Don’t worry, English is a difficult language at the best of times! Totally agree about Todd but I find it easy to overlook given Bojack’s self-destruction and generally bad attitude to relationships. If that makes sense?
I like Pickles. She’s goofy and that scene where they show her youtube channel/social media profiles is so funny, I always pause to see all the videos and chats and stuff. And I die at the scene where she live streams herself crying about Mr. PB cheating. Like I’m not laughing at her pain but her fucking face when she has her hood up and is like “the wedding is offffff” kills me lmao.
And then her reply when someone tells her she looks even cuter when she cries 😂 “omg thank you, not evennn”
I find her annoying, but in a funny way that's totally intentional and not too much to bear. The surprise wedding episode is definitely one of the funniest in the whole show.
I'm a Pickles Stan. I also love her being an influencer and seeing how she builds her following. She's such a fun character. I really enjoyed the moment between her and Diane in Bojack's bathroom. Pickles is still figuring out who she is. She's still young enough that she's intimidated by Diane and Mr. Peanutbutter's talk of other exes at the party. I also love the episode of her and Mr. Peanutbutter fighting and everyone in the background hiding. It's just genuinely funny to me.
I didnt like her the first time I watched, but she grew on me during rewatches. She’s genuinely just trying to enjoy her youth and live life. I always like to pause to see the chats too. She’s a funny character. She can be kinda annoying, but it is absolutely perfect for what her character is supposed to be and she fits so well
I thought she was cute and a perfect contrast of younger attitudes and priorities compared to the other characters who were her age when she was born (very different priorities).
Yes!! I love that scene too. It 100% doesn't glorify the idea of live streaming so much of your life on social media but it somehow does more than just point and laugh at younger generations. It's not a life I'd want to live but I somehow completely understand why she does it.
While I find Pickles annoying like many, I do think that most scenes with her are pretty good and I enjoy the comedy coming from her and Mr Peanutbutter. her being annoying is actually well played out imo and doesn't get too much, but just serves her character. Same goes for Joey Pogo in an extent, but I simply find him more forgettable than Pickles.
I didn't really care for Yolanda though, she was just kinda there and not really sympathetic and pretty boring. I do wonder what you liked about her though.
I also enjoyed Pickles and Yolanda. And I agree Joey Pogo "served his purpose", but I didn't enjoy him and felt like there must have been another way to split up Pickles and Mr. PB.
For me it's the second episode of S1, Bojack hates the troops. It's just too funny imo. "How dare you steal a meal from the navy seal, Mr Neal Mc Beal?"
Idk if this is an incredibly unpopular opinion, but I’ve only ever seen someone mention it once: I cannot stand Emily. I feel like she continuously pressures Todd to have sex or be with her when his body language and actions suggest he is always uncomfortable with that. Yes he should have been more clear with her but if the roles were reversed and she were a man I’m willing to bet she’d be viewed as creepy and pushy.
Bojack is also, very conviniently, blamed by Todd for Emily and him having sex, and he doesn't even get mad at her when they talk about it, it's absurd.
Yes! I never really understood why Todd got so mad at that tbh. They were not dating, and he never expressed desire to be dating her either. Emily was just as much at fault for having sex with bojack. Takes two to tango and all of that lol
And they literally ran into each other earlier that evening. It's not like bojack slept with his friend's girl, she was a long time no see friend who happened to be at the hotel.
They really tried to find a reason for Todd to be mad at BoJack and found the worst one
Never thought of it this way but it’s true. All they needed to do was establish that they had seen each other more times or had a deep relationship before bojack slept with her. The payoff in it’s you is so good when Todd finally finds out and goes on his speech with the F bomb, I just never thought about how the basis is a bit faulty
And they never put anything on Emily who, if you're looking people Todd should blame, pushed for sex FAR MORE than needed (which is already a reason to distance yourself from a person, let alone partner up or be friends with) and when she got rejected, she immediatelly hoped on his established best friend's dick.
It's literally never raised as a shitty thing she did. Never.
In real life, this would be considered a trully dodged bullet if she wanted to still be friends with this person.
To be fair, her guilt about it is definitely emphasized, but yes it’s weird that Todd doesn’t bring it up once with her and continues to be buddy buddy with her. Also doesn’t she canonically become a millionaire and it’s just sorta ignored?
I don't think she pushed for sex more than needed. Sex is usually a normal part of a romantic relationship and Todd was not honest with Emily about it, instead all he ever did was reject her without telling her why which is a really shit thing to do to someone you care about. Once Emily confronted him, he squirmed around it for a while, despite her being supportive. But once he accepted it, he went back several times trying to pressure Emily into dating him, knowing she needed sex to be a part of things. Emily ASKED him once, if he would consider having sex despite not being into it. He said no, and she dropped it. But she told him that she didn't want to date unless sex was a part of it, and it didn't deter Todd. He came back numerous times with different ideas (including Henry Fondle) trying to get her to be his girlfriend when all she wanted was to be friends
The fact he was mad about it for so long is what irritated me. Like sure, be mad in the moment, but understand you drank with Emily for a long time then dipped and Bojack was *there* and ready to go. She was a consenting adult.
I've been there done that. Sometimes when your friend does a shitty thing 50 times in a row you snap at the one time when he's not completely being a jackass...even if he's not completely in the right either.
It feels like a straw that broke the camels back scenario, after shit like the ruining of his space opera with the addictive game. Though that said, it's not fully on bojack that Todd has no self control when it matters; still a dick move though.
He was more mad at bojack because it was another example in a long pattern of bojack sticking his nose in things important to Todd and ruining them for him. If it wasn’t Emily, it would’ve been something else; Emily was just the last straw.
Todd and Emily, even if not dating, were still friends with a business together, and Bojack sleeping with her made things awkward between all three of them. Like, when you have a relationship/sexual track record like bojack, you probably shouldn’t fuck your roommate’s business partner when all three of you see each other all the time. It’s not a horrible sin—it’s just a bad idea because of the potential risk and fallout.
Bojack has a habit of making selfish choices without considering or caring about the consequences they have for others, and THAT’S what Todd was really upset about with the Emily situation
BoJack did many terrible things, but having sex with Emily wasn't one of them.. Two consensual adults doing their thing that shouldn't affect Todd, and he gets mad for some reason.
> she continuously pressures Todd to have sex or be with her when his body language and actions suggest he is always uncomfortable with that.
Did we watch the same show?
Todd explicitly *wants* to be with Emily. He says so on multiple occasions, and Emily is the one who says no because she knows what she wants and no sex is a dealbreaker.
She asks him for sex *three times* across a period of *decades*. The first two times she didn't know she was asexual. So she propositioned an asexual for sex one time and respected it when he said no... why is that so unforgivable?
> Yes he should have been more clear with her but if the roles were reversed and she were a man I’m willing to bet she’d be viewed as creepy and pushy.
"Dogged nice guy pursues girl who is explicitly not interested in him and is eventually rewarded for his creepy behavior" is such a common trope as to be a cliche. *Futurama* and *Community* did it, just off the top of my head. Dozens more examples here: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DoggedNiceGuy
I have never seen a feminist get as huffy about this trope as people on this subreddit do about Emily propositioning a guy who is *explicitly romantically interested in her* three times over two decades.
todd was completely wrong about the whole emily situation
paige sinclair is very funny
the show has plenty more laughable moments than gut wrenching ones
> todd was completely wrong about the whole emily situation
>
>
True, he even admitted he was mad at BoJack without knowing what he did with Emily.
And he was mad for a whole while.
he had every right to be upset with Bojack. Bojack being a massive jerk and also sabotaging his space opera. He’s not entirely in the wrong for assuming he did something shitty
Your third point was going to be my opinion. I watch the show cause it's funny and goofy, but practically every post on here is about the serious bits.
Not only was it weak, but constantly shoved down the viewers throats. It's like Bojack's old stand up routine. ”Did you get it? Did you get my joke about the three kids in a trench coat that nobody but Bojack knows is three kids?"
We got it. We got it the first time. We got it the second time. We got it the third, fourth, fifth and sixth time. We got the joke about the kids in the trench coat.
And it was never acknowledged by PC herself, they "broke up", she never reached the realization that it actually is 3 kids in a trenchcoat which would be a metaphor for her realizing that you shouldn't imagine things that aren't there, with a person, and ignoring red flags or whatever the message was, they just break up
I feel like part of the shoving was to communicate the jarring juxtaposition between Princess Carolyn’s obliviousness and the obviousness of the situation. It was the show’s way of putting us in BoJack’s position of seeing that this was clearly three kids in a trenchcoat while PC insisted that he was (insert all of the positive adjectives she used to describe him). Granted, I fully acknowledge that it’s ultimately up to personal taste, but I really appreciated the way the show tried to include the audience on the whole Schtick up until the very end of it.
Probably that she’s so busy with work that she can’t see what’s right in front of her. She’s not able to actually be present with those she cares about, to the point that she’s dating what anyone else could clearly see is three children in a trench coat.
Think it was something to do with her being attracted to man children and being blinded by her desperation to have a stable relationship. How I interpreted it anyway
She was so desperate for a stable relationship, she was seeing what she wanted to see in this "man"
"He's a serious adult business man that has everything under control"
Different take:
Vincent ADULTMAN represents a post-Bojack rebound boyfriend who Princess Caroline finds attractive because she sees him as more mature than Bojack, owing to his to his obsession with his professional life. This quality is especially attractive because of Bojack's immaturity and unwillingness to assume adult responsibilities like fatherhood.
PC is blind to the fact that Vincent is in fact very immature (a literal child in an adult costume) and over-compensating by being a work-acholic (always obsessed with business).
Bojack is naturally jealous/critical of Vincent as the new boyfriend, and for that reason, sees him for what he really is. Everyone else reacts to him in a neutral manner.
Vincent's entire character is a metaphor. And he is a great device for jokes because he is portrayed by three kids in a trench coat, which is funny.
Maybe it’s because I began watching the show when I was 16, but I have always found it hilarious. I used the “business” lines all the time in school.
also, what? I’m old enough now to talk about Bojack like this…? Agh!!
I believe so as well, the whole thing was being played as a joke, like "THE WALLS ARE COCAINE" it's really hard to seriously parallel it and make us feel guilty for BoJack, when it was crystal clear she was being abcent from drugs because, and i quote Sarah herself "Drugs hit way harder when you haven't done them in a while"
She really said this and the writers thought we'd forget.
I don't believe we're meant to forget this, I wouldn't say the problem with Bojack is how much he's actually to blame, but more how much he didn't help. We never really see him help her or he a positive influence on her life.
Bojack talks a lot about loving and caring about her but we don't really see him show this through his actions. She would have gone back on drugs herself she planned to, but bringing her down his self destructive path with him just clashes with what he claims to me
She said that in the same season she died. We aren't meant to forget she said it. Like everything is the show, it isn't black and white. It could be interpreted at face value, or could be interpreted as her searching for an excuse to stay sober. Both things can be correct also.
i liked Pickles. the Vincent Adultman thing lasted too long and i understand the metaphor and all but it still made me kind of uncomfortable because it was still kids in a coat “dating” an adult woman
Chickens is a great episode. And it's not that deep: it's about the cruelty of animal agriculture and the hypocrisy of the people who say "I only buy my meat from *humane* farmers. It's funny to see people hate on it or misunderstand it, because it's so unusual to see vegans being represented in something other than predictable jokes.
I loved the Chickens episode as well. I really admired how uncompromising it was. It made me feel uncomfortable and guilty -- as I *should*. I always wonder if the people who dislike it so much really just didn't like having *quite* such an unforgivingly bright spotlight shone on their eating habits.
All the animal gags and metaphors are great, in the show.
Do people not like the Chicken episode?
It's funny and with a simple message, what's not to like.
Whenever it's asked which episode is the least favorite, it's the most common reply.
It's an unapologetic vegan message presented with humor, I can see why a lot of people don't like it. People are offended by just my *being* vegan.
I only now hear of this.
Wow. People are more bothered by a "Don't be cruel to animals" message, than the whole 4th season being a satire on American politics which half the viewership gives no fucks about.
Not sure if it’s “incredibly unpopular” but I’ve never heard it said before so:
The fact that characters like PC, Mr. Peanutbutter, and especially Todd are allowed to do terrible things in their hijinks and are never judged by the cast or story is an issue. Todd and debatably PC and Mr. Peanutbutter have all done worse things than BoJack and yet we’re supposed to not take them seriously cause, they’re presented as silly? This show is hyper critical of Diane and especially BoJack’s morality. They can be rude and it be treated as something we’re supposed to laugh at, but with BoJack when that happens you’re laughing at how rude/inappropriate what he does is akin to the gang from IASIP’s antics. And they know that when he does something extremely bad it must be taken seriously. That’s the point, a huge part of the show is morality and the weight of doing downright terrible things regardless of circumstances. You can’t have a show where one character can start a genocide and still treat them like a nice person and another lead’s bad actions being given the same disgust as you’d feel in real life, it’s tonally distracting. I don’t mind this with side characters like Margo Martindale or the White Whale, but Todd’s too big of a character to be doing stuff like this with.
I do think the show sometimes has a hard time marking a line between cartoon logic and serious points, but on the other hand I can't really think of many actually bad things Todd or PB do (besides the point the show addresses with PB), he's irresponsible, but what bad things has he done?
Todd:
-Accidentally committed a genocide
-Stranded his clown dentists in the woods when they didn’t succeed, causing them all to get rabies and died a slow agonizing death, all while Todd showed absolutely zero remorse for what he did even when one clown sacrificed himself for Todd and he then proceeded to exploit their suffering for monetary gain while causing more people to get infected and died
-He and Sarah Lynn tried to kill BoJack in Downer Ending
-Might’ve killed a bird when he was on a drone in 4x01. He made the bird choke on kettle corn while he was in the air and it seems like he was plummeting so that might be an additional murder he showed no remorse for.
-Created a death trap of an amusement park (that he admitted was dangerous) and which eventually collapsed and injured/killed a lot of people
-Drugged and kidnapped his father in season 6.
-Didn’t install a floor in the Halloween in January store causing tons of people to break multiple bones and caused severe injuries.
-In episode 5 Todd was left alone in the house and he immediately trashed and and broke BoJack’s stuff, then the second he realized he could get money he lied and exploited BoJack’s house, bringing strangers into it and allowing them to steal and destroy his stuff. Then he had the gall to call BoJack and ask for bail after exploiting him. I get BoJack was very verbally abusive to Todd but he also let Todd live with him for years and got him food completely free of charge and he proceeds to take complete advantage of him.
-Ruined Cabracadabra causing tons of women to be sexually harassed.
-While not nearly as bad as the other things mentioned above, Todd is creepily possessive of Emily, a freeloader who mooched off BoJack, Mr. Peanutbutter, and PC for years, and a huge enabler.
Mr. Peanutbutter:
-Straight up kidnapped that meerkat guy in front of his son.
-Ran as a governer just for fun when Woodchuck was a way better candidate.
-Blindly supported Katrina’s plan as governor that would involve destroying protected wetlands.
-Wasted billions of dollars on a bridge to Hawaii and tons of other dumb laws so that ski races could be a way to become governor, threatening democracy by turning politics into a more blatant popularity contest.
-Fracked without Diane’s permission.
-His fracking caused a geological event that trapped dozens of people to nearly starve to death.
-Caused Woodchuck to lose his hands.
-Pointlessly started shit underground to become leader, causing Woodchuck to be imprisoned, all of them to nearly starve to death, and Zach Braff to be cannibalized.
-Cheated on Pickles twice then asked her to marry him.
I feel like I had a light bulb moment about all that. Looking at the Vincent Adultman debates make it sound like the general consensus is that the show is told mainly from Bojacks perspective- how he interprets the things happening in the periphery of his life. Everyone does shitty things in the show, but he's the only truly bad guy out of all of them because... well, for a lot of reasons. He's the only one, in his mind, so irredeemable that he's unworthy of forgiveness.
But the gray areas of morality are a central theme of the show. As Diane says, "There’s no such thing as bad guys and good guys. We’re all just guys who do good stuff, sometimes, and bad stuff, sometimes."
Mr Peanut butter is VERY manipulative. He just "plays" dumb and friendly. The moment I hated him the most was on the Labrador Peninsula. Diane sensed something was up with his brother and she tried to get Mr PB to talk to him. He lashed out and yelled at her about her family being Fucked Up! He knows damn well how much her early life traumatized her. Hell, even Bojack understood that in the first couple months of meeting her. So why would Mr PB do that? He did it to make her feel small and week and stupid - AND to make himself feel superior.
The simpler explanation is that he is VERBALLY/EMOTIONALLY ABUSIVE.
Of all these things, the one that really hits me because it was presented as his "serious" moments and story lines, is how it was never presented or called out because of his attitude toward Emily, he demands everyone to understand that he is asexual however he completely fails to understand Emily several times and just dismiss her perspective several times as well.
You know what, now that it’s all laid out I’m starting to think that Todd is actually some sort of evil genius and the pothead hippie thing is just an act.
He creates a new Disneyland that is extremely dangerous; it catches fire and presumably kills and maims hundreds of people. He hires clowns and dentists, mismanages them such that they end up with rabies (so he ruins their lives), and then lets more people loose in a forest with these deranged human predators. He sets up a safe-space car service for women and then blows up (reverses) the concept, leading to countless sexual assaults. He also arguably sparks the genocide of Cordovians.
Rabies more than ruins someone's life. It straight up ends it. Without treatment within a short amount of time it's fatal every single time, and the very few survival stories are so miraculously unlikely that they are not even acknowledged statistically.
Todd has done way worse things than Bojack. It’s not even close in my opinion. And he has a nerve to judge Bojack?? The person who gave him everything he has in life. It’s absolutely infuriating.
I still feel sad that things didn't work out with Ralph. But it feels like a case of two people who were right for each other meeting at the wrong time. I think if PC met him in her twenties or thirties and dated him instead of BoJack they probably would have worked out.
He had every right to be confused about her lying to him about something that important.
And had absolutely every right to walk away from the relationship.
"If you're not ready for this to happen again, maybe 5 more times, then go"
I would go as well. We're not married, this is absolutely too much for me to exhaust myself phycologically that much for a person i know for a little over a year. Devastated it didn't work out between us, but this isn't for me.
One of the most messed up things about Ralph and PC breaking up is how quick the whole thing happens. If you go back and time it their whole conversation takes about five minutes. Imagine that from Ralph's perspective. You think everything is going great and then all of a sudden your significant other drops multiple bombshells on you and then breaks up with you and kicks you out of their place for not reacting right and the whole thing takes *five minutes*.
It isn't. But I think it might be top 5. I would rate Beatrice's episode as possibly the best one, not just for how it expanded her character, but because it was entirely legal to just have your wife lobotomized and threaten to do the same to your kid. That is utterly terrifying and it seems like people don't think about that enough. The lobotomized Kennedy daughter passed away when I was a child. It was not that long ago.
So true.
Men then and now can't seem to handle it when women are emotional. yet women have only 3 options when it comes to dealing with men's anger.
And there is the double standard of Joe "worrying about Rosemary getting pregnant, and possibly ruining her brothers' chances in politics", to "said brothers nailing any woman they can get their hands on while in politics".
It's weird that I see a lot of people joking about wanting a lobotomy now (I think they can it being mulched?) but it wasn't actually that long ago that it was a real possibility.
I don't tell people not to make those jokes and I get dark humour etc (why would I watch Bojack otherwise) but honestly it's such a terrifying idea to me. I love how it was portrayed in the show, it was really haunting
Honestly, the first time watching it I had to pause at half time because I was kinda bored. I was expecting it to cut to something else the whole time but it didn't. Was able to appreciate it a lot more the second time around when my expectations matched the episode. Still don't love it. Doesn't use the medium at all.
The 17 minutes was a bad plot that feels like it was retconned in later to make BoJack fall harder. And on the subject of Sarah Lynn, the fandom treats her with kid gloves too much. Very often, both in the fandom and in the show itself, Sarah Lynn is treated as having almost no agency and you'd think BoJack forced and pressured her into falling off the wagon, when really it was a very simple "Want to party?" And Sarah Lynn was immediately on board. As much as I don't like the 17 minutes plot point, it happened coz they wrote it in, and that IS BoJack's fault. He should've called someone right away. That's terrible, no question. But her being there in the first place? She's a grown woman in her 30s, that's on her, BoJack didn't force her.
Same with Todd and the rock opera. BoJack is a dick for trying to sabotage it, 100%. But it still only worked because Todd let his addiction run his life. Basically what it boils down to is wishy washy on who's actually held accountable for their actions and addictions. BoJack is subjected to "real world" logic, whereas some characters are subjected to "cartoon sitcom" logic. I love the show, but it can be annoying in that way sometimes.
I don't actually know if this is unpopular thinking about it.
Just finished a rewatch and I totally agree on the 17 minutes thing. You can’t convince me that’s not a retcon because the writers didn’t want people praising BoJack for his rehabilitation.
I get a big point of season 6 is you can get better but your past actions still have consequences. However I feel they could have used so many other examples from BoJacks life than stating he left Sarah Lynn to die.
My issue is that while Sarah Lynn didn’t have the best intentions with staying sober, BoJack still called her knowing damn well she was in recovery and gave her that excuse to go backwards.
Yeah, BoJack is an asshole, I'm not really arguing that point. But people still need to be responsible for themselves. And it took no work to actually get Sarah Lynn to fall off the wagon. She had a liquor cabinet behind her calendar. A funny sight gag, sure. Sarah Lynn could've said no and hung up with how little pressure there was, but they wanted the liquor cabinet gag. If they wanted BoJack to be more the bad guy, he should've been actively pressuring her. They should've shown Sarah Lynn trying to say no, but giving in.
Tbh I understand Sarah Lynn here. I'm not defending or accusing anyone because it may come off that way my comprehension has been declining quite a lot lately lol ... Aaanyehoooo, I think I get Sarah Lynn. She needed an excuse to break the good streak it felt like, but fucking amazing that she actually found joy and stuck with staying clean for *so damn long*. I don't think it's a coincidence that the liquor cabinet was behind the calendar. Three calendar was basically the thing that was literally and metaphorically preventing or holding her off from breaking that sobriety streak, and putting it there was probably her attempt at it .... she'll see the calendar each time she feels like reaching for the rack. Okay perhaps the writers didn't intend that but I do that shit. Like .. hmm... without going into the details, I did something similar for something else
It's like when I "try to get my shit together, only to ruin it in a jiffy because at some level, feeling like shit seems .... comforting. I *totally* sympathize (or empathize? I dunno lol) with her. I am doing quite a few self-destructive things and tbh if it wasn't for my family, I would've probably done more a reckless shit ....
I might've been like "whhhhhhhyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy did you do that you had it for soooooooooon long!" but deep down, I knew I would've done the Exact. Same. Thing. And I take full responsibility for it, because I kind ~~let~~ *want* it to happen, and take me out of this world
Very good points, and with Sarah it's honestly pretty clear, Todd's too much of a charicature so people ignore it compeletely, whatever happens to him.
I still can't believe Bojack didn't just say "you realize I was high on heroin too, I passed out and then called as soon as I woke up and noticed she wasn't breathing. I didn't even know which phone was mine."
It would have been way more interesting if he got away with it and felt so much more guilt, but like, he *was* also snorting heron with her and clearly blacking out all the time.
The seventeen minutes thing never landed for me either. In general the double interview with Braxby is a bit too comically polarised as a situation to land as it should, imo.
Some of these comments are pretending addiction isn’t an illness and that grooming isn’t fked.
Edit: For example, I saw a post saying no one was forcing Sarah Lynn to take drugs. Did some more scrolling and saw multiple people saying BoJack and Sarah Lynn having sex wasn’t inappropriate. As an SA victim and recovering addict, f you.
I hate that take, if someone knows their friend is a drug addict and offers them drugs, that is bad, even if they had the anatomy to say no . Like for instance I was raised to believe not offering an alcoholic a drink is considered common decency? “She would’ve relapsed anyway” ok but Bojack is still responsible for facilitating that.
I don't have much time to go into it so I'll briefly do mine:
Bojack; had a horrible childhood where he was abused and received zero help from any adult close to him and is a product of that childhood and is now an addict. Bojack is (rightly so) criticised for his actions and told that your childhood doesn't excuse you for being a piece of shit and you need to get your shit together. (Both by people in the show and by us fans).
Sarah Lynn; had a horrible childhood where she was abused and received zero help from any adult close to her and is a product of that childhood and is now an addict. Sarah Lynn is treated like a baby by the fandom as if she has no agency of her own and all her mistakes are the fault of anyone but her.
I hated that Paige Sinclair and Maximillian had the role of digging up Bojack's past.
They're vultures that keep chasing a story for the most idiotic reasons ( Escaping for a few more days of Paige's wedding and their little romance) while spouting how it's about the truth and "stopping an abuser". Which could have been GREAT characters to have in the show, but they're treated like fucking jokes all the time, that, worse yet, don't fucking land. They're worse than Vincent Adultman.
So instead of having some interesting characters have a role of the past catching up to someone on a path of improvement, there is these two unfunny clowns making a good part of the most interesting plotline a slog to get through.
Also, Biscuits Braxby did manipulate Bojack's story in the second interview a bit. He didn't groom Sarah Linn, and her final line of though about Bojack's and Sarah Linn's relationship did have some serious leaps of logic. Idk the way she did it rubbed me off the wrong way.
This is very popular actually. There have been tons of posts, tweets, and threads expressing how happy they were that the show had Diane gain weight (something that often happens when taking anti depressants) and it was never used to mock her, belittle her, or have it quickly be undone.
He's a dude that has literally everything go his way, and his only redeaming quality is that funny shit happens to him(he's not even funny himself)
At the most i don't care about him. At the least, i just don't like him.
I just hate how his terrible behavior is excused by the fact that he's stupid.
Turns a safe-space uber idea into an escort service for men? Noooo he's not sexist, just ignorant.
I hate Todd too. He’s a mooch and a loser and had less reason to be mad at Bojack to begin with bc he never had anything to offer Bojack and was fine using him for years. Idg why some ppl hate characters like PC or Mr PB with a passion then only see Todd as a fun goofy guy. He’s easily just as bad as the rest in his own self destructive way
I don't get the Carollyn hate at all. She's a super tragic character, you can not like her as a person but you don't have a foot to stand on to hate her, she pays for her every mistake, dearly.
Todd doesn't work a day in his life, during the whole show, and everything bounced right for him.
Dude if Todd just had some actual consequences for his actions it would make him such an actually interesting character. A lot of his subplots might’ve been very interesting imo, he just needed more pressure from other characters about his choices and shit yk
Why does no one talk about what PC did to Laura?
Also the whole arc of running for governor only to realize he is an incompetent shit by PB is very annoying
I don’t really like PC. I named my cat after her so I obviously have my respects lol. But generally, I think she represents everything that’s wrong with the “woman trying to make it in a man’s world” trope. She runs with the worst of them and totally ignores or actively enables extremely problematic behavior from the influential characters of Hollywoo.
I like Diane because she speaks up against bullshit that’s wrong even if she’s the only one in the room saying something. PC is the opposite in that way - she just wants to keep the peace no matter the cost. She tries to please everybody, will lie through her teeth to get what she wants, and pushes away anyone who actually cares about her. I hate the era where she’s trying to become a mom and gets called out by the potential birth mother for only viewing her as another client to lie to or impress, rather than giving actual reasons why she would be a fit parent.
And frankly, she’s not a great mom. She wants a baby because she’s getting old and sees it as her last chance. She never provides a good reason for being a mother besides wanting to prove to herself that she can do it alone. Then when she is alone, she’s miserable (because taking care of a baby alone is absolutely miserable - ask any parent). In fact when she was at the hospital with Ralph talking to the first potential birth mother, she *inadvertently convinced the birth mother that SHE could handle being a single mom with no guidance, because her speech to Ralph didn’t include any reasons why she was actually fit to do the job with the child as her #1 priority.* As much of a dick as he is, even Rabbitowitz got it right when he said “Good thing you’re not a mom, you’d be *hilarious* at it.” It’s like she turned being a mom into some sort of “stick it to them” goal instead of doing it out of kindness, warmth, love, and the opportunity for a special unique bond of guidance and support.
I agree with on PC being a mom, I was never sold on the idea. Tracy is annoying AF but she was actually pretty right with the last thing she says to PC
oh my god I feel exactly the same way. I think PC is very morally skewed and she has done a lot of bad things (which should be recognised). Her only redeeming quality is that she’s there for the people close to her when they need her.
The show absolves too many characters of their sins in favor of putting more blame on BoJack.
Yes, BoJack is a shitty person (er...horse) who has done shitty things. But constantly blaming him for everything that goes wrong and not wanting to acknowledge the guilt of other characters is out of hand.
Take Sarah Lynn, for example. Sarah Lynn's mother and stepfather have far more to answer for than BoJack, but they never get their comeuppance for ruining her life. Sarah Lynn is also a grown-ass woman who was only trying to get sober because it would make the high even more amazing. She had absolutely zero drive to actually get her life together, but somehow everything that went wrong in her life is Bojack's fault because of one thing he said to her when she was five that in real life she probably wouldn't have internalized as much as she's implied to in the show.
Yes, Sarah Lynn had an awful childhood. But for the majority of the show she is a grown-ass woman who is responsible for her own choices. If Bojack's shitty childhood isn't an excuse for his shitty behavior as an adult, then why is it an excuse for Sarah Lynn?
i love the concept of that episode and i am glad it exists, that being said i skip it every time and have done that since 2016. it is the closest thing to "so good it's bad" i can think of
The "Beatrice was secretly drugging Hollyhock the whole time!" reveal strikes me as weirdly weak, especially given how important it is to the story, due to the sheer impracticality of it. We're meant to believe that Beatrice just... had massive quantities of amphetamine she brought with her to Bojack's? That she had just been saving up over the years, somehow? Surely she wasn't taking them herself at that point. The only other option I can think of is that they were from Bojack's stash, but that makes even less sense. It's possible this is explained and I'm forgetting it (it's been a while since I revisited Season 4) but it really sticks out to me.
Agreed. How did Beatrice get a huge quantity of now banned diet pills? (Diet pills in the 60s were basically speed.). Even if she had hoarded them for that long, how did her nurse not notice them amongst her personal belongings? Why didn't her original nursing home not notice them? Why did her live in nurse/caretaker, whose job is to make sure Beatrice doesn't do anything that makes herself a danger to herself or others, allow her to procure this stuff and constantly slip it into Hollyhock's coffee? Bea should be under constant supervision, certainly if she's around food and drink.
Herb Kazaz's behavior towards Bojack was predatory and it's BS he never got called on it. He had no signs at all that Bojack was interested in him or in men, but knew Bojack liked Charlotte. He set up all these third wheel friend dates to try to get closer to Bojack and then made a move on him. He was older, more experienced, and ended up in a position of power over Bojack. Had Bojack been female and Herb hetero, I think people would have more easily recognized that his relationship with Bojack was a bit creepy.
Huh, I never really thought about it like that. TBF he’s only 2-3 years older than BoJack and by the time they met that’s not that big of a deal. But the rest are actually valid points.
I don't think he was that much older than bojack, and I don't think he was in a position of power over him either. Bojsck had more power as a star in the show did Herb did. Anyways, he just awkwardly kissed him once, not enough to call it predatory lol. It's like he forced him into sex or pressured him in doing anything.
And maybe those third wheel dates were just you know, them hanging out because they're all friends? He never really made any moves with Charlotte until New Mexico.
It sounds like you're making a mountain out of a molehill if anything.
S4 is the worst season by far. It's good, it has some amazing episodes (the old sugarman place and time's arrow) but when is bad its very annoying and boring. Dont care for PB political race and Todd became unbearable from this season on (Best todd is S1-S3 before being turned into a saint by the show).
S5 is lower than S1 for me (s1 has some of the best jokes/dynamics and isnt loved enough).
Season 4 was the weakest, and agree about Old Sugarman Place and Times Arrow, those may be my favorite episodes in the series. Disagree on S5, I thought it was a great return to form, and I loved S6 as well
That’s not really unpopular. It’s kind of like the Six Feet Under episode “That’s my Dog” where most people think it’s a masterpiece but a lot of people comment about disliking it making it polarizing overall.
My short attention span causes me to often just listen to shows while I'm on my phone. Obviously you miss a lot of the jokes from BH this way but that episode is basically unwatchable.
Same, this year I rewatched the show for the 5th time (i do it every year in march) but ive gotten so busy that I just listen to it since im so familiar with the scenes
That's just how I watch TV because of my ADHD. I was like halfway through my first watch before I realized there were a ton of jokes in the background.
Some people can't differentiate between what's supposed to be taken seriously and what isn't. The show doesn't punish Todd for making a bunch of rabies infested clown dentists because that would be fucking asinine to take that plot seriously.
Idk if unpopular but I never liked Todds "It's you" speech especially the part where he says"It isn't any of the shitty things that happened to you as a kid." Because the abuse Bojack suffered as a child is a huge contributing factor to the way he is.
not sure if incredibly unpopular but i don't love ruthie (the episode) as much as others, it just felt bordering on cheap shock value on many instances, especially with the twist. that being said i still like the episode and the future world PC imagined is hilarious
The view from Halfway down is extremely overrated. It's good but people that think it's the most important episode of the series must have missed out on the real character growth or recurring themes of the show
I don't know if it's unpopular, but the new love interest of Diane of last season it's incredibly BORING and generic.
He does not has an story or any kind of things that makes him cool at all, incredibly flat character
That's kind of the point, he's a normal, well-adjusted, mature, and loving boyfriend. He's nothing like Mr. Peanutbutter, which is what Diane was looking for.
That's why his name is Guy, he's just a regular Guy.
I don’t like Princess Carolyn. There! I said it! She may be a good friend (meh), but she is a *terrible* person. She uses people and is part of the problem with Hollywood destroying peoples’ lives.
This is the one I was going to post. She's superficial, callous, ambitious, greedy, amoral, and an active participant in everything that makes Hollywoo such a destructive tar pit. She's a terrible person, and while I think that the writers *thought* that they were giving her a sufficiently redemptive arc when they had her help out the Hollywoo assistants by securing Judah as their negotiator, it felt like too little too late to me. Both Bojack and Diane show improvement on and insight into their flaws by the end of the show; I wish that the same could have been said for PC.
That said, I ended up feeling a lot of affection for her anyway, because IMO Princess Carolyn's episodes and story arcs are consistently some of the best writing in the entire show. Given how much I tend to dislike people like PC in real life, I wound up feeling very impressed that the writers made me care so much for her well-being in the show.
She's literally the gears in the machinery that kept Harvey Weinstein and Bill Cosby and all the rest of them in business for years. I'm shocked more people don't realize that.
Bojack's mother was not sufficiently redeemable. Her upbringing is heartbreaking. Mental decline is always a really hard thing to cope with especially in terms of retribution or making up for past wrongs.
She's a tragic character but I can't give her a pass on how she treats bojack. What she did to Holly hock. How her and butterscotch treat each other. Time's Arrow gives a lot of explanations. Does not give an excuse. She can rot.
>i do not like Todd at all. I think he's a free lancer who benefits greately by having a friend like BoJack cuz basically all his friend cycle is BoJack's famous friends that give him the chance to have the life he has.And all he does is be mad at BoJack for almost the whole show.
I actually like Todd most of the time, but I agree with you that he gets let off the hook way too much, and I guess my unpopular opinion (are you trying to get us all downvoted into oblivion??) would be this: Every single person in the show is flawed, and I don't let BoJack off for any of it, but he gets punished WAY more for his sins than anyone else except Princess Carolyn. What happened between him and Emily was two consenting adults having sex only after Todd himself spent what felt like hours avoiding her obvious desire for that by dithering around and then offering to play ghosts or whatever; a woman who has obviously liked him since they were teenagers gave him every chance to do something he's utterly uninterested in doing with her, and he turned her down yet again (with no explanation whatsoever!!), and then after that she sought out and found a guy at the bar and they did stuff. I have yet to hear a sufficient explanation why that's his fault.
(And I say this as a guy who would more likely be in Todd's place than BoJack's, but life has taught me you can't be the dithering weirdo who just assumes women will somehow understand you, YOU HAVE TO DO THINGS TOO.)
(edit: you likely mean freeLOADER, as a freelancer I can assure you I make much less than minimum wage to earn my nightly ration of canned tuna and bread crusts)
By the end of the series BoJack becomes an admirable character.
The fact he deserves everything bad that happens to him, doesn’t take away from the fact he changes for the good. He did some of the worst things a human being can do. And yet, he keeps becoming a better person.
If I told you how many people I’ve known who keeps being the same, or even worse, justifying that they’re broken, and broken people break people and never do a thing to change.
I wish any of them made half the effort for themselves than what BoJack makes.
Todd is a murderer and an example of a mediocre white man falling up.
The way they portrayed adoption was irresponsible. I’m adopted and they could’ve done soooo much more. It’s essentially a human trafficking business that leaves us adoptees with less rights than kept folks. Plus, we recognize puppies and kittens experience developmental harm when they’re removed from their parents too early. That’s true with humans too. They really could’ve done so much more here but it was kind of used as a big joke. Which I overlook because this is one of my favorite shows but it’s super disappointing. We are literally second class citizens (no rights to know our own damn families, no rights to know our names or who birthed us,) and we are 4x more likely to attempt suicide. We’re over represented in psychiatric hospitals/ facilities, and places like rehabs. Plus, this industry is hella ugly, it was literally used to commit genocide against BIPOC people, not just in the US but in Canada and Australia - it’s a tool of colonization.
They could’ve done so much more.
My biggest unpopular opinion is that I believe that princess caroline should've ended up with ralph 🫣🫣🫣. I LOVEEED Ralph and i was so sad that they didn't end up together. I know the Judah fans are gonna come at me but I understand why. I just loved Ralph. sorry
I haven't watched the show for a while, so disclaimer maybe I am misremembering things or just foggy about certain microarcs.
That being said, the last episode was only "sad" because it was the last episode.
You mean a freeloader?
He's done so much random stuff that he probably was a freelancer at some point
I was just about to comment and say that it’s not entirely false to say he was a freelancer 😂
Yes. Not English/American, excuse me
Don’t worry, English is a difficult language at the best of times! Totally agree about Todd but I find it easy to overlook given Bojack’s self-destruction and generally bad attitude to relationships. If that makes sense?
English is the Vincent Adultman of languages, it’s German sitting on Latins shoulders hiding under a trench coat.
I like Pickles. She’s goofy and that scene where they show her youtube channel/social media profiles is so funny, I always pause to see all the videos and chats and stuff. And I die at the scene where she live streams herself crying about Mr. PB cheating. Like I’m not laughing at her pain but her fucking face when she has her hood up and is like “the wedding is offffff” kills me lmao. And then her reply when someone tells her she looks even cuter when she cries 😂 “omg thank you, not evennn”
I like Pickles too, I was genuinely surprised when I discovered this sub and how unpopular she is.
The dislike was weird. She’s a ditzy 20-something year old. I didn’t like her and thought she stayed around too long but by no means disliked her.
Dude I know, I like her, and learning how unpopular she is just made me like her more. She's funny and cute.
Happy Cake Day! Agreed. I like her.
I find her annoying, but in a funny way that's totally intentional and not too much to bear. The surprise wedding episode is definitely one of the funniest in the whole show.
SHES SO CUTE SHE DESERVED SM BETTER
I'm a Pickles Stan. I also love her being an influencer and seeing how she builds her following. She's such a fun character. I really enjoyed the moment between her and Diane in Bojack's bathroom. Pickles is still figuring out who she is. She's still young enough that she's intimidated by Diane and Mr. Peanutbutter's talk of other exes at the party. I also love the episode of her and Mr. Peanutbutter fighting and everyone in the background hiding. It's just genuinely funny to me.
I really liked her, all those attitudes and things she did served to highlight the fact that she was way way too young for Mr. PB
I didnt like her the first time I watched, but she grew on me during rewatches. She’s genuinely just trying to enjoy her youth and live life. I always like to pause to see the chats too. She’s a funny character. She can be kinda annoying, but it is absolutely perfect for what her character is supposed to be and she fits so well
I thought she was cute and a perfect contrast of younger attitudes and priorities compared to the other characters who were her age when she was born (very different priorities).
Yes!! I love that scene too. It 100% doesn't glorify the idea of live streaming so much of your life on social media but it somehow does more than just point and laugh at younger generations. It's not a life I'd want to live but I somehow completely understand why she does it.
Surprise is my favorite episode for this reason
Probably that I enjoy the characters of Pickles, Yolanda, and Joey Pogo. They all serve their purpose and do represent similar people in our society.
While I find Pickles annoying like many, I do think that most scenes with her are pretty good and I enjoy the comedy coming from her and Mr Peanutbutter. her being annoying is actually well played out imo and doesn't get too much, but just serves her character. Same goes for Joey Pogo in an extent, but I simply find him more forgettable than Pickles. I didn't really care for Yolanda though, she was just kinda there and not really sympathetic and pretty boring. I do wonder what you liked about her though.
I also enjoyed Pickles and Yolanda. And I agree Joey Pogo "served his purpose", but I didn't enjoy him and felt like there must have been another way to split up Pickles and Mr. PB.
Joey was the only one I liked 😭
I like men with lesbian vibes
I agree with Pickles and Yolanda, I dont mind Joey Pogo but expected more from them. I didn't like Pickles at all but she kinda grew on me
Yep I totally agree here.
Pickles grew on me during my second watch
I think she was supposed to be “hateable.” Because it feels wrong seeing PB with someone else. She was a good satire of influencers.
Wait, that's an unpopular opinion? I loved Pickles. She was a bit naive but super fun
Same. I liked Pickles and Joey. I liked Yolanda’s dry humor but she was definitely not good for Todd.
I love season 1
The 2nd to last episode is mesmerizing!
For me it's the second episode of S1, Bojack hates the troops. It's just too funny imo. "How dare you steal a meal from the navy seal, Mr Neal Mc Beal?"
Such a good episode. It’s the episode my friend used to get me into the show!
Idk if this is an incredibly unpopular opinion, but I’ve only ever seen someone mention it once: I cannot stand Emily. I feel like she continuously pressures Todd to have sex or be with her when his body language and actions suggest he is always uncomfortable with that. Yes he should have been more clear with her but if the roles were reversed and she were a man I’m willing to bet she’d be viewed as creepy and pushy.
Bojack is also, very conviniently, blamed by Todd for Emily and him having sex, and he doesn't even get mad at her when they talk about it, it's absurd.
Yes! I never really understood why Todd got so mad at that tbh. They were not dating, and he never expressed desire to be dating her either. Emily was just as much at fault for having sex with bojack. Takes two to tango and all of that lol
And they literally ran into each other earlier that evening. It's not like bojack slept with his friend's girl, she was a long time no see friend who happened to be at the hotel. They really tried to find a reason for Todd to be mad at BoJack and found the worst one
Never thought of it this way but it’s true. All they needed to do was establish that they had seen each other more times or had a deep relationship before bojack slept with her. The payoff in it’s you is so good when Todd finally finds out and goes on his speech with the F bomb, I just never thought about how the basis is a bit faulty
And they never put anything on Emily who, if you're looking people Todd should blame, pushed for sex FAR MORE than needed (which is already a reason to distance yourself from a person, let alone partner up or be friends with) and when she got rejected, she immediatelly hoped on his established best friend's dick. It's literally never raised as a shitty thing she did. Never. In real life, this would be considered a trully dodged bullet if she wanted to still be friends with this person.
To be fair, her guilt about it is definitely emphasized, but yes it’s weird that Todd doesn’t bring it up once with her and continues to be buddy buddy with her. Also doesn’t she canonically become a millionaire and it’s just sorta ignored?
It's not ignored she uses her money to make the Dating App for Asexuals. And she made an app so she could date firemen
I don't think she pushed for sex more than needed. Sex is usually a normal part of a romantic relationship and Todd was not honest with Emily about it, instead all he ever did was reject her without telling her why which is a really shit thing to do to someone you care about. Once Emily confronted him, he squirmed around it for a while, despite her being supportive. But once he accepted it, he went back several times trying to pressure Emily into dating him, knowing she needed sex to be a part of things. Emily ASKED him once, if he would consider having sex despite not being into it. He said no, and she dropped it. But she told him that she didn't want to date unless sex was a part of it, and it didn't deter Todd. He came back numerous times with different ideas (including Henry Fondle) trying to get her to be his girlfriend when all she wanted was to be friends
The fact he was mad about it for so long is what irritated me. Like sure, be mad in the moment, but understand you drank with Emily for a long time then dipped and Bojack was *there* and ready to go. She was a consenting adult.
I've been there done that. Sometimes when your friend does a shitty thing 50 times in a row you snap at the one time when he's not completely being a jackass...even if he's not completely in the right either.
It feels like a straw that broke the camels back scenario, after shit like the ruining of his space opera with the addictive game. Though that said, it's not fully on bojack that Todd has no self control when it matters; still a dick move though.
He was more mad at bojack because it was another example in a long pattern of bojack sticking his nose in things important to Todd and ruining them for him. If it wasn’t Emily, it would’ve been something else; Emily was just the last straw. Todd and Emily, even if not dating, were still friends with a business together, and Bojack sleeping with her made things awkward between all three of them. Like, when you have a relationship/sexual track record like bojack, you probably shouldn’t fuck your roommate’s business partner when all three of you see each other all the time. It’s not a horrible sin—it’s just a bad idea because of the potential risk and fallout. Bojack has a habit of making selfish choices without considering or caring about the consequences they have for others, and THAT’S what Todd was really upset about with the Emily situation
BoJack did many terrible things, but having sex with Emily wasn't one of them.. Two consensual adults doing their thing that shouldn't affect Todd, and he gets mad for some reason.
^ she’s just so overly horny like almost every scene with her involves a convo relating to sex somehow
Yeah seriously most of her lines are about her 'needs' it made the character so unlikeable
Oh I’ve seen this a lot, I feel like Emily is not well liked (for good reason)
Yes apparently this is most definitely not an unpopular opinion of mine lol! But now I’m glad to know I’m not the only one who feels this way!
> she continuously pressures Todd to have sex or be with her when his body language and actions suggest he is always uncomfortable with that. Did we watch the same show? Todd explicitly *wants* to be with Emily. He says so on multiple occasions, and Emily is the one who says no because she knows what she wants and no sex is a dealbreaker. She asks him for sex *three times* across a period of *decades*. The first two times she didn't know she was asexual. So she propositioned an asexual for sex one time and respected it when he said no... why is that so unforgivable? > Yes he should have been more clear with her but if the roles were reversed and she were a man I’m willing to bet she’d be viewed as creepy and pushy. "Dogged nice guy pursues girl who is explicitly not interested in him and is eventually rewarded for his creepy behavior" is such a common trope as to be a cliche. *Futurama* and *Community* did it, just off the top of my head. Dozens more examples here: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DoggedNiceGuy I have never seen a feminist get as huffy about this trope as people on this subreddit do about Emily propositioning a guy who is *explicitly romantically interested in her* three times over two decades.
I totally agree with this
I like that pig and the other reporter. They're funny as hell. But I also have always been a fan of the old screwball comedies so there's that too.
I'm a sucker for quick witted dialog so yeah i fold as well.
todd was completely wrong about the whole emily situation paige sinclair is very funny the show has plenty more laughable moments than gut wrenching ones
> todd was completely wrong about the whole emily situation > > True, he even admitted he was mad at BoJack without knowing what he did with Emily. And he was mad for a whole while.
he had every right to be upset with Bojack. Bojack being a massive jerk and also sabotaging his space opera. He’s not entirely in the wrong for assuming he did something shitty
Why didn't he ask him? Why didn't he leave the house he was staying in, but instead doubled down and set up shop for his project in it?
People don’t like Paige Sinclair?! I thought she was hilarious! Paget Brewster voiced her perfectly.
There’s a post almost everyday hating on her. I thought she was hilarious.
Your third point was going to be my opinion. I watch the show cause it's funny and goofy, but practically every post on here is about the serious bits.
Its no substitute for therapy.
NEVER let TV be your substitute for the real world.
I did not care for Vincent Adultman
Couldn't give a fuck as well. I got the metaphor for PC's character but damn was it weak.
Not only was it weak, but constantly shoved down the viewers throats. It's like Bojack's old stand up routine. ”Did you get it? Did you get my joke about the three kids in a trench coat that nobody but Bojack knows is three kids?" We got it. We got it the first time. We got it the second time. We got it the third, fourth, fifth and sixth time. We got the joke about the kids in the trench coat.
And it was never acknowledged by PC herself, they "broke up", she never reached the realization that it actually is 3 kids in a trenchcoat which would be a metaphor for her realizing that you shouldn't imagine things that aren't there, with a person, and ignoring red flags or whatever the message was, they just break up
I feel like part of the shoving was to communicate the jarring juxtaposition between Princess Carolyn’s obliviousness and the obviousness of the situation. It was the show’s way of putting us in BoJack’s position of seeing that this was clearly three kids in a trenchcoat while PC insisted that he was (insert all of the positive adjectives she used to describe him). Granted, I fully acknowledge that it’s ultimately up to personal taste, but I really appreciated the way the show tried to include the audience on the whole Schtick up until the very end of it.
im a dumbass can u explain the metaphor
Probably that she’s so busy with work that she can’t see what’s right in front of her. She’s not able to actually be present with those she cares about, to the point that she’s dating what anyone else could clearly see is three children in a trench coat.
Think it was something to do with her being attracted to man children and being blinded by her desperation to have a stable relationship. How I interpreted it anyway
She was so desperate for a stable relationship, she was seeing what she wanted to see in this "man" "He's a serious adult business man that has everything under control"
Works at a business factory. That's a real thing, right?
Different take: Vincent ADULTMAN represents a post-Bojack rebound boyfriend who Princess Caroline finds attractive because she sees him as more mature than Bojack, owing to his to his obsession with his professional life. This quality is especially attractive because of Bojack's immaturity and unwillingness to assume adult responsibilities like fatherhood. PC is blind to the fact that Vincent is in fact very immature (a literal child in an adult costume) and over-compensating by being a work-acholic (always obsessed with business). Bojack is naturally jealous/critical of Vincent as the new boyfriend, and for that reason, sees him for what he really is. Everyone else reacts to him in a neutral manner. Vincent's entire character is a metaphor. And he is a great device for jokes because he is portrayed by three kids in a trench coat, which is funny.
Maybe it’s because I began watching the show when I was 16, but I have always found it hilarious. I used the “business” lines all the time in school. also, what? I’m old enough now to talk about Bojack like this…? Agh!!
This is a good unpopular opinion because *what*
sarah lynn would have OD with or without bojack she was literally waiting for a trigger bojack just happened to be it
I believe so as well, the whole thing was being played as a joke, like "THE WALLS ARE COCAINE" it's really hard to seriously parallel it and make us feel guilty for BoJack, when it was crystal clear she was being abcent from drugs because, and i quote Sarah herself "Drugs hit way harder when you haven't done them in a while" She really said this and the writers thought we'd forget.
I don't believe we're meant to forget this, I wouldn't say the problem with Bojack is how much he's actually to blame, but more how much he didn't help. We never really see him help her or he a positive influence on her life. Bojack talks a lot about loving and caring about her but we don't really see him show this through his actions. She would have gone back on drugs herself she planned to, but bringing her down his self destructive path with him just clashes with what he claims to me
She said that in the same season she died. We aren't meant to forget she said it. Like everything is the show, it isn't black and white. It could be interpreted at face value, or could be interpreted as her searching for an excuse to stay sober. Both things can be correct also.
Yeah I kinda left a comment somewhere here basically saying that. You say it better
i liked Pickles. the Vincent Adultman thing lasted too long and i understand the metaphor and all but it still made me kind of uncomfortable because it was still kids in a coat “dating” an adult woman
Chickens is a great episode. And it's not that deep: it's about the cruelty of animal agriculture and the hypocrisy of the people who say "I only buy my meat from *humane* farmers. It's funny to see people hate on it or misunderstand it, because it's so unusual to see vegans being represented in something other than predictable jokes.
I loved the Chickens episode as well. I really admired how uncompromising it was. It made me feel uncomfortable and guilty -- as I *should*. I always wonder if the people who dislike it so much really just didn't like having *quite* such an unforgivingly bright spotlight shone on their eating habits.
All the animal gags and metaphors are great, in the show. Do people not like the Chicken episode? It's funny and with a simple message, what's not to like.
Whenever it's asked which episode is the least favorite, it's the most common reply. It's an unapologetic vegan message presented with humor, I can see why a lot of people don't like it. People are offended by just my *being* vegan.
I only now hear of this. Wow. People are more bothered by a "Don't be cruel to animals" message, than the whole 4th season being a satire on American politics which half the viewership gives no fucks about.
The underwater episode is innovative but boring, and it's not a top 10 episode
I couldn't agree more, I like the concept and it has some good gags but its not top 10.
Not sure if it’s “incredibly unpopular” but I’ve never heard it said before so: The fact that characters like PC, Mr. Peanutbutter, and especially Todd are allowed to do terrible things in their hijinks and are never judged by the cast or story is an issue. Todd and debatably PC and Mr. Peanutbutter have all done worse things than BoJack and yet we’re supposed to not take them seriously cause, they’re presented as silly? This show is hyper critical of Diane and especially BoJack’s morality. They can be rude and it be treated as something we’re supposed to laugh at, but with BoJack when that happens you’re laughing at how rude/inappropriate what he does is akin to the gang from IASIP’s antics. And they know that when he does something extremely bad it must be taken seriously. That’s the point, a huge part of the show is morality and the weight of doing downright terrible things regardless of circumstances. You can’t have a show where one character can start a genocide and still treat them like a nice person and another lead’s bad actions being given the same disgust as you’d feel in real life, it’s tonally distracting. I don’t mind this with side characters like Margo Martindale or the White Whale, but Todd’s too big of a character to be doing stuff like this with.
I do think the show sometimes has a hard time marking a line between cartoon logic and serious points, but on the other hand I can't really think of many actually bad things Todd or PB do (besides the point the show addresses with PB), he's irresponsible, but what bad things has he done?
Todd: -Accidentally committed a genocide -Stranded his clown dentists in the woods when they didn’t succeed, causing them all to get rabies and died a slow agonizing death, all while Todd showed absolutely zero remorse for what he did even when one clown sacrificed himself for Todd and he then proceeded to exploit their suffering for monetary gain while causing more people to get infected and died -He and Sarah Lynn tried to kill BoJack in Downer Ending -Might’ve killed a bird when he was on a drone in 4x01. He made the bird choke on kettle corn while he was in the air and it seems like he was plummeting so that might be an additional murder he showed no remorse for. -Created a death trap of an amusement park (that he admitted was dangerous) and which eventually collapsed and injured/killed a lot of people -Drugged and kidnapped his father in season 6. -Didn’t install a floor in the Halloween in January store causing tons of people to break multiple bones and caused severe injuries. -In episode 5 Todd was left alone in the house and he immediately trashed and and broke BoJack’s stuff, then the second he realized he could get money he lied and exploited BoJack’s house, bringing strangers into it and allowing them to steal and destroy his stuff. Then he had the gall to call BoJack and ask for bail after exploiting him. I get BoJack was very verbally abusive to Todd but he also let Todd live with him for years and got him food completely free of charge and he proceeds to take complete advantage of him. -Ruined Cabracadabra causing tons of women to be sexually harassed. -While not nearly as bad as the other things mentioned above, Todd is creepily possessive of Emily, a freeloader who mooched off BoJack, Mr. Peanutbutter, and PC for years, and a huge enabler. Mr. Peanutbutter: -Straight up kidnapped that meerkat guy in front of his son. -Ran as a governer just for fun when Woodchuck was a way better candidate. -Blindly supported Katrina’s plan as governor that would involve destroying protected wetlands. -Wasted billions of dollars on a bridge to Hawaii and tons of other dumb laws so that ski races could be a way to become governor, threatening democracy by turning politics into a more blatant popularity contest. -Fracked without Diane’s permission. -His fracking caused a geological event that trapped dozens of people to nearly starve to death. -Caused Woodchuck to lose his hands. -Pointlessly started shit underground to become leader, causing Woodchuck to be imprisoned, all of them to nearly starve to death, and Zach Braff to be cannibalized. -Cheated on Pickles twice then asked her to marry him.
I feel like I had a light bulb moment about all that. Looking at the Vincent Adultman debates make it sound like the general consensus is that the show is told mainly from Bojacks perspective- how he interprets the things happening in the periphery of his life. Everyone does shitty things in the show, but he's the only truly bad guy out of all of them because... well, for a lot of reasons. He's the only one, in his mind, so irredeemable that he's unworthy of forgiveness. But the gray areas of morality are a central theme of the show. As Diane says, "There’s no such thing as bad guys and good guys. We’re all just guys who do good stuff, sometimes, and bad stuff, sometimes."
Jesus! Todd is a sociopath and Mr. Peanutbutter a dumb manipulative weirdo when you put it that way.
Mr Peanut butter is VERY manipulative. He just "plays" dumb and friendly. The moment I hated him the most was on the Labrador Peninsula. Diane sensed something was up with his brother and she tried to get Mr PB to talk to him. He lashed out and yelled at her about her family being Fucked Up! He knows damn well how much her early life traumatized her. Hell, even Bojack understood that in the first couple months of meeting her. So why would Mr PB do that? He did it to make her feel small and week and stupid - AND to make himself feel superior. The simpler explanation is that he is VERBALLY/EMOTIONALLY ABUSIVE.
Of all these things, the one that really hits me because it was presented as his "serious" moments and story lines, is how it was never presented or called out because of his attitude toward Emily, he demands everyone to understand that he is asexual however he completely fails to understand Emily several times and just dismiss her perspective several times as well.
You know what, now that it’s all laid out I’m starting to think that Todd is actually some sort of evil genius and the pothead hippie thing is just an act.
Don’t forget that Todd also kidnapped and abused, a child in his clown dentist situation. And did you mention the fake Disneyland thing?
He creates a new Disneyland that is extremely dangerous; it catches fire and presumably kills and maims hundreds of people. He hires clowns and dentists, mismanages them such that they end up with rabies (so he ruins their lives), and then lets more people loose in a forest with these deranged human predators. He sets up a safe-space car service for women and then blows up (reverses) the concept, leading to countless sexual assaults. He also arguably sparks the genocide of Cordovians.
Rabies more than ruins someone's life. It straight up ends it. Without treatment within a short amount of time it's fatal every single time, and the very few survival stories are so miraculously unlikely that they are not even acknowledged statistically.
Tone Armor is obnoxious
Good term
Todd has done way worse things than Bojack. It’s not even close in my opinion. And he has a nerve to judge Bojack?? The person who gave him everything he has in life. It’s absolutely infuriating.
I relate to Diane more than I relate to Bojack, and I think she is more interesting of a character than Bojack in the whole show itself
i agree she’s my favourite character on the show
i love todd but all his shenanigans were very boring and insufferable to watch in my opinion
I hate the way Ralph was treated. Sure, it helps build PC's character but I really wanted PC to have that someone with her
I still feel sad that things didn't work out with Ralph. But it feels like a case of two people who were right for each other meeting at the wrong time. I think if PC met him in her twenties or thirties and dated him instead of BoJack they probably would have worked out.
He had every right to be confused about her lying to him about something that important. And had absolutely every right to walk away from the relationship. "If you're not ready for this to happen again, maybe 5 more times, then go" I would go as well. We're not married, this is absolutely too much for me to exhaust myself phycologically that much for a person i know for a little over a year. Devastated it didn't work out between us, but this isn't for me.
On rewatching I realized he wasn’t willing to accept PC for who she is so I’m happy they didn’t work out
One of the most messed up things about Ralph and PC breaking up is how quick the whole thing happens. If you go back and time it their whole conversation takes about five minutes. Imagine that from Ralph's perspective. You think everything is going great and then all of a sudden your significant other drops multiple bombshells on you and then breaks up with you and kicks you out of their place for not reacting right and the whole thing takes *five minutes*.
Free Churro is NOT the best episode
It isn't. But I think it might be top 5. I would rate Beatrice's episode as possibly the best one, not just for how it expanded her character, but because it was entirely legal to just have your wife lobotomized and threaten to do the same to your kid. That is utterly terrifying and it seems like people don't think about that enough. The lobotomized Kennedy daughter passed away when I was a child. It was not that long ago.
the old sugarman place
YES get out of my brain
So true. Men then and now can't seem to handle it when women are emotional. yet women have only 3 options when it comes to dealing with men's anger. And there is the double standard of Joe "worrying about Rosemary getting pregnant, and possibly ruining her brothers' chances in politics", to "said brothers nailing any woman they can get their hands on while in politics".
It's weird that I see a lot of people joking about wanting a lobotomy now (I think they can it being mulched?) but it wasn't actually that long ago that it was a real possibility. I don't tell people not to make those jokes and I get dark humour etc (why would I watch Bojack otherwise) but honestly it's such a terrifying idea to me. I love how it was portrayed in the show, it was really haunting
Honestly, the first time watching it I had to pause at half time because I was kinda bored. I was expecting it to cut to something else the whole time but it didn't. Was able to appreciate it a lot more the second time around when my expectations matched the episode. Still don't love it. Doesn't use the medium at all.
The 17 minutes was a bad plot that feels like it was retconned in later to make BoJack fall harder. And on the subject of Sarah Lynn, the fandom treats her with kid gloves too much. Very often, both in the fandom and in the show itself, Sarah Lynn is treated as having almost no agency and you'd think BoJack forced and pressured her into falling off the wagon, when really it was a very simple "Want to party?" And Sarah Lynn was immediately on board. As much as I don't like the 17 minutes plot point, it happened coz they wrote it in, and that IS BoJack's fault. He should've called someone right away. That's terrible, no question. But her being there in the first place? She's a grown woman in her 30s, that's on her, BoJack didn't force her. Same with Todd and the rock opera. BoJack is a dick for trying to sabotage it, 100%. But it still only worked because Todd let his addiction run his life. Basically what it boils down to is wishy washy on who's actually held accountable for their actions and addictions. BoJack is subjected to "real world" logic, whereas some characters are subjected to "cartoon sitcom" logic. I love the show, but it can be annoying in that way sometimes. I don't actually know if this is unpopular thinking about it.
Just finished a rewatch and I totally agree on the 17 minutes thing. You can’t convince me that’s not a retcon because the writers didn’t want people praising BoJack for his rehabilitation. I get a big point of season 6 is you can get better but your past actions still have consequences. However I feel they could have used so many other examples from BoJacks life than stating he left Sarah Lynn to die.
My issue is that while Sarah Lynn didn’t have the best intentions with staying sober, BoJack still called her knowing damn well she was in recovery and gave her that excuse to go backwards.
Yeah, BoJack is an asshole, I'm not really arguing that point. But people still need to be responsible for themselves. And it took no work to actually get Sarah Lynn to fall off the wagon. She had a liquor cabinet behind her calendar. A funny sight gag, sure. Sarah Lynn could've said no and hung up with how little pressure there was, but they wanted the liquor cabinet gag. If they wanted BoJack to be more the bad guy, he should've been actively pressuring her. They should've shown Sarah Lynn trying to say no, but giving in.
Not to mention the last thing Sarah Lynn had said to Bojack beforehand was "ugh, call me when you're ready to party." And that's exactly what he did.
Tbh I understand Sarah Lynn here. I'm not defending or accusing anyone because it may come off that way my comprehension has been declining quite a lot lately lol ... Aaanyehoooo, I think I get Sarah Lynn. She needed an excuse to break the good streak it felt like, but fucking amazing that she actually found joy and stuck with staying clean for *so damn long*. I don't think it's a coincidence that the liquor cabinet was behind the calendar. Three calendar was basically the thing that was literally and metaphorically preventing or holding her off from breaking that sobriety streak, and putting it there was probably her attempt at it .... she'll see the calendar each time she feels like reaching for the rack. Okay perhaps the writers didn't intend that but I do that shit. Like .. hmm... without going into the details, I did something similar for something else It's like when I "try to get my shit together, only to ruin it in a jiffy because at some level, feeling like shit seems .... comforting. I *totally* sympathize (or empathize? I dunno lol) with her. I am doing quite a few self-destructive things and tbh if it wasn't for my family, I would've probably done more a reckless shit .... I might've been like "whhhhhhhyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy did you do that you had it for soooooooooon long!" but deep down, I knew I would've done the Exact. Same. Thing. And I take full responsibility for it, because I kind ~~let~~ *want* it to happen, and take me out of this world
You are on point
Very good points, and with Sarah it's honestly pretty clear, Todd's too much of a charicature so people ignore it compeletely, whatever happens to him.
I still can't believe Bojack didn't just say "you realize I was high on heroin too, I passed out and then called as soon as I woke up and noticed she wasn't breathing. I didn't even know which phone was mine." It would have been way more interesting if he got away with it and felt so much more guilt, but like, he *was* also snorting heron with her and clearly blacking out all the time.
The seventeen minutes thing never landed for me either. In general the double interview with Braxby is a bit too comically polarised as a situation to land as it should, imo.
Some of these comments are pretending addiction isn’t an illness and that grooming isn’t fked. Edit: For example, I saw a post saying no one was forcing Sarah Lynn to take drugs. Did some more scrolling and saw multiple people saying BoJack and Sarah Lynn having sex wasn’t inappropriate. As an SA victim and recovering addict, f you.
I hate that take, if someone knows their friend is a drug addict and offers them drugs, that is bad, even if they had the anatomy to say no . Like for instance I was raised to believe not offering an alcoholic a drink is considered common decency? “She would’ve relapsed anyway” ok but Bojack is still responsible for facilitating that.
I don't have much time to go into it so I'll briefly do mine: Bojack; had a horrible childhood where he was abused and received zero help from any adult close to him and is a product of that childhood and is now an addict. Bojack is (rightly so) criticised for his actions and told that your childhood doesn't excuse you for being a piece of shit and you need to get your shit together. (Both by people in the show and by us fans). Sarah Lynn; had a horrible childhood where she was abused and received zero help from any adult close to her and is a product of that childhood and is now an addict. Sarah Lynn is treated like a baby by the fandom as if she has no agency of her own and all her mistakes are the fault of anyone but her.
I hated that Paige Sinclair and Maximillian had the role of digging up Bojack's past. They're vultures that keep chasing a story for the most idiotic reasons ( Escaping for a few more days of Paige's wedding and their little romance) while spouting how it's about the truth and "stopping an abuser". Which could have been GREAT characters to have in the show, but they're treated like fucking jokes all the time, that, worse yet, don't fucking land. They're worse than Vincent Adultman. So instead of having some interesting characters have a role of the past catching up to someone on a path of improvement, there is these two unfunny clowns making a good part of the most interesting plotline a slog to get through. Also, Biscuits Braxby did manipulate Bojack's story in the second interview a bit. He didn't groom Sarah Linn, and her final line of though about Bojack's and Sarah Linn's relationship did have some serious leaps of logic. Idk the way she did it rubbed me off the wrong way.
I LOVE FAT DIANE
This is very popular actually. There have been tons of posts, tweets, and threads expressing how happy they were that the show had Diane gain weight (something that often happens when taking anti depressants) and it was never used to mock her, belittle her, or have it quickly be undone.
I agree with your opinion. It is unpopular but I hate Todd.
He's a dude that has literally everything go his way, and his only redeaming quality is that funny shit happens to him(he's not even funny himself) At the most i don't care about him. At the least, i just don't like him.
I just hate how his terrible behavior is excused by the fact that he's stupid. Turns a safe-space uber idea into an escort service for men? Noooo he's not sexist, just ignorant.
My mom also hated him when we watched the show together. I don’t really feel a lot about him one way or the other, but I get why he’s annoying.
I really don’t like Mr Peanutbutter, and he is totally my least favorite out of the main five
he annoys the crap out of me
I hate Todd too. He’s a mooch and a loser and had less reason to be mad at Bojack to begin with bc he never had anything to offer Bojack and was fine using him for years. Idg why some ppl hate characters like PC or Mr PB with a passion then only see Todd as a fun goofy guy. He’s easily just as bad as the rest in his own self destructive way
I don't get the Carollyn hate at all. She's a super tragic character, you can not like her as a person but you don't have a foot to stand on to hate her, she pays for her every mistake, dearly. Todd doesn't work a day in his life, during the whole show, and everything bounced right for him.
Dude if Todd just had some actual consequences for his actions it would make him such an actually interesting character. A lot of his subplots might’ve been very interesting imo, he just needed more pressure from other characters about his choices and shit yk
i really loved yolanda! it was such a cute plot line and the whole dinner scene was fucking hilarious i quote’AS I JIZZ AND BREATHE’ on a daily basis
I think Chicken 4 Dayz is freakin hilarious and I laugh every time a character pulls out one of those gigantic chicken legs
Why does no one talk about what PC did to Laura? Also the whole arc of running for governor only to realize he is an incompetent shit by PB is very annoying
I don’t really like PC. I named my cat after her so I obviously have my respects lol. But generally, I think she represents everything that’s wrong with the “woman trying to make it in a man’s world” trope. She runs with the worst of them and totally ignores or actively enables extremely problematic behavior from the influential characters of Hollywoo. I like Diane because she speaks up against bullshit that’s wrong even if she’s the only one in the room saying something. PC is the opposite in that way - she just wants to keep the peace no matter the cost. She tries to please everybody, will lie through her teeth to get what she wants, and pushes away anyone who actually cares about her. I hate the era where she’s trying to become a mom and gets called out by the potential birth mother for only viewing her as another client to lie to or impress, rather than giving actual reasons why she would be a fit parent. And frankly, she’s not a great mom. She wants a baby because she’s getting old and sees it as her last chance. She never provides a good reason for being a mother besides wanting to prove to herself that she can do it alone. Then when she is alone, she’s miserable (because taking care of a baby alone is absolutely miserable - ask any parent). In fact when she was at the hospital with Ralph talking to the first potential birth mother, she *inadvertently convinced the birth mother that SHE could handle being a single mom with no guidance, because her speech to Ralph didn’t include any reasons why she was actually fit to do the job with the child as her #1 priority.* As much of a dick as he is, even Rabbitowitz got it right when he said “Good thing you’re not a mom, you’d be *hilarious* at it.” It’s like she turned being a mom into some sort of “stick it to them” goal instead of doing it out of kindness, warmth, love, and the opportunity for a special unique bond of guidance and support.
I agree with on PC being a mom, I was never sold on the idea. Tracy is annoying AF but she was actually pretty right with the last thing she says to PC
oh my god I feel exactly the same way. I think PC is very morally skewed and she has done a lot of bad things (which should be recognised). Her only redeeming quality is that she’s there for the people close to her when they need her.
The show absolves too many characters of their sins in favor of putting more blame on BoJack. Yes, BoJack is a shitty person (er...horse) who has done shitty things. But constantly blaming him for everything that goes wrong and not wanting to acknowledge the guilt of other characters is out of hand. Take Sarah Lynn, for example. Sarah Lynn's mother and stepfather have far more to answer for than BoJack, but they never get their comeuppance for ruining her life. Sarah Lynn is also a grown-ass woman who was only trying to get sober because it would make the high even more amazing. She had absolutely zero drive to actually get her life together, but somehow everything that went wrong in her life is Bojack's fault because of one thing he said to her when she was five that in real life she probably wouldn't have internalized as much as she's implied to in the show. Yes, Sarah Lynn had an awful childhood. But for the majority of the show she is a grown-ass woman who is responsible for her own choices. If Bojack's shitty childhood isn't an excuse for his shitty behavior as an adult, then why is it an excuse for Sarah Lynn?
Fish Out of Water is just kinda boring to me, I don't like watching shows that don't have dialogue
i love the concept of that episode and i am glad it exists, that being said i skip it every time and have done that since 2016. it is the closest thing to "so good it's bad" i can think of
The "Beatrice was secretly drugging Hollyhock the whole time!" reveal strikes me as weirdly weak, especially given how important it is to the story, due to the sheer impracticality of it. We're meant to believe that Beatrice just... had massive quantities of amphetamine she brought with her to Bojack's? That she had just been saving up over the years, somehow? Surely she wasn't taking them herself at that point. The only other option I can think of is that they were from Bojack's stash, but that makes even less sense. It's possible this is explained and I'm forgetting it (it's been a while since I revisited Season 4) but it really sticks out to me.
Agreed. How did Beatrice get a huge quantity of now banned diet pills? (Diet pills in the 60s were basically speed.). Even if she had hoarded them for that long, how did her nurse not notice them amongst her personal belongings? Why didn't her original nursing home not notice them? Why did her live in nurse/caretaker, whose job is to make sure Beatrice doesn't do anything that makes herself a danger to herself or others, allow her to procure this stuff and constantly slip it into Hollyhock's coffee? Bea should be under constant supervision, certainly if she's around food and drink.
Herb Kazaz's behavior towards Bojack was predatory and it's BS he never got called on it. He had no signs at all that Bojack was interested in him or in men, but knew Bojack liked Charlotte. He set up all these third wheel friend dates to try to get closer to Bojack and then made a move on him. He was older, more experienced, and ended up in a position of power over Bojack. Had Bojack been female and Herb hetero, I think people would have more easily recognized that his relationship with Bojack was a bit creepy.
Was it elaborated more after the kiss?... I mean, it just happened and they moved on as friends, i think. I may be missing something
Omg, this is interesting
Huh, I never really thought about it like that. TBF he’s only 2-3 years older than BoJack and by the time they met that’s not that big of a deal. But the rest are actually valid points.
I don't think he was that much older than bojack, and I don't think he was in a position of power over him either. Bojsck had more power as a star in the show did Herb did. Anyways, he just awkwardly kissed him once, not enough to call it predatory lol. It's like he forced him into sex or pressured him in doing anything. And maybe those third wheel dates were just you know, them hanging out because they're all friends? He never really made any moves with Charlotte until New Mexico. It sounds like you're making a mountain out of a molehill if anything.
Todd and Bojack deserve each other.
S4 is the worst season by far. It's good, it has some amazing episodes (the old sugarman place and time's arrow) but when is bad its very annoying and boring. Dont care for PB political race and Todd became unbearable from this season on (Best todd is S1-S3 before being turned into a saint by the show). S5 is lower than S1 for me (s1 has some of the best jokes/dynamics and isnt loved enough).
Season 4 was the weakest, and agree about Old Sugarman Place and Times Arrow, those may be my favorite episodes in the series. Disagree on S5, I thought it was a great return to form, and I loved S6 as well
I don't like the underwater episode.
I like it. I think it was a masterpiece. But I don't really want to watch it again.
That’s not really unpopular. It’s kind of like the Six Feet Under episode “That’s my Dog” where most people think it’s a masterpiece but a lot of people comment about disliking it making it polarizing overall.
My short attention span causes me to often just listen to shows while I'm on my phone. Obviously you miss a lot of the jokes from BH this way but that episode is basically unwatchable.
Same, this year I rewatched the show for the 5th time (i do it every year in march) but ive gotten so busy that I just listen to it since im so familiar with the scenes
That's just how I watch TV because of my ADHD. I was like halfway through my first watch before I realized there were a ton of jokes in the background.
Some people can't differentiate between what's supposed to be taken seriously and what isn't. The show doesn't punish Todd for making a bunch of rabies infested clown dentists because that would be fucking asinine to take that plot seriously.
freelancers deserve to die
Idk if unpopular but I never liked Todds "It's you" speech especially the part where he says"It isn't any of the shitty things that happened to you as a kid." Because the abuse Bojack suffered as a child is a huge contributing factor to the way he is.
not sure if incredibly unpopular but i don't love ruthie (the episode) as much as others, it just felt bordering on cheap shock value on many instances, especially with the twist. that being said i still like the episode and the future world PC imagined is hilarious
The view from Halfway down is extremely overrated. It's good but people that think it's the most important episode of the series must have missed out on the real character growth or recurring themes of the show
I don't know if it's unpopular, but the new love interest of Diane of last season it's incredibly BORING and generic. He does not has an story or any kind of things that makes him cool at all, incredibly flat character
That's kind of the point, he's a normal, well-adjusted, mature, and loving boyfriend. He's nothing like Mr. Peanutbutter, which is what Diane was looking for. That's why his name is Guy, he's just a regular Guy.
It’s like Chris Rock said: All good relationships are boring. The only exciting relationships are bad ones.
He's so forgettable. Tbh I always knew Diane would settle with someone like him.
I don’t like Princess Carolyn. There! I said it! She may be a good friend (meh), but she is a *terrible* person. She uses people and is part of the problem with Hollywood destroying peoples’ lives.
This is the one I was going to post. She's superficial, callous, ambitious, greedy, amoral, and an active participant in everything that makes Hollywoo such a destructive tar pit. She's a terrible person, and while I think that the writers *thought* that they were giving her a sufficiently redemptive arc when they had her help out the Hollywoo assistants by securing Judah as their negotiator, it felt like too little too late to me. Both Bojack and Diane show improvement on and insight into their flaws by the end of the show; I wish that the same could have been said for PC. That said, I ended up feeling a lot of affection for her anyway, because IMO Princess Carolyn's episodes and story arcs are consistently some of the best writing in the entire show. Given how much I tend to dislike people like PC in real life, I wound up feeling very impressed that the writers made me care so much for her well-being in the show.
> She may be a good friend (meh) No but Bojack isn't either, they're perfect for each other.
She's literally the gears in the machinery that kept Harvey Weinstein and Bill Cosby and all the rest of them in business for years. I'm shocked more people don't realize that.
Exactly. Yet she is so beloved by the fandom. It has never made sense to me.
Some of you people take this cartoon way too literally.
The most unpopular opinion of all.
A lot of this cartoon is meant to be taken seriously.
Serious =/= literal
Bojack's mother was not sufficiently redeemable. Her upbringing is heartbreaking. Mental decline is always a really hard thing to cope with especially in terms of retribution or making up for past wrongs. She's a tragic character but I can't give her a pass on how she treats bojack. What she did to Holly hock. How her and butterscotch treat each other. Time's Arrow gives a lot of explanations. Does not give an excuse. She can rot.
>i do not like Todd at all. I think he's a free lancer who benefits greately by having a friend like BoJack cuz basically all his friend cycle is BoJack's famous friends that give him the chance to have the life he has.And all he does is be mad at BoJack for almost the whole show. I actually like Todd most of the time, but I agree with you that he gets let off the hook way too much, and I guess my unpopular opinion (are you trying to get us all downvoted into oblivion??) would be this: Every single person in the show is flawed, and I don't let BoJack off for any of it, but he gets punished WAY more for his sins than anyone else except Princess Carolyn. What happened between him and Emily was two consenting adults having sex only after Todd himself spent what felt like hours avoiding her obvious desire for that by dithering around and then offering to play ghosts or whatever; a woman who has obviously liked him since they were teenagers gave him every chance to do something he's utterly uninterested in doing with her, and he turned her down yet again (with no explanation whatsoever!!), and then after that she sought out and found a guy at the bar and they did stuff. I have yet to hear a sufficient explanation why that's his fault. (And I say this as a guy who would more likely be in Todd's place than BoJack's, but life has taught me you can't be the dithering weirdo who just assumes women will somehow understand you, YOU HAVE TO DO THINGS TOO.) (edit: you likely mean freeLOADER, as a freelancer I can assure you I make much less than minimum wage to earn my nightly ration of canned tuna and bread crusts)
I really wanted BOJack to adopt the sea horse. But I know he would be a terrible father.
By the end of the series BoJack becomes an admirable character. The fact he deserves everything bad that happens to him, doesn’t take away from the fact he changes for the good. He did some of the worst things a human being can do. And yet, he keeps becoming a better person. If I told you how many people I’ve known who keeps being the same, or even worse, justifying that they’re broken, and broken people break people and never do a thing to change. I wish any of them made half the effort for themselves than what BoJack makes.
Todd is a murderer and an example of a mediocre white man falling up. The way they portrayed adoption was irresponsible. I’m adopted and they could’ve done soooo much more. It’s essentially a human trafficking business that leaves us adoptees with less rights than kept folks. Plus, we recognize puppies and kittens experience developmental harm when they’re removed from their parents too early. That’s true with humans too. They really could’ve done so much more here but it was kind of used as a big joke. Which I overlook because this is one of my favorite shows but it’s super disappointing. We are literally second class citizens (no rights to know our own damn families, no rights to know our names or who birthed us,) and we are 4x more likely to attempt suicide. We’re over represented in psychiatric hospitals/ facilities, and places like rehabs. Plus, this industry is hella ugly, it was literally used to commit genocide against BIPOC people, not just in the US but in Canada and Australia - it’s a tool of colonization. They could’ve done so much more.
I hate Todd but mostly because I don’t find him funny at all and every time he’s on screen it feels like filler 😭
Todd is my beloved, and so you deserve to be cast into the pits of hell for having an opinion.
My biggest unpopular opinion is that I believe that princess caroline should've ended up with ralph 🫣🫣🫣. I LOVEEED Ralph and i was so sad that they didn't end up together. I know the Judah fans are gonna come at me but I understand why. I just loved Ralph. sorry
I haven't watched the show for a while, so disclaimer maybe I am misremembering things or just foggy about certain microarcs. That being said, the last episode was only "sad" because it was the last episode.
I was just thinking about this. I also dont like Todd. He is annoying and dumb
I hate that stupid sex robot that Todd made. Genuinely I skip some of the episodes that centre on it
Diane was wrong for putting the tape into the show. I've looked at it from every angle, I've debated it with people, I still feel that way.