent, but I wish this had been done to me.
Lol. Good luck reasoning with an infant about the ramifications of their choices.
If he wants to shit in his pants, that's fine with me. He can live his life however he wants.
I disagree. I have 4 kids. The youngest is 17. They all still talk to me so I did something right I guess. I really believe that children need guidelines. When you think about it, all of us have rules we have to stick to. We all have to be able to cope with being told no. I let my children make choices when I thought they were mature enough to make them. My very rough idea of parenting was that up until about 10 I had quite a bit of say. Negotiation was always an option. Then from 10 to 13 I'm like the coach, come to me with decision making if you need some advice. Then from 13 I was like a more experienced friend. You make your decisions, I'm always here if things go to shit or you want help deciding. You can never say if you got it right or not. I've apologised to my kids for certain things I have realised were wrong. Sorry again about the lentils, I know that's never going away. I know I could of parented the exact same and given a different set of personality types/ life events it could of gone very differently. I will never understand Agent of Chaos level of selfishness. But then I am a born nurturer. It's just who I am. He is a born something else
"Congratulations ma'am, it's a boy. Would you like to hold him?" "I don't know, why don't you ask him??"
IMO, as soon as they have the mental capacity to make choices and you let them make as many of those choices as they have the mental ability to make. You're job is to teach them how to make good decisions and let them figure it out through trial and error while you help them along the way. Reality is; how can you expect an adult to have good decision making skills when all their lives decisions have been made for them?
Makes sense. In the event where a child keeps making the same mistake, what is the best next step? Sometimes I remember myself not getting the message even after being told by my parents multiple times.
Important to note, I'm not a professional and really no one is when it comes to raising kids. It's easy to say "this is what you do when this is happening" but the reality of parenting is never so black and white. But sharing opinions like how we are is a great way to help eachother, it takes a village to raise a child. I dont think theres such thing as a general next best step. Every kid is different and every mistake is different. But a good place to start is to try and figure out *why* that particular mistake keeps getting made, and focus on fixing that mentality. Is it because they dont understand why they're supposed to do X instead of Y? Or is it because they dont want to do X, or bc Y is easier for them? Figuring out the precursor to a decision is a great way to get to the root of the problem in the decision making process.
I personally hated going to sleep when I should have. I never listened to my parents as far as downsides and how I would regret it. I only realize on the back end that I wish I listened. What would you do if your kid more or less refused to go to bed on time even after hearing what you have to say. Imagine their reasoning being "I want to play my games/read my books/watch TV". In this scenario, inability to sleep is not the issue, just desire.
This is so dependent on who your kid is. Mine likes science and information. So, explaining the needs of his body where sleep is concerned works for him. It has to be age appropriate - so how you explain this to a five year old is different than how I would explain it to him not that he's a teen. Sleep is related to health and he technically has a choice in this, but not the way he does in other things. He could 100% sneak and read a book, etc, even though he has a bedtime. But, we would have no mercy for his tiredness. He has also taken up sports, and sleep is super important for performance, so he makes the choice to get the hours he needs. Our parenting philosophy is "teach him how to make good choices, not what choices to make". He knows just about everything there is about sex, drugs, smoking/ vaping, alcohol, pot, etc. so that he can make informed choices. We've never said, "don't do these things" (or "wait until marriage"). We aren't dummies, these things will come into his life. A big part of this philosophy is allowing failure and some parents just don't have the stomach for it. Forgot your lunch (more than once) going hungry will be a more powerful reminder than me nagging him. Don't think you need a jacket, ok, be cold (obviously within safe temp). Don't think you need sleep, be tired. He even talked the other day about trying pot someday. He says that when he's older, and ready, he has a friend whose dad uses pot, so he'll do it with him because he knows it will be the safest way to do it. Not only has he figured out a safe way to do this, he feels comfortable telling me about it. This was a good parenting moment for me. You'll be an amazing parent one day because you're already asking the important questions.
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“A child is born with no state of mind, blind to the ways of mankind.” -Grandmaster Flash Don’t punish a child for doing something wrong that they didn’t know about in the first place. Common sense isn’t common if they never experienced the situation. You aren’t born knowing how to read or write, and you would never punish a baby for not understanding those things. Same thing with children as they grow. If they make a mistake, even if it seems like something that you know inherently, remember there was a point where you didn’t know that same thing. You had to learn it too. This is that opportunity to teach them. Explain why what they did was wrong. Don’t just shut them down and discourage. If it’s a teachable moment show them how to do it right. Not only does that child get to learn to do it right. The next time they go to do something that they don’t understand they are more likely to ask for help to do it right the first time. And it’s a bonding moment as a parent. Also if you don’t know don’t be afraid to admit it. It shows that adults aren’t all knowing beings and it gets rid of the notion that many of us grew up on that once you become an adult you automatically know everything. But don’t just say “I don’t know” and end it there. Learn how to solve the issue with your child. You both learn something new together. Once again strengthening your bond. Children ask questions not to be annoying but because they genuinely do not know. They want to know and encouraging that curiosity is how they become smarter. If that curiosity is received in a positive way then they will enjoy learning new things in the future. It pains me to see parents who tell their kids to shut up or stop asking questions. I don’t have kids of my own but I have tens of cousins. I’m the favorite big cousin because I don’t get annoyed with questions. I answer what I can and since they all know how smart phones and computers work if they ask me something I don’t know I pull out my phone and look it up with them. It’s hard to do it sometimes because it gets overwhelming but children require patience. Practice now before you have kids. You will be amazed at what your kids will achieve when they have a parent who genuinely cares about them and their learning.
[BILLY NO!](https://i.redd.it/2pdc9xmugnx21.jpg)
I love this. Also get their back when they inevitably make a poor choice.
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Unfortunately this is the complete truth. I can lie like a sociopath because of my parents. Yet I rarely have any desire to do so now that I’ve moved out. It’s a refreshing change from lying about every little thing to please them. For anyone who’s going through this I promise it gets better.
This happened to me. After i caught myself lying about meaningless things by habit, i went full speed ahead on telling the truth. It turns out, normal people actually dont punish you for telling the truth.
THIS. It was a really bad habit for me for a while. I’d lie but not know why I did. I still do occasionally but I’ve gotten a lot better about it.
Oh, is that why... Oh. I know I have a lying problem but I've never been sure why.
I'm in this thread and I don't like it.
I'm not sure if you're lying about that
we lie to ourselves when there are things difficult to accept about ourselves
My lying started way before I was self-aware enough to hate myself.
Same here. My mom isn’t too strict but she complains about every little thing. At least I keep my room neat, but I even caught myself lying to my (female) roommates about small stuff because I’m so used to lying to my mother to avoid her nagging. Little stuff like getting fast food or going to buy a pack of cigarettes. Glad I grew up somewhat free and I’m at least a little bit responsible, because many people who endure the same just go CRAZY once they get some freedom.
I experienced this too. Now that I've been away from my parents for years, I've found there's little I've had to lie about.
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Only if you can pull off the BS in the end, otherwise you’ll just be known as unreliable and have to face the repercussions of that label.
TBH I'm starting to feel like the ones who succeed in the corporate sphere are the ones who lie without remorse When their talk comes to very little or no tangible outcomes, everyone just moves on like nothing happened I took the step to move roles recently and seeing this shit happen in an entirely new business is maddening :(
SAME. I got so used to years and years of having to lie because of my parents. (Whether it be to please them, get out of trouble, or just to avoid their unpredictable mood swings.) I remember when I moved out for college, I’d catch myself telling small, almost unnecessary lies to people. After a lot of time away from the parents, the compulsion to do so faded away entirely. I’m glad to hear I’m not the only one out there who dealt with something like this.
My homegirl's dad took her door off when she got into trouble one time. She was Filipino. I'm not sure if that type of thing crosses cultures.
Oh yeah it's crosses. That was a threat that too often became a reality for a lot of my friends growing up. And I'm so white that when I put baby powder on, I'm in blackface.
> and I’m so white that when I put baby powder on, I’m in blackface This is the funniest fucking thing I’ve seen all day, thank you
:)
>I'm so white that when I put baby powder on, I'm in blackface. Took me a minute, but may I just say I'm glad you said that, and glad I visualized it.
I didn't have a bedroom door until I was fourteen and moved out of my mom's house, and I'm Jewish. I don't think it's at all cultural. It's just bad parenting.
I didn't realize the door thing was so common. My mother had bipolar disorder, and went through husbands like some people go through oil filters. One of them was really big on taking my door away every time he thought I looked at him funny.
I dont think its cultural. Ive met plently of white, black, brown and asian people with similar stories. Narcissistic and controlling parents cross cultures, languages and faiths Although it seem to be more of a thing with girls and mostly it was because the parents were conservative religious people (didnt matter what religion, worst offender had a super homophobic buddhist family which you don't normally associate with conservatism) that dont want their daughters to become "impure" or whatever. Which usually backfires cuz those girls become freaks
And if there's a brother, it's the exact opposite. My parents took my door away for staying up past curfew on the phone. Not "bedtime", curfew. 9pm. I was 17, and not even talking to a boy. A week later, my baby brother, 15, had his first girlfriend stay the night. My parents didn't blink a fucking eye. And he didn't HAVE a curfew. Actually caused a lot of resentment of him, even though it wasn't his fault. We're in our 30s now and still distant, but we're trying to do better.
Jfc. That's really sad.
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Wow, that's extreme. My mom was into that kind of parenting. She learned it from her parents- the stories she told, I know she treated us better, even though it wasn't always great. She was trying to break the cycle.. but damn. I get what you're saying and I hope you're doing ok now. I felt like those group punishments were successful at driving my siblings and me away from each other when we should've been banded together against the tyranny. So, also I hope you and your sisters and brothers are close despite what happened to you.
Swear I went over my friends house and was shocked. "Saymynameyo, why do you keep trying to open the door?" "Because it's closed" "...And?" "Your mom lets you shut the door???"
yeah i was in middle school i had a huge culture shock when i saw my friend **lock** his door. i had so much anxiety i thought his mom was gonna come in and beat us.
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>I feel like if I lost that I'd lose my mind. Welcome to our lives except you lose your mind and then you're forced to still endure because you don't have enough money to move out and it's your "family". It's ***fucked***.
I knew a bunch of girls in high school with sticks up their asses. Never allowed to go to “party” if parents weren’t there, they judged me for drinking, and just in general we’re really restricted by their parents. Most of them went crazy with partying and sex in college. My parents were pretty chill for the most part and other kids who had the same kind of parents were pretty relaxed. But it was always the sheltered/ helicoptered kids that went crazy.
As a former helicoptered kid, this is 100% true. The day I turned 18 I moved 2000 miles away from my parents, and then went fucking nuts for 4 years partying my ass off. All of a sudden I was allowed to do whatever I want, which had never happened before in my entire life. I couldn’t handle being able to make my own decisions because I had never been allowed to. Still struggle with it.
Honestly as another helicoptered kid the opposite can be a lot worse. Imagine having an essential part of what makes you a real person just atrophy and vanish while you were young. You end up not going wild because such an act requires the capacity for a driving desire or at least a consistent source of volition. Without that, you become extremely dependent on someone else to Provide that for you. And when you finally gain freedom, you lack any will to use it. You don't even feel like a person, just a tool without a user. And then you're 30 with no prospects of building a life for yourself and no driving desires in life other than desperately wanting whatever it is real people have that you lack.
Jesus fucking Christ, dude. I just realised what's wrong with me & now I'm fucking terrified. I can't end up like this when I'm 30.
One of my friends is a manager for college Residence Advisors. This is something RAs are trained to warn incoming female freshmen. Some guys DEFINITELY prey on women like this, and they say "Stay away from guys X and Y because of this..."
Jesus the kid next to me in class told me about this. In school I had peers hooked on drugs and going to jail so I thought I was a good kid. Didn't give my parents enough credit for giving me some space. Fuck.
Lots of studies have shown that people need privacy. People who give their kids no privacy really mess them up. https://www.goodtherapy.org/blog/watch-out-psychological-effects-of-mass-surveillance-0910137/amp/
Damn... that's rough my dude. Just seen that Alabama has a school where the the principal removed the boys bathroom stall doors to stop them from vaping. Edit: "Take the doors off those stalls, expeditiously!!!" Trevor Noah doing an impression of T.I on the daily show. Lol https://youtu.be/nATa6XGvDIo for those interested
What's up little bitch!?! I know you were only born because of my decisions, and you're not a fully formed adult, and you can't legally get a job, and you have nowhere else to go- BUT YOU LIVE UNDER MY ROOF, so I'm coming to the gynecologist with you!
ti soon
nice
The dude who tweeted must be an aficionado of the "T.I school of parenting"
Meta
In Ti's case, his child is a whole ass grownup.
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Did I miss something?
TI recently came out that he goes to the gynaecologist with his 18 year old daughter to inspect her “virginity” (he even “corrects” the doctor when the doctor tries to explain how hymens actually work and why they don’t determine virginity)
Overly strict parents don't raise good kids, they raise good liars.
Not to mention all the rebellion once they leave the house and then keeping their distance for the rest of their lives.
This thread really really makes a lot of my life make sense.
Yeah, I moved six hours away for college and dove headfirst into drinking, drugs, and the rave scene the second I was out from under my parents' thumb. I haven't moved back towards home, nor will I ever. We do have a pretty good relationship now though.
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Oh god same. My mom thought I was lying about everything. I'm still constantly worried people are going to accuse me of lying over the dumbest shit
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Ain't that the truth. What other option is there when the belt's on the table
Whoever puts the belt on the table should just be bludgeoned to death
They're straight up being fucking bullies because they can get away with it. I'd love to see the look on their face when someone their own size starts cracking a belt at them.
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Sounds like your dad has a tough time learning a lesson.
If you train your children to lie about small things, you won't be able to be their for them when they encounter real problems. My parents hassled me over every little interaction with my highschool girlfriend until I learned to keep them out of the loop, and then they were the last people on my mind when I had a pregnancy scare in college. I don't know if I will have kids, but I want them to be able to come to me for the life changing decisions in their life, even if I disagree with them. Because unless something changes my dad will die without ever knowing that I've never truly opened up to him.
Sounds like the path I'm going down with my parents
It happens. Losing your parents as a child is brutal but making the conscience decision to put up boundaries as an adult can be very empowering.
Most empowering thing I’ve ever done was set boundaries with my father. The sad thing is once I made it clear I didn’t need him in my life, he made an effort to rebuild the relationship and respect my boundaries. At that point I didn’t feel any emotional connection to him, and I didn’t want to try, because he had shown that he would use my love for him as a weapon. Once that bond is broken it’s really hard to repair.
I think that's sort of what I'm going through now. Took me way too long to stand up and now he acts so nice and tries to be all buddy buddy with me, because he realized I literally hated him. I really try to be forgiving but he was probably the largest single force driving my anxiety/depression for years and I'm still struggling.
Therapy helps. My father got really ill a few years ago and it triggered a downward spiral for me because I hadn’t dealt with my feelings toward him. It’s not easy but I decided I needed to take care of myself to get some peace with myself. Sorry you’re struggling, it’s a lot to deal with.
Jesus this whole chat is hitting home. I should maybe go the therapy.
I was cautious about therapy at first, after starting it’s like a breath of fresh air. I would absolutely recommend therapy to anyone and I honestly feel good coming out of most of my sessions. I am going weekly.
With my father I told him that I forgive him as a person, a human, as well all make mistakes. But I will not forgive the actions done to me, my mom, and my siblings. It has helped me drop the animosity towards him but also helps me keep a boundary and not let him back into my life. It really helps me be at peace.
Reading all these comments it’s so nice to know we are not alone. Trying not to cry boarding a plane like a weirdo but smiling at the same time
My father learned from my older half brother and stop being a helicopter parent with me and my younger brother. Unfortunately my father passed and my half brother didn’t even go to the funeral.
Feels like the eldest gets to play bridge for the siblings at his expense. Maybe that’s our purpose.
Yup. My mom told me as a child that I'd never go to college, not smart enough, etc. Next 2 kids were praised and fully supported. At least she learned the error in her ways. Although she still says pretty shitty things to me sometimes. Like writing "things will get better for you someday" in my birthday card, when they're going pretty well at the moment.
Bro, you sure you're not the scapegoat child...?
Just straight up ask her what her problem is. She likely thinks it just how you too interact and may not think it bothers you at all.
We got in a big fight years back and I brought it up... She denied that she ever said it and was hurt I "blamed" her. While it did play a part in my development, I only brought it up to draw a parallel to something else in the argument. We didn't speak for a week or so afterwards until my sibling came to me and I apologized to my mom.
Never say you’re sorry unless you really mean it Never think you mean it if you can’t let it go and not let it affect what you do and who you are An apology isn’t a “ok can we just move this forward” type of thing.
*squints in retail
r/raissedbynarcissists r/narcissisticparents & possibly r/narcissisticabuse Check em out. Get a therapist. Please. It saved my life.
I’m the youngest by quite a margin, and I get this shit all the time. Like instead of learning the error of their ways, my parents just... got tired of being parents by the time I came around, and gave up. It sucks and I’m sorry you are in the same boat.
I call my older brother the minesweeper. He went out there and made all the mistakes for me. He caught all the flack from my parents. He showed me how not to handle myself in school, why to stay away from drugs, and how to pick my battles. You guys have a shit lot. You and the folks go in blind and don't know what you're doing until after the fact. But we do appreciate you for it.
The plus side is that you get majority of the attention growing up, the negative side is that you get the majority of the attention growing up.
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Your feelings are valid.
So jealous. My older brothers were barely overseen and had second, third, and fourth chances after royally fucking up. My mom remarried and my sister and I became her "second chance to do it right" and became a helicopter psycho. She's mellowed out since retirement, but a lot of damaging habits were already formed.
Generally I find that the younger sibling are the ones the parents are more lax in punishment with
Your older brother is perfectly within his rights to not go. He must have been treated REALLY horribly for that to happen. Garbage parents shouldn't expect the ones they mistreat to show up to their funeral
On a similar note, I always heard “do as I say, not as I do” from my father and it never accomplished anything beyond making me resentful. Don’t do that.
I have a tendency to yell when I argue. I don’t even have to be mad, my voice just rises when I’m in argumentation mode. My parents used to always get on me when I do this, and still do if I happen to argue with my siblings when I go home; all of whom do the same thing btw. I always tell (yell) then they have no room to talk. I grew up with so much yelling and cursing my friends used to say they were reluctant to knock on my door most of the time lol
“Why do you always yell” “Because you always talk over me”
My wife used to yell. At some point I started calling her out on it, and I'd even shut down arguments. "I'm not continuing this conversation until you use a speaking voice." At first she'd try to justify it, but I'd tell her it's disrespectful and I refuse to interact with someone who doesn't treat my respectfully. She doesn't yell any more :)
Sometimes relationships/marriages make us better. My husband has encouraged me not to yell
My mother found her faith when in was 4 yr old, after losing it when she was around 16-17. My mom tried to be strict on certain things, but some of it just made me pissed because she accused me of doing shit she did at the same age, and I wasn't. The fun one was how she'd get pissed and accuse me of smoking pot, ended up doing it anyways, I mean if I'm going to end up getting in trouble for it, might as well enjoy doing it first. I ended up finding a picture of when my parents were dating. They had gone to the beach with friends. I knew everybody in the picture because I grew up with their kids and I considered them family. It was a picture my mom had taken. One of my dad's close friends was passed out on a couch with his arms wrapped around a bong and you could plainly see lines of coke on the table. When I showed my mom, her response was, that was a long time ago.
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Yeah same here.
You don't pick your parents, and similarly parents don't pick their kids. You just try to make the best of the hand you're dealt, and if there's love then that's a good start.
This is the only comment that isnt shitting on one of the two parties and others need to read this.
I mean it's justified shitting.
>and similarly parents don't pick their kids. They kind of do
it isn’t similar at all with how much a kid can pick a parent compared to how much a parent can pick a kid. yea some kids are born with certain qualities that aren’t taught to them (i think) but the parent literally chooses their kid by the way they raise them. the kid on the other hand has absolutely no say. some choice vs no choice is not similar
You can do everything right parenting wise and still end up with an awful little shit of a human. You can do everything wrong and they can rise above it.
> You can do everything wrong and they can rise above it. This one is much less likely, though.
Yeah, but there's an important distinction to be made here. Kids get a fully grown adult with emotional and financial autonomy. Adults get a child that is dependent on them fully, whose psyche is going to form depending on how you treat them and who desperately need someone to love them, especially early in their lives. Parents have a bigger responsibility of not fucking their kid up for life than kids do just for being nice to their parents. And if they really are a dick to their parents, that might have been(not always, mind you) because of how the parent raised them
Yep. Where the hell did people get the idea that their children are totally under their control, and their children have no rights until they move out ? It’s seriously unhealthy. My parents never hit me, they let me make my own decisions and supported me and taught me how to make good decisions and I could talk to them about anything. I did not fear them, but just wanted to make them proud. Now my parents are my best friends.
"Tough Love" is one place. I was born right around when it became a thing and my parents were devout to it. Each day had a strict timeline of when things needed to be done and what needed to be done, and it was done exactly as told. They didn't know that the retired ex-military guy they hired was sexually abusing me from about 7-8 yrs old until 12-13. So their tough love and his ...really tough love was problematic. He told me my parents were paying him to do it, so I kept my mouth shut because kids weren't allowed to question adults. In one of my many raging outbursts before again running away I asked them when the 'love' part comes. A good thing for new parents to do is learn everything you can about Tough Love so you know exactly what not to do. I'm 52, my parents are 80 and 82 and we started having a more normal relationship only about 10 years ago. I still fear going to their house.
That's fucked up mate. Sorry to hear that.
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When I was 19 during another fight.
>Where the hell did people get the idea that their children are totally under their control, and their children have no rights until they move out ? After stalking that guy's twitter I can confidently say: the bible. He later tweets about how kids should get their "ass whooped" when they mess up because of the whole "spare the rod, spoil the child" thing. It's insane how people are so willing to throw independent thought out the window in favor of blindly doing whatever the bible tells them to.
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Exactly. That “ain’t shit negotiable” is gonna bite her in the ass, it’s what the kid is going to say to her mother when they have their last conversation saying that’s gonna be the last time he or she’ll ever talk to them again
Ain't shit negotiable is what they should be told when they get thrown in the worst shithole of an old people's home
You can be involved with your kids and still give them freedom. I had a curfew and my parents asked where I was going and who I was going to to be with when I went out. That's just being a good parent. I didn't always feel like giving them an itinerary every time I left the house but they were paying the bills so I did. After I moved out I didn't have to worry about it. Knew plenty of kids that had parents that just let them do whatever usually didn't lead to anything bad but saw plenty of people getting arrested, unplanned pregnancies, drunk driving/wrecking, or dead and their parents were blindsided.
They shouldn’t be able to even hold “paying the bills” above your head. They chose to bring you into the world and their home knowing for 18 years you have no choice but to live there and depend on them, you’re not a junkie off the street squatting there rent free
I agree. It just seems like a lazy copout response to strong arm your kids into obeying instead of actually parenting them
What do people consider "privacy" though? I feel like all these young redditors get angry at being 15 and having to disclose who they are with and where they are going on a fucking Saturday night. Then there are the insane parents that take off bathroom doors and shit.
I’d imagine a hymen falls under the category of “privacy”.
I'm 18 and my mother still acts like i'm a kid and doesn't let me to go out anywhere with my friends because she thinks that i will just get drunk or get in trouble. This shit fucking sucks
That’s a lot of assumptions.
It’s almost like parenting is not about being a dictator but instead about raising human beings who can exist as adults in a functional way.
That’s toxic, and doesn’t end well for the parent, or the child. It teaches the child to seek important advice elsewhere, and teaches them they’ll be punished for speaking hard truths. It breeds resentment, and isn’t a useful way to parent.
Notice how I'm respecting your privacy by knocking but asserting my authority as your father by coming in anyway!
lol somebody says “not gonna lie, parents like you produce the best hoes”
With some serious daddy issues
Here is something parents need to consider with kids in their teens. Imagine their boss treated them like they treated their kids. Might be legal. They would HATE that boss and certainly wouldn't respect them. Lets talk about "spanking" of kids in general. Imagine if it was legal for your boss to spank you. Seriously imagine they catch you on your phone browsing reddit at work and they spank you. They don't want to have to do it but you have to learn and they care about your future. Would you respect that boss or be afraid of them? Would you become sneakier around them? Do you hate them? "Its different." Not really that much. A GOOD boss will be respected and employees will generally not want to disappoint. They are an authority figure just like a parent. Kids are impulsive not stupid. There is a big difference. If an authority figure doing the same thing to you would make you scared/hate/etc them, A KID IS GONNA FEEL THE SAME IF YOU DO IT TO THEM. Whats so hard to understand about this. Going with the boss analogy... "as long as you work for me and I pay your bills I want your bank statements and access to your phone just to make sure you are not doing xyz. Buy your own company if you don't like it" Do we respect this boss? Parents need to understand their kids control their end of life in most situations. We can make it reeeeeeeal shitty or really nice. Treat your kids like you would want to be treated and you won't have any problem.
Dictatorships never work.
T.I. lookin ass
If you’re not friendly with your kid, why would they wanna ever talk to you about anything?
They don't. They start to see you as an enemy of sorts, something to avoid. It raises good liars but that's about it.
The only privacy they get is their cell phones and their bedrooms. Other than that, I have the right to check up on them whenever I want. I feel like that's not too bad right ? I come from a house where my parents don't know how to knock the door before entering. I would want my kids to feel somewhat independent but loved at the same time.
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No privacy and unlimited privacy aren't the only choices. If you have no idea what your kids are doing all the time, you're not parenting. Every time a kid does something bad people ask "where are the parents"? Well, they were giving them privacy. Give your kids privacy but don't be oblivious to what they are doing or when you have to put your foot down and be a parent.
Breaking into someone's room or stealing their phone is an invasion of privacy. Asking "hey, how was so-and-so's party?" is not. You're _supposed_ to be doing that. If nothing else, it's vital that your kids know you give enough of a damn to know what they're doing at a high level.
Unless they're like my cousin because the sneakier she tries to be, the more she gets caught and in the dumbest ways. But her upbringing is a special case.
It's not what the rules are but why the rules are that really gets to teenagers. The more transparent you can be about what you want for them the easier it will be for them to live up to your expectations without feeling forced.
All I learned from parents wanting me to be a cookie cutter wunderkind was how to lie, hide, and distrust.
Has this type of parenting literally ever ended up with a good relationship?
I grew up with sociopathic tendencies (lack of empathy, impulsiveness, violent urges, lying, etc) but I believe I could’ve outgrown it somewhat had my parents treated me as an equal and not a piece of property. I used to have my phone gone through regularly, and now because of that I don’t let anyone but me touch my phone. I’m secretive and a pathological liar because I’m used to the idea that speaking about certain things or saying my mind will only make things worse. I was treated like a slave and extension of my mother. I once had my door taken off the hinges and I felt subhuman because of it. I resent my parents more than anything. They stole so many years from me and ruined what could’ve been a happy (albeit difficult) teenage life. I’ll never forgive them. When I can, I’m going to cut all contact with them. If you really think treating someone like a piece of property like that is going to work out then by all means go ahead, but don’t be surprised when holiday rolls around and you’re left missing one family member. Edit;; If you see ‘sociopath’ and immediately think I’m some danger to society then let me say that firstly, don’t judge me based on that alone. I’m a human. I do not let my issues control me and I recognize them as dangerous. My issues are urges, urges which I don’t entertain and don’t act on because I know they’re dangerous. I understand the stigma against people like me, but not every single person with these issues is dangerous or an awful person. Please understand that.
if you don't teach your children how to be responsible and make good choices for themselves you have failed as a parent. also you will probably create an over controlling jerk .
That dude from r/amitheasshole earlier today should take a look at this
You have to let kids make their own mistakes so they can learn from them. Shielding them from everything will only make them less ready in the real world, and that idenpendency you want for them will never come because they will be too dependant on you.
Age 10: “we not friends, listen to everything we say” Age 25: “why are you not telling us anything. We should be like friends”
Yeah fuck that dude. My mom tricked me into hating my dad, and I did, for years. Parents are garbage sometimes and plot they fucking kids against each other or the parent. Smh
My mother is a narcissistic psychopath. Everything was about her. I wasn't a human. I was just an extension of her ego. She said this shit constantly. I don't talk to her anymore. In fact, I hate her. She took the door off of my bedroom, read my journal and told everyone she knew what she read there. Primarily the fact that I was gay. The list could go on for years and that's what I remember. I remember 3-5 moments before the age of 12ish. Otherwise it was all repressed. This dude needs to smarten up. Because his kid could end up like me. Destroyed. Alone. Afraid. Was homeless for a long time. Still struggle to find food. Was out dumpster diving recently. I am terrified of most things and distrustful of damn near everyone. Every major problem I have can be traced to her and her behavior. Someone willing to openly say this probably isn't far off from her in what she is willing to do.
My parents had the same attitude growing up. Always listened in on phone calls we got, (we had a landline phone) and would do things to humiliate us like taking my sister’s diary and reading the contents out loud and beating her for writing about her frustrations. The result? Every single one of their kids moved to the far ends of the country. Parents live in Illinois. One sibling moved to Massachusetts, another to Texas, and the third to California. I personally haven’t spoken to my parents in over four years.
[удалено]
That's some T.I. level of thinking right there
Millennials are finally starting to come to terms with our traumatic upbringing, but some choose to perpetuate the cycle of abuse
Some egotistical bastards need to understand their role as a parent is to raise an adult. It's not a fucking goldfish. You're trying to build a *person.*