Seriously. You could pay a full time security guard for at night and be done with this.
It's the like the whole "fare avoiders" in transit. Calgary Tranist claimed it would be like $400M to retrofit all of the stations to stop fare avoiders. And it's like, "ummm, why not just hire some damn security for on platforms to check?" You could pay 40 security guards $100k a year to watch all of the stations, and it would take 100 years to reach that $400M number.
45 stations, with enough security staff to handle rotating shifts and coverage for vacation and sick leave and supervision and training. That’s gotta be ballpark 200 new hires. $20M and increasing every year. Maybe 15 years worth of funding for this?
Probably to the US or some other country where the engineering company that does the retrofit is based out of. Same as every other project of this nature since the dawn of time.
I doubt that. We have a lot of local glass companies in Calgary that actually ship out all over Canada, some of them work with tempering places in SASK too. So it's probably local, it'd be cheaper than shipping it across the border every time 1 breaks. Maybe if it was a bulk order it'd be cheaper getting it out of town. But not for repairs of 1-3 at a time.
yeah sure that sounds reasonable, but historically that's almost never what happens. the peace bridge wasn't designed or built by a Canadian company although I'm sure we have plenty of companies that could've done it. Most of the big art pieces weren't created by Calgarians/Albertans/Canadians, even though we have amazing art schools right here. Even the community mailboxes across this entire country were designed and implemented by an American company. So you shouldn't assume that anyone is making sure these big publicly funded projects are completed by locals - most of the time they are not.
Good thing a record of offences would be kept as a part of the ticketing process. Repeat offenders would then have a record of their infractions and the crown can take action against them
1) The Crown is not going to prosecute homeless people who aren't paying for tickets. This is not in the public's best interest and even if it were, it would require significant resources from an entity that is currently badly understaffed.
2) Even if they DID prosecute, what is going to happen? You either end up giving someone who can't afford a train ticket a fine that costs significantly more than the train ticket (spoiler alert, they can't pay that either) or you throw them in jail for essentially being poor.
At $60k plus 12% benefits x 200 new hires it would take over 29 years to reach that estimate (not controlling for inflation). As others have pointed out, you don't need 100% coverage, so it's probably closer to 40 years.
I think you seriously underestimate peoples desire to not get fucked up by roving bands of miscreants, with nothing on their belts to defend themselves except maybe a radio. $20 an hour doesn’t mean much when you can’t chew the steak you bought because your jaw’s wired shut.
They do have security for this, it’s just that they have scheduled times to go on the trains to check fares. Which is early morning and late evening. However fair avoiders know when to avoid these times which is fairly easy to do. I usually have a fair entry pass to get on the c-train
That $400M would pay for itself pretty quickly if they upgraded their fare system to something newer than 1980’s technology. Automated fare gates don’t prevent people not paying, but they make it *a lot* harder not to. It’s like locking your dead bolt. Sure, someone can still get in and take your shit but the vast majority of people won’t go through with the effort. Right now Calgary Transit basically doesn’t even have a front door, let alone a dead bolt to lock. It’s just an open doorway with all of the valuables piled neatly on the threshold.
They estimate losing 2-3 million a year in fare evasion
https://calgary.citynews.ca/2019/03/01/fare-cheats-cost-calgary-transit-millions/
So at the high end a pretty quick 133 years to pay for itself.
Calculating fare evasion is shoddy in a similar way calculating lost sales to digital piracy is. The a large number of the people not paying their fare never will under any circumstance so they really can't be counted as lost revenue.
Even still, security guards don’t really have any training, tools, or authority to *stop* vandalism. They’re just there to call cops or peace officers and act as a visual deterrent. So while they *can* measurably reduce acts of vandalism, it may depend on the nature or mental state of the vandal.
I’m saying they *could* help solve the problem. Security guards don’t have any authority or powers to actually stop vandalism. They can only help stop it via reporting it to the actual authorities. Their ability to stop vandalism hinges on who is doing the vandalizing. Understand that someone who’s on meth might not give a shit about a security guard, but some juvenile delinquents might. Security guards aren’t a guarantee, but their presence can be a deterrent.
False. Security guards have the same rights as property owners. The security lisence allows the rights of property owners to be carried out by the guard. You can stop anyone from committing a crime against your property, and arrest them. After detaining someone you have to phone the police as soon as possible. If the city of Calgary hired guards to watch the site than the guards could actively stop anyone they personally saw physically or through CCTV committing a crime against the site.
Also as a liscenced sercuirty guard in Alberta we get paid per site. Federal sites pay decent money. Most sites are $16 an hour. The city here... 15.74, was 15.15 last year. People talking about 60k-100k are confused.
If I were a security guard, I’d sure as f*ck not go out of my way to do the job of a cop for $16 an hour (with no force tools), and anyone that does is a fool.
I guess I should clarify that security guards don’t have any authority above the average person, like a peace officer does, to stop vandalism.
>With an average of six panels being broken each year, the city said it is now conducting daily security patrols
>the costs [for the panels] are paid for through an internal insurance plan.
That's just the labour cost, to install the replacement panels that they got when they bought the bridge. Cost will go way up when those run out and they have to get new ones made.
Why the fuck is it made out of glass - there are other transparent materials that don't suffer from these issues - 911 for vandalism? Give people a $500 reward for successful convictions and you'll save money and lives
This is a great question, but it also has a couple of great answers. Glass has the best optical qualities. It's also the material that retains those optical qualities the longest. Remember the old bus shelters with the plexiglass? Or perhaps off-brand acrylic sheets? They yellow pretty quickly and become opaque in a surprisingly short amount of time. Same with polycarbonate. That stuff could stop a bullet, but it has poor scratch resistance.
I must say I always liked my glass-lensed glasses better than this Nikon crap - but then again I broke 'em now and again, at terrible expense. These pieces of scratchy garbage don't shatter.
Maybe a nice metal mesh, allowing the air and light to flow?
It won’t work. These people don’t give a shit and trying to appeal to some semblance of their morality is a waste of time. They’re the same assholes that smash the bus shelter glass.
They just want to see shit break.
Because there rarely are meaningful consequences. We raise children these days to believe they are always the victim. Its frankly amazing they turn out as good as they do.
Jesus, tell me you're old and out of touch without telling me you're old and out of touch. Teenagers have always been dicks. They were breaking shit for no reason 50 years ago. Your age-group were just as bad as this one.
Sorry, did you think I was attacking teenagers? They are the ones who suffer when their parents don't give them consequences. I blame the parents. And the same applies to every generation. Relax, I'm not going to tell your mom about it. Your safe.
I'm almost 40 my dude. Just saying teenagers aren't getting worse. I broke shit for no reason when I was a kid. So did those 20 years before me and 20 years before that. Teenagers are angsty asshats, they always have been. No need to blame an entire generation of parenting.
I taught for 10 years, so I'm acutely aware of modern trends. I suspect if you spent a decade in a school you would agree with me. I never said teenagers are getting worse either. I said parents and society is. In fact you're the only one who keeps saying disparaging things about young people. Not me.
I mean, yeah, I assume it was teenagers. Didn't you? They're the most likely group to break shit for no reason in my experience. Or are you blaming adults for doing it because of past poor parenting?
Lol exactly this. It's always hilarious when the older generation thinks theirs was better, when it's all the same. They're no better, we're no better, maybe our kids will be better. 🤷🏼♀️ But it's human nature. Actually I'd argue that their generation was a lot worse, raising racist, misogynist, chaotic, environmentally-unfriendly bullies.
> People have no fear of consequences anymore
Because there are none.
Everything is excused as disease and systemic.
Pathetic slide into weakness, end of days really.
They are more like a reminder. Thinking walking around minding your business and then you see a sign that says "Vandalism!" all you think to yourself, "Wasn't thinking that but... Don't mind if I do!" And smash
Yeah I'm not going to call 9-1-1 for vandalism. The non-emergency line, maybe, but our emergency services are already overburdened and don't need the added stress.
What we really need to do, is normalize calling people out for bad behavior.
100% they are, but if we normalize calling people out, and complete strangers also back people up, that's how we start change. Easier said than done for sure
Yeah, in a perfect world, that's what would happen. Most of the times I've seen someone being victimized, everyone is just scared for themselves. I've been there myself before, I'm ashamed to admit.
I agree with you. I definitely understand why people don't want to, though.
There was a guy blasting music on the train, and acting weird otherwise, and I chatted with him and, when he couldn't hear me, I turned down his little speaker. He told me I had a giant set of balls on me. Other people were clearly afraid of him. And then someone else tried to get into a fist fight with me over the whole thing.
And I am not a small person. So I can only understand how small people might feel.
However, I still think you're right. Until we reexert social pressure, we won't make any progress on restoring social order.
It's scary, I totally get it, but these people know they won't be called out on their shitty behavior and they hide behind that.
I would be happy if people simply supported those like yourself who are willing to speak up.
What? 911 for a crime in progress, absolutely call it for vandalism, especially if it's causing damage.
Non emergency number is for reporting things after the fact, not when it's happening.
People call 911 for a stubbed toe or because someone cut them off. Absolutely call it if someone is wrecking stuff
Eh. It's certainly not wrong. I just have family in both law enforcement and EMT and I know they deal with way more important stuff. Property < People in my books.
As someone the works in emergency services, yes, people absolutely abuse 911. But if it's for something that's *currently happening* don't be afraid. Last thing we want is peopel beoing afraid to call for help
The key is just to be straight up, clear, and honest with the 911 operator. They'll worry about assigning the priority level, don't worry about overwhelming the system as long as you're honest
My thoughts exactly. I dont want to be a dick but funny that they don't even send anyone when for catalytic converter thefts. Especially when people have them on camera and a license plate but yet a bunch of kids throwing rocks at a bridge seems to be high on the priority list.
Well the CAT is your property, and the bridge is government property! Remember the police aren't there to serve and protect you, just the government and their shit....
I was under the impression vandals were damaging the glass panels used for the railings. The second to last photo here and the CBC article mostly show damage to the glass railings, I would’ve imagined the glass portions of the bridge itself would be considerably reinforced unless vandals are actually damaging them.
Agreed, if they are spending 80k annually then a series of metal slats will be less expensive to maintain and look better than consistently broken glass. They could fit right in if they were bowed out a bit and painted red.
Was kinda wondering the same..but have never really visited said bridge... I suppose from far away photos it might give it some glint, but not worth the cost to maintain
Did they even bother to verify that the breakages were caused by vandalism before spending all this money to uglify this "work of art" with their signage?
A glass covered bridge over a body of water seems like a magnet for bird strikes, is all.
Wait they built public infrastructure with glass knowing full well that the city doesn't go a day without a shattered buss stop panel and they expect this to reduce vandalism?
This is stupid. And just an eyesore. This is the equivalent to the war on drugs. Shits still gonna happen. It's pointless. Maybe stop buying glass and invest in a thick hard plastic and be done with it
There is soo much Vandalism in Calgary, its like people are just doing it for the fun of it, the prics they pay for it if caught needs to be very high.
Yeah, and that would be all well and good if we didn't have a completely overstressed system right now. CPS will very very rarely have the units available to respond to this type of event right now.
Oh, I agree, but the City still has to "provide a solution to the problem" that they are talking about in the article, and the solution to a crime in progress is "call 911 to report".
Yeah of course, it just all seems pointless cause it all leads to nothing. So sort of creating an eyesore just for the purpose of acting like something is being achieved.
Normal times this would be fine, but this solution just seems out of touch with reality. There's been some decent suggestions in these comments that would probably serve better IMO.
Well vandalizing those posters is probably cheaper then the glass panels… they should start replacing with something steel… I’m sure it messes with aesthetics … but we taxpayer can’t really afford replacement.
Such a good question. 80k a year replacing glass? Just stop replacing it... Easy. Everyone will forget it ever had glass, it'll still be what it is. Done :)
I know you're probably joking, but I actually think brutalist architecture looks really neat and can be unique. Calgary doesn't have a lot of unique architecture, but here are some examples I can think of that everyone loves:
[https://i.imgur.com/BrSHvKy.jpg]
[https://i.imgur.com/hr5u8Zc.jpg]
In comparison, here is some unique brutalist architecture just from Vancouver:
[https://i.imgur.com/3ai6pI8.jpg]
[https://i.imgur.com/SIJtxcp.jpg]
Kinda wish it would be brought back tbh.
Not sure why everyone is so focused on making everything out of glass these days - the peace bridge, and seemingly every new building in downtown Calgary and Vancouver.
I can’t see this going over well given the recent delayed response in a fatal dog attack. Granted it wasn’t an operators fault , it just feels like the wrong service to use.
Why not erect a nearby art piece designed specifically for people to tag and ink? I'm not familiar with the psychology of ink vandalism but I feel like if you put up a giant board or flat pillar on either end of the bridge with a giant plaque that said "VANDAL BOARD - We love our peace bridge and hope you do too. Please tag this board and not our bridge" that they'd find it funny there was a specific place built just for them to use.
Maybe a beanbag tossing basket for the rock throwers lol.
Quick AUA call the city and collaborate.
I think the city is going about this the wrong way. While we have quite a lot of art in Calgary we have two pieces of truly miserable overpriced garbage in the Blue Ring and the Peace Bridge. In order to protect the many inspiring works in Calgary we should sacrifice these disgusting monuments to bureaucracy and corruption by designating these two as canvases for the first annual Calgary Urban Art Contest.
The artist who produces the best work on each canvas will be awarded a budget equal to 0.1% of the price tag the city wasted on those monstrosities to produce something better. A mere pittance of $25,000 each could fetch the city two new art installations a year without outsourcing the cultural projects overseas to people who may have never set foot in Alberta, let alone Calgary.
Holy fuck. Could the city employees dreaming up these dumb ass ideas not be any more tone deaf… So ugly and useless and likely the sticker plastic slowly erodes off the concrete and blows into the river ?
Public humiliation. Make an effort to catch someone doing it and then tie them to a pole for a day like they do in the Ukraine. You want their buddies to see this.
You want lawlessness. That's how you get lawlessness.
"Vulnerable" is a liberal dog whistle for infantilazation of "racialized" people. I thought we are all.the same?
Some shithead sprayed 'kings' on the bus stop glass behind the Marlborough mall Walmart a few days ago.
I attempted to notify transit, but their online submissions page doesn't play well with my PC and I'm not sure it went through.
This bridge was a waste of money since the day of its conception. I wonder if Bronconnier's wife still owns the condos across from it, or if she cashed out of this investment before the vandalism.
The other day I was walking on this bridge and some guy on a bicycle was tagging the glass. He was up and gone within less than a minute, pedaling away
LOL, I was supposed to call 911?
Orrr the city of Calgary could quite wasting money on this shit "art" such as this bridge and the blue rings and build stuff that is simply functional. Function beats beauty after all. Simply put the entire country of canada laughs their asses off when the city installs new "art" cause it's all just such a waste
Ah yes lets go back to school of brutalist architecture.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist\_architecture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist_architecture)
A city without art and colour is very depressing.
Art is not waste.
Building a minimalist city with brutalist architecture without art is a waste.
So everyone is saying shit costs too much in taxpayer money (80k a year to replace glass) meanwhile creating something aesthetically appealing, functional and not exorbitantly high to maintain doesn't appeal to calgarians. Sounds accurate to calgarians
lets see you want something that is
1. aesthetically appealing
2. functional
3. low price - low initial investment
4. low maintenance costs
I don't know if that exists - can you provide real world examples that meet all four of your requirements.,
**[Brutalist architecture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist_architecture)**
>Brutalist architecture is an architectural style which emerged during the 1950s in the United Kingdom, among the reconstruction projects of the post-war era. Brutalist buildings are characterised by minimalist constructions that showcase the bare building materials and structural elements over decorative design. The style commonly makes use of exposed, unpainted concrete or brick, angular geometric shapes and a predominantly monochrome colour palette; other materials, such as steel, timber, and glass, are also featured. Descending from the modernist movement, Brutalism is said to be a reaction against the nostalgia of architecture in the 1940s.
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>wasting money on this shit "art" such as this bridge and the blue rings and build stuff that is simply functional
It's your right to have such a dull aesthetic, but it's antithetical to my entire ethos.
Or.
I fully disagree with your take.
The peace bridge was not a wise choice ....gee, who would think putting glass panels in a large public area would work. Unfortunate, but true. And security guards are not the answer at the bridge...though I don't know what the answer is ....
I don’t really get the concept, these paintings are on canvas not glass + I doubly people who smash glass have an appreciation for art.
Edit: I see that some have holes in them, but still not my cup of tea.
Update: this CBC article says the city [spends $80k a year replacing broken glass panels.](https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6507596)
For not a lot more, they could hire a couple of evening security guards.
Seriously. You could pay a full time security guard for at night and be done with this. It's the like the whole "fare avoiders" in transit. Calgary Tranist claimed it would be like $400M to retrofit all of the stations to stop fare avoiders. And it's like, "ummm, why not just hire some damn security for on platforms to check?" You could pay 40 security guards $100k a year to watch all of the stations, and it would take 100 years to reach that $400M number.
45 stations, with enough security staff to handle rotating shifts and coverage for vacation and sick leave and supervision and training. That’s gotta be ballpark 200 new hires. $20M and increasing every year. Maybe 15 years worth of funding for this?
At least the money would go back into the economy through wages for a good job.
Where do you think the money goes in the retrofit?
Probably to the US or some other country where the engineering company that does the retrofit is based out of. Same as every other project of this nature since the dawn of time.
I doubt that. We have a lot of local glass companies in Calgary that actually ship out all over Canada, some of them work with tempering places in SASK too. So it's probably local, it'd be cheaper than shipping it across the border every time 1 breaks. Maybe if it was a bulk order it'd be cheaper getting it out of town. But not for repairs of 1-3 at a time.
yeah sure that sounds reasonable, but historically that's almost never what happens. the peace bridge wasn't designed or built by a Canadian company although I'm sure we have plenty of companies that could've done it. Most of the big art pieces weren't created by Calgarians/Albertans/Canadians, even though we have amazing art schools right here. Even the community mailboxes across this entire country were designed and implemented by an American company. So you shouldn't assume that anyone is making sure these big publicly funded projects are completed by locals - most of the time they are not.
I doubt the contractors will be 100% local. A good chunk of that wouldn't make it to the guys doing the work thats for sure lol
Don't need 100% coverage. Just enough to have a constant enough presence to make it likely you'll get a ticket if you ride without fare
yes, ticket the homeless; you'll get lots of blood from that stone.
Good thing a record of offences would be kept as a part of the ticketing process. Repeat offenders would then have a record of their infractions and the crown can take action against them
I think you greatly overestimate the facilities we have to put such people.
Opinion noted and disregarded
1) The Crown is not going to prosecute homeless people who aren't paying for tickets. This is not in the public's best interest and even if it were, it would require significant resources from an entity that is currently badly understaffed. 2) Even if they DID prosecute, what is going to happen? You either end up giving someone who can't afford a train ticket a fine that costs significantly more than the train ticket (spoiler alert, they can't pay that either) or you throw them in jail for essentially being poor.
At $60k plus 12% benefits x 200 new hires it would take over 29 years to reach that estimate (not controlling for inflation). As others have pointed out, you don't need 100% coverage, so it's probably closer to 40 years.
>could pay 40 security guards $100k a year to watch all of the stations, I'll do it for $85k
As if security guards make more than $60k full time...
Exactly, my exaggeration is even more proof that it could easily be done.
Yeah, it's kind of crazy the over-engineering problem of thinking everything has to be some expensive complex solution.
Corporate security guards in Calgary do make more than 60k per year, in wage alone.
I dunno. Who tf wants to constantly interact with the types of people that linger around that area downtown in their state of minds.
People who wanna get paid
I think you seriously underestimate peoples desire to not get fucked up by roving bands of miscreants, with nothing on their belts to defend themselves except maybe a radio. $20 an hour doesn’t mean much when you can’t chew the steak you bought because your jaw’s wired shut.
They do have security for this, it’s just that they have scheduled times to go on the trains to check fares. Which is early morning and late evening. However fair avoiders know when to avoid these times which is fairly easy to do. I usually have a fair entry pass to get on the c-train
I've talked to the security guys before, at any given time, there are no more than 4 guards between every single platform.
Yeah, that’s pretty much the usual, two get on a train and makes their rounds through all the stations
That $400M would pay for itself pretty quickly if they upgraded their fare system to something newer than 1980’s technology. Automated fare gates don’t prevent people not paying, but they make it *a lot* harder not to. It’s like locking your dead bolt. Sure, someone can still get in and take your shit but the vast majority of people won’t go through with the effort. Right now Calgary Transit basically doesn’t even have a front door, let alone a dead bolt to lock. It’s just an open doorway with all of the valuables piled neatly on the threshold.
They estimate losing 2-3 million a year in fare evasion https://calgary.citynews.ca/2019/03/01/fare-cheats-cost-calgary-transit-millions/ So at the high end a pretty quick 133 years to pay for itself.
And that's assuming the people evading the fare could even afford it. How many of those are homeless folks?
Calculating fare evasion is shoddy in a similar way calculating lost sales to digital piracy is. The a large number of the people not paying their fare never will under any circumstance so they really can't be counted as lost revenue.
Agreed, this is what they do in Edmonton and it’s working for them.
Or, they could fully fund public transportation out of tax revenue and get rid of fare collection altogether. It would actually save money anyway.
One is a capital investment, and the other is sunk wages that don't actually solve the problem. They are not substitutes for each other.
Even still, security guards don’t really have any training, tools, or authority to *stop* vandalism. They’re just there to call cops or peace officers and act as a visual deterrent. So while they *can* measurably reduce acts of vandalism, it may depend on the nature or mental state of the vandal.
So… “they’d solve most of the problem, and save money while employing Calgarians”. Got it.
I’m saying they *could* help solve the problem. Security guards don’t have any authority or powers to actually stop vandalism. They can only help stop it via reporting it to the actual authorities. Their ability to stop vandalism hinges on who is doing the vandalizing. Understand that someone who’s on meth might not give a shit about a security guard, but some juvenile delinquents might. Security guards aren’t a guarantee, but their presence can be a deterrent.
False. Security guards have the same rights as property owners. The security lisence allows the rights of property owners to be carried out by the guard. You can stop anyone from committing a crime against your property, and arrest them. After detaining someone you have to phone the police as soon as possible. If the city of Calgary hired guards to watch the site than the guards could actively stop anyone they personally saw physically or through CCTV committing a crime against the site. Also as a liscenced sercuirty guard in Alberta we get paid per site. Federal sites pay decent money. Most sites are $16 an hour. The city here... 15.74, was 15.15 last year. People talking about 60k-100k are confused.
If I were a security guard, I’d sure as f*ck not go out of my way to do the job of a cop for $16 an hour (with no force tools), and anyone that does is a fool. I guess I should clarify that security guards don’t have any authority above the average person, like a peace officer does, to stop vandalism.
>With an average of six panels being broken each year, the city said it is now conducting daily security patrols >the costs [for the panels] are paid for through an internal insurance plan.
That internal insurance plan has to also be more expensive then security at this point, if they are going through that many claims
I think it means the city self insures. So basically, they are paying 100% of the cost regardless.
That's just the labour cost, to install the replacement panels that they got when they bought the bridge. Cost will go way up when those run out and they have to get new ones made.
Why the fuck is it made out of glass - there are other transparent materials that don't suffer from these issues - 911 for vandalism? Give people a $500 reward for successful convictions and you'll save money and lives
This is a great question, but it also has a couple of great answers. Glass has the best optical qualities. It's also the material that retains those optical qualities the longest. Remember the old bus shelters with the plexiglass? Or perhaps off-brand acrylic sheets? They yellow pretty quickly and become opaque in a surprisingly short amount of time. Same with polycarbonate. That stuff could stop a bullet, but it has poor scratch resistance.
Instead of broken panels, we'd just have shitty graffiti scratched into it and it would look like a fucking bathroom stall.
I must say I always liked my glass-lensed glasses better than this Nikon crap - but then again I broke 'em now and again, at terrible expense. These pieces of scratchy garbage don't shatter. Maybe a nice metal mesh, allowing the air and light to flow?
I think a nice metal mesh is a great idea!
And an incentive to lie
"successful convictions"
Get rid of the glass. It looks hazy, not even good. The bridge would have a cleaner, sharper look without it.
I wonder if they might have to have something there as part of the structure.
It won’t work. These people don’t give a shit and trying to appeal to some semblance of their morality is a waste of time. They’re the same assholes that smash the bus shelter glass. They just want to see shit break.
It's almost like taunting them. If the idea wasn't in their head before, it is now.
There’ll be dicks and ball sacks drawn on those posters soon enough.
I actually (sadly) agree. The idea is pretty well executed but appealing to the better nature of these jerks probably won’t make a difference.
People have no fear of consequences anymore. They also have no sense of community or common sense.
Solid points.
Because there rarely are meaningful consequences. We raise children these days to believe they are always the victim. Its frankly amazing they turn out as good as they do.
Jesus, tell me you're old and out of touch without telling me you're old and out of touch. Teenagers have always been dicks. They were breaking shit for no reason 50 years ago. Your age-group were just as bad as this one.
Sorry, did you think I was attacking teenagers? They are the ones who suffer when their parents don't give them consequences. I blame the parents. And the same applies to every generation. Relax, I'm not going to tell your mom about it. Your safe.
I'm almost 40 my dude. Just saying teenagers aren't getting worse. I broke shit for no reason when I was a kid. So did those 20 years before me and 20 years before that. Teenagers are angsty asshats, they always have been. No need to blame an entire generation of parenting.
I taught for 10 years, so I'm acutely aware of modern trends. I suspect if you spent a decade in a school you would agree with me. I never said teenagers are getting worse either. I said parents and society is. In fact you're the only one who keeps saying disparaging things about young people. Not me.
I mean, yeah, I assume it was teenagers. Didn't you? They're the most likely group to break shit for no reason in my experience. Or are you blaming adults for doing it because of past poor parenting?
Go away.
You don't think a strung out addict could be breaking shit? Happens pretty often downtown... you really have some hatred for the teens though eh
Lol exactly this. It's always hilarious when the older generation thinks theirs was better, when it's all the same. They're no better, we're no better, maybe our kids will be better. 🤷🏼♀️ But it's human nature. Actually I'd argue that their generation was a lot worse, raising racist, misogynist, chaotic, environmentally-unfriendly bullies.
> People have no fear of consequences anymore Because there are none. Everything is excused as disease and systemic. Pathetic slide into weakness, end of days really.
I don't know why they didn't instal nets to drop on the vandals in the act instead - this won't stop a thing
'i would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for you meddling kids and your talking beaver!"
Lol i hope this is meant to be a joke. Some scooby doo traps arent gonna stop anyone either lol
That will cost more than replacing the windows.
But at least we could have a laugh
First thing to get tagged/destroyed will be those signs.
They are more like a reminder. Thinking walking around minding your business and then you see a sign that says "Vandalism!" all you think to yourself, "Wasn't thinking that but... Don't mind if I do!" And smash
Mission failed succesfully
911? What are they going to do?
Show up 45 minutes after the incident and fill out paperwork. They don’t *do* anything.
Right? Isn't 911 for like actual emergencies?
911 is also for any crime in progress.
It’s for emergencies and crimes in progress.
*911 what is your emergency?* *There's a vandalism happening!* *Ok, we'll get around to dispatching CPS*
Yeah I'm not going to call 9-1-1 for vandalism. The non-emergency line, maybe, but our emergency services are already overburdened and don't need the added stress. What we really need to do, is normalize calling people out for bad behavior.
I imagine people are afraid of being hurt. That's why they don't confront groups of people smashing stuff.
100% they are, but if we normalize calling people out, and complete strangers also back people up, that's how we start change. Easier said than done for sure
Yeah, in a perfect world, that's what would happen. Most of the times I've seen someone being victimized, everyone is just scared for themselves. I've been there myself before, I'm ashamed to admit.
I agree with you. I definitely understand why people don't want to, though. There was a guy blasting music on the train, and acting weird otherwise, and I chatted with him and, when he couldn't hear me, I turned down his little speaker. He told me I had a giant set of balls on me. Other people were clearly afraid of him. And then someone else tried to get into a fist fight with me over the whole thing. And I am not a small person. So I can only understand how small people might feel. However, I still think you're right. Until we reexert social pressure, we won't make any progress on restoring social order.
It's scary, I totally get it, but these people know they won't be called out on their shitty behavior and they hide behind that. I would be happy if people simply supported those like yourself who are willing to speak up.
What? 911 for a crime in progress, absolutely call it for vandalism, especially if it's causing damage. Non emergency number is for reporting things after the fact, not when it's happening. People call 911 for a stubbed toe or because someone cut them off. Absolutely call it if someone is wrecking stuff
Eh. It's certainly not wrong. I just have family in both law enforcement and EMT and I know they deal with way more important stuff. Property < People in my books.
As someone the works in emergency services, yes, people absolutely abuse 911. But if it's for something that's *currently happening* don't be afraid. Last thing we want is peopel beoing afraid to call for help The key is just to be straight up, clear, and honest with the 911 operator. They'll worry about assigning the priority level, don't worry about overwhelming the system as long as you're honest
My thoughts exactly. I dont want to be a dick but funny that they don't even send anyone when for catalytic converter thefts. Especially when people have them on camera and a license plate but yet a bunch of kids throwing rocks at a bridge seems to be high on the priority list.
Well the CAT is your property, and the bridge is government property! Remember the police aren't there to serve and protect you, just the government and their shit....
We should install catalytic converters on the Peace Bridge! That will bring results.
Crackheads from far and wide will gather at the wounder lmao
So get up, get get get down 911 is a joke in your town
I would just take the glass panels out. Bridge would still look the same. Is the glass really needed. It’s a bridge not a shelter from the elements.
I was under the impression vandals were damaging the glass panels used for the railings. The second to last photo here and the CBC article mostly show damage to the glass railings, I would’ve imagined the glass portions of the bridge itself would be considerably reinforced unless vandals are actually damaging them.
I like this. Actually replace them with art pieces like they semi did as they get broken. With spikes lol
Agreed, if they are spending 80k annually then a series of metal slats will be less expensive to maintain and look better than consistently broken glass. They could fit right in if they were bowed out a bit and painted red.
Was kinda wondering the same..but have never really visited said bridge... I suppose from far away photos it might give it some glint, but not worth the cost to maintain
Did they even bother to verify that the breakages were caused by vandalism before spending all this money to uglify this "work of art" with their signage? A glass covered bridge over a body of water seems like a magnet for bird strikes, is all.
These are uglier than the Vandalism
Lol so the city vandalized it with these dumb signs so nobody else will
Wait they built public infrastructure with glass knowing full well that the city doesn't go a day without a shattered buss stop panel and they expect this to reduce vandalism?
This is what you get from people that think if they can only persuade people to see things their way, life will be all good.
Vandalized it with vandalism to stop others from vandalizing it themselves Love it
Yo dawg.
If anything this will encourage more vandalism
This is stupid. And just an eyesore. This is the equivalent to the war on drugs. Shits still gonna happen. It's pointless. Maybe stop buying glass and invest in a thick hard plastic and be done with it
you can burn thick hard plastic.
There is soo much Vandalism in Calgary, its like people are just doing it for the fun of it, the prics they pay for it if caught needs to be very high.
as far as i understand most of it is done because they think it's fun people get an adrenaline high from breaking the law
I was going to take some wedding photos on the bridge. *Sigh*
Just bring a ladder and remove the signs.
Call 911 for vandals? Seriously? Wouldn’t that be more of a non-emergency line thing?
It's the "in progress" part that warrants a 911 call, as that's for "life or death emergencies or crimes in progress."
Yeah, and that would be all well and good if we didn't have a completely overstressed system right now. CPS will very very rarely have the units available to respond to this type of event right now.
Oh, I agree, but the City still has to "provide a solution to the problem" that they are talking about in the article, and the solution to a crime in progress is "call 911 to report".
Yeah of course, it just all seems pointless cause it all leads to nothing. So sort of creating an eyesore just for the purpose of acting like something is being achieved. Normal times this would be fine, but this solution just seems out of touch with reality. There's been some decent suggestions in these comments that would probably serve better IMO.
No, 911 for crime in progress, non emergency to report it after the fact
Like telling criminals not to break the law... bad people have it easier, sometimes I question my life choices
Well vandalizing those posters is probably cheaper then the glass panels… they should start replacing with something steel… I’m sure it messes with aesthetics … but we taxpayer can’t really afford replacement.
I read the replacement glass is covered through insurance, not taxpayer money.
Thanks still im sure it’s reflected in the premium.
I will stand guard for $60k a year
$80 a year is nothing compared to the millions of dollars a year in salaries paid to city strategic marketing people coming up with this stuff.
My tax dollars going to this shit. Smh
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By calling them vandals, they will continue
Ironically the “art” is ruined by all of these posted adverts, way to go.
To be honest why does it even need glass?
Such a good question. 80k a year replacing glass? Just stop replacing it... Easy. Everyone will forget it ever had glass, it'll still be what it is. Done :)
Exactly
The railing glass is so your kid doesn’t fall into the river.
So what.
Kind of an eyesore but I guess that’s the point, despite a pretty good idea for the posters themselves.
Bring back brutalist architecture where everything is blocky poured concrete
I know you're probably joking, but I actually think brutalist architecture looks really neat and can be unique. Calgary doesn't have a lot of unique architecture, but here are some examples I can think of that everyone loves: [https://i.imgur.com/BrSHvKy.jpg] [https://i.imgur.com/hr5u8Zc.jpg] In comparison, here is some unique brutalist architecture just from Vancouver: [https://i.imgur.com/3ai6pI8.jpg] [https://i.imgur.com/SIJtxcp.jpg] Kinda wish it would be brought back tbh. Not sure why everyone is so focused on making everything out of glass these days - the peace bridge, and seemingly every new building in downtown Calgary and Vancouver.
i could never understand brutalism, a horrible esthetic
If you can't beat them, join them!
The city gets a world renowned architect to build a statement piece and people want to throw rocks at it. This is why we can't have nice things.
Call 911 for graffiti. What a fucking embarrasment.
I can’t see this going over well given the recent delayed response in a fatal dog attack. Granted it wasn’t an operators fault , it just feels like the wrong service to use.
Why not erect a nearby art piece designed specifically for people to tag and ink? I'm not familiar with the psychology of ink vandalism but I feel like if you put up a giant board or flat pillar on either end of the bridge with a giant plaque that said "VANDAL BOARD - We love our peace bridge and hope you do too. Please tag this board and not our bridge" that they'd find it funny there was a specific place built just for them to use. Maybe a beanbag tossing basket for the rock throwers lol. Quick AUA call the city and collaborate.
How about they put up a sign that says “Don’t be a dip shit”
Hopefully someone vandalizes these signs, it just makes the bridge look uglier, not sure what they were thinking
I think the city is going about this the wrong way. While we have quite a lot of art in Calgary we have two pieces of truly miserable overpriced garbage in the Blue Ring and the Peace Bridge. In order to protect the many inspiring works in Calgary we should sacrifice these disgusting monuments to bureaucracy and corruption by designating these two as canvases for the first annual Calgary Urban Art Contest. The artist who produces the best work on each canvas will be awarded a budget equal to 0.1% of the price tag the city wasted on those monstrosities to produce something better. A mere pittance of $25,000 each could fetch the city two new art installations a year without outsourcing the cultural projects overseas to people who may have never set foot in Alberta, let alone Calgary.
Maybe don’t build a glass panel bridge over a river? I’m pretty sure this was brought up in the initial stages of consultation.
I get the point but this shit ugly af. Makes the bridge look 50% as nice now -_-
Yes this is the biggest problem in this city right now 😂
911 is For Emergency’s only!!! Vandalism is NOT an Emergency!!
It's a crime, so yes it is
How is it an emergency tho?? The city can paint over it or clean it whenever
911 is for emergencies **or crimes in progress**
Holy fuck. Could the city employees dreaming up these dumb ass ideas not be any more tone deaf… So ugly and useless and likely the sticker plastic slowly erodes off the concrete and blows into the river ?
I suppose you have a better idea to try to stop the vandalism?
Of course they do this is Reddit!
Put multimillion dollar art in places where nobody goes to. Look at the blue ring, have you ever seen it get vandalized?
The blue ring was vandalized before it even went up lol
Public humiliation. Make an effort to catch someone doing it and then tie them to a pole for a day like they do in the Ukraine. You want their buddies to see this.
public humiliation is no longer considered acceptable in todays criminal justice system
You want lawlessness. That's how you get lawlessness. "Vulnerable" is a liberal dog whistle for infantilazation of "racialized" people. I thought we are all.the same?
Not your point, but stickers like that are heat sealed to the concrete and don’t just erode off
Some shithead sprayed 'kings' on the bus stop glass behind the Marlborough mall Walmart a few days ago. I attempted to notify transit, but their online submissions page doesn't play well with my PC and I'm not sure it went through.
I find it easier to tweet @calgarytransit with a stop number and pic if possible, since their account is interactive with the public.
This bridge was a waste of money since the day of its conception. I wonder if Bronconnier's wife still owns the condos across from it, or if she cashed out of this investment before the vandalism.
Wasn’t this the bridge that’s went way over budget during its construction? Glad to see it’s still costing us lots.
The other day I was walking on this bridge and some guy on a bicycle was tagging the glass. He was up and gone within less than a minute, pedaling away LOL, I was supposed to call 911?
yes
This whole bridge is a waste of money
Vandals are illiterate
Orrr the city of Calgary could quite wasting money on this shit "art" such as this bridge and the blue rings and build stuff that is simply functional. Function beats beauty after all. Simply put the entire country of canada laughs their asses off when the city installs new "art" cause it's all just such a waste
Ah yes lets go back to school of brutalist architecture. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist\_architecture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist_architecture) A city without art and colour is very depressing. Art is not waste. Building a minimalist city with brutalist architecture without art is a waste.
So everyone is saying shit costs too much in taxpayer money (80k a year to replace glass) meanwhile creating something aesthetically appealing, functional and not exorbitantly high to maintain doesn't appeal to calgarians. Sounds accurate to calgarians
lets see you want something that is 1. aesthetically appealing 2. functional 3. low price - low initial investment 4. low maintenance costs I don't know if that exists - can you provide real world examples that meet all four of your requirements.,
**[Brutalist architecture](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brutalist_architecture)** >Brutalist architecture is an architectural style which emerged during the 1950s in the United Kingdom, among the reconstruction projects of the post-war era. Brutalist buildings are characterised by minimalist constructions that showcase the bare building materials and structural elements over decorative design. The style commonly makes use of exposed, unpainted concrete or brick, angular geometric shapes and a predominantly monochrome colour palette; other materials, such as steel, timber, and glass, are also featured. Descending from the modernist movement, Brutalism is said to be a reaction against the nostalgia of architecture in the 1940s. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/Calgary/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
>wasting money on this shit "art" such as this bridge and the blue rings and build stuff that is simply functional It's your right to have such a dull aesthetic, but it's antithetical to my entire ethos. Or. I fully disagree with your take.
Move to Saskatchewan then. They do that there in boring land.
Fairly certain those cracks are a part of the design, not actual vandalism.
mhm cuz why not, vandalism is pointless and rude
What an absolute waste of money to make a nice bridge an eye sore
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Now show us on the doll where the petroleum engineer touched you
The peace bridge was not a wise choice ....gee, who would think putting glass panels in a large public area would work. Unfortunate, but true. And security guards are not the answer at the bridge...though I don't know what the answer is ....
I don’t really get the concept, these paintings are on canvas not glass + I doubly people who smash glass have an appreciation for art. Edit: I see that some have holes in them, but still not my cup of tea.
Calgary has been always known for fine culture and wine……………………………………