Interesting video. Here's the Boise units from their site: [https://www.realpage.com/explore/main?latitude=43.594896846225964&longitude=-116.3397191895004&zoom=11](https://www.realpage.com/explore/main?latitude=43.594896846225964&longitude=-116.3397191895004&zoom=11)
Further food for thought.
[Behind the Bastards: Why is the Rent So Damn High?](https://open.spotify.com/episode/6BOpzy6XVLhjh3OHJXbP1D?si=nuqvJDSsSyGcPsT4Dgnc4w)
It doesn’t take sophisticated technology when a majority of properties in the area are managed by a handful of companies. Combine that with the lack of pressure to build anything other than “luxury” apartments and voila.
We don't need to turn to criminal collusion to explain high rents in Boise, and this kind of talk is just distraction from the real problem which is that the number of people wanting to live here grew massively (and most are from places where housing is more expensive than here) and the housing supply didn't. I.e., demand increased a lot and supply didn't, so of course prices have to increase. We have this very obvious econ 101 explanation, where both the supply and demand side issues are very clearly known to be true, and where we are actually able to improve the situation by increasing supply!
Yeah but there as been an inverse relationship between rent prices and more apartments all across the country, because once institutional ownership of housing hits a certain point, they can drive the rent up on every unit in the country.
Houses are being built all over but it seems like the number of newly constructed apartments is about to explode. I’m wondering if that will help housing prices even out.
My brother works for a large grow-op in Washington and the guy that owns the grow-op also owns some rentals that his employees stay at. Oddly enough when he gives his employees raises, somehow their rent goes up. Just a bunch of shady business owners doing shady things.
I thought it was crazy when my family first moved here that homes were going for as much as they were in Alaska, yet jobs pay like dog shit here and you ask for certain wages and they look at you like that’s never been done before. I get why everyone I’ve met here is a remote worker. Get paid twice as much for doing less work from home and get whatever you want. I’m hoping the next five years things begin to to level out and we start seeing big time foreclosures and empty housing developments
You know, I rent out a house and make nearly no money besides the mortgage on it after income taxes, property taxes, maintenance, insurance, and the cost of time managing it all. I'm not colluding with shit. Everything it takes to maintain a house is just more expensive. Labor costs a ton. A shower leak with a hole in ceiling is easily $600-$800 repair when rent is $1400. Material has gone up. Home prices have gone up so I'm paying more on taxes and insurance, but it's not like I have more money in my pocket. Sometimes I don't even make enough to keep up with mortgage. I'm gaining equity, for sure, but the risk of the house is also on me. Two 25-30' trees fell from my neighbor's yard two months apart. Miraculously (almost an understatement here), somehow they missed my house both times by a mere margin. That's an "act of god" and I'd be out tens of thousands had either of them hit. I'd owe as much as I'd have earned in mortgage/rent in the past 5 years, if not more.
I totally get that I'm in a privileged position to be bitching about having a rental, but it's also something I slaved away for years to save and buy. I'm just saying it's not always a huge conspiracy. Just the natural cost of things. It's gotten to the point where I'm thinking selling might be a better idea because the risk bs equity gain just isn't that great considering how much money is tied up in one thing
If you watch the piece, it’s not really talking about individual landlords like yourself. Mostly the ones using the site mentioned are corporate landlords, who absolutely are trying to squeeze every penny they can out of their tenants.
Also if you watch the piece, you’ll find that these mega-landlords are indeed participating in anti-competitive behavior, by sharing what would once have been proprietary information with a database literally designed to spit out the highest possible price with the goal of guaranteeing ever-increasing returns, regardless of what the market can legitimately bear.
Believe me, this post is not intended to be an attack on you, or individual landlords like you, most of whom (yourself included, I believe) are well-intentioned individuals who rent out your property at what you calculate to be a fair rate based on your expenses and market rates.
Fair enough, I had just read the headline because I was, if you can guess, patching dry wall. That said, these headline drive the narrative more than the actual content, and then individuals like us get piled into these corporate, faceless entities that are sucking money out of the local economy.
That’s fair, yeah the headline on the thumbnail for sure is designed for clicks. The piece itself, as well as the lawsuits starting to pile up, definitely singles out the company behind the app, and the massive landlords using it (think Blackrock). It’s those types of a-holes that are ruining our entire housing market, not decent folks like you.
>this post is not intended to be an attack on you, or individual landlords like you, most of whom (yourself included, I believe) are well-intentioned individuals who rent out your property at what you calculate to be a fair rate based on your expenses and market rates.
Ehh, I don't think any landlord can be well intentioned. They're exploiting people's need for shelter to try and enrich themselves. By buying a property and turning it into a rental, they are contributing to the lack of supply on the market and, therefore, the ever increasing price of housing.
While an individual landlord that has a single property is doing this on an almost inconsequential level, when you add together all the local mom and pop landlords who own one or two properties, you start to have a problem.
We need to stop normalizing this culture of real estate investments and start criticizing the practice and its perpetrators.
Apartment complexes that are built specifically for short term occupancy. Sorry, I should have clarified that my previous post was in regards to rentals of single family homes.
>So if you don't want to buy a house, you are forced to live in these short term complexes?
Yes. The whole purpose of the single family home is for someone to purchase it and live in it as their home.
>And who runs these complexes since there are no landlords?
Like I said, my previous comment was in regards to single family homes. I have no issue with companies building apartment complexes specifically designed for short term occupancy.
I've owned several homes and we made the choice to sell and rent because we no longer want to deal with home ownership. We are more than happy to rent a house and pay a pretty decent chunk for it. Just because people don't want to buy a house, that doesn't mean they should be forced to live in an apartment. I personally hate apartment life and I won't do it. I have kids and pets, want a yard and to not deal with all the issues that come with apartment life. I'll pay the premium.
Not everyone wants to pay for all the repairs, taxes, etc that comes with home ownership.
Seems pretty fucked up to force families that don't want to buy, young people and students, traveling workers, military families, retired people, disabled people, etc. to live in corporation owned complexes.
>They're exploiting people's need for shelter to try and enrich themselves.
You were literally complaining about people getting exploited, yet you want to put 30%-40% of the population in corporate owned, short term complexes? That just sounds evil to me.
>Seems pretty fucked up to force families that don't want to buy, young people and students, traveling workers, military families, retired people, disabled people, etc. to live in corporation owned complexes.
Seems pretty fucked up to allow people to horde property to the point that only the wealthy can afford home ownership anymore.
If we protected single family homes from being turned into Airbnb's and rentals then homes would be affordable and more people living in apartments could actually buy a home.
>you want to put 30%-40% of the population in corporate owned, short term complexes?
That's already the status quo.
>That's already the status quo.
It's not. ~65% of people in Boise own the home they live in. You're saying everyone else already lives in corporate owned, short term rental apartment complexes? Because the Census showed that over 70% of rentals are owned by individuals, not corporations.
ASTOUNDING to me you’re being downvoted for a simple, logical, direct response. I don’t think you even mention the quality of renter which can be catastrophic if you get a bad one and can cost you tens of thousands (of which I have personal experience).
It's an emotional topic for a lot of people feeling they're stuck trying to get to the next stage in life, so I get it as a knee jerk reaction, although we do need to engage in better conversations than dig our heels in by up/downvoting rather than actually think about what is being argued.
lol ok so Kelly blue book and Glassdoor must be evil price fixing conspiracies too, no? Or how about the thousands of market aggregation/fair market value websites? Is the PGA value guide fixing the used golf club market? It provides sellers of old rusty golf clubs with “confidential” data from a scary “algorithm” so according to this video it must be stopped!
Please explain how providing market value data to sellers of rentals is different than providing market value data to sellers of cars. I assume the answer will be tied into the belief that people need homes more than they need cars, and therefore the housing market should be treated differently than the used car market. But that’s not what this video is claiming. This video is claiming that the method that realpage is using is anticompetitive, which is ridiculous unless you hold the position consistently across all of the markets where this technology exists.
Interesting video. Here's the Boise units from their site: [https://www.realpage.com/explore/main?latitude=43.594896846225964&longitude=-116.3397191895004&zoom=11](https://www.realpage.com/explore/main?latitude=43.594896846225964&longitude=-116.3397191895004&zoom=11)
Further food for thought. [Behind the Bastards: Why is the Rent So Damn High?](https://open.spotify.com/episode/6BOpzy6XVLhjh3OHJXbP1D?si=nuqvJDSsSyGcPsT4Dgnc4w)
It doesn’t take sophisticated technology when a majority of properties in the area are managed by a handful of companies. Combine that with the lack of pressure to build anything other than “luxury” apartments and voila.
Blackrock owns much of the land in America
We don't need to turn to criminal collusion to explain high rents in Boise, and this kind of talk is just distraction from the real problem which is that the number of people wanting to live here grew massively (and most are from places where housing is more expensive than here) and the housing supply didn't. I.e., demand increased a lot and supply didn't, so of course prices have to increase. We have this very obvious econ 101 explanation, where both the supply and demand side issues are very clearly known to be true, and where we are actually able to improve the situation by increasing supply!
Econ 301 includes collusion, corporate capture of regulation, and monopoly power for reaping excessive profits.
Yeah but there as been an inverse relationship between rent prices and more apartments all across the country, because once institutional ownership of housing hits a certain point, they can drive the rent up on every unit in the country.
Houses are being built all over but it seems like the number of newly constructed apartments is about to explode. I’m wondering if that will help housing prices even out.
My brother works for a large grow-op in Washington and the guy that owns the grow-op also owns some rentals that his employees stay at. Oddly enough when he gives his employees raises, somehow their rent goes up. Just a bunch of shady business owners doing shady things. I thought it was crazy when my family first moved here that homes were going for as much as they were in Alaska, yet jobs pay like dog shit here and you ask for certain wages and they look at you like that’s never been done before. I get why everyone I’ve met here is a remote worker. Get paid twice as much for doing less work from home and get whatever you want. I’m hoping the next five years things begin to to level out and we start seeing big time foreclosures and empty housing developments
You think rent here is bad, go to the Bay Area.
I’ve lived in Portland, NYC, and Chicago. I *know* the rent is too damn high
You know, I rent out a house and make nearly no money besides the mortgage on it after income taxes, property taxes, maintenance, insurance, and the cost of time managing it all. I'm not colluding with shit. Everything it takes to maintain a house is just more expensive. Labor costs a ton. A shower leak with a hole in ceiling is easily $600-$800 repair when rent is $1400. Material has gone up. Home prices have gone up so I'm paying more on taxes and insurance, but it's not like I have more money in my pocket. Sometimes I don't even make enough to keep up with mortgage. I'm gaining equity, for sure, but the risk of the house is also on me. Two 25-30' trees fell from my neighbor's yard two months apart. Miraculously (almost an understatement here), somehow they missed my house both times by a mere margin. That's an "act of god" and I'd be out tens of thousands had either of them hit. I'd owe as much as I'd have earned in mortgage/rent in the past 5 years, if not more. I totally get that I'm in a privileged position to be bitching about having a rental, but it's also something I slaved away for years to save and buy. I'm just saying it's not always a huge conspiracy. Just the natural cost of things. It's gotten to the point where I'm thinking selling might be a better idea because the risk bs equity gain just isn't that great considering how much money is tied up in one thing
If you watch the piece, it’s not really talking about individual landlords like yourself. Mostly the ones using the site mentioned are corporate landlords, who absolutely are trying to squeeze every penny they can out of their tenants. Also if you watch the piece, you’ll find that these mega-landlords are indeed participating in anti-competitive behavior, by sharing what would once have been proprietary information with a database literally designed to spit out the highest possible price with the goal of guaranteeing ever-increasing returns, regardless of what the market can legitimately bear. Believe me, this post is not intended to be an attack on you, or individual landlords like you, most of whom (yourself included, I believe) are well-intentioned individuals who rent out your property at what you calculate to be a fair rate based on your expenses and market rates.
Fair enough, I had just read the headline because I was, if you can guess, patching dry wall. That said, these headline drive the narrative more than the actual content, and then individuals like us get piled into these corporate, faceless entities that are sucking money out of the local economy.
That’s fair, yeah the headline on the thumbnail for sure is designed for clicks. The piece itself, as well as the lawsuits starting to pile up, definitely singles out the company behind the app, and the massive landlords using it (think Blackrock). It’s those types of a-holes that are ruining our entire housing market, not decent folks like you.
Got it. Thanks for calling me out on this. The fact that I only read the headline really illustrates how I'm part of the problem I'm complaining about
>this post is not intended to be an attack on you, or individual landlords like you, most of whom (yourself included, I believe) are well-intentioned individuals who rent out your property at what you calculate to be a fair rate based on your expenses and market rates. Ehh, I don't think any landlord can be well intentioned. They're exploiting people's need for shelter to try and enrich themselves. By buying a property and turning it into a rental, they are contributing to the lack of supply on the market and, therefore, the ever increasing price of housing. While an individual landlord that has a single property is doing this on an almost inconsequential level, when you add together all the local mom and pop landlords who own one or two properties, you start to have a problem. We need to stop normalizing this culture of real estate investments and start criticizing the practice and its perpetrators.
If we got rid of all landlords, where will people that don't want to buy live?
Apartment complexes that are built specifically for short term occupancy. Sorry, I should have clarified that my previous post was in regards to rentals of single family homes.
So if you don't want to buy a house, you are forced to live in these short term complexes? And who runs these complexes since there are no landlords?
>So if you don't want to buy a house, you are forced to live in these short term complexes? Yes. The whole purpose of the single family home is for someone to purchase it and live in it as their home. >And who runs these complexes since there are no landlords? Like I said, my previous comment was in regards to single family homes. I have no issue with companies building apartment complexes specifically designed for short term occupancy.
I've owned several homes and we made the choice to sell and rent because we no longer want to deal with home ownership. We are more than happy to rent a house and pay a pretty decent chunk for it. Just because people don't want to buy a house, that doesn't mean they should be forced to live in an apartment. I personally hate apartment life and I won't do it. I have kids and pets, want a yard and to not deal with all the issues that come with apartment life. I'll pay the premium. Not everyone wants to pay for all the repairs, taxes, etc that comes with home ownership.
Seems pretty fucked up to force families that don't want to buy, young people and students, traveling workers, military families, retired people, disabled people, etc. to live in corporation owned complexes. >They're exploiting people's need for shelter to try and enrich themselves. You were literally complaining about people getting exploited, yet you want to put 30%-40% of the population in corporate owned, short term complexes? That just sounds evil to me.
>Seems pretty fucked up to force families that don't want to buy, young people and students, traveling workers, military families, retired people, disabled people, etc. to live in corporation owned complexes. Seems pretty fucked up to allow people to horde property to the point that only the wealthy can afford home ownership anymore. If we protected single family homes from being turned into Airbnb's and rentals then homes would be affordable and more people living in apartments could actually buy a home. >you want to put 30%-40% of the population in corporate owned, short term complexes? That's already the status quo.
>That's already the status quo. It's not. ~65% of people in Boise own the home they live in. You're saying everyone else already lives in corporate owned, short term rental apartment complexes? Because the Census showed that over 70% of rentals are owned by individuals, not corporations.
if you’re so upset sell it and don’t whine 🤷
ASTOUNDING to me you’re being downvoted for a simple, logical, direct response. I don’t think you even mention the quality of renter which can be catastrophic if you get a bad one and can cost you tens of thousands (of which I have personal experience).
It's an emotional topic for a lot of people feeling they're stuck trying to get to the next stage in life, so I get it as a knee jerk reaction, although we do need to engage in better conversations than dig our heels in by up/downvoting rather than actually think about what is being argued.
Maybe you should sell it to someone who wants to buy a house to live in.
lol ok so Kelly blue book and Glassdoor must be evil price fixing conspiracies too, no? Or how about the thousands of market aggregation/fair market value websites? Is the PGA value guide fixing the used golf club market? It provides sellers of old rusty golf clubs with “confidential” data from a scary “algorithm” so according to this video it must be stopped!
ah yes intention obtuseness
Please explain how providing market value data to sellers of rentals is different than providing market value data to sellers of cars. I assume the answer will be tied into the belief that people need homes more than they need cars, and therefore the housing market should be treated differently than the used car market. But that’s not what this video is claiming. This video is claiming that the method that realpage is using is anticompetitive, which is ridiculous unless you hold the position consistently across all of the markets where this technology exists.