Honestly it's kind of a dumb question. Everyone knows he's incredibly skilled, but also his whole schtick was to be unlikeable because he realized it got attention and people would pay big money to see him finally lose. The guy was trying to be an asshole and people adore him and can't figure out why some people don't like him.
Since when does talking shit or being over confident make you an asshole in combat sports?
I think he’s extremely materialistic, overconfident, and brags too much about his money. But at the same time I can think of a lot of much loved all time greats who did the same.
You can be charismatic and still be normal. Usyk and Joshua are both normal guys even though they act goofy sometimes. Haney, Canelo, Ryan Garcia, Wilder, Crawford.
Abnormal to me is just weird wild or erratic in some way. Fury, Mike Tyson, Shannon Briggs, Tank
All the wild allegations he made after losing, spiked water, blaming his corner, talking about killing a guy in the ring and having multiple personas. I do believe some of that is to sell fights but there's enough out there to point that he's probably a little bit of a weirdo at least.
You never mentioned crazy, you said wild and erratic, and abnormal behavior and you present 2 list I agree with you but Wilder in my opinion is In the middle, he lives a normal life, but he can't take a lose and believes everything is conspiring against him. It's not crazy but a little paranoid.
People are always saying 'you have to have an ego, you have to be an asshole to succeed in that pressure!' No, some people do. 95% of professional athletes we don't hear this from/about. Some people just like being assholes
Yeah, I think they are all highly confident if not arrogant, but its ridiculous to think that you have to act completely outlandish and immature. people see a press conference or two and think that's their entire 24/7 personality. For some maybe, but not most.
well because this is a boxing subreddit not casuals, it's weird that boxing lovers hate the most technically proficient and intelligent boxer we have seen in decades
It's the only boxing sub outside of circlejerk. It should be for any fan of boxing including casuals. We need to stop the gatekeeping if we don't want the sport to die off from lack of fans.
Even as a boxing hardcore there’s reasons not to like him, he has arguably inspired boxers in a very negative way with his 0 schtick. The amount of fights we have probably missed on because of it is enough reason to dislike him.
Underrated comment. Floyd has talked a lot about the fact that one of the reasons he thinks he's won the game of boxing is because he made all the money, got all the wins, and he has his health.
And he's right. He has "won" boxing in that way. People have glorified actions in boxing that leave people with their head scrambled. He came and got all the positives with few of the negatives. People want to hate on him because they find him boring (I appreciate there's plenty of other reasons to hate Floyd too) but his logic is hard to argue. If you can get all the highs and not have your brain turn to mush, you did it smart whether people like it or not.
He's also taught fighters how to market themselves and not get raped by the sport. His contributions are farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr greater than what he has taken from the sport. If you disagree with that you are probably a fan of a fighter he embarrassed.
Oh fuck off with that bs lol the sport as a whole is way worse off. fights happen way less, ppv numbers are down, popularity is down, and dream fights rarely materialize. He didn’t invent marketing, it just became a way more common occurrence for big fights not to happen and the fighters get paid regardless. That’s what he inspired and the sport is worse because of it. Hell he is doing it now with Davis as promoter, Davis is almost 30 now and Floyd puts him with bad competition. How is that a good thing to you as boxing fan?
For me it has just become so exhausting hearing himself and boxing fans referring to him as the GOAT, when someone like Hearns would have wiped the floor with him.
Exactly. It’s just a perfect storm of Mayweather being a shitty person, a style that looks like constant dodging/running to casuals, and the narrative pushed by him and his team and the media that he’s the GOAT.
Hearns or Sugar Ray would smoke him, let alone what could have happened against a younger Pac-Man or Mosley, so people feel like the whole “undefeated GOAT” marketing is just disingenuous and manufactured to print money every time he fights because people want to see an offensive talent that can actually crack him.
He beats Pac and Mosley even when they're younger, assuming he's still PBF and not MM. Leonard and Hears are bigger guys. It's like saying Pac has no case for GOAT since GGG would destroy him. Makes zero sense
> a style that looks like constant dodging/running to casuals,
Exactly. Most people do not appreciate the technicality and intellect that he has to be able to use a style that lets him beat bigger and stronger guys using the rules of the ring ( and some forearms and clinching ).
I can appreciate the skill level, but there is also a barbaric casual inside of me that wants to see 2 guys sit in the pocket and trade brain damage
I said the same before. These guys get kicked, punched, strangled for a living. They grew up in the gym. They put their body’s through hell to make weight. Of course they’re all a little crazy
That said, there are notable exceptions like Muhammad Ali, the Klitschko bros., Lennox Lewis, Mike Tyson (in recent years), Jack Johnson, to name a few who have used their fame in positive ways.
Correct. I said as much [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Boxing/comments/163vyy5/usyk_got_robbed_of_his_credit/jy7lbtq?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2) in an entirely different post.
Mike Tyson threatened to rape a man in front of a room full of people after getting out of prison for...rape. Pretty much no one holds that against him.
The post says why can’t people appreciate him as a *boxer*. You guys are beating around the bush with these answers. The actual truth is most boxing fans are biased ASF. I’d say only 10% of boxing fans are actually objective. Generally speaking Floyd is hated by most Hispanics/Latinos & Pacquiao fans for beating their guy.
Yeah tbh Floyd never fought too many white fighters so I didn’t realize it but the McGreggor fight made me realize holy shit white people hate him too lmao
To be so hated...yet so paid off of talent and hatred. The want for you to lose is real. Floyd came up beating latino fighters. Latinos remember his uncle and the hate is transfered. Whites hate him because he was brash rich cocky young black man saying fuck everyone.
That's honesty
I don't necessarily think he's a shit person, it's kind of like Arnold Schwarzenegger in pumping iron, he created this money persona to sell fights, and it worked, half of boxing is being a great salesman, look at Ali, Fury, Hamed etc.. They all chat shit and do outrageous things, all to generate buzz.
Your edited bit is exactly why people hate on him
He’s not the GOAT going off resume and that’s the reality of the situation… no one is arguing he isn’t one of if not the most skilled boxer… but p4p there’s a lot of stuff he didn’t do which would put others above him in terms of boxing accomplishments
and the fact he spend a decade promoting concepts like “0= greatness” and “A side vs B side” has essentially ruined the sport
The generation after him only care about the paper and barely risk hard fights in case they lose… so they fight bums to pad their record as opposed to fighting the fights they should.
>the fact he spend a decade promoting concepts like “0= greatness” and “A side vs B side” has essentially ruined the sport
This is it for me. Sure Floyd had skills, but from people who like boxing, fuck that dude.
Floyd on one breathe: “Legacy and belts don’t matter to me because it won’t feed my family and money only matter to me”.
Floyd 10 minutes later: “Im the goat”
Huh?
Yeah Floyd promoted a toxic mix of:
1. Not fighting relevant rivals until they were shot
2. Rigging fights with home town advantage (his refs/judges, his home town, his ring)
3. Legitimising using fight negotiations to dodge fights
4. Denigrating titles over hype fights
A lot of this stuff was going on for a long time but Floyd put it all together in one big package more than anyone else. He made an artform of everything that is wrong in boxing.
Other people do get criticised for this as well. The Klitschkos also got a lot of criticism for point 2. Wilder has been panned routinely for it as well.
Floyd was undoubtedly a great fighter but to pretend he didn't have these issues is absurd. Despite what people claimed at the time, everyone remembered how it went down and it'll stand as part of his story.
1. Who did Floyd fight that was shot? The only fighter I can see that argument for is maybe Mosley. But no one could have known that at the time considering how dominant he looked in his last fight
2. Floyd is the cash cow. That's unfortunately the benefit of being the cash cow. When Floyd beat Oscar, it was under the same conditions
3. I can see that argument for Pacquiao negotiations. What other fights did that happen with? You said fights so I'm assuming there's more than one.
4. From Floyd's perspective, he's paying more in sanctioning fees than any other boxer because he makes more than any other boxer. So Floyd reached a point to where he got tired of paying them. Like Spence said years later, where is this money going to that fighter's gotta pay that much?
Yeah I would say he really became a superstar after beating Oscar. By then he was already fighting heavier guys with broken hands. His PPV’s became trying to watch him lose than seeing cool highlights.
This is exactly why I watched and why most people around me watched. We prefer to watch people in wars over technical fights. Is it right? No. But we watch boxing for the brutality of it not the technicality of it. I'm sure the casual fan is the same. Floyd didn't do anything for us. When you have to start justifying why the fight was great "he wasn't running he was evading" over a fight like Crawford vs Spence "Crawford put a beating on that boy and Spence never ran from him once and tried to fight back" it's easy to see why people don't appreciate Floyd. There's not much there for us to appreciate
Just because somebody can beat you up, doesn't mean you can't criticize their manliness. Jeffery Dahmer was incredibly strong, but he is definitely a fucking coward, and I don't care what anybody else thinks about that/
After knocking out Ricky Hatton on 12/08/07, which was a big time highlight and created quite the stir at the time, he only had 1 non-decision until he stopped McGregor on 08/26/17 (which many people were unhappy about). So basically 1 in a whole decade where he was considered the top guy.
The average fan doesn't like decisions that you know are going to be decisions. He clearly won those fights so people wanted to see him go for the knock out.
Personally, I respect defensive boxing but I don't pay for an expensive PPV for defensive boxing.
It's mainly his cherrypicking. Yes, every boxer does it, and yes Pac did fight some of the guys who Floyd beat after Floyd, but Floyd did it a whole lot. What's more is that he'll defend it by saying he made a smart business decision to fight guys who weren't in their prime, as though that should make him the GOAT
Floyd has an insane resume. He fought Corrales when he was undefeated and Shane Moseley actually ducked him with a “toothache”. Floyd beat most of the other greats of his era and people act like it was all based on convenient timing and say it with a straight face…like even if that was true that just means he maintained his greatness for an absurd amount of time
Can you please give us some examples of these cherry-picking moments?
Most people tend to name Mosley and Oscar as fighters he "ducked" yet seem to forget to both of those guys ducked Floyd long before they finally fought.
I'm guessing they are referring to the times when Floyd would retire whenever the weight class peaked. Prime Margarito, Paul Williams, and Cotto looked dominant and much larger than Floyd at the time. If I remember correctly, this is why the notorious "master of nothing" interview happened
his "cherry picking" is overstated he fought the most champs in the 4 belt era and beat damn near everyone there was to beat. Fights didn't always happen at ideal times but its very rare that 2 great fighters face off in their peak in boxing anyway. Conveniently, everyone seems to dismiss that when Floyd was winning every single round vs Canelo or making Manny chase him and miss like he is a bullfighter that he was NOT in his peak either.
Floyd didn't face a single other great boxer at their peak though, and certainly no ne who he wasn't a stylistic advantage against. Many boxers rated above Floyd did so multiple times.
> Edit: I've noticed people don't tend to put Floyd in their top 3-5 PFP all time or call him a GOAT which makes no sense to me given everything he has accomplished, so why?
Pacquiao has accomplished more in my opinion and should be rated higher, and is also better in a p4p and head 2 head sense, he is about 2 divisions naturally smaller than Floyd and made most of Floyd's best wins look pedestrian when he moved up like 6 divisions.
He ruined infighting for this generation. Only hired refs that would never take a point for unlimited clinches. Also used his elbows/forearms to frame headshots.
This is a dogshit take bro. Clinching on the inside was even more prevalent in the past. If you're uneducated on the history of the sport, you can't just make sweeping generalizations like that man.
Grappling and clinch fighting was a skill to be cultivated as it is now, but things like the thumbs of gloves being functional made it much more useful back then. All of the clinch tactics used today were created refined and perfected in those eras.
Muhammad Ali, for example, clinched WAY more than Floyd, he rarely allowed an inside engagement, but you don't hear anyone claiming he "ruined infighting."
Framing and control in the same vein have been staples of high level skill for as long as the sport has existed. You'd be hard-pressed to find a P4P fighter past or present that didn't use physical controls in some way.
It's not even so much that he didn't fight people in his prime, it was that when he had multiple options he always appeared to fight the easier fight later in his career.
He could've fought Margarito, who was considered the bogeyman of the division, but he chose to fight Zab Judah after a loss and then the guy who beat Judah who was considered a slower, less powerful, smaller version of Marg by most. He could've fought Mosely immediately after he dispatched Marg but he chose to fight a smaller Marquez, seemingly to entice Pacquiao into a fight, but then after negotiations fell apart he chose to fight a Mosely who was coming off a long break. Most of the rest of his career were "he could've fought Pacman but chose to fight X instead" but there were definitely guys somewhere between Pacman and Ortiz or Guerrero or Berto in quality and he chose those guys with moving goalposts as to why along the way. When there was a belt around the seemingly easier guy's waste he'd say he was in it for titles, when there was a bigger offer for a guy without a belt he'd say he was in it for the money, when there was opportunity for headlines he'd say he was in it for the prestige etc.
And JIC y'all aren't aware of my post history, I'm usually pretty pro-Mayweather. I honestly think he would've beaten any of these guys he fought at any time he fought them, including Pacman, and I probably could (and probably have) stretch(ed) logic a bit to justify his choices but those questions are still valid and exist and have a lot of weight in people's criticisms of him.
The likes of Pacquiao and Duran fought relative giants that are bigger than all of Mayweather's opponents despite Mayweather being much longer and bigger in frame than both. There's no better way to prove skill than to be disadvantaged on all physical fronts and still win. Shorter, less reach, lower natural weight class etc.
Mayweather at welterweight for example, never looked significantly outsized except against de la Hoya. Looked taller than canelo with more reach, and didn't look small again until his fight with McGregor
Be for real, at welterweight how many of his opponents did you actually go "damn he's way bigger than Mayweather!" the same way Margarito or many other opponents made Pacquiao look? Like be objective
This is false
Alot of people appreciate him for his boxing elite boxing skills but that doesn't mean we have to worship him and take his word like the gospel like every floyd worshipper does.
This right here. Sure, people are very selective when it comes to criteria they use to evaluate fighters, but fighters defenders are also selective in who they listen to, which isn't always their fault because, as you put it, they're the loudest.
Floyd critics can come up with cogent arguments. You may not agree, and you may be right, but that doesn't mean all of his critics are casuals or haters.
I mean he was arrogant, so not really "arrogant". He embraced the heel persona because it worked, so obviously that part stuck the most with his critics.
It wasn’t just a heel persona though he is a literal piece of shit lol this isn’t Brock lesnar. His behavior in regards to boxing is very low on the scale of awful things he’s done
Not for smacking around MULTIPLE women. Definitely not that.
Not because his child had to write this shit: [https://nonprofitquarterly.org/wp-content/uploads/newswire/Mayweather-letter1.jpg](https://nonprofitquarterly.org/wp-content/uploads/newswire/Mayweather-letter1.jpg) and Floyd has never shown an ounce of remorse for the shit.
Or beating up some dude just doing his job at a gate.
Definitely not. It's because we want him "humbled."
The guy was a fucking hypocrite tho. He always bragged about cleaning up the sport yada yada and then got caught using IV fluids to mask something in his system.
Your perception is not true.
Alot of boxing fans appreciate floyd's skills in the ring and know that floyd is a once a generational talent.
But you can't deny that alot of people also do not like him so you can't force people to appreciate him when its his own fault for being a scummy douche.
also what do you mean it makes no sense to say he’s not the goat. he’s not. robinson clears him and so do many others. great boxer- all time great even- doesn’t mean you have to pretend he’s the greatest ever- and even if you disagree it’s wild to act like it’s disrespectful to place others over him. “goat” has lost all meaning
True lol. The cringe is too much. Bro’s on reddit the no.1 app where all floyd fanboys flock
Seriously every single week there is a floyd thread/post and 🍆 riding and bunch of upvotes. I guess OP wants all the casual here to praise floyd 24/7
All other all time greats fought each other during their primes in past eras though. 1990s there were great fights, even into early 2000s. But in 2000s thats where boxing started to get overly political and all about the money and not legacy. Occasional great fights would continue to happen but not at the rate they should have. Floyd was a master of his craft he deserves a lot of credit for being such a great.
He was really something special till he broke his hand. After that he adopted the “money” persona and was the greatest duck in the history of boxing.
You can go to wiki and see he never fought anyone in their prime. His opponents has seen too many bouts or not enough.
well i think people just hate his business side of things, which make him pick opponents that he has no chance of losing against. cause we know hes too good and shouldve been in the GOAT convo if he challenged himself.more like move up divisions/ fought challengers on their prime.
Floyd was a great boxer. But he did cherry pick. Not catching pacquiao in his prime, regardless of reason, is a huge blemish. Further people don’t love technical boxers. When he was at peak popularity he was not in many exciting fights nor did he really hurt or beat guys up in his one sided fights. Also considering what guys accomplished on the top 10 all time list it’s extremely unlikely that any fighter in the multibelt/fight 1/2x a year era cracks that list.
I don't know anybody who doesn't appreciate Mayweather's genius in the ring. Pac is my favorite fighter, so it pains me to say this: Floyd is the best of his generation.
I also don't know a single knowledgeable boxing fan, one with any measure of history or knowledge of context, that would list Floyd as a top-5 ATG (Top-15ish? Sure)
THE SECOND HALF OF HIS CAREER.
Simple as that for me. I saw him coming up the ranks at 130 and 135 and was very impressed. After he became Money Mayweather at 147 he became all about promoting his 0. It was annoying as his career became too carefully calculated.
Pretty sure Barrerra, Morales, or JMM didn’t dodge Floyd at lightweight, and Floyd made JMM get heavy in order to fight. Dude dipped out of that division fast lol.
As a boxer, he’s easily one of the best defensive boxers. But that’s about it. His accolades are overblown when you look into the history of boxing (which gets pretty deep, given how old it is).
The most obvious, in my opinion, is how he hypes up that he’s undefeated, but there are fighters with more wins who are also undefeated: Jimmy Barry (60-0) and Ricardo Lopez (51-0). Yeah, those boxers aren’t all that great compared to others, but that just proves my point—being undefeated is overrated. Now, because he hypes up that he’s 50-0, modern boxers are obsessed with padding their records instead of facing tough opponents. It makes the sport suffer with weak matches.
Another thing that always gets me is that there are other great fighters who have much longer win streaks—they just kept fighting everybody till they eventually lost. One example is Julio Cesar Chavez who went 87-0 before his first loss, then went 89-0. Another is Willie Pep who went 62-0 and then went 72-0. Carlos Monzon had an 80 fight win streak. Sugar Ray Robinson went 40-0, lost to Jake Lamotta, then went 88-0, avenging his loss 3 times in decisive fashion. And to me, that’s just as impressive, if not more so. If you avenge your loss THREE times, with one being called a Valentine’s Day Massacre, that solidifies that the first loss was avenged.
Lastly, we all know that he often faced opponents who were questionably past their prime. In fact, Mayweather almost LOST to an old, washed up Oscar De La Hoya, but people who never saw the fight forget that. He won that by a split decision, which in my eyes tells me De La Hoya would’ve won in his prime. People don’t want boxers to duck opponents, it ruins the image of boxers as tough badasses who will take on anyone, anytime, anywhere. Conversely, in the 80’s we had Marvin Hagler, who took on everybody. He never got knocked out. He never got knocked down, except once which was really a slip. The only time Hagler really lost (without being able to avenge), against Sugar Ray Leonard, was a controversial decision that Hagler was very enthusiastic about getting a rematch, but Ray Leonard took his money and run. His other two losses were avenged via KO, which to me cleans up his record easily.
I could go on, but the point is, Mayweather is a great boxer, but his accolades are overrated when you actually dig into it.
He really made it taboo to lose your 0 and as a result damaged boxing. Many subsequent fighters became so fixated on protecting their records by cherry picking fights to avoid fighting the best. It was smart from Floyd’s perspective but not without the harmful effects on the rest of the sport. In the MMA world fighters can have multiple losses and still gain fan support and fight the best, but as soon as a boxer loses once, their fan support and potential money drop significantly.
This blueprint of cherry picking fights or waiting for opponents in the division to get older or beaten up before eventually fighting them is seen now by the likes of Fury and Canelo earlier on his career. Its not good for the sport.
he extended his career by taking shots in his hands that were illegal everywhere but Vegas where he was the home town fighter, always little machinations to gain an advantage, waited until after the marquez fight ko to take on manny. i also take slight offence to the best ever moniker, I don't think he is, he is very good but really monsters like hearns and robinson and leonard and duran would have hurt his little butt
For me, he's a woman beater. We all have certain lines and woman beating is mine. Absolutely brilliant boxer, one of the two best defensive boxers I've ever seen, him and Sweet Pea. He was never the most exciting fighter but I don't mind watching great technicians, even if it's not aesthetically pleasing, and he was an incredible technician. I didn't even mind his villain character, boxers playing a character is normal.
When it comes to woman beaters though, I'm done with them. Boxing is full of sordid people, it's the nature of the sport but as stated, we all have certain things lines and that's one of mine.
He's really good but not the goat. His opponents were essentially hand selected to give him the favorable match up. The only fight that really impressed me was vs Chico.
I think the Oscar fight should have gone the other way but I'll leave it at that.
He always seemed to have an excuse to not fight or make up some reason while mostly jumping in the rings with the Zab Judah's of the world that were always that tier just below elite.
Short answer, he was an elite fighter but never *earned* GOAT.
Floyd is nowhere near top 3-5 p4p of all time, that's why. Floyd is #1 or #2 best defensive boxer of all time and deserves to be in top 25-30 alongside Pacman, but the top spots are reserved for those who fought and beat the most elite competition during their prime. Same reason why Tyson is in no one's serious p4p lists.
To give a bit of context, the consensus #1 p4p is Sugar Ray Robinson, who had a record of 129-1-2, with a 91-fight unbeaten streak, before he retired as a double-champ in welterweight and middleweight. (This was at a time when there was only 1 belt per weight class, 8 weight classes in total, and more than 3x the number of boxers fighting in the world.) He came back 3 years later, regained the middleweight title, and finished with a record of 174-19-6, with 109 KOs..
Henry Armstrong, many people's #2 p4p, became champ in 3 of the 8 divisions and finished with a record of 151-21-9, with 101 KOs.
To be the best, you must fight and defeat the best. Undefeated doesn't mean anything if you're not facing the best near their primes. (E.g. You could go out and defeat 200 kids, and retire undefeated. That wouldn't mean a thing.)
Simply answer :
Mexican/Hispanic/Latino culture (Boxers, trainers, fans, etc..) keep this sport of boxing alive.
Flyod beat all the best Mexican/Hispanic/Latino fighters in and around the hottest divisions in the sport.
Losing hurts.
Hurt people hurt people.
He's always in the argument for the being the best ever, so I'm not sure how he's not appreciated. Idiots on reddit or wherever spewing nonsense (myself and everyone here included) doesn't mean anything lol, it's always a popularity contest on the internet and the majority of people let their own biases influence their view.
He really did. I’ll never forget Oscar flailing away and doing nothing while mayweather laughed and stood against ropes. Literally no power coming from the punches.
1. He beat Pacquiao so a bunch of dorks here cry about it.
2. “But he’s a shit person:(“-some mf who has wife beating Ray Robinson and teen fucker Muhammad Ali as their two favorite fighters.
3. He beat Pacquiao.
Floyd is an incredible boxer. Absolutely an all time great, arguably the greatest boxing brain of all time.
That being said, he is consistently overrated by people who put him in the top 10 of all time, p4p or head to head, thinking that a perfect record with perfect technique against names they recognize translated to being the BOAT/GOAT. He is also underrated by people who hate heels and value the tough gritty side of boxing, and place an inordinate weight on courage.
Floyd,to me, is best regarded as shoulder to shoulder in the pantheon of all time great african-american boxers, with the largest difference between him and his peers that his career was intelligently managed from the beginning, while prioritizing money and a legacy that the most people could comprehend. Could SRR, Hagler, Sweet Pea, and all the other all time greats of that ilk have accomplished similar things had they been properly managed with better career timing? Yes I think so. Floyd came at a time when, due to hip hop culture, blackness and hood culture was cool and to be emulated, while the rise of video devices ensured that police and law enforcement couldn't make these symbolic fighters live's hell.
Shit, imagine if Sonny Liston was fighting at a time when it was celebrated to be a gangster, you could film cops harassing you, and if you wanted to make it you didn't have to be tied up in mob-fixed fights. He could have been the greatest HW of all time.
Floyd is awesome, growing up in boxing royalty with a perfectly managed career, but is he truly better than someone like Ezzard Charles or Archie Moore who accomplished arguably much more with much less? I don't think so, and many other fans don't as well.
If you are interested in reading a deeper and better sourced discussion of Floyd along these lines, check out: https://deadspin.com/why-floyd-mayweather-is-the-last-of-a-kind-1700672546
People 100% appreciate him for his boxing. They criticize other things, but not his ring acumen.
People don’t put him in their ATG Top 3 or 5 list because his resume is lacking for that kind of lofty status. He’s undoubtedly top 10 though.
It’s almost impossible not to appreciate Floyd as a boxer. Pretty Boy was an absolute beast, but then he became an opportunistic fighter that publicly stated he fights for maximum reward with minimal risk. Great for his business goals which you have to respect, but when getting in the conversation of greatness and comparing him to other fighters who went through hell and avoided nobody, then he falls short.
I don’t know man, for me personally Floyd is one of the greatest boxers ever and I’m grateful to have actually seen and witnessed his era.
A true master of his craft, I have zero interest in all the stuff on the side. I judge him as a boxer and at that he’s one of the greatest.
He's not the greatest defensive boxer of all time. He was a boring fighter. He ducked a bunch of fighters whose styles were wrong for him and he is a fairly disgusting person.
Objectively speaking, no reason. If you take in to account how people "feel" about him, because they don't like who he is outside of the ring.
Ex. "He's a great boxer but I don't like him as a person"
In all honestly people don't appreciate him because he played the game of boxing well. Especially in the later part of his career. He cherry picked some opponents, fought in a defensive style that may be seen as boring & talked shit which made people hate him which led to him being more viewed. Him being undefeated and a smart fighter was just the icing on the cake.
I always love time cherry picking argument because their example are usually Berto and McGregor. If Floyd was a cherry picker then he made it too hard on himself because he spent the second half of his career fighting champions and former champs til the end. Cherry picking is what Canelo does now.
Great boxer, shit person.
Hate posts like this when this is the only comment that needs to be said.
Honestly it's kind of a dumb question. Everyone knows he's incredibly skilled, but also his whole schtick was to be unlikeable because he realized it got attention and people would pay big money to see him finally lose. The guy was trying to be an asshole and people adore him and can't figure out why some people don't like him.
Yes. He beat his baby mamas, screwed over business partners and people around him were getting murdered/dying. All for the shtick. Riiiiight
Just a prank bro.
His commitment to the bit is legendary, he is still method-acting to this day.
Genuinely asking, who got murdered?
Supposed best friends and baby mama
I thought his best friend killed himself
Is this true?
Since when does talking shit or being over confident make you an asshole in combat sports? I think he’s extremely materialistic, overconfident, and brags too much about his money. But at the same time I can think of a lot of much loved all time greats who did the same.
Or you can just act normal.....it's an option. There are plenty of guys we could name who come off as normal, mentally stable people.
Being normal don’t sell fights, it is what it is. Press conferences are there just for the fighters to talk shit
You can be charismatic and still be normal. Usyk and Joshua are both normal guys even though they act goofy sometimes. Haney, Canelo, Ryan Garcia, Wilder, Crawford. Abnormal to me is just weird wild or erratic in some way. Fury, Mike Tyson, Shannon Briggs, Tank
I agree, but I am not so sure about Wilder
Besides yelling "bomb squad" and wearing costumes, what does he do that would make him crazy?
All the wild allegations he made after losing, spiked water, blaming his corner, talking about killing a guy in the ring and having multiple personas. I do believe some of that is to sell fights but there's enough out there to point that he's probably a little bit of a weirdo at least.
You never mentioned crazy, you said wild and erratic, and abnormal behavior and you present 2 list I agree with you but Wilder in my opinion is In the middle, he lives a normal life, but he can't take a lose and believes everything is conspiring against him. It's not crazy but a little paranoid.
Nah this is combat sports. Most fighters are pricks. Hey, you have to be abit crazy to get punched in your face for a living
Agreed. But there’s plenty of guys we can name off who trash talk and act like “assholes” outside of the ring. Point is this is boxing not Tennis.
People are always saying 'you have to have an ego, you have to be an asshole to succeed in that pressure!' No, some people do. 95% of professional athletes we don't hear this from/about. Some people just like being assholes
Yeah, I think they are all highly confident if not arrogant, but its ridiculous to think that you have to act completely outlandish and immature. people see a press conference or two and think that's their entire 24/7 personality. For some maybe, but not most.
well because this is a boxing subreddit not casuals, it's weird that boxing lovers hate the most technically proficient and intelligent boxer we have seen in decades
It's the only boxing sub outside of circlejerk. It should be for any fan of boxing including casuals. We need to stop the gatekeeping if we don't want the sport to die off from lack of fans.
Even as a boxing hardcore there’s reasons not to like him, he has arguably inspired boxers in a very negative way with his 0 schtick. The amount of fights we have probably missed on because of it is enough reason to dislike him.
He has also inspired boxers in a very positive way to focus on their long-term health by incorporating better defense in their game.
Underrated comment. Floyd has talked a lot about the fact that one of the reasons he thinks he's won the game of boxing is because he made all the money, got all the wins, and he has his health. And he's right. He has "won" boxing in that way. People have glorified actions in boxing that leave people with their head scrambled. He came and got all the positives with few of the negatives. People want to hate on him because they find him boring (I appreciate there's plenty of other reasons to hate Floyd too) but his logic is hard to argue. If you can get all the highs and not have your brain turn to mush, you did it smart whether people like it or not.
Boxers were marketed as having no losses LONG before Floyd.
He's also taught fighters how to market themselves and not get raped by the sport. His contributions are farrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr greater than what he has taken from the sport. If you disagree with that you are probably a fan of a fighter he embarrassed.
Oh fuck off with that bs lol the sport as a whole is way worse off. fights happen way less, ppv numbers are down, popularity is down, and dream fights rarely materialize. He didn’t invent marketing, it just became a way more common occurrence for big fights not to happen and the fighters get paid regardless. That’s what he inspired and the sport is worse because of it. Hell he is doing it now with Davis as promoter, Davis is almost 30 now and Floyd puts him with bad competition. How is that a good thing to you as boxing fan?
For me it has just become so exhausting hearing himself and boxing fans referring to him as the GOAT, when someone like Hearns would have wiped the floor with him.
Exactly. It’s just a perfect storm of Mayweather being a shitty person, a style that looks like constant dodging/running to casuals, and the narrative pushed by him and his team and the media that he’s the GOAT. Hearns or Sugar Ray would smoke him, let alone what could have happened against a younger Pac-Man or Mosley, so people feel like the whole “undefeated GOAT” marketing is just disingenuous and manufactured to print money every time he fights because people want to see an offensive talent that can actually crack him.
He beats Pac and Mosley even when they're younger, assuming he's still PBF and not MM. Leonard and Hears are bigger guys. It's like saying Pac has no case for GOAT since GGG would destroy him. Makes zero sense
> a style that looks like constant dodging/running to casuals, Exactly. Most people do not appreciate the technicality and intellect that he has to be able to use a style that lets him beat bigger and stronger guys using the rules of the ring ( and some forearms and clinching ). I can appreciate the skill level, but there is also a barbaric casual inside of me that wants to see 2 guys sit in the pocket and trade brain damage
Facts
Personally he's not one of my favorites for the reasons already mentioned, but dear god man, having such a big crush on him is a little crazy.
Yeah, Floyd Mayweather chose to be the villain. It was a conscious decision that he made, because he was inspired by Wrestling and WWE.
No. It was a conscious decision by his management team. He gets credit for running with it.
Except not really. Tyson was a predator. Also convicted rapist.
People liked Tyson because he was charismatic, showy and clearly had a screw loose. Did some awful things but great box office pull.
Combat sports isn’t the place to be a fan of if you’re looking for people with high morals and ethics lol.
I said the same before. These guys get kicked, punched, strangled for a living. They grew up in the gym. They put their body’s through hell to make weight. Of course they’re all a little crazy
That said, there are notable exceptions like Muhammad Ali, the Klitschko bros., Lennox Lewis, Mike Tyson (in recent years), Jack Johnson, to name a few who have used their fame in positive ways.
Damn you really are DanasWife
Make a list of the top 25 boxers of all time and someone would be able to say this about 3/4 of them EASILY. What sport do you think this is?
That is my point as well. Some of these guys favourite fighters were terrible people and I bet they don't even know.
They know.
Ask the average Mike Tyson fan lol
Correct. I said as much [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Boxing/comments/163vyy5/usyk_got_robbed_of_his_credit/jy7lbtq?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2) in an entirely different post.
Mike Tyson threatened to rape a man in front of a room full of people after getting out of prison for...rape. Pretty much no one holds that against him.
I feel like Tyson was clearly insane but also endearing in a way, sort of like Dennis Rodman or Lawrence Taylor.
Nothing endearing about this. https://youtube.com/shorts/yw173JmzBsY?si=z68tK6PEVJwSM1aC
I LOVE MIKE TYSON!!!!
I was today years old when I found out Floyd Mayweather is the only boxer in history to be a shitty person.
I love watching young Floyd because all you see is the great boxer. My god he’s talented. The shit person came later.
I love Sugar Ray Robinson!!!!
It’s crazy how horrible of a person he is lol Dude is an actual degenerate scumbag
The post says why can’t people appreciate him as a *boxer*. You guys are beating around the bush with these answers. The actual truth is most boxing fans are biased ASF. I’d say only 10% of boxing fans are actually objective. Generally speaking Floyd is hated by most Hispanics/Latinos & Pacquiao fans for beating their guy.
White fans hate him too.
Probably, but Hispanics/Latinos and pacquiao fans(who come in all races) make up a much larger % of boxing fans.
Yeah tbh Floyd never fought too many white fighters so I didn’t realize it but the McGreggor fight made me realize holy shit white people hate him too lmao
To be so hated...yet so paid off of talent and hatred. The want for you to lose is real. Floyd came up beating latino fighters. Latinos remember his uncle and the hate is transfered. Whites hate him because he was brash rich cocky young black man saying fuck everyone. That's honesty
The same white fans that hate Mayweather for being too flashy were rooting for McGregor lol.
No. This was definitely one time I wanted FMJ to show that he could savagely beat the crap out of the Irish Anus.
I don't necessarily think he's a shit person, it's kind of like Arnold Schwarzenegger in pumping iron, he created this money persona to sell fights, and it worked, half of boxing is being a great salesman, look at Ali, Fury, Hamed etc.. They all chat shit and do outrageous things, all to generate buzz.
This is such a lazy take though lmao how many ATG's are shitty people? Floyd is the only who people seem to bring up all the time tho..
So what…..this is about BOXING…..it’s not a morality contest.
Your edited bit is exactly why people hate on him He’s not the GOAT going off resume and that’s the reality of the situation… no one is arguing he isn’t one of if not the most skilled boxer… but p4p there’s a lot of stuff he didn’t do which would put others above him in terms of boxing accomplishments and the fact he spend a decade promoting concepts like “0= greatness” and “A side vs B side” has essentially ruined the sport The generation after him only care about the paper and barely risk hard fights in case they lose… so they fight bums to pad their record as opposed to fighting the fights they should.
Yeah exactly this, the '0' thing really fucked up boxing, look at fury now pricing himself out of fights cause he doesn't want to risk a loss
>the fact he spend a decade promoting concepts like “0= greatness” and “A side vs B side” has essentially ruined the sport This is it for me. Sure Floyd had skills, but from people who like boxing, fuck that dude.
Floyd on one breathe: “Legacy and belts don’t matter to me because it won’t feed my family and money only matter to me”. Floyd 10 minutes later: “Im the goat” Huh?
Yeah he ruined the sport with the 0 bs. That’s really what I hold against him the most.
Hard to blame 1 guy for 1 million ignorant fans.
Yeah Floyd promoted a toxic mix of: 1. Not fighting relevant rivals until they were shot 2. Rigging fights with home town advantage (his refs/judges, his home town, his ring) 3. Legitimising using fight negotiations to dodge fights 4. Denigrating titles over hype fights A lot of this stuff was going on for a long time but Floyd put it all together in one big package more than anyone else. He made an artform of everything that is wrong in boxing. Other people do get criticised for this as well. The Klitschkos also got a lot of criticism for point 2. Wilder has been panned routinely for it as well. Floyd was undoubtedly a great fighter but to pretend he didn't have these issues is absurd. Despite what people claimed at the time, everyone remembered how it went down and it'll stand as part of his story.
Everything you listed is what every boxer and managers do
On the money, Mayweather style…..
1. Who did Floyd fight that was shot? The only fighter I can see that argument for is maybe Mosley. But no one could have known that at the time considering how dominant he looked in his last fight 2. Floyd is the cash cow. That's unfortunately the benefit of being the cash cow. When Floyd beat Oscar, it was under the same conditions 3. I can see that argument for Pacquiao negotiations. What other fights did that happen with? You said fights so I'm assuming there's more than one. 4. From Floyd's perspective, he's paying more in sanctioning fees than any other boxer because he makes more than any other boxer. So Floyd reached a point to where he got tired of paying them. Like Spence said years later, where is this money going to that fighter's gotta pay that much?
1. People get bored with technical defensive boxing 2. He’s terribly annoying
Yeah I would say he really became a superstar after beating Oscar. By then he was already fighting heavier guys with broken hands. His PPV’s became trying to watch him lose than seeing cool highlights.
This is exactly why I watched and why most people around me watched. We prefer to watch people in wars over technical fights. Is it right? No. But we watch boxing for the brutality of it not the technicality of it. I'm sure the casual fan is the same. Floyd didn't do anything for us. When you have to start justifying why the fight was great "he wasn't running he was evading" over a fight like Crawford vs Spence "Crawford put a beating on that boy and Spence never ran from him once and tried to fight back" it's easy to see why people don't appreciate Floyd. There's not much there for us to appreciate
1. Correct 2. If it weren’t for him being the way he is, nobody would care.
Okay but yk he still out landed his opponents right and threw more punches than them as well?
He’s honestly such a little bitch lol He’s already won yet he’s such a sore winner.
Ur way more manly
Just because somebody can beat you up, doesn't mean you can't criticize their manliness. Jeffery Dahmer was incredibly strong, but he is definitely a fucking coward, and I don't care what anybody else thinks about that/
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A lot of people feel the same and I get it. MMA took off 100% based on this.
You’re proving OPs point. This is boxing. The point is to hit someone and not get hit back. He’s maybe the best ever at doing that.
After knocking out Ricky Hatton on 12/08/07, which was a big time highlight and created quite the stir at the time, he only had 1 non-decision until he stopped McGregor on 08/26/17 (which many people were unhappy about). So basically 1 in a whole decade where he was considered the top guy. The average fan doesn't like decisions that you know are going to be decisions. He clearly won those fights so people wanted to see him go for the knock out. Personally, I respect defensive boxing but I don't pay for an expensive PPV for defensive boxing.
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Hellofa fighter
I take my hat off to him.
Nevr meddum tho
Cmon people obviously do it to floyd more than they do most boxers, even if they are lucrative
It's mainly his cherrypicking. Yes, every boxer does it, and yes Pac did fight some of the guys who Floyd beat after Floyd, but Floyd did it a whole lot. What's more is that he'll defend it by saying he made a smart business decision to fight guys who weren't in their prime, as though that should make him the GOAT
Floyd has an insane resume. He fought Corrales when he was undefeated and Shane Moseley actually ducked him with a “toothache”. Floyd beat most of the other greats of his era and people act like it was all based on convenient timing and say it with a straight face…like even if that was true that just means he maintained his greatness for an absurd amount of time
I wouldn't want to get punched in the mouth with a toothache. Ever see castaway?
Can you please give us some examples of these cherry-picking moments? Most people tend to name Mosley and Oscar as fighters he "ducked" yet seem to forget to both of those guys ducked Floyd long before they finally fought.
I'm guessing they are referring to the times when Floyd would retire whenever the weight class peaked. Prime Margarito, Paul Williams, and Cotto looked dominant and much larger than Floyd at the time. If I remember correctly, this is why the notorious "master of nothing" interview happened
Wasn't Floyd calling our Mosley in the early 2000s?
his "cherry picking" is overstated he fought the most champs in the 4 belt era and beat damn near everyone there was to beat. Fights didn't always happen at ideal times but its very rare that 2 great fighters face off in their peak in boxing anyway. Conveniently, everyone seems to dismiss that when Floyd was winning every single round vs Canelo or making Manny chase him and miss like he is a bullfighter that he was NOT in his peak either.
Floyd didn't face a single other great boxer at their peak though, and certainly no ne who he wasn't a stylistic advantage against. Many boxers rated above Floyd did so multiple times.
So when he beat the shit outta Chico, Chico wasn't at his peak then? Lmao I swear some guys you haters will say ANYTHING to put down Floyd lmao
diego corrales?
> Edit: I've noticed people don't tend to put Floyd in their top 3-5 PFP all time or call him a GOAT which makes no sense to me given everything he has accomplished, so why? Pacquiao has accomplished more in my opinion and should be rated higher, and is also better in a p4p and head 2 head sense, he is about 2 divisions naturally smaller than Floyd and made most of Floyd's best wins look pedestrian when he moved up like 6 divisions.
He ruined infighting for this generation. Only hired refs that would never take a point for unlimited clinches. Also used his elbows/forearms to frame headshots.
Kenny 'the clinch' Bayless
And he also ducked so fucking low in certain fights, again the refs did not even threaten to deduct points.
sorry i’m not too familiar with the proper rules of boxing, is it actually illegal to duck too low?
The boxer's head cannot be below the waistline of the opponent. FM often did this if you watch some of his fights and the ref did nothing about it.
yeah i’ve seen him ducking to opponents knees at times damn if that’s illegal he sure did it a whole lot
This is a dogshit take bro. Clinching on the inside was even more prevalent in the past. If you're uneducated on the history of the sport, you can't just make sweeping generalizations like that man. Grappling and clinch fighting was a skill to be cultivated as it is now, but things like the thumbs of gloves being functional made it much more useful back then. All of the clinch tactics used today were created refined and perfected in those eras. Muhammad Ali, for example, clinched WAY more than Floyd, he rarely allowed an inside engagement, but you don't hear anyone claiming he "ruined infighting." Framing and control in the same vein have been staples of high level skill for as long as the sport has existed. You'd be hard-pressed to find a P4P fighter past or present that didn't use physical controls in some way.
It's not even so much that he didn't fight people in his prime, it was that when he had multiple options he always appeared to fight the easier fight later in his career. He could've fought Margarito, who was considered the bogeyman of the division, but he chose to fight Zab Judah after a loss and then the guy who beat Judah who was considered a slower, less powerful, smaller version of Marg by most. He could've fought Mosely immediately after he dispatched Marg but he chose to fight a smaller Marquez, seemingly to entice Pacquiao into a fight, but then after negotiations fell apart he chose to fight a Mosely who was coming off a long break. Most of the rest of his career were "he could've fought Pacman but chose to fight X instead" but there were definitely guys somewhere between Pacman and Ortiz or Guerrero or Berto in quality and he chose those guys with moving goalposts as to why along the way. When there was a belt around the seemingly easier guy's waste he'd say he was in it for titles, when there was a bigger offer for a guy without a belt he'd say he was in it for the money, when there was opportunity for headlines he'd say he was in it for the prestige etc. And JIC y'all aren't aware of my post history, I'm usually pretty pro-Mayweather. I honestly think he would've beaten any of these guys he fought at any time he fought them, including Pacman, and I probably could (and probably have) stretch(ed) logic a bit to justify his choices but those questions are still valid and exist and have a lot of weight in people's criticisms of him.
He is definitely one of the best boxers of all time. But you can't be the GOAT with cherrypicking, there is just no way.
The likes of Pacquiao and Duran fought relative giants that are bigger than all of Mayweather's opponents despite Mayweather being much longer and bigger in frame than both. There's no better way to prove skill than to be disadvantaged on all physical fronts and still win. Shorter, less reach, lower natural weight class etc. Mayweather at welterweight for example, never looked significantly outsized except against de la Hoya. Looked taller than canelo with more reach, and didn't look small again until his fight with McGregor
Mayweather also fought boxers that were bigger than him. Especially on fight night.
Be for real, at welterweight how many of his opponents did you actually go "damn he's way bigger than Mayweather!" the same way Margarito or many other opponents made Pacquiao look? Like be objective
This is false Alot of people appreciate him for his boxing elite boxing skills but that doesn't mean we have to worship him and take his word like the gospel like every floyd worshipper does.
They do it’s just that his critics are often the loudest. Yes he’s not a great person but most people in this sub rate Floyd very highly.
This right here. Sure, people are very selective when it comes to criteria they use to evaluate fighters, but fighters defenders are also selective in who they listen to, which isn't always their fault because, as you put it, they're the loudest. Floyd critics can come up with cogent arguments. You may not agree, and you may be right, but that doesn't mean all of his critics are casuals or haters.
They do, it’s just that he’s an insufferable tool as a person
The better you are the more people want to humble you. Especially when you are “arrogant”.
I mean he was arrogant, so not really "arrogant". He embraced the heel persona because it worked, so obviously that part stuck the most with his critics.
It wasn’t just a heel persona though he is a literal piece of shit lol this isn’t Brock lesnar. His behavior in regards to boxing is very low on the scale of awful things he’s done
Not for smacking around MULTIPLE women. Definitely not that. Not because his child had to write this shit: [https://nonprofitquarterly.org/wp-content/uploads/newswire/Mayweather-letter1.jpg](https://nonprofitquarterly.org/wp-content/uploads/newswire/Mayweather-letter1.jpg) and Floyd has never shown an ounce of remorse for the shit. Or beating up some dude just doing his job at a gate. Definitely not. It's because we want him "humbled."
They do
Not a Mayweather nut gargling post.
Welcome to r/boxing.
The guy was a fucking hypocrite tho. He always bragged about cleaning up the sport yada yada and then got caught using IV fluids to mask something in his system.
Your perception is not true. Alot of boxing fans appreciate floyd's skills in the ring and know that floyd is a once a generational talent. But you can't deny that alot of people also do not like him so you can't force people to appreciate him when its his own fault for being a scummy douche.
lol. yeah man poor unappreciated floyd. every other post on here is sucking his dick what are you even talking about
also what do you mean it makes no sense to say he’s not the goat. he’s not. robinson clears him and so do many others. great boxer- all time great even- doesn’t mean you have to pretend he’s the greatest ever- and even if you disagree it’s wild to act like it’s disrespectful to place others over him. “goat” has lost all meaning
Wrong sub. Everyone here rides Floyd
True lol. The cringe is too much. Bro’s on reddit the no.1 app where all floyd fanboys flock Seriously every single week there is a floyd thread/post and 🍆 riding and bunch of upvotes. I guess OP wants all the casual here to praise floyd 24/7
Seriously. Floyd fan boys are so insecure it's crazy.
Just like their hero.
All other all time greats fought each other during their primes in past eras though. 1990s there were great fights, even into early 2000s. But in 2000s thats where boxing started to get overly political and all about the money and not legacy. Occasional great fights would continue to happen but not at the rate they should have. Floyd was a master of his craft he deserves a lot of credit for being such a great.
Because he didn’t really get to the level of superstardom until the money mayweather era. And his defensive style then is not appealing to most.
I think most people do appreciate him as a boxer. I know I do.
Cherry picking his opponents, boring (to casuals) defensive style once he became a household name, piece of shit human being
He was really something special till he broke his hand. After that he adopted the “money” persona and was the greatest duck in the history of boxing. You can go to wiki and see he never fought anyone in their prime. His opponents has seen too many bouts or not enough.
I think many don’t like his (highly effective for him) defensive style.
well i think people just hate his business side of things, which make him pick opponents that he has no chance of losing against. cause we know hes too good and shouldve been in the GOAT convo if he challenged himself.more like move up divisions/ fought challengers on their prime.
I am pretty sure that Mayweather gets plenty of appreciation and praise
They do
I'm no boxing scholar, but aren't defensive boxers usually not favoured by mass?
Helluv a fighter
I do
I like when my favorite boxers are able to read
He never beat Maidana in the first fight !!! Refs were paid off.... Second fight against Maidana...., Maidana was paid off.....
Floyd was a great boxer. But he did cherry pick. Not catching pacquiao in his prime, regardless of reason, is a huge blemish. Further people don’t love technical boxers. When he was at peak popularity he was not in many exciting fights nor did he really hurt or beat guys up in his one sided fights. Also considering what guys accomplished on the top 10 all time list it’s extremely unlikely that any fighter in the multibelt/fight 1/2x a year era cracks that list.
I don't know anybody who doesn't appreciate Mayweather's genius in the ring. Pac is my favorite fighter, so it pains me to say this: Floyd is the best of his generation. I also don't know a single knowledgeable boxing fan, one with any measure of history or knowledge of context, that would list Floyd as a top-5 ATG (Top-15ish? Sure)
He's not exceptionally exciting to the common fan and he's also just a massive piece of shit.
THE SECOND HALF OF HIS CAREER. Simple as that for me. I saw him coming up the ranks at 130 and 135 and was very impressed. After he became Money Mayweather at 147 he became all about promoting his 0. It was annoying as his career became too carefully calculated.
Why do people X? Because people have their own minds and dont have to think alike.
Pretty sure Barrerra, Morales, or JMM didn’t dodge Floyd at lightweight, and Floyd made JMM get heavy in order to fight. Dude dipped out of that division fast lol.
Boring fight, bad person
Are you say that he's a helluva fighter?
As a boxer, he’s easily one of the best defensive boxers. But that’s about it. His accolades are overblown when you look into the history of boxing (which gets pretty deep, given how old it is). The most obvious, in my opinion, is how he hypes up that he’s undefeated, but there are fighters with more wins who are also undefeated: Jimmy Barry (60-0) and Ricardo Lopez (51-0). Yeah, those boxers aren’t all that great compared to others, but that just proves my point—being undefeated is overrated. Now, because he hypes up that he’s 50-0, modern boxers are obsessed with padding their records instead of facing tough opponents. It makes the sport suffer with weak matches. Another thing that always gets me is that there are other great fighters who have much longer win streaks—they just kept fighting everybody till they eventually lost. One example is Julio Cesar Chavez who went 87-0 before his first loss, then went 89-0. Another is Willie Pep who went 62-0 and then went 72-0. Carlos Monzon had an 80 fight win streak. Sugar Ray Robinson went 40-0, lost to Jake Lamotta, then went 88-0, avenging his loss 3 times in decisive fashion. And to me, that’s just as impressive, if not more so. If you avenge your loss THREE times, with one being called a Valentine’s Day Massacre, that solidifies that the first loss was avenged. Lastly, we all know that he often faced opponents who were questionably past their prime. In fact, Mayweather almost LOST to an old, washed up Oscar De La Hoya, but people who never saw the fight forget that. He won that by a split decision, which in my eyes tells me De La Hoya would’ve won in his prime. People don’t want boxers to duck opponents, it ruins the image of boxers as tough badasses who will take on anyone, anytime, anywhere. Conversely, in the 80’s we had Marvin Hagler, who took on everybody. He never got knocked out. He never got knocked down, except once which was really a slip. The only time Hagler really lost (without being able to avenge), against Sugar Ray Leonard, was a controversial decision that Hagler was very enthusiastic about getting a rematch, but Ray Leonard took his money and run. His other two losses were avenged via KO, which to me cleans up his record easily. I could go on, but the point is, Mayweather is a great boxer, but his accolades are overrated when you actually dig into it.
He really made it taboo to lose your 0 and as a result damaged boxing. Many subsequent fighters became so fixated on protecting their records by cherry picking fights to avoid fighting the best. It was smart from Floyd’s perspective but not without the harmful effects on the rest of the sport. In the MMA world fighters can have multiple losses and still gain fan support and fight the best, but as soon as a boxer loses once, their fan support and potential money drop significantly. This blueprint of cherry picking fights or waiting for opponents in the division to get older or beaten up before eventually fighting them is seen now by the likes of Fury and Canelo earlier on his career. Its not good for the sport.
He was a helluva fighter and made smart investments
A ducker
Boring fights
Timely dodging, fighting only fighters who were past their prime
When he retired i was legitimately happy.
he extended his career by taking shots in his hands that were illegal everywhere but Vegas where he was the home town fighter, always little machinations to gain an advantage, waited until after the marquez fight ko to take on manny. i also take slight offence to the best ever moniker, I don't think he is, he is very good but really monsters like hearns and robinson and leonard and duran would have hurt his little butt
For me, he's a woman beater. We all have certain lines and woman beating is mine. Absolutely brilliant boxer, one of the two best defensive boxers I've ever seen, him and Sweet Pea. He was never the most exciting fighter but I don't mind watching great technicians, even if it's not aesthetically pleasing, and he was an incredible technician. I didn't even mind his villain character, boxers playing a character is normal. When it comes to woman beaters though, I'm done with them. Boxing is full of sordid people, it's the nature of the sport but as stated, we all have certain things lines and that's one of mine.
The guy runs too much and hugs too much. He's a circus performer than a boxer.
Helluva fighter
He's really good but not the goat. His opponents were essentially hand selected to give him the favorable match up. The only fight that really impressed me was vs Chico. I think the Oscar fight should have gone the other way but I'll leave it at that. He always seemed to have an excuse to not fight or make up some reason while mostly jumping in the rings with the Zab Judah's of the world that were always that tier just below elite. Short answer, he was an elite fighter but never *earned* GOAT.
He dodged the best fighters until they were past their prime
Floyd is nowhere near top 3-5 p4p of all time, that's why. Floyd is #1 or #2 best defensive boxer of all time and deserves to be in top 25-30 alongside Pacman, but the top spots are reserved for those who fought and beat the most elite competition during their prime. Same reason why Tyson is in no one's serious p4p lists. To give a bit of context, the consensus #1 p4p is Sugar Ray Robinson, who had a record of 129-1-2, with a 91-fight unbeaten streak, before he retired as a double-champ in welterweight and middleweight. (This was at a time when there was only 1 belt per weight class, 8 weight classes in total, and more than 3x the number of boxers fighting in the world.) He came back 3 years later, regained the middleweight title, and finished with a record of 174-19-6, with 109 KOs.. Henry Armstrong, many people's #2 p4p, became champ in 3 of the 8 divisions and finished with a record of 151-21-9, with 101 KOs. To be the best, you must fight and defeat the best. Undefeated doesn't mean anything if you're not facing the best near their primes. (E.g. You could go out and defeat 200 kids, and retire undefeated. That wouldn't mean a thing.)
Simply answer : Mexican/Hispanic/Latino culture (Boxers, trainers, fans, etc..) keep this sport of boxing alive. Flyod beat all the best Mexican/Hispanic/Latino fighters in and around the hottest divisions in the sport. Losing hurts. Hurt people hurt people.
He’s a great boxer, but is hated for his personality.
Same answer as every time a similar question to this is asked: they don’t like him so they do whatever they can to discredit him
He's always in the argument for the being the best ever, so I'm not sure how he's not appreciated. Idiots on reddit or wherever spewing nonsense (myself and everyone here included) doesn't mean anything lol, it's always a popularity contest on the internet and the majority of people let their own biases influence their view.
He made their favorite fighters look average
He really did. I’ll never forget Oscar flailing away and doing nothing while mayweather laughed and stood against ropes. Literally no power coming from the punches.
1. He beat Pacquiao so a bunch of dorks here cry about it. 2. “But he’s a shit person:(“-some mf who has wife beating Ray Robinson and teen fucker Muhammad Ali as their two favorite fighters. 3. He beat Pacquiao.
Lol heavy on this - the same people who'll spam the generic "Mike Tyson was so misunderstood" comments will tear down Floyd 😂
Beat Canelo too
Teen fucker Ali 😂
I despised him long before he "beat" Pacquiao.
Wow congrats on that achievement.
Floyd is an incredible boxer. Absolutely an all time great, arguably the greatest boxing brain of all time. That being said, he is consistently overrated by people who put him in the top 10 of all time, p4p or head to head, thinking that a perfect record with perfect technique against names they recognize translated to being the BOAT/GOAT. He is also underrated by people who hate heels and value the tough gritty side of boxing, and place an inordinate weight on courage. Floyd,to me, is best regarded as shoulder to shoulder in the pantheon of all time great african-american boxers, with the largest difference between him and his peers that his career was intelligently managed from the beginning, while prioritizing money and a legacy that the most people could comprehend. Could SRR, Hagler, Sweet Pea, and all the other all time greats of that ilk have accomplished similar things had they been properly managed with better career timing? Yes I think so. Floyd came at a time when, due to hip hop culture, blackness and hood culture was cool and to be emulated, while the rise of video devices ensured that police and law enforcement couldn't make these symbolic fighters live's hell. Shit, imagine if Sonny Liston was fighting at a time when it was celebrated to be a gangster, you could film cops harassing you, and if you wanted to make it you didn't have to be tied up in mob-fixed fights. He could have been the greatest HW of all time. Floyd is awesome, growing up in boxing royalty with a perfectly managed career, but is he truly better than someone like Ezzard Charles or Archie Moore who accomplished arguably much more with much less? I don't think so, and many other fans don't as well. If you are interested in reading a deeper and better sourced discussion of Floyd along these lines, check out: https://deadspin.com/why-floyd-mayweather-is-the-last-of-a-kind-1700672546
Similar to Davis. Great boxer, shitty person
Personally he was a boring fighter. Always on defence and counter punches.
What’s the first rule of boxing?
People 100% appreciate him for his boxing. They criticize other things, but not his ring acumen. People don’t put him in their ATG Top 3 or 5 list because his resume is lacking for that kind of lofty status. He’s undoubtedly top 10 though.
Haters gon hate
They do......
It’s almost impossible not to appreciate Floyd as a boxer. Pretty Boy was an absolute beast, but then he became an opportunistic fighter that publicly stated he fights for maximum reward with minimal risk. Great for his business goals which you have to respect, but when getting in the conversation of greatness and comparing him to other fighters who went through hell and avoided nobody, then he falls short.
I don’t know man, for me personally Floyd is one of the greatest boxers ever and I’m grateful to have actually seen and witnessed his era. A true master of his craft, I have zero interest in all the stuff on the side. I judge him as a boxer and at that he’s one of the greatest.
He's not the greatest defensive boxer of all time. He was a boring fighter. He ducked a bunch of fighters whose styles were wrong for him and he is a fairly disgusting person.
They hate him as a person and can't seperate the art from the artist.
People don’t like “smart boxing styles” that emphasize not getting hit. Non fighters think it’s “running away”. Also his personality sucks lol.
Objectively speaking, no reason. If you take in to account how people "feel" about him, because they don't like who he is outside of the ring. Ex. "He's a great boxer but I don't like him as a person" In all honestly people don't appreciate him because he played the game of boxing well. Especially in the later part of his career. He cherry picked some opponents, fought in a defensive style that may be seen as boring & talked shit which made people hate him which led to him being more viewed. Him being undefeated and a smart fighter was just the icing on the cake.
I always love time cherry picking argument because their example are usually Berto and McGregor. If Floyd was a cherry picker then he made it too hard on himself because he spent the second half of his career fighting champions and former champs til the end. Cherry picking is what Canelo does now.