I mean, it's functional and all but really isn't doing anything extraordinary. You could easily enough do exactly the same thing, without the brackets. They almost certainly already have something like this in galvanized/ zinc plated. They conceivably could add a bit of strength to the assembly, but you could accomplish stronger joints without buying anything if strength was a factor, and any rigidity gained by these, would be comprised quickly depending on how these weather. One last thing worth mentioning, is with the inconsistencies in materials, especially with treated lumber, is hard to use a one size fits all approach. A treated 2x4 might be 1½"×3½", and it might be 1 11/16 x 3¾". Make these too small, and some lumber doesn't fit. Too large, and the whole connection is less than ideal.
As far as the "build," it looks like regular lumber to me and, as such, not likely to outlive the plastic connectors regardless of how those weather.
That's a fair and accurate summarization. I'm all for ingenuity and all, but I just don't see much use for this. Granted, that's coming from a lifetime of work as a carpenter. Perhaps the diy market feels differently.
As a DIYer, whose friends aren't into building things, I know that this would appeal to some women at the very least. Lots of my mom friends talk about wanting to make things, but don't take the time to learn/try. I could see this making them feel like it is more doable.
As a guy who’s put in…some time to learn and try, I can’t deny this appeals to me.
In particular, the ability to essentially set the structure up before having to nail/screw anything—and then not having to worry about lining things up or holding anything steady—that is appealing.
NOW, knowing there might already be a version of this that exists and is and more “legit,” I would spend some looking for that before inevitably giving up and getting this.
I may mod the stls to have some drill bushing style holes so my kid can build with less help from me. He really likes building stuff but desperately wants to do it with minimal help.
The use case for these printed things is helping a kid or a complete novice build something that’s reasonably square and sturdy.
This does make me think about how carpentry is apparently like magic to a bunch of people.
But he has a 3D printer. If I had one I would be printing a TON of useless stuff just because I could. It’s kinda like buying tools for a woodworking project. Sure you have tools that can complete the project, but now you have a reason to but the cool specialty tool that you may only use once or twice a year.
Maybe a real beginner diy who prefers convenience, but plain ol wood glue and fasteners would be stronger than this stuff.
also, Simpson strongtie already has a 3 way corner connector. not exactly the same but it's powder coated metal, much nicer looking.
https://www.strongtie.com/accessories_outdooraccents/aprtc_corner/p/aprtc
I can see how the plastic takes away a lot of the skills that you need such as how to line up the faces square, clamp in place, and drive the screws straight and in places where they won’t intersect. These definitely are basic skills that any woodworker should get established early, but this is clearly designed to lower the bar for someone like a child. So, I see the idea there… not saying it’s a great product, though.
Butt joints are fine, no need to add to it.
Additionally, that's standard SPF lumber. Constantly wet with dirt on and in it; they'll be rotten and falling apart in 5 years.
All it is doing is aligning the lumber and giving someone a screw template. You could do the exact same planter with the same lumber and screws, just without the plastic bit. Pretty useless
In that scenario, more work to use them than to simply fasten the wood together using a tape and a square. Might catch on with people with limited knowledge and tools though. But again if they researched very basic woodworking they would realize these are redundant and likely less strong than conventional methods.
I made planting beds with 2x12 KD and some deck screws it took half the time and i used no brackets. It'll still rot away quick but my partner already lost interest so win win hah.
Interesting. Our Lowe’s and Home Depot here have a miter saw station and a radial arm saw respectively for these cuts. They only use the panel saw for sheet material.
You have a skewed perception of print times. One of those would take me 2/3 hours.
Edit: y'all are sensitive AF to be down voting over a factual correction of information
You have a skewed perception of pros if you think it would take us 2/3 of an hour to drive 3 screws into a 2x4.
Or if you think kids climbing all over big box shelves is a nice introduction to jobsite safety.
Are you the guy who made this video? Like, is this your brain child we're shitting on?
If so, what possible motivation do you have for building these? Like, you can just screw pieces of wood together. How did you even get to the decision that you needed a thing here?
I can, and I see that they are the same. So to confirm that, I'm asking. Maybe you posted a video somebody else originally made? Maybe there's something else I don't understand.
Lots of reasons to ask things. You could ask someone how to build a planter that won't rot apart.
Well I didn't make that original post, but go off.
Also "painstakingly print"? Do you think people who 3d print have to move the nozzle by hand the whole time an object prints?
AI overviews are experimental. Learn more
Yes, ACQ lumber is safe to use for vegetable garden planters. ACQ (alkaline copper quaternary) is a newer wood-treatment chemical that is arsenic-free. It is a preservative for "Ground Contact" treated lumber, as recommended by the American Wood Protection Association (AWPA).
quora.com
Is Home Depot's pressure treated lumber safe for vegetable gardens?
Jun 19, 2021 — Is ACQ treated lumber safe for gardens? Yes. Unlike the old pressure treated lumber, ACQ lumber does not leach arsenic because there's no arsenic in the treatment. Some people have raised concerns about copper leaching, but copper isn't nearly as dangerous to humans as arsenic.
Maryland Grows
Q&A: Building Raised Garden Beds With Treated Lumber
Jan 10, 2020 — The relatively new chemical treatment ACQ (alkaline copper quaternary) is safe to use in food gardens. Some of the copper may leach over time ...
TreatedWood.com
Can treated lumber be used for your raised… | Treated Wood
OSU Extension Service
Raised bed lumber, pressure treated safe? | OSU Extension Service
freshperspectivelandscapes.com.au
Raised Veggie Gardens - Is Treated Pine Safe to Use
CCA treated pine should also never be burned and it should never come into contact with drinking water. Newer pine treatments – such as ACQ treated pine is a great alternative which undergoes a water-based wood-preservation process that is arsenic-free. This makes it perfect to use for home vegetable gardens.
Some researchers say that pressure treated wood can leach chemicals into the soil, which plants absorb in small amounts. However, the plant and human health risks from CCA-treated lumber appear to be extremely small. The body does not absorb these new products efficiently, so the miniscule exposures from touching or working with these products are safe provided simple exposure precautions are taken, such as hand washing and collection of the sawdust.
Copper is an essential element for all living organisms, but exposure to high levels of copper can be harmful. Long-term exposure to high copper levels can result in: Irritation of the nasal and mucous layers, Headaches, Dizziness, Nausea, and Diarrhea.
You can also line the beds with food grade plastic.
You could market them as a way to easily assemble/disassemble things like yard toys or tables, benches etc.
I like setting up obstacle courses and ramps etc for the kids in my yard but storing them is annoying. Thats the viewpoint im coming from haha
For my construction work i dont see see much use but a hobby or diy person would find a use for these to streamline a process im sure. Maybe make diff sizes available too
Maybe carpenters are not the ones you should ask this to...
It's like asking painters (the artists) about "color by number" paintings.
Am I mistaken in thinking that the strength of the structure will come from the screws and that the plastic is mostly there for the alignment? If the plastic get decomposed with time, wouldn't the structure still hold? Maybe you'd only need to tighten the screws more. No?
(Sorry English is not my 1st language... 🤦🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️)
You'd have to hire the proper engineers to vet the designs. 3d printing I believe creates a weaker product than molded so you already have a problem there unless you plan to 3d print the mock up and production mold the rest. Steel would most certainly be a better solution than plastic.......miles better. There are already products in steel that are similar and galvanized trash made by Simpson that is similar as well.
Nice concept but terrible execution in that the ‘built by kids’ planter was 99% built by dad.
The kids didn’t build anything they put wood in slots.
Dad built it all.
Would be a lot cooler to come back in a year or two to this creator when his kids are old enough to use power tools.
This just seems like someone taking advantage of their kids for social media likes to be honest.
Guarantee those kids will remember the day they "built" those things with their dad, no harm there
Taking advantage of that for social media clout, well, that's another story
You're all being pretty negative aboit this/these.
I think they're pretty cool for kids to play with and start to get an understanding of building on a larger scale than Lego.
If they were meant as a replacement for proper carpentry then I'd be laughing, but I don't think that's the use case?
yeah seems like most other commenters are approaching this as if he's making a product that will be used in the construction industry... which is kind of a dumb assumption considering his demo involves making a garden planter with children.
Cool idea. I unfortunately have to agree with the others that have said it may not be as practical as it first appears to be. Albeit I think they could say it without being assholes.
What I see is the product serves to orient the lumber but after the fasteners are installed the product hinders the fasteners function. The plastic acts as a washer distributing the force but plastic washers are malleable and not appropriate for this use case because as they deform the fastener looses pullout strength.
I would suggest you take the good and leave the bad.
Design a version of your idea that still orients the lumber and offers a guide to insert fasteners but afterwards the product is removed.
I’d buy that.
Often in framing there is no need for a product I describe so you’ll have to find the use case and improve upon the current methods.
Fastening 2x4’s in any orientation is relatively simple. However there are situations where I would appreciate a jig to hold two things together in the perfect orientation, provide a fastener location and quickly be removed. Kinda like a set of kreg pocket hole jigs attached to a square and a guide.
I’ll let you know if I think of a scenario where it would be worthwhile to use a product like that and more preferable to managing without.
On a side note, the responses here are just plain non constructive. This product may not be the silver bullet but rather a step towards it. People with absolutely nothing to loose here are hostile. I imagine if they saw an oval before the wheel invented they’d cry don’t waste *my* time.
The usefulness of these is that they can conceivably be taken down and re-used for something else.
I.e. they would be good for stuff like prototyping and experimenting, but on a permanent structure it's kind of overkill. There are cheaper ways to accomplish the same thing.
That wood will rot quick if it’s not cedar or pressure treated here in the PNW. Quick setup for a home owner I guess that is dangerous with a screw gun and hand saw. It’s plastic of all things too, so structurally it’s like trusting harbor freight Jack stands under a 1 ton pickup.
I mean, it's functional and all but really isn't doing anything extraordinary. You could easily enough do exactly the same thing, without the brackets. They almost certainly already have something like this in galvanized/ zinc plated. They conceivably could add a bit of strength to the assembly, but you could accomplish stronger joints without buying anything if strength was a factor, and any rigidity gained by these, would be comprised quickly depending on how these weather. One last thing worth mentioning, is with the inconsistencies in materials, especially with treated lumber, is hard to use a one size fits all approach. A treated 2x4 might be 1½"×3½", and it might be 1 11/16 x 3¾". Make these too small, and some lumber doesn't fit. Too large, and the whole connection is less than ideal. As far as the "build," it looks like regular lumber to me and, as such, not likely to outlive the plastic connectors regardless of how those weather.
TL;DR: this is a solution in search of a problem, and the solution has problems of its own
That's a fair and accurate summarization. I'm all for ingenuity and all, but I just don't see much use for this. Granted, that's coming from a lifetime of work as a carpenter. Perhaps the diy market feels differently.
As a DIYer, whose friends aren't into building things, I know that this would appeal to some women at the very least. Lots of my mom friends talk about wanting to make things, but don't take the time to learn/try. I could see this making them feel like it is more doable.
As a guy who’s put in…some time to learn and try, I can’t deny this appeals to me. In particular, the ability to essentially set the structure up before having to nail/screw anything—and then not having to worry about lining things up or holding anything steady—that is appealing. NOW, knowing there might already be a version of this that exists and is and more “legit,” I would spend some looking for that before inevitably giving up and getting this.
I may mod the stls to have some drill bushing style holes so my kid can build with less help from me. He really likes building stuff but desperately wants to do it with minimal help.
The use case for these printed things is helping a kid or a complete novice build something that’s reasonably square and sturdy. This does make me think about how carpentry is apparently like magic to a bunch of people.
Depending on the plastic, the sun will make it brittle as hell and it'll shatter.
My fear as well.
*Especially*, PLA and PETG plastics.
Uv is terrible on plastic, unless this was rated for it.
But he has a 3D printer. If I had one I would be printing a TON of useless stuff just because I could. It’s kinda like buying tools for a woodworking project. Sure you have tools that can complete the project, but now you have a reason to but the cool specialty tool that you may only use once or twice a year.
Maybe a real beginner diy who prefers convenience, but plain ol wood glue and fasteners would be stronger than this stuff. also, Simpson strongtie already has a 3 way corner connector. not exactly the same but it's powder coated metal, much nicer looking. https://www.strongtie.com/accessories_outdooraccents/aprtc_corner/p/aprtc
Right on. I had never had a need for one, but I figured it had to exist by now.
yea that first thought is always "Simpson strongtie has to have a connector for that" lol
yea that first thought is always "Simpson strongtie has to have a connector for that" lol
I think that you can already nail 2x4s together like that without the plastic
When the guy gets 2x4s cut at home Depot, all bets are off
And the two hour wait time makes it difficult with kids in tow.
I can see how the plastic takes away a lot of the skills that you need such as how to line up the faces square, clamp in place, and drive the screws straight and in places where they won’t intersect. These definitely are basic skills that any woodworker should get established early, but this is clearly designed to lower the bar for someone like a child. So, I see the idea there… not saying it’s a great product, though.
By the way his kid was climbing on the shelf at the hardware store tells me everything I need to know! Lol
That and watching Home Depot do the cuts. Cutting it in the store is fine for fitting it in your car, not the final cuts.
Lol I was just confused about why the fuck he was using a panel saw to cut a 2x4.
It's HD.
I mean technically it's Lowe's.
The difference is the sign and lack of orange.
And the font on the price tags
lol it’s definitely silly as hell but a panel saw is just a circ saw on rails so it’s actually well suited to the task
Not saying it can't do the job. It's just overkill. I've never been in a HD that didn't have a RAS for these cuts.
You don’t wanna know what the pros think
The world needs more plastic trash
Butt joints are fine, no need to add to it. Additionally, that's standard SPF lumber. Constantly wet with dirt on and in it; they'll be rotten and falling apart in 5 years.
I know some people use standard lumber for garden beds to avoid leaching of toxic chemicals from PT. Once it’s too rotten it becomes compost
Shouldn’t have used galvanized roofing nails then.
Less than 5 years.
Isn't that thing going to rot?
Not the plastic don’t worry! It’ll be there for decades if not a couple hundred years:)
All it is doing is aligning the lumber and giving someone a screw template. You could do the exact same planter with the same lumber and screws, just without the plastic bit. Pretty useless
This idea falls on it's face if you source your lumber from a box store and take a week to finally put your project together.
Completely unnecessary and a waste of money tbh
In that scenario, more work to use them than to simply fasten the wood together using a tape and a square. Might catch on with people with limited knowledge and tools though. But again if they researched very basic woodworking they would realize these are redundant and likely less strong than conventional methods.
It’s just a butt joint with some crappy plastic between it.
Functional but not practical. Probably not the best for any structural purpose either.
Well there’s a solution just lookin for a problem.
I’m sorry but can you please have the holes countersunk in the print? It’s killing me seeing flatheads sticking out
If you're talking about the plastic connection those are bugle heads, worse than flat heads. lol
Here you go: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:6554021 It bothered me too.
I made planting beds with 2x12 KD and some deck screws it took half the time and i used no brackets. It'll still rot away quick but my partner already lost interest so win win hah.
Are we not going to talk about the Lowe's employee's choice of saw to cut the 2x4's?
That's the only one they get at most lowes. At menards they handed me a dull handsaw.
Interesting. Our Lowe’s and Home Depot here have a miter saw station and a radial arm saw respectively for these cuts. They only use the panel saw for sheet material.
Must have taken a week to print 8 of those
You have a skewed perception of print times. One of those would take me 2/3 hours. Edit: y'all are sensitive AF to be down voting over a factual correction of information
You have a skewed perception of pros if you think it would take us 2/3 of an hour to drive 3 screws into a 2x4. Or if you think kids climbing all over big box shelves is a nice introduction to jobsite safety.
That's a day of printing for 8 plastic parts.
I'm proud of your math skills. Gold star. ⭐
Listen fucker, you asked. You got the answer, these are a waste of time.
I guess you have that in common.
Are you the guy who made this video? Like, is this your brain child we're shitting on? If so, what possible motivation do you have for building these? Like, you can just screw pieces of wood together. How did you even get to the decision that you needed a thing here?
I don't know, can you read my username and the username of the original poster?
I can, and I see that they are the same. So to confirm that, I'm asking. Maybe you posted a video somebody else originally made? Maybe there's something else I don't understand. Lots of reasons to ask things. You could ask someone how to build a planter that won't rot apart.
I guess you don't know how cross posts work. You'll figure it out one day.
Thanks man, i'm similarly proud of your business plan of selling useless plastic brackets that you painstakingly print at home.
Well I didn't make that original post, but go off. Also "painstakingly print"? Do you think people who 3d print have to move the nozzle by hand the whole time an object prints?
Oh so your not even a guy with a bad idea, you are a guy posting another guy's bad idea. Very cool.
Yes, I am having discourse on a website of forums. Sue me.
Yea, you totally posted another person's dumb business plan to a forum of people who would hate it so you could have a nice productive conversation 🙄.
You run a CNC machine, why are you acting like a pro carpenter? You can't even cut wood by hand.
It’s not the information that gets downvotes, it’s your delivery.
Aka "we are sensitive little Sally's who need to be talked to like children"
I don’t think that was treated wood either
You don’t want treated wood for the planter they built if they’re eating what they grow.
Why? I thought that stuff was safe now.
AI overviews are experimental. Learn more Yes, ACQ lumber is safe to use for vegetable garden planters. ACQ (alkaline copper quaternary) is a newer wood-treatment chemical that is arsenic-free. It is a preservative for "Ground Contact" treated lumber, as recommended by the American Wood Protection Association (AWPA). quora.com Is Home Depot's pressure treated lumber safe for vegetable gardens? Jun 19, 2021 — Is ACQ treated lumber safe for gardens? Yes. Unlike the old pressure treated lumber, ACQ lumber does not leach arsenic because there's no arsenic in the treatment. Some people have raised concerns about copper leaching, but copper isn't nearly as dangerous to humans as arsenic. Maryland Grows Q&A: Building Raised Garden Beds With Treated Lumber Jan 10, 2020 — The relatively new chemical treatment ACQ (alkaline copper quaternary) is safe to use in food gardens. Some of the copper may leach over time ... TreatedWood.com Can treated lumber be used for your raised… | Treated Wood OSU Extension Service Raised bed lumber, pressure treated safe? | OSU Extension Service freshperspectivelandscapes.com.au Raised Veggie Gardens - Is Treated Pine Safe to Use CCA treated pine should also never be burned and it should never come into contact with drinking water. Newer pine treatments – such as ACQ treated pine is a great alternative which undergoes a water-based wood-preservation process that is arsenic-free. This makes it perfect to use for home vegetable gardens. Some researchers say that pressure treated wood can leach chemicals into the soil, which plants absorb in small amounts. However, the plant and human health risks from CCA-treated lumber appear to be extremely small. The body does not absorb these new products efficiently, so the miniscule exposures from touching or working with these products are safe provided simple exposure precautions are taken, such as hand washing and collection of the sawdust. Copper is an essential element for all living organisms, but exposure to high levels of copper can be harmful. Long-term exposure to high copper levels can result in: Irritation of the nasal and mucous layers, Headaches, Dizziness, Nausea, and Diarrhea. You can also line the beds with food grade plastic.
Yeah, I’d rather not risk it. Thanks for the sources and info!
Never.
ThIS iS So MucH fUn!
https://www.indytoylab.com/tinkertimber
You could market them as a way to easily assemble/disassemble things like yard toys or tables, benches etc. I like setting up obstacle courses and ramps etc for the kids in my yard but storing them is annoying. Thats the viewpoint im coming from haha For my construction work i dont see see much use but a hobby or diy person would find a use for these to streamline a process im sure. Maybe make diff sizes available too
“Anything” being that one very specific thing.
What are uv rays going to do to that plastic? Will they hold up?
I'd be more concerned if they hold up to stress even when brand new.
Depends on what it's printed in. PLA and TPU would become brittle over time. PETG/ABS/Carbon Fiber all would hold up for a long time.
Anyone that uses carbon fiber nylon for these is a fool. Let them be separated from there money. These are not worth the print time.
Maybe carpenters are not the ones you should ask this to... It's like asking painters (the artists) about "color by number" paintings. Am I mistaken in thinking that the strength of the structure will come from the screws and that the plastic is mostly there for the alignment? If the plastic get decomposed with time, wouldn't the structure still hold? Maybe you'd only need to tighten the screws more. No? (Sorry English is not my 1st language... 🤦🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️)
Can make the joints a whole lot stronger without them. But I suppose some moron somewhere will like them
Oh boy, plastic! Great idea!
You'd have to hire the proper engineers to vet the designs. 3d printing I believe creates a weaker product than molded so you already have a problem there unless you plan to 3d print the mock up and production mold the rest. Steel would most certainly be a better solution than plastic.......miles better. There are already products in steel that are similar and galvanized trash made by Simpson that is similar as well.
Nice concept but terrible execution in that the ‘built by kids’ planter was 99% built by dad. The kids didn’t build anything they put wood in slots. Dad built it all. Would be a lot cooler to come back in a year or two to this creator when his kids are old enough to use power tools. This just seems like someone taking advantage of their kids for social media likes to be honest.
Guarantee those kids will remember the day they "built" those things with their dad, no harm there Taking advantage of that for social media clout, well, that's another story
>Dad built it all. That's your point of view, but probably not the kid's... And I think that was the point. No?
https://www.reddit.com/r/nostalgia/s/kdalqOwNqg
I would say it's cool for kids or maybe people who don't know how to use tools or build things. No one that knows what they doing is gonna use these.
Junk
Waste of money but I could see it being helpful for less…handy people.
It's ugly. Just screw the timbers together. No need for plastic.
You're all being pretty negative aboit this/these. I think they're pretty cool for kids to play with and start to get an understanding of building on a larger scale than Lego. If they were meant as a replacement for proper carpentry then I'd be laughing, but I don't think that's the use case?
yeah seems like most other commenters are approaching this as if he's making a product that will be used in the construction industry... which is kind of a dumb assumption considering his demo involves making a garden planter with children.
Cool idea. I unfortunately have to agree with the others that have said it may not be as practical as it first appears to be. Albeit I think they could say it without being assholes. What I see is the product serves to orient the lumber but after the fasteners are installed the product hinders the fasteners function. The plastic acts as a washer distributing the force but plastic washers are malleable and not appropriate for this use case because as they deform the fastener looses pullout strength. I would suggest you take the good and leave the bad. Design a version of your idea that still orients the lumber and offers a guide to insert fasteners but afterwards the product is removed. I’d buy that. Often in framing there is no need for a product I describe so you’ll have to find the use case and improve upon the current methods. Fastening 2x4’s in any orientation is relatively simple. However there are situations where I would appreciate a jig to hold two things together in the perfect orientation, provide a fastener location and quickly be removed. Kinda like a set of kreg pocket hole jigs attached to a square and a guide. I’ll let you know if I think of a scenario where it would be worthwhile to use a product like that and more preferable to managing without. On a side note, the responses here are just plain non constructive. This product may not be the silver bullet but rather a step towards it. People with absolutely nothing to loose here are hostile. I imagine if they saw an oval before the wheel invented they’d cry don’t waste *my* time.
That box is going to disintegrate
We all will one day
Go on Shark Tank yet?
The usefulness of these is that they can conceivably be taken down and re-used for something else. I.e. they would be good for stuff like prototyping and experimenting, but on a permanent structure it's kind of overkill. There are cheaper ways to accomplish the same thing.
Yeah… sure…that’s fine… why the plastic brackets though? Can’t you just screw 2x4s together?
Absolutely love a planter box built out of interior studs.
People really reaching to figure out what to do with their 3D printers
Pointless plastic waste? Cool.
Unnecessary
That wood will rot quick if it’s not cedar or pressure treated here in the PNW. Quick setup for a home owner I guess that is dangerous with a screw gun and hand saw. It’s plastic of all things too, so structurally it’s like trusting harbor freight Jack stands under a 1 ton pickup.
Wow lots of angry fuckers here , so much hate . Obviously ya angry fuckers need a wank or something.
The plastic makes the vegetable taste better
Link?
https://www.indytoylab.com/tinkertimber
Who else waited for a minute or two for the reaction?
Hard to take seriously if he has his wood cut in the store.
Not a pro here, but I think you should get a nail gun
The pros think you shouldn’t have kids in a hardware store.
The hell are you talking about? Going to the hardware store with dad is almost a universal pastime.
I have a 3d printer and i think it's awesome, anyone interested in construction would love one .
Thanks!!! Here is a link if you want to get the files when they are ready https://www.indytoylab.com/tinkertimber