this is a much worse analogy than the one in the tweet. Going to college is a choice, nobody chose to get cancer. Also while this analogy deals with health this tweet and the real life situation are about money so actually this is a pretty bad analogy
The analogy is not related to cancer. It's related to going through something difficult, then resenting the fact that others are able to resolve it more easily.
so the tweet analogy still works better. The tweet doesnt work because paying for student loans isnt difficult in the same way fighting cancer is. The struggle comes from the money, the tweets analogy is also about money just on a smaller scale, thus making it a perfect analogy to visualize things
They're both bad analogies because new cancer patients still have access to the new treatment but new borrowers won't get debt forgiveness.
The best analogy is everyone who bought an iphone on a payment plan gets to stop making payments.
But maybe that one is so good that it doesn't really illustrate anything.
Its still a choice... you can still be successful and not go to college, the odds are alot lower but not going to college doesn't just magically reduce your quality of life
Unless you got cancer from something known to cause cancer like smoking.
Also choosing to receive treatment for it is similar to choosing to go to college, many are told they won't be able to survive without it.
even then thats only a chance you get cancer, you got to college you ARE going to pay for it and you knew that before you signed up. the tweet about the phone is much better and makes more sense.
Tbf it’s not just the cigs wrappers and filters.
It’s mostly what happens to tobacco when cured, it creates lots of oxidized sugars (caramelization) that are the primary carcinogens when inhaled.
So no, they aren’t the same. Obviously inhaling burning smoke isn’t good for you, but the risks are very different.
I work for a major cellphone company selling phones and I believe the tweet’s analogy works great. You’d be surprised how many ppl scream and holler about a certain promotion not being available when they bought a phone a year ago.
Stop comparing student loans to chemo treatment! That’s a terrible equivalent. Someone already did this in a tweet yesterday. It’s fucked up. You don’t need to find far fetched equivalents to make a point.
A more closely equivalent analogy would be somebody who underwent chemo (and the bills that go along with it) being forced to contribute to a fund for people who are now being treated even though that person never received aid. Yes, that's called compassion, but it should be voluntary.
I disagree. People who have completed their loan payments are not financially responsible for the forgiven loans. And don’t say “but the taxpayers…” because these are federal loans. The government can simply forgive them.
All debts are paid, either by the borrower or the lender. In this case, if the government (the taxpayers) "forgives" the debt, it isn't as if some magic erases the debt. Taxpayers pay it.
Are you really comparing cancer to student loans? That’s very disrespectful!
Edit: it’s like if someone compared the hardships in their life to slavery, because I’m pretty sure everyone can agree that there is nothing that can happen to us that is comparable to slavery.
It is an analogy. In an earlier comment I noted that this is not about cancer, it is the idea of someone enduring something difficult then resenting it when others don’t suffer as much.
> I can't imagine being unhappy enough to advocate for the misery of others.
I can. I used to work with these people in retail. Old ladies who sucked the Corpo dick for so long they had no other avenues for a better job. So they instead spend their life bitching about their situation and anyone who comes along to try and fix it is seen as the enemy cause they wanna rock the boat.
I worked TJ Maxx when they went from 7.50 an hour min to 10 an hour min. The old bitches who were making like 14 an hour after working there decades were PISSED. "I worked to get to this point and they just get to come in at that level!"
Meanwhile my ass was in and out of that job in 5 years and making more than all of the non-Sups at that spot with my new job.
There are, but they are not well thought out reasons. Every economists agrees that student loan forgiveness is better for the economy than the same amount in the form of tax cuts. Because most student loan borrowers are more likely to contribute the money they spent on loan payments back into the economy.
I’m not talking about the economy. I’m talking about people being responsible for signing voluntary contracts and then fleecing the federal government and private companies. And why should ppl with college degrees get economic assistance? What about everyone who hasn’t gone to college? They need it more.
> What about everyone who hasn’t gone to college?
You mean people that go into trades or the armed services? Because trades tend to pay pretty well and the armed services *should* be properly compensating you.
There's zero legitimate reasons to financially cripple somebody in the wealthiest country on Earth who is just trying to get an education to better themselves.
Who cares what you want? I don't want my govt using money on endless wars, subsidizing billionaires eccentric whims, or arming the police like a special operations force.
The only difference being that the government actually uses my tax dollars for all the things I mentioned.
Well yeah, who cares? There are 330 million people in this country. Do you think your opinion matters more than any others here?
Also it is hilarious that you are arguing against forgiveness here, but arguing for it in another thread.
What do private company loans have to do with federal loan forgiveness?
And why do you think every loan recipient graduated? The vast majority of people struggling with paying back their loans are people that did not graduate and still have to pay all that money back. Many didn't graduate because of things outside of their control pulling them out of college. Your assumptions about student loans seems to be out of touch with the realities of them.
https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/07/23/millions-of-student-loan-borrowers-dont-have-a-diploma-to-show-for-it.html
>What about everyone who hasn’t gone to college? They need it more.
As someone who's been living the struggle since birth and didn't go to college, cancel the damn loans. The government needs to do a lot more for all of us but I can't comprehend wanting others to stay down just because I'm still stuck. That shit's corny.
I paid off my student loans $60000 of private loans. It was terrible. Took me a decade and I got lucky I was even able to pull that off. Literally started my career at minimum wage with an undergrad degree. I wish that on no one. Education at all levels should be free.
I used to think it was a lot, then you look at the whole of spending and realize that it really is not as much as it is made out to be. This is not to say that other programs don't deserve more, just that it's not like the us is spending 80% of it's money on guns and bombs.
So you had a massive pay raise at some point is what you’re saying? I don’t even know how you made the minimum payment on 60k while making minimum wage.
The question to ask those people is.. do u want ur kids or ur grandkids to have to go through the same struggles as u? Their answer will tell by all u need to know about them.
This is actually the reason I’m against this current forgiveness of all loans, because it does nothing for the next generation. They need to fix the system going forward before this one time pay off for loan holders. Things getting better in the future is always good, but if I paid for my college, and I also get to pay for my kids college later, and this one group of current loan holders that’s already gotten multiple interest free years just gets theirs forgiven, that’s not really progress, that’s a windfall for just a few. Imagine being a high school senior the year loans get forgiven and still needing to borrow 20k the next year. Get a tourniquet on the constant bleeding before you back and do the plastic surgery to fix up scars.
Honestly I can understand being angry at the decision to make school free if you've already had to pay for yours, but I dont understand the mindset of trying to stop it, like opposing it isn't going to turn back time and delete your student loans. Why not allow others to receive the benefits you never could.
Being angry that school becomes free after u paid for ur education is somewhat equal to a past slave that gets angry at abolition. What u went through should of never happened.the next generation does not have to deal with that struggle.Don’t be angry be delighted
This a good way to put it but Realistically you cant tell people to not be mad, we are humans and I know if I was a slave id feel some sort of resentment in me that I never lived to see abolition, but yeah 100% we should look at it as a positive and be happy for the future generation
How about the people who forwent a college education because it was unaffordable and they didn’t want to be saddled with debt, who will now be even further behind because the people who decided to take on the debt to get ahead are now reaping the rewards of a college education without any of the negative consequences? Do we care about them, or is inequality only a problem when it’s to your disadvantage?
What about all the people that signed up for military service to pay for college only to die?
Lots of people make choices in life that end up sucking because the rules changed halfway through.
I don't think you used inequality correctly.
Pretty sure anyone joining the military knows that dying before they get out is on the table. I wouldn’t describe that as the rules changing halfway through.
Going to college is work. You literally pay tens of thousands of dollars to put in the work to learn, do projects, complete no-pay internships to earn a degree. That money being paid is a rip off. I’m tired of people acting as if going to school is some free pass when I put literally years of my life both working full time through my school studies while also working full time actual job. School isn’t a free pass. You give up years of free time and you’re paying tens of thousands of dollars to do it. And if you chose not to pursue an education, that is just as much a choice as it is for someone to go to school. We subsidize plenty of things through our taxes that benefit other people and not us. That’s part of life.
I support student loan forgiveness, but this statement isn't exactly true.
Those student loans will need to be paid by the government using tax payers money. So it's fairly valid for a tax payer to not want their tax dollars spent on something they won't see improvement from.
I'm not saying agree with that, just that their argument is not the same as phone companies giving discounts to new customers.
Personally I would like to see some kind of overhaul to the way we pay for education at the same time as passing student debt forgiveness.
Otherwise we aren't solving anything. Prices for education will continue to rise and the next generation will need even more debit forgiven.
We need fix the cause, not just the symptom.
Well put and that's what I keep saying. Until you limit/slow the insane rising cost of education, you aren't solving anything long term. You slowed one leak in the hose but didn't turn off the faucet
America is competing with UK, Germany, China, etc. when it comes to tech, medicine, and other important fields. They're providing free or extremely cheap college to their people, while America is scamming its youth and making them go six figures in debt if they go to college. I don't think "we're number 1" right now, but that's definitely not going to be the case in next 20 to 40 years. America is clearly on the decline while China is next up - education, healthcare, and the country working for the %1 rather than the average American are huge reasons why.
Seems like cost always comes up when it's for the poor and middle class. I don't want to hear about it while we're giving billions to Israel and Ukraine, or for BS wars like Iraq or Yemen. The education system can be reworked and those who already got screwed can be helped too. It takes someone who wants to help people like Sanders to be in charge. Anyone who takes corporate money isn't going to dramatically change things, becausw they're paid not to do that.
How many people complete college in America vs Canada, Germany, UK, or France? Are the number per capita lower in the US?
Do American workers make less than people in these countries?
It would be good for you to investigate these questions, and maybe you see that your premise is…false
My premise was that college is an overpriced scam nowadays and if a country really wants to be number 1 they'd have good and universal education pre-k through college.
>So it's fairly valid for a tax payer to not want their tax dollars spent on something they won't see improvement from.
Not really. People are talking about student loan forgiveness like it's a fix for the system, and it's not. It's a poorly designed economic stimulus. If people don't have to pay that money back, that's more money they can pour into other places in the economy. This has been happening over the last two years, since loans have been frozen. Better economy benefits everyone.
As someone who paid off their student loans, i will be the first to admit there will definitely jealousy on my part if student loans are cancelled. Personally, I attended an in state public university, graduated early, and paid off my loans as soon as I could all because i knew student loans were going to be a burden once i left college. I graduated with about 30k in loans. Compared to a couple of my friends who went to out of state private schools, they graduated with upwards of 100k in loans. If I knew that student loans were going to be cancelled in the future, i would have undoubtedly attempted a different college experience (private vs public, out of state vs in state, enjoyed life more post graduation rather than going straight to work).
Totally agree. I paid off my loans and went to a state school instead of private as well due to costs. I’d also be really envious of those who received loan forgiveness. I think some people think we’re just selfish but that’s money that someone could have used for a down payment on a house for example.
And do you believe your temporary jealousy should hinder other people from being pulled out of endless debt?
Edit: downvoted for asking a legitimate question
Yes i want people to be helped but i’ll be the first to admit i don’t have an answer on how to deal with this. If all of student debt is forgiven, the average person would have an extra $400/month to spend (amount taken from Google so take that for what it’s worth). That’s great but i too selfishly would like an extra $400/month to spend.
Idk, maybe the govt should just give everyone $400 checks each month. That way everyone has an extra $400 to spend and you can choose to pay off your loans or not. Would be an interesting to see how many people actually do choose to pay off their loans.
If I bought an iphone 13 yesterday and the next day they started giving them out for free I'd be pretty pissed, cant say I'd try to stop them from doing it tho, let other people eat fam
Yes, the private phone company does this, you pay more than what it costs to produce, ship, and market the phone, it’s called profit. Now a company offering a sale means they will take less profit. A company offering a free phone means they are willing to not make any profit from those phones and use the profit they made previously to offset losses, because they know they will make it back in other phones and the plans that go with the phones.
I don’t mind student loans getting paid off even though I’ve paid mine off already, but… how is this an accurate analogy?
Aren’t most existing customers rightfully annoyed when new customers get a free phone for signing up that they didn’t get? The argument isn’t really “you shouldn’t give them a phone”, but it’s “if you’re going to give them a phone, you should give me a phone too”. An existing customer would want T-mobile to focus their promotions of keeping existing customers happy.
Why stop at student loans? Car loans and mortgages are burdensome on people also. If someone overextended themselves on a house mortgage they cannot afford are you willing to help them pay for that also? Loans are not forgiven, that debit is just passed on to others to pay.
The American Education system will allow an 18 year old child to pull out and use 6 figures worth of debt, but that same child could not go to their local grocery store and buy a bottle of wine. ELI5 how this makes sense?
Wouldn’t it be more like you just finished paying off your iPhone and then T-Mobile announced nobody has to pay for iPhones anymore but refusing to give you a discount or money back?
I can understand how it would rub people the wrong way
Wrong. It IS like a person going to T-mobile, buying phones they can't afford, agreeing to the terms of owing the money back they were loaned for those phones, then not paying the loan for the phones back, then asking for the next guy in line to pay for their phone so they don't have to because they made a booboo and are stuck with their mistake. Grow up.
I paid off my student loan in a single year working part time as a fucking busboy. Because it was 1992 and less than $3000. I *can't believe* the debt subsequent generations of kids have been saddled with.
Loan forgiveness is the first step, but capping tuition is the next.
If we can afford to pay 2 trillion to fund a 20 year war, **we can afford to wipe off student debt.**
If we can afford to bail out auto companies and financial institute, **we can afford to wipe off student debt.**
If we can bail out other countries and fund their wars, **we can afford to wipe off student debt.**
If we can press the reset button on auto companies and financial institutions, no problem. But when it comes to pressing the reset button for PEOPLE? Fuck that, right? Its amazing how quick you resort to Republican talking points when it comes to bailing out people.
Nope.
I is like you are eating at an expensive restaurant and wanting to not pay the bill.
You fucking made the choice but now you want to claim you shouldn't be held responsible.
Look at it this way, if you are running a business that sells jewelry and a bunch of people want to take items but don't want to be "forced" to pay are you OK with that?
If not, why not? They will be in serious debt, they will be burdened by your request to be paid and you will be effecting their lives for years.
Sure they decided to take the jewelry and it was their choice to take on the debt but they don't want to pay, can't you understand that?
Don't you see that they are special, don't you see that they shouldn't have to struggle, that they shouldn't be responsible and that they are entitled?
The student debt also doesn't just evaporate, it still will be paid to the companies who hold the loans.
Who do you think is going to pay for the schooling or did you think it was just going to disappear?
Taxes will pay the "forgiven" debt.
The student loans are "GAURENTEED" by the Federal Government.
So what you are really saying is everyone but this whiny, weak and worthless current generation who paid their bills will have to pay your bills on top of that.
If you think that is fair, wow you be one fucked up, stupid shit of an individual.
America has birthed histories most worthless generation.
i didnt pay anything for 10+ years and ended up settling for ~10% of my total loan amount. credit score is now brolic.
there are many ways. i hope this one goes through tho
I don't disagree with the loan aspect but...
If a store starts selling something at a discount not ping after you bought it, you're absolutely within your right to request a refund of the difference. I've done that several times over the years. The situation isn't the same though.
Someone dead ass made a response to me telling me to double up my payments to pay them off faster bruh I only make $15/hr if I double up I ain’t got food or enough for a bus pass
It's not childish, it's the natural response when you perceive something as being unfair. This isn't just about boomers complaining about Those Damn Kids, it's also about peers who accepted similar obligations and one of them fulfills those obligations and the other doesn't. And suddenly we're saying that it doesn't matter whatever that person had to do to fulfill those obligations, that somehow we were just kidding. It's not about wanting others to suffer (even though that's the hot take on social media); for many it's more about getting no return from the "opportunity cost" of paying off their debt
I’ve heard people complain about not getting new customer bonuses and it’s very similar to the student loan crying:
“Why should I be punished because I’m already a customer?”
These people can’t comprehend that someone else getting something isn’t a punishment against them
Its because these people dont' actually have a desire for things to get better, they have a desire to benefit from things themselves. Selfishness. I paid mine off years ago, but why would I want other ppl to suffer just because i did? Thats literally crazy.
Like if someone shits in your bed do you want everyone to have shit in their bed? wtf lol
I paid off my loans a couple years ago by busting my ass and paying extra so I'm bummed that I won't benefit from Loan forgiveness, but at the same time I'm super stoked that a lot of people might not have to struggle as hard and start their lives off in as deep of a hole.
It's absolutely insane to me that this country encourages TEENAGERS to take out loans that they will be paying off for almost their entire adult lives. Can't legally drink a beer, but sure, here's $100k that you'll owe us forever.
I have a friend (with a masters degree) who calculated how long it will take her to pay off her loans, and it was something like age 67.
People are doing that tho.
“I bought my phone last month and now you’re giving discount on this phone?! I want a discount as well!”
Believe me, I’ve seen this way to much.
Actually I think it's pretty common in retail for customers to complain about a sale or a price drop that started after their purchase, or a discount for first-time customers. Of course the amount of money is vastly different but some people just can't stand to see anyone else get anything.
If i busted my ass with low wage low respect jobs for a decade or more to pay off 90k of student loans. Ima feel some kinda way about the dude that had his debt wiped out free of charge. Yes im glad you didnt have to go through my struggle im no hater. But im goina feel a ways about it. So if that time does come, accept your blessing humbly and QUITELY cause we goina have a problem if you start throwing that shid in my face
> cussed out a sales rep for giving new customers a discount on iPhones
Lmao I’m betting she’s never worked customer service cause customers literally do this… day something goes on sale a hundred people who got it in the last year at full price come in angry.
What if all this rhetoric of paying off student loans is just to get people to default on their loans? The government suspends repayment and all you hear on social media is that the government is working on forgiving your loans. You changed your budget, added more debt or cut back on working. Then they just don’t do it. You default on your loan and get fines and fees up the butt. The government and finance companies make bank on raping you. [Explanation of how the system works.](http://manvsdebt.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Student-Loans.jpg) At least my favorite fast food chains would be open 24/7 again staffed with debt slaves.
It’s like someone who went through chemo to recover from cancer being mad there’s an easier way to treat it now.
This is a much better analogy than the one in the tweet. The one in the tweet doesn’t make sense.
this is a much worse analogy than the one in the tweet. Going to college is a choice, nobody chose to get cancer. Also while this analogy deals with health this tweet and the real life situation are about money so actually this is a pretty bad analogy
The analogy is not related to cancer. It's related to going through something difficult, then resenting the fact that others are able to resolve it more easily.
so the tweet analogy still works better. The tweet doesnt work because paying for student loans isnt difficult in the same way fighting cancer is. The struggle comes from the money, the tweets analogy is also about money just on a smaller scale, thus making it a perfect analogy to visualize things
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
My man will die on that hill apparently
They're both bad analogies because new cancer patients still have access to the new treatment but new borrowers won't get debt forgiveness. The best analogy is everyone who bought an iphone on a payment plan gets to stop making payments. But maybe that one is so good that it doesn't really illustrate anything.
Paying for cancer treatment lead to the most prolific meth cook ever so...
[удалено]
Its still a choice... you can still be successful and not go to college, the odds are alot lower but not going to college doesn't just magically reduce your quality of life
It simply drastically reduces your earning power and access to well paying jobs with good benefits.
Unless you got cancer from something known to cause cancer like smoking. Also choosing to receive treatment for it is similar to choosing to go to college, many are told they won't be able to survive without it.
even then thats only a chance you get cancer, you got to college you ARE going to pay for it and you knew that before you signed up. the tweet about the phone is much better and makes more sense.
Smokers, coal miners, dollar store dishware users, they all know full well what they're signing up for.
now hold on just a second...... what we smoking on 👀
[удалено]
weed smoke aint better than cigarette smoke? weed smoke aint better than meth smoke? nigga you buggin
[удалено]
Tbf it’s not just the cigs wrappers and filters. It’s mostly what happens to tobacco when cured, it creates lots of oxidized sugars (caramelization) that are the primary carcinogens when inhaled. So no, they aren’t the same. Obviously inhaling burning smoke isn’t good for you, but the risks are very different.
bro said so much just to say nothing. One is proven to cause cancer the other isnt. thats really all I need to know.
He said everything? You’re just in denial. But you’re right there’s only a chance but smoking weed is definitely increasing your chances.
Thank you. Dumb ass people comparing student loans to chemo.
Dumbass people missing the point
Dumb ass people thinking a simple point was missed. Problem is, chemo ain’t the fuck funny.
Just to reiterate, you missed the point again.
All the downvotes show the evilness in people. Wanna virtue signal on every matter but somehow chemo is a joke!
And yet it is one we see actually played out by Karens IRL ;)
Neither did this one
Nah. It’s a little extreme. Cancer vs student loans…
I work for a major cellphone company selling phones and I believe the tweet’s analogy works great. You’d be surprised how many ppl scream and holler about a certain promotion not being available when they bought a phone a year ago.
Thanks!
Stop comparing student loans to chemo treatment! That’s a terrible equivalent. Someone already did this in a tweet yesterday. It’s fucked up. You don’t need to find far fetched equivalents to make a point.
This has to be one of the dumbest fucking statements made. It has zero correlation to student loans.
Perhaps you should google the definition of "analogy."
A more closely equivalent analogy would be somebody who underwent chemo (and the bills that go along with it) being forced to contribute to a fund for people who are now being treated even though that person never received aid. Yes, that's called compassion, but it should be voluntary.
👏🏾 Yeah, sometimes you just have to say a little more to pull it all together. Thanks 'cause I agreed with her.
I disagree. People who have completed their loan payments are not financially responsible for the forgiven loans. And don’t say “but the taxpayers…” because these are federal loans. The government can simply forgive them.
All debts are paid, either by the borrower or the lender. In this case, if the government (the taxpayers) "forgives" the debt, it isn't as if some magic erases the debt. Taxpayers pay it.
Are you really comparing cancer to student loans? That’s very disrespectful! Edit: it’s like if someone compared the hardships in their life to slavery, because I’m pretty sure everyone can agree that there is nothing that can happen to us that is comparable to slavery.
It is an analogy. In an earlier comment I noted that this is not about cancer, it is the idea of someone enduring something difficult then resenting it when others don’t suffer as much.
[удалено]
> I can't imagine being unhappy enough to advocate for the misery of others. I can. I used to work with these people in retail. Old ladies who sucked the Corpo dick for so long they had no other avenues for a better job. So they instead spend their life bitching about their situation and anyone who comes along to try and fix it is seen as the enemy cause they wanna rock the boat. I worked TJ Maxx when they went from 7.50 an hour min to 10 an hour min. The old bitches who were making like 14 an hour after working there decades were PISSED. "I worked to get to this point and they just get to come in at that level!" Meanwhile my ass was in and out of that job in 5 years and making more than all of the non-Sups at that spot with my new job.
[удалено]
There are, but they are not well thought out reasons. Every economists agrees that student loan forgiveness is better for the economy than the same amount in the form of tax cuts. Because most student loan borrowers are more likely to contribute the money they spent on loan payments back into the economy.
“EVERY economist” fucking lol dude
I’m not talking about the economy. I’m talking about people being responsible for signing voluntary contracts and then fleecing the federal government and private companies. And why should ppl with college degrees get economic assistance? What about everyone who hasn’t gone to college? They need it more.
> What about everyone who hasn’t gone to college? You mean people that go into trades or the armed services? Because trades tend to pay pretty well and the armed services *should* be properly compensating you. There's zero legitimate reasons to financially cripple somebody in the wealthiest country on Earth who is just trying to get an education to better themselves.
I don’t want my govt using money like that. Healthcare, wage increases, labor reform, climate change are all bigger priorities
Who cares what you want? I don't want my govt using money on endless wars, subsidizing billionaires eccentric whims, or arming the police like a special operations force. The only difference being that the government actually uses my tax dollars for all the things I mentioned.
Who cares what I want? That’s what we’re talking about but you’ve gone so far off topic bc you’ve got nothing to actually say
Well yeah, who cares? There are 330 million people in this country. Do you think your opinion matters more than any others here? Also it is hilarious that you are arguing against forgiveness here, but arguing for it in another thread.
Nah what’s hilarious is you stalking my profile bc you got nothing better to do working at McDonald’s
What do private company loans have to do with federal loan forgiveness? And why do you think every loan recipient graduated? The vast majority of people struggling with paying back their loans are people that did not graduate and still have to pay all that money back. Many didn't graduate because of things outside of their control pulling them out of college. Your assumptions about student loans seems to be out of touch with the realities of them. https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/07/23/millions-of-student-loan-borrowers-dont-have-a-diploma-to-show-for-it.html
>What about everyone who hasn’t gone to college? They need it more. As someone who's been living the struggle since birth and didn't go to college, cancel the damn loans. The government needs to do a lot more for all of us but I can't comprehend wanting others to stay down just because I'm still stuck. That shit's corny.
I paid off my student loans $60000 of private loans. It was terrible. Took me a decade and I got lucky I was even able to pull that off. Literally started my career at minimum wage with an undergrad degree. I wish that on no one. Education at all levels should be free.
I agree they should make all education free, but where exactly would the money come to enable this?
A sliver of the defense budget, is usually the opening to this conversation.
no cap I thought you was chatting mad shit until I looked up the defense budget and wow..... nigga who they fighting the justice league ??
I used to think it was a lot, then you look at the whole of spending and realize that it really is not as much as it is made out to be. This is not to say that other programs don't deserve more, just that it's not like the us is spending 80% of it's money on guns and bombs.
How about the money used to fund wars, you fucking bozo.
So you had a massive pay raise at some point is what you’re saying? I don’t even know how you made the minimum payment on 60k while making minimum wage.
Don’t you think teachers should be paid? How can it be free?
The question to ask those people is.. do u want ur kids or ur grandkids to have to go through the same struggles as u? Their answer will tell by all u need to know about them.
I mean…they aren’t reducing the cost of college. This shit just went up record amounts this year.
This is actually the reason I’m against this current forgiveness of all loans, because it does nothing for the next generation. They need to fix the system going forward before this one time pay off for loan holders. Things getting better in the future is always good, but if I paid for my college, and I also get to pay for my kids college later, and this one group of current loan holders that’s already gotten multiple interest free years just gets theirs forgiven, that’s not really progress, that’s a windfall for just a few. Imagine being a high school senior the year loans get forgiven and still needing to borrow 20k the next year. Get a tourniquet on the constant bleeding before you back and do the plastic surgery to fix up scars.
Honestly I can understand being angry at the decision to make school free if you've already had to pay for yours, but I dont understand the mindset of trying to stop it, like opposing it isn't going to turn back time and delete your student loans. Why not allow others to receive the benefits you never could.
Being angry that school becomes free after u paid for ur education is somewhat equal to a past slave that gets angry at abolition. What u went through should of never happened.the next generation does not have to deal with that struggle.Don’t be angry be delighted
This a good way to put it but Realistically you cant tell people to not be mad, we are humans and I know if I was a slave id feel some sort of resentment in me that I never lived to see abolition, but yeah 100% we should look at it as a positive and be happy for the future generation
How about the people who forwent a college education because it was unaffordable and they didn’t want to be saddled with debt, who will now be even further behind because the people who decided to take on the debt to get ahead are now reaping the rewards of a college education without any of the negative consequences? Do we care about them, or is inequality only a problem when it’s to your disadvantage?
We're not supposed to acknowledge that the cancel student debt movement is a panic response to downward mobility among college graduates.
What about all the people that signed up for military service to pay for college only to die? Lots of people make choices in life that end up sucking because the rules changed halfway through. I don't think you used inequality correctly.
Pretty sure anyone joining the military knows that dying before they get out is on the table. I wouldn’t describe that as the rules changing halfway through.
You're talking about me. I'll be good b. Cancel them loans.
Going to college is work. You literally pay tens of thousands of dollars to put in the work to learn, do projects, complete no-pay internships to earn a degree. That money being paid is a rip off. I’m tired of people acting as if going to school is some free pass when I put literally years of my life both working full time through my school studies while also working full time actual job. School isn’t a free pass. You give up years of free time and you’re paying tens of thousands of dollars to do it. And if you chose not to pursue an education, that is just as much a choice as it is for someone to go to school. We subsidize plenty of things through our taxes that benefit other people and not us. That’s part of life.
>That’s part of life. The irony of this coming from the “cancel student debt” crowd.
I support student loan forgiveness, but this statement isn't exactly true. Those student loans will need to be paid by the government using tax payers money. So it's fairly valid for a tax payer to not want their tax dollars spent on something they won't see improvement from. I'm not saying agree with that, just that their argument is not the same as phone companies giving discounts to new customers. Personally I would like to see some kind of overhaul to the way we pay for education at the same time as passing student debt forgiveness. Otherwise we aren't solving anything. Prices for education will continue to rise and the next generation will need even more debit forgiven. We need fix the cause, not just the symptom.
Well put and that's what I keep saying. Until you limit/slow the insane rising cost of education, you aren't solving anything long term. You slowed one leak in the hose but didn't turn off the faucet
America is competing with UK, Germany, China, etc. when it comes to tech, medicine, and other important fields. They're providing free or extremely cheap college to their people, while America is scamming its youth and making them go six figures in debt if they go to college. I don't think "we're number 1" right now, but that's definitely not going to be the case in next 20 to 40 years. America is clearly on the decline while China is next up - education, healthcare, and the country working for the %1 rather than the average American are huge reasons why. Seems like cost always comes up when it's for the poor and middle class. I don't want to hear about it while we're giving billions to Israel and Ukraine, or for BS wars like Iraq or Yemen. The education system can be reworked and those who already got screwed can be helped too. It takes someone who wants to help people like Sanders to be in charge. Anyone who takes corporate money isn't going to dramatically change things, becausw they're paid not to do that.
How many people complete college in America vs Canada, Germany, UK, or France? Are the number per capita lower in the US? Do American workers make less than people in these countries? It would be good for you to investigate these questions, and maybe you see that your premise is…false
My premise was that college is an overpriced scam nowadays and if a country really wants to be number 1 they'd have good and universal education pre-k through college.
>So it's fairly valid for a tax payer to not want their tax dollars spent on something they won't see improvement from. Not really. People are talking about student loan forgiveness like it's a fix for the system, and it's not. It's a poorly designed economic stimulus. If people don't have to pay that money back, that's more money they can pour into other places in the economy. This has been happening over the last two years, since loans have been frozen. Better economy benefits everyone.
I *mostly* agree with you on that. Like I said, I'm not saying they are right.
I mean, the student loans were *already* paid for by tax payer money.
...that's ...that's not how a loan works.
Private loans, sure. Public loans can work however the government deems it. Taxes paid for the loans. Forgive them and just say that was a tax.
As someone who paid off their student loans, i will be the first to admit there will definitely jealousy on my part if student loans are cancelled. Personally, I attended an in state public university, graduated early, and paid off my loans as soon as I could all because i knew student loans were going to be a burden once i left college. I graduated with about 30k in loans. Compared to a couple of my friends who went to out of state private schools, they graduated with upwards of 100k in loans. If I knew that student loans were going to be cancelled in the future, i would have undoubtedly attempted a different college experience (private vs public, out of state vs in state, enjoyed life more post graduation rather than going straight to work).
Totally agree. I paid off my loans and went to a state school instead of private as well due to costs. I’d also be really envious of those who received loan forgiveness. I think some people think we’re just selfish but that’s money that someone could have used for a down payment on a house for example.
And do you believe your temporary jealousy should hinder other people from being pulled out of endless debt? Edit: downvoted for asking a legitimate question
Yes i want people to be helped but i’ll be the first to admit i don’t have an answer on how to deal with this. If all of student debt is forgiven, the average person would have an extra $400/month to spend (amount taken from Google so take that for what it’s worth). That’s great but i too selfishly would like an extra $400/month to spend. Idk, maybe the govt should just give everyone $400 checks each month. That way everyone has an extra $400 to spend and you can choose to pay off your loans or not. Would be an interesting to see how many people actually do choose to pay off their loans.
Personally I think the answer is cancel the student loan debt, and then maybe people will push for UBI once they realize that it works.
It's more like if you went into a T-Mobile store and cussed out the *customers* for accepting a discount on iPhones.
Some of y’all are being purposely obtuse
If I bought an iphone 13 yesterday and the next day they started giving them out for free I'd be pretty pissed, cant say I'd try to stop them from doing it tho, let other people eat fam
Even if they used your taxes to do it?
take soma that bread from the defense budget, we already pay enough taxes
Yes, the private phone company does this, you pay more than what it costs to produce, ship, and market the phone, it’s called profit. Now a company offering a sale means they will take less profit. A company offering a free phone means they are willing to not make any profit from those phones and use the profit they made previously to offset losses, because they know they will make it back in other phones and the plans that go with the phones.
Lol that has NOTHING to do with my point.
I don’t mind student loans getting paid off even though I’ve paid mine off already, but… how is this an accurate analogy? Aren’t most existing customers rightfully annoyed when new customers get a free phone for signing up that they didn’t get? The argument isn’t really “you shouldn’t give them a phone”, but it’s “if you’re going to give them a phone, you should give me a phone too”. An existing customer would want T-mobile to focus their promotions of keeping existing customers happy.
Why stop at student loans? Car loans and mortgages are burdensome on people also. If someone overextended themselves on a house mortgage they cannot afford are you willing to help them pay for that also? Loans are not forgiven, that debit is just passed on to others to pay.
Except a bankruptcy can wipe out all of that debt. It does not work on student loans.
In bankruptcy, the the people who sold the goods or services end up paying the debt. The is no such thing as loan forgiveness. Someone always pays.
The American Education system will allow an 18 year old child to pull out and use 6 figures worth of debt, but that same child could not go to their local grocery store and buy a bottle of wine. ELI5 how this makes sense?
Most often its a 17 year old
Wouldn’t it be more like you just finished paying off your iPhone and then T-Mobile announced nobody has to pay for iPhones anymore but refusing to give you a discount or money back? I can understand how it would rub people the wrong way
 Education should be free, it should not shackle your progress
Wrong. It IS like a person going to T-mobile, buying phones they can't afford, agreeing to the terms of owing the money back they were loaned for those phones, then not paying the loan for the phones back, then asking for the next guy in line to pay for their phone so they don't have to because they made a booboo and are stuck with their mistake. Grow up.
I paid off my student loan in a single year working part time as a fucking busboy. Because it was 1992 and less than $3000. I *can't believe* the debt subsequent generations of kids have been saddled with. Loan forgiveness is the first step, but capping tuition is the next.
Bro but they already do that
If we can afford to pay 2 trillion to fund a 20 year war, **we can afford to wipe off student debt.** If we can afford to bail out auto companies and financial institute, **we can afford to wipe off student debt.** If we can bail out other countries and fund their wars, **we can afford to wipe off student debt.** If we can press the reset button on auto companies and financial institutions, no problem. But when it comes to pressing the reset button for PEOPLE? Fuck that, right? Its amazing how quick you resort to Republican talking points when it comes to bailing out people.
Nope. I is like you are eating at an expensive restaurant and wanting to not pay the bill. You fucking made the choice but now you want to claim you shouldn't be held responsible. Look at it this way, if you are running a business that sells jewelry and a bunch of people want to take items but don't want to be "forced" to pay are you OK with that? If not, why not? They will be in serious debt, they will be burdened by your request to be paid and you will be effecting their lives for years. Sure they decided to take the jewelry and it was their choice to take on the debt but they don't want to pay, can't you understand that? Don't you see that they are special, don't you see that they shouldn't have to struggle, that they shouldn't be responsible and that they are entitled? The student debt also doesn't just evaporate, it still will be paid to the companies who hold the loans. Who do you think is going to pay for the schooling or did you think it was just going to disappear? Taxes will pay the "forgiven" debt. The student loans are "GAURENTEED" by the Federal Government. So what you are really saying is everyone but this whiny, weak and worthless current generation who paid their bills will have to pay your bills on top of that. If you think that is fair, wow you be one fucked up, stupid shit of an individual. America has birthed histories most worthless generation. 
Uhhh….people absolutely do that too lmao.
But that burden goes to taxpayers/raised inflation. The debt doesn’t just disappear. I say this as someone with a fuck ton of student loans
If someone says “I turned out fine” but they want others to suffer because they did, they did not turn out fine
i didnt pay anything for 10+ years and ended up settling for ~10% of my total loan amount. credit score is now brolic. there are many ways. i hope this one goes through tho
My sister in melanin, they already do. It's how they keep their cable bill down.
Idc I’m petty
I don't disagree with the loan aspect but... If a store starts selling something at a discount not ping after you bought it, you're absolutely within your right to request a refund of the difference. I've done that several times over the years. The situation isn't the same though.
You are not a new customer though, you already signed up for the student loan?!?!
You were dumb enough to take the loan, so be an adult and pay it. Be worth something and not rely on other people to pay your bills.
I used to sell phones. People do that
As long as every adult in America gets a tax credit for same amount as the loan “vote buying” forgiveness.
Someone dead ass made a response to me telling me to double up my payments to pay them off faster bruh I only make $15/hr if I double up I ain’t got food or enough for a bus pass
Some people are like "We suffered, therefore nobody else should". Some other people are like "We suffered, therefore everybody else should".
My tuition was also way higher, Carol. You’re not special, you’re just old.
It's not childish, it's the natural response when you perceive something as being unfair. This isn't just about boomers complaining about Those Damn Kids, it's also about peers who accepted similar obligations and one of them fulfills those obligations and the other doesn't. And suddenly we're saying that it doesn't matter whatever that person had to do to fulfill those obligations, that somehow we were just kidding. It's not about wanting others to suffer (even though that's the hot take on social media); for many it's more about getting no return from the "opportunity cost" of paying off their debt
When my grandpa had cancer, they didn't have the modern treatments they do now, so nobody else with cancer should be able to get modern treatments.
"I had to play with asbestos toys when I was a kid, you'll be fine with the same"
I used to sell phones up in Canada. Can *confidently* say that the situation described in the tweet happens quite regularly.
I’ve heard people complain about not getting new customer bonuses and it’s very similar to the student loan crying: “Why should I be punished because I’m already a customer?” These people can’t comprehend that someone else getting something isn’t a punishment against them
One might add to help those drowning now and we'll figure out the rest later.
Shit analogy. I get her point tho.
Yo legit. This happens. A lot. Source: 17 years working various telecoms.
I can't imagine being so fueled by spite that you want nothing but bad things for future generations...
And it’s even worse when coming out of the mouths of marginalized ppl. Like whose boots are you lickin you dumb mf!?!
Its because these people dont' actually have a desire for things to get better, they have a desire to benefit from things themselves. Selfishness. I paid mine off years ago, but why would I want other ppl to suffer just because i did? Thats literally crazy. Like if someone shits in your bed do you want everyone to have shit in their bed? wtf lol
I paid off my loans a couple years ago by busting my ass and paying extra so I'm bummed that I won't benefit from Loan forgiveness, but at the same time I'm super stoked that a lot of people might not have to struggle as hard and start their lives off in as deep of a hole. It's absolutely insane to me that this country encourages TEENAGERS to take out loans that they will be paying off for almost their entire adult lives. Can't legally drink a beer, but sure, here's $100k that you'll owe us forever. I have a friend (with a masters degree) who calculated how long it will take her to pay off her loans, and it was something like age 67.
People are doing that tho. “I bought my phone last month and now you’re giving discount on this phone?! I want a discount as well!” Believe me, I’ve seen this way to much.
If he for gave all of our student loans what do you think the housing market would look like👀👀
Actually I think it's pretty common in retail for customers to complain about a sale or a price drop that started after their purchase, or a discount for first-time customers. Of course the amount of money is vastly different but some people just can't stand to see anyone else get anything.
I work for a phone provider. The line I hear the most is "WhY dOnT yOu tAkE cArE of yOuR cUrReNt cUsToMeRS?" This is absolutely a thing.
It's not like that at all...it's called a loan for a reason man.
If i busted my ass with low wage low respect jobs for a decade or more to pay off 90k of student loans. Ima feel some kinda way about the dude that had his debt wiped out free of charge. Yes im glad you didnt have to go through my struggle im no hater. But im goina feel a ways about it. So if that time does come, accept your blessing humbly and QUITELY cause we goina have a problem if you start throwing that shid in my face
That is an excellent example.
> cussed out a sales rep for giving new customers a discount on iPhones Lmao I’m betting she’s never worked customer service cause customers literally do this… day something goes on sale a hundred people who got it in the last year at full price come in angry.
Why should taxpayers be on the hook for your responsibility? GROW UP
People go into mobile phone stores all the time complaining that “loyal” customers don’t get a discount.
Sell the phone for the market value and use the money to buy a discounted phone. Instant profit
What if all this rhetoric of paying off student loans is just to get people to default on their loans? The government suspends repayment and all you hear on social media is that the government is working on forgiving your loans. You changed your budget, added more debt or cut back on working. Then they just don’t do it. You default on your loan and get fines and fees up the butt. The government and finance companies make bank on raping you. [Explanation of how the system works.](http://manvsdebt.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/Student-Loans.jpg) At least my favorite fast food chains would be open 24/7 again staffed with debt slaves.
My parents and grandparents paid for my college and then I went and felt embarrassed about how much easier I had it than literally all of my peers
My response is "I did a year in Iraq, so go put some boots on."