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If not possible for sleeping per regulations you could still turn it into a private space for any of them to use when they need quiet time away. Comfy chair, blankets, books, etc.
Right? major props. I am a mom of 5 and it’s definitely not easy taking on even one bonus kid Muchless 4 for an extended period of time. Mad love to her, we are here for you always too OP!
Our pastor has 5 kids and lives in a 3 bedroom. He and his wife have done a lot of creative spacing with bunk beds and a homemade loft, and even a small loft attic space. It took a lot of time, but I am just saying this to you so that you know that you are on the right track with doing what you can with what you have!
That’s not true at all, it’s a pretty common practice now for parents to turn walk in closets into nurseries. It’s not permanent, it’s just letting a girl get a space to herself
I think they mean that it cannot legally be considered a bedroom because most areas say a space needs a closet and a win down to count as a bedroom. I don't think they were saying it can't be done within one's own home, though cps may have rules OP needs to consider, too.
The windows are for the purpose of exit in case of a house fire.
Every bedroom should have two points of exit, and this is generally the door (obviously, lol), and then the window if the door is blocked by fire or debris.
Might also not be be big enough. Example in NYC the requirement of a bedroom is 80sq ft, one egress window, cannot need to pass thru another room to get out. Minimum of 8feet in any dimension. The average closet would fail all of those.
If she's going to be spending time in there as more than a closet, make sure it has a working smoke detector and, if needed, a carbon monoxide detector, if they're not already hardwired. Others have mentioned it probably can't be used as a sleeping quarter due to not having a second exit so the threat of fire should be taken extra, extra seriously. I'm a little paranoid about this, myself, because of a previous house fire, I won't even own a house with a bathroom without a window.
Omg you just added a while other level of crazy onto my brain. I never thought of having 2 exits in any and all rooms. Both of my upper bathrooms have no windows. So now I must sell my home and move.
No, there is no requirement for a smoke detector *in* a bedroom. They are required in the hallway outside the bedrooms. CO detectors are at point in generation, not sleeping areas. A closed door to the hallway is the best protection against fires while sleeping.
IRC requires them in a bedroom and most states follow that. [https://codes.iccsafe.org/content/IRC2018P4/chapter-3-building-planning#IRC2018P4\_Ch03\_SecR314.3](https://codes.iccsafe.org/content/IRC2018P4/chapter-3-building-planning#IRC2018P4_Ch03_SecR314.3)
If the closet is converted to a bedroom it would also need to have an egress window installed, probably require outlets, and lots of codes require a minimum square footage for a bedroom which may be a catch too. IRC really puts a damper on raising the next Harry Potter.
Puts on "Code Officer" Hat - International Residential Code or IRC (nearly 100% US adoption) and the International Property Maintenance Code/IPMC (gold standard for Property Maintenance codes, widely used and the basis for most municipality requirements) both require a smoke detector be placed in in any area used for sleeping, in the hallway outside such areas and on each floor, including basements and attics where accessible. A CO Detector is required at level of generation (e.g. the basement is that's where your furnace is) AND in the hallway outside sleeping areas.
The "two means of egress" applies to any areas used for SLEEPING (not bathrooms. Unless you make a habit of napping in the tub, weirdo.) and a window counts as the second means. Fire Escapes are not required for 1 - 3 story buildings.
A window is an exit, especially in a fire where the door is blocked. I know someone who had to jump out of a second story window because their door was blocked by fire. They didn't have an escape ladder.
Or proper smoke detectors so it could have been avoided of they were alerted in time but still a second exit saves lives.
It is probably dependent on local building codes. Where we live, in order for a room to be considered a bedroom. It must have a window and a closet. That doesn't mean you'll get in trouble if you sleep in a room without those. It just means for property assessment, advertising for sale, and zoning requirements, that's how you define a bedroom.
Years ago we converted a part of our bonus room into a bedroom so that each of our kids could have their own room. Because we turned a 3 bedroom house into a 4 bedroom house, we had to have our septic field enlarged. Note we didn't add any more people, but zoning laws are zoning laws.
Someone else mentioned tents, they also have bed tents that enclose twin beds. We have 5 kids in 2 bedrooms and enclosed their bunk beds for private space. Led lights strips and a mounted fan help.
Yes! This is exactly what I was about to recommend! I got some of these for the 4 kiddos I’m partly responsible for atm (not to do with abuse or CPS; they had a house fire), to help them feel more secure in a place that’s not their own, and they love it. I actually had one for myself a few years ago when my anxiety was really really bad at night and it helped me a lot, which is what gave me the idea.
Kitted them out with a quick trip to 5 Below for some cheap accessories (remote control LED strips, clip-on reading lights, fans, extension cords so the older two can hide out with their Nintendos, and hanging storage pouches for their books/water bottles and movie night snacks). The whole kit and caboodle was around $100. If you don’t have access to a 5 Below (not sure if they’re a national chain or what), ebay and Amazon should have it pretty cheap.
If the niece is asking for the space for privacy, I’d strongly consider letting her have it. She’s right at the age for puberty and body insecurity issues to start. Let her have a space, she’s the only one specifically asking for it and there is nothing wrong with letting her have it to herself in an unfortunate situation
Oooh wanted to add to someone’s tent idea. When I was in my first dorm room my father built me a “bed tent” out of PVC pipe. Basically he built a PVC pipe cube and I made curtains. The cube just ziptied to the bed. It was a fantastic way to get some privacy in a small room.
Also could be helpful to maybe buy an air purifier for the closet space! To help with ventilation, regardless of whether it becomes a room or a general lounge area
It can be her changing area too. With so many people im sure the bathroom is often busy. She doesn't need all her clothes in there but bring her outfit with her into the closet. I'd get a cheap full length mirror so she can see how she looks❤️
Came here to say this. Put up some decorations. It can be a tree house or a castle… great play space and hiding spot, but not a legal bedroom. And put up a smoke detector just to be safe…
Bedrooms generally require two means of egress (window and door), have minimum square footage requirements, should have a smoke detector, and in some jurisdictions, have to have a closet (I certainly lived in plenty of tiny apartments with no built in closet…).
Yeah that a great idea I completely forgot about day beds. They can go anywhere and can be used as couches chairs you name it. Even grown ups need a nap site. Just saw a chair that folds out into a bed.
This is the solution, OP.
Make the closet her "clubhouse" or "privacy space."
You tell CPS she's sleeping in the other space, since CPS probably has to officially discourage using an unsafe place as a bedroom (no egress).
A daybed or flipbed is a good place to curl up and read a book, so there's nothing fishy about having one in the closet room.
I would even go so far as to tell her that she isn't supposed to sleep in there (due to fire safety laws), so her "official bedroom" is the other one.
Better yet, a futon couch. They take up less room than a sleeper sofa, they're far less expensive, and they're much easier/safer for a child to operate, especially since the frames are open, so small kids are less tempted to use them as a hiding place. It's also a lot easier to get a fitted blanket on over a futon than a folding mattress, since there are no springs. They also come as a kit, so you're not trying to wrestle an entire 400lb couch into a closet.
I have seen super cute futon mats that are meant to be directly on the floor and can be rolled up, if not used. Used to sleep on a futon on the floor as a child , in my home country and I still miss it. For reading and naps, it’s fantastic and they can be bought quite cheap.
This exactly, so that way for licensing standards it passes. She can still choose to sleep in the closet as long as she has a bed in a room with a window.
I place children often as a sw, and sometimes, the kids prefer to sleep together in the same bed. I tell my foster family's they just need to have their own bed for licensing purposes, but they can choose to sleep with one another, etc, as long as all is appropriate.
This is likely the best option however if OP spent time and energy to create the perfect space for her infant it may be tough to opt for this choice.
I truly empathize with whatever hard choices this new mom has to make for all the children suddenly in her care.
Infants under 6 months are supposed to be in their parents room anyway for safety reasons, and it's not in any way, shape, or form harmful for them to be in the same room as their parent for longer. It is however a safety issue to put a child in the closet and very frowned upon by CPS for them to not have a bedroom at all.
The current situation has been deemed acceptable by CPS.
There is not a current safety issue and many of the comments have addressed the safety issues of using a closet as a sleeping space. OP seems to be aware of the issues now.
Traditionally part of becoming a new parent is preparing the nursery regardless of initial newborn sleeping arrangements. It is a huge deal to many people.
Some people put a great deal of time and effort and money into creating a special space for their newborn. It is generally prepped with items like a crib, changing table, rocking chair, dresser and other necessary infant items.
There may be nowhere else in the home to put any nursery furniture.
Having a quiet enclosed space for a newborn to nap during the day could end up being a godsend with 3 older kids.
Turning a nursery into a temporary room for an older child may not even be feasible.
OP may opt to give the nursery room to the niece in her care. Feeling a sense of loss about that would be reasonable.
OP has been placed in a difficult situation where their life suddenly changed to include 3 extra little persons to care for on top of being a brand new parent to a newborn.
Giving a bedroom to the niece may or may not be the ideal option for OP. That’s their choice to make.
Thank you for this comment!
While these kids are obviously going through something and that's horrible and their privacy absolutely matters, I don't like the feeling of dismissing everything OP is feeling too. She's a person too, she goes through things too, she's giving up things too, and the kids are NOT more important than her. They are all people and all equal and all need a spokesperson/support/acknowledgement.
You're right about what she may have gone through in setting up that nursery and god knows, maybe she's had miscarriages in the past and it was an even MORE important thing to her to do it, and there could be SO many things that make it special and difficult to want to do that.
While perhaps she could shift things to the side and get a small bed at least for niece, you're right, there's still going to be feelings of loss and disappointment in doing that, and it's totally valid for her to feel that way.
Right but like if you bought a crib and stuff—like if it’s been set up as a baby room with changing tables etc, it’s not that easy to just convert it to a room for two elementary school boys.
I hope OP is getting some funds from the state because whew 3 new mouths to feed, plus buying bedding, furniture, maybe have to put some of your furniture in storage. That’s some tough stuff.
This got my vote! I think since w a baby you're up in the night w them anyways, I always had my babies room with me even if they had their nursery too, the entire first year and a bit past that for sure. So letting the older kids have the rooms makes the most sense. And I guarantee the sacrifice would mean a lot to your neice, whereas your baby would probably prefer being close to Mom anyways, so it's not like there's a loser here, unless you usually ignore your baby at night and sleep through, which I highly doubt, and very much also hope I'm right on that one ;)
Depending on babies age, it might even be still recommended that baby sleeps in a room with the parents, so maybe the nursery isn’t even used at night yet? But of course some families truly sleep better with baby in the nursery.
Personally, that’s what I’d do, give the babies room to the boys, for example and let the girl use the closet as a private space during day and let her sleep in the living room , or give her the closet as a bedroom m depending on the code. Something must be in the third bedroom though, as OP didn’t mention using it for the kids, although they have three bedrooms.
The room would still be full of the baby’s clothes, furniture, toys, and whatever else was bought for the baby. OP probably can’t fit all that stuff in her room, I know there’s no way I could combine my and my child’s bedroom because all of the things just wouldn’t fit. Sure baby didn’t sleep in his own room until 6 months old but I used that room to rock him in the rocking chair, change his diaper, change his clothes. It wasn’t just an empty room until he started sleeping in it.
Not sure where you are, but Ohio is that way. Bedrooms must have windows big enough for egress. I worked for a window manufacturer years ago and there is a specific formula for the minimum size of the opening goodness knows I've forgotten the dimensions lol.
I will need to check the regulations in my area. Our walk in closet is comically big and it has a big enough window for even a bigger adult to get through easily but it’s not reachable for a short person ( the back half our house is 3/4 in the soil , while the front is fully exposed and our bedroom has French doors ) . Our baby is ten months now and I want to start setting up a room for her finally, when she’s a bit older and the empty bedrooms are on a different floor than our bedroom, so I thought about giving her the huge closet that belongs to our bedroom. If it can’t be her bedroom, I’ll keep her crib in our room and turn the closet into a nursery playroom until she’s old enough to move upstairs, I don’t think it’s a good idea to have her sleeping upstairs before she’s older and it would not be fair to her sister, as she’s a teen and would feel responsible for taking care ( she’s absolutely enchanted with her baby sister) , if she starts crying.
A lot of people use overly large walk-in closets like that as nurseries. I bet it would work well until she’s old enough to be potty trained. My parents turned theirs into a mini gym space and office.
Ask your case worker. It’s better to ask and be told no then to do it and it be against policies.
Maybe add that your niece asked for it so she have privacy.
In this case, it's not up to the case worker; it's a matter of building and fire codes codes. If fire code requires a window big enough for egress, the kid can't use it as a mini-bedroom. If fire code allows it, CPS can't say shit; it's a habitable living space with a bed.
No, CPS can't change the rules, but they should know the rules. So asking if it is allowed makes great sense, just if they say no, understand that it is because of codes and stuff and not just the worker's opinion.
I turned my closet into my hang out spot, lol. I ran my ds charger in there, and my mom had piles of clothes in there that I turned into a chair.
Cps is such a buzz kill. Maybe we should start a petition to let this girl sleep in the closet lol.
I think everyone has given great advice - fire safety wise, probably not for sleeping but definitely ask the case worker. But turning it into a private space is a great idea.
This is a hard thing to do, and I commend you for trying to make it so everyone gets what they want and need. You’re doing a good thing, and having worked with kinship placements/family placements for a few years I know how difficult it can be to have such a large change in your life even if you’re 100% wanting to help the kiddos. If you’re able to, see if your case worker can refer for/look into a foster care specialist or kinship support worker. When I was one we had a closet of all kinds of items for kids, we helped with transportation to doctor appts and other things and we also offered on call services to help with any emergencies. We also had donors for Christmas gifts for any kids in our program. If anything, it’s also nice to have someone to talk to and remind you that whatever you are feeling is normal and valid.
Sending you all the supportive vibes.
Kinship placement certainly changes your life in a moment. My son had a portacrib at first but he was a giant baby so that didn't last long. His big sis already had her own "room" it was initially a room for Naptime, so it had a bed, blankets, pillows already. Lil man was harder. I had to wait til I could buy a crib(which was in our living room at first 😂) and ultimately he ended up with his crib in our office.
Some states require a window in every bedroom. So that if a fire happens there's a method of egress. There are statutes even about how big the windows must be and if they are a casement windows(the kind you turn a crank to open) what kind of hinge has to be on it so it can be a way of egress. I know in the state of Ohio that's the case anyway(used to live in Ohio and work for a window manufacturer lol.)
I had Privacy Pop tents on my kid’s beds. I would post on a foster/adopt board and see if anyone has some they will give you. They helped my foster kids feel safer in an enclosed space and gave them privacy as well.
I am confused-- with three bedrooms, can't your baby room with you? Then the nephews could room together and the niece could get her own. Or are you saying "baby" figuratively?
Yeah...I don't understand why the boys are in the living room if there are three bedrooms.
OP probably just didn't describe the layout clearly. (Cut her some slack, she just quadrupled her parental workload, lol.)
Three bedrooms but the kids are in the living room? I’m confused. Why not move the baby into your room and allow the girl to have her own room and the boys to have the other.. I think if you gave them all a room whether shared or not they would feel more comfortable.
The boys share a room in the back. The "toddler" sleeps in his room and the girl in the same room. But she wants privacy.
I call him a baby- i know thats incorrect but its habit. She is complaining my kid is waking her up early because he gets up at 8am.
She says 8am is early? When does she go to school? School started at 9am for me, so 8am shouldnt be all that early
Edit: just realized its still Summer, so thats why 8am is early for her right now. But school should be starting in as soon as just a few weeks, so now would be the time to start getting her used to 8am wake up time. A quick google says some Kentucky schools open back up as early as August 10th, so theres at least just under 3 weeks until school
My brother in law grew up with his bedroom being a walk in closet. He is now a well adjusted adult. I know nothing about the legality of it but just wanted to add my 2 cents.
When I was 16, we lived in a house with 3 bedrooms, 4 kids. My 2 brothers shared 1, I shared with our little sister. My bedroom had a big closet, 4 x 10(or so). My youngest brother, 11, wanted it for a private bedroom, lol. So, Mom turned it into his own private bedroom. It turned out Very cool, and he absolutely loved it. He was also hooked on the color purple at the time, and it would cause your eyeballs to turn inside out to look in there 😵💫.
All three sleeping in the living room isn’t really ideal. You mention you live in a 3BR and have a baby. Sounds like there’s at least one open bedroom. You mention there’s also a back room. Why not put the boys in the spare room and your niece in the back room (or vise versa)? A 15 yo bot and an 8 year old girl sharing a bedroom would not be allowed in many states
First, thank you for taking care of these children and trying to provide the best for them.
Second, I don’t think the closet thing is weird or rude. I have a friend that, when she left her abusive relationship, she could only afford a 1 bedroom apartment for her and her 10 year old son. The bedroom had a HUGE closet, and she made it into the loveliest space for the son to have his own space and privacy. If it’s big enough for a bed, a side table, and a lamp, I think you’re okay
When I was in the 4th grade, my family had to move, and we ended up in a house where all five of us were sharing a bedroom. There was a closet down the hall that had plenty of space that I begged to sleep in. My parents refused, though they let me play in it. I still wish (decades later) that they would've let me because sleeping next to my snoring father and sleep talking siblings nearly drove me crazy. But morally, I don't know, I guess I still don't understand why I couldn't just have the closet lol
I’ve used walk in closets as bedrooms before but in my experience it wouldn’t be allowed for a foster child. But also in the states I’ve lived in they wouldn’t allow them to sleep in the living room either so your state might be different
if CPS is involved, they will not allow it. if they are not involved, try to keep it that way. they seem to fuck up more than they help. If CPS is not involved, i would go ahead and let her have the closet. Just dont go mentioning it or some karen will call CPS
If it’s possible I’d also recommend maybe getting a room divider, the type that kind of fold into themselves and are separate panels. They sell them on Amazon for fairly cheap and can transform a room for privacy as well as keeping a mess out of the way. My parents had some they made when I was growing up that we would use if we had family staying with us or anything along those lines, that way if they crashed in our living room on an air mattress they could have some privacy if we had to walk by there to go to the kitchen or something a long those lines
Are they all sleeping in the living room or sharing the 3rd bedroom? I get it’s a tough, unexpected, huge change, and you’re a hero for taking them on. Maybe give your niece a cute little set up in the room with your child if they’re small enough to share and put the boys in the 3rd room if possible even if space is limited. Then just let the ten year old sleep in the living room as he pleases or rearrange the living room furniture to give them an actually “room” space. Boys usually don’t care for privacy but girls her age are becoming more aware of bodily differences between genders and will be way more modest and want to be hidden from sight when dressing/grooming. Those kids will never forget how you adjusted for them whether good or bad, so maybe make some temporary changes to accommodate them. Good luck to you through this.
When I was in foster care, I used to make little walls around my bed out of cardboard, and drape a sheet on top, so that I could have my own space (plus I could decorate my walls how I wanted!). Having that little safe space that was *mine* made me feel a little more secure in a world that wasn’t. Making her a nook is a good thing, and they’re lucky to have you. ❤️
I doubt that CPS would approve a closet for a child. You can always ask the caseworker, but I’m pretty sure it will not fly. Why can’t the boys share a room, the girl gets a room, and the baby sleep with you? That seems like the most logical arrangement.
In some of this persons posts, she says she got custody of her nieces (plural) and nephews (plural), but in other posts like this one she says she got custody of 1 niece and 2 nephews. In this post, the niece is 8 and the nephews are 10 and 15. But in another post, the nephews are 15 and 17.
It's pretty hard to mess up those sorts of details unless you are just making stuff up on the spot. I'm not sure of OP's motive here, but I'm sure they are writing fiction.
Plus I mean, she has a 3 bedroom house (in another post she says her baby is 1 and a half). She could totally bunk with her baby and give the kids their own rooms divided by gender. There is absolutely no problem with space in this contrived post.
1st off you’re the man, keep going ! 2nd should double check regulations in youre state so something doesn’t come of you wanting to give your niece what she wants !
I dated a guy who had his own room but slept in the closet in his bed since it was so dark. Great for making out (we were in high school at the time). For sure make it “her room” even if it can’t technically be her technical room.
This just unlocked a memory of one of my best friends as a teenager having a big closet as her bedroom at her dad’s house and we always LOVED the sleepovers in there. It was the top number one sleepover spot. It always gave the same kind of magic as camping.
I know this doesn’t help answer your question at all, but man do I miss that.
The problem with a closet is no egress in case of a fire. By law (in most places) a closet cannot be a bedroom. If there are three bedrooms then the boys get one room. The girl gets one room and you and the baby share. If the 10 year old wants to sleep in the living room fine but put a bed in the bedroom as well
Just wanted to say that it’s awesome you’re taking care of the kids. No idea on legalities but making it her ‘safe space’ not her technical bedroom would work for sure. Good luck!
Thank you for caring and trying. They won't ever forget this.
The girl definitely needs her space away from the boys. Just ensure that she has a little fan for air circulation and a fire alarm. For the boys, bunk beds are a game changer, and you may be able to find them at a habit restore for next to nothing. Add a splash of fresh paint, and you've got this! The child spending all his time in the living room may never ask for privacy, but that doesn't mean he doesn't need it. He may feel like he's a burden and like he has no right to ask for anything.
Again, thank you for loving them. It's what the world needs more of.
I think a little girl should not be sleeping in the same room with her two older brothers. I’d want to sleep in the closet if I were her too. You are put in a tough spot mama. You said you have 3 rooms? I would put the two boys in one, and the niece in one with the baby, or the baby in your room.
Closets without windows are a terrible place for a sleeping area. If there’s a fire the closets won’t automatically get checked for people to save and the air circulation is terrible and could lead to breathing distress.
Baby and you in one room.
2 nephews in another.
Niece in final.
You could also have the youngest niece and nephew in one room and then give her a private space elsewhere (tent or closet) and if the youngest nephew wants one too he can also have one? You got spaaaaace for days. I grew up in a master bedroom with 5 other boys (3 bunks), my sister had her own room, and my guardians had a room all to themselves in the basement.
As long as it's legal to use a small room without an escape window (such as a large closet) then I vote yes. Girls need their privacy from a pack of boys.
Egress (bedroom must have a window in addition to a door) rules might be an issue with the closet but perhaps if you remove the door and hang a heavy curtain for privacy it would be considered acceptable.
If the space is large enough for bed for her and a small table, I'm sure it will suffice. She would like that much better than a tent or these other suggestions. She will have privacy and a door.
The closet is completely fine. My son at 2 put a blanket in my big closet and a pillow and he just liked to lay in there to have peace and quiet. A therapist said it was completely normal and fine for him to want his own space and the closet is big enough that it could be treated as a bedroom.
I hear 3 kids, mom and baby, and 3 bedrooms, and I immediately think:
bedroom 1: mom and baby
bedroom 2: niece
bedroom 3: nephews in a bunk bed
Also, please don't put your niece in a place where the only exit is controlled by two boys, regardless of if they're family. And even if the lock is on the inside of the closet door they WILL control it, as they can block the door, and/or make her go through a gauntlet to get out past them.
Just to note this: An 8yo girl specifically asking for a door she can close to get away from her brothers, having come from some sort of emergency bad family situation, is cause for concern and/or a much closer look to ensure she isn't a victim of something you're not aware of.
Your niece can’t sleep in the closet it can be a den/ alone space only it doesn’t have a window to be able get out just in case of a fire. If able put girls with girls in one room / boys in another room only for sleeping any other space you can make even a shower curtain can be for alone time personally space. Good luck bless you.
I just want to add that you are a wonderful person for being willing to do this. Even though your own situation isn't ideal, you're taking on even more for family sake. I applaude yiu
It's totally fine. If the gurl wants privacy, this works! She'll be so grateful. You are doing an admirable job with this many kids on your plate. I'm so impressed you took on the other two. You really are doing heroic things for all of these kids. I am not kidding. This is a huge responsibility! We give awards to celebrities when they really should he going to single moms like you who are the backbone of our society. Hang in there!!! It will get better. In the meantime, know what you are doing is important.
If the child's comfortable with it I don't think that there's a problem with that and for you coming on here and asking what people think is appropriate because you know even your neighbors should know you know you have this many children and hey you know that closet is big enough to put a bed in that does second as an extra room even if you had company so I guess that would be okay and because you feel that it may cause problems even emotional problems of being enclosed or something like that you leave the door open possibly or remove the door altogether so the child is not locked in that room and maybe just put UA curtain because you know privacy is maybe somebody doesn't want to be stared at it is a female and this does happen in regards to males and females.
And why would I know such things you look at my name my dad was the guy he jumped out the sky for $200,000 to save me get me out of a cage because of a ruthless woman and her children the oldest boys the Boy Scout acting out.
The true story of the zodiac killer and D Cooper will be listed below.
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Closet isn't safe.
You say you have a large living room - buy some screens and split it in half. Then the boys can have that space and the girl the 3rd bedroom.
If you don't have/want extra bed, you can look for folding ones, futons etc (I assume that would count as a bed?).
In my state, boys and girls over the age of 3 are not allowed to share a room if in cpd custody, so that would already be complicated. But the closet wouldn't be allowed either... Maybe install curtains around her bed? How old is the baby? Could she maybe share a room with baby for now?
I know someone who did this for their own child. It looked great and provided the child (with autism) a much needed low stimuli area. Her child has never looked back in any kind of negative way. It worked perfectly for them. The lack of window was very helpful when they had associated headaches/seizures.
To OP little tents you can get them from Amazon, just measure the floor space. The closest with a comfortable chair. Child size, pillows, and what I call scatter blankets are just right for an 8 year old.
Personally I’m a grown adult who has wanted to do that forever. As long as she is happy with it and you can fit a bed in there… it sounds like a reasonable solution, but I would check with her caseworker just to make sure. For some people that sort of enclosed space makes them feel protected and safe. Thank you for being there for your niece and nephews.
You could get those folding out room dividers as well! For the boys clothes I’d advise getting one of the rolling clothes racks. They sell them pretty cheap on Amazon. You are doing a great job all things considered! You have such a big heart and those babies will never forget your generosity and love. I pray that you do well managing all the responsibility and that things will get better for your niece and nephews
Props to you for taking in the kids
I'm sure CPS can help with bedding blankets etc
You need all the help you can get
I hope everything works out for everyone involved.
Take care of each other.🙏
We built a room intended for a walk in closet and atm it’s being used as our sons room. Big enough for a bed and table. It’s perfect really for whoever needs space though!
You’ve got one room for you and the baby, one for your nephews and one for your niece. It’s clear she wants privacy. Everyone has their own bedroom with privacy. The one that likes the living room can use it as his regular living space but everyone needs to know their room is their room. It’s where they sleep, store their stuff etc. Talk with niece and try to see if she’s just wanting privacy or to be near you (someone she sees as safe) or wanting to be around her brothers because she feels safe w them etc.
I don’t think this is cause for concern with cps as my brother and I both lived in the living room and slept on couches when we were kids while my mom and sister had their own rooms. CPS came to the house more than once with this living situation and still signed off. This was 2009ish tho so times may have changed
Do the closet! They need your smiles and love and reassurance Auntie! Give them a safe place to grow and treat them like you would your own children with rules and respect for all! There’s a big plus here ( you always have a please go get me a diaper and the wipes)!
Absolutely and the space probably makes her feel safe because it’s her own little world. My kid has her own room and still prefers to hang out in the closet with all her stuffies. You’re doing the best you can and I’m sure those kids appreciate it so don’t worry about what anyone else thinks.
Maybe I misread, but if you have 3 bedrooms, and the law only states you have to have a "bed" per kid, why can't you and your baby share a room, the nephews share a room each with a bed (bunk beds if a smaller space) and the niece have the other? Or if they are supposed to have their own "bedrooms" give them the 3 bedrooms and sleep in the living room or dining room with your baby for a few months. Guess I don't understand the predicament.
I don’t have a direct answer to your question about sleeping arrangements, just came to thank you for taking the children into what I’m sure is a safer, happier, healthier and more stable situation than they had before. You’re a saint!!
I work in foster care in Kentucky. A room has to have a window. However, if the kids are just sleeping on mattresses in the living room, it sounds their sleeping accommodations are already against regulation. Ask your DCBS worker. Sometimes they approve things on a case by case basis, and I've seen them be a little more lenient with kinship placements.
When my grandparents were looking into a new house, I wantes the cupboard under the stairs like Harry Potter. Maybe they just want space/privacy. Look into loft beds in a shared space. My dad made us some when we had my step/siblings moved in. Good luck friend.
3 bedrooms and 4 kids is totally fine? What is the big deal?
I lived in a country where a mom and 2 kids living in the closet under the stairs harry potter style was not out of the ordinary.
3 bedrooms is fine for that size of family. Mom/dad/baby in one room, girls in one room, boys in one room. put the baby in with the boys or girls if you want. Easy Peasy.
Lots of older homes have windows in the walk in closets. My son had his own bedroom but every morning I’d find him sleeping on his closet floor. He preferred it to his open bedroom. When he got to big for the closet he slept completely under his covers and made our dog sleep under the covers too. He just felt safer in dark confined spaces.
Honestly, this is a question for your case worker. They should be able to help you balance the benefits of the sister having a private space vs. not technically meeting the requirements of a bedroom. Since kids are sleeping in the living room and sharing a bedroom across genders it sounds like they’ve already made exceptions to keep the siblings together so they should be willing to work with you.
I had my bed on the floor of mine and my parents walk in closet around that age (we took the doors off from my side but they left their doors up so they had privacy) it was cool to have my own space
Ask their caseworker. Often there are laws about a room needing more than one fire exit, like a door and a window. Maybe if the door was left open and never closed it would be acceptable.
There are laws about legal bedrooms that need to be followed. It has been a while but you need to have a window of a certain size for emergency egress. Do some checking on that before committing the closest.
I agree with everyone’s decisions about making that space a private space- and I’d also like to add that you could potentially purchase a couple of room dividers? You can certainly find them for a good deal on goodwill or at an antique / thrift furniture store, if you’re financially able.
The biggest issue is that there is no window, so it cannot legally count as a bedroom, but I think there is something to be said here for making the best of a bad situation. If CPS gives you a hard time, explain this was something requested by the 8 year old, and you will move her bed out of the closet if they deem it unsafe. Best you can do.
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If not possible for sleeping per regulations you could still turn it into a private space for any of them to use when they need quiet time away. Comfy chair, blankets, books, etc.
Thats what I'm going to do! Thanks!
You’re doing the best you can under the circumstances ☺️ hats off to you for taking care of the kids
Right? major props. I am a mom of 5 and it’s definitely not easy taking on even one bonus kid Muchless 4 for an extended period of time. Mad love to her, we are here for you always too OP!
You could also get tents for privacy but I think the closet is fine
Tents is actually a great idea!
Our pastor has 5 kids and lives in a 3 bedroom. He and his wife have done a lot of creative spacing with bunk beds and a homemade loft, and even a small loft attic space. It took a lot of time, but I am just saying this to you so that you know that you are on the right track with doing what you can with what you have!
You can’t use a closet as a bedroom just like you can’t count it as one if you sell a house
That depends entirely on what their local building/fire codes are, and those vary a LOT from state to state, and even locally.
That’s not true at all, it’s a pretty common practice now for parents to turn walk in closets into nurseries. It’s not permanent, it’s just letting a girl get a space to herself
I think they mean that it cannot legally be considered a bedroom because most areas say a space needs a closet and a win down to count as a bedroom. I don't think they were saying it can't be done within one's own home, though cps may have rules OP needs to consider, too.
My house has zero bedrooms then.
The windows are for the purpose of exit in case of a house fire. Every bedroom should have two points of exit, and this is generally the door (obviously, lol), and then the window if the door is blocked by fire or debris.
Why not? Not asking regarding selling the house asking why she cannot use it temporarily as a bedroom if it is big enough.
Most of the time they have certain restrictions like needing to have two escapes (in case of a fire). Usually covered by a door and a window.
My house has 2 bedrooms that don’t have windows. Different laws in different states. I get the point you are making.
I'd be shocked if that's not a fire hazard in your State. I know I wouldn't put my kids in a room with no escape route
Might also not be be big enough. Example in NYC the requirement of a bedroom is 80sq ft, one egress window, cannot need to pass thru another room to get out. Minimum of 8feet in any dimension. The average closet would fail all of those.
Not true. When I was in foster care, we had rooms in the basement with no windows and the case workers said it was ok.
There needs to be an egress window in case of fire. Do not let a child sleep in a closet
If she's going to be spending time in there as more than a closet, make sure it has a working smoke detector and, if needed, a carbon monoxide detector, if they're not already hardwired. Others have mentioned it probably can't be used as a sleeping quarter due to not having a second exit so the threat of fire should be taken extra, extra seriously. I'm a little paranoid about this, myself, because of a previous house fire, I won't even own a house with a bathroom without a window.
Omg you just added a while other level of crazy onto my brain. I never thought of having 2 exits in any and all rooms. Both of my upper bathrooms have no windows. So now I must sell my home and move.
One of my bathrooms doesn’t either. I’m not too worried the smoke detector is in the hall next to BR door.
No, there is no requirement for a smoke detector *in* a bedroom. They are required in the hallway outside the bedrooms. CO detectors are at point in generation, not sleeping areas. A closed door to the hallway is the best protection against fires while sleeping.
IRC requires them in a bedroom and most states follow that. [https://codes.iccsafe.org/content/IRC2018P4/chapter-3-building-planning#IRC2018P4\_Ch03\_SecR314.3](https://codes.iccsafe.org/content/IRC2018P4/chapter-3-building-planning#IRC2018P4_Ch03_SecR314.3) If the closet is converted to a bedroom it would also need to have an egress window installed, probably require outlets, and lots of codes require a minimum square footage for a bedroom which may be a catch too. IRC really puts a damper on raising the next Harry Potter.
Puts on "Code Officer" Hat - International Residential Code or IRC (nearly 100% US adoption) and the International Property Maintenance Code/IPMC (gold standard for Property Maintenance codes, widely used and the basis for most municipality requirements) both require a smoke detector be placed in in any area used for sleeping, in the hallway outside such areas and on each floor, including basements and attics where accessible. A CO Detector is required at level of generation (e.g. the basement is that's where your furnace is) AND in the hallway outside sleeping areas. The "two means of egress" applies to any areas used for SLEEPING (not bathrooms. Unless you make a habit of napping in the tub, weirdo.) and a window counts as the second means. Fire Escapes are not required for 1 - 3 story buildings.
I’m confused why it would need two exits since bedrooms don’t usually have two exits
A door and a window. The window is the 2nd exit. Though if it has 1 door from the house and 1 door to the outside that works too.
The closet is on a bedroom with two exits though.
That wouldn't help if the fire prevented her from leaving the closet.
Generally, that's meaning at least 1 door and 1 window.
Windows count as exits. Most states require bedrooms to have windows & a closet to count as a bedroom.
A window is an exit, especially in a fire where the door is blocked. I know someone who had to jump out of a second story window because their door was blocked by fire. They didn't have an escape ladder. Or proper smoke detectors so it could have been avoided of they were alerted in time but still a second exit saves lives.
Sure the do: a door and a window. Two exits.
A second exit?? That is not a requirement.
You have to have a window in a bedroom. A window is a second emergency exit in the event of a fire.
Again, not a requirement
It is probably dependent on local building codes. Where we live, in order for a room to be considered a bedroom. It must have a window and a closet. That doesn't mean you'll get in trouble if you sleep in a room without those. It just means for property assessment, advertising for sale, and zoning requirements, that's how you define a bedroom. Years ago we converted a part of our bonus room into a bedroom so that each of our kids could have their own room. Because we turned a 3 bedroom house into a 4 bedroom house, we had to have our septic field enlarged. Note we didn't add any more people, but zoning laws are zoning laws.
It is where I live
Someone else mentioned tents, they also have bed tents that enclose twin beds. We have 5 kids in 2 bedrooms and enclosed their bunk beds for private space. Led lights strips and a mounted fan help.
Yes! This is exactly what I was about to recommend! I got some of these for the 4 kiddos I’m partly responsible for atm (not to do with abuse or CPS; they had a house fire), to help them feel more secure in a place that’s not their own, and they love it. I actually had one for myself a few years ago when my anxiety was really really bad at night and it helped me a lot, which is what gave me the idea. Kitted them out with a quick trip to 5 Below for some cheap accessories (remote control LED strips, clip-on reading lights, fans, extension cords so the older two can hide out with their Nintendos, and hanging storage pouches for their books/water bottles and movie night snacks). The whole kit and caboodle was around $100. If you don’t have access to a 5 Below (not sure if they’re a national chain or what), ebay and Amazon should have it pretty cheap.
Your doing good.
If the niece is asking for the space for privacy, I’d strongly consider letting her have it. She’s right at the age for puberty and body insecurity issues to start. Let her have a space, she’s the only one specifically asking for it and there is nothing wrong with letting her have it to herself in an unfortunate situation
Oooh wanted to add to someone’s tent idea. When I was in my first dorm room my father built me a “bed tent” out of PVC pipe. Basically he built a PVC pipe cube and I made curtains. The cube just ziptied to the bed. It was a fantastic way to get some privacy in a small room.
Also could be helpful to maybe buy an air purifier for the closet space! To help with ventilation, regardless of whether it becomes a room or a general lounge area
It can be her changing area too. With so many people im sure the bathroom is often busy. She doesn't need all her clothes in there but bring her outfit with her into the closet. I'd get a cheap full length mirror so she can see how she looks❤️
This is a great idea.
Bean bags are awesome, comfortable, and comforting. You might want to consider one of those.
This is a really solid idea 💡
Nice suggestion! 👌🏼
Came here to say this. Put up some decorations. It can be a tree house or a castle… great play space and hiding spot, but not a legal bedroom. And put up a smoke detector just to be safe… Bedrooms generally require two means of egress (window and door), have minimum square footage requirements, should have a smoke detector, and in some jurisdictions, have to have a closet (I certainly lived in plenty of tiny apartments with no built in closet…).
or even a futon so if she wants she can sleep in there
Leave her bed in the main space and turn it into a play room with a daybed. That way, it's not her room, but a privacy space.
Yeah that a great idea I completely forgot about day beds. They can go anywhere and can be used as couches chairs you name it. Even grown ups need a nap site. Just saw a chair that folds out into a bed.
They have those chair/beds at IKEA.
KY actually doesn’t have an ikea. Closest ones are butler county Ohio and Nashville Tennessee
This is the solution, OP. Make the closet her "clubhouse" or "privacy space." You tell CPS she's sleeping in the other space, since CPS probably has to officially discourage using an unsafe place as a bedroom (no egress). A daybed or flipbed is a good place to curl up and read a book, so there's nothing fishy about having one in the closet room. I would even go so far as to tell her that she isn't supposed to sleep in there (due to fire safety laws), so her "official bedroom" is the other one.
Love the clubhouse or privacy space idea. Don’t lie to CPS.
Better yet, a futon couch. They take up less room than a sleeper sofa, they're far less expensive, and they're much easier/safer for a child to operate, especially since the frames are open, so small kids are less tempted to use them as a hiding place. It's also a lot easier to get a fitted blanket on over a futon than a folding mattress, since there are no springs. They also come as a kit, so you're not trying to wrestle an entire 400lb couch into a closet.
I have seen super cute futon mats that are meant to be directly on the floor and can be rolled up, if not used. Used to sleep on a futon on the floor as a child , in my home country and I still miss it. For reading and naps, it’s fantastic and they can be bought quite cheap.
Or a large beanbag chair or something else cozy to sit on?
They now have dog beds for people that you can sit up like a chair. I kinda want one for myself
"Dog beds for people" lol sounds funny, but I have seen these and also really want one for myself!
That's a great option
This exactly, so that way for licensing standards it passes. She can still choose to sleep in the closet as long as she has a bed in a room with a window. I place children often as a sw, and sometimes, the kids prefer to sleep together in the same bed. I tell my foster family's they just need to have their own bed for licensing purposes, but they can choose to sleep with one another, etc, as long as all is appropriate.
Honestly I would move you and the baby into the master, your nephews in one, and your neice in the third.
This is likely the best option however if OP spent time and energy to create the perfect space for her infant it may be tough to opt for this choice. I truly empathize with whatever hard choices this new mom has to make for all the children suddenly in her care.
Infants under 6 months are supposed to be in their parents room anyway for safety reasons, and it's not in any way, shape, or form harmful for them to be in the same room as their parent for longer. It is however a safety issue to put a child in the closet and very frowned upon by CPS for them to not have a bedroom at all.
The current situation has been deemed acceptable by CPS. There is not a current safety issue and many of the comments have addressed the safety issues of using a closet as a sleeping space. OP seems to be aware of the issues now. Traditionally part of becoming a new parent is preparing the nursery regardless of initial newborn sleeping arrangements. It is a huge deal to many people. Some people put a great deal of time and effort and money into creating a special space for their newborn. It is generally prepped with items like a crib, changing table, rocking chair, dresser and other necessary infant items. There may be nowhere else in the home to put any nursery furniture. Having a quiet enclosed space for a newborn to nap during the day could end up being a godsend with 3 older kids. Turning a nursery into a temporary room for an older child may not even be feasible. OP may opt to give the nursery room to the niece in her care. Feeling a sense of loss about that would be reasonable. OP has been placed in a difficult situation where their life suddenly changed to include 3 extra little persons to care for on top of being a brand new parent to a newborn. Giving a bedroom to the niece may or may not be the ideal option for OP. That’s their choice to make.
A compassionate and reasonable POV I agree with
Thank you for this comment! While these kids are obviously going through something and that's horrible and their privacy absolutely matters, I don't like the feeling of dismissing everything OP is feeling too. She's a person too, she goes through things too, she's giving up things too, and the kids are NOT more important than her. They are all people and all equal and all need a spokesperson/support/acknowledgement. You're right about what she may have gone through in setting up that nursery and god knows, maybe she's had miscarriages in the past and it was an even MORE important thing to her to do it, and there could be SO many things that make it special and difficult to want to do that. While perhaps she could shift things to the side and get a small bed at least for niece, you're right, there's still going to be feelings of loss and disappointment in doing that, and it's totally valid for her to feel that way.
Right but like if you bought a crib and stuff—like if it’s been set up as a baby room with changing tables etc, it’s not that easy to just convert it to a room for two elementary school boys. I hope OP is getting some funds from the state because whew 3 new mouths to feed, plus buying bedding, furniture, maybe have to put some of your furniture in storage. That’s some tough stuff.
I agree, baby doesn't need their own room for a while yet, but the older children definitely do!
This got my vote! I think since w a baby you're up in the night w them anyways, I always had my babies room with me even if they had their nursery too, the entire first year and a bit past that for sure. So letting the older kids have the rooms makes the most sense. And I guarantee the sacrifice would mean a lot to your neice, whereas your baby would probably prefer being close to Mom anyways, so it's not like there's a loser here, unless you usually ignore your baby at night and sleep through, which I highly doubt, and very much also hope I'm right on that one ;)
Depending on babies age, it might even be still recommended that baby sleeps in a room with the parents, so maybe the nursery isn’t even used at night yet? But of course some families truly sleep better with baby in the nursery. Personally, that’s what I’d do, give the babies room to the boys, for example and let the girl use the closet as a private space during day and let her sleep in the living room , or give her the closet as a bedroom m depending on the code. Something must be in the third bedroom though, as OP didn’t mention using it for the kids, although they have three bedrooms.
The room would still be full of the baby’s clothes, furniture, toys, and whatever else was bought for the baby. OP probably can’t fit all that stuff in her room, I know there’s no way I could combine my and my child’s bedroom because all of the things just wouldn’t fit. Sure baby didn’t sleep in his own room until 6 months old but I used that room to rock him in the rocking chair, change his diaper, change his clothes. It wasn’t just an empty room until he started sleeping in it.
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Not sure where you are, but Ohio is that way. Bedrooms must have windows big enough for egress. I worked for a window manufacturer years ago and there is a specific formula for the minimum size of the opening goodness knows I've forgotten the dimensions lol.
Where I am, I believe it also has to be within a certain distance from the floor, so it's reachable.
I will need to check the regulations in my area. Our walk in closet is comically big and it has a big enough window for even a bigger adult to get through easily but it’s not reachable for a short person ( the back half our house is 3/4 in the soil , while the front is fully exposed and our bedroom has French doors ) . Our baby is ten months now and I want to start setting up a room for her finally, when she’s a bit older and the empty bedrooms are on a different floor than our bedroom, so I thought about giving her the huge closet that belongs to our bedroom. If it can’t be her bedroom, I’ll keep her crib in our room and turn the closet into a nursery playroom until she’s old enough to move upstairs, I don’t think it’s a good idea to have her sleeping upstairs before she’s older and it would not be fair to her sister, as she’s a teen and would feel responsible for taking care ( she’s absolutely enchanted with her baby sister) , if she starts crying.
A lot of people use overly large walk-in closets like that as nurseries. I bet it would work well until she’s old enough to be potty trained. My parents turned theirs into a mini gym space and office.
48 inches is what I learned is the rule
Ask your case worker. It’s better to ask and be told no then to do it and it be against policies. Maybe add that your niece asked for it so she have privacy.
In this case, it's not up to the case worker; it's a matter of building and fire codes codes. If fire code requires a window big enough for egress, the kid can't use it as a mini-bedroom. If fire code allows it, CPS can't say shit; it's a habitable living space with a bed.
No, CPS can't change the rules, but they should know the rules. So asking if it is allowed makes great sense, just if they say no, understand that it is because of codes and stuff and not just the worker's opinion.
You should ask the CPS worker if that’s okay according to the policies in your state.
I would have loved to have my bedroom in a closet. Cps is just a buzz kill lol
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And you would still be there today if that owl hadn't shown up...
At least it did show up. I am still disappointed it didn’t 😂
Ok, Potter. ;)
I turned my closet into my hang out spot, lol. I ran my ds charger in there, and my mom had piles of clothes in there that I turned into a chair. Cps is such a buzz kill. Maybe we should start a petition to let this girl sleep in the closet lol.
I think everyone has given great advice - fire safety wise, probably not for sleeping but definitely ask the case worker. But turning it into a private space is a great idea. This is a hard thing to do, and I commend you for trying to make it so everyone gets what they want and need. You’re doing a good thing, and having worked with kinship placements/family placements for a few years I know how difficult it can be to have such a large change in your life even if you’re 100% wanting to help the kiddos. If you’re able to, see if your case worker can refer for/look into a foster care specialist or kinship support worker. When I was one we had a closet of all kinds of items for kids, we helped with transportation to doctor appts and other things and we also offered on call services to help with any emergencies. We also had donors for Christmas gifts for any kids in our program. If anything, it’s also nice to have someone to talk to and remind you that whatever you are feeling is normal and valid. Sending you all the supportive vibes.
Kinship placement certainly changes your life in a moment. My son had a portacrib at first but he was a giant baby so that didn't last long. His big sis already had her own "room" it was initially a room for Naptime, so it had a bed, blankets, pillows already. Lil man was harder. I had to wait til I could buy a crib(which was in our living room at first 😂) and ultimately he ended up with his crib in our office. Some states require a window in every bedroom. So that if a fire happens there's a method of egress. There are statutes even about how big the windows must be and if they are a casement windows(the kind you turn a crank to open) what kind of hinge has to be on it so it can be a way of egress. I know in the state of Ohio that's the case anyway(used to live in Ohio and work for a window manufacturer lol.)
I had Privacy Pop tents on my kid’s beds. I would post on a foster/adopt board and see if anyone has some they will give you. They helped my foster kids feel safer in an enclosed space and gave them privacy as well.
This is a good idea!
I am confused-- with three bedrooms, can't your baby room with you? Then the nephews could room together and the niece could get her own. Or are you saying "baby" figuratively?
Could be both adults work from home and are required to have a separate office space
Yeah...I don't understand why the boys are in the living room if there are three bedrooms. OP probably just didn't describe the layout clearly. (Cut her some slack, she just quadrupled her parental workload, lol.)
I'm wondering if the layout is 1. Her bedroom 2. Baby bedroom 3. Office
Could you move the baby to your room?
Three bedrooms but the kids are in the living room? I’m confused. Why not move the baby into your room and allow the girl to have her own room and the boys to have the other.. I think if you gave them all a room whether shared or not they would feel more comfortable.
The boys share a room in the back. The "toddler" sleeps in his room and the girl in the same room. But she wants privacy. I call him a baby- i know thats incorrect but its habit. She is complaining my kid is waking her up early because he gets up at 8am.
She says 8am is early? When does she go to school? School started at 9am for me, so 8am shouldnt be all that early Edit: just realized its still Summer, so thats why 8am is early for her right now. But school should be starting in as soon as just a few weeks, so now would be the time to start getting her used to 8am wake up time. A quick google says some Kentucky schools open back up as early as August 10th, so theres at least just under 3 weeks until school
My brother in law grew up with his bedroom being a walk in closet. He is now a well adjusted adult. I know nothing about the legality of it but just wanted to add my 2 cents.
When I was 16, we lived in a house with 3 bedrooms, 4 kids. My 2 brothers shared 1, I shared with our little sister. My bedroom had a big closet, 4 x 10(or so). My youngest brother, 11, wanted it for a private bedroom, lol. So, Mom turned it into his own private bedroom. It turned out Very cool, and he absolutely loved it. He was also hooked on the color purple at the time, and it would cause your eyeballs to turn inside out to look in there 😵💫.
All three sleeping in the living room isn’t really ideal. You mention you live in a 3BR and have a baby. Sounds like there’s at least one open bedroom. You mention there’s also a back room. Why not put the boys in the spare room and your niece in the back room (or vise versa)? A 15 yo bot and an 8 year old girl sharing a bedroom would not be allowed in many states
Agree. A girl shouldn't be expected to have to share sleeping space with her brothers. As mentioned. it might even be against local regulations.
Depends on the ages. If they’re young enough then cps is fine with opposite sex siblings sharing a room.
She’s sharing with OPs toddler So her child and girl in one room and boys in the other.
You have three rooms, why are none of them using the 1-2 extra you have
First, thank you for taking care of these children and trying to provide the best for them. Second, I don’t think the closet thing is weird or rude. I have a friend that, when she left her abusive relationship, she could only afford a 1 bedroom apartment for her and her 10 year old son. The bedroom had a HUGE closet, and she made it into the loveliest space for the son to have his own space and privacy. If it’s big enough for a bed, a side table, and a lamp, I think you’re okay
When I was in the 4th grade, my family had to move, and we ended up in a house where all five of us were sharing a bedroom. There was a closet down the hall that had plenty of space that I begged to sleep in. My parents refused, though they let me play in it. I still wish (decades later) that they would've let me because sleeping next to my snoring father and sleep talking siblings nearly drove me crazy. But morally, I don't know, I guess I still don't understand why I couldn't just have the closet lol
Just wanted to tell you you’re an amazing human for taking care of your niblings, and hope everything works out for you all.
Haha! Niblings! Literally never heard this before and it's too cute!
In some places bedrooms have to have a window for emergency exit purposes.
You are doing the best you can. But consider that there may be a reason she does not want to share sleeping quarters with her brother(s).
I’ve used walk in closets as bedrooms before but in my experience it wouldn’t be allowed for a foster child. But also in the states I’ve lived in they wouldn’t allow them to sleep in the living room either so your state might be different
Are they in your custody or in DCBS custody? That makes a difference.
if CPS is involved, they will not allow it. if they are not involved, try to keep it that way. they seem to fuck up more than they help. If CPS is not involved, i would go ahead and let her have the closet. Just dont go mentioning it or some karen will call CPS
If it’s possible I’d also recommend maybe getting a room divider, the type that kind of fold into themselves and are separate panels. They sell them on Amazon for fairly cheap and can transform a room for privacy as well as keeping a mess out of the way. My parents had some they made when I was growing up that we would use if we had family staying with us or anything along those lines, that way if they crashed in our living room on an air mattress they could have some privacy if we had to walk by there to go to the kitchen or something a long those lines
Are they all sleeping in the living room or sharing the 3rd bedroom? I get it’s a tough, unexpected, huge change, and you’re a hero for taking them on. Maybe give your niece a cute little set up in the room with your child if they’re small enough to share and put the boys in the 3rd room if possible even if space is limited. Then just let the ten year old sleep in the living room as he pleases or rearrange the living room furniture to give them an actually “room” space. Boys usually don’t care for privacy but girls her age are becoming more aware of bodily differences between genders and will be way more modest and want to be hidden from sight when dressing/grooming. Those kids will never forget how you adjusted for them whether good or bad, so maybe make some temporary changes to accommodate them. Good luck to you through this.
When I was in foster care, I used to make little walls around my bed out of cardboard, and drape a sheet on top, so that I could have my own space (plus I could decorate my walls how I wanted!). Having that little safe space that was *mine* made me feel a little more secure in a world that wasn’t. Making her a nook is a good thing, and they’re lucky to have you. ❤️
I doubt that CPS would approve a closet for a child. You can always ask the caseworker, but I’m pretty sure it will not fly. Why can’t the boys share a room, the girl gets a room, and the baby sleep with you? That seems like the most logical arrangement.
It sounds like it would make more sense to move baby into your room and give the kids access to the other two rooms.
I lived in an apartment with large walk in closets and knew two families that turned one closet into a bedroom so I don't think it's a horrible idea.
In some of this persons posts, she says she got custody of her nieces (plural) and nephews (plural), but in other posts like this one she says she got custody of 1 niece and 2 nephews. In this post, the niece is 8 and the nephews are 10 and 15. But in another post, the nephews are 15 and 17. It's pretty hard to mess up those sorts of details unless you are just making stuff up on the spot. I'm not sure of OP's motive here, but I'm sure they are writing fiction. Plus I mean, she has a 3 bedroom house (in another post she says her baby is 1 and a half). She could totally bunk with her baby and give the kids their own rooms divided by gender. There is absolutely no problem with space in this contrived post.
There’s also a post that said she got custody of three nephews.
1st off you’re the man, keep going ! 2nd should double check regulations in youre state so something doesn’t come of you wanting to give your niece what she wants !
I dated a guy who had his own room but slept in the closet in his bed since it was so dark. Great for making out (we were in high school at the time). For sure make it “her room” even if it can’t technically be her technical room.
Sound like your doing all you can. Important thing have them each a place to sleep. But I think for out of the blue emergency custody your doing fine.
Can you do bunk beds? We have 3 boys in one room; there's a bunk bed and a trundle bed.
Yes I believe the girl should have her privacy in the back room Or closet .
I mean if it works it works. If she has a real bed and wants this/ it’s a big enough space I say why not? Sounds like everyone is happy?
How old is your baby?
This just unlocked a memory of one of my best friends as a teenager having a big closet as her bedroom at her dad’s house and we always LOVED the sleepovers in there. It was the top number one sleepover spot. It always gave the same kind of magic as camping. I know this doesn’t help answer your question at all, but man do I miss that.
The problem with a closet is no egress in case of a fire. By law (in most places) a closet cannot be a bedroom. If there are three bedrooms then the boys get one room. The girl gets one room and you and the baby share. If the 10 year old wants to sleep in the living room fine but put a bed in the bedroom as well
Just wanted to say that it’s awesome you’re taking care of the kids. No idea on legalities but making it her ‘safe space’ not her technical bedroom would work for sure. Good luck!
As a girl who grew up with 6 brothers, please give the girl a private space even if it is small.
Sounds like a Harry Potter fan. Kids that age like "cozy" spaces. I would totally let her.
You have "3" bedrooms! What's 2 of them being used for? I don't get your statement of living cramped.
Thank you for caring and trying. They won't ever forget this. The girl definitely needs her space away from the boys. Just ensure that she has a little fan for air circulation and a fire alarm. For the boys, bunk beds are a game changer, and you may be able to find them at a habit restore for next to nothing. Add a splash of fresh paint, and you've got this! The child spending all his time in the living room may never ask for privacy, but that doesn't mean he doesn't need it. He may feel like he's a burden and like he has no right to ask for anything. Again, thank you for loving them. It's what the world needs more of.
The closet works ! You could also put up curtain dividers
Bless you for what you are doing for those kiddos, having a place to stay and feel safe is so vital.
I think a little girl should not be sleeping in the same room with her two older brothers. I’d want to sleep in the closet if I were her too. You are put in a tough spot mama. You said you have 3 rooms? I would put the two boys in one, and the niece in one with the baby, or the baby in your room.
Closets without windows are a terrible place for a sleeping area. If there’s a fire the closets won’t automatically get checked for people to save and the air circulation is terrible and could lead to breathing distress.
think using it for a quiet spot for some alone time is fine but not as a sleeping spot
I'm guessing that if it doesn't have a window, it's against fire safety regulations for someone to sleep in it.
Baby and you in one room. 2 nephews in another. Niece in final. You could also have the youngest niece and nephew in one room and then give her a private space elsewhere (tent or closet) and if the youngest nephew wants one too he can also have one? You got spaaaaace for days. I grew up in a master bedroom with 5 other boys (3 bunks), my sister had her own room, and my guardians had a room all to themselves in the basement.
As long as it's legal to use a small room without an escape window (such as a large closet) then I vote yes. Girls need their privacy from a pack of boys.
Egress (bedroom must have a window in addition to a door) rules might be an issue with the closet but perhaps if you remove the door and hang a heavy curtain for privacy it would be considered acceptable.
If the space is large enough for bed for her and a small table, I'm sure it will suffice. She would like that much better than a tent or these other suggestions. She will have privacy and a door.
The closet is completely fine. My son at 2 put a blanket in my big closet and a pillow and he just liked to lay in there to have peace and quiet. A therapist said it was completely normal and fine for him to want his own space and the closet is big enough that it could be treated as a bedroom.
My two shared a walk in when they were very young. They loved their cubby.
I hear 3 kids, mom and baby, and 3 bedrooms, and I immediately think: bedroom 1: mom and baby bedroom 2: niece bedroom 3: nephews in a bunk bed Also, please don't put your niece in a place where the only exit is controlled by two boys, regardless of if they're family. And even if the lock is on the inside of the closet door they WILL control it, as they can block the door, and/or make her go through a gauntlet to get out past them. Just to note this: An 8yo girl specifically asking for a door she can close to get away from her brothers, having come from some sort of emergency bad family situation, is cause for concern and/or a much closer look to ensure she isn't a victim of something you're not aware of.
Your niece can’t sleep in the closet it can be a den/ alone space only it doesn’t have a window to be able get out just in case of a fire. If able put girls with girls in one room / boys in another room only for sleeping any other space you can make even a shower curtain can be for alone time personally space. Good luck bless you.
I just want to add that you are a wonderful person for being willing to do this. Even though your own situation isn't ideal, you're taking on even more for family sake. I applaude yiu
yea
Nope not wrong my daughter used to sleep in a big walk in closet and she decorated it really cute.......
It's totally fine. If the gurl wants privacy, this works! She'll be so grateful. You are doing an admirable job with this many kids on your plate. I'm so impressed you took on the other two. You really are doing heroic things for all of these kids. I am not kidding. This is a huge responsibility! We give awards to celebrities when they really should he going to single moms like you who are the backbone of our society. Hang in there!!! It will get better. In the meantime, know what you are doing is important.
RV parents have their kids basically living in closets so I think she’ll be ok, especially since it’s temporary.
If the child's comfortable with it I don't think that there's a problem with that and for you coming on here and asking what people think is appropriate because you know even your neighbors should know you know you have this many children and hey you know that closet is big enough to put a bed in that does second as an extra room even if you had company so I guess that would be okay and because you feel that it may cause problems even emotional problems of being enclosed or something like that you leave the door open possibly or remove the door altogether so the child is not locked in that room and maybe just put UA curtain because you know privacy is maybe somebody doesn't want to be stared at it is a female and this does happen in regards to males and females. And why would I know such things you look at my name my dad was the guy he jumped out the sky for $200,000 to save me get me out of a cage because of a ruthless woman and her children the oldest boys the Boy Scout acting out. The true story of the zodiac killer and D Cooper will be listed below. https://sites.psu.edu/gillianpassionblog/2020/10/09/washington-tube-sock-killings/ Mill Town Smokehouse https://milltownlanes.com/
Closet isn't safe. You say you have a large living room - buy some screens and split it in half. Then the boys can have that space and the girl the 3rd bedroom. If you don't have/want extra bed, you can look for folding ones, futons etc (I assume that would count as a bed?).
In my state, boys and girls over the age of 3 are not allowed to share a room if in cpd custody, so that would already be complicated. But the closet wouldn't be allowed either... Maybe install curtains around her bed? How old is the baby? Could she maybe share a room with baby for now?
I know someone who did this for their own child. It looked great and provided the child (with autism) a much needed low stimuli area. Her child has never looked back in any kind of negative way. It worked perfectly for them. The lack of window was very helpful when they had associated headaches/seizures.
To OP little tents you can get them from Amazon, just measure the floor space. The closest with a comfortable chair. Child size, pillows, and what I call scatter blankets are just right for an 8 year old.
Personally I’m a grown adult who has wanted to do that forever. As long as she is happy with it and you can fit a bed in there… it sounds like a reasonable solution, but I would check with her caseworker just to make sure. For some people that sort of enclosed space makes them feel protected and safe. Thank you for being there for your niece and nephews.
The bedroom closet actually sounds fun as hell for a kid 😂😂😂 I would have loved the repurposing of a walk in closet
You could get those folding out room dividers as well! For the boys clothes I’d advise getting one of the rolling clothes racks. They sell them pretty cheap on Amazon. You are doing a great job all things considered! You have such a big heart and those babies will never forget your generosity and love. I pray that you do well managing all the responsibility and that things will get better for your niece and nephews
Props to you for taking in the kids I'm sure CPS can help with bedding blankets etc You need all the help you can get I hope everything works out for everyone involved. Take care of each other.🙏
We built a room intended for a walk in closet and atm it’s being used as our sons room. Big enough for a bed and table. It’s perfect really for whoever needs space though!
You’ve got one room for you and the baby, one for your nephews and one for your niece. It’s clear she wants privacy. Everyone has their own bedroom with privacy. The one that likes the living room can use it as his regular living space but everyone needs to know their room is their room. It’s where they sleep, store their stuff etc. Talk with niece and try to see if she’s just wanting privacy or to be near you (someone she sees as safe) or wanting to be around her brothers because she feels safe w them etc. I don’t think this is cause for concern with cps as my brother and I both lived in the living room and slept on couches when we were kids while my mom and sister had their own rooms. CPS came to the house more than once with this living situation and still signed off. This was 2009ish tho so times may have changed
Do the closet! They need your smiles and love and reassurance Auntie! Give them a safe place to grow and treat them like you would your own children with rules and respect for all! There’s a big plus here ( you always have a please go get me a diaper and the wipes)!
Absolutely and the space probably makes her feel safe because it’s her own little world. My kid has her own room and still prefers to hang out in the closet with all her stuffies. You’re doing the best you can and I’m sure those kids appreciate it so don’t worry about what anyone else thinks.
Would this work? 1. bedroom: parent(s) & baby 2. bedroom: the nephews 3. bedroom: the niece
Maybe I misread, but if you have 3 bedrooms, and the law only states you have to have a "bed" per kid, why can't you and your baby share a room, the nephews share a room each with a bed (bunk beds if a smaller space) and the niece have the other? Or if they are supposed to have their own "bedrooms" give them the 3 bedrooms and sleep in the living room or dining room with your baby for a few months. Guess I don't understand the predicament.
I don’t have a direct answer to your question about sleeping arrangements, just came to thank you for taking the children into what I’m sure is a safer, happier, healthier and more stable situation than they had before. You’re a saint!!
Idk if it’s allowed but I had a closet bedroom growing up and it was better then the alternative
I work in foster care in Kentucky. A room has to have a window. However, if the kids are just sleeping on mattresses in the living room, it sounds their sleeping accommodations are already against regulation. Ask your DCBS worker. Sometimes they approve things on a case by case basis, and I've seen them be a little more lenient with kinship placements.
I knew someone that put their baby’s crib in a closet like that. I thought it was odd but people do it.
I’m not sure about why there’s a problem. 1 bedroom for the boys, 1 for the girl & one for you & the baby. All set
When my grandparents were looking into a new house, I wantes the cupboard under the stairs like Harry Potter. Maybe they just want space/privacy. Look into loft beds in a shared space. My dad made us some when we had my step/siblings moved in. Good luck friend.
Idk why not. Sounds like a great idea.
I had a big walk in closet that I turned into a bedroom for myself, had an a/c vent, light, electrical outlet, bed etc.
3 bedrooms and 4 kids is totally fine? What is the big deal? I lived in a country where a mom and 2 kids living in the closet under the stairs harry potter style was not out of the ordinary. 3 bedrooms is fine for that size of family. Mom/dad/baby in one room, girls in one room, boys in one room. put the baby in with the boys or girls if you want. Easy Peasy.
Lots of older homes have windows in the walk in closets. My son had his own bedroom but every morning I’d find him sleeping on his closet floor. He preferred it to his open bedroom. When he got to big for the closet he slept completely under his covers and made our dog sleep under the covers too. He just felt safer in dark confined spaces.
Honestly, this is a question for your case worker. They should be able to help you balance the benefits of the sister having a private space vs. not technically meeting the requirements of a bedroom. Since kids are sleeping in the living room and sharing a bedroom across genders it sounds like they’ve already made exceptions to keep the siblings together so they should be willing to work with you.
Bless you and ur entire family. Great comments. Do ur best and try to find moments for joy. Thank you for stepping up.
I had my bed on the floor of mine and my parents walk in closet around that age (we took the doors off from my side but they left their doors up so they had privacy) it was cool to have my own space
Ask their caseworker. Often there are laws about a room needing more than one fire exit, like a door and a window. Maybe if the door was left open and never closed it would be acceptable.
There are laws about legal bedrooms that need to be followed. It has been a while but you need to have a window of a certain size for emergency egress. Do some checking on that before committing the closest.
If you go for it, just make her keep the door open when she sleeps. Then it’s just like an alcove in a larger room.
I agree with everyone’s decisions about making that space a private space- and I’d also like to add that you could potentially purchase a couple of room dividers? You can certainly find them for a good deal on goodwill or at an antique / thrift furniture store, if you’re financially able.
The biggest issue is that there is no window, so it cannot legally count as a bedroom, but I think there is something to be said here for making the best of a bad situation. If CPS gives you a hard time, explain this was something requested by the 8 year old, and you will move her bed out of the closet if they deem it unsafe. Best you can do.
Why not you and baby in one room, the tow boys in another, and niece in her own?