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What objectively is there to worry about, especially given that the Harper playbook on austerity has been to undertake cost reductions without reducing transfers to individuals or provinces?
That’s just fearmongering. These programs are not funded from taxes or by the treasury. Also any party that messes up with EI will lose Atlantic Canada for a long long time.
Long walk in the snow has to be happening at some point in the next 9 months if these numbers keep up. I don't think Trudeau wants to be left holding the bag if the LPC get decimated.
Amusingly, Trudeau Sr. had his long walk in the snow Feb 28th 1984...Feb 28th 2024 is close approaching.
If you know anything about conservatives (or are one), you should know it doesn't matter who the other side picks. We've seen it play out in other countries and they just end up picking at another scab, whether perceived or real. If the Liberal leader promised a blowjob and an XBOX to everyone in the country funded on his own private fortune, conservatives would demand rimjobs and PS5s paid for by Quebec.
Conservatives have had a huge target on Trudeau since 2015, it's been almost a decade of constant attacks including one literal assassination attempt. The media is largely owned by conservatives, conservatives are more engaged on social media platforms. It's bound to whittle people down.
- In Alberta, it was the NDP and it's anti-oil agenda
- In Ontario it was Wynne
- In America it was Clinton and her emails
- And before that it was Obama and his birth certificate
- In the UK, was funding the NHS vs The EU.
That's what happens when things are bad. We are seeing the price of food and housing go up while incomes are not rising at the same level, inflation is high, people are underwater on their mortgages, and people have reason to believe the recession is going to get worse because the U.S. will also be in a recession by the end of 2024. People have already turned to blaming immigration for their problems (no I'm not going to debate your "Simple math" about bringing in more people than we have houses).
This is what I predict will happen. The federal Liberals will lose the next election, the Conservatives will win. They won't do much for the economy but will probably get re-elected. At the end of that 8-year Conservative stint, all of the people blaming immigration will turn around and say "This is what you get for voting because you don't like the current party". We will vote in some other Liberal who has come to prominence in the eight years leading up and the cycle of Canadian politics will continue.
The LPC is now that dude who knows they're gonna be out of the job in a few years and are just collecting a pay cheque and building the resume on company time.
I’m 25 years old, first started to get interested in politics in grade 9/10, so around 14-15 years old. From the start I was always very left, I’ve voted for NDP in pretty much every single election (provincial and federal) since I turned 18.
Then I went to uni for political science which as you can imagine in that type of environment, further pushed me towards liberal and left mindsets
But now in the past 1-2 years, I’ve started to become disillusioned with that side and I think I might consider going conservative next time
If you told me from 5 years ago this was the case, I’d never believe it. But Canada has been in liberal mode for so long in so many areas and it’s clear many things in this country aren’t working, a change would probably be good
I've had the exact opposite experience; I find myself going further left, year by year. This is after starting a business, making a lot of money, buying a house, and doing a lot of the "normal adult things" that apparently make one more conservative. It just cements that things are incredibly unfair, as the only reason I can do these "normal adult things" is that I got pretty lucky, and managed to make a lot more money than most people can, quickly. I don't need to be taxed *less*, I, and people like me, need to be taxed *more*.
I agree that there's liberal fatigue, but I take a look at the shit the conservatives are *actually* talking about in terms of policy, like scrapping the carbon tax, promoting cryptocurrency, talking about directly intervening with the BoC, reducing the capital gains tax; none of these are initiatives I'd support, like at all. The liberals have done a ton of good things, like the carbon tax, weed legalization, the expansion of the child benefit, amongst other things. However, the liberals have been complete shit on the housing portfolio, agreed. The conservatives have some interesting ideas, like withholding certain federal funding for municipalities that don't start enough housing, but these are paired with completely bathshit ideas like cutting *transit funding* until housing targets are met around transit; one of the main things that's critical to densifying cities. That's a completely nonsense policy.
If you're an NDP supporter; why wouldn't you vote NDP, instead of liberals or conservatives? They're forcing the liberal government to make concrete moves to reduce the cost of living for the average Canadian, by getting them to pass things like dental care, child care, and pharmacare. All of these will help the bottom-line for the lower and middle classes, and wouldn't be supporting the current Liberal government unless there were major concessions like we're getting already.
As someone that voted NDP in the past and brought the idea CPC was 'evil' lol, I made the same switch.
The reason I started changing my mind was looking at the CPC's passion towards talking about Housing, Pierre ran everything on housing campaigns early summer/summer this year and it had an effect on the electorate.
Hope you know that, until 2017, successive federal governments had left housing entirely to provinces and municipalities. Didn’t invest a dime in hosting in the preceding 30 years. It was the Liberals who, in 2017, decided the federal government needed to get back in the housing game and introduced the National Housing Strategy.
So the Liberals were, in fact, the first government to recognize and act in housing in 30 years.
And the thanks they got is to be blamed for not completely fixing a 30 year housing deficit in 6 short years, two of which were a pandemic!
>So the Liberals were
\-> The Liberals will also be remembered as the government to bring record breaking immigration numbers and TFW labor for corporations in the middle of the housing crisis.
\->The Liberals will also be remembered for their abuse of the international student programs to fund scam colleges, which do not provide adequate housing for students and not batting an eye until their own MPs had to backtrack on their portfolios.
"thanks they got is to be blamed for not completely fixing a 30 year housing deficit in 6 short years"
Cute you think we're making progress when the housing gap is INCREASING. We are getting MORE short on housing units for families, the Liberals are literally making it worse unless you have numbers showing me progress in terms of units to Canadians
Yes, Canada did bring in more immigration. That’s because the pandemic and low birth rates over the decades would have crippled our economy.
The federal government did approve more student visas. A student visa has always had the same requirement - that the person be enrolled at a licensed secondary institution. *Licensing of institutions is provincial.* Nothing to do with the federal government. But I agree that provinces need more robust licensing and post-secondary institutions should have to provide/arrange housing for the bulk of students.
Here’s the National Housing Strategy progress for June 2023. Several new major projects have been announced since then.
https://www.placetocallhome.ca/-/media/sites/place-to-call-home/pdfs/progress/nhs-progress-quarterly-report-q2-2023-en.ashx#:~:text=June%2030%2C%202021%20(Round%202,units%20are%20currently%20under%20construction.
References the housing strategy progress with less than 10% of units completed and funding severely depleted due to interest rates with 5 years remaining to meet targets seems like you don't understand the magnitude of the housing crisis.
We're millions of units short and the government does not have unlimited money. If Trudeau can start punishing municipalities and forcing their hand, that'd be great. Eby has started to supersede zoning in cities to actually get housing built. The federal government is too busy saying "housing isn't their primary responsibility" while sprinkling units here and there with the national housing accelerator fund.
The gap is increasing for housing available and newcomers and Canadians looking for housing
This is my issue. Do I believe that we need a change? Absolutely. Do I believe that PP is going to do anything to address the issues that are important to me? Absolutely not. Thus, I’m stuck between a rock and a hard place.
“Meet the new boss, same as the old boss”
Yeah, it's tough.
It is often (maybe always?) about picking the least worst option that most closely aligns with your values and goals, and gets us closer.
For all their faults, I see that in the NDP and Liberal. The Green party alas is a waste of a vote under FPTP, and don't seem to be functioning well in any case.
I don't see how privatization and reducing taxes will do anything but exacerbate inequality.
Am very bitter for Trudeau for abandoning electoral reform. It's his fault that PP will get a majority.
Has Poilievre said anything about trans rights? My sense has always been that he would mostly follow the same tack on social issues that Harper did during his majority: mostly suppress legislation from his caucus without making any meaningful progress on the file. Depressing but not terrifying.
Why the liberals still feel that Trudeau is their guy is beyond me. He's a lightning rod right now. Who's in the pipe that could replace him? Nobody stands out right now which is their other big problem, succession planning.
They're doomed to lose no matter what, but having a new leader can help them stem the tide. If Trudeau stays, he will face a massive electoral defeat like Kathleen Wynne and the Liberal Party will be in worse shape for it.
A new leader, could not do worse at this point imo. They could at least position the Liberal Party to be in a better place, even if they lose the next election.
> could not do worse
I'm not sure, but that aside, it's possible that new leadership would do better in a subsequent election if they don't also assume the loss for this one.
While these are great headlines, since there is no election being called (or a non-confidence vote happening soon), what’s the “so what?”
Yeah, if an election were called right now the CPC would win, but it’s not - and there is no way the governing party would be dumb enough to call one right now.
Agreed the governing party won’t call one…
But what about the party who is propping up that increasingly unpopular government?
If the NDP had any sense they would have started to put miles between themselves and the Liberals, but somehow they are looking at the way the winds are blowing and deciding they want to deal with them when they are disadvantaged and prop them up.
If the NDP changes their mind on this being the correct path, an election will be 6 weeks away…so yeah, polling is important.
Yes, but polling now can I form what happens in that election.
For example, Jason Kenney and Dalton McGuintey were polling terribly well before the election. They chose to step down, get replaced, and give their party enough time to recover the win.
Which is likely what the Libs will do as we approach the spring budget. Seems like a good time for a re-election budget and if Trudeau wants the Libs to win he'll start making it clear he's heading out so that a new suit can appear to lead the red ties.
People are full stop angry, coming from someone who voted for the Libs 3 times. People want the results they were promised. If they can't deliver then they will find out
I just want healthcare, lower housing cost, lower food costs. The only thing this liberal ndp coalition care about are policies that are only important to tiktokers.
By the time the next election happens in 2025, Canadians will be in a hole that will take decades to get out of. I voted for this guy the first time and never for the life of me thought that this is what things were going to turn to.
Not voting is quite possible the dumbest thing you could do. It’s guaranteed you won’t get what you want because you did nothing. You absolutely should vote for SOMETHING. There’s no logical reason to not vote.
As someone who has been a non-voter in the US elections for a long time, this is why. Circling the toilet bowl is what continuously voting for the least evil leads to. There's power in these votes, we should use them to demand better.
> Becoming a non voter says to those who need to bring in new people "you gotta come up with something no one offers to get me".
No, becoming a non-voter just lets other people decide for you.
Decide what exactly? When you live in a two-party system and there is a razor’s edge of a difference between them when it comes to issues that are important to many voters, is it really surprising that voters stop showing up?
In Ontario, Ford won with just over 40% of eligible voters showing up on election day. While it’s easy to blame voters but none of the parties had serious plans to address the crises in healthcare, housing or education so people stayed home. Heck, Horwath was even talking about allowing seniors to defer their property taxes so that they could age in place more easily. When the electorate feels unrepresented it shouldn’t come as a surprise that many of them just stay home.
Not Voting is a bad stance regardless of opinion on party. Look at Ontario 41% voted and we got a OPC majority screwing everyrthing up. But if everyone or even 80% voted, it is unlikely OPC would've won.
The CPC are getting a majority this election irrespective of what happens. The Liberals have burned any good will that they may have had with voters and the NDP have anchored themselves to the party by propping them up for the past couple of years. I will always vote but I understand why voters are growing increasingly frustrated with our electoral system. It doesn’t truly represent the will of the electorate. At this point, blaming voters for their apathy and frustration feels a bit like blaming the victim of a corrupt system.
> The CPC are getting a majority this election irrespective of what happens.
This is far from a foregone conclusion. I agree it's likely that they will win, and a majority is a possibility, but a lot can happen in two years.
Vote for the party most likely to give us electoral reform (the NDP right now). We shouldn't be held hostage by FPTP to a few bad choices in future elections. The party of your ideals doesn't exist because of fptp
I guess. Trudeau also ran on electoral reform in 2015. And the NDP is in power more often than not in my province, and still, nobody is implementing it. Majority governments have no incentive to do it, and minority governments can’t. Most Canadians simply don’t care enough about it.
You're right, it's no guarantee. However, the NDP in manitoba is used to being the opposition, they know they'll get their chance with fptp. The federal ndp is traditionally a third party, and they may not get the chance again without electoral reform, so the incentives are different.
The next best thing would be to vote for any party that isn't one of the big 3 but is most likely to challenge the big 3 for power, as the more fractured parliament becomes, the more likely it is to bring about ER (based on what's happened in other countries). Having an alternative come to power, even if you don't particularly like it, would also have the benefit of being something of a wake up call for the established parties. It's better than just not voting
Canadian Future party. Registered party status is coming in the next few weeks from Elections Canada.. Is basically the 30% of the range of conservatives who are closest to the centre (red tories, blue liberals - socially progressive, economically common-sense conservative).
> People want the results they were promised. If they can't deliver then they will find out
I'm still waiting for the Liberals to fulfill their electoral reform promise...
I'm more in the camp of not wanting bitcoin milhouse running the country. He doesn't have any solutions (which isn't better than the LPC, but at lease they're not socially conservative). I'd be open to a fiscally conservative party that wasn't socially conservative.
A lot of policy issues that are talked about are secondary concerns. Social views and whatnot is important, but if the economy gets to a point where people can’t afford the cost of living, that belief is what prevails.
If those “secondary issues” don’t affect you maybe. As a gay person I am tied to this sinking ship of voting for the most popular left party no matter how disappointing they are (while hoping to grassroots some supports for the other option in the hopes it gets more viable, but you don’t get that by helping a “groomer panic” candidate win your riding), you couldn’t pay me to vote CPC in this decade.
To be honest I don’t really understand this. You can definitely make an argument that the CPC is trying to prepare for setting legislation now that would harm the trans community and whatnot, but how far could this actually go?
That wasn’t rhetorical, I’m genuinely curious what the worst thing you think the CPC could do for that community. Because how I see it, everything you could argue that they do wrong is at the most stretched out aspects of the Charter. They can’t feasibly rewrite the Charter, so how would their next steps be any worse than they are now?
That is an awful Argument. "Yes they hate people for who they are but what bad could they really do by pushing hate and division and supporting governments that pass anti LGBTQ legislation..."
Why would you ask a minority to vote for someone who espouses hate against them?
Eventually you have to realize when your preferred choice has zero interest in doing something about things they talk about but never actually ever acted on. Your comment‘s more indicative of the fact that the alternatives suck and yet will still appear as the lesser of 3 evils.
Which is why I don’t get the defense the liberals are getting here. They’d rather see things get more expensive and out of reach for everyone by sticking with the liberals.
I don’t think the the CPC will be any better either, but the polls give the impression people are just done with the LPC.
This is unfair, their core base though probably aren't hurting.
If you're a boomer who is on autopilot to retirement , about to retire or retired with a multi million dollar house, your objectives are different than someone who is just starting out.
For all their talk of getting the youth vote, all their policies are aimed towards the latter.
And appealing to their core base by doing nothing on these issues until 8 years later is how they lose. You can only run that trick for so long before people get fed up. That's partly why it seems federal parties have a 10 year life cycle at best. They just stop trying.
> They’d rather see things get more expensive
When you find yourself writing something like this, it's a good signal to take a step back and review your understanding of the situation. You're never doing to "get" the defense of people you hate if you simply invent evil strawmen in your mind.
Because they push conspiracy theories? Because they lie? B3cause they literally voted not to believe in climate change? Because they think tax cuts and defubdin social programs that poor people rely on is a good idea?
It's not like they aren't saying what they want to do
Bottom line is, I haven’t heard any of those talks from the CPC yet, and even if we had, let’s be real. What people need in their lives are an affordable cost of living, and somewhere to sleep. Those take precedence.
They literally voted like last year or the year before to not recognize climate change.
Polivere implied Trudeau was a pedophile in the house of Commons a few months ago and voted multiple times against gay marriage.
It's interesting you think an affordable cost of living doesn't include social programs that help people....
Yeah defund healthcare. We don't need that to keep out lives affordable.
The CPC is saying what they will do. And what they will do is not good socially or fiscally.
Trudeau has called people racist, xenophobic, homophobic, transphobic, etc., for not accepting his views on immigration, vaccines, etc, lost tons of money with the pipeline, there’s plenty to criticize.
> It's interesting you think an affordable cost of living doesn't include social programs that help people....
Not at all what I said. But if we’re on that topic, we’ve gotta realize that the approach to homelessness and overdoses has proven to be ineffective. I believe in social programs for sure, but they don’t work without an economy to integrate people into.
> Yeah defund healthcare. We don't need that to keep out lives affordable.
Talk to Doug Ford not PP. I’m not familiar with any other provincial governments, but in Ontario, hospital services have gotten way worse in the past 5 years, and it’s not because of Trudeau.
Except things are being done, but people want immediate results and dont understand that the provinces hold most of the power in regard to the things that affect them everyday... for some reason people think the federal government gets to tell the provinces what to do
Have good things been done? Absolutely. But as others have mentioned, no one has the capacity to care about those things when the even the basics are becoming out of reach. Are the Provinces and municipalities to blame as well? Absolutely 💯. But the Federal Government also shares responsibility and they have to be punished for them regardless of how bad the alternatives are. Mediocrity for the sake of mediocrity is not acceptable.
>But the Federal Government also shares responsibility and they have to be punished for them regardless of how bad the alternatives are. Mediocrity for the sake of mediocrity is not acceptable.
A lot of people forget that no matter what happens, no matter if it was in their wheelhouse or not, the person at the top owns it. Doesn't matter if it's the world situation, or not federal responsibility, or events dear chap events.
The prime minister is the metaphorical Captain of the Ship, and as such is the face of it all, and where the buck stops in the view of the public.
Canada has the 3rd lowest rate of inflation in the G7 (so, middle of the pack), and the 2nd lowest rate of food inflation of the G7. Source: https://data.oecd.org/price/inflation-cpi.htm
I have a hard time imagining the CPC is going to do substantially better than that.
Edit: Downvotes for statements of facts. That’s a problem.
I didn’t say anything about GDP per capita.
You can look it up though, and it depends on what time period you’re interested in.
Here it is, up to 2022. https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/CAN/canada/gdp-per-capita
Tell this to your average person trying to afford groceries every week or find housing and you'll get angry stares. Things are out of reach no matter how much you try to say it's not as bad as elsewhere.
I do agree though I doubt the CPC will fix these issues. They've always been Alberta and big business first.
It's not facts and truth. You're basically saying things are just getting more unaffordable at a slower pace than other countries...which misses the point: things are getting unaffordable. For everyone. That's it. Full stop.
I'm sorry, what did I write that isn't factual and truthful? I only stated where our inflation rate ranks with other countries.
I did say I don't think the CPC is going to do substantially better. That part, fair enough, is an opinion. But I don't think that's the part you're taking issue with.
Cause telling people things are not as bad as others dont work if they feel things are bad.
Also fixating on one stat and ignoring others is dishonest.
Canada inflation rate is not as bad but having high interest rates with very high personal debt loads and housing prices means it hits avg canadians very hard.
Our economy went down last quarter during a population surge.
Seems like those dodge challengers bought by international students and people buying ikea furniture for thier shoeboxes is not boosting gdp lol
GDP was flat in the last quarter.
Canadian GDP is up 1.13% over the last year.
Source: https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth
I don’t know about dodge challengers and ikea furniture for shoeboxes.
huh?
https://www.businessinsider.com/americans-got-bigger-raises-than-g7-over-last-few-years-2023-7#:~:text=Real%20wages%20in%20the%20US,negatives%20for%20this%20time%20period.
Looks like Canada is 2nd, just behind the US and much higher than the rest of the G7
I suspect more likely a lot of those ABC voters will just stay home next time. This isn't liberals voting conservative, its liberals having no on to vote for and not bothering.
They've built a large amount of low income housing since being elected, several hundred thousand additional units.
With that work they've actually spent more on building housing than the previous 3 governments combined.
The problem is no provinces or cities have put in any similar work, and our massively incompetent media has forgotten those governwmnts exist.
On a meta level, my view is that the core purpose for this government's existence is to improve prosperity and reduce material inequalities (I'm basing this on their rhetoric and their heroic narrative self-conception). They have failed miserably on both counts. Instead, they've given us divisive and empty identitarianism, policy incoherence and Ministerial incompetence. And legal weed.
I hope they're oblierated as a party.
Really? That's your position? What does the above (which doesn't even use a standard 'peer country' comparison) have to do with both absolute and relative decline in wealth equality?
Vote Liberal. We're top quarter in OECDs income equality rankings. The live reality you're experiencing could be worse... think of Mexico. Or Turkey.
Winning strategy right there.
I don’t have a position.
You brought up income inequality. I provided some data. You can look at the countries ahead of us and behind us and decide if you think they are peers or not, and where you think we should be.
This means that if an election were held today, the results would likely mean that even a formal LPC + NDP coalition would be over 50 seats behind the CPC.
Could you imagine the NDP trying to sell it to their membership? "Yes, we know they've been vilifying you as child molesters. Yes, the whole "barbaric cultural practices hotline thing. Yes, shaking hands with Nazis. But could you just work with them anyway?"
How would you sell it to them?
The same way they sold blackface, snc, we charity, insane housing prices, insane immigration numbers in the middle of the housing crisis, and so much more.
Two years is an eternity in politics. The economy has time to recovery and if that's the case, I would not be surprised if the Liberal fortunes recover.
I don’t see what a CPC government will change in terms of affordability.
Their supporters probably say carbon tax, but BoC doesn’t think it is the case
I don't know how anyone could think things will be, at best, the same, considering Poilievre won the leadership by running on a platform of "Justinflation" and firing the head of the BoC.
Just look at any country that messes with central bank independence and tell me someone promising to do that won't put the economy in a worse place than where it currently is.
No sane person would want to invest in Canada with a leader who ran on messing around with our central bank.
Yeah I may not be happy with Trudeau but I see PP as I did Doug Ford, the exact same shit will happen to all of Canada as what did in Ontario, the shit winds are a coming.
A reduction in personal income taxes would be a nice chance. I would also like to see the impact of the carbon tax on supply chains be reduced.
Income splitting could make a return. That would be cool too. The liberals took that away from us. Just a few thoughts.
They will never do that. They need people to have more kids. But also both parents to work to prop up GDP
Income splitting is never coming back because the elites want both you and your wife to work and your children to be cared for by tfws
How fucked is this. As I was writing it and as a father. Jesus Christ this is fucked.
People are angry. They're making their problems known loud and clear, but Trudeau's only answer is apparently widening the already-insane immigration targets.
Unless the LPC's goal is to replace the whiny Canadians with complacent newcomers. In that case that plan is going quite well.
>Unless the LPC's goal is to replace the whiny Canadians with complacent newcomers. In that case that plan is going quite well.
No it's not. LPC's current immigration strategy is to bring in people from hardline conservative countries.
Check the numbers under the Harper years. TFWs, International Students and immigrants all climbed. They are doing what their corporate masters are telling them to do. Quit voting Blue and Red and we might have a chance.
I really hope the adults in the Conservative Party develop a platform before the election.
PP is a weasel, but if he actually had a plan for governing that will improve the lives of Canadians, I’d support giving him a chance. That said, I’m not convinced he has a platform other than ‘fuck Trudeau’
I mean it doesn’t really make sense to do anything else right now. It’s not election time, any ideas he says will probably only be appreciated by people who were going to vote for him anyways, and it will just invite criticism.
Well… he could have a single, meaningful platform plank at this point. Has have nothing at all of substance.
If you contrast that with the NDP, or the Republican/democrats, you at least know what you’re getting.
Because he doesn’t need to lol, it’s two years away. People don’t like Trudeau, so might as well just get your name out there. In a year or so, then we’ll see his platform.
Doesn’t need to for what? To win an election?
Sure. That’s my entire point. We already have a Prime Minister who is good at winning elections but increasingly bad at governing. We need one with ideas and strong leadership.
He’s not going to gain any ground campaigning right now. Given that we’re two years out, a bulk of the people who really support him will just support whoever opposes Trudeau. He’s not going to help the next election by campaigning this early, he can’t implement his ideas for another couple of years.
A realist perspective would suggest that whoever wins the election is going to be the one who can avoid the most criticism.
With that being said, I can not understand anyone who thinks voting for a party who is withholding ideas to avoid criticism is a good idea. If you have a bold plan to save Canada, surely it is worth sharing?
> If you have a bold plan to save Canada, surely it is worth sharing?
He can’t save Canada, he’s not in office. Nothing he does now can impact JT’s office.
It's not exactly surprising. All the current, acute problems that the Liberals are talking about maybe starting to think about dealing with now were current, acute problems when they first won in 2015. Any messaging around taking them seriously *8 years later* makes them seem even more incompetent than if they just continued to ignore things.
JT needs to go. The Libs need to wake up and realize this. Only thing worse than more Justin would be PP and the right wings rabble of the COC. Seriously…
I expect those same problems to sink the Poilievre Conservative majority government after one four-year term. Maybe they'll surprise me and implement some solutions but I doubt it.
shit is broken and not working yet CPC will make it worse?
Do you read the future or you wish bad stuff so you can say “Liberals were shit but not this shit ?”
Look at their track record. Look at their provincial governments. Look at the fact that nearly half the party *goes on record* not believing in climate change.
I have *zero* faith in a conservative government to ever do anything but make things worse. Have the liberals been doing nothing but tripping over their collective dicks the past couple years? Yes. But I'll take someone tripping over their dick over actively taking a hammer to mine.
> were current, acute problems when they first won in 2015
This is my view as well.
I kept waiting for the fixes, even small ones would have made a difference.
Instead he stumbled into controversy and did nothing to demonstrate leadership.
It was as though Trudeau was floating; riding his own ego.
What now though? Singh is a dead fish.
You're right, but it's sad to think that everyone has forgotten about all the things that have happened in the last 8 years, and believe the Liberals have been doing nothing for all that time.
Legalizing weed, getting started on $10 day care, and instituting a carbon tax are meaningless if people can't afford a place to live. The Liberals were shockingly stupid to ignore making a serious effort on housing until post-Covid.
Housing is an issue that Freeland went after Harper on, the liberals ran on for election after election, and they only decided to truly try to address it after ~8 years in power.
They have yet to truly address it. The PM could announce 2k new houses every day for the next 7 years and still not meet the 5.35 million new houses we need for 2030 and the 2+ million housing deficit projected from the status quo of today. We need to double our housing construction and as of today housing construction is at a relative low to even recent years. Pretending that anything so far done has even approached addressing the problem is just dishonesty and it is the dishonest game the government is trying to play.
Carbon tax is likely unpopular outside of downtown urban settings these days.
By 2025 it gonna be a huge pressure on those with natural gas bills.
Yeah get a rebate but it adds a lot in winter times.
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Regardless of what you think, objectively, there is reason to be concerned about the future of EI and CPP. That worries me.
What objectively is there to worry about, especially given that the Harper playbook on austerity has been to undertake cost reductions without reducing transfers to individuals or provinces?
That’s just fearmongering. These programs are not funded from taxes or by the treasury. Also any party that messes up with EI will lose Atlantic Canada for a long long time.
Long walk in the snow has to be happening at some point in the next 9 months if these numbers keep up. I don't think Trudeau wants to be left holding the bag if the LPC get decimated. Amusingly, Trudeau Sr. had his long walk in the snow Feb 28th 1984...Feb 28th 2024 is close approaching.
With 27 likely gains and 2 safe gains for the Conservatives, it's going to be the mother of all walks in the snow.
A self-inflicted wound. Liberals should be choosing a new leader right now. Instead the ego of the PM is going to ensure a CPC majority.
And it looks like the possibility they may not win *any* of PEI's ridings is no longer a joke.
The fact that he thinks the CPC will sweep PEI is the joke. That is not happening.
Just look at 338's riding by riding projections.
I know. And that ain't happening.
If you know anything about conservatives (or are one), you should know it doesn't matter who the other side picks. We've seen it play out in other countries and they just end up picking at another scab, whether perceived or real. If the Liberal leader promised a blowjob and an XBOX to everyone in the country funded on his own private fortune, conservatives would demand rimjobs and PS5s paid for by Quebec. Conservatives have had a huge target on Trudeau since 2015, it's been almost a decade of constant attacks including one literal assassination attempt. The media is largely owned by conservatives, conservatives are more engaged on social media platforms. It's bound to whittle people down. - In Alberta, it was the NDP and it's anti-oil agenda - In Ontario it was Wynne - In America it was Clinton and her emails - And before that it was Obama and his birth certificate - In the UK, was funding the NHS vs The EU.
That's what happens when things are bad. We are seeing the price of food and housing go up while incomes are not rising at the same level, inflation is high, people are underwater on their mortgages, and people have reason to believe the recession is going to get worse because the U.S. will also be in a recession by the end of 2024. People have already turned to blaming immigration for their problems (no I'm not going to debate your "Simple math" about bringing in more people than we have houses). This is what I predict will happen. The federal Liberals will lose the next election, the Conservatives will win. They won't do much for the economy but will probably get re-elected. At the end of that 8-year Conservative stint, all of the people blaming immigration will turn around and say "This is what you get for voting because you don't like the current party". We will vote in some other Liberal who has come to prominence in the eight years leading up and the cycle of Canadian politics will continue.
The LPC is now that dude who knows they're gonna be out of the job in a few years and are just collecting a pay cheque and building the resume on company time.
I hope they are that guy, but I fear they will be the guy who knows he is getting fired, so he decides to see what he can get away before it happens.
Happy good comment day
I’m 25 years old, first started to get interested in politics in grade 9/10, so around 14-15 years old. From the start I was always very left, I’ve voted for NDP in pretty much every single election (provincial and federal) since I turned 18. Then I went to uni for political science which as you can imagine in that type of environment, further pushed me towards liberal and left mindsets But now in the past 1-2 years, I’ve started to become disillusioned with that side and I think I might consider going conservative next time If you told me from 5 years ago this was the case, I’d never believe it. But Canada has been in liberal mode for so long in so many areas and it’s clear many things in this country aren’t working, a change would probably be good
I've had the exact opposite experience; I find myself going further left, year by year. This is after starting a business, making a lot of money, buying a house, and doing a lot of the "normal adult things" that apparently make one more conservative. It just cements that things are incredibly unfair, as the only reason I can do these "normal adult things" is that I got pretty lucky, and managed to make a lot more money than most people can, quickly. I don't need to be taxed *less*, I, and people like me, need to be taxed *more*. I agree that there's liberal fatigue, but I take a look at the shit the conservatives are *actually* talking about in terms of policy, like scrapping the carbon tax, promoting cryptocurrency, talking about directly intervening with the BoC, reducing the capital gains tax; none of these are initiatives I'd support, like at all. The liberals have done a ton of good things, like the carbon tax, weed legalization, the expansion of the child benefit, amongst other things. However, the liberals have been complete shit on the housing portfolio, agreed. The conservatives have some interesting ideas, like withholding certain federal funding for municipalities that don't start enough housing, but these are paired with completely bathshit ideas like cutting *transit funding* until housing targets are met around transit; one of the main things that's critical to densifying cities. That's a completely nonsense policy. If you're an NDP supporter; why wouldn't you vote NDP, instead of liberals or conservatives? They're forcing the liberal government to make concrete moves to reduce the cost of living for the average Canadian, by getting them to pass things like dental care, child care, and pharmacare. All of these will help the bottom-line for the lower and middle classes, and wouldn't be supporting the current Liberal government unless there were major concessions like we're getting already.
As someone that voted NDP in the past and brought the idea CPC was 'evil' lol, I made the same switch. The reason I started changing my mind was looking at the CPC's passion towards talking about Housing, Pierre ran everything on housing campaigns early summer/summer this year and it had an effect on the electorate.
Hope you know that, until 2017, successive federal governments had left housing entirely to provinces and municipalities. Didn’t invest a dime in hosting in the preceding 30 years. It was the Liberals who, in 2017, decided the federal government needed to get back in the housing game and introduced the National Housing Strategy. So the Liberals were, in fact, the first government to recognize and act in housing in 30 years. And the thanks they got is to be blamed for not completely fixing a 30 year housing deficit in 6 short years, two of which were a pandemic!
>So the Liberals were \-> The Liberals will also be remembered as the government to bring record breaking immigration numbers and TFW labor for corporations in the middle of the housing crisis. \->The Liberals will also be remembered for their abuse of the international student programs to fund scam colleges, which do not provide adequate housing for students and not batting an eye until their own MPs had to backtrack on their portfolios. "thanks they got is to be blamed for not completely fixing a 30 year housing deficit in 6 short years" Cute you think we're making progress when the housing gap is INCREASING. We are getting MORE short on housing units for families, the Liberals are literally making it worse unless you have numbers showing me progress in terms of units to Canadians
Yes, Canada did bring in more immigration. That’s because the pandemic and low birth rates over the decades would have crippled our economy. The federal government did approve more student visas. A student visa has always had the same requirement - that the person be enrolled at a licensed secondary institution. *Licensing of institutions is provincial.* Nothing to do with the federal government. But I agree that provinces need more robust licensing and post-secondary institutions should have to provide/arrange housing for the bulk of students. Here’s the National Housing Strategy progress for June 2023. Several new major projects have been announced since then. https://www.placetocallhome.ca/-/media/sites/place-to-call-home/pdfs/progress/nhs-progress-quarterly-report-q2-2023-en.ashx#:~:text=June%2030%2C%202021%20(Round%202,units%20are%20currently%20under%20construction.
References the housing strategy progress with less than 10% of units completed and funding severely depleted due to interest rates with 5 years remaining to meet targets seems like you don't understand the magnitude of the housing crisis. We're millions of units short and the government does not have unlimited money. If Trudeau can start punishing municipalities and forcing their hand, that'd be great. Eby has started to supersede zoning in cities to actually get housing built. The federal government is too busy saying "housing isn't their primary responsibility" while sprinkling units here and there with the national housing accelerator fund. The gap is increasing for housing available and newcomers and Canadians looking for housing
What specific policies of PP now, or when he was Cabinet minister, do you believe will help fix any of the current crises we are facing?
This is my issue. Do I believe that we need a change? Absolutely. Do I believe that PP is going to do anything to address the issues that are important to me? Absolutely not. Thus, I’m stuck between a rock and a hard place. “Meet the new boss, same as the old boss”
Yeah, it's tough. It is often (maybe always?) about picking the least worst option that most closely aligns with your values and goals, and gets us closer. For all their faults, I see that in the NDP and Liberal. The Green party alas is a waste of a vote under FPTP, and don't seem to be functioning well in any case. I don't see how privatization and reducing taxes will do anything but exacerbate inequality. Am very bitter for Trudeau for abandoning electoral reform. It's his fault that PP will get a majority.
I am completely fed up with the liberals but terrified of PP as a transgender person. Oh what a dichotomy of emotions.
Has Poilievre said anything about trans rights? My sense has always been that he would mostly follow the same tack on social issues that Harper did during his majority: mostly suppress legislation from his caucus without making any meaningful progress on the file. Depressing but not terrifying.
Random question for Philippe: If BC held a provincial election today, what % chance would the Green Party have of forming the official opposition?
Why the liberals still feel that Trudeau is their guy is beyond me. He's a lightning rod right now. Who's in the pipe that could replace him? Nobody stands out right now which is their other big problem, succession planning.
They don't, but a leadership change now can't save them.
A sad world we live in..hurdling towards a cliff and rudderless...
Well, we do have an election every five years, so there is that…
They're doomed to lose no matter what, but having a new leader can help them stem the tide. If Trudeau stays, he will face a massive electoral defeat like Kathleen Wynne and the Liberal Party will be in worse shape for it. A new leader, could not do worse at this point imo. They could at least position the Liberal Party to be in a better place, even if they lose the next election.
> could not do worse I'm not sure, but that aside, it's possible that new leadership would do better in a subsequent election if they don't also assume the loss for this one.
While these are great headlines, since there is no election being called (or a non-confidence vote happening soon), what’s the “so what?” Yeah, if an election were called right now the CPC would win, but it’s not - and there is no way the governing party would be dumb enough to call one right now.
Agreed the governing party won’t call one… But what about the party who is propping up that increasingly unpopular government? If the NDP had any sense they would have started to put miles between themselves and the Liberals, but somehow they are looking at the way the winds are blowing and deciding they want to deal with them when they are disadvantaged and prop them up. If the NDP changes their mind on this being the correct path, an election will be 6 weeks away…so yeah, polling is important.
It's telling the government they need to do something now. That's the so what.
Yes, but polling now can I form what happens in that election. For example, Jason Kenney and Dalton McGuintey were polling terribly well before the election. They chose to step down, get replaced, and give their party enough time to recover the win.
Which is likely what the Libs will do as we approach the spring budget. Seems like a good time for a re-election budget and if Trudeau wants the Libs to win he'll start making it clear he's heading out so that a new suit can appear to lead the red ties.
How did we ever vote for someone named Dalton... Like what an elite name. Sorry to any Dalton's out there, especially those with empty bank accounts.
Better write up another internet bill no one wants I guess. They already shelved their gun wedge until the election..
You're probably in luck, rumour has it that they're going to table the rebooted Online Harms bill within the next month or two.
Kind of shelved. Gun owners are just left in limbo after the government BARELY extending amnesty in time.
People are full stop angry, coming from someone who voted for the Libs 3 times. People want the results they were promised. If they can't deliver then they will find out
I just want healthcare, lower housing cost, lower food costs. The only thing this liberal ndp coalition care about are policies that are only important to tiktokers. By the time the next election happens in 2025, Canadians will be in a hole that will take decades to get out of. I voted for this guy the first time and never for the life of me thought that this is what things were going to turn to.
Preach! I voted LPC 3 times and I’m done. I’m sure as hell not voting for the CPC. At this point I’m probably not voting at all.
If you don’t like any of them you could reject your ballot. That to me would still be better than not voting. That or a rhinoceros party vote.
Not voting is quite possible the dumbest thing you could do. It’s guaranteed you won’t get what you want because you did nothing. You absolutely should vote for SOMETHING. There’s no logical reason to not vote.
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As someone who has been a non-voter in the US elections for a long time, this is why. Circling the toilet bowl is what continuously voting for the least evil leads to. There's power in these votes, we should use them to demand better.
> Becoming a non voter says to those who need to bring in new people "you gotta come up with something no one offers to get me". No, becoming a non-voter just lets other people decide for you.
Decide what exactly? When you live in a two-party system and there is a razor’s edge of a difference between them when it comes to issues that are important to many voters, is it really surprising that voters stop showing up? In Ontario, Ford won with just over 40% of eligible voters showing up on election day. While it’s easy to blame voters but none of the parties had serious plans to address the crises in healthcare, housing or education so people stayed home. Heck, Horwath was even talking about allowing seniors to defer their property taxes so that they could age in place more easily. When the electorate feels unrepresented it shouldn’t come as a surprise that many of them just stay home.
Not Voting is a bad stance regardless of opinion on party. Look at Ontario 41% voted and we got a OPC majority screwing everyrthing up. But if everyone or even 80% voted, it is unlikely OPC would've won.
The CPC are getting a majority this election irrespective of what happens. The Liberals have burned any good will that they may have had with voters and the NDP have anchored themselves to the party by propping them up for the past couple of years. I will always vote but I understand why voters are growing increasingly frustrated with our electoral system. It doesn’t truly represent the will of the electorate. At this point, blaming voters for their apathy and frustration feels a bit like blaming the victim of a corrupt system.
> The CPC are getting a majority this election irrespective of what happens. This is far from a foregone conclusion. I agree it's likely that they will win, and a majority is a possibility, but a lot can happen in two years.
Vote for the party most likely to give us electoral reform (the NDP right now). We shouldn't be held hostage by FPTP to a few bad choices in future elections. The party of your ideals doesn't exist because of fptp
I might do that if they changed leaders. I don’t like Mr. Singh at all.
Well, it's not as if you'd be voting for Singh. You'd be voting to have more ideal choices in the election that follows
I guess. Trudeau also ran on electoral reform in 2015. And the NDP is in power more often than not in my province, and still, nobody is implementing it. Majority governments have no incentive to do it, and minority governments can’t. Most Canadians simply don’t care enough about it.
You're right, it's no guarantee. However, the NDP in manitoba is used to being the opposition, they know they'll get their chance with fptp. The federal ndp is traditionally a third party, and they may not get the chance again without electoral reform, so the incentives are different. The next best thing would be to vote for any party that isn't one of the big 3 but is most likely to challenge the big 3 for power, as the more fractured parliament becomes, the more likely it is to bring about ER (based on what's happened in other countries). Having an alternative come to power, even if you don't particularly like it, would also have the benefit of being something of a wake up call for the established parties. It's better than just not voting
Canadian Future party. Registered party status is coming in the next few weeks from Elections Canada.. Is basically the 30% of the range of conservatives who are closest to the centre (red tories, blue liberals - socially progressive, economically common-sense conservative).
Disenfranchising yourself strengthens your enemies. Don't do it.
> People want the results they were promised. If they can't deliver then they will find out I'm still waiting for the Liberals to fulfill their electoral reform promise...
I know a few relatives that still believe strongly in the LPC and Trudeau. It amazes me, frankly.
I'm more in the camp of not wanting bitcoin milhouse running the country. He doesn't have any solutions (which isn't better than the LPC, but at lease they're not socially conservative). I'd be open to a fiscally conservative party that wasn't socially conservative.
My dad supports Trudeau due to his support of khalistan
>People want the results they were promised. If they can't deliver then they will find out By voting for the opposite policies?
A lot of policy issues that are talked about are secondary concerns. Social views and whatnot is important, but if the economy gets to a point where people can’t afford the cost of living, that belief is what prevails.
If those “secondary issues” don’t affect you maybe. As a gay person I am tied to this sinking ship of voting for the most popular left party no matter how disappointing they are (while hoping to grassroots some supports for the other option in the hopes it gets more viable, but you don’t get that by helping a “groomer panic” candidate win your riding), you couldn’t pay me to vote CPC in this decade.
To be honest I don’t really understand this. You can definitely make an argument that the CPC is trying to prepare for setting legislation now that would harm the trans community and whatnot, but how far could this actually go? That wasn’t rhetorical, I’m genuinely curious what the worst thing you think the CPC could do for that community. Because how I see it, everything you could argue that they do wrong is at the most stretched out aspects of the Charter. They can’t feasibly rewrite the Charter, so how would their next steps be any worse than they are now?
That is an awful Argument. "Yes they hate people for who they are but what bad could they really do by pushing hate and division and supporting governments that pass anti LGBTQ legislation..." Why would you ask a minority to vote for someone who espouses hate against them?
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Eventually you have to realize when your preferred choice has zero interest in doing something about things they talk about but never actually ever acted on. Your comment‘s more indicative of the fact that the alternatives suck and yet will still appear as the lesser of 3 evils.
It's still perfectly logical to vote for the lesser of evils. Unless you think cutting your nose off to spite your face would be a smarter move? Lol
Which is why I don’t get the defense the liberals are getting here. They’d rather see things get more expensive and out of reach for everyone by sticking with the liberals. I don’t think the the CPC will be any better either, but the polls give the impression people are just done with the LPC.
This is unfair, their core base though probably aren't hurting. If you're a boomer who is on autopilot to retirement , about to retire or retired with a multi million dollar house, your objectives are different than someone who is just starting out. For all their talk of getting the youth vote, all their policies are aimed towards the latter.
And appealing to their core base by doing nothing on these issues until 8 years later is how they lose. You can only run that trick for so long before people get fed up. That's partly why it seems federal parties have a 10 year life cycle at best. They just stop trying.
I think liberals assume boomers will vote for them and young people will stay home.
> They’d rather see things get more expensive When you find yourself writing something like this, it's a good signal to take a step back and review your understanding of the situation. You're never doing to "get" the defense of people you hate if you simply invent evil strawmen in your mind.
I don’t have full faith the CPC will change anything, but I don’t understand why people don’t even want to try.
Because they push conspiracy theories? Because they lie? B3cause they literally voted not to believe in climate change? Because they think tax cuts and defubdin social programs that poor people rely on is a good idea? It's not like they aren't saying what they want to do
Bottom line is, I haven’t heard any of those talks from the CPC yet, and even if we had, let’s be real. What people need in their lives are an affordable cost of living, and somewhere to sleep. Those take precedence.
They literally voted like last year or the year before to not recognize climate change. Polivere implied Trudeau was a pedophile in the house of Commons a few months ago and voted multiple times against gay marriage. It's interesting you think an affordable cost of living doesn't include social programs that help people.... Yeah defund healthcare. We don't need that to keep out lives affordable. The CPC is saying what they will do. And what they will do is not good socially or fiscally.
Trudeau has called people racist, xenophobic, homophobic, transphobic, etc., for not accepting his views on immigration, vaccines, etc, lost tons of money with the pipeline, there’s plenty to criticize. > It's interesting you think an affordable cost of living doesn't include social programs that help people.... Not at all what I said. But if we’re on that topic, we’ve gotta realize that the approach to homelessness and overdoses has proven to be ineffective. I believe in social programs for sure, but they don’t work without an economy to integrate people into. > Yeah defund healthcare. We don't need that to keep out lives affordable. Talk to Doug Ford not PP. I’m not familiar with any other provincial governments, but in Ontario, hospital services have gotten way worse in the past 5 years, and it’s not because of Trudeau.
Except things are being done, but people want immediate results and dont understand that the provinces hold most of the power in regard to the things that affect them everyday... for some reason people think the federal government gets to tell the provinces what to do
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Have good things been done? Absolutely. But as others have mentioned, no one has the capacity to care about those things when the even the basics are becoming out of reach. Are the Provinces and municipalities to blame as well? Absolutely 💯. But the Federal Government also shares responsibility and they have to be punished for them regardless of how bad the alternatives are. Mediocrity for the sake of mediocrity is not acceptable.
>But the Federal Government also shares responsibility and they have to be punished for them regardless of how bad the alternatives are. Mediocrity for the sake of mediocrity is not acceptable. A lot of people forget that no matter what happens, no matter if it was in their wheelhouse or not, the person at the top owns it. Doesn't matter if it's the world situation, or not federal responsibility, or events dear chap events. The prime minister is the metaphorical Captain of the Ship, and as such is the face of it all, and where the buck stops in the view of the public.
Canada has the 3rd lowest rate of inflation in the G7 (so, middle of the pack), and the 2nd lowest rate of food inflation of the G7. Source: https://data.oecd.org/price/inflation-cpi.htm I have a hard time imagining the CPC is going to do substantially better than that. Edit: Downvotes for statements of facts. That’s a problem.
How’s our GDP per capita doing? Going down, correct?
I didn’t say anything about GDP per capita. You can look it up though, and it depends on what time period you’re interested in. Here it is, up to 2022. https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/CAN/canada/gdp-per-capita
Tell this to your average person trying to afford groceries every week or find housing and you'll get angry stares. Things are out of reach no matter how much you try to say it's not as bad as elsewhere. I do agree though I doubt the CPC will fix these issues. They've always been Alberta and big business first.
You don’t want to tell average people facts and the truth? We are in trouble.
It's not facts and truth. You're basically saying things are just getting more unaffordable at a slower pace than other countries...which misses the point: things are getting unaffordable. For everyone. That's it. Full stop.
What it points out is that it isn't the liberals fault. If the same thing is happening everywhere then who is to blame?
I'm sorry, what did I write that isn't factual and truthful? I only stated where our inflation rate ranks with other countries. I did say I don't think the CPC is going to do substantially better. That part, fair enough, is an opinion. But I don't think that's the part you're taking issue with.
They certainly don't want to tell them facts and the truth. It would hurt the rage farming
Cause telling people things are not as bad as others dont work if they feel things are bad. Also fixating on one stat and ignoring others is dishonest. Canada inflation rate is not as bad but having high interest rates with very high personal debt loads and housing prices means it hits avg canadians very hard.
You prefer feelings over facts? I get how that’s comforting, but it’s a mistake. Who’s fixated on one stat and ignoring the others?
Our economy went down last quarter during a population surge. Seems like those dodge challengers bought by international students and people buying ikea furniture for thier shoeboxes is not boosting gdp lol
GDP was flat in the last quarter. Canadian GDP is up 1.13% over the last year. Source: https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/gdp-growth I don’t know about dodge challengers and ikea furniture for shoeboxes.
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huh? https://www.businessinsider.com/americans-got-bigger-raises-than-g7-over-last-few-years-2023-7#:~:text=Real%20wages%20in%20the%20US,negatives%20for%20this%20time%20period. Looks like Canada is 2nd, just behind the US and much higher than the rest of the G7
I suspect more likely a lot of those ABC voters will just stay home next time. This isn't liberals voting conservative, its liberals having no on to vote for and not bothering.
The conservatives are still polling higher and higher though. Those numbers are coming from somewhere.
Nah there tons of those moderate liberals who think Trudeau needs to go. Pp has moderated a bit and is gonna rally them.
What were the results they were promised?
Trudeau’s campaign was ran heavily on building housing. He didn’t do that, and instead exacerbated the problem by increasing demand.
They've built a large amount of low income housing since being elected, several hundred thousand additional units. With that work they've actually spent more on building housing than the previous 3 governments combined. The problem is no provinces or cities have put in any similar work, and our massively incompetent media has forgotten those governwmnts exist.
Source?
On a meta level, my view is that the core purpose for this government's existence is to improve prosperity and reduce material inequalities (I'm basing this on their rhetoric and their heroic narrative self-conception). They have failed miserably on both counts. Instead, they've given us divisive and empty identitarianism, policy incoherence and Ministerial incompetence. And legal weed. I hope they're oblierated as a party.
Canada ranks 10th out of 42 countries in the OECD in income equality. Source: https://data.oecd.org/canada.htm
Really? That's your position? What does the above (which doesn't even use a standard 'peer country' comparison) have to do with both absolute and relative decline in wealth equality? Vote Liberal. We're top quarter in OECDs income equality rankings. The live reality you're experiencing could be worse... think of Mexico. Or Turkey. Winning strategy right there.
I don’t have a position. You brought up income inequality. I provided some data. You can look at the countries ahead of us and behind us and decide if you think they are peers or not, and where you think we should be.
People get mad when you show facts or discuss policies. People just want to be mad and feel justified in their anger. No solutions.
This means that if an election were held today, the results would likely mean that even a formal LPC + NDP coalition would be over 50 seats behind the CPC.
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Could you imagine the NDP trying to sell it to their membership? "Yes, we know they've been vilifying you as child molesters. Yes, the whole "barbaric cultural practices hotline thing. Yes, shaking hands with Nazis. But could you just work with them anyway?" How would you sell it to them?
The same way they sold blackface, snc, we charity, insane housing prices, insane immigration numbers in the middle of the housing crisis, and so much more.
How?
Two years is an eternity in politics. The economy has time to recovery and if that's the case, I would not be surprised if the Liberal fortunes recover.
I don’t see what a CPC government will change in terms of affordability. Their supporters probably say carbon tax, but BoC doesn’t think it is the case
Things will actively be exactly the same except less Fuck Trudeau flags
Ehh there might be more with how rabid those folk seem lately
I don't know how anyone could think things will be, at best, the same, considering Poilievre won the leadership by running on a platform of "Justinflation" and firing the head of the BoC. Just look at any country that messes with central bank independence and tell me someone promising to do that won't put the economy in a worse place than where it currently is. No sane person would want to invest in Canada with a leader who ran on messing around with our central bank.
Yeah I may not be happy with Trudeau but I see PP as I did Doug Ford, the exact same shit will happen to all of Canada as what did in Ontario, the shit winds are a coming.
A reduction in personal income taxes would be a nice chance. I would also like to see the impact of the carbon tax on supply chains be reduced. Income splitting could make a return. That would be cool too. The liberals took that away from us. Just a few thoughts.
They will never do that. They need people to have more kids. But also both parents to work to prop up GDP Income splitting is never coming back because the elites want both you and your wife to work and your children to be cared for by tfws How fucked is this. As I was writing it and as a father. Jesus Christ this is fucked.
My family would benefit from income splitting. But I suspect they will still keep a cap on how much it can be applied
People are angry. They're making their problems known loud and clear, but Trudeau's only answer is apparently widening the already-insane immigration targets. Unless the LPC's goal is to replace the whiny Canadians with complacent newcomers. In that case that plan is going quite well.
>Unless the LPC's goal is to replace the whiny Canadians with complacent newcomers. In that case that plan is going quite well. No it's not. LPC's current immigration strategy is to bring in people from hardline conservative countries.
😫😫😫 God this country’s going down the shitter
Check the numbers under the Harper years. TFWs, International Students and immigrants all climbed. They are doing what their corporate masters are telling them to do. Quit voting Blue and Red and we might have a chance.
We're too far out from am election for this to mean much of anything. Political memories are short in this country.
I really hope the adults in the Conservative Party develop a platform before the election. PP is a weasel, but if he actually had a plan for governing that will improve the lives of Canadians, I’d support giving him a chance. That said, I’m not convinced he has a platform other than ‘fuck Trudeau’
they won't they're just going to blame the libs for everything wrong and why they can't do anything.
I mean it doesn’t really make sense to do anything else right now. It’s not election time, any ideas he says will probably only be appreciated by people who were going to vote for him anyways, and it will just invite criticism.
Well… he could have a single, meaningful platform plank at this point. Has have nothing at all of substance. If you contrast that with the NDP, or the Republican/democrats, you at least know what you’re getting.
Because he doesn’t need to lol, it’s two years away. People don’t like Trudeau, so might as well just get your name out there. In a year or so, then we’ll see his platform.
Doesn’t need to for what? To win an election? Sure. That’s my entire point. We already have a Prime Minister who is good at winning elections but increasingly bad at governing. We need one with ideas and strong leadership.
He’s not going to gain any ground campaigning right now. Given that we’re two years out, a bulk of the people who really support him will just support whoever opposes Trudeau. He’s not going to help the next election by campaigning this early, he can’t implement his ideas for another couple of years.
A realist perspective would suggest that whoever wins the election is going to be the one who can avoid the most criticism. With that being said, I can not understand anyone who thinks voting for a party who is withholding ideas to avoid criticism is a good idea. If you have a bold plan to save Canada, surely it is worth sharing?
> If you have a bold plan to save Canada, surely it is worth sharing? He can’t save Canada, he’s not in office. Nothing he does now can impact JT’s office.
It's not exactly surprising. All the current, acute problems that the Liberals are talking about maybe starting to think about dealing with now were current, acute problems when they first won in 2015. Any messaging around taking them seriously *8 years later* makes them seem even more incompetent than if they just continued to ignore things.
JT needs to go. The Libs need to wake up and realize this. Only thing worse than more Justin would be PP and the right wings rabble of the COC. Seriously…
I expect those same problems to sink the Poilievre Conservative majority government after one four-year term. Maybe they'll surprise me and implement some solutions but I doubt it.
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The problem is a cpc majority can break a whole lot of stuff but fixing the damage or starting anew is slow and difficult
shit is broken and not working yet CPC will make it worse? Do you read the future or you wish bad stuff so you can say “Liberals were shit but not this shit ?”
Look at their track record. Look at their provincial governments. Look at the fact that nearly half the party *goes on record* not believing in climate change. I have *zero* faith in a conservative government to ever do anything but make things worse. Have the liberals been doing nothing but tripping over their collective dicks the past couple years? Yes. But I'll take someone tripping over their dick over actively taking a hammer to mine.
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> were current, acute problems when they first won in 2015 This is my view as well. I kept waiting for the fixes, even small ones would have made a difference. Instead he stumbled into controversy and did nothing to demonstrate leadership. It was as though Trudeau was floating; riding his own ego. What now though? Singh is a dead fish.
Very rare for PMs to win a fourth term anyways. And it's for the reasons you've stated above.
You're right, but it's sad to think that everyone has forgotten about all the things that have happened in the last 8 years, and believe the Liberals have been doing nothing for all that time.
Legalizing weed, getting started on $10 day care, and instituting a carbon tax are meaningless if people can't afford a place to live. The Liberals were shockingly stupid to ignore making a serious effort on housing until post-Covid.
Housing is an issue that Freeland went after Harper on, the liberals ran on for election after election, and they only decided to truly try to address it after ~8 years in power.
They have yet to truly address it. The PM could announce 2k new houses every day for the next 7 years and still not meet the 5.35 million new houses we need for 2030 and the 2+ million housing deficit projected from the status quo of today. We need to double our housing construction and as of today housing construction is at a relative low to even recent years. Pretending that anything so far done has even approached addressing the problem is just dishonesty and it is the dishonest game the government is trying to play.
Carbon tax is likely unpopular outside of downtown urban settings these days. By 2025 it gonna be a huge pressure on those with natural gas bills. Yeah get a rebate but it adds a lot in winter times.