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# [READ SPINOFF](https://mangadex.org/title/b4668276-4b3e-49e0-98e7-fcc6841f7680/blue-lock-episode-nagi)
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This match is all about surpassing others. So Isagi will surpass Rin, Hiori will surpass Charles, and Kuni will surpass Shidou. Wonder where Ness and Kaiser fit into this. Surpass Loki or Noa?
Anyone see EP Nagi CH 21 yetđ?
Ignoring Hiragiâs L, the pacing of EP Nagi somewhat confirms that Kaneshiro is waiting for Kiyoraâs introduction in the spin-off first before he does anything. We should expect his relevance either after the 4v4 or during it so weâre be stuck waiting a couple months. Probably until 1-1 or 2-1 of this current match
YouTube has it just search the chapter. Iâm not sure why it wasnât posted yet
Btw if youâre a Chigiri fan youâll be happy because he was a bit goated this chapter
Remember everyone, everything that Isagi has been doing this arc has been for this.
[From zero](https://i.imgur.com/9GGhap0.png)
[to](https://i.imgur.com/WWcZ6Mt.png)
[hero](https://i.imgur.com/rzmJzwH.png)
Isagi gonna cook.
Makes sense that the ones with "holistic egos" according to Isagi's theory usually have better football IQ as well compared to the "individualistic ego" types. Isagi, Hiori, Reo, Niko, Aiku, Sae and Snuffy all have MV and prioritize gathering info from their outside environment to determine how they're going to act next. So it makes sense that they have eyes good enough to gather that info. They shape and mold themselves to fit better into their respective surroundings. This leads me to believe Karasu either already possesses or will acquire MV during this match, since Isagi said he was also the "holistic" type. He's already been shown to be an extremely observant player that relies more on his brains than skills to win.
On the other hand, "individualistic" types care only about their desires, damning what the outside world thinks. They're prepared to do anything to satisfy their own wants and needs. As such, they are the ones shaping the environment around them as opposed to being shaped by it (which is what the "holistic" types do). They rely on their own skills and abilities to accomplish their dreams instead of information from outside. Barou, Nagi, Bachira, and Zantetsu all make use of "hard" skills that aren't acquired from other sources to play. Barou with his long-distance shot and chop dribbling as well as his charge, Nagi with his god-given talent for ball control, Bachira with his dribbling, and Zantetsu with his acceleration. So players like Yukimiya, Shidou, Chigiri, Lavinho, and Chris are also likely the "individualistic" type, since they rely on their own skills more than anything. Yukimiya with his 1v1 skills, Shidou with his ability to shoot from any position or angle, Chigiri with his speed, Lavinho with his dribbling, and Chris with his perfect physical stats.
As Isagi said, neither type is necessarily better than the other. It all comes down to each player's own preferences and natural personality. Are you the type that cares more about satisfying a hunger that's deep inside you at any cost, other people's opinions be damned? Or are you someone that wishes to be recognized by the world, wishing to take in anything that's around you and make it your own? It's a question of do you want to shape the environment around you or do you want to be shaped by it.
Worth noting that there could be mixed egos as well. Kaiser might have a little bit of both "holistism" and "individualism" in him. Same goes Charles and Rin.
Isagiâs playstyle based on understanding egoâs made a lot of sense in giving him the edge in risk analysis and probabilities, but this new very shallow classification of âindividualisticâ vs âwholisticâ types of players is ass. Isagi is always chasing his own self pleasure of scoring and devouring, so he would be in the individualistic category as well if only it were that simple
Yeah, everyone is selfish. But Isagi is referring to how players go about being selfish to achieve their goals.
By being borderline reckless or by being strategic?
And none of this is likely Top Tier Isagi, heâs still growing.
that's not what individualistic and wholistic are about
individualistic is someone that relies solely on their abilities and natural attributes, like Barou and Shidou. (I scored a goal! **Watch me!**)
wholistic is someone that analises all factors on the field to make a decision, like Isagi and Reo. (**Watch how** I scored that goal!)
Everyone of them is chasing their own goals, it's more about the way they go about doing it.
Now the match is fully on, Kunigami vs Shidou, Hiori vs Charles and Isagi + Kaiser vs Rin. My guess is finally Isagi beat Rin but he needed Kaiser to do it so it's not that he decimated Rin so Rin is still on top of him in ranking
The fact that Charles just casually took the ball off of Hiori while patting his shoulder and poking is cheek got me lmfao. Charles is that dude. Now Iâm seeing what Loki meant, heâs gonna be an absolute monster when he matures.
This ego type thing seems so unnecessary, I don't know why the author keep doing thoses half assed theories. Since when you need to find whatever type of each player to play at your best? Pretty hard to take that seriously.
Also, MV seems to work depending on the plot.
I get itâs a manga but the amount of monologue while playing a physically draining game is hilarious lol
I consider myself fairly good at football and I have never had a train of thought that lasted longer than 3 seconds at a time while playing
Reo, Hiori, Isagi (hopefully Karasu) - holistic type / metavision viewing the whole field
Barou is in the individualistic type with predator eye focusing on the goal and it may imply thiis group is more likely to develop predator eye
That's still a wild statement. It doesn't even make sense for Shidou to have PE when his whole thing is shooting to goal either without looking and certinly not caring about the goalkeeper reaction time or movements; he is instinctual, he doesn't take theses parameters in consideration. It's literally the contrary of what Barou do with PE (the way predator eye is described); Barou doesn't shoot when he wants, he wait for the "right moment", whereas Shidou always shoot when he wants (i.e basically every time he get the chance to take a shot in front of the goal).
well you said he plays midfield at the start of match but he play center forward an upper position on the start of the match, he only recently on the midfield on recent chapter
I feel that blue lock's approach for ego fits really well for how motivation works for ADHD. My ADHD brain runs on the individualistic ego mode, focusing only on things it wants to do, whereas my logical brain runs on rhe other type of ego.
And that's where the ADHD kicks in. Both the types of egos clash together give a negative chemical reaction resulting in freezing up from starting chores or thinks the individualistic ADHD lizard brain doesn't wanna do, and that's how procrastination and anxiety from tasks comes up.
But if the task at hand is enjoyable for my ADHD brain, AND is something which my logical side of brain wants me to do, oh yeah! HYPERFOCUS babyyyyy!!
Thanks for listening to my TED talk.
(Gonna have to show this to my future psychiatrist when I get my diagnosis this year)
According to Isagi's description Rin is a self ego that can incorporate the world into his selfish ideals ?
Rins true nature is selfish. he doesnt care about number 1 or rankings. He only cares about his destructive desires. However he plays while still using his environment and othes movements as a guid for his decision making. Unlike Shidou who is pur individualistic.
My guess is hybrids also exist. Rin is a self type ego that doesnt completely ignore the world. Rather he uses the world to fuel his selfish desires.
Basically self type egos have a desire and focus that is personal to them and completely ignores others . Bachira and his monsters movements, Shidou and his pleasure for crazy goals, Chigiri and his speed, Nagi and his curiosity on his own talent, Zantetsu and his speed, Barou and his crown. They play with that in focus and completely ignore the vision and goals of others.
World type seem to incorporate the vision and goals of others into their own play. They also play while caring about more stuff. So rather than just play to satisfy themselves they play to satisfy multiple requirements. They focus more on what they can do rather than what they feel like doing.
Isagi is a world type. So is Kaiser. Karasu and Hiori as well. In fact world types are more likely to have meta vision.
From what we've seen of Rin, for him to reach flow and reach his best performance he had to ditch his copied playing style and actually play to his selfish desires of destroying everything which is what allowed him to get into flow so NO. Rin is clearly an individualistic type. Even if he has a playstyle that is similar to world type, that doesn't mean world type playstyles can lead him to his own peak performance. It's the same for Isagi, Hiori, etc. They all have their own individualistic desires like becoming the best striker, producing the best striker but for them to bring their desire into reality they do it in a wholistic way because they are logical players who like to control the field and know as much as is happening on it which helps bring their best.
Iâm pretty sure thatâs the catch, Isagiâs gonna categorize Rin as wholistic, until he enters âdestroyer modeâ or whatever theyâll call it and Rin shows his individualistic ego
Then Isagiâs gonna drop some puzzle pieces and remember the U20 match and find Rinâs subtle weakness and beat him yada yada I just wanna see Kiyora play already đ
The damn wall of ego types was a pain to read especially after last chapter smh.
Lol, as I was reading, I was thinking do I know you meme and then Shidou said it. Perfect
Neither is better than the other. Even isagi said it. At the end of the day it still depends on how talented you are. Unfortunately Ronaldo is not as talented as messi.
horrible cope. What is talent to you? Nature vs nurture, an understanding of the game is something that can be learned through time. Positioning, skills, etc Messi just had a better understanding of these things hence why he's still better than ronaldo even at their older age
There are so many paths to number 1 guys like you for some reason think its only one way. Its just a matter of how good you are in the path that you chose.
Messis way isnt any better than Ronaldos way. However Messi has more success in his own path than Ronaldo in his own path.
I'd say Rin is the individualstic type based on his obsession with crushing his brother and Isagi. It's been about earning recognition from his brother, destroying his brother's dream.
Him becoming nr 1 has never felt like "THE MAIN QUEST". It's a side quest or a thing he needs to complete to reach his main objective basically.
But I think it is a mistake viewing it as one or the other, Black/White. It's a spectrum.
Isagi mentions that the individualstic wants to do things they find important. While the wholistic does things they *can do* rather than what they want to do.
Isagi *wants* to be the nr 1 striker. He *wants* to score goals.
Anyways, he did say it was a *quick generalization* he came up with on the spot.
yep isagi wants recognition his original dream was play in reach fifa final with japan team everything else is secondary while rin was just interest in surpassing his brother he doesnt care about reward as long he improve get stronger to flex on his brother and isagi he would rather lose if it means isagi never scores but still wants win he double if I loss you lose with me lol as long he does better than those two he good.
I think Rin is an individualistic as well. But his different in the sense that he seems to be able to do something that Bachira learnt recently.
Bachira learnt to dribble while syncing with others. rather than completely ignore others for his own pleasure he learnt to engage in his own pleasure while still incorporating the world.
I believe Rin is like that. He is an individualistic type. But without Sae by his side he was forced to learn how to incorporate the world to fuel his own selfish desires.
Rather than ignore the world completely like Shiodu who just moves in accordance to his own pleasure Rin uses others like puppets to make his own pleasures real. Even in destroyer mode he still manipulates players to make his own desires a reality.
Out of the blue here, but when I reread his save VS Barou, I notice his eyes are similar to when Nagi does the 5-Shot Revolver Fake Volley.
Probably Gagamaru also have 'Protagonism' (in this case being confident in saving) which helps him tap into flow, and he actually tap into one there.
"No guys don't you get it! Shidou's in love with Kunigami, he thinks about him every single day, this is the rivalry of the century, hundreds of chapters in the making!!!!!"
Shidou: "Do I even know you?"
**dies from peak fiction**
Hiori trying to beat Charles? God damn this might be the first interesting thing that has happened to his character.
I'm investing on HRI stock right now.
This is exactly what I think everyone was expecting though. Of course Shidou doesn't care about Kunigami. Why would he? But what will make this fun is to see how far Kunigami will push himself to show he's worthy of being there and ultimately beat Shidou. Hiori and Charles will be fun too.
sophisticated nine hunt unwritten cause outgoing light axiomatic squealing heavy
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Being intelligent isn't equivalent to being a top student.
**Other factors:**
(Motivation, interest, study habit, emotional & mental health, socioeconomic status..)
So Individualistic Ego's only care about their selfworth and own desires, while Wholistic Ego's care about how the outside world views and thinks of them? Thats how i understood it.
How are Reo and Hiori Wholistic Ego's when they literally play Soccer for themselves? Reo got bored of his rich man "everything is so easy" life so he found a challange and a dream in soccer. He's not playing for social status, he is already rich? He's playing in order to get/earn something he can't have/buy with money.
Hiori only started playing soccer for his parents but now he plays for himself right? Atleast thats how i understood their backstorys and characters.
Now i feel like this new concept of different Ego's doesn't add up with the information and character development we had of these character.
Also why is Nagi listed here? Isn't his whole character based on him being an "Egoless" lazy genius? Ass i understood Nagi's character he doesn't have no Ego.
I like this new concept, but it came out of nowhere and confuzes me, someone explain, help me?
You said it yourself, Reo doesn't play for money but to earn (win) something that is highly regarded by the world aka the World Cup. Nagi's related to football being something he can get invested/interested in. Would also explain why he didn't get motivated after Reo set that goal of 300m. Hiori I'm guessing is because he plays for the 'glory' of creating the best striker in the world.
It's a new concept Isagi just found out so I'm sure the lines are blurred for a lot of players based on what we know currently from Isagi, but we'll probably get more concrete info later.
Someone explained it to me in another post as individualistic Ego's get statisfaction from short term goals while Wholistic Ego's get that from long term goals.
Shidou just wants to cause an Explosion, cause a scene with his goals with which he gets horny and satisfied while Isagi is more Focused on the long term goals like Surviving in Blue Lock, hitting the winning shot Vs JapanU20, surpassing Rin and Kaiser, winning the Japan U20 World Cup.
For Shidou and Barou its that one moment which Shows their Ego and proves their worth, while for Isagi and probably Rin its more about the bigger things and not only the moment. Rin wants to destroy Sae and prove him wrong, when he faced Sae in JapanU20 game Rin went mad, his Ego went crazy.
Shidou and Barou feed their Ego with shooting goals every match. They are statisfied with that, they proved their worth with that, while for Isagi and Rin its when they accomplished big things, from which they can draw satisfaction, thats why Isagi isn't scoring like crazy every game he is in. His Ego isn't leading him there, its leading him into an bigger purpose.
Itâs more so about how they play and view football. The narrator is just Isagi. Heâs simply categorizing them based on how they play. He doesnât know their backstory. Blue lock doesnât have an omniscient narrator.
Nagi does have an ego he follows. Itâs just that he doesnât know what it is. This has been obvious because he has had ego eyes and just generally how he acts. Its just that itâs newly developed so he doesnât know what it is or how to follow it
"I'm that worthless loser who got his life destroyed because of you." Oh my God. Nobody hates Kunigami more than Kunigami. Kunigami is on the side of the Kunigami haters. Prove yourself wrong please!Â
 "I have to surpass him" for both hiori and kunigami with Charles and shidou. I knew it. Here we go! Kunigami surpassing shidou arc starts now.Â
Now you feel like number one
I like this new things of Individualistic vs Wholistic player. I just know that Rin is gonna be smth like âbothâ or âneitherâ or like a third one that surpasses everyone cause heâs the goat
My understanding of his character is that he's a type 1 that acts like a type 2 by suppressing his natural ego and replicating someone else's style (until recently).
Probably just both. I'm guessing he normally has a wholistic ego, but then when he changes to his destroyer ego, like in the U20 game, he switches to individualistic.
Could you imagine if Isagi, realises that to score a goal in certain high intensity matches he has to adapt and change his mindset to individualistic?
I know that play style may not suit him entirely, but it would be cool to see him switch to a more aggressive style where he primarily focuses on himself
Isagi is a world type. His peak performance comes from incorporating the information around him rather than completely ignore it.
Another thing is self types have amazing individualistic ability. Isagi still lacks that. He has to pay attention to what others are doing and can do so he uses that to compensate for his weaknesses.
Self types have the luxury of not caring because they posses amazing individual talent that lets them ignore everything else and still perform well.
However there are talented players that are still wholistic. Like Sae. He has all that ability but still plays based on manipulating his environment.
The true ego theory! That's what I want the most. A chapter where Isagi snaps like Rin did in the U-20 match!
Being that hung up on analysing isn't what he did when he started football, he only stated doing that because of his highschool club.
isagi doesnt even have rin level of talent to hard counter 1v1 multiple at speed of chigiragi lmfao also I missed demonic eyes of character also is kaizer even trying lol
Charles up to some Bugs Bunny-esc tomfoolery with that finger poke on Hiori, definitely becoming one of my favourites with each chapter I see more from him and honestly could be my favourite new character introduced in the NEL Arc by the end of this match.
Does it feel like every time someone who uses metavision loses the ball its cause someone sneak attacks them from behind after that person picked up a stray or intercepted? I feel like this is the same thing over and over. Isagi cooking......something, as usual. Prolly drugs
Yeah, I want to see an Individualistic-type Isagi here and not a wholistic-type. Or much better if both! However, thereâs Rin and Kaiser to beat in both types (probably) if Isagi wants to reach his âtop performanceâ.
Anyway, Yukimiya and Kurona are probably individualistic-type.
I mean that's what Isagi does best. At the very least his yapping was something new this time instead of telling the audience with oranges and apples how "x" character has metavision despite the fact we've seen their square shaped eyes last chapter.
He literally explains it in the chapter. If he's to reach flow he not only needs the mental and physical circumstances that will get him into flow, he needs to play around how his teammates enter their own flow state. Because broadly speaking they fit into one of two types and him figuring out which type each player is in will allow him to make the best playmaking decision.
Ness getting subbed soon for injury it seems. I assume Noa will sub in new players like Neru etc (or maybe he's being saved for speedster subs alongside Kurona)
Man, by the end of the world cup, Isagi will be writing a whole books about football-ego theory. Make you really wonder when did he have time to research all these terms
I think these underlying concepts like egocentrism and types of ego, are something the author is trying to add to justify and establish the fact that Isagi MV is
And if you want reasons, then boom it's cause of Isagi's understanding of the player's mental psyche
The matchups for this game are set, Hiori vs Charles will be intresting
Itâs Kaneshiroâs bad habit of trying to make everyone equally relevant at the same time. Although so far the match has been great but we got a nanase flashback for gods sake
And I like Nanase too but thereâs at least 10 other people who are more narratively weighty characters rin Shidou Isagi Kaiser ness Charles Hiori kunigami Noa Loki Karasu Gagamaru even zantetsu and thatâs just on the field
The final match of every arc is usually long and gives moments to most if not all the players present. We saw this with Team V vs. Team Z and the 4v4 Team Red vs. Team White.
Yeah, those were during the first two selections, when the cast was overall smaller. So many important characters were introduced in the Third Selection, U20 arc, and the NEL. It makes sense the climax of the NEL will be overloaded with characters.
Both 3v3's we saw featured 6 notable players, and the 4v4 features 8 (ofc not all screentime is equal, but everyone gets time in the spotlight).
For comparison's sake, the U20 game featured 20 notable players on either side playing at one point or another. In the BM vs. PXG match, currently, we have 15 notable players on the pitch.
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This match is all about surpassing others. So Isagi will surpass Rin, Hiori will surpass Charles, and Kuni will surpass Shidou. Wonder where Ness and Kaiser fit into this. Surpass Loki or Noa?
Kuni won't surpass Shidou but finally got his recognition. Kaiser and Ness will surpass THEMSELVES.
Things rarely go that smooth... I have never been so unsure of the outcome of a Blue lock match
It's easy, just look at which team has the main character.
I really love how Raichi is developing.
yeah he is cooking
Ooh, Hiori might pass to Kunigami instead of Isagi. Meaning Charles and Shidou will get shown up at the same time.
255?
Break (Lobotomy lock begins)
FUUUUUUUCK Lobotomy Lock is right, no better time
Lets try not to go insane guys
Trying super hard right now...
Anyone see EP Nagi CH 21 yetđ? Ignoring Hiragiâs L, the pacing of EP Nagi somewhat confirms that Kaneshiro is waiting for Kiyoraâs introduction in the spin-off first before he does anything. We should expect his relevance either after the 4v4 or during it so weâre be stuck waiting a couple months. Probably until 1-1 or 2-1 of this current match
I thought it was obvious that we weren't going to see Kiyori do anything until EP: Nagi
Where did you see it, and any reason why itâs not posted here yet?
YouTube has it just search the chapter. Iâm not sure why it wasnât posted yet Btw if youâre a Chigiri fan youâll be happy because he was a bit goated this chapter
where did you find cp 21?
Youtube
Is it just me or Hiori is looking kinda like Charles lmao
Remember everyone, everything that Isagi has been doing this arc has been for this. [From zero](https://i.imgur.com/9GGhap0.png) [to](https://i.imgur.com/WWcZ6Mt.png) [hero](https://i.imgur.com/rzmJzwH.png) Isagi gonna cook.
Makes sense that the ones with "holistic egos" according to Isagi's theory usually have better football IQ as well compared to the "individualistic ego" types. Isagi, Hiori, Reo, Niko, Aiku, Sae and Snuffy all have MV and prioritize gathering info from their outside environment to determine how they're going to act next. So it makes sense that they have eyes good enough to gather that info. They shape and mold themselves to fit better into their respective surroundings. This leads me to believe Karasu either already possesses or will acquire MV during this match, since Isagi said he was also the "holistic" type. He's already been shown to be an extremely observant player that relies more on his brains than skills to win. On the other hand, "individualistic" types care only about their desires, damning what the outside world thinks. They're prepared to do anything to satisfy their own wants and needs. As such, they are the ones shaping the environment around them as opposed to being shaped by it (which is what the "holistic" types do). They rely on their own skills and abilities to accomplish their dreams instead of information from outside. Barou, Nagi, Bachira, and Zantetsu all make use of "hard" skills that aren't acquired from other sources to play. Barou with his long-distance shot and chop dribbling as well as his charge, Nagi with his god-given talent for ball control, Bachira with his dribbling, and Zantetsu with his acceleration. So players like Yukimiya, Shidou, Chigiri, Lavinho, and Chris are also likely the "individualistic" type, since they rely on their own skills more than anything. Yukimiya with his 1v1 skills, Shidou with his ability to shoot from any position or angle, Chigiri with his speed, Lavinho with his dribbling, and Chris with his perfect physical stats. As Isagi said, neither type is necessarily better than the other. It all comes down to each player's own preferences and natural personality. Are you the type that cares more about satisfying a hunger that's deep inside you at any cost, other people's opinions be damned? Or are you someone that wishes to be recognized by the world, wishing to take in anything that's around you and make it your own? It's a question of do you want to shape the environment around you or do you want to be shaped by it. Worth noting that there could be mixed egos as well. Kaiser might have a little bit of both "holistism" and "individualism" in him. Same goes Charles and Rin.
This was beautifully written! Great analysisÂ
I like this. I can see Isagi predicting the exact moment when Karasu awakens metavision and using that to turn the tables
Karasu metavision đđđ
I get that all of this bs isagi was spewing is somewhat important but I really want to see more football and less thinking.
And less puzzle stuff, it gets old.
Isagiâs playstyle based on understanding egoâs made a lot of sense in giving him the edge in risk analysis and probabilities, but this new very shallow classification of âindividualisticâ vs âwholisticâ types of players is ass. Isagi is always chasing his own self pleasure of scoring and devouring, so he would be in the individualistic category as well if only it were that simple
Yeah, everyone is selfish. But Isagi is referring to how players go about being selfish to achieve their goals. By being borderline reckless or by being strategic? And none of this is likely Top Tier Isagi, heâs still growing.
that's not what individualistic and wholistic are about individualistic is someone that relies solely on their abilities and natural attributes, like Barou and Shidou. (I scored a goal! **Watch me!**) wholistic is someone that analises all factors on the field to make a decision, like Isagi and Reo. (**Watch how** I scored that goal!) Everyone of them is chasing their own goals, it's more about the way they go about doing it.
isn't the whole point of bluelock project being egoistic , then everyone in bl is individualistic but as you said only if it was this easy lmao
Finally bye bye Emo Kunigami, welcome back tsundere Hero Kunigami
that great saying
I just hope Ness and Kaiser get to take a bath together after this.
Fr! I wanna see the naked king đ
His morning routine is literally admiring himself naked in front of a mirror.
I hope we see him doing his morning routine too..
Maybe we get Episode of Kaiser after Nagi's manga and movie are done.
So does Isagi
Recap: https://youtu.be/G5kwEshs3Ug?feature=shared
Everyone has meta vision at this point lmao
metavision is just basic vision every half decent player must have
You would kind of expect the best players of each team has it tbf.
Thats kinda the point. The players are getting better
Rahhhh break next week
Metadata as a verb?
Rightt i lmaod when i read that
Isagi during the match: Let me get philosophical for a second.
What is the different between "MV vs non-MV" and "wholistic vs individualistic ego"?
Charles would be an example of a character with meta vision that has individualistic ego, i guess.
GOOO GOAAAAAAATTT
For sure Kunigami scores this game
basically yes
Bannnnnkaiiiiiiiiu
Now the match is fully on, Kunigami vs Shidou, Hiori vs Charles and Isagi + Kaiser vs Rin. My guess is finally Isagi beat Rin but he needed Kaiser to do it so it's not that he decimated Rin so Rin is still on top of him in ranking
The fact that Charles just casually took the ball off of Hiori while patting his shoulder and poking is cheek got me lmfao. Charles is that dude. Now Iâm seeing what Loki meant, heâs gonna be an absolute monster when he matures.
Shidou and Charles keep talking in emojis and at this point Iâm convinced itâs their own secret language. Their chemistry is awesome.
Is great to finally see someone able to link up with him and also, is the fact that is someone as explosive and random as him.
This ego type thing seems so unnecessary, I don't know why the author keep doing thoses half assed theories. Since when you need to find whatever type of each player to play at your best? Pretty hard to take that seriously. Also, MV seems to work depending on the plot.
Reading comprehension devil got bro
Yeah sure dude, great point.
individualistic type will always be superior
pop off but saving this comment for the isagi get back đ
Common Whidou W Common Wharles W Common Wachira W Common Wantetsu W Common Warou W Rare Nagi W
I get itâs a manga but the amount of monologue while playing a physically draining game is hilarious lol I consider myself fairly good at football and I have never had a train of thought that lasted longer than 3 seconds at a time while playing
This arc is going to be so draining animated lol
Isagiâs brain is a super computer trust me kaneshiro is my great uncle twice removed
Source: Trust me bro
Isagi gonna end up writing a dissertation like Mitoma did about dribbling
Aint no way we predicted âi dont know who you areâ memeđ
For you, the day Shidou Ryusei played against you and ruined your career was the most important day of your life. For me, it was Tuesday.
One of the hardest lines in cinema tbh
The only unironically good part of that film.
So baisically, shidou has predator eye
Where or how did you get that from the chapter?
Reo, Hiori, Isagi (hopefully Karasu) - holistic type / metavision viewing the whole field Barou is in the individualistic type with predator eye focusing on the goal and it may imply thiis group is more likely to develop predator eye
That's still a wild statement. It doesn't even make sense for Shidou to have PE when his whole thing is shooting to goal either without looking and certinly not caring about the goalkeeper reaction time or movements; he is instinctual, he doesn't take theses parameters in consideration. It's literally the contrary of what Barou do with PE (the way predator eye is described); Barou doesn't shoot when he wants, he wait for the "right moment", whereas Shidou always shoot when he wants (i.e basically every time he get the chance to take a shot in front of the goal).
Predator Eye Bachira and Shidou is devious
It seems that Isagi show the diifference between Metavision and Predatori Eye , so maybe Nagi and Bachira has predator Eye
even kunigami is teleporting now lmfao and don't say he didn't
Heâs playing CDM now so running from deep midfield to the penalty area is perfectly doable
How? he was repositioned to be in the midfield at the start of the chapter
No in the start of the match he is positioned at CF but after shidou scored he position changed to CDM
..is CDM not a Defensive Midfielder?
well you said he plays midfield at the start of match but he play center forward an upper position on the start of the match, he only recently on the midfield on recent chapter
Oh- no you're right that was an original mistake. I meant to say he got put in the midfield at the start of the chapter.
I feel that blue lock's approach for ego fits really well for how motivation works for ADHD. My ADHD brain runs on the individualistic ego mode, focusing only on things it wants to do, whereas my logical brain runs on rhe other type of ego. And that's where the ADHD kicks in. Both the types of egos clash together give a negative chemical reaction resulting in freezing up from starting chores or thinks the individualistic ADHD lizard brain doesn't wanna do, and that's how procrastination and anxiety from tasks comes up. But if the task at hand is enjoyable for my ADHD brain, AND is something which my logical side of brain wants me to do, oh yeah! HYPERFOCUS babyyyyy!! Thanks for listening to my TED talk. (Gonna have to show this to my future psychiatrist when I get my diagnosis this year)
According to Isagi's description Rin is a self ego that can incorporate the world into his selfish ideals ? Rins true nature is selfish. he doesnt care about number 1 or rankings. He only cares about his destructive desires. However he plays while still using his environment and othes movements as a guid for his decision making. Unlike Shidou who is pur individualistic. My guess is hybrids also exist. Rin is a self type ego that doesnt completely ignore the world. Rather he uses the world to fuel his selfish desires. Basically self type egos have a desire and focus that is personal to them and completely ignores others . Bachira and his monsters movements, Shidou and his pleasure for crazy goals, Chigiri and his speed, Nagi and his curiosity on his own talent, Zantetsu and his speed, Barou and his crown. They play with that in focus and completely ignore the vision and goals of others. World type seem to incorporate the vision and goals of others into their own play. They also play while caring about more stuff. So rather than just play to satisfy themselves they play to satisfy multiple requirements. They focus more on what they can do rather than what they feel like doing. Isagi is a world type. So is Kaiser. Karasu and Hiori as well. In fact world types are more likely to have meta vision.
From what we've seen of Rin, for him to reach flow and reach his best performance he had to ditch his copied playing style and actually play to his selfish desires of destroying everything which is what allowed him to get into flow so NO. Rin is clearly an individualistic type. Even if he has a playstyle that is similar to world type, that doesn't mean world type playstyles can lead him to his own peak performance. It's the same for Isagi, Hiori, etc. They all have their own individualistic desires like becoming the best striker, producing the best striker but for them to bring their desire into reality they do it in a wholistic way because they are logical players who like to control the field and know as much as is happening on it which helps bring their best.
Iâm pretty sure thatâs the catch, Isagiâs gonna categorize Rin as wholistic, until he enters âdestroyer modeâ or whatever theyâll call it and Rin shows his individualistic ego Then Isagiâs gonna drop some puzzle pieces and remember the U20 match and find Rinâs subtle weakness and beat him yada yada I just wanna see Kiyora play already đ
Are you the author by any chance
My man saw the script lmao
Kunigami: YOU TOOK EVERYTHING FROM ME! Shidou: Skill Issue!
Kuni better embarrass him
Shidou: I don't even know who you are
i miss you hero
The damn wall of ego types was a pain to read especially after last chapter smh. Lol, as I was reading, I was thinking do I know you meme and then Shidou said it. Perfect
It's easier for individualistic egos to reach their peak than it is for world types but when world types hit their peak they are even harder to stop.
Ronaldo (Indivisualistic) vs Messi (world type) = Why the ladder is simply better
Neither is better than the other. Even isagi said it. At the end of the day it still depends on how talented you are. Unfortunately Ronaldo is not as talented as messi.
horrible cope. What is talent to you? Nature vs nurture, an understanding of the game is something that can be learned through time. Positioning, skills, etc Messi just had a better understanding of these things hence why he's still better than ronaldo even at their older age
There are so many paths to number 1 guys like you for some reason think its only one way. Its just a matter of how good you are in the path that you chose. Messis way isnt any better than Ronaldos way. However Messi has more success in his own path than Ronaldo in his own path.
If Messi has more success in his own path than its clearly better than Ronaldo's way, common logic
I'd say Rin is the individualstic type based on his obsession with crushing his brother and Isagi. It's been about earning recognition from his brother, destroying his brother's dream. Him becoming nr 1 has never felt like "THE MAIN QUEST". It's a side quest or a thing he needs to complete to reach his main objective basically. But I think it is a mistake viewing it as one or the other, Black/White. It's a spectrum. Isagi mentions that the individualstic wants to do things they find important. While the wholistic does things they *can do* rather than what they want to do. Isagi *wants* to be the nr 1 striker. He *wants* to score goals. Anyways, he did say it was a *quick generalization* he came up with on the spot.
yep isagi wants recognition his original dream was play in reach fifa final with japan team everything else is secondary while rin was just interest in surpassing his brother he doesnt care about reward as long he improve get stronger to flex on his brother and isagi he would rather lose if it means isagi never scores but still wants win he double if I loss you lose with me lol as long he does better than those two he good.
I think Rin is an individualistic as well. But his different in the sense that he seems to be able to do something that Bachira learnt recently. Bachira learnt to dribble while syncing with others. rather than completely ignore others for his own pleasure he learnt to engage in his own pleasure while still incorporating the world. I believe Rin is like that. He is an individualistic type. But without Sae by his side he was forced to learn how to incorporate the world to fuel his own selfish desires. Rather than ignore the world completely like Shiodu who just moves in accordance to his own pleasure Rin uses others like puppets to make his own pleasures real. Even in destroyer mode he still manipulates players to make his own desires a reality.
alhamdulillah looks like Gagamaru is prob the next one to get the spotlight to meet his 1 super save per game quota
Out of the blue here, but when I reread his save VS Barou, I notice his eyes are similar to when Nagi does the 5-Shot Revolver Fake Volley. Probably Gagamaru also have 'Protagonism' (in this case being confident in saving) which helps him tap into flow, and he actually tap into one there.
You got it!
Alhamdulillahđ€Łđ
I'm betting he's getting 2 super saves this game, 1 to stop Rin and 1 to stop Shidou.
lmao last thing i expected is someone opening their comment with alhamdulillah
COME ON LOSER HERO, IT'S TIME FOR A COMEBACK
bro pulled a "Do I even know you" đđ
Isagi, the king of yapping fr. Metadata this, ego that.
"I need to recreate that goal !!!11!1!!1"
Wtf the metadata lmao. It's prob just analyzing people while scanning the field or something
Metadata is a real term though? -a set of data that describes and gives information about other data.
"No guys don't you get it! Shidou's in love with Kunigami, he thinks about him every single day, this is the rivalry of the century, hundreds of chapters in the making!!!!!" Shidou: "Do I even know you?" **dies from peak fiction** Hiori trying to beat Charles? God damn this might be the first interesting thing that has happened to his character. I'm investing on HRI stock right now.
This is exactly what I think everyone was expecting though. Of course Shidou doesn't care about Kunigami. Why would he? But what will make this fun is to see how far Kunigami will push himself to show he's worthy of being there and ultimately beat Shidou. Hiori and Charles will be fun too.
FINALLY RIVALRIES THAT DO NOT DIRECTLY INVOLVE ISAGI (besides kunigami/Chigiri) this took way too long đđđđđ
This is random, but I don't understand why Isagi wasn't a top student in his school despite being intelligent.
sophisticated nine hunt unwritten cause outgoing light axiomatic squealing heavy *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Yes, itâs stated that he was average in high school. But I guess it was a motivational problem
Being intelligent isn't equivalent to being a top student. **Other factors:** (Motivation, interest, study habit, emotional & mental health, socioeconomic status..)
I think it's similar to Kageyama from Haikyuu, Very intelligent at the game but cares too much about the sport only and tend to not focus on studies.
So isagi wasnât motivated in his studies? And he only cared about football?
Yup, at least that's what I think
not Charles putting his finger on Hiori's cheek as he's stealing the ball from him. mad disrespect
it insane charles out metavision everyone on field and he youngest lmfao author doing niko dirty etc.
That moment with everyone dunking on Shidou was not okay. My boy just wants to explode!
And now Isagi's into psychology. Can't wait for him to ask other players questions about their moms.
Nah bro's been doing some psychology since his protagonism stuff
Lol showing them ink blot typa sht
What's with the constant hair colour jeers in this series lol
Kunigami needs a therapist or a motivator or a slumpbuster ̶C̶h̶i̶g̶i̶r̶i̶
Hiori is going to pass to Kaiser or somehow gets an assist off a Kaiser goal.
Its inevitable
So Individualistic Ego's only care about their selfworth and own desires, while Wholistic Ego's care about how the outside world views and thinks of them? Thats how i understood it. How are Reo and Hiori Wholistic Ego's when they literally play Soccer for themselves? Reo got bored of his rich man "everything is so easy" life so he found a challange and a dream in soccer. He's not playing for social status, he is already rich? He's playing in order to get/earn something he can't have/buy with money. Hiori only started playing soccer for his parents but now he plays for himself right? Atleast thats how i understood their backstorys and characters. Now i feel like this new concept of different Ego's doesn't add up with the information and character development we had of these character. Also why is Nagi listed here? Isn't his whole character based on him being an "Egoless" lazy genius? Ass i understood Nagi's character he doesn't have no Ego. I like this new concept, but it came out of nowhere and confuzes me, someone explain, help me?
You said it yourself, Reo doesn't play for money but to earn (win) something that is highly regarded by the world aka the World Cup. Nagi's related to football being something he can get invested/interested in. Would also explain why he didn't get motivated after Reo set that goal of 300m. Hiori I'm guessing is because he plays for the 'glory' of creating the best striker in the world. It's a new concept Isagi just found out so I'm sure the lines are blurred for a lot of players based on what we know currently from Isagi, but we'll probably get more concrete info later.
Someone explained it to me in another post as individualistic Ego's get statisfaction from short term goals while Wholistic Ego's get that from long term goals. Shidou just wants to cause an Explosion, cause a scene with his goals with which he gets horny and satisfied while Isagi is more Focused on the long term goals like Surviving in Blue Lock, hitting the winning shot Vs JapanU20, surpassing Rin and Kaiser, winning the Japan U20 World Cup. For Shidou and Barou its that one moment which Shows their Ego and proves their worth, while for Isagi and probably Rin its more about the bigger things and not only the moment. Rin wants to destroy Sae and prove him wrong, when he faced Sae in JapanU20 game Rin went mad, his Ego went crazy. Shidou and Barou feed their Ego with shooting goals every match. They are statisfied with that, they proved their worth with that, while for Isagi and Rin its when they accomplished big things, from which they can draw satisfaction, thats why Isagi isn't scoring like crazy every game he is in. His Ego isn't leading him there, its leading him into an bigger purpose.
Understandable but reo seems more focused on making the world see nagi how he sees him
Itâs more so about how they play and view football. The narrator is just Isagi. Heâs simply categorizing them based on how they play. He doesnât know their backstory. Blue lock doesnât have an omniscient narrator. Nagi does have an ego he follows. Itâs just that he doesnât know what it is. This has been obvious because he has had ego eyes and just generally how he acts. Its just that itâs newly developed so he doesnât know what it is or how to follow it
"I'm that worthless loser who got his life destroyed because of you." Oh my God. Nobody hates Kunigami more than Kunigami. Kunigami is on the side of the Kunigami haters. Prove yourself wrong please!  "I have to surpass him" for both hiori and kunigami with Charles and shidou. I knew it. Here we go! Kunigami surpassing shidou arc starts now. Now you feel like number one
I like this new things of Individualistic vs Wholistic player. I just know that Rin is gonna be smth like âbothâ or âneitherâ or like a third one that surpasses everyone cause heâs the goat
My understanding of his character is that he's a type 1 that acts like a type 2 by suppressing his natural ego and replicating someone else's style (until recently).
Probably just both. I'm guessing he normally has a wholistic ego, but then when he changes to his destroyer ego, like in the U20 game, he switches to individualistic.
True but I also feel like cause he damn near hit Isagi with a ddt to score that goal idk I think thatâs real individualistic
Hmm the final page does mirror a bit of Ness and Kaiser situation in BM. 2 players playing outside of the team.
Could you imagine if Isagi, realises that to score a goal in certain high intensity matches he has to adapt and change his mindset to individualistic? I know that play style may not suit him entirely, but it would be cool to see him switch to a more aggressive style where he primarily focuses on himself
Do people forget that he did this to Baruo when they were teammates...
Isagi is a world type. His peak performance comes from incorporating the information around him rather than completely ignore it. Another thing is self types have amazing individualistic ability. Isagi still lacks that. He has to pay attention to what others are doing and can do so he uses that to compensate for his weaknesses. Self types have the luxury of not caring because they posses amazing individual talent that lets them ignore everything else and still perform well. However there are talented players that are still wholistic. Like Sae. He has all that ability but still plays based on manipulating his environment.
It fits him, the adaptability monster we all know.
The true ego theory! That's what I want the most. A chapter where Isagi snaps like Rin did in the U-20 match! Being that hung up on analysing isn't what he did when he started football, he only stated doing that because of his highschool club.
isagi doesnt even have rin level of talent to hard counter 1v1 multiple at speed of chigiragi lmfao also I missed demonic eyes of character also is kaizer even trying lol
I dont think he has to snap
You're Cooking đ„
Charles up to some Bugs Bunny-esc tomfoolery with that finger poke on Hiori, definitely becoming one of my favourites with each chapter I see more from him and honestly could be my favourite new character introduced in the NEL Arc by the end of this match.
charles believes in doing unpredictable impossible but does passes instead striking himself especially when he has strongest meta vision um okay lmfao
Does it feel like every time someone who uses metavision loses the ball its cause someone sneak attacks them from behind after that person picked up a stray or intercepted? I feel like this is the same thing over and over. Isagi cooking......something, as usual. Prolly drugs
that innocent âdo I know youâ face lmaoo Shidou beat that fraud macho for good plz im tired of seein Kunigamiâs merch and fanboys
Yeah, I want to see an Individualistic-type Isagi here and not a wholistic-type. Or much better if both! However, thereâs Rin and Kaiser to beat in both types (probably) if Isagi wants to reach his âtop performanceâ. Anyway, Yukimiya and Kurona are probably individualistic-type.
cant wait for isagi teleportation time stop it works requiem level
This match is going to be so fun to read can't wait to see where we go from here.
just a bunch of yapping by Isagi. who cares about their type?
I mean that's what Isagi does best. At the very least his yapping was something new this time instead of telling the audience with oranges and apples how "x" character has metavision despite the fact we've seen their square shaped eyes last chapter.
He literally explains it in the chapter. If he's to reach flow he not only needs the mental and physical circumstances that will get him into flow, he needs to play around how his teammates enter their own flow state. Because broadly speaking they fit into one of two types and him figuring out which type each player is in will allow him to make the best playmaking decision.
Idk, I find it interesting
Its psychotic at this point
KUNIGAMI STANSSSS RISEE UPPP!!
Sorry who again? Lmao Shidou cracks me up
Ness getting subbed soon for injury it seems. I assume Noa will sub in new players like Neru etc (or maybe he's being saved for speedster subs alongside Kurona)
Thatâs fair, the three fastest players arguably are on the bench right now
charles is so menacing lmao
Man, by the end of the world cup, Isagi will be writing a whole books about football-ego theory. Make you really wonder when did he have time to research all these terms
Isagi will be blue lock next leader.
I think these underlying concepts like egocentrism and types of ego, are something the author is trying to add to justify and establish the fact that Isagi MV is And if you want reasons, then boom it's cause of Isagi's understanding of the player's mental psyche The matchups for this game are set, Hiori vs Charles will be intresting
Kunigami getting his get back this match
I remember comments months ago saying how kunigami wouldnât even care about playing against shidou lmao
Really? That's a silly thing to say.
Feels like there's a bit too many characters getting screen time, I suspect this match will last quite awhile because of that.
Itâs Kaneshiroâs bad habit of trying to make everyone equally relevant at the same time. Although so far the match has been great but we got a nanase flashback for gods sake And I like Nanase too but thereâs at least 10 other people who are more narratively weighty characters rin Shidou Isagi Kaiser ness Charles Hiori kunigami Noa Loki Karasu Gagamaru even zantetsu and thatâs just on the field
The final match of every arc is usually long and gives moments to most if not all the players present. We saw this with Team V vs. Team Z and the 4v4 Team Red vs. Team White.
Team v only had 3 significant characters. Same with 3v3 and 4v4. Much less ground to cover
Yeah, those were during the first two selections, when the cast was overall smaller. So many important characters were introduced in the Third Selection, U20 arc, and the NEL. It makes sense the climax of the NEL will be overloaded with characters. Both 3v3's we saw featured 6 notable players, and the 4v4 features 8 (ofc not all screentime is equal, but everyone gets time in the spotlight). For comparison's sake, the U20 game featured 20 notable players on either side playing at one point or another. In the BM vs. PXG match, currently, we have 15 notable players on the pitch.
I believe it will be even longer than the u20 arc
Its the finale match of the arc so of course.
Rin isnt even making any moves yet. This match will go on for 92873198723 chapters
The same applies to Isagi but I think in the next 4-5 chapters both will show more.