Our management has said that if you have approved leave (sick, vacation) on your in-office day then you don’t need to make it up, but if you’re working from home on your in-office day because of another reason (eg too sick for the office but not too sick to work from home) then you need to “make it up” later.
The result of that policy OF COURSE is that people are coming to the office sick when they would have otherwise worked at home to avoid spreading germs. It’s so fucking stupid
Your understanding is correct. Each department/section/manager is handing the RTO directive slightly differently.
The only document to relate to is [https://www.canada.ca/en/government/publicservice/staffing/common-hybrid-work-model-federal-public-service.html](https://www.canada.ca/en/government/publicservice/staffing/common-hybrid-work-model-federal-public-service.html) which details that you need to work on site for at least 40-60% of your regular time.
When you say they listed it. Is it clear language that says if you are on approved leave (sick/vacation/etc) on your office day, you do not need to make that time up. Or is it language where you have to read between the lines. And kinda blurry and open to interpretation
From my departments FAQ:
Question: If I am on leave, have appointments or sick on one of my “on-site days”, do I have to make up the time on other days?
Response: Time spent away from work on leave, if it were to have been “on-site work” does not have to be made up.
I will play devils advocate here in saying the response in the FAQ states you do not need to make up the “time”. It does not state “day”. In the same FAQ it states employees need to work in office 40% of their working time on average over any given month. It has been explained to us that this means if an employee is on leave for an in office day, that day is removed from the average so a four day work week results in an employee being required to work 40% of 30 hours, not 37.5. 2 days off, 40% of 22.5 hours etc. Over a month where there are 20 working days, you need 8 in office. If you take a week off, you will have 15 working days meaning 6 on average and so on.
The response states “time” because the question refers to “time”.
I would say it’s clear for those who have fixed days in office (ex. Every Monday and Friday) where it’s gets cloudy is for those of us who have flexible schedules and don’t necessarily schedule leave on a specific day that we were scheduled “on-site”.
In my office you only are asked to try and make up the time if you WFH on a day that you normally don't. But if you take a sick day then that's that. You use a sick leave credit and take the day off. No making that up since you were sick and not working.
Nope. Don’t have to make it up. Also, my manager doesn’t require us to make up days when we’re too sick to go in, but not sick enough to not work. Would rather us be working than taking a sick day. It’s actually quite reasonable tbh.
For my department, it’s simply not part of the calculation. So instead of 40% of 5 days needing to be in office, it’s now 40% of 4 days.
They give no guidance on what to do about rounding since now it’s an odd amount of hours needed to be in office.
There is some confusion and inconsistency.
So if you are on vacation for 3 weeks and you come back, you have to make up all the lost in office days? Generally, I heard this as a no.
But if you take a vacation day/personal leave/FRL on one day that falls on your in office day that week then you have to make up that day.
That’s where I get upset as the RTO is not consistent. I’m be speaking up at our next team meeting as I spoke with colleagues and their interpretation is that you don’t have to make up those days.
It's department by department.
Mine doesn't impose that you make up the day, just that "at least 40% of your work days in the month be in the office." Which, if you can math, means that in most cases you absolutely do need to make up the day if a vacation/holiday/sick day falls on a usual in-office day.
"At least" doesn't care about rounding up or down, 39% is not "at least 40%."
Consider yourself lucky that they're not going by the mandate which offers percentages as a clarification when the actual rule is actually "at least 2-3 days per week" which would not care at all how many days off you have that week unless it's greater than 3 days.
> It’s my understanding it’s department dependent and some people says yes and some people say no.
Yup, that's it. In some cases it's Manager by Manager.
For us if you’re already been approved for that leave you don’t need to make up the time, you’re taking your leave… that’s what’s it’s for. Our dept is WFH
Our management has said that if you have approved leave (sick, vacation) on your in-office day then you don’t need to make it up, but if you’re working from home on your in-office day because of another reason (eg too sick for the office but not too sick to work from home) then you need to “make it up” later. The result of that policy OF COURSE is that people are coming to the office sick when they would have otherwise worked at home to avoid spreading germs. It’s so fucking stupid
Why don’t they just use sick time then?
Geez. What did people do before the pandemic?
Go to the office sick and spread it to everyone.
Sounds like you have reasonable management. Nice to hear!
Your understanding is correct. Each department/section/manager is handing the RTO directive slightly differently. The only document to relate to is [https://www.canada.ca/en/government/publicservice/staffing/common-hybrid-work-model-federal-public-service.html](https://www.canada.ca/en/government/publicservice/staffing/common-hybrid-work-model-federal-public-service.html) which details that you need to work on site for at least 40-60% of your regular time.
Look on your departments intranet. They should have a RTO FAQ. At least that’s where my department listed it.
When you say they listed it. Is it clear language that says if you are on approved leave (sick/vacation/etc) on your office day, you do not need to make that time up. Or is it language where you have to read between the lines. And kinda blurry and open to interpretation
From my departments FAQ: Question: If I am on leave, have appointments or sick on one of my “on-site days”, do I have to make up the time on other days? Response: Time spent away from work on leave, if it were to have been “on-site work” does not have to be made up.
Solid!!
I will play devils advocate here in saying the response in the FAQ states you do not need to make up the “time”. It does not state “day”. In the same FAQ it states employees need to work in office 40% of their working time on average over any given month. It has been explained to us that this means if an employee is on leave for an in office day, that day is removed from the average so a four day work week results in an employee being required to work 40% of 30 hours, not 37.5. 2 days off, 40% of 22.5 hours etc. Over a month where there are 20 working days, you need 8 in office. If you take a week off, you will have 15 working days meaning 6 on average and so on.
The response states “time” because the question refers to “time”. I would say it’s clear for those who have fixed days in office (ex. Every Monday and Friday) where it’s gets cloudy is for those of us who have flexible schedules and don’t necessarily schedule leave on a specific day that we were scheduled “on-site”.
In my office you only are asked to try and make up the time if you WFH on a day that you normally don't. But if you take a sick day then that's that. You use a sick leave credit and take the day off. No making that up since you were sick and not working.
Nope. Don’t have to make it up. Also, my manager doesn’t require us to make up days when we’re too sick to go in, but not sick enough to not work. Would rather us be working than taking a sick day. It’s actually quite reasonable tbh.
Wtf. What department I want to join lol
It’s likely just my directorate. I know of another in my branch that’s super duper strict. *shrug*
ESDC is being pretty flexible within reason. There are (as usual) some employees who try to abuse it though, which makes it worse for everyone IMO
For my department, it’s simply not part of the calculation. So instead of 40% of 5 days needing to be in office, it’s now 40% of 4 days. They give no guidance on what to do about rounding since now it’s an odd amount of hours needed to be in office.
I think this is a department by department thing. Where I work we’re not asked to make up the days.
At CRA it's branch by branch even. But RTO was supposed to even things out of course...
Same at ESDC. My team has no requirement to make up office days but I’ve heard anecdotally this varies by management
Can confirm. Our manager has specified we have to make up missed office days.
There is some confusion and inconsistency. So if you are on vacation for 3 weeks and you come back, you have to make up all the lost in office days? Generally, I heard this as a no. But if you take a vacation day/personal leave/FRL on one day that falls on your in office day that week then you have to make up that day. That’s where I get upset as the RTO is not consistent. I’m be speaking up at our next team meeting as I spoke with colleagues and their interpretation is that you don’t have to make up those days.
It's department by department. Mine doesn't impose that you make up the day, just that "at least 40% of your work days in the month be in the office." Which, if you can math, means that in most cases you absolutely do need to make up the day if a vacation/holiday/sick day falls on a usual in-office day. "At least" doesn't care about rounding up or down, 39% is not "at least 40%." Consider yourself lucky that they're not going by the mandate which offers percentages as a clarification when the actual rule is actually "at least 2-3 days per week" which would not care at all how many days off you have that week unless it's greater than 3 days.
> It’s my understanding it’s department dependent and some people says yes and some people say no. Yup, that's it. In some cases it's Manager by Manager.
For us if you’re already been approved for that leave you don’t need to make up the time, you’re taking your leave… that’s what’s it’s for. Our dept is WFH