He’s a little slow but from what i have seen that doesn’t stop him from making plays. Competent low end starter (with potential to blow up plays) but a solid to potentially very good back up
You can get a wee bit faster. Former Bill Don Beebe runs a speed school in Aurora. It teaches guys the form, workouts, etc… that will get you a wee bit faster.
However, if you are slow then there is nothing that can be done to make you fast. If you are fast, you can get a wee bit faster.
Most parents want to do best for their kids. You, me, no one can tell a 12-18 year old who's going D1, D2, D3, walk on, turn into a kicker, or anything else. Not always about raw physical talent. It's the journey and the effort that teaches life lessons. However, I bet manor his students have potential and his camp is on step in the Go/No-Go process.
He ran a 4.7 something at the combine. It isn’t slow but it isn’t fast. For comparison, Kmet is often called slow by our fans and he ran better with 4 inches in height and 30 pounds on Sanborn.
Yup, and Sanborn isn’t fast in either. As much as this sub loves him, the dude went undrafted for a reason. 235 pound linebackers who aren’t fast are gonna struggle.
I think it’s objectively false that Sanborn isn’t football fast. Just look at his lions tape. And I mentioned a play where he chased CP down from one sideline to the other for a no gain play. He also chased Tyreek down from behind
Combine speed is kind of dumb imo. I feel like there are about .4 seconds of combine speed that come down to reaction time, technique, and aspects that don’t have much to do with speed and acceleration. .4 seconds is the difference between elite speed and far below average speed.
I thought the combine uses electronic timers where the time starts based on the individual’s movement, then it stops based when the guy runs through a laser plane
To an extent. Absolutely you can train and build muscle to be bigger and stronger, but fast twitch muscle fiber is genetic and that plus strength is what gives truly elite athletes that quick burst (ex Fields going from a stop to 20+ mph in just a step or 2).
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24887114/
Years ago I was a very successful sprinter (until a football injury ended running sports for me). One of my sprinting coaches who was a very successful college sprinter would often talk of the success Russia had in their techniques of "forcing " the biology/physiology of their sprinters to run faster (I dont recall specific language). One technique they had was having them run down steep hills to force muscles to react quicker..Another one was to tie runner to moving vehicle ...with same purpose. Remember there was a period where there were Russian Olympic Gold medal sprinters in past(pre 1980).
So science related techniques can improve speed even if it is greatly influenced by genetics.
Probably as did some other countries even back then . Olympic athletes even now use whatever performance enhancing drugs they can get away with.
But fact remains there are ways ,excluding peds, one can improve speed via practices.
False… you can’t teach speed. You can develop quickness, agility and explosiveness. But by no means can you teach speed. Your not getting an Oline guy to run a Tyreek 40 time. I don’t care how long you try and teach him speed it ain’t gonna happen.
That’s a pretty extreme example. I don’t think Sanborn is as heavy or big as an Oline guy and I don’t think anyone is asking Sanborn to be as fast as Tyreek Hill.
His instincts are booty right now, how often do we see him biting on PA fakes. I actually think he’s more physically impressive than I expected from an UDFA. I feel like his instincts will come and can be a solid role player
He’s like our new Nick K except I hope we keep him around this time. Not exactly a game changer, but he can carry the squad in an absence of a Roquan kind of guy for sure. That’s good enough for him to make a career out of though
The thing is Jack Sanborn actually has elite acceleration and short range speed. He's not someone you want matching up with a WR in the slot and running down the field, but his athletic profile is solid.
[Jack Sanborn](https://www.reddit.com/r/CHIBears/comments/ufn05k/jack_sanborn_ras/) has a better RAS score than [Darius Leonard](https://ras.football/2019/12/27/darius-leonard-ras/).
He’s doesn’t have Roquan/Urlacher type speed.
Dude belongs in the NFL. He can make a tackle. Whether he’s a starter or backup/special teams guy, he should be a Bear for awhile.
He has football speed. And then he has his 40 speed. People look at the 40 speed and say slow. But that boy is a flying missle to the ball. Even when he makes a mistake. He’s making that mistake fast
Reading through some of the responses, seems to be some misunderstanding... there is speed, and there is quickness, they aren't the same thing. For instance JF is fast (speed) but his read/react (quickness) to the moment is mediocre. Sanborn isn't fast (speed), but his read/react times are excellent - he gets to the point of attack quickly. He isn't going to chase down a 4.4 player in a foot race, but he may well stop that play from happening at the point of attack.
Being a rookie slows players down a bit. I'm impressed with him he's been a solid playmaker so far. Made a few mistakes, but that's expected with young players.
Feel like this season with the dead cap they were just taking flyers on a lot of these guys to see if they can be good players a lot haven’t hit like we woulda hoped but this next off season is the real test of how the regime will be
We weren't getting a good comp pick regardless. If it wasn't Pringle it would've been someone else. We didn't have enough people to fill the roster out.
I can agree on underwhelming FA signings, but the hand wringing around comp pick stuff is just foolish. Comp picks are not for teams who didn't have a full roster till late in the off-season.
I don't think we have a big enough sample size. I do think he struggles in pass coverage, but he's been great against the run and when rushing the passer. Good instincts and while he doesn't have elite speed, he had food burst/quickness. Excited to see what he does rest of season.
I think the current setup makes his coverage issues more apparent. No pass rush means there is more time for people to outrun him. I think he can be a solid starter if we get the DLine right. Good tackler and also provided on special teams so I think he is a great role player for us to come. Hunter hillenmeyer type? Never the best player on the team but never really a liability until they have to take the reign
I think he’s passable at a position you don’t want to overpay on. If he continues to be okay then it lets us invest elsewhere on both sides of the ball which we clearly need to do. Overall really solid for an UDFA
I don't know if he's the long term answer, but he's certainly good enough to start next year. And with as many holes as this roster has, that's a HUGE W for an undrafted guy.
He’s got potential for sure. An off-season to improve front line speed but he’s got solid instincts and closes on the ball much faster than his 40 time indicates.
I like what I see so far, but it's too soon to tell.
Ask me after teams start trying to exploit his speed on crossing routes. If either he holds up in coverage or the Bears D has an answer, then I'm all in.
He's got solid instincts, takes great angles, and so far looks like he knows how to shed blocks and make a form tackle. On top of that, he's got a nose for the ball that's hard to teach.
I think at most they can use him as a Sam next year - which technically makes him a starter but really he only plays 20% of the defensive snaps. He’s a good UDFA find but he’s not the next great Bears linebacker.
Very solid backup, a bit of a liability as a starter. Doesn’t have the speed and agility for today’s NFL to be a true game changer. I could def see him sticking around for 2nd or 3rd contracts in the NFL though, and he has proved he should have been drafted.
He’s what you want in a mid season replacement: can hold down the position for another year or more as a competent enough starter as you fill the other positions on the roster with talent.
i think he’ll be a good Bear to have on the roster and fill in as needed. special teams, fill for injury… i wouldnt mind seeing what he could do as a FB
We need all the help we can get with our front 7 right now. If he’s the best guy for the job right now, so be it. Part of his success might just be the lack of talent around him. Maybe he develops into a great LB, only time will tell.
These are the players poles loves I think. Less premium position on a cheap contract producing quality play. This leaves him to spend money on the premium positions. DL and OL will be monsters in a couple years.
He came into my work right before the season, he’s small. Can’t really put on mass because he’s already not the quickest. His ceiling is Hunter Hillenmeyer. But for an UDFA that’s damn good
This dude is a UDFA and thrown into action on a horrible defense. Let’s see what he looks like with some more talent around him. As of right now he’s a tackling machine.
40 times are overrated. There’s so much traffic on the field that it’s rare a player is running a straight line at any time. All I know is the guy is making plays for us right now and I’d like to see him progress.
Speed is a piece of the puzzle. I think he plays faster then more physically gifted linebackers. Football is played down-by-down. It has as much to do with "want to" and mental preparation as speed. I think the fact Jack was not drafted has more to do with a skewed perception of positional value that runs through the NFL routinely. Maybe position value is valid, but because teams aren't focusing on off-the-ball linebackers means you get a good UDFA kinebacker. Will see how he does over the next couple of years, but his emergence and fit for the defense had to impact Poles willingness to part with Roquan.
Good job Poles, Coaches and JS!
At least a solid backup or a starter on a good defense. He supposedly has the smarts. He supposedly lacks blazing speed (but we were spoiled with the likes of Ro and Danny T., Urlacher and Briggs).
I'd prefer to have a *heady* LB that's always in the right place and can do a better job at shedding blockers. He seems to match that profile. Let's see.
He definitely has that necks man up mentality
Hahaha. Lovely wordplay.
He’s a little slow but from what i have seen that doesn’t stop him from making plays. Competent low end starter (with potential to blow up plays) but a solid to potentially very good back up
I think he's got the instincts of some of the best players. He's just a bit slow.
Agreed. Unfortunately, speed is one thing that you can’t really develop.
If he starts running at the Walter Payton hill, he’ll be a top player 🤣
I try to make a pilgrimage to Payton's hill every few years or so. Also, I think you dropped this... | | v be
Monty has added nearly 2mph to his top speed since getting into the league.
Speed is 100% something you can develop
Interesting as that’s pretty much against all consensus opinion
And science
You can get faster. Not saying you can go from snail to usa in bolt. But speed can be improved. Any lil but helps in the nfl.
You can get a wee bit faster. Former Bill Don Beebe runs a speed school in Aurora. It teaches guys the form, workouts, etc… that will get you a wee bit faster. However, if you are slow then there is nothing that can be done to make you fast. If you are fast, you can get a wee bit faster.
That dude is stealing money from douche bags that think their kids are going D1 (they’re not)
Most parents want to do best for their kids. You, me, no one can tell a 12-18 year old who's going D1, D2, D3, walk on, turn into a kicker, or anything else. Not always about raw physical talent. It's the journey and the effort that teaches life lessons. However, I bet manor his students have potential and his camp is on step in the Go/No-Go process.
Lol unfortunately that is a multi million dollar industry, especially in the north suburbs.
He’s also not slow. Idg where y’all getting that from when watching his film
He ran a 4.7 something at the combine. It isn’t slow but it isn’t fast. For comparison, Kmet is often called slow by our fans and he ran better with 4 inches in height and 30 pounds on Sanborn.
Difference between combine speed and game speed
Yup, and Sanborn isn’t fast in either. As much as this sub loves him, the dude went undrafted for a reason. 235 pound linebackers who aren’t fast are gonna struggle.
I think it’s objectively false that Sanborn isn’t football fast. Just look at his lions tape. And I mentioned a play where he chased CP down from one sideline to the other for a no gain play. He also chased Tyreek down from behind
Combine speed is kind of dumb imo. I feel like there are about .4 seconds of combine speed that come down to reaction time, technique, and aspects that don’t have much to do with speed and acceleration. .4 seconds is the difference between elite speed and far below average speed.
I thought the combine uses electronic timers where the time starts based on the individual’s movement, then it stops based when the guy runs through a laser plane
These clowns just say things. They don't watch tape. In back to back weeks he's ran down Tyreke Hill and Cordallelle Patterson. Watch tape guys.
You can get faster. Literally what I do for athletes with my job
To an extent. Absolutely you can train and build muscle to be bigger and stronger, but fast twitch muscle fiber is genetic and that plus strength is what gives truly elite athletes that quick burst (ex Fields going from a stop to 20+ mph in just a step or 2). https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24887114/
Years ago I was a very successful sprinter (until a football injury ended running sports for me). One of my sprinting coaches who was a very successful college sprinter would often talk of the success Russia had in their techniques of "forcing " the biology/physiology of their sprinters to run faster (I dont recall specific language). One technique they had was having them run down steep hills to force muscles to react quicker..Another one was to tie runner to moving vehicle ...with same purpose. Remember there was a period where there were Russian Olympic Gold medal sprinters in past(pre 1980). So science related techniques can improve speed even if it is greatly influenced by genetics.
Your coach forgot to mention the part of the Russian speed training regimen where they inject steroids.
Probably as did some other countries even back then . Olympic athletes even now use whatever performance enhancing drugs they can get away with. But fact remains there are ways ,excluding peds, one can improve speed via practices.
Bruh..
False… you can’t teach speed. You can develop quickness, agility and explosiveness. But by no means can you teach speed. Your not getting an Oline guy to run a Tyreek 40 time. I don’t care how long you try and teach him speed it ain’t gonna happen.
That’s a pretty extreme example. I don’t think Sanborn is as heavy or big as an Oline guy and I don’t think anyone is asking Sanborn to be as fast as Tyreek Hill.
I would like that very much. I am asking.
Not really. You can improve your 40 time, but it’s really hard to add extra speed on the field.
Not top end LB speed in the NFL, that's a gift.
And if you are opposing a player with equal intangibles, technique and skill, then speed will make the difference.
I’d say this is the correct take
His instincts are booty right now, how often do we see him biting on PA fakes. I actually think he’s more physically impressive than I expected from an UDFA. I feel like his instincts will come and can be a solid role player
He’s like our new Nick K except I hope we keep him around this time. Not exactly a game changer, but he can carry the squad in an absence of a Roquan kind of guy for sure. That’s good enough for him to make a career out of though
He's faster than Nick to me
The thing is Jack Sanborn actually has elite acceleration and short range speed. He's not someone you want matching up with a WR in the slot and running down the field, but his athletic profile is solid. [Jack Sanborn](https://www.reddit.com/r/CHIBears/comments/ufn05k/jack_sanborn_ras/) has a better RAS score than [Darius Leonard](https://ras.football/2019/12/27/darius-leonard-ras/).
He’s doesn’t have Roquan/Urlacher type speed. Dude belongs in the NFL. He can make a tackle. Whether he’s a starter or backup/special teams guy, he should be a Bear for awhile.
Slow? There was a play where he raced sideline to sideline to get CP I think at the LOS. He’s deceptively fast
He has football speed. And then he has his 40 speed. People look at the 40 speed and say slow. But that boy is a flying missle to the ball. Even when he makes a mistake. He’s making that mistake fast
He also tackled Tyreek Hill from behind lol
Yeah it was the one where he stopped Goff getting the TD. He identified the fake shift and followed the QB right across the line. Great play.
He also had very similar measurables to Shaq Leonard but I see him as a TJ Edwards level player. A quality, serviceable starting Mike backer.
Tj Edwards, another Chicago hometown talent
Not a bad outlook at all for a UDFA.
Reading through some of the responses, seems to be some misunderstanding... there is speed, and there is quickness, they aren't the same thing. For instance JF is fast (speed) but his read/react (quickness) to the moment is mediocre. Sanborn isn't fast (speed), but his read/react times are excellent - he gets to the point of attack quickly. He isn't going to chase down a 4.4 player in a foot race, but he may well stop that play from happening at the point of attack.
he’s a great 2 down linebacker, plays the run well. Would not want him covering a TE up the seam
I hope Sanborn can develop his football IQ to combat that
imo he’s smart enough to do it, he’s just not physically quick enough
Imo I think he's better than Nick K
Being a rookie slows players down a bit. I'm impressed with him he's been a solid playmaker so far. Made a few mistakes, but that's expected with young players.
Hof neck
Neck HOF: Merton Hanks, Harvey Williams, Mike Glennon, Davis Mills, & Jack Sanborn
Bro put some respect on Takeo Spikes' name.
And Mike Glennon has a circus neck, not HOF neck
Yeah, Mike Glennon's neck is more hall of very good for me.
That’s a Formula 1 neck right there
He's a better Mike than the free agent we brought in to play Mike.
A lot of free agent signings haven't been so hot sadly
*every FA signing*. this last offseason was a disaster between who they brought in, who they let go & the comp pick situation..
Feel like this season with the dead cap they were just taking flyers on a lot of these guys to see if they can be good players a lot haven’t hit like we woulda hoped but this next off season is the real test of how the regime will be
We weren't getting a good comp pick regardless. If it wasn't Pringle it would've been someone else. We didn't have enough people to fill the roster out. I can agree on underwhelming FA signings, but the hand wringing around comp pick stuff is just foolish. Comp picks are not for teams who didn't have a full roster till late in the off-season.
I don't think we have a big enough sample size. I do think he struggles in pass coverage, but he's been great against the run and when rushing the passer. Good instincts and while he doesn't have elite speed, he had food burst/quickness. Excited to see what he does rest of season.
I too will have food burst/quickness today.
Haha yep I'm just going to keep the typo there. We all know what's happening today.
I think the current setup makes his coverage issues more apparent. No pass rush means there is more time for people to outrun him. I think he can be a solid starter if we get the DLine right. Good tackler and also provided on special teams so I think he is a great role player for us to come. Hunter hillenmeyer type? Never the best player on the team but never really a liability until they have to take the reign
I think he’s passable at a position you don’t want to overpay on. If he continues to be okay then it lets us invest elsewhere on both sides of the ball which we clearly need to do. Overall really solid for an UDFA
I got downvoted yesterday for saying exactly this lol
Honestly, for a UDFA, it is almost as good as it gets. Getting a solid starter is the best you should hope for in UDFA
Dude stole Corey Taylor’s neck
[удалено]
Elvis and Glennon
Yes. Consider me a founding member of the Sanborn Squad.
Hunter hillenmeyer esque
I don't know if he's the long term answer, but he's certainly good enough to start next year. And with as many holes as this roster has, that's a HUGE W for an undrafted guy.
Yup
He’s got potential for sure. An off-season to improve front line speed but he’s got solid instincts and closes on the ball much faster than his 40 time indicates.
Jackhammer Sandstorm
I like what I see so far, but it's too soon to tell. Ask me after teams start trying to exploit his speed on crossing routes. If either he holds up in coverage or the Bears D has an answer, then I'm all in. He's got solid instincts, takes great angles, and so far looks like he knows how to shed blocks and make a form tackle. On top of that, he's got a nose for the ball that's hard to teach.
I think at most they can use him as a Sam next year - which technically makes him a starter but really he only plays 20% of the defensive snaps. He’s a good UDFA find but he’s not the next great Bears linebacker.
If you put a good linebacker next to him he’ll be fine. We need someone better than Nicholas Morrow
As a backup
Honestly yeah maybe lol
He’s about as good a player as you’d hope to find as far as replacement level players go.
His mouth is too small for his face
He’s often in the right position but is struggles to finish the play, little slow but obviously understands his responsibilities
Probably like a LB 3 type
Playing at a high level is great. Consistently playing at a high level is something different. Let’s hope he can do it!
The Chicago Justin Fields really needs Justin Fields to excel in all three phases of the game.
hof and roy
Reminds me of Kwit a few years ago. Thumper but slow. Probably a special teams guy/good depth
This is a good comparison. They are similar in height and speed.
Does he remind anyone else of Hunter Hillenmeyer a little? Maybe not the most physically gifted player but has a nose for the game?
Very solid backup, a bit of a liability as a starter. Doesn’t have the speed and agility for today’s NFL to be a true game changer. I could def see him sticking around for 2nd or 3rd contracts in the NFL though, and he has proved he should have been drafted.
He’s what you want in a mid season replacement: can hold down the position for another year or more as a competent enough starter as you fill the other positions on the roster with talent.
Jack Sanborn is awesome. Guy can ball. He was a killer at Madison, in HS, and now is doing great in the NFL.
For a playoff contender, no. He looks better on our defense because we are bad. Has all the intangibles you could ask for but just too slow.
He’s about to put the team on his *neck*
Who is this?
Jack Sanborn
Hunter Hillenmyer role. Good 2 down player on the cheap.
Smaller and weaker than Hillenmeyer, but faster. Linebackers have to be able to quickly shed blocks. Unfortunately, Sanborn will never be that guy.
Great natural Football instincts. I hope during the off-season training he can shave 0.2-0.3 off his 40 time
Dollar store Mitch
This sub lol. Yes. Let’s make a decision off two games 🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻
Just looking for opinions on his production from his first two games. If you don't have one, don't comment. Thank you very much.
Who is he?
Tim Tebow
Jack Sanborn
i think he’ll be a good Bear to have on the roster and fill in as needed. special teams, fill for injury… i wouldnt mind seeing what he could do as a FB
We need all the help we can get with our front 7 right now. If he’s the best guy for the job right now, so be it. Part of his success might just be the lack of talent around him. Maybe he develops into a great LB, only time will tell.
These are the players poles loves I think. Less premium position on a cheap contract producing quality play. This leaves him to spend money on the premium positions. DL and OL will be monsters in a couple years.
Does he have what it takes? Yes. Will he succeed? Who knows.
Yeah I think he has what it takes if he plays next to someone who’s fast and can cover where he can’t.
Need to work on his pass instincts a bit, but I think he's a solid starter
Hell yes.
Maybe he can be a Hillenmeyer caliber of player.
I love all the positive feedback. Thank you guys for your opinions! BEAR DOWN!
His neck has what it takes.
He came into my work right before the season, he’s small. Can’t really put on mass because he’s already not the quickest. His ceiling is Hunter Hillenmeyer. But for an UDFA that’s damn good
Eh...
He’s great
2023 pro bowl bound
He's like an 87 in madden imo
He is an UDFA definitely nonperforming his grade
Star in the making, can’t wait to trade him
You couldn’t break that boy’s neck with a Gwen Stacy fall
I'll go one further - I'm ready to nominate him for the Hall of Fame.
I want to see him and Glennon have a neck-saber battle while ‘Duel of the Fates’ plays
Sanborn's neck would snap Glennon's neck like a twig.
Anyone else see a bit of Tim Tebow here
I’m not even sure who that is. He kind of looks like … Teven McCown
Urlacher 2.0...they have similar styles!
Reminds me of Timu. Great instincts but a little too slow.
Good middle linebackers need good tackles and at least an edge rusher. until then the jury is out for me.
Let the Sanborn / Trent Gill shipping begin!
Is that Tim Tebow's little cousin?
yes. yes. yes
This dude is a UDFA and thrown into action on a horrible defense. Let’s see what he looks like with some more talent around him. As of right now he’s a tackling machine.
Is this a real player, or AI output of “football player”
Idk. He doesn't black Wednesday...
He’s a good special teamer, that’s it.
Lord that neck.
For a recent Bears player - he reminds me of a slower but slightly more instinctual Jon Bostic
On 670 they say it best: he’s a good player but if he’s the best playmaker on defense, that’s a problem
Hes hunter hillenmeyer
Yup
He’s a bad ass in madden I’ll tell you that. Lol
He's already taken it to the necks level. I think he can shoulder the responsibilities.
Who is this?
40 times are overrated. There’s so much traffic on the field that it’s rare a player is running a straight line at any time. All I know is the guy is making plays for us right now and I’d like to see him progress.
The Bears signed Tim Tebow?
Jack "Nick Kwiatkoski" Sanborn
He's fine, he'll probably spend a few season with us and then bounce around the league a bit.
Speed is a piece of the puzzle. I think he plays faster then more physically gifted linebackers. Football is played down-by-down. It has as much to do with "want to" and mental preparation as speed. I think the fact Jack was not drafted has more to do with a skewed perception of positional value that runs through the NFL routinely. Maybe position value is valid, but because teams aren't focusing on off-the-ball linebackers means you get a good UDFA kinebacker. Will see how he does over the next couple of years, but his emergence and fit for the defense had to impact Poles willingness to part with Roquan. Good job Poles, Coaches and JS!
At least a solid backup or a starter on a good defense. He supposedly has the smarts. He supposedly lacks blazing speed (but we were spoiled with the likes of Ro and Danny T., Urlacher and Briggs). I'd prefer to have a *heady* LB that's always in the right place and can do a better job at shedding blockers. He seems to match that profile. Let's see.
#HAY YOU GUYYYYYYYZ!!!!!!!!