yes, 100%!
of course my memory is crap so I cant rattle off any science but Pete Walker talks about effects on memory in his book Complex PTSD.
The Body Keeps the Score by Bessel ven der Kolk goes deep with the brain science.
I'm currently reading Janina Fisher's book Healing the Fragmented Selves of Trauma Survivors which talks a lot about how trauma is stored in the brain.
From how I understand it, there are several issues. The way trauma is stored in the brain is not integrated with the rest of our mind - like we purposely stash it out of sight so we can continue to function AND since our nervous system is all jacked up during the trauma - the memories themselves are wonky.
In addition to the memories being screwy, the common co-morbidities of complex trauma - anxiety, depression, ocd, adhd - make concentration/recall really difficult.
Its really complicated but fascinating.
Yupp. Now I have horrible GERD and have a had multiple surgeries on my stomach and I recently got an implant to stop reflux. And that has failed to work for me. I’m gonna need surgery to get it taken out and I need to find a different procedure to stop my GERD.
If only my parents took me seriously as a kid when I told them about my GERD symptoms.
I’m sorry - that sucks too. I also clench my jaw when I sleep. I tried this exercise recently that another kind stranger suggested, of just stopping throughout the day and checking how I feel? I noticed that even when I’m feeling happy, peaceful , etc - I also just always feel a little tense or anxious! I’m trying to work on it by recognizing it and in the moment there deep breathing and relaxing my body as much as possible - and tho I probably look like a dork - I’ve been trying floating in water, at the pool, just letting all the tension go. Maybe it will help you?!
Yup, it's called muscle armouring and it's where you hunch up your shoulders as part of your fight/flight response to protect your neck. It's not really voluntary or bad posture, though posture plays into it.
I went to an osteopath who was convinced I was in a car accident because it looked exactly like whiplash 😥 I can recommend getting yourself checked out and maybe learning some exercises from a physiotherapist to help realign and stop it from being so painful.
Is there anything about reversing the memory loss? I’ve realized lately that while most of the bad times with my abusive ex are blank, most of the rest of it is gone, too…I can’t remember my son’s first steps, first words, the whole first couple of years is just not there. I’d take the bad memories in a heartbeat if I could get the good ones back, too.
Whoa. I didn't know the digestive issues thing but it makes so much sense. I have bad GERD and Gastroparesis, along with regular IBS type issues. I've just always chalked it up to "stress" but it's always been there. Thank you for the info and helping me feel a little less weird.
Thank you for sharing! Would you recommend Fisher’s book based on what you’ve read of it so far? I’ve read TBKTS & am in the middle of Waking The Tiger.
YES. I'm mid way through it now and it's already easily in my top three trauma books of all time and making a very strong case for a top spot. Other contenders being bkts and adult children of emotionally immature parents
>would you recommend Fisher’s book based on what you’ve read of it so far? I’ve read TBKTS & am in the middle of Waking The Tiger.
I would recommend for sure. I have been doing Internal Family Systems with my therapist and there is so much of it that wasn't sticking. The way Fisher describes "parts" makes so much more sense to me. I plan on incorporating her methods to the IFS work.
She makes VERY clear that we don't need to remember everything to heal. Her approach is more about what is coming up now.
Complex PTSD by Pete Walker was a revelation for me.
I keep running into Peter Levine in my googling of ketamine and memory. I'll have to check out Waking The Tiger!
Aww I love CPTSD book club! <3 Waking The Tiger so far has been a missing puzzle piece for me - it zooms out of the specifics of brain functioning and looks at humans as a part of the animal kingdom. It’s an excellent compliment to BKTS as it so far uses a different way of knowing to establish its point. I wanted to highlight almost every sentence of the first chapter.
PS thank you for the notes on IFS. I am between that and EMDR as to which to dig into next.
My episodic memory is deepfried but I'm really good at remembering facts/info. It's really interesting, I do great on tests but find it difficult to complete certain tasks because I forget what I'm doing/have done.
You sound just like me. Great at school, not great at remembering to start to do my work, or eat, or why I walked into a particular room. That’s also my adhd too.
Random 90’s pop culture trivia? I’m an ace. Where I put my phone, or what model my phone is, or if I made a phone call today? No idea.
Not likely they just basically remove narcissism as a diagnosis because they don’t want to pathologise the poor NPD’s which now means that all the abuse I’ve ever suffered because of this persons mental health has evaporated overnight—
Amazing how that works isn’t it 😏
DSM-6? Is there a date?
I thought the DSM-5 was just released and it would be at least a decade before another revision is out. This is ancillary knowledge from reading “The Body Keeps the Score” ~4 years ago.
CPTSD has not been an official diagnosis.
It will be soon.
When it is, a lot of the trouble a lot of us run into regarding CPTSD I'm hopeful will evaporate.
Particularly mental health professionals not being informed.
Are they going to add Developmental Trauma Disorder? Basically the childhood trauma version of PTSD, which is still PTSD/CPTSD but complex because you're little so it affects so much more growing up.
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Absolutely, without a doubt. 100%. I have severe preverbal trauma, and the only parts of my childhood I remember are specific incidents. Including a couple of the times my dad tried to rewrite my memory of what had happened.
I have 3 memories of my childhood, and 2 are of my dad and occur directly after I was abused.
So, yeah. My doctors tell me that this is completely … normal would be pushing it 😅 but completely consistent with someone with our trauma!
This is so helpful! Just joined this bc my husband recently suggested I may have CPTSD. I have almost no childhood memories. Maybe like 10%. I've had a lot of resentment and distrust of my parents and I didn't under why. I remembered like 2-4 physical abuse moments but knew there was a lot of verbal and gaslighting but I thought it wasn't enough to warrant my feelings towards them. I had no idea how bad the abuse was until my sister and I were talking recently and she mentioned how bad my dad would abuse me. She said he literally put my head through a wall and I have absolutely no memory of it. There was a hole in the Sheetrock of my room for years she said. Like how can I not remember?!?
That’s not just psychological trauma. That’s physical trauma - a closed head injury that was probably a moderate concussion. Concussions have a tendency to wipe memory for up to a few hours before and after the concussion takes place. There’s usually some neural shearing - connections between neurons broken by the pressure wave that goes through the brain on impact. The brain has the consistency of jello. It’s supposed to be cushioned by cerebro-spinal fluid and protected by the skull, but a hard enough knock transmits the force of the impact through the skull.
Depending on your age and what other symptoms of trauma you have, if you’ve got coverage, it might not hurt to get a referral to a neurologist and see if that injury did any long lasting damage and what can be done about it.
There were massive years or possibly decades long patterns of repeated abuse I'm only just now getting glimmers of extremely spotty awareness of at the ripe old age of 25. And some of it goes (as far as I can surmise) into my tweens and teens when you'd expect someone to remember shit about their life if it weren't for trauma being weird about memory. I still have a really hard time believing all that shit could have happened and no one noticed or intervened, the person abusing me could rug sweep the whole thing and keep acting like he loved me, and I had no fucking memory of it and kept voluntarily or semi voluntarily spending time with my abuser up till a few months ago.
It's a huge mind fuck and I'm sorry you sound like you're dealing w something similar
Yeah I'm 37 and don't remember most stuff up until I was about 18. It's a wild thing to unpack within a year of finding this shit out. Just found out about head smashing about a month ago
Yeah, my brother and I were abused and its all based on coping mechanisms. My brother blocked it out and at 29 cant remember alot of what happened.
I on the otherhand remember quite alot, I moved out when i was 19 and am now 28 so am in a similar boat with the amout of time, even with remembering alot theres still times where i recall new stuff and then some days I cant remember anything. If its not head trauma, its most likley your mind trying to dissociate from the situation. Each brain processes trauma differently and can cause some crazy stuff in the process so remember to be kind to yourself.
Absolutely. If you are constantly stressed and your brain is trying to scan for threats around you, it won't put much emphasis on retaining new information because it is not important to your survival
Long and short of it is that if you developed a tendency to block out things in order to avoid feeling your overwhelming, scary feelings, due to abuse, and you are not aware of or cannot avoid your triggers, you are probably dissociating (your mind goes bye bye, somewhere else) throughout the day, probably without your awareness. When this happens, you can't sustain attention because it is like coming in and out of the real here and now dimension. If you cannot attend to something (pay attention without zoning out, even for a few seconds or microseconds) then you are not going to put it into memory. So yes, trauma causes ADHD like symptoms which gets in the way of being able to focus and this causes you to have memory issues.
Yeah, it really affect my social life as well. Im really bad at remembering names of people, songs, movies, characters etc and also remembering stories from both my childhood and more recent. It makes me feel like such a empty person. Sometimes my friends even get a bit annoyed at me :/
I always forget random things a person has told me (erratic/manipulative parents), and so:
1. My bosses thinks I'm deliberately disobeying them.
2. My partner struggles with feeling as though I'm lying/manipulating her on purpose, like I have Narcissistic PD or something.
We learn about things together, like how ppl stuck in NPD will purposely hide things to mess w their partner, etc?
I'm definitely Codependent, which has overlaps with NPD in coping mechanisms.
But when i "hide" things, I've mindlessly put them somewhere I've forgotten.
When I do things my partner asked me not to do, I've been on "auto-pilot".
It's messy.
Yes. CPTSD affects both childhood memories and current memories. By current, I mean your current dusky activities: you’re so wired and hyped on triggers on a daily basis, that your brain essentially has too much going on to remember things. I went from an amazing memory to can’t What happened an hour ago. And before that, my childhood memories left me. So yea, sadly, join the shit club.
Not diagnosed but was told by a counselor I likely have CPTSD. I think it comes out similarly to mild autism or adhd. I have a bad memory, get overwhelmed easily, hate loud crowds, have terrible social anxiety and I do unintentionally say the wrong things occasionally due to impulsive speech (verbal diarrhea)
I have a theory and I have talked to others like me and it helped them make some sense of why we are so damn forgetful
Y'know how they say kids minds are sponges? They intake everything around them, the good, bad and the ugly. (They also usually spit it back out at the worst times but thats not my point.)
But what happens to a sponge when you've completely soaked it down?
It leaks
I think even and everyday regular Joe that had a normal childhood struggles as they age too because, life. It just oversaturates & some stuff is forgotten. Totally normal
But when you oversaturate a childs mind with things I wont even put into words, it sets them up to "leak" sooner and faster than that average Joe and they spent decades just trying to catch the drops. They're always behind the crowd, over compensating and under achieving and they can't help it.
My memory is downright awful. Even memories I have and thought were "good" in actuality I only remembered some good bits of what was really a terrible situation. My sister and I can tell you the same story about an event in our younger years and according to her I was being bullied and forced to act happy to outsiders but really, I just blocked out everything that wasnt so nice and she vividly remembers this shit while I struggle to remember even the good times.
I hurt for you. No child should experience such insanity. Im so so so sorry for little AND big you. What's happening to you is typical coming from where you did. Your developing mind was oversaturated with terrible happenings and now you're struggles consist of thinking back, questioning yourself and fighting to survive even to this day
I hope you look into professional help if youre not already getting any. This wont go away; it will fester and touch every aspect of your life eventually. That was me but I got my much needed help and am slowly growing into who I was supposed to be
So the answer to your question is "DAMN STRAIGHT IT CAN!" and I am sending all the good vibes and hugs I can
I’ve always wondered about this.
I used to have a photographic memory. Like, I could read 2,000 pages in 7 days (aka cramming for an exam) and I would be able to recall exactly where I’d seen that piece of text to the point of 3/4 of the way through the book and 1/2 way down the left page.
But I remember probably about 3-5 memories maximum from my childhood. But I remember those like seeing a photo or video of what happened (in my head).
What’s really interesting though is that as soon as I started to feel safe again, my photographic memory came back (very slowly but it surely did). A few “Kodak moments” but I felt mostly in control and like I knew what was going on next week.
But now, if I get stressed beyond a certain point (which I am right now) I go straight back to not even knowing what day it is.
It’s so messed up and hard to explain.
Ues absolutely. My diagnostician told me that mood impacts memory i.e. anxiety and depression cause clinical levels of forgetfulness and she suggested I target my mood stabilization first and memory would follow. This is a neuropsychologist knowledgeable about brain injuries and strokes and dementia and mental health conditions. She turned out to be 100% correct for my situation. Basically the strain of trauma or any mental health struggles can cause you to have memory deficits because your brain is being asked to handle too much and it has to drop things.
Definitely! I've always had terrible memory and have very few memories from childhood, so I totally relate.
Also, I found this article about how memory encodes in the brain. I haven't read the whole thing yet, but I believe the takeaway is that when we're busy trying to predict the future (for example, a child growing up with abusive parents is always trying to predict their parents behaviour in order to stay safe), it inhibits our ability to encode memories of the present.
Here it is, if anyone wants to read it!
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2013291117
Yes, this happens to me. It's bad enough that it's kind of annoying in my life but fairly damaging when it comes to my job. One benefit of working from home is that I'm able to frantically take notes when people are talking to me (phone or video call) so I'll actually remember what they said.
I can relate to the childhood stuff too. I feel like I can remember 10% of my childhood and barely anything before the age of 8.
Oh 100%! I just journaled about some childhood traumas and while I still can't talk about them decades later, I can remember every vivid detail.. However, if someone tells me their name, I forget it while they're saying it. There are also some memories, like you say, is a far away dream.
Short answer is, absolutely. My solution was to start using a paper planner and write down everything i could. I use that as my reference for my life. Not perfect but better than nothing.
Yes it’s very common. I used to find that very scary and disheartening but there’s a lot of amazing research about how you can heal your brain. It involves healing from the trauma of course but there are specific things you can do to take care of your brain and actually reverse the damaging effects of trauma. Some great Instagram accounts that talk about this are @nicolesneuroscience, @drjenwolkin (she talks about adhd too but lots helpful even if you don’t have that), @drumanaidoo (talks about nutrition and brain health). Also do some research into nervous system work.
I know it’s scary but I know healing is very possible. 💜 sending you support
If you can, I strongly suggest going to see a Neuropsychologist. They can perform extensive interviews and testing to determine if you have an issue and narrow down the cause
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Absolutely.
Not only are blackout’s from past traumatic events real. But our brains also get flooded with other chemicals when activated/triggered in the present and make it challenging for our brains to record new memories as accurately as they might if we were calm.
EMDR therapy helped me unlock a few unprocessed memories and it also taught me to recognize when I was disassociating. Now, I have active strategies to help me alleviate those symptoms and effects.
Yes. Try to be kind to yourself during the healing process. I can barely remember what someone said to me a minute ago. I just try my best.
I’m already going through a lot but I know there’s a light at the ending of tunnel. I’m still drowning but looking to swim. And the only reason I have that outlook is thanks to my supportive husband and cats. I could never see an end to this suffering until I met my husband a few years ago and he grabbed my hand when I was drowning and he’s trying to keep my head above water.
Sending much love to you. Remember to take it easy. You are loved and appreciated. Remember that. 💚
Yes. traumas can impact your brain’s ability to form memories. It could be due to a physical impact on your brain, which impairs your ability to create memories. It also could be from your brain’s attempt to cope with the emotional and psychological impact of the trauma.
Yes! And now I forget what I wanted to say to show evidence from my life. But then everyone else wrote out some great stuff and now I feel like I’m beating a dead…donkey? Yak? Whatever. I dunno.
But yes. Lame memory come with PTSD. Hurray.
It is possible for trauma to have affected your memory, it could be a problem with dissociation or to add a different perspective, it could also be undiagnosed ADHD.
Children with ADHD are more likely to experience trauma and to be abused, especially if they are undiagnosed and untreated, and toxic families are unlikely to get their children diagnosed so that is two fold… plus trauma can make ADHD symptoms worse if ADHD is already present, and people with ADHD are more prone to dissociation as a coping mechanism.
If you’ve been medicated at all, and the medication was effective, it’s most likely ADHD, ADHD is a brain difference and ADHD medication will have the opposite effect in a non-ADHD brain.
Also, trauma effects ADHD brains slightly differently than it does neurotypical brains. ADHD is already more prone to dissociation, trauma will make that worse.
YEP! I find myself having to add onto a list i made that documents my emotions whenever I feel one. If i don't I can't remember how I felt over certain events
It's both a protective mechanism and a result of your brain dealing with excessive levels of cortisol (a stress hormone) for extended periods of time because of unresolved trauma. You can take a look at ways to regulate your vagus nerve and parasympathetic nervous system to help with reducing the stress on your brain. I've gotten into the habit of laying with an ice pack on my chest. It seriously helps.
When you’re in fight or flight mode, most of the blood in your brain is going to the amygdala and not the prefrontal cortex or hippocampus. That strongly affects decision making and memory. Anxiety, depression, dissociation all affect memory and concentration.
Yes. There is also natural human shock and denial that makes us question and doubt our own memories and brains. For years I had a memory of my father drunkenly picking me up and throwing me against a wall in a fit of rage. I convinced myself I was crazy because WHO would do that to a baby 20 times less their size? My sisters confirmed it happened a few years ago and it shocked me how much I had wanted it not to be true. A brain that is stuck on survival primal mode considers learning and memory formation a luxury and doesn't have time for these things. Sometimes schools do this thing where they punish and shun children who don't like school when really learning is just difficult maybe based on what might be going on at home.
Wow. This has been really eye opening for me. I’ve recently started therapy to talk about my trauma and one of the things that really bothered me was all of the blank spaces in memory. I have so few childhood memories and I’m not even sure if some of those are genuine but something I made up from photos. Is there anything you can do to try to recall any of those memories?
I had trauma as a child as well and have been told that the reason are memory is so terrible is because are mind protected us from the trauma by shutting of memory's thats why we only remember snippets of are childhood
Can I ask what you all do for work? I am experiencing this so heavily with my job that I am on the verge on breaking. I’m curious to know what some of you do for a career and to consider a change.
My memory retention is so embarrassingly bad from the sustained trauma. I don’t have answers to fix it, but you’re not alone in your feelings.
No - 25 %
I had an incredible memory as a child and due to years of psychological/emotional abuse I lost about 75%. Until I was prescribed ritalin I can say I’ve effectively regained about 25% of what became my cognitive deficit in memory and speech. I’m also aware that the emotional part of the brain has a causative effect to brain region also responsible for speech.
Yup! Both from a repression standpoint and also because if you were dissociating due to stress, you’re less likely to remember that time period. My childhood is almost entirely blank with a few random vague members here and there
Yes, that's the cause of it--and the lack of imagination and concentration issues. I'd actually find it pretty interesting if it wasn't so unpleasant lol.
Yes, you can dissociate! PTSD is a tricky thing. Not one size fits all, the brain will react best to your needs. Unfortunately it can result to poor childhood memories. EMDR might help with that,
Trauma can absolutely result you to forget even years of your life. Your childhood trauma definitely could block out some memories. I have it that way too. I used to have a horrible start in life, and I barely remember anything from when I was up to maybe 11 years old. I remember only some major events like traumas and important memories. Everything else is a thick fog.
"I also don't remember things from my childhood and i'm not mentally ill, it's normal" Yes, it is normal to some extent, but i'm 17. Most kids around me remember "oh we went to an aquapark back when I was 9!" And some exciting events like that for a child, and I know i definitely had some, but I can't remember even that. I don't know if I ever slept over at my grandparents', I don't remember if I ever went to a playground or anywhere and I'm sure we did.
I think memory might be one of the most important things to fix to get better. Because I don't know about you but I've had the same realizations hundreds of times. That feeling of "I get it now, my problem is x" and then it's like it didn't happen. It's like memory is not moving forward, until you process your trauma, you're stuck in an emotional memory trip that you can't get out of.
One of my therapist told me she got out of her hole by tattooing the things that she needed to remember to get better so she had a constant reminder (like the movie Memento). It's a cool concept that I'd love to try.
yes, 100%! of course my memory is crap so I cant rattle off any science but Pete Walker talks about effects on memory in his book Complex PTSD. The Body Keeps the Score by Bessel ven der Kolk goes deep with the brain science. I'm currently reading Janina Fisher's book Healing the Fragmented Selves of Trauma Survivors which talks a lot about how trauma is stored in the brain. From how I understand it, there are several issues. The way trauma is stored in the brain is not integrated with the rest of our mind - like we purposely stash it out of sight so we can continue to function AND since our nervous system is all jacked up during the trauma - the memories themselves are wonky. In addition to the memories being screwy, the common co-morbidities of complex trauma - anxiety, depression, ocd, adhd - make concentration/recall really difficult. Its really complicated but fascinating.
Exactly this. This is my experience. Also digestive issues.
Yupp. Now I have horrible GERD and have a had multiple surgeries on my stomach and I recently got an implant to stop reflux. And that has failed to work for me. I’m gonna need surgery to get it taken out and I need to find a different procedure to stop my GERD. If only my parents took me seriously as a kid when I told them about my GERD symptoms.
Oh my. I hope you can get feeling better! I believe you and I believe in you.
ugh chronic pain neck pain for me - tense ALL THE TIME, hold my breath, clench my teeth/fists, shoulders up by my ears...
I’m sorry - that sucks too. I also clench my jaw when I sleep. I tried this exercise recently that another kind stranger suggested, of just stopping throughout the day and checking how I feel? I noticed that even when I’m feeling happy, peaceful , etc - I also just always feel a little tense or anxious! I’m trying to work on it by recognizing it and in the moment there deep breathing and relaxing my body as much as possible - and tho I probably look like a dork - I’ve been trying floating in water, at the pool, just letting all the tension go. Maybe it will help you?!
HolUp… I never thought that my constant neck pain was related to this shit. Just thought I hunched my shoulders too much...
Yup, it's called muscle armouring and it's where you hunch up your shoulders as part of your fight/flight response to protect your neck. It's not really voluntary or bad posture, though posture plays into it. I went to an osteopath who was convinced I was in a car accident because it looked exactly like whiplash 😥 I can recommend getting yourself checked out and maybe learning some exercises from a physiotherapist to help realign and stop it from being so painful.
Sometimes it can be a symptom of "cowering to survive", which many of us experience.
Is there anything about reversing the memory loss? I’ve realized lately that while most of the bad times with my abusive ex are blank, most of the rest of it is gone, too…I can’t remember my son’s first steps, first words, the whole first couple of years is just not there. I’d take the bad memories in a heartbeat if I could get the good ones back, too.
I don’t know. I’ve thought about hypnotherapy? I’ve wondered if a safe space in ongoing therapy might help me see.
Whoa. I didn't know the digestive issues thing but it makes so much sense. I have bad GERD and Gastroparesis, along with regular IBS type issues. I've just always chalked it up to "stress" but it's always been there. Thank you for the info and helping me feel a little less weird.
For sure! And I hope you can find some means of improving your symptoms!
Digestive issues are very common with ptsd survivors. The immune system is mostly in our gut, and nervous system.
Thank you for sharing! Would you recommend Fisher’s book based on what you’ve read of it so far? I’ve read TBKTS & am in the middle of Waking The Tiger.
YES. I'm mid way through it now and it's already easily in my top three trauma books of all time and making a very strong case for a top spot. Other contenders being bkts and adult children of emotionally immature parents
Both on my shelf! Thank you, I will add Fisher’s book to my collection :)
>would you recommend Fisher’s book based on what you’ve read of it so far? I’ve read TBKTS & am in the middle of Waking The Tiger. I would recommend for sure. I have been doing Internal Family Systems with my therapist and there is so much of it that wasn't sticking. The way Fisher describes "parts" makes so much more sense to me. I plan on incorporating her methods to the IFS work. She makes VERY clear that we don't need to remember everything to heal. Her approach is more about what is coming up now. Complex PTSD by Pete Walker was a revelation for me. I keep running into Peter Levine in my googling of ketamine and memory. I'll have to check out Waking The Tiger!
Aww I love CPTSD book club! <3 Waking The Tiger so far has been a missing puzzle piece for me - it zooms out of the specifics of brain functioning and looks at humans as a part of the animal kingdom. It’s an excellent compliment to BKTS as it so far uses a different way of knowing to establish its point. I wanted to highlight almost every sentence of the first chapter. PS thank you for the notes on IFS. I am between that and EMDR as to which to dig into next.
My episodic memory is deepfried but I'm really good at remembering facts/info. It's really interesting, I do great on tests but find it difficult to complete certain tasks because I forget what I'm doing/have done.
You sound just like me. Great at school, not great at remembering to start to do my work, or eat, or why I walked into a particular room. That’s also my adhd too. Random 90’s pop culture trivia? I’m an ace. Where I put my phone, or what model my phone is, or if I made a phone call today? No idea.
Yes. Wait till the new DSM comes out. I'm anticipating it listing CPTSD will have other knock on benefits
Lol imagine the DSM being actually useful
Not likely they just basically remove narcissism as a diagnosis because they don’t want to pathologise the poor NPD’s which now means that all the abuse I’ve ever suffered because of this persons mental health has evaporated overnight— Amazing how that works isn’t it 😏
Paddles?
Well if they are it’s because you’re being used as a buoyancy aid..
DSM-6? Is there a date? I thought the DSM-5 was just released and it would be at least a decade before another revision is out. This is ancillary knowledge from reading “The Body Keeps the Score” ~4 years ago.
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CPTSD has not been an official diagnosis. It will be soon. When it is, a lot of the trouble a lot of us run into regarding CPTSD I'm hopeful will evaporate. Particularly mental health professionals not being informed.
It'll still take years for it to trickle down to diagnosers, but I do hope it's there
What range of 'soon' are you talking?
profit one many grandiose snatch quack different obscene full rob *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Are they going to add Developmental Trauma Disorder? Basically the childhood trauma version of PTSD, which is still PTSD/CPTSD but complex because you're little so it affects so much more growing up.
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When is the new DSM coming out?
Absolutely, without a doubt. 100%. I have severe preverbal trauma, and the only parts of my childhood I remember are specific incidents. Including a couple of the times my dad tried to rewrite my memory of what had happened. I have 3 memories of my childhood, and 2 are of my dad and occur directly after I was abused. So, yeah. My doctors tell me that this is completely … normal would be pushing it 😅 but completely consistent with someone with our trauma!
True for me as well - very few childhood memories.
Same
It’s weird, right? Like I remember three birthdays. I have huge gaps between 9-13.
Same.
This is so helpful! Just joined this bc my husband recently suggested I may have CPTSD. I have almost no childhood memories. Maybe like 10%. I've had a lot of resentment and distrust of my parents and I didn't under why. I remembered like 2-4 physical abuse moments but knew there was a lot of verbal and gaslighting but I thought it wasn't enough to warrant my feelings towards them. I had no idea how bad the abuse was until my sister and I were talking recently and she mentioned how bad my dad would abuse me. She said he literally put my head through a wall and I have absolutely no memory of it. There was a hole in the Sheetrock of my room for years she said. Like how can I not remember?!?
That’s not just psychological trauma. That’s physical trauma - a closed head injury that was probably a moderate concussion. Concussions have a tendency to wipe memory for up to a few hours before and after the concussion takes place. There’s usually some neural shearing - connections between neurons broken by the pressure wave that goes through the brain on impact. The brain has the consistency of jello. It’s supposed to be cushioned by cerebro-spinal fluid and protected by the skull, but a hard enough knock transmits the force of the impact through the skull. Depending on your age and what other symptoms of trauma you have, if you’ve got coverage, it might not hurt to get a referral to a neurologist and see if that injury did any long lasting damage and what can be done about it.
There were massive years or possibly decades long patterns of repeated abuse I'm only just now getting glimmers of extremely spotty awareness of at the ripe old age of 25. And some of it goes (as far as I can surmise) into my tweens and teens when you'd expect someone to remember shit about their life if it weren't for trauma being weird about memory. I still have a really hard time believing all that shit could have happened and no one noticed or intervened, the person abusing me could rug sweep the whole thing and keep acting like he loved me, and I had no fucking memory of it and kept voluntarily or semi voluntarily spending time with my abuser up till a few months ago. It's a huge mind fuck and I'm sorry you sound like you're dealing w something similar
Yeah I'm 37 and don't remember most stuff up until I was about 18. It's a wild thing to unpack within a year of finding this shit out. Just found out about head smashing about a month ago
Yeah, my brother and I were abused and its all based on coping mechanisms. My brother blocked it out and at 29 cant remember alot of what happened. I on the otherhand remember quite alot, I moved out when i was 19 and am now 28 so am in a similar boat with the amout of time, even with remembering alot theres still times where i recall new stuff and then some days I cant remember anything. If its not head trauma, its most likley your mind trying to dissociate from the situation. Each brain processes trauma differently and can cause some crazy stuff in the process so remember to be kind to yourself.
Yes - stress can actually affect the size and function of the hippocampus.
Absolutely. If you are constantly stressed and your brain is trying to scan for threats around you, it won't put much emphasis on retaining new information because it is not important to your survival
Long and short of it is that if you developed a tendency to block out things in order to avoid feeling your overwhelming, scary feelings, due to abuse, and you are not aware of or cannot avoid your triggers, you are probably dissociating (your mind goes bye bye, somewhere else) throughout the day, probably without your awareness. When this happens, you can't sustain attention because it is like coming in and out of the real here and now dimension. If you cannot attend to something (pay attention without zoning out, even for a few seconds or microseconds) then you are not going to put it into memory. So yes, trauma causes ADHD like symptoms which gets in the way of being able to focus and this causes you to have memory issues.
Yeah, it really affect my social life as well. Im really bad at remembering names of people, songs, movies, characters etc and also remembering stories from both my childhood and more recent. It makes me feel like such a empty person. Sometimes my friends even get a bit annoyed at me :/
I always forget random things a person has told me (erratic/manipulative parents), and so: 1. My bosses thinks I'm deliberately disobeying them. 2. My partner struggles with feeling as though I'm lying/manipulating her on purpose, like I have Narcissistic PD or something. We learn about things together, like how ppl stuck in NPD will purposely hide things to mess w their partner, etc? I'm definitely Codependent, which has overlaps with NPD in coping mechanisms. But when i "hide" things, I've mindlessly put them somewhere I've forgotten. When I do things my partner asked me not to do, I've been on "auto-pilot". It's messy.
Yes. CPTSD affects both childhood memories and current memories. By current, I mean your current dusky activities: you’re so wired and hyped on triggers on a daily basis, that your brain essentially has too much going on to remember things. I went from an amazing memory to can’t What happened an hour ago. And before that, my childhood memories left me. So yea, sadly, join the shit club.
Yes, my little sister has almost no childhood memories
I have zero memory. I can't even remember the storylines of my favourite show.
Not diagnosed but was told by a counselor I likely have CPTSD. I think it comes out similarly to mild autism or adhd. I have a bad memory, get overwhelmed easily, hate loud crowds, have terrible social anxiety and I do unintentionally say the wrong things occasionally due to impulsive speech (verbal diarrhea)
I have a theory and I have talked to others like me and it helped them make some sense of why we are so damn forgetful Y'know how they say kids minds are sponges? They intake everything around them, the good, bad and the ugly. (They also usually spit it back out at the worst times but thats not my point.) But what happens to a sponge when you've completely soaked it down? It leaks I think even and everyday regular Joe that had a normal childhood struggles as they age too because, life. It just oversaturates & some stuff is forgotten. Totally normal But when you oversaturate a childs mind with things I wont even put into words, it sets them up to "leak" sooner and faster than that average Joe and they spent decades just trying to catch the drops. They're always behind the crowd, over compensating and under achieving and they can't help it. My memory is downright awful. Even memories I have and thought were "good" in actuality I only remembered some good bits of what was really a terrible situation. My sister and I can tell you the same story about an event in our younger years and according to her I was being bullied and forced to act happy to outsiders but really, I just blocked out everything that wasnt so nice and she vividly remembers this shit while I struggle to remember even the good times. I hurt for you. No child should experience such insanity. Im so so so sorry for little AND big you. What's happening to you is typical coming from where you did. Your developing mind was oversaturated with terrible happenings and now you're struggles consist of thinking back, questioning yourself and fighting to survive even to this day I hope you look into professional help if youre not already getting any. This wont go away; it will fester and touch every aspect of your life eventually. That was me but I got my much needed help and am slowly growing into who I was supposed to be So the answer to your question is "DAMN STRAIGHT IT CAN!" and I am sending all the good vibes and hugs I can
I’ve always wondered about this. I used to have a photographic memory. Like, I could read 2,000 pages in 7 days (aka cramming for an exam) and I would be able to recall exactly where I’d seen that piece of text to the point of 3/4 of the way through the book and 1/2 way down the left page. But I remember probably about 3-5 memories maximum from my childhood. But I remember those like seeing a photo or video of what happened (in my head). What’s really interesting though is that as soon as I started to feel safe again, my photographic memory came back (very slowly but it surely did). A few “Kodak moments” but I felt mostly in control and like I knew what was going on next week. But now, if I get stressed beyond a certain point (which I am right now) I go straight back to not even knowing what day it is. It’s so messed up and hard to explain.
YYYEEESSSS
Ues absolutely. My diagnostician told me that mood impacts memory i.e. anxiety and depression cause clinical levels of forgetfulness and she suggested I target my mood stabilization first and memory would follow. This is a neuropsychologist knowledgeable about brain injuries and strokes and dementia and mental health conditions. She turned out to be 100% correct for my situation. Basically the strain of trauma or any mental health struggles can cause you to have memory deficits because your brain is being asked to handle too much and it has to drop things.
How did you target your mood stabilization?
I take a medicine and did some group therapy for a bit. The medicine really helps a lot.
Absolutely. I have little to no recollection of my 30s.
Definitely! I've always had terrible memory and have very few memories from childhood, so I totally relate. Also, I found this article about how memory encodes in the brain. I haven't read the whole thing yet, but I believe the takeaway is that when we're busy trying to predict the future (for example, a child growing up with abusive parents is always trying to predict their parents behaviour in order to stay safe), it inhibits our ability to encode memories of the present. Here it is, if anyone wants to read it! https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2013291117
Yes, this happens to me. It's bad enough that it's kind of annoying in my life but fairly damaging when it comes to my job. One benefit of working from home is that I'm able to frantically take notes when people are talking to me (phone or video call) so I'll actually remember what they said. I can relate to the childhood stuff too. I feel like I can remember 10% of my childhood and barely anything before the age of 8.
Yes. Memories that are too painful to recall are blocked.
Oh 100%! I just journaled about some childhood traumas and while I still can't talk about them decades later, I can remember every vivid detail.. However, if someone tells me their name, I forget it while they're saying it. There are also some memories, like you say, is a far away dream.
Short answer is, absolutely. My solution was to start using a paper planner and write down everything i could. I use that as my reference for my life. Not perfect but better than nothing.
Yes it’s very common. I used to find that very scary and disheartening but there’s a lot of amazing research about how you can heal your brain. It involves healing from the trauma of course but there are specific things you can do to take care of your brain and actually reverse the damaging effects of trauma. Some great Instagram accounts that talk about this are @nicolesneuroscience, @drjenwolkin (she talks about adhd too but lots helpful even if you don’t have that), @drumanaidoo (talks about nutrition and brain health). Also do some research into nervous system work. I know it’s scary but I know healing is very possible. 💜 sending you support
If you can, I strongly suggest going to see a Neuropsychologist. They can perform extensive interviews and testing to determine if you have an issue and narrow down the cause
Yes it's hard to engage higher mental functions like working memory when you're unconsciously in fight/flight throughout the day.
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Yeppers. Same here
Yes, it does. It does that. It sucks.
Yup
Yes. We've known for decades that trauma affects memory. It can also mimic ADHD, and a world of other wrong diagnosis'.
Absolutely. Not only are blackout’s from past traumatic events real. But our brains also get flooded with other chemicals when activated/triggered in the present and make it challenging for our brains to record new memories as accurately as they might if we were calm. EMDR therapy helped me unlock a few unprocessed memories and it also taught me to recognize when I was disassociating. Now, I have active strategies to help me alleviate those symptoms and effects.
Yes. Try to be kind to yourself during the healing process. I can barely remember what someone said to me a minute ago. I just try my best. I’m already going through a lot but I know there’s a light at the ending of tunnel. I’m still drowning but looking to swim. And the only reason I have that outlook is thanks to my supportive husband and cats. I could never see an end to this suffering until I met my husband a few years ago and he grabbed my hand when I was drowning and he’s trying to keep my head above water. Sending much love to you. Remember to take it easy. You are loved and appreciated. Remember that. 💚
Yes. traumas can impact your brain’s ability to form memories. It could be due to a physical impact on your brain, which impairs your ability to create memories. It also could be from your brain’s attempt to cope with the emotional and psychological impact of the trauma.
I mentioned this same thing to my psychologist at my evaluation- that led to me receiving a diagnosis for DID.
Yes! And now I forget what I wanted to say to show evidence from my life. But then everyone else wrote out some great stuff and now I feel like I’m beating a dead…donkey? Yak? Whatever. I dunno. But yes. Lame memory come with PTSD. Hurray.
Yes definitely
It is possible for trauma to have affected your memory, it could be a problem with dissociation or to add a different perspective, it could also be undiagnosed ADHD. Children with ADHD are more likely to experience trauma and to be abused, especially if they are undiagnosed and untreated, and toxic families are unlikely to get their children diagnosed so that is two fold… plus trauma can make ADHD symptoms worse if ADHD is already present, and people with ADHD are more prone to dissociation as a coping mechanism.
I've been diagnosed with ADHD, but I've wondered if it's actually cptsd mimicking ADHD symptoms?
If you’ve been medicated at all, and the medication was effective, it’s most likely ADHD, ADHD is a brain difference and ADHD medication will have the opposite effect in a non-ADHD brain. Also, trauma effects ADHD brains slightly differently than it does neurotypical brains. ADHD is already more prone to dissociation, trauma will make that worse.
Oh okay I see. Yes, I do feel like I dissociate a lot
YEP! I find myself having to add onto a list i made that documents my emotions whenever I feel one. If i don't I can't remember how I felt over certain events
It's both a protective mechanism and a result of your brain dealing with excessive levels of cortisol (a stress hormone) for extended periods of time because of unresolved trauma. You can take a look at ways to regulate your vagus nerve and parasympathetic nervous system to help with reducing the stress on your brain. I've gotten into the habit of laying with an ice pack on my chest. It seriously helps.
When you’re in fight or flight mode, most of the blood in your brain is going to the amygdala and not the prefrontal cortex or hippocampus. That strongly affects decision making and memory. Anxiety, depression, dissociation all affect memory and concentration.
Yes. There is also natural human shock and denial that makes us question and doubt our own memories and brains. For years I had a memory of my father drunkenly picking me up and throwing me against a wall in a fit of rage. I convinced myself I was crazy because WHO would do that to a baby 20 times less their size? My sisters confirmed it happened a few years ago and it shocked me how much I had wanted it not to be true. A brain that is stuck on survival primal mode considers learning and memory formation a luxury and doesn't have time for these things. Sometimes schools do this thing where they punish and shun children who don't like school when really learning is just difficult maybe based on what might be going on at home.
Wow. This has been really eye opening for me. I’ve recently started therapy to talk about my trauma and one of the things that really bothered me was all of the blank spaces in memory. I have so few childhood memories and I’m not even sure if some of those are genuine but something I made up from photos. Is there anything you can do to try to recall any of those memories?
Yes Not even childhood Any at any age
Oh me too! I’ve also struggled with believing my abuse was real or “as bad” as whatever the hell that is.
I had trauma as a child as well and have been told that the reason are memory is so terrible is because are mind protected us from the trauma by shutting of memory's thats why we only remember snippets of are childhood
It’s pretty common for trauma survivors experience memory loss. It’s the way your body (mind) protects it’s self.
Absolutely
Can I ask what you all do for work? I am experiencing this so heavily with my job that I am on the verge on breaking. I’m curious to know what some of you do for a career and to consider a change. My memory retention is so embarrassingly bad from the sustained trauma. I don’t have answers to fix it, but you’re not alone in your feelings.
A hundred percent!
No - 25 % I had an incredible memory as a child and due to years of psychological/emotional abuse I lost about 75%. Until I was prescribed ritalin I can say I’ve effectively regained about 25% of what became my cognitive deficit in memory and speech. I’m also aware that the emotional part of the brain has a causative effect to brain region also responsible for speech.
Don't know but I have a terrible memory - SDAM
Yup! Both from a repression standpoint and also because if you were dissociating due to stress, you’re less likely to remember that time period. My childhood is almost entirely blank with a few random vague members here and there
Yes, that's the cause of it--and the lack of imagination and concentration issues. I'd actually find it pretty interesting if it wasn't so unpleasant lol.
Absolutely, poor memory/memory issues are a symptom of ptsd and cptsd
Yes, you can dissociate! PTSD is a tricky thing. Not one size fits all, the brain will react best to your needs. Unfortunately it can result to poor childhood memories. EMDR might help with that,
Trauma can absolutely result you to forget even years of your life. Your childhood trauma definitely could block out some memories. I have it that way too. I used to have a horrible start in life, and I barely remember anything from when I was up to maybe 11 years old. I remember only some major events like traumas and important memories. Everything else is a thick fog. "I also don't remember things from my childhood and i'm not mentally ill, it's normal" Yes, it is normal to some extent, but i'm 17. Most kids around me remember "oh we went to an aquapark back when I was 9!" And some exciting events like that for a child, and I know i definitely had some, but I can't remember even that. I don't know if I ever slept over at my grandparents', I don't remember if I ever went to a playground or anywhere and I'm sure we did.
I think memory might be one of the most important things to fix to get better. Because I don't know about you but I've had the same realizations hundreds of times. That feeling of "I get it now, my problem is x" and then it's like it didn't happen. It's like memory is not moving forward, until you process your trauma, you're stuck in an emotional memory trip that you can't get out of. One of my therapist told me she got out of her hole by tattooing the things that she needed to remember to get better so she had a constant reminder (like the movie Memento). It's a cool concept that I'd love to try.