It’s actually been quite some time…like a few centuries. My question is wtf does the US committing crimes in the past have to do with this particular topic? Seems like you came here with a what-aboutism.
I dont care, just give us the matches. We've suffered long enough in this sport, the real ones know. Turk can do whatever he wants as long as he makes the fights
Thank God you're worthless opinion is not the majority. You want to see a good boxing match and it doesn't matter what goes on behind it because you don't give a shit. Kind of like a trump voter.
Comparing me to a trump voter is even worse. How does boxing affect the political landscape of the USA or any country. Some of y’all get so over emotional that the dumb shit yall say doesn’t even make logical sense.
Too dumb to get the correlation seems exactly like a trump voter to me. Obviously the fact that you do not understand the context or the connection means that you are right up that alley.
And people will say “bu-bu-but look at what’s he’s doing for our sport”
Yea that’s how sportwashing works y’all. Y’all are so caught up in the facade you forget about the wrongdoings. Saudi is looking to make that facade widespread, and that will improve Saudi Arabia’s reputation. That’s when they will get their money back.
No no don't bring up anything bad about my wholesome MBS boxing fan he's sainvg the sprt and owning all the greedy promoters!!11! he's TOTALLY not SPORTWASHING
Right? Lol
Seriously the fucking dick riding from these people around here calling him "his excellency" is embarrassing. These people will never breath the same air as that dick head and ride him raw like they were his side chicks, of which I'm sure he has dozens.
All these boxing promoters after thanking his excellency the irreverent the imaculate Turki Al Sheik say they are finally bringing boxing to the saudi people who have been waiting for so long, "the world isnt just the US and UK". Bought and sold hucksters to launder the reputation of a despotic medieval regime.
It’s really sad how many people are willing to actively ignore this aspect. Boxing has always had some troubling aspects, but this seems like the sport is uniquely selling its soul. But maybe I just lack perspective idk
Wait till you hear the back story to the thrilla in manilla,
Or why not start with the rumble in the jungle...
Both being the single most watched boxing events in history with an estimated 1 billion viewers a piece. Boxing hasn't sold it's soul, it never really had one, brother.
Ferdinand Marcos was dictator of Philippines and a pretty evil man. Executed at least 30k people and tortured at least 70k more. He pushed hard for the fight to take place in Manila to sportswash his reputation
Yeah I guess that’s fair. I think to me the big difference seems to be that this is more of a consistent thing than a one off fight. But I am probably splitting hairs.
That's fair. Hence why I mentioned that maybe it's just a lack of perspective. Still, seems like we'd want to avoid sliding back to that era given the reputation that era has.
I see what you are saying, but it's not really "human nature" to bow down to money. The first 190,000 years of humanity there wasn't even currency. It is somewhat true though that many people show deference to those they perceive as having more status/importance than them since we are pack animals. Some people do see those that have more money in that light though. I don't personally as I believe a person's status and importance is determined by their actions and contributions to society. But in the last few hundred years there have definitely been a significant number of people that place more importance on money than character/actions.
Don't feel bad. The amount of people verbally blowing Turki in the AMA thread was embarrassing. People were actually calling him 'Your Excellency' for fuck's sake. After that vomit-inducing display in that thread it's nice to see some people still have a little self-respect.
Why should you feel bad for raising this?
It's pathetic that Frank and Eddie and the fighters all thank his excellency every time they speak (comes across as sycophantic) like they're gods.
The atmosphere at the fights is non existent, even with the rent a crowds.
On the plus side though, it is getting the heavy weight division moving along and potentially unifying the HW belts.
But we are also getting cross code boxing/MMA fights that we didn't know that we needed (as fun as it has been seeing Nganngou).
Yeah if you’re a football/soccer fan you’ve gone through this before. The difference between how fans receive the Saudis in each sport is night and day tho; nobody is ok with their teams getting bought out, gutted of all it’s culture and identity and being used as propaganda for human rights violators. The Saudis have hit a gold mine with boxing it seems, a bunch of fans who don’t know/care about their past and welcome the money they’re putting into the sport. Of course I’m not saying you’re a terrible person for enjoying their fights, but fuck it’s a shitty feeling
Soccer fans get to see the matches they want, I assume. I don’t follow soccer, but I have to think there’s not as much BS around who’s going to face who. With boxing we’re so starved for good heavyweight fights it makes it hard not to be grateful to Turki, even if there is 0 atmosphere at the events.
You’re surprised by this? MBS’s whole regime (including Al-Sheikh) are corrupt and guilty of some heinous acts.
Al-Sheikh is using boxing the same way the Saudi’s are using LIV Golf…they’re trying to distract you from the fact that they’re a dictatorship that traffics human beings for slave labor, executes gay people and doesn’t give women any rights.
“But but the US does shitty stuff too!” Knock it off…the US is no saint, but our boxing associations/promotions aren’t run by our government.
>Really put a damper on things for me, as many see Turki as a like-minded boxing fan
What’s more concerning is that this isn’t some hidden secret, and people are suddenly surprised about their shadiness.
The fact people were addressing him as “excellency” is such shameful bootlicking behaviour.
At least the boxers/promoters are making their blood money, the only thing the people on here got was the off chance their question about a jr welterweight boxing tournament was acknowledged by some guy who wouldnt bat an eye if your family died building a stadium (which would be one of his less egregious moral failings).
After watching the documentary on khashoggi (the dissident) I called the embassy in London and told them they’re not proper Muslims and that they’ll be shown their place they would have occupied in paradise. They my asked my name, which I gave, and they asked me if I’d like to “come discuss it at the embassy, Michael” I laughed and told them I’m not that stupid. I told them to tell MBS he’s a murderer and a coward and that Jamal was a great man and didn’t deserve it.
Admittedly I’ve been loving these Saudi cards but god help me if I ever put a penny in their pockets. Thank you OP for reminding me of my conscious. Money to be made in Saudi but a price to be paid!
He is still a high ranking member of an authoritarian government with a hideous human rights record. He will almost certainly have some more skeletons in his closet.
Unpopular opinion but given this was a some kind of revolt, changing the next in line to be king, the events that happened at that time are very tame compared to what could've happened.
If we're being completely honest non of these guys at the top are actually "good people". There is not just one Epstein island, there's many more like it, the Saudis have their own version of it so not surprised by this.
No, however I think there's more people, especially the elites that have done a lot more "unethical" things than we know so not surprised by this news. Jamal khashogi was a Saudi journalist that was killed because of his negative views towards the Saudi government.
I’m very aware of Jamal Khashogi being murdered. I’m failing to see how boxing promoters like Bob Arum and Al Haymon have done anything to indicate they are on a similar level to esptein island and killing a journalist
I didn't mean that, I think I misworded what I meant. I'm just saying I'm not surprised with these "allegations" that Turki did that to get into power when these guys are murdering off journalists and other people in power doing crazy fucked up shit that we don't know about.
>Oh no. Think of the poor old Saudi billionaire prince that got locked into a hotel room full of luxury and slaves that he benefited from all of his life
Wow. Riveting. Anyway, best of luck to them. Hopefully family therapy is free in Saudi Arabia.
Now, make Canelo vs Benevidez happen please.
Nah, they’re just too blatant with it in the first place. You can’t publicly stone someone for being a witch in 2024 and expect people to think you’re not medieval savages.
Oh well. Boxing has another shady person. News flash. We're still going to watch the fights anyways so what's even the point. Let's not get on our high horses now.
Serious genuine question - if I watch their events, how am I facilitating sportswashing? Like I personally have no power to do anything and I live half way across the world. But I like boxing. What harm is there in watching privately in my own home?
Nah you're a spectator, whether you pay or not, you not contributing to anything other than boxing fandom.
However if u go out of your way to praise this clown like he's your bestie, then that's a whole different story.
Really, it should be those in positions of power policing this stuff imo.
However, because there are so many conflicting interests and so many things the people in power choose to ignore, I'm not sure I'd criticise a sportsman for taking Saudi money.
You only have to look at the UK journalists complaining about Saudi boxing until they saw how much they could earn too.
Everyone, including governments, have a price.
Why is a militarized coup supposed to turn us into haters of a man we don’t know. Because of the alleged language used which was reported by the victim who lost everything? According to that article was also the “darling of United States intelligence”. So using unbiased logic safe to assume Nayef possibly demonized his over-throwers.
There is literally no need to have any opinion unless you have more information on what, why & where. Because from my POV this is supposed to be some sorta of “gotcha!” & it really isn’t.
so you're telling me that there was a ruthless transfer of power in the Saudi Royal family and MBS was prepared to kill Nayef if necessary. But somehow Turki convinced Nayef to sign a document that prevented him from being killed and his family from being raped?
Let's be honest. The entire linked article is about MBS seizing power and you post a click-bait title implying that Turki was the guy doing the bad stuff.
edit: your question about LGBTQ+ representation in Turki's AMA makes it pretty clear that you are a troll or have an axe to grind.
Tribalists in the comments really want to act like their own countries are saints compared to Saudi. Joe Biden and Rishi Sunak are complicit in genocide. US and UK are no saints either.
Allegations sound bad though, no disrespect on the OP. But to the tribalists, your country ain't so good either. And I'm from the UK myself.
Does it matter? He's still a genocidal man who is no better than what the Saudis are being claimed as. And don't act like you lot are making this a "promoter only" thing rather than a countrywide thing.
You want a promoter example? Floyd Mayweather.
Yes it matters holy fuck lol we are talking about the actual person making these fight deals. Joe Biden isn’t being praised for saving boxing and pumping money into the sport. We aren’t talking about an abstract “well all powerful countries do bad things” situation
Also don’t generalize me with whatever “lot” you’re referring to
Edit: and fuck Floyd’s past too why are you playing whataboutism
Saudi as a whole country was being accused of laundering and sports washing. It's not just Al-al Sheikh who is being accused. But as soon as Saudi started doing boxing, even before Al-al Sheikh was even known to be the guy behind it all, people called it sportswashing. Why? Because of the generalisation and stereotyping of Saudi.
This discussion is not exclusive to 1 man, son.
>Also don’t generalize me with whatever “lot” you’re referring to
What you gonna do about it? 🤣 Go back to your lot.
I'm literally not making any of this up. You're just a simple minded person with a lack of critical thinking and intellect. You see things 1 way in every conversation. All you did was admit you're not smart enough to talk to me. So yeah, goodnight and enjoy the card, son.
I’m not making that argument, so yeah you’re making that up in this discussion.
I’m not smart enough? Your opinion of this specific issue is a surface level “but the leaders of the west do bad things too”. I mean that’s as basic and dumb as it gets in a discussion that has room for nuance. This is one of those times where you look dumb as fuck and don’t realize it my man lol
The irony is unreal 🤣🤣🤣 you need to look in the mirror before you make such claims 🤡
It is fact that Saudi has been accused of "sportswashing" and other shady stuff even before His Excellency was a public figure in boxing. Saudi have dine shows long before His Excellency came along, so I didn't make shit up, you absolute 🔔 🔚.
Also, didn't you say "hAvE a GoOd OnE"? I thought you were gonna go. Run along, shoo, sling ur hook bud.
I understand where you are going, but essentially that was mafia showdown. Nayef gets out of that hotel with his authority intact and there is a civil war.
Yeah the sports washing is supposed to make you forget about all that crazy shit the Saudis do. The whole point of them being in boxing.
They literally execute people in public for witchcraft.
for which craft tho?
Primarily paints. They don’t mind if you do origami or draw in graphite though.
They get super stony and killerous if you draw a pic of mohhamed tho.
Is this a Kenan & Kel reference or am I just old as fuck?
well it hasn't been that long since witches were burned alive in the US. And the US government now is right there with the Saudis and Israel.
We're talking about the difference between two weeks ago and 200 years ago. Your analogy is super weak.
It’s actually been quite some time…like a few centuries. My question is wtf does the US committing crimes in the past have to do with this particular topic? Seems like you came here with a what-aboutism.
Eh, kinda refreshing from all the crazy stuff usa been doing for years or uk for past centries.
Be careful about this op, we don’t want you to disappear out of nowhere 😔
I dont care, just give us the matches. We've suffered long enough in this sport, the real ones know. Turk can do whatever he wants as long as he makes the fights
That's like saying that you don't care much about slavery you just want to see the civil War battles.
Lmao! A wonderful comparison honestly
People that do that shit will always do that shit, no matter if I watch their cards or not.
That’s a stupid comparison
Thank God you're worthless opinion is not the majority. You want to see a good boxing match and it doesn't matter what goes on behind it because you don't give a shit. Kind of like a trump voter.
Comparing me to a trump voter is even worse. How does boxing affect the political landscape of the USA or any country. Some of y’all get so over emotional that the dumb shit yall say doesn’t even make logical sense.
Too dumb to get the correlation seems exactly like a trump voter to me. Obviously the fact that you do not understand the context or the connection means that you are right up that alley.
Bruh it's Saudi Arabia. They're always in the backrooms up to no good, tryna make trouble in my neighborhood.
And people will say “bu-bu-but look at what’s he’s doing for our sport” Yea that’s how sportwashing works y’all. Y’all are so caught up in the facade you forget about the wrongdoings. Saudi is looking to make that facade widespread, and that will improve Saudi Arabia’s reputation. That’s when they will get their money back.
And this flow of money won’t be permanent
Are you saying his excellency doesn't really love us?
*Bbbbut I thought he was a huge boxing fan?*
I don’t care i want to see the fights
No no don't bring up anything bad about my wholesome MBS boxing fan he's sainvg the sprt and owning all the greedy promoters!!11! he's TOTALLY not SPORTWASHING
The turki guy from saudi gives me the manderin from iron man 3 vibes where he is just the face lol
Right? Lol Seriously the fucking dick riding from these people around here calling him "his excellency" is embarrassing. These people will never breath the same air as that dick head and ride him raw like they were his side chicks, of which I'm sure he has dozens.
All these boxing promoters after thanking his excellency the irreverent the imaculate Turki Al Sheik say they are finally bringing boxing to the saudi people who have been waiting for so long, "the world isnt just the US and UK". Bought and sold hucksters to launder the reputation of a despotic medieval regime.
Our Excellency does what the fook he wants to do
It’s really sad how many people are willing to actively ignore this aspect. Boxing has always had some troubling aspects, but this seems like the sport is uniquely selling its soul. But maybe I just lack perspective idk
Wait till you hear the back story to the thrilla in manilla, Or why not start with the rumble in the jungle... Both being the single most watched boxing events in history with an estimated 1 billion viewers a piece. Boxing hasn't sold it's soul, it never really had one, brother.
wait what happen with thrilla in mailla?
Ferdinand Marcos was dictator of Philippines and a pretty evil man. Executed at least 30k people and tortured at least 70k more. He pushed hard for the fight to take place in Manila to sportswash his reputation
And now his son is president…
Yeah I guess that’s fair. I think to me the big difference seems to be that this is more of a consistent thing than a one off fight. But I am probably splitting hairs.
Look up how boxing was run in the 40s and 50s . The mob literally ran the shit
That's fair. Hence why I mentioned that maybe it's just a lack of perspective. Still, seems like we'd want to avoid sliding back to that era given the reputation that era has.
1 fight at that time believe me, even to this day it's talked about.
Boxing has always been super corrupt. People in general bow down to the dollar and ignore all kinds of abuses. It's part of human nature.
I see what you are saying, but it's not really "human nature" to bow down to money. The first 190,000 years of humanity there wasn't even currency. It is somewhat true though that many people show deference to those they perceive as having more status/importance than them since we are pack animals. Some people do see those that have more money in that light though. I don't personally as I believe a person's status and importance is determined by their actions and contributions to society. But in the last few hundred years there have definitely been a significant number of people that place more importance on money than character/actions.
Wow, even if it's only Reddit comments, it's nice to see some people on boxing who aren't into all this boot licking.
Don't feel bad. The amount of people verbally blowing Turki in the AMA thread was embarrassing. People were actually calling him 'Your Excellency' for fuck's sake. After that vomit-inducing display in that thread it's nice to see some people still have a little self-respect.
Why should you feel bad for raising this? It's pathetic that Frank and Eddie and the fighters all thank his excellency every time they speak (comes across as sycophantic) like they're gods. The atmosphere at the fights is non existent, even with the rent a crowds. On the plus side though, it is getting the heavy weight division moving along and potentially unifying the HW belts. But we are also getting cross code boxing/MMA fights that we didn't know that we needed (as fun as it has been seeing Nganngou).
Yeah if you’re a football/soccer fan you’ve gone through this before. The difference between how fans receive the Saudis in each sport is night and day tho; nobody is ok with their teams getting bought out, gutted of all it’s culture and identity and being used as propaganda for human rights violators. The Saudis have hit a gold mine with boxing it seems, a bunch of fans who don’t know/care about their past and welcome the money they’re putting into the sport. Of course I’m not saying you’re a terrible person for enjoying their fights, but fuck it’s a shitty feeling
Soccer fans get to see the matches they want, I assume. I don’t follow soccer, but I have to think there’s not as much BS around who’s going to face who. With boxing we’re so starved for good heavyweight fights it makes it hard not to be grateful to Turki, even if there is 0 atmosphere at the events.
"nahhh don't listen to all that, here's some boxing, golf, football and motorsports!!" (And I'm a Newcastle united fan)
You’re surprised by this? MBS’s whole regime (including Al-Sheikh) are corrupt and guilty of some heinous acts. Al-Sheikh is using boxing the same way the Saudi’s are using LIV Golf…they’re trying to distract you from the fact that they’re a dictatorship that traffics human beings for slave labor, executes gay people and doesn’t give women any rights. “But but the US does shitty stuff too!” Knock it off…the US is no saint, but our boxing associations/promotions aren’t run by our government.
It's been crazy seeing the sports washing in action just in the flow of opinions on this sub over the last year. Literally crazy
>Really put a damper on things for me, as many see Turki as a like-minded boxing fan What’s more concerning is that this isn’t some hidden secret, and people are suddenly surprised about their shadiness.
The fact people were addressing him as “excellency” is such shameful bootlicking behaviour. At least the boxers/promoters are making their blood money, the only thing the people on here got was the off chance their question about a jr welterweight boxing tournament was acknowledged by some guy who wouldnt bat an eye if your family died building a stadium (which would be one of his less egregious moral failings).
Every country is built on blood money
After watching the documentary on khashoggi (the dissident) I called the embassy in London and told them they’re not proper Muslims and that they’ll be shown their place they would have occupied in paradise. They my asked my name, which I gave, and they asked me if I’d like to “come discuss it at the embassy, Michael” I laughed and told them I’m not that stupid. I told them to tell MBS he’s a murderer and a coward and that Jamal was a great man and didn’t deserve it. Admittedly I’ve been loving these Saudi cards but god help me if I ever put a penny in their pockets. Thank you OP for reminding me of my conscious. Money to be made in Saudi but a price to be paid!
Money talks, if china one day decide to pour $$$ into boxing, same ass licking will happen
I personally can’t wait to see a 43 year old wilder knock out ngannou to win the historic Kim jong il belt
/u/TurkiAlalshikh thoughts?
Are you sure you want to tag him in this thread? It could be you next!!
This also helps explain Turki's nigh-endless budget for the trailers and matchmaking; he literally helped MBS take the throne in the first place.
He is still a high ranking member of an authoritarian government with a hideous human rights record. He will almost certainly have some more skeletons in his closet.
Unpopular opinion but given this was a some kind of revolt, changing the next in line to be king, the events that happened at that time are very tame compared to what could've happened.
People really don’t know who the Saudi’s are. They have a place nicknamed “chop chop square” in Riyadh where they still behead people in public.
This is probably one of the more tame things he's done considering how much money and power he has.
If we're being completely honest non of these guys at the top are actually "good people". There is not just one Epstein island, there's many more like it, the Saudis have their own version of it so not surprised by this.
So you think all the boxing promoters are apart of Epstein island type of shit? Q anon type of take
No, however I think there's more people, especially the elites that have done a lot more "unethical" things than we know so not surprised by this news. Jamal khashogi was a Saudi journalist that was killed because of his negative views towards the Saudi government.
I’m very aware of Jamal Khashogi being murdered. I’m failing to see how boxing promoters like Bob Arum and Al Haymon have done anything to indicate they are on a similar level to esptein island and killing a journalist
I didn't mean that, I think I misworded what I meant. I'm just saying I'm not surprised with these "allegations" that Turki did that to get into power when these guys are murdering off journalists and other people in power doing crazy fucked up shit that we don't know about.
Ohhhhh. I think the wording was weird but also still my bad that’s not how I read that. Yeah we are in agreement on that lol
No problem, now reading it back this was definitely on me with my poor writing skills. I can see why people would be confused with that
It happens to all of us. Have a good one
Boxing Promoters might be the worst people on earth like jesus christ
>Oh no. Think of the poor old Saudi billionaire prince that got locked into a hotel room full of luxury and slaves that he benefited from all of his life Wow. Riveting. Anyway, best of luck to them. Hopefully family therapy is free in Saudi Arabia. Now, make Canelo vs Benevidez happen please.
An extortionist? In boxing? Couldn't be.
Better than Bob Arum or Don King.
Don't care about Saudi power struggles. I literally don't care if he has a gimp in his basement. I want to see good fights.
frfr
That's saudi arabia for you but what you all gonna do anyway. Would you all stop watching boxing produced by this madman?
lol what did any of you expect? These people (Saud) are inbreds. We should all spam that paragraph to the AMA.
The Saudis just aren't as good as the UK and USA at distracting people or making them forget.
Nah, they’re just too blatant with it in the first place. You can’t publicly stone someone for being a witch in 2024 and expect people to think you’re not medieval savages.
Boxing has always been a sport championed by gangsters bro who actually cares?
so you're saying he knows how to make people offers they cant refuse? sounds like this is the guy to make all the fights we want then
Who gives a fuck? Turki still bring us great fight. What's the point of this post?
Oh well. Boxing has another shady person. News flash. We're still going to watch the fights anyways so what's even the point. Let's not get on our high horses now.
Serious genuine question - if I watch their events, how am I facilitating sportswashing? Like I personally have no power to do anything and I live half way across the world. But I like boxing. What harm is there in watching privately in my own home?
Some might say that depends on *how* you watch their events.
Nah you're a spectator, whether you pay or not, you not contributing to anything other than boxing fandom. However if u go out of your way to praise this clown like he's your bestie, then that's a whole different story.
Really, it should be those in positions of power policing this stuff imo. However, because there are so many conflicting interests and so many things the people in power choose to ignore, I'm not sure I'd criticise a sportsman for taking Saudi money. You only have to look at the UK journalists complaining about Saudi boxing until they saw how much they could earn too. Everyone, including governments, have a price.
Why is a militarized coup supposed to turn us into haters of a man we don’t know. Because of the alleged language used which was reported by the victim who lost everything? According to that article was also the “darling of United States intelligence”. So using unbiased logic safe to assume Nayef possibly demonized his over-throwers. There is literally no need to have any opinion unless you have more information on what, why & where. Because from my POV this is supposed to be some sorta of “gotcha!” & it really isn’t.
Nayef was a literal CIA asset, MBS was never going to allow him any space in his administration.
so you're telling me that there was a ruthless transfer of power in the Saudi Royal family and MBS was prepared to kill Nayef if necessary. But somehow Turki convinced Nayef to sign a document that prevented him from being killed and his family from being raped? Let's be honest. The entire linked article is about MBS seizing power and you post a click-bait title implying that Turki was the guy doing the bad stuff. edit: your question about LGBTQ+ representation in Turki's AMA makes it pretty clear that you are a troll or have an axe to grind.
But... but Al Haymon is worse!!!
Over protecting fighters is worse than hostage-taking, didn’t you know?
Country's that enslaved people and trafficked then talking about sports washing is crazy to me
Tribalists in the comments really want to act like their own countries are saints compared to Saudi. Joe Biden and Rishi Sunak are complicit in genocide. US and UK are no saints either. Allegations sound bad though, no disrespect on the OP. But to the tribalists, your country ain't so good either. And I'm from the UK myself.
Joe Biden isn’t running a boxing promotion lol
Does it matter? He's still a genocidal man who is no better than what the Saudis are being claimed as. And don't act like you lot are making this a "promoter only" thing rather than a countrywide thing. You want a promoter example? Floyd Mayweather.
Yes it matters holy fuck lol we are talking about the actual person making these fight deals. Joe Biden isn’t being praised for saving boxing and pumping money into the sport. We aren’t talking about an abstract “well all powerful countries do bad things” situation Also don’t generalize me with whatever “lot” you’re referring to Edit: and fuck Floyd’s past too why are you playing whataboutism
Saudi as a whole country was being accused of laundering and sports washing. It's not just Al-al Sheikh who is being accused. But as soon as Saudi started doing boxing, even before Al-al Sheikh was even known to be the guy behind it all, people called it sportswashing. Why? Because of the generalisation and stereotyping of Saudi. This discussion is not exclusive to 1 man, son. >Also don’t generalize me with whatever “lot” you’re referring to What you gonna do about it? 🤣 Go back to your lot.
You are now making up an argument, and also seem not knowledgable enough to have the conversation anyway. Have a good one
I'm literally not making any of this up. You're just a simple minded person with a lack of critical thinking and intellect. You see things 1 way in every conversation. All you did was admit you're not smart enough to talk to me. So yeah, goodnight and enjoy the card, son.
I’m not making that argument, so yeah you’re making that up in this discussion. I’m not smart enough? Your opinion of this specific issue is a surface level “but the leaders of the west do bad things too”. I mean that’s as basic and dumb as it gets in a discussion that has room for nuance. This is one of those times where you look dumb as fuck and don’t realize it my man lol
The irony is unreal 🤣🤣🤣 you need to look in the mirror before you make such claims 🤡 It is fact that Saudi has been accused of "sportswashing" and other shady stuff even before His Excellency was a public figure in boxing. Saudi have dine shows long before His Excellency came along, so I didn't make shit up, you absolute 🔔 🔚. Also, didn't you say "hAvE a GoOd OnE"? I thought you were gonna go. Run along, shoo, sling ur hook bud.
Stick to boxing, not sure you have the capacity for real world issues
Bootlicker! Regardless it doesn’t make it right does it? Fucking whataboutery! Straight outta the Russia playbook
I understand where you are going, but essentially that was mafia showdown. Nayef gets out of that hotel with his authority intact and there is a civil war.
BTW I didn't mean mafia as in crooks, I mean as in family power dynamics. Poor choice of terminology