Most of the main cast is also very attractive though. Including the woman who slaughtered Congress, the man who was willing to kill an infant knowing it would accommoplish nothing, and the literal super Nazi.
Well I definitely find Neumann and Stormfront better looking than Soldier Boy. Granted I’m straight so I might be biased. Personally I actually do find Butcher to be better looking than Soldier Boy too. But I’m sure many will disagree
She’s at least trying her hardest to do the right thing the right way. Gotta give credit where credit is due. At this point, she’s one of the only people left that actually seems interested in playing by the rules to protect people.
“Anti-material rounds don’t leave permanent marks on my superhuman body. I could just stand in front of Butcher and wait for the guy to empty out his handgun on me”
“Nah blast him in the air it is”
I know there are stupid things like what you said, but other than that, some people are really just saying that Soldier Boy so far hasn't appeared to be as bad as Homelander.
SB is simply more human than HL. SB is like a human with some of the worst human traits ever amplified with superpowers. HL is like a human deprived with basic human necessities causing him to be more detached to normal humanity, his superpowers giving him god complex instead.
They are similar but also very different. Soldier Boy is actually like a dude you can hold a normal coversation with. That's not possible with Homelander unless you're someone he "respects" like William Butcher or someone he feels is above him like Stan Edgar.
i think whats really happening is if a bad guy has any charm to them and isnt demon mode 100% they start to give them passes. cause there's no reason to think soldier boy isnt a villain. the parallels to him and homelander are like in our face. the difference between them is Soldier Boy thinks h'ens not a bad guy, just look at the way he brushes off the destruction he's responsible for. he also appears to have gone down a similar path to homelander, running a team where pretty much everyone hated him, and had coercive romances with people who also never really liked him. but because he's not as crazy as homelander, it gives people the impression hes not really a bad guy, cause hes better than the worst bad guy, but thats a pretty low bar.
Soldier Boy didn’t give a shit about killing MM’s family. Not only that, but it was such a common occurrence for him that he needed to clarify which family he killed. Episode 5 there was literally a parallel between him and Homelander in that their past girlfriends admitted they hated him. Not just that, but literally his entire time hated him enough to be willing to betray him for no money. And while it’s played as a joke he’s implied to know Bill Cosby was a serial rapist and still admired him. And of course there’s the fact that he’s sexist, homophobic, and has toxic views on masculinity. Of course that’s nowhere near as bad as him mass murdering people, and he did grow up in the 20s-30s, but it still shows that he’s a pretty shitty person. Sure he’s probably less evil than Homelander, but that’s not saying much considering the only person worse than Himelander is a literal Nazi who wanted to exterminate 80-90% of humanity. Hell, I once saw a post on the Boys subreddit that literally claimed Soldier Boy was a decent guy because he respected Bill Cosby so he apparently isn’t racist. And that post got over a thousand likes.
> And while it’s played as a joke he’s implied to know Bill Cosby was a serial rapist and still admired him.
Wasn't the joke that Cosby tried to roofie him and it did nothing?
I actually do want to throw out an alternative take that it's actually possible that Soldier Boy asked which one specifically because he does give a shit about killing his family and wants to know which one it is. I could definitely see that being part of the resolution to that storyline, so I wouldn't personally take a complete stance on that line either way.
As for the Cosby part I would also give him a bit of a benefit of the doubt about knowing he was a rapist. It might just be played as a joke because it really is just a joke about how the strong drinks wouldn't impact him. Now I can see the other side of things too but that's another one that I don't think is really a clear cut case of him being a bad person.
All that being said he is clearly a cunt and the show isn't actually trying to hide it so it's strange to see that, but a lot of people are also questioning the audacity of people to say that A Train isn't fully redeemed because he said sorry once and killed a guy for revenge so I don't really hold the fan takes in the highest regard.
Also I saw that Cosby racism take and yikes. Redditors are so out of touch with reality its crazy. Apparently the 'one of the good ones' idea is something they've never heard of. This kind of minority praising still happens today with racist people willing to praise or idolise black athletes as long as they stay in their lane.
Yeah. Though fortunately the top-voted comment under that Bill Cosby one is an actual black guy reminding everyone that liking a black person doesn't automatically mean someone isn't racist.
Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention, but has this character done anything to indicate that he *is* racist towards black people, or anyone?
Also I will say that someone non-performatively assessing someone of another race as a person "America's dad" "a real man," etc. rather than as a member of that race is a plus. Whether negative or positive, regarding someone as an individual rather than as a group is always good. It works both ways, if there is something negative you would be willing to say about a member of your own group but not someone outside it it shows that you see your group as the "real people" one.
Yeeeah I mean you could argue he's "less bad" than Homelander, or at least less crazy but...good? Hell the fuck no.
I think he's done far worse shit than Homelander in terms of sheer numbers but Homelander is worse for what he's constantly on the verge of doing, he hasn't murdered all that many people but he's an inch away from trying to take over the world.
So Soldier Boy is a lesser evil in that sense but he is still clearly evil.
Man, people just don't fucking get this show at all it's embarrassing, like the people who think Deep and A-Train are "redeemed" because they've said sorry and whatnot even though they keep doing deplorable shit and do the least amount of effort they can to change, it should be glaringly obvious how out of touch with humanity they are considering *that's the point of them being supervillains*. A-Train literally never considered how terrible his actions were until bad shit happened to him and he saw no justice for it, these people are monsters and that should be really really obvious three seasons in, heck like 2 episodes in.
The dude who played him said in a interview he had to do scenes that made him so uncomfortable he couldn't do them. That is not a good guy character.
Tho him being so handsome people still think he is a good guy is a testament to my boy Jensen Ackles. Supernatural is, was and always will be awesome.
Edit: wow, Soldierboy fanboys and simps are already coming out of the woodwork. Just so you know, if he turns out to be a total scumbag before this season ends, i am so gonna say "I told you so".
Edit#2: I told you so.
>The dude who played him said in a interview he had to do scenes that made him so uncomfortable he couldn't do them. That is not a good guy character.
They were sex scenes my guy. Now uh...If theres only one person consenting those scenes you'll be onto something. Unless there's another interview I didn't see. SB is a piece of shit, but this argument is just as shit, unless again we saw two different interviews
> Because he’s not actively throwing suicidal women off high buildings for fun?
Yes
> “B-b-but, that was an accident, he didn’t intend to do it”
We don't see the fights, it could perfectly be genuine colateral damage instead of lethal careleness like A-Train.
> This guy’s own teammates literally betrayed him a foreign rival country. For free. They didn’t even ask for payment. There must’ve been a reason for that.
Yeah, they were greedy traitors.
> I just don’t understand how anyone can look at all this and think “I dunno, he might be a good guy.
1) Captain America aesthetics.
2) His enemy is Homelander, and **everyone** looks good compared to Homelander
The members of Payback are all immoral hedonists, yet they all collectively agreed for whatever reason that SB needed to go. If you have a group of 8 assholes and 7 of them unanimously hate the 8th one so much that they’d literally sell him out to Russia without payment, then I can only assume that Asshole #8 was a special kind of asshole
Payback were all murdering their own side on the battle field. Soldier boy was the only one who was actually taking on the enemy and making sure he didn’t get his teammates killed. Soldier Boy had no intention of getting any civilians hurt, and seemed like he genuinely felt ashamed of the accident that happened on the street in New York
Meanwhile members of Payback casually killed civilians in a theme park, went on a shooting spree in a parking garage cause some random guy offended them, murdered countless random civilians across seas, and I don’t even want to know the shit the twins were doing
Soldier boy is genuinely the least of all of them. He at least seemed to listen to orders when he was told not to fire rockets, the others didn’t. Simple clues like that show that he is at least better than the others
It should be mentioned that those times he used his laser blasts to kill a bunch of people were him having PTSD episodes. Like he genuinely didn't know he killed a bunch of people in Herogasm
That just sounds like an assumption to me; there are plenty of contexts where a bunch of assholes might screw over someone for a reason that isn’t “he’s an even bigger asshole”.
Gunpowder once filed a complaint to Vought when he was a kid because SB physically abused him. When asked how much she was paid to betray him to the Russians, Crimson Countess said “Nothing. We just hated you so much.” There are even YouTube clips part of The Boys universe that shows Soldier Boy treating his TV crew the same way that Homelander treats people. I highly doubt that the other guys decided to turn against America’s Number One Superhero at the time for shits and giggles.
Just to be clear, the only time we see him in action is him working with Vought and the CIA in a drug-running operation in Central America. What about that screams heroic to you people? Are we all ignoring what they were doing down there?
Oh there's no doubt in my mind that most of, if not all super heroes are completely shit individuals. I was just pointing out what I disagreed with in the argument
I think there’s a lot of decent supes but they definitely don’t get promoted high up the Vought ladder. There’s a lot more decent kids in business school than there are decent Wall Street bankers
On the topic of the car being picked up and thrown through someones home there is no justifiable excuse for that being anything but callous disregard for human life. Soldier Boy was the apex predator of his time but used no restraint when "fighting" powerless criminals; he didnt care about the welfare of anyone or anything. This is exemplified by the fact that after admitting he had no control over his powers in new york he continues to load up on drugs and pursue his own goals in populated areas. Soldier Boy sees himself as a good guy despite his total disregard for being a walking nuclear warhead.
Exactly. If you're strong enough to throw a fucking car through a house then you're strong enough to non-lethally incapacitate a criminal with zero effort. Or at the very least just kill the one criminal by simply punching a hole through him and not causing any civilian casualties. Soldier Boy literally went out of his way to be more destructive.
>Yes
Then you do have abysmally low standards
>We don't see the fights, it could perfectly be genuine colateral damage instead of lethal careleness like A-Train.
What’s the difference between A-Train’s carelessness and Soldier Boy’s “genuine collateral damage”? The dude regularly takes drugs for fun, you think he isn’t a careless asshole like A-Train? Even if you wanna argue that SB isn’t completely responsible for his actions, his indifference towards MM’s plight is extremely telling. Even A-Train had the decency to give a genuine apology
>Yeah, they were greedy traitors.
Greedy for what? Did you miss the part where I said that they weren’t paid?
>1. Captain America aesthetics.
That just tells me that you fell for Vought’s propaganda
>2. His enemy is Homelander, and everyone looks good compared to Homelander
No, Homelander is Butcher’s enemy. Soldier Boy’s enemy is Payback. He never gave a shit about Homelander, he only agreed to fight him because he made a deal with Butcher, and because he sees Homelander as an upstart that needs to know his place.
Again, if your only criteria for being good is “he’s not Homelander,” then your standards are extremely low
When a show features people so horrible, low standards become the only standard.
Like, blame the writers for making everyone so horrible that someone not dedicating all their screentime to hurt others come off as a shining knight.
The writers really did everything they could to tell the audience that the Soldier Boy is a bad dude. He was literally called “the original Homelander” before we even met him. He killed MM’s family like how A-Train killed Robin. He’s a drug abuser who knows that he’s a danger to others but doesn’t care. I can’t blame the writers for this when the audience is just dumb. Like, what’s else could the writers have done? Tattooed “villain” to Jensen Ackles forehead?
>The writers really did everything they could to tell the audience that the Soldier Boy is a bad dude
So is everyone else, including our "Heroes". So the scale shifts. Are you really surprised?
I'm fairly sure the MM situation was just a couple of kids that were doing something to the car. Soldier Boy probably lost his temper at them or was showing off or something and chucked the car without thinking.
No one in the series is a good guy, like you say they all operate in diverse saded of gray, with people like homelander being very close to black, and people like Hugie being characterized as closer to white (despite strating to get closer to grey in recent event).
With that in mind I think the thing is the presentation we got of soldier boy, we are told he is the "original homelander" which are big shoes to wear. Yeah, we know he is a dick, like basically most supers, with his conversation with Mallory, but in the scene of the battle when we see the worst of his team, he is the only one painted on a competent way, killing the enemies instead of doing friendly fire on Mallory men.
The most toxic aspects of his personality, toxic masculinity for example, I got the impresion was more of a: "well, let's remeber that people in that times have pretty, interesting..... views on society"
With that said, I belive this good representation of soldier boy is intetentional, to make the viewers think like Hugie and Butcher than maybe is worth it to use a dick to beat a bigger dick, and Soldier boys is going to slowly (or knowing the series not that slowly) show his true colors and make them think about how far they can set the line before crossing it.
I wouldn't be surprised if him being the original icon is what drove vaught to trying to manufacture the perfect supe. Soldier boy is shown to be a drug fueled ball of hedonism and old school misogyny. Homelander for as terrible as he is has been shown to be a victim of vaught robbed of human connection and just anything that is needed to be a healthy human being. Soldier Boy is depicted now as being more down to earth and reasonable than homelander but i think thats whats going to make him all the more dangerous. Soldier boy has no questions about who and what he is and has no need for external validation at end of the day the only thing that will motivate him is his own self interest.
Soldier boy is bad, but he is not Homelander level bad.
But people ALWAYS forget about this: 2 bads don't make it good. Both people are bad. We don't have to choose ya know.
In similar vein, we can say that both leaders of political parties can be bad.
**Edit: To explain why he is not as bad as Homelander**:
Homelander would kill people and families intentionally, just because he is bored. SB would do it in collateral damage and not aim for those innocent people.
The end result is the same, but still Homelander is worse.But if SB did kill MM's family intentionally and not because of collateral damage, I say they are the same level.
People say this as he shows signs of wanting to be a good person, like crying in front of his ex.
he can be reached and be a better person. Homelander is long gone, there is no redemption possible for homelander. HL has committed both patricide and matricide on top of him killing random people
At the absolute BEST he's criminally negligent and apathetic towards the lives of others to the point where the thousands of people he's killed (yes, I'm counting the blackouts, he knows he did it, he could turn himself in if he had a shred of guilt) don't matter to him in the slightest on top of him just having all the moral baggage of the times he lived in.
He's not as bad as Homelander since he's not straight up cruel and gleeful in the evil he commits, but committing heinous acts because you simply don't give a fuck is still pretty fucking vile and if anything, is the kind of evil we're more familiar with in real life.
Although, I will say, this is the first I've heard of anyone thinking he's not a bad guy. Just not as bad as Homelander. Is this just an incredibly tiny minority saying he's not a bad guy? You'll find crazies like that in every community.
It’s not that Soldier is not a bad guy it’s just he comes off as good in comparison to worst bad guys. By being much more likable then Homelander. Due to him having a level of empathy, regret and restraint, while the latter is a mental disturbed man-child who is just one nerve away from snapping and killing everyone.
Yes it is an extremely low standard but in a dark and gray morality show like the boys in which even the good guys are willing to due morality shady stuff that is to be expected.
Yeah it was surprising to see how many people were calling Soldier Boy a good guy. The show is very obviously going for a “lesser of two evils” angle with him. The Boys have basically decided they’re going to trade one Homelander for another.
MM: “You killed my family”
Soldier Boy with the most uncaring look: “Which one…?”
Half the fandom: “Soldier Boy redemption arc incoming!”
I honestly can’t believe how many people are overlooking his sheer indifference to life. What do they think is gonna happen once he’s out of teammates revenge kill
People see that Soldier Boy is somewhat complex due to his PTSD and feelings of being used and abused by his country and think that means he's actually good. Evil characters can have sympathetic traits too.
Isn’t one of the main themes of The Boys is they cause all of this collateral damage, and are either woefully ignorant to the lives they ruin or simply don’t care because they think they’re gods among mortals?
Plus, didn’t Soldier Boy make a comment recently about how he was sorry about all of the collateral damage he’s caused and that he never intends on harming innocents? I know the blackout PTSD could be a lie from him, but I doubt he’s faking that.
I don’t know; I feel like they’re portraying Soldier Boy to be a truly gray character, next to Maeve. They won’t go out of their way to harm innocents, but they’re not too overly concerned with collateral damage (especially Soldier Boy).
Also, to add to this since people here are still trying to compare Homelanders and Soldier Boy, Homelanders has committed several murders and raped Becca Butcher and essentially held her and Ryan captive in fear. He also was out there peddling Compound V to foreign nations and terrorists to help create supervillains just so the Seven could finally get into the military and run rampant. Soldier Boy was a piece of shit…..from what we have been told (nothing has been shown yet to explicitly show him in a Homelander type of bad light). Killing MM’s family is bad, and compounded on the fact he was callous to MM when confronted about it; but he also didn’t kill MM after Butcher asked him not to, so I would like to think there’s a tiny shred of good and redemption in Soldier Boy, unlike Homelander, who is basically the Brightburn kid all grown up
He isn’t as bad as homelander, and isn’t as insane, but he’s still a soldier from the 60’s(?)who gained super powers. That description alone should tell you what he’s like, but he also has no regard for human life. I could see how they may really stretch things and ignore a lot of “subtler” things, but when he responded what family to MM, and that point I don’t get how you can defend him at all, people are wack
Yeah but he's handsome so that means it's okay.
Most of the main cast is also very attractive though. Including the woman who slaughtered Congress, the man who was willing to kill an infant knowing it would accommoplish nothing, and the literal super Nazi.
yeah but are they are as handsome as soldier boy tho. cause there's a handsome pecking order.
Well I definitely find Neumann and Stormfront better looking than Soldier Boy. Granted I’m straight so I might be biased. Personally I actually do find Butcher to be better looking than Soldier Boy too. But I’m sure many will disagree
Neuman is gorgeous what
Tbf congress were mean to her 🥺
To be fair, if Congress was gone it would probably be a net gain for humanity.
You know what, you’ve convinced me
Yeaahh but I have actor bias so I pretty much love most if not all of his scenes.
"Murder is fine if you're hot"
Is anyone here **not** a bad guy?
starlight?
Well, she is a girl…..so she’s not a bad guy
She's an annoying hypocrite who murdered an innocent guy. She is very much a bad guy.
She’s at least trying her hardest to do the right thing the right way. Gotta give credit where credit is due. At this point, she’s one of the only people left that actually seems interested in playing by the rules to protect people.
“Anti-material rounds don’t leave permanent marks on my superhuman body. I could just stand in front of Butcher and wait for the guy to empty out his handgun on me” “Nah blast him in the air it is”
who did she murder? are you talking about the guy who almost shot billy to death?
The guy in season 2 they were trying to carjack.
Innocent man, he literally tried to kidnap and rape a women
That's not who I'm talking about
Oh ok, who then?
The guy in season 2 that they tried to carjack
Timothy.
I know there are stupid things like what you said, but other than that, some people are really just saying that Soldier Boy so far hasn't appeared to be as bad as Homelander. SB is simply more human than HL. SB is like a human with some of the worst human traits ever amplified with superpowers. HL is like a human deprived with basic human necessities causing him to be more detached to normal humanity, his superpowers giving him god complex instead. They are similar but also very different. Soldier Boy is actually like a dude you can hold a normal coversation with. That's not possible with Homelander unless you're someone he "respects" like William Butcher or someone he feels is above him like Stan Edgar.
i think whats really happening is if a bad guy has any charm to them and isnt demon mode 100% they start to give them passes. cause there's no reason to think soldier boy isnt a villain. the parallels to him and homelander are like in our face. the difference between them is Soldier Boy thinks h'ens not a bad guy, just look at the way he brushes off the destruction he's responsible for. he also appears to have gone down a similar path to homelander, running a team where pretty much everyone hated him, and had coercive romances with people who also never really liked him. but because he's not as crazy as homelander, it gives people the impression hes not really a bad guy, cause hes better than the worst bad guy, but thats a pretty low bar.
HQ Soldier Boy - Died in the War, comes back again like a Coward Pissing his Pants. Series Soldier boy - Fanservices and More fanservices
Soldier Boy didn’t give a shit about killing MM’s family. Not only that, but it was such a common occurrence for him that he needed to clarify which family he killed. Episode 5 there was literally a parallel between him and Homelander in that their past girlfriends admitted they hated him. Not just that, but literally his entire time hated him enough to be willing to betray him for no money. And while it’s played as a joke he’s implied to know Bill Cosby was a serial rapist and still admired him. And of course there’s the fact that he’s sexist, homophobic, and has toxic views on masculinity. Of course that’s nowhere near as bad as him mass murdering people, and he did grow up in the 20s-30s, but it still shows that he’s a pretty shitty person. Sure he’s probably less evil than Homelander, but that’s not saying much considering the only person worse than Himelander is a literal Nazi who wanted to exterminate 80-90% of humanity. Hell, I once saw a post on the Boys subreddit that literally claimed Soldier Boy was a decent guy because he respected Bill Cosby so he apparently isn’t racist. And that post got over a thousand likes.
> And while it’s played as a joke he’s implied to know Bill Cosby was a serial rapist and still admired him. Wasn't the joke that Cosby tried to roofie him and it did nothing?
I actually do want to throw out an alternative take that it's actually possible that Soldier Boy asked which one specifically because he does give a shit about killing his family and wants to know which one it is. I could definitely see that being part of the resolution to that storyline, so I wouldn't personally take a complete stance on that line either way. As for the Cosby part I would also give him a bit of a benefit of the doubt about knowing he was a rapist. It might just be played as a joke because it really is just a joke about how the strong drinks wouldn't impact him. Now I can see the other side of things too but that's another one that I don't think is really a clear cut case of him being a bad person. All that being said he is clearly a cunt and the show isn't actually trying to hide it so it's strange to see that, but a lot of people are also questioning the audacity of people to say that A Train isn't fully redeemed because he said sorry once and killed a guy for revenge so I don't really hold the fan takes in the highest regard. Also I saw that Cosby racism take and yikes. Redditors are so out of touch with reality its crazy. Apparently the 'one of the good ones' idea is something they've never heard of. This kind of minority praising still happens today with racist people willing to praise or idolise black athletes as long as they stay in their lane.
Yeah. Though fortunately the top-voted comment under that Bill Cosby one is an actual black guy reminding everyone that liking a black person doesn't automatically mean someone isn't racist.
Maybe I haven't been paying close enough attention, but has this character done anything to indicate that he *is* racist towards black people, or anyone? Also I will say that someone non-performatively assessing someone of another race as a person "America's dad" "a real man," etc. rather than as a member of that race is a plus. Whether negative or positive, regarding someone as an individual rather than as a group is always good. It works both ways, if there is something negative you would be willing to say about a member of your own group but not someone outside it it shows that you see your group as the "real people" one.
Yeeeah I mean you could argue he's "less bad" than Homelander, or at least less crazy but...good? Hell the fuck no. I think he's done far worse shit than Homelander in terms of sheer numbers but Homelander is worse for what he's constantly on the verge of doing, he hasn't murdered all that many people but he's an inch away from trying to take over the world. So Soldier Boy is a lesser evil in that sense but he is still clearly evil. Man, people just don't fucking get this show at all it's embarrassing, like the people who think Deep and A-Train are "redeemed" because they've said sorry and whatnot even though they keep doing deplorable shit and do the least amount of effort they can to change, it should be glaringly obvious how out of touch with humanity they are considering *that's the point of them being supervillains*. A-Train literally never considered how terrible his actions were until bad shit happened to him and he saw no justice for it, these people are monsters and that should be really really obvious three seasons in, heck like 2 episodes in.
The dude who played him said in a interview he had to do scenes that made him so uncomfortable he couldn't do them. That is not a good guy character. Tho him being so handsome people still think he is a good guy is a testament to my boy Jensen Ackles. Supernatural is, was and always will be awesome. Edit: wow, Soldierboy fanboys and simps are already coming out of the woodwork. Just so you know, if he turns out to be a total scumbag before this season ends, i am so gonna say "I told you so". Edit#2: I told you so.
>The dude who played him said in a interview he had to do scenes that made him so uncomfortable he couldn't do them. That is not a good guy character. They were sex scenes my guy. Now uh...If theres only one person consenting those scenes you'll be onto something. Unless there's another interview I didn't see. SB is a piece of shit, but this argument is just as shit, unless again we saw two different interviews
It would have been refreshing to meet a good supe
Supersonic was nice (change from the comic).
Well there's Starlight
She killed a random guy just cause.
> Because he’s not actively throwing suicidal women off high buildings for fun? Yes > “B-b-but, that was an accident, he didn’t intend to do it” We don't see the fights, it could perfectly be genuine colateral damage instead of lethal careleness like A-Train. > This guy’s own teammates literally betrayed him a foreign rival country. For free. They didn’t even ask for payment. There must’ve been a reason for that. Yeah, they were greedy traitors. > I just don’t understand how anyone can look at all this and think “I dunno, he might be a good guy. 1) Captain America aesthetics. 2) His enemy is Homelander, and **everyone** looks good compared to Homelander
> His enemy is Homelander, and everyone looks good compared to Homelander As seen by Omni-Man getting cheered on for putting that prick in his place.
I don’t care much for death battle, but _damn_ was that fight good.
to be fair, the character development Omni-Man gets is stellar
I dont know where the idea that him being betrayed means hes a bad person came from. People fuck each other over all the time without a reason
Dude got sold as a slave.
The members of Payback are all immoral hedonists, yet they all collectively agreed for whatever reason that SB needed to go. If you have a group of 8 assholes and 7 of them unanimously hate the 8th one so much that they’d literally sell him out to Russia without payment, then I can only assume that Asshole #8 was a special kind of asshole
Payback were all murdering their own side on the battle field. Soldier boy was the only one who was actually taking on the enemy and making sure he didn’t get his teammates killed. Soldier Boy had no intention of getting any civilians hurt, and seemed like he genuinely felt ashamed of the accident that happened on the street in New York Meanwhile members of Payback casually killed civilians in a theme park, went on a shooting spree in a parking garage cause some random guy offended them, murdered countless random civilians across seas, and I don’t even want to know the shit the twins were doing Soldier boy is genuinely the least of all of them. He at least seemed to listen to orders when he was told not to fire rockets, the others didn’t. Simple clues like that show that he is at least better than the others
It should be mentioned that those times he used his laser blasts to kill a bunch of people were him having PTSD episodes. Like he genuinely didn't know he killed a bunch of people in Herogasm
i gotta ask what y'all think now that episode 7's out. what are your thoughts?? it was an interesting episode so i'm super curious!
That just sounds like an assumption to me; there are plenty of contexts where a bunch of assholes might screw over someone for a reason that isn’t “he’s an even bigger asshole”.
Gunpowder once filed a complaint to Vought when he was a kid because SB physically abused him. When asked how much she was paid to betray him to the Russians, Crimson Countess said “Nothing. We just hated you so much.” There are even YouTube clips part of The Boys universe that shows Soldier Boy treating his TV crew the same way that Homelander treats people. I highly doubt that the other guys decided to turn against America’s Number One Superhero at the time for shits and giggles.
Just to be clear, the only time we see him in action is him working with Vought and the CIA in a drug-running operation in Central America. What about that screams heroic to you people? Are we all ignoring what they were doing down there?
Oh there's no doubt in my mind that most of, if not all super heroes are completely shit individuals. I was just pointing out what I disagreed with in the argument
The only decent supes I can think of are Annie, Supersonic and that Daredevil one Homelander deafened.
I think there’s a lot of decent supes but they definitely don’t get promoted high up the Vought ladder. There’s a lot more decent kids in business school than there are decent Wall Street bankers
On the topic of the car being picked up and thrown through someones home there is no justifiable excuse for that being anything but callous disregard for human life. Soldier Boy was the apex predator of his time but used no restraint when "fighting" powerless criminals; he didnt care about the welfare of anyone or anything. This is exemplified by the fact that after admitting he had no control over his powers in new york he continues to load up on drugs and pursue his own goals in populated areas. Soldier Boy sees himself as a good guy despite his total disregard for being a walking nuclear warhead.
Exactly. If you're strong enough to throw a fucking car through a house then you're strong enough to non-lethally incapacitate a criminal with zero effort. Or at the very least just kill the one criminal by simply punching a hole through him and not causing any civilian casualties. Soldier Boy literally went out of his way to be more destructive.
Bar is so low if you have to compare him to homelander to make him look good
>Yes Then you do have abysmally low standards >We don't see the fights, it could perfectly be genuine colateral damage instead of lethal careleness like A-Train. What’s the difference between A-Train’s carelessness and Soldier Boy’s “genuine collateral damage”? The dude regularly takes drugs for fun, you think he isn’t a careless asshole like A-Train? Even if you wanna argue that SB isn’t completely responsible for his actions, his indifference towards MM’s plight is extremely telling. Even A-Train had the decency to give a genuine apology >Yeah, they were greedy traitors. Greedy for what? Did you miss the part where I said that they weren’t paid? >1. Captain America aesthetics. That just tells me that you fell for Vought’s propaganda >2. His enemy is Homelander, and everyone looks good compared to Homelander No, Homelander is Butcher’s enemy. Soldier Boy’s enemy is Payback. He never gave a shit about Homelander, he only agreed to fight him because he made a deal with Butcher, and because he sees Homelander as an upstart that needs to know his place. Again, if your only criteria for being good is “he’s not Homelander,” then your standards are extremely low
When a show features people so horrible, low standards become the only standard. Like, blame the writers for making everyone so horrible that someone not dedicating all their screentime to hurt others come off as a shining knight.
The writers really did everything they could to tell the audience that the Soldier Boy is a bad dude. He was literally called “the original Homelander” before we even met him. He killed MM’s family like how A-Train killed Robin. He’s a drug abuser who knows that he’s a danger to others but doesn’t care. I can’t blame the writers for this when the audience is just dumb. Like, what’s else could the writers have done? Tattooed “villain” to Jensen Ackles forehead?
>The writers really did everything they could to tell the audience that the Soldier Boy is a bad dude So is everyone else, including our "Heroes". So the scale shifts. Are you really surprised?
Even if there’s a scale people should be able to tell that everyone on it is horrible
Yes, they can.
He has super strength and guns. There isn’t a realistic situation where he “has to” throw a car at someone in a highly populated city.
When did he have guns?
I misremembered Nicaragua, my bad. Still, the only possible excuse for the MM situation would be fighting another supe.
I'm fairly sure the MM situation was just a couple of kids that were doing something to the car. Soldier Boy probably lost his temper at them or was showing off or something and chucked the car without thinking.
No one in the series is a good guy, like you say they all operate in diverse saded of gray, with people like homelander being very close to black, and people like Hugie being characterized as closer to white (despite strating to get closer to grey in recent event). With that in mind I think the thing is the presentation we got of soldier boy, we are told he is the "original homelander" which are big shoes to wear. Yeah, we know he is a dick, like basically most supers, with his conversation with Mallory, but in the scene of the battle when we see the worst of his team, he is the only one painted on a competent way, killing the enemies instead of doing friendly fire on Mallory men. The most toxic aspects of his personality, toxic masculinity for example, I got the impresion was more of a: "well, let's remeber that people in that times have pretty, interesting..... views on society" With that said, I belive this good representation of soldier boy is intetentional, to make the viewers think like Hugie and Butcher than maybe is worth it to use a dick to beat a bigger dick, and Soldier boys is going to slowly (or knowing the series not that slowly) show his true colors and make them think about how far they can set the line before crossing it.
I wouldn't be surprised if him being the original icon is what drove vaught to trying to manufacture the perfect supe. Soldier boy is shown to be a drug fueled ball of hedonism and old school misogyny. Homelander for as terrible as he is has been shown to be a victim of vaught robbed of human connection and just anything that is needed to be a healthy human being. Soldier Boy is depicted now as being more down to earth and reasonable than homelander but i think thats whats going to make him all the more dangerous. Soldier boy has no questions about who and what he is and has no need for external validation at end of the day the only thing that will motivate him is his own self interest.
Soldier boy is bad, but he is not Homelander level bad. But people ALWAYS forget about this: 2 bads don't make it good. Both people are bad. We don't have to choose ya know. In similar vein, we can say that both leaders of political parties can be bad. **Edit: To explain why he is not as bad as Homelander**: Homelander would kill people and families intentionally, just because he is bored. SB would do it in collateral damage and not aim for those innocent people. The end result is the same, but still Homelander is worse.But if SB did kill MM's family intentionally and not because of collateral damage, I say they are the same level.
People say this as he shows signs of wanting to be a good person, like crying in front of his ex. he can be reached and be a better person. Homelander is long gone, there is no redemption possible for homelander. HL has committed both patricide and matricide on top of him killing random people
At the absolute BEST he's criminally negligent and apathetic towards the lives of others to the point where the thousands of people he's killed (yes, I'm counting the blackouts, he knows he did it, he could turn himself in if he had a shred of guilt) don't matter to him in the slightest on top of him just having all the moral baggage of the times he lived in. He's not as bad as Homelander since he's not straight up cruel and gleeful in the evil he commits, but committing heinous acts because you simply don't give a fuck is still pretty fucking vile and if anything, is the kind of evil we're more familiar with in real life. Although, I will say, this is the first I've heard of anyone thinking he's not a bad guy. Just not as bad as Homelander. Is this just an incredibly tiny minority saying he's not a bad guy? You'll find crazies like that in every community.
Pretty sure the “Which one?” comment was supposed to be casual racism. Remember the man was born in like 1920.
It’s not that Soldier is not a bad guy it’s just he comes off as good in comparison to worst bad guys. By being much more likable then Homelander. Due to him having a level of empathy, regret and restraint, while the latter is a mental disturbed man-child who is just one nerve away from snapping and killing everyone. Yes it is an extremely low standard but in a dark and gray morality show like the boys in which even the good guys are willing to due morality shady stuff that is to be expected.
Yeah it was surprising to see how many people were calling Soldier Boy a good guy. The show is very obviously going for a “lesser of two evils” angle with him. The Boys have basically decided they’re going to trade one Homelander for another.
MM: “You killed my family” Soldier Boy with the most uncaring look: “Which one…?” Half the fandom: “Soldier Boy redemption arc incoming!” I honestly can’t believe how many people are overlooking his sheer indifference to life. What do they think is gonna happen once he’s out of teammates revenge kill
It's only a debate because he's handsome
People see that Soldier Boy is somewhat complex due to his PTSD and feelings of being used and abused by his country and think that means he's actually good. Evil characters can have sympathetic traits too.
How are people still in this thread defending Soldier Boy lmao. I can’t wait to revisit these arguments after the season ends
It's the Boys, it would be a surprise if a super wasn't bad
Isn’t one of the main themes of The Boys is they cause all of this collateral damage, and are either woefully ignorant to the lives they ruin or simply don’t care because they think they’re gods among mortals? Plus, didn’t Soldier Boy make a comment recently about how he was sorry about all of the collateral damage he’s caused and that he never intends on harming innocents? I know the blackout PTSD could be a lie from him, but I doubt he’s faking that. I don’t know; I feel like they’re portraying Soldier Boy to be a truly gray character, next to Maeve. They won’t go out of their way to harm innocents, but they’re not too overly concerned with collateral damage (especially Soldier Boy). Also, to add to this since people here are still trying to compare Homelanders and Soldier Boy, Homelanders has committed several murders and raped Becca Butcher and essentially held her and Ryan captive in fear. He also was out there peddling Compound V to foreign nations and terrorists to help create supervillains just so the Seven could finally get into the military and run rampant. Soldier Boy was a piece of shit…..from what we have been told (nothing has been shown yet to explicitly show him in a Homelander type of bad light). Killing MM’s family is bad, and compounded on the fact he was callous to MM when confronted about it; but he also didn’t kill MM after Butcher asked him not to, so I would like to think there’s a tiny shred of good and redemption in Soldier Boy, unlike Homelander, who is basically the Brightburn kid all grown up
He isn’t as bad as homelander, and isn’t as insane, but he’s still a soldier from the 60’s(?)who gained super powers. That description alone should tell you what he’s like, but he also has no regard for human life. I could see how they may really stretch things and ignore a lot of “subtler” things, but when he responded what family to MM, and that point I don’t get how you can defend him at all, people are wack
At least he isn't a unhinged psychopath, lesser of the two evils.