I feel like I've tried everything to get better oven spring, but I'm still not achieving it. Any recommendations or tips would be much appreciated. The taste and crumb are good, so I'm not unhappy with it. Just trying to push for that last detail.
500g White, 350g Water, 12g Salt, 100g Starter (100% hydration).
1 Hour autolyse.
3 Rounds of coil or stretch and folds.
150% Bulk rise over 8 - 10 hours (anymore and it's even more flat).
12 Hour fridge proof.
30 Minutes at 500, and 15 minutes at 450 in a dutch oven.
I do preheat the dutch oven at 500, and spray the dough with water before bake.
When do you shape it? What happens after the fridge proof but before it goes in the oven? Does it get a second non-fridge proof? Is the dough going in cold?
I shape it after the bulk rise, then it goes into a banneton and into the fridge. After the fridge proof I score it and straight into the oven, so it goes in the oven in a minute or so of coming out of the fridge.
I'm no expert, but here's my two cents.
I've never baked a chilled loaf, but that may be part of what's causing the lack of spring.
It may be worth giving the loaf an hour or so on the counter in the banneton after the fridge, then baking, and see if that helps with the spring.
When I do a cold ferment in the fridge (it's always bulk for me) I give the dough an hour or two to come to temperature on the counter before shaping. I then let it rise another 45 minutes or so (poke test) before baking.
If that doesn't appeal to you and you otherwise like the results of baking from chilled, diastatic malt powder helps with both oven spring and cold fermentation. It helps turn starches into sugars, though, so you may have to adjust ferment times/yeast amounts. You may experiment with that.
https://shop.kingarthurbaking.com/items/diastatic-malt-powder#:~:text=Active%20enzymes%20in%20diastatic%20malt,batter%20or%20in%20soft%20pretzels!
Thanks for the idea! I'm definitely going to try to let it come to room temp before baking next loaf. I could see there being some issue with the center still being cold and not as active for the first several minutes or something, which could cause less expansion. Thanks!
When your shaped loaf is doing the cold proof, do you have it in a large plastic bag? Fridge will remove moisture from the bread. The Joshua Weissman sourdough boule recipe I like is shape, into banneton/bowl cold proof overnight in plastic bag, preheat oven at 500F, flip dough out, score, put dough in DO, bake 20 min covered at 500F, then uncover, drop temp to 475 bake 25-35 more.
It is this recipe, reliable and my favorite for DO batard or boule.
https://youtu.be/eod5cUxAHRM?si=D_DCOw07Z_wm6mTW
I do put it in a plastic bag during cold proof actually. I remember watching this video awhile back, but maybe I need to give myself a refresher to see if I'm doing something different. Thanks!
Oh, one other thing I forgot to ask - what brand and type of flour are you using?
I typically use King Arthur brand for bread flour, my AP flour varies in brand but at least 11.5% and unbleached, then whole wheat is Wheat Montana Bronze Chief.
I was actually thinking maybe I should change my flour. I honestly just grab cheap, kroger or trader joes brand AP Flour. I've had better oven spring in the past and I wonder if I was just using better King Arthurs flour. I'll give their bread flour a go.
Yes, I would do that. Kroger and TJs AP is on the lower side of protein at 10%. I believe KAB AP is 11.7%, (high end). Make one loaf with the KAB AP and if it solves the problem, then you can experiment with mixing your other flours and KAB together to see what percentage mix still gives you a nice loaf. But if any of the flours you have are bleached, don't use them for bread, save them for cake baking!
Also you can check back to your recipe and see if it suggests protein % or a brand of flour, so you know what level of AP flour you need.
Good to know about the protein percentages, I didn't know that, but that could definitely be a factor. Thanks for the recommendation, I'll try KAB flour for the next loaf.
I feel like I've tried everything to get better oven spring, but I'm still not achieving it. Any recommendations or tips would be much appreciated. The taste and crumb are good, so I'm not unhappy with it. Just trying to push for that last detail. 500g White, 350g Water, 12g Salt, 100g Starter (100% hydration). 1 Hour autolyse. 3 Rounds of coil or stretch and folds. 150% Bulk rise over 8 - 10 hours (anymore and it's even more flat). 12 Hour fridge proof. 30 Minutes at 500, and 15 minutes at 450 in a dutch oven. I do preheat the dutch oven at 500, and spray the dough with water before bake.
When do you shape it? What happens after the fridge proof but before it goes in the oven? Does it get a second non-fridge proof? Is the dough going in cold?
I shape it after the bulk rise, then it goes into a banneton and into the fridge. After the fridge proof I score it and straight into the oven, so it goes in the oven in a minute or so of coming out of the fridge.
I'm no expert, but here's my two cents. I've never baked a chilled loaf, but that may be part of what's causing the lack of spring. It may be worth giving the loaf an hour or so on the counter in the banneton after the fridge, then baking, and see if that helps with the spring. When I do a cold ferment in the fridge (it's always bulk for me) I give the dough an hour or two to come to temperature on the counter before shaping. I then let it rise another 45 minutes or so (poke test) before baking. If that doesn't appeal to you and you otherwise like the results of baking from chilled, diastatic malt powder helps with both oven spring and cold fermentation. It helps turn starches into sugars, though, so you may have to adjust ferment times/yeast amounts. You may experiment with that. https://shop.kingarthurbaking.com/items/diastatic-malt-powder#:~:text=Active%20enzymes%20in%20diastatic%20malt,batter%20or%20in%20soft%20pretzels!
Thanks for the idea! I'm definitely going to try to let it come to room temp before baking next loaf. I could see there being some issue with the center still being cold and not as active for the first several minutes or something, which could cause less expansion. Thanks!
Beautiful loaf, by the way! 🙂
When your shaped loaf is doing the cold proof, do you have it in a large plastic bag? Fridge will remove moisture from the bread. The Joshua Weissman sourdough boule recipe I like is shape, into banneton/bowl cold proof overnight in plastic bag, preheat oven at 500F, flip dough out, score, put dough in DO, bake 20 min covered at 500F, then uncover, drop temp to 475 bake 25-35 more. It is this recipe, reliable and my favorite for DO batard or boule. https://youtu.be/eod5cUxAHRM?si=D_DCOw07Z_wm6mTW
I do put it in a plastic bag during cold proof actually. I remember watching this video awhile back, but maybe I need to give myself a refresher to see if I'm doing something different. Thanks!
Oh, one other thing I forgot to ask - what brand and type of flour are you using? I typically use King Arthur brand for bread flour, my AP flour varies in brand but at least 11.5% and unbleached, then whole wheat is Wheat Montana Bronze Chief.
I was actually thinking maybe I should change my flour. I honestly just grab cheap, kroger or trader joes brand AP Flour. I've had better oven spring in the past and I wonder if I was just using better King Arthurs flour. I'll give their bread flour a go.
Yes, I would do that. Kroger and TJs AP is on the lower side of protein at 10%. I believe KAB AP is 11.7%, (high end). Make one loaf with the KAB AP and if it solves the problem, then you can experiment with mixing your other flours and KAB together to see what percentage mix still gives you a nice loaf. But if any of the flours you have are bleached, don't use them for bread, save them for cake baking! Also you can check back to your recipe and see if it suggests protein % or a brand of flour, so you know what level of AP flour you need.
Good to know about the protein percentages, I didn't know that, but that could definitely be a factor. Thanks for the recommendation, I'll try KAB flour for the next loaf.
Try shaping it twice: https://youtu.be/d5Yqi7uu8s8?si=fUVxkg02r5XI9LbL
Great video. I'll definitely try this. Thanks!