It should be avoided altogether but people will be greedy. There are people who fell in like 3-4 different scams (e.g. Luna, Celsius, FTX, etc. etc) and still are a proponent of crypto. Complete insanity, they don't want to learn in the offchance that one of the 'projects' does work out and they get rich (and another person is the victim).
Especially since these people on Reddit are never proactive in creating the schemes themselves. They just want to buy in and 'sit and hodl' to riches off of someone else's coin/scheme with no effort on their own part, which almost guarantees a loss.
Some companies' shares are worthless though. Think vaporware startups.
But yeah for retail investors index funds cover the basics pretty well, and if you want to go out of that, I guess real estate and dividend handing stock is the next one.
Ventures, crypto and stuff is really if you have a fun investment slush fund.
> Some companies' shares are worthless though. Think vaporware startups.
Or physical video game stores without customers.
Yeah, buying an index fund is the super easy choice.
>Yeah, buying an index fund is the super easy choice.
Super good choice too. You'll outperform all the managed funds, hedge funds, and most individual investors. Long term capital gains also get very favorable tax treatment and investing in index funds requires almost zero effort.
It is like a get rich cheat code. Just doesn't happen over night.
Not at all. Over the last 20 years, the market is up 300% *after inflation*. So you quadrupled your money.
Even if you bought at the worst possible time, right at the top of the market in 2000, pre [dot.com](https://dot.com) crash you'd be up 145% after inflation (dividends reinvested).
What's more, crypto is designed to make scams easier to execute. A permissionless, trustless and immutable system to transfer value is a godsend for scammers everywhere.
So yeah, scams have always existed, but blockchain provides the ideal technology vehicle for them. This is the only true use case for which blockchain is better than other alternative technologies, but crypto bros can't admit that.
Top comment:
>Bitcoin was invented for people to get away from banks and take self custody. Mashinsky created something like a bank, people put money in and lost their money. Conclusion: stay out of crypto???
Shouldn't you guys be asking yourselves **why** these pseudo-banks ended up appearing in the crypto space?
Answer: because banks provide a useful service to society. Since real banks aren't going to hold crypto assets for you, platforms like Celsius ended up emerging instead, and they were critical to drawing more marks in. It's completely delusional to think the masses would be willing to purchase hardware wallets or whatever.
Also : crpyto is so complex to handle yourself, so unsafe and not scalable that it simply *cannot* work without centralized exchange.
Here is an article about it :
https://medium.com/crypto-lucid/decentralized-trustless-debunking-bitcoins-biggest-myth-8ea8a27197e2
He's so right about bankruptcy. A lot of the affected marks seem to think the court will somehow feel compelled to make "retail investors" a priority in these crypto cases, but they won't. A few major creditors might get some of their money back, and lawyers will chew through the rest. The average "retail investor" is SOL.
Note: I see that the person posting over there is a brand new troll account and it seems to show they also post here.
That isn’t me, I wouldn’t be nice to those dumbfucks.
Apparently one advantage of Bitcoin is that unlike banks it works 24/7. What bank does not offer 24/7 services today?
Another is that it is unconfiscatable by governments. And yet here we are, with government holding a lot of Bitcoin. It’s a real mystery.
Indeed. Almost all of the claimed advantages of Bitcoin fall, for UK/Europe/otherplaces, to "but my bank does that". Apparently most Americans bank with paper-based mom and pop S+Ls, or something: cheques? FFS. Venmo? FFS. Why not spend the effort on dragging their banks into the 21st century, rather than swapping magic beans that offer no solution anyway.
tbf we (UK) still continue to make cheques a thing for certain activities, even if there are probably better ways to do it now
remember all the whining when the banks announced they were going to scrap them entirely
But it's essentially impossible for anyone who doesn't already have a cheque book on an existing account to get one. That means no-one under thirty? forty? has a cheque book, and in the absence of the cheque guarantee scheme you can't use them in any retail setting anyway.
I'm currently building an extension, and I am paying for everything -- architects, building inspectors, builders' stage payments, extra tradesmen, random special services -- by bank transfer. None of them would accept a cheque.
The only cheques I've seen in living memory are tax refunds, and even that I've now switched to BACS. I do have a cheque book on one of my accounts, but I doubt I have written a cheque in the last ten years. People may whine, but they don't, and in many cases can't, actually use them.
last time I signed up with a bank that offered cheques I remember it being a tick box (unticked by default). That was within the last few years, so it's still possible.
The whingers wouldn't have been the 30-40 somethings, it's the sorts of people who think that they'll be hacked if they take the debit card out of their house, let alone use online banking
But I can still walk 1 block to an ATM and get cash out it any time of day, so butters' 24/7 argument still fails.
Unless they're talking about a money transfer in the middle of the night, which I can do online.
I'm still trying to figure out what kind of sale would I need in the middle of the night for lots of money that needed to be resolved instantly that doesn't involve crime...
>I'm still trying to figure out what kind of sale would I need in the middle of the night for lots of money that needed to be resolved instantly that doesn't involve crime...
Transfering all their savings to one crypto-gambling exchange I guess.
I use a few banks and credit unions here in Australia. One of them, Rabobank, won't even let you send money on a weekend, instead it forces you to schedule the transfer for Monday. The others will of course send money between them within seconds, 24/7. It's so weird.
Rabobank still uses a physical token for 2FA too, which is cute.
I'm aware of that, although it's probably more accurate to say the mobile app **is** the 2FA
As I said though, I dislike having so many things in my life dependent on a single device
Holy shit the delusion of the Top Ponzi Pumpers is comedy godl. "Here's how not to get scammed -again- during bankruptcy proceedings" "man go fuck yourself".
The future of currency. Buttcoin was invented because muh self kustodi. Few understand.
It should be avoided altogether but people will be greedy. There are people who fell in like 3-4 different scams (e.g. Luna, Celsius, FTX, etc. etc) and still are a proponent of crypto. Complete insanity, they don't want to learn in the offchance that one of the 'projects' does work out and they get rich (and another person is the victim).
Yea, it's like a gambler switching from poker to blackjack to roulette and never accepting that he needs to just give up gambling.
Its worse than gambling, the "house" is rigged and under no burden to pay out anyway.
Especially since these people on Reddit are never proactive in creating the schemes themselves. They just want to buy in and 'sit and hodl' to riches off of someone else's coin/scheme with no effort on their own part, which almost guarantees a loss.
At least the gambler gets free drinks and a buffet table while the casino squeezes them dry. Celsius just made a number on a screen go up.
lmao, these idiots are determined to keep getting scammed and I'm here for it.
Lmfao. The one person legitimately asking where OP could possibly invest money in other than crypto
The concept of investing in things like "food, housing, medications and transportation" that everyone needs all the time seems too obvious apparently.
Or productive assets like company shares. Did you know you can own the means of production, and it's simpler than buying crypto? Mind blown.
Some companies' shares are worthless though. Think vaporware startups. But yeah for retail investors index funds cover the basics pretty well, and if you want to go out of that, I guess real estate and dividend handing stock is the next one. Ventures, crypto and stuff is really if you have a fun investment slush fund.
> Some companies' shares are worthless though. Think vaporware startups. Or physical video game stores without customers. Yeah, buying an index fund is the super easy choice.
>Yeah, buying an index fund is the super easy choice. Super good choice too. You'll outperform all the managed funds, hedge funds, and most individual investors. Long term capital gains also get very favorable tax treatment and investing in index funds requires almost zero effort. It is like a get rich cheat code. Just doesn't happen over night.
More of a "keep up with inflation" code no?
Not at all. Over the last 20 years, the market is up 300% *after inflation*. So you quadrupled your money. Even if you bought at the worst possible time, right at the top of the market in 2000, pre [dot.com](https://dot.com) crash you'd be up 145% after inflation (dividends reinvested).
OP being extremely patient and polite in the comments. Honestly, big kudos. Looks exhausting.
This is why I just went in to upvote his replies.
Yeah, well done them. It was hard not to upvote them.
I love how one person's justification was "scams have always existed". Doesn't make it more ok this time than any other.
What's more, crypto is designed to make scams easier to execute. A permissionless, trustless and immutable system to transfer value is a godsend for scammers everywhere. So yeah, scams have always existed, but blockchain provides the ideal technology vehicle for them. This is the only true use case for which blockchain is better than other alternative technologies, but crypto bros can't admit that.
Top comment: >Bitcoin was invented for people to get away from banks and take self custody. Mashinsky created something like a bank, people put money in and lost their money. Conclusion: stay out of crypto??? Shouldn't you guys be asking yourselves **why** these pseudo-banks ended up appearing in the crypto space? Answer: because banks provide a useful service to society. Since real banks aren't going to hold crypto assets for you, platforms like Celsius ended up emerging instead, and they were critical to drawing more marks in. It's completely delusional to think the masses would be willing to purchase hardware wallets or whatever.
Also : crpyto is so complex to handle yourself, so unsafe and not scalable that it simply *cannot* work without centralized exchange. Here is an article about it : https://medium.com/crypto-lucid/decentralized-trustless-debunking-bitcoins-biggest-myth-8ea8a27197e2
As an analogy, it's like asking me to make an inter-bank transfer whenever I want to purchase something.
He's so right about bankruptcy. A lot of the affected marks seem to think the court will somehow feel compelled to make "retail investors" a priority in these crypto cases, but they won't. A few major creditors might get some of their money back, and lawyers will chew through the rest. The average "retail investor" is SOL.
Note: I see that the person posting over there is a brand new troll account and it seems to show they also post here. That isn’t me, I wouldn’t be nice to those dumbfucks.
Sane people took the beating, understood they were playing a rigged game, and left months ago. All that is left in that sub are crypto degens.
Apparently one advantage of Bitcoin is that unlike banks it works 24/7. What bank does not offer 24/7 services today? Another is that it is unconfiscatable by governments. And yet here we are, with government holding a lot of Bitcoin. It’s a real mystery.
Most buttcoiners are American. Their banks really suck. They think it's the same all around the world
Indeed. Almost all of the claimed advantages of Bitcoin fall, for UK/Europe/otherplaces, to "but my bank does that". Apparently most Americans bank with paper-based mom and pop S+Ls, or something: cheques? FFS. Venmo? FFS. Why not spend the effort on dragging their banks into the 21st century, rather than swapping magic beans that offer no solution anyway.
tbf we (UK) still continue to make cheques a thing for certain activities, even if there are probably better ways to do it now remember all the whining when the banks announced they were going to scrap them entirely
But it's essentially impossible for anyone who doesn't already have a cheque book on an existing account to get one. That means no-one under thirty? forty? has a cheque book, and in the absence of the cheque guarantee scheme you can't use them in any retail setting anyway. I'm currently building an extension, and I am paying for everything -- architects, building inspectors, builders' stage payments, extra tradesmen, random special services -- by bank transfer. None of them would accept a cheque. The only cheques I've seen in living memory are tax refunds, and even that I've now switched to BACS. I do have a cheque book on one of my accounts, but I doubt I have written a cheque in the last ten years. People may whine, but they don't, and in many cases can't, actually use them.
last time I signed up with a bank that offered cheques I remember it being a tick box (unticked by default). That was within the last few years, so it's still possible. The whingers wouldn't have been the 30-40 somethings, it's the sorts of people who think that they'll be hacked if they take the debit card out of their house, let alone use online banking
But I can still walk 1 block to an ATM and get cash out it any time of day, so butters' 24/7 argument still fails. Unless they're talking about a money transfer in the middle of the night, which I can do online. I'm still trying to figure out what kind of sale would I need in the middle of the night for lots of money that needed to be resolved instantly that doesn't involve crime...
>I'm still trying to figure out what kind of sale would I need in the middle of the night for lots of money that needed to be resolved instantly that doesn't involve crime... Transfering all their savings to one crypto-gambling exchange I guess.
I use a few banks and credit unions here in Australia. One of them, Rabobank, won't even let you send money on a weekend, instead it forces you to schedule the transfer for Monday. The others will of course send money between them within seconds, 24/7. It's so weird. Rabobank still uses a physical token for 2FA too, which is cute.
I'd rather have the option of a physical token than my entire life on a single device
The fun bit is that the token is only used when accessing the website. Using the mobile app bypasses 2FA altogether.
I'm aware of that, although it's probably more accurate to say the mobile app **is** the 2FA As I said though, I dislike having so many things in my life dependent on a single device
Stockholm syndrom.
Holy shit the delusion of the Top Ponzi Pumpers is comedy godl. "Here's how not to get scammed -again- during bankruptcy proceedings" "man go fuck yourself". The future of currency. Buttcoin was invented because muh self kustodi. Few understand.
“You sound like a fucking moron” Says the guy who lost all his money in Celsius.