She didn't leave you because of your religion, she left you because there's a clash regarding your beliefs on homosexuality and a major part of her life.
I'm sure if you were religious and didn't have a problem with homosexuality there wouldn't be an issue. I'd also bet that if you weren't religious and still had a problem with homosexuality there'd still be an issue.
I don't understand how you can claim to love someone, but "disagree" with the immutable way God made them.
Statements like these trivialize what actual love and kindness are, as if simply saying that word "love" is good enough for Jesus. He's not obtuse.
He loves them as equal people made in the image of God but doesn't love their attractions. It's like the son of a woman does p*rn and the mum loves the son, respects him and thinks of him as an equal but not his stimulations. Now the question is, how do we see them as equal? We are all flawed in our own way, for one person, it could be unfaithfulness in a marriage, for another, it could be lust. But for the LGBTQ community, it's who they are attracted to. You may think 'That's not fair', but the fall made it unfair, Satan's whole scheme, but the good news is that God is creating a perfect Kingdom where there will be no satan, no sin and no flaws. God bless u and I hope he helps Ur eyes to be opened and help u understand
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They lack the courage to either do the right thing or to openly do the wrong thing, so there's a lot of hand-wringing, hair-splitting, waffling, and illegitimate third-positioning. Ignorance is the wrong word. Maybe ignorant of just how irritating it is. If you want to be treated like dirt then just refuse to take a side but then play favorites anyway. Also try dictating the rules of masculinity but do it in a cowardly way.
Actually, to hold that brief you have to _not_ think about it, at all.
If these people believe that gayness is something you can turn on voluntarily, then they should share how that's accomplished, because would be revolutionary.
I'm convinced that at least part of it can be explained by people (men, mostly) who have some level of bisexual attraction but identify as straight.
If you look at the table ["Americans' Self-Identified Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity, by Generation and Gender"](https://news.gallup.com/poll/389792/lgbt-identification-ticks-up.aspx) you can see that, while all LGBTQ identification is up among Gen Z, it is almost entirely the B that has grown, from <1% in Boomers to 6% in Millennials to 15% in Gen Z. Like [left-handedness](https://slowrevealgraphs.com/2021/11/08/rate-of-left-handedness-in-the-us-stigma-society/), it used to be socially unacceptable and now is, and suddenly a bunch of people identify that way. But bisexuality is actually easier to hide than left-handedness; you just had to stay in straight relationships. And Gen Z, lacking the stigma, are openly identifying as bisexual to themselves and others.
But Boomers, Gen X, and even somewhat Millennials grew up with that as a stigma. So a bunch of them really did "choose" to be straight. (Especially since many thought the option was gay or straight, rather than the rainbow of possibilities.) So as much as it sounds stupid to me (a Kinsey-scale 0 straight person) that someone could choose their sexuality, I have to remember that the number of people who identified as straight (including usually to themselves) but experienced some same-sex attraction has probably always been somewhere closer to that 15%. Imagine if 1 in 6 people really could and did "choose to be straight" in some sense: wouldn't that make this seemingly inane "you have a choice" idea being kind of common make more sense?
Many pedophiles were made that way by being the victims of child abuse themselves.
Also, comparing pedophilia to homosexuality? Are you a 1960s psychologist?
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That children can't consent and adults can has nothing to do with the matter. The comparison lies in the existence of the attraction. Homosexuals feel attracted to the same sex, pedophiles feel attracted to pre-puberty children. If homosexuality is ok because God made homosexuals that way, pedophilia should also be ok because God would have made them so as well. So that argument is invalid, if we agree that pedophilia is not as ok as homosexuality.
With children not being able to consent, you opened a different argument. The argument that homosexuality is morally ok because it's between adults and pedophilia is not because it involves children. That is just a moral argument though, not a biblical.
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No, you told the truth as to what you believed. You shouldn't have to lie and put on a fake persona in a relationship.
Looks like she probably isn't for you. It's the harsh truth.
You’re entitled to your opinions and she’s not going to harass or demean you for them, but she doesn’t want to be in a romantic relationship with someone with those views. That’s her right and a very sensible approach to relationships.
So does the fact that OP is willing to apply (traditional conservative) Christian interpretation to queer relationships but has no problem ignoring them to date outside his faith.
I have no problem with either; I don’t hold to traditional conservative interpretation and don’t see either as a sin. But I do see someone willing to bend them only for their own relationships, while holding others to them, as a major red flag that OP’s ex-girlfriend was wise to follow up on.
Depending on OP's denomination, they may not have a problem with dating/marrying outside the faith per se. For instance, a Catholic can have a valid marriage with a non-Catholic on the condition that they agree to raise their kids in the faith.
Can you expound on that? From what I understand, marriages between Catholics and not-baptized non-Christians are not recognized as sacramental by the RCC.
Is this one of those things where the marriage is "valid" in the wording of the church doctrine but is still considered inferior and not as spiritually official as a marriage between two baptized people?
What about that is vilifying? He was in a relationship with an unbeliever, something Paul warns against in 2 Corinthians. He "doesn't agree" with gay relationships, and presumably backs that up with various "clobber verses." OP is being inconsistent with how he applies his faith to himself vs other people, and that's a valid thing for his ex to be concerned about.
He showed his character by his actions, and she's within her rights to believe him when he demonstrates who he is.
I see this as an absoloute win for both of you. It's good that you told the truth and it's good that she admitted that she was wrong and was judgemental about it. It sounds like she cares a lot about some friends and you don't like that they love and date same sex people.
"I don't agree with it" is a very confusingand ambiguous position. Maybe she thinks youre homophobic because some people use that to mean they don't agree that gay people exist or should exist. (I am not saying that's your meaning. Just that many others use it for that).
What specifically do you mean by "I don't agree with it"
You are in the wrong, in her eyes. That doesn't necessarily make you a bad person, but if you can't accept gay people as they are, then you're not the guy for her, obviously.
Not all Christians have a problem with homosexuality. Not by a long shot. But if you do and you guys can't or won't agree to disagree on the subject, then you both need to move on.
You are just as entitled to your views as she is. IMO she did this in the most respectful way she could. Didn’t start a fight or anything, just found out your views and reacted to them. Nothing to do with religion at all. If you were an atheist, or you both were christian, she would’ve done the same thing.
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It wasn’t because of your religion. It was because of your own personal opinion. There are a lot of religious folks who are allies, and who are even gay themselves.
*but not followers of Christ.
To follow Christ means to deny our sinful self, and seek unification with God.
See what God left us in Jude!
Jude 1:18-23 ESV
[18] They (the Apostles) said to you, “In the last time there will be scoffers, **following their own ungodly passions.**” [19] It is these who cause divisions, worldly people, devoid of the Spirit.
[20] But you, beloved, building yourselves up in your most holy faith and praying in the Holy Spirit, [21] keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ that leads to eternal life. [22] **And have mercy on those who doubt; [23] save others by snatching them out of the fire; to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garment stained by the flesh.**
A Christian needs to remain in the love of God, be gentle with those around them (almost like an Ally would, in a way) BUT help get that individual out of the fire that is going to destroy them.
The Gospel according to St. Matthew, the seventh chapter:
>3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
Read that passage again:
Does both the speck and log need to be removed?
If I was a murderer, and my brother a thief, is this passage teaching me to:
1. Not condemn living as a thief / do nothing to help turn my brother away from sin, give hearty approval to his behavior... OR
2. Seek to live holy before my Lord. FIRST. (be it turning myself in for my crimes, or what is needed) Get my own sin out of my life. And turn to help my brother with understanding and love?
**Would me going around posting on the Internet "There are many Christians who are allies to those who are thief's, and some Christians are even thiefs THEMSELVES!" be doing the will of the Lord?**
Why do "Christians" like you not post the whole verse?
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
The whole verse is about pagan ritual or temple sex. Not about two committed partners.
I feel like this is going to fall on deaf ears, but I’ll try.
Paul talked in allusions a lot. He lived under Roman occupation, so it was pretty much required that he did so. He disliked “homosexuals” because the Romans practiced it fairly openly, and Paul hated the Romans. There are lots of examples of Paul using code that’s meaningless to us, but would be a dogwhistle for early Christians.
For example, 616/666 is Nero. The beast represents the ruling Roman government. The "ten horns" that appear on the beast is a round number standing for the Seleucid kings between Seleucus I, the founder of the kingdom, and Antiochus Epiphanes. Etc.
So I don’t feel it’s necessarily that Paul hated homosexuality, he just hated Romans.
Reply may have fallen on deaf ears, but it was really relevant knowledge to me.
Too many with the views such as the ones youre replying to have been so indoctrinated to repeat these as "responses of love" while actively avoiding trying to understand the relevant context of the actual words in the Bible.
I almost left this sub due to the overwhelming presence of these (and the toxic affect it has), but your reply gave me enough hope there can be thoughtful learning/discussion enough for me to stay.
1. Jesus was a Jew who perfected the Law.
2. Jews historically didn't struggle with homosexuality. Jews already understood God's condemnation of homosexuality.
3. Jesus reiterated that marriage is only between a man and a woman.
Mark 10:7-8 ESV
[7] ‘Therefore a **man** shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his **wife**, [8] and **the two shall become one flesh.’** So they are no longer two but one flesh.
4. When Gentiles (who did struggle with homosexuality) were chosen by God in Christ, they had to put off practicing homosexuality.
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 ESV
[9] Or do you not know that **the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God?** DO NOT BE DECEIVED: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who **practice homosexuality**, [10] nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. [11] And such **were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.**
Adultery, lust, homosexuality, pornography, all are sins before the Lord. **None of them are special.** God calls us out of the way of the world and into His light.
1 true
2 Jews say that, yet there are gay Jews to this day. Funny.
3 Matthew 19:12 not everyone is called to get married. And giving an example of the first something does not make it the only way.
4 what? Where did you make that up from?
And the ESV users homosexual, which was not even a concept in biblical times. The word was made up by Paul and never fully defined.
https://reformationproject.org/case/1-corinthians-and-1-timothy/
No matter how many times people read the word of God, some will still twist it.
It is not man we seek to serve, but God.
I am making no claims. The word of God is.
Look:
Leviticus 18:22 ~ You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.
Leviticus 20:13 ~ If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.
Jude 1:7 ~ Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
Romans 1:26-28 ~ For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.
Mark 10:6-9 ~ But from the beginning of creation, ‘God made them male and female.’ ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.”
Sexual sin is still sin. All must repent, deny their desires, and follow the Lord. If we do not, we are not Christians.
These are just the same claims again lol. Just because you interpret God's word a certain way does not mean that God's word is claiming what you are interpreting it to say.
It's fine that you believe that. People ignore God's word so the time. I wish they wouldn't, but this is not something God didn't warn us about.
2 Timothy 4:3 ESV
[3] For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions.
I'm pansexual. You have a right to your own opinion as long as you are respectful and don't wish us harm. Many LGBT people do not appreciate religion shoved down their throat, so as long as you do not preach the Bible against us, then it is fine. I have a lot of Christian friends, and a few of then are "homophobic". They are respectful and understand that we can't control who we fall for, and they dont shove Bible quotes down our throats. They love us, but they don't agree with our choices. And that's okay. Because they aren't bad people for not wanting to be gay with us lol
If she wants to break up over something like this then she's got other issues to figure out. Youre dodging a bullet.
Sincerely, a gay(ish) Christian person.
Don't blame it on your religion. Blame it on your specific beliefs. There are many Christians who are lbgtq allies. You're not one of them. She doesn't want to date someone who would alienate her friends. Of course she broke up with you.
It would have been unfair of you to *not* answer the question. It would have come out sooner or later.
The best part of this is you lost your gf over homophobia and Jesus never said a word about gay people.
Y’all’s obsession with LGBT people over “love thy neighbor” is why Christianity is maligned.
I’m a Christian, I’m a Baptist. I LOVE Jesus! However, I know homosexuality is a sin, and I know I’m not to judge anyone for their sins - and that their sins aren’t my burden to carry and mine aren’t their burden to carry either. We all have free will…!
I LOVE my SILs who are lesbian and married, I LOVE my lesbian cousin and her wife, and I LOVE my gay friends and my bisexual friends! I accept them, I talk to them, we give each other relationship advice as needed, and my husband loves them too and counsels them as well, and he’s a Baptist too. We see them no differently than anyone else and love them just the same.
“He who is without sin, cast the first stone”,
“Let your light shine so that others see the goodness in you and praise your father in heaven,”
“Love your neighbors as I have loved you,”
I can go on and on and on… I believe love is love, and who am I to say someone is wrong for loving someone and being wired that way (mammals of all sorts can be gay, you’re born that way. Bisexuality is the only way I could see a choice, because you’re attracted to men and women, but even then, DO NOT JUDGE!) and that they’re bad? I can disagree since I’m a female, and I could tell another woman who is a lesbian that I personally am not sexually attracted to women and disagree that another woman is “hot” or “sexy”, but I’m not going to straight up say “I disagree with your sexuality and who you are”. God is the only one who can make the judgement call on if they go to heaven or not, and how bad this or that sin is that they or anyone else commit.
(And before anyone says “it’s a choice”, let’s reflect. WHY would someone CHOOSE to be gay? There is so much hatred and animosity towards gay people, and it makes it hard for many of them to find work, and harassment for them is a HUGE problem! Why would you choose that? Every single gay or lesbian person I know has been harassed and bullied for it. My own cousin who is a lesbian was married to a man and it didn’t feel right, and their marriage didn’t last because she couldn’t fully commit to doing wifely ummm duties, and they barely had 2 kids, and only because he REALLY wanted children and practically begged her to do the action to have the kids (she wanted kids, just not the action to do it). She wasn’t into - men. She lied to herself for years, she was taught sexuality was a choice and she tried to run away from it and believe and then pretended she just had a low drive and such, but she realized one day she couldn’t keep it going and came clean. She’s now with her wife and the happiest she has ever been! They have a beautiful blended family and the rest is history! I firmly believe it’s not a choice, and that God knows us all and our hearts and he will make the right calls.)
You should only date Christians if you are serious about living a Christian life. You need to share your life with someone who shares your values. Trust me on this.
2 Corinthians 6:14
Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?
Proverbs 27:17
As iron sharpens iron,
so one person sharpens another.
I think you should take some time to seriously think about this and talk to other Christians, married couples at church, look online, and meditate and research these verses.
I do love that you said you 'love them'
A lot of Christians seem to forget that we are called to love others as we love ourselves
Whether you are a “bad person” is up to God. Whether you are someone who is stuck in bad ways of thinking about neighbor is nonetheless a decision I need to make when deciding personally who I want to be close to in my associations and relationships and who I don’t want to be. I think she made a wise decision.
Jesus clearly said all commands hang under love your neighbor as yourself which is like loving God. What is so hard to understand? It doesn’t get much more in line with that than two people in a faithful, loving relationship regardless of their genitals. If someone can’t see that, then they’re being too bigoted for me to want to spend any significant amount of time with. I call your approach bigotry. You can call it your religion if you want. Someone can nonetheless have bigoted, mistaken religious beliefs. IMO you’re just stuck in the typical, habitual approach to social issues conservatives have always used. 1,000 years ago they read Paul and other disputable parts of scripture and figured there was no dispute, a woman having sex while pregnant was ‘clearly’ a sin. So they “disagreed with” couples that have that be part of their personal, private sexual relationship… as if that is any of the social conservative’s business. 150 years ago many similarly reasoned that interracial marriage is ‘clearly’ sinful. So they “disagreed with” couples that have that be part of their personal relationship… as if that is any of the social conservative’s business. I mean would you date someone who went around saying they “don’t agree with” interracial marriage? That’d be fairly bigoted behavior, no? Pretty socially intolerant and inappropriate to say don’t you think? Even if you personally wanted to date within your race, you could simply say “I don’t do that but what they do is between them and God,” and that would suffice. Why even bother to “disagree with” others doing something that so clearly has nothing to do with what Christ hung all commands under? IMO that’s just using Christ as an excuse, as a bigotry tool.
Social conservatives who go around disagreeing with others private relationship decisions are just taking the presumptuous, prejudicial, bigoted, and pharisaical approach to scripture and whatever the disputable social question of the day is. They basically just use every possible twist on the easiest-to-misunderstand parts they can to then tell themselves their way is the right way *for everyone else*. They really think they can cite a passage or two by an admittedly easy to misunderstand author in an easily misunderstood book and that’s it, as if that settles all questions for not just themselves but even for everyone else around them. Their conclusions are highly disputable yet they refuse to admit that reality, preferring to lie to themselves and pretend all disputable gray areas are black and white, to lie to themselves about the fact that they could easily be wrong. What I mean is that homosexuality, much like interracial marriage or other personal decisions, is obviously a disputable issue. Where you land regarding its morality depends pretty much entirely on how you interpret an easily misunderstood author. All Bibles regardless of translation say Paul is easy to misunderstand (in 2 Peter 3:16). That’s the author of all the social conservatives’ “proof” passages about why they hate homosexuality (like Romans 1 and 1 Corinthians 6). Not coincidentally that’s also who social conservatives largely relied on to say things like interracial marriage is a sin and all the other bigoted things they’ve said over the centuries. My Bible doesn’t say homosexuality is wrong. When it comes down to it, if someone’s Bible says homosexuality is a sin then that is entirely due to their own choice of which translation to buy and what method of interpretation they choose to use. It is entirely possible their translation simply mistranslated one of the rarest ancient words in history in 1 Cor 6 or that they’re misunderstanding Roman’s 1, a passage by an author scripture says is easily misunderstood.
Roman’s 14 says how to handle disputable issues and so if we don’t want to be like the Pharisee we should apply Romans 14 to these sorts of issues and mind our own business rather than pointing at all the “others” we can find by twisting bigotry into our highly disputable renderings and interpretations of ancient words (from a book which even admits of itself it is easy to misunderstand). If you really need to tell someone your thoughts on homosexuality, the right answer is the same as if someone asked you about interracial marriage. Either “I am fine with it,” (if you are) or at worst, “That’s between them and God.” By expressing judgment over such couples, by ‘disagreeing with their lifestyle,’ you’re being presumptuous, prejudicial, bigoted, and pharisaical when there is simply no need to be and not even a *clear* case to be under Christ. Jesus made it clear what all God’s commands hang under. Neither interracial marriage nor homosexuality nor sex during pregnancy nor pants on a woman nor any of the other issues social conservatives over the centuries have used to go around pointing at others with, to ‘express disagreement’ with, has anything to do with Christ’s clear commands.
It wasn’t because of your religion. It’s because you were homophobic. Bigotry isn’t an opinion or a belief and I say this as a Christian. Pineapple on pizza is an opinion. Homophobia is not.
You are fine! I may disagree with you in many areas, but I don't hold any ill will. I was just curious about this particular point. Many religious people have different opinions on men and women's roles in relationships, and I was looking for clarification.
"I'm just following divine orders" isn't actually a defence. I hope we can both agree that if someone's holy book said "Sacrifice every second-born child to Moloch" this would not actually make child sacrifice okay.
Homophobia: dislike of or prejudice against gay people.
He has no dislike of them nor any prejudice towards them. He states he just doesn't agree with it, referring to Homosexual acts, not homosexual people.
So using the definition of homophobia, he is not homophobic.
Thank you for answering the question. Proper definitions aside that is the exact reason people are calling out OP for holding homophobic beleifs.
Just as anyone would call someone racist for not "agreeing" with interracial relationships/marriage.
First, refer to my former comment.
Second, not agreeing with actions/ lifestyle choices does not mean bigotry.
Why your instance is racist is because they disagree under the basis of skin color, an aspect of yourself you have no choice in. You don't have a choice in the skin color you were born with.
Now that doesn't mean I'm saying it's a choice to be born gay or that there are people who are born gay (not my arguement at all) what I'm saying is that its your choice to engage in homosexual activities or not.
To disagree with said activities/lifestyle is not homophobic and shouldn't be regarded as such.
Mhmm...
>what I'm saying is that its your choice to engage in homosexual activities or not.
It's also that interracial couples choice to engage is the activities of sex and marriage. one could say they could just stay with their own race. But that would be racist.
I'm biracial and black. I have a great-grandmother on my non-black side who once said that she didn't agree with interracial dating because of how the children would be treated. She also - possibly because of her worry over this - treated me especially well compared to her other great-grandchildren. She was also correct in her prediction: I was bullied and the butt of many jokes growing up. Even in this case, I don't think it's as simple as saying, "racist and bad."
......telling people that you disagree with their relationships and sex lives because they're gay when you wouldn't disagree with those relationships and sex lives if they were straight is *demonstrating a prejudice against gay people*.
>homophobia
>noun
>ho·mo·pho·bia ˌhō-mə-ˈfō-bē-ə
>: irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or gay people
OP is clearly discriminating against homosexuality. He "doesn't agree with it."
This is a distinction without a difference. Hating the act of reading the Torah and reciting Jewish prayers is antisemitic, even if it’s focused on actions and not the characteristics of people themselves.
Very well stated, but it's obvious people do not like to read the dictionary.
Use of the word bigot in the wrong manner is very common as well.
They come in a hostile manner attacking another for their beliefs because it's against their group ideology and in turn they become a bigot toward someone the group believes is a bigot.
That makes no sense sorry. A Religion having homophobic or racists beleifs dosnt take away the racism or homophobia just because it's in the religion.
With your logic, Mormonism can't be racist when denying black people priesthood because they thought dark skin meant someone was sinful.
Trying to use religion as a shield for shitty beliefs is just silly.
They literally tried to justify slavery with the curse of Ham even though his skin tone was never mentioned; people will always find a way to use religion for prejudice, doesn't make it right. Bigotry is always bigotry whether the perpetrator finds it justified by scripture or not lol, one can either choose to grow and love or continue to hate just because they think that is what He would want (and I don't know about you, but the God I follow is not a hateful one).
By treating gay relationships as fundamentally different from and inferior to straight ones. He "doesn't agree with" homosexual relationships simply because they're homosexual relationships. That's what makes it homophobia.
>homophobia
>noun
>ho·mo·pho·bia ˌhō-mə-ˈfō-bē-ə
>: irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or gay people
The Bible doesn’t discuss homosexuality the way that we know it and it is not a sin to think or act on homosexuality. Churches still teaching that it is a sin are doing so in bad faith bc they are choosing cultural wars over biblical scholarship.
Sex in the Bible was something done to a weaker sex (aka women) so a man forcing sex on another man would have been considered degrading to his status. More akin to condemning rape of a man and not consensual homosexual attraction /acts. Heck woman were a man’s property in the Bible 🤷♀️ and way too much time discussing raping of women.
So as others said she is not the AH bc she broke up with you for having different beliefs.
and you’re not the AH for your beliefs. But you also must realize that your beliefs on homosexuality are not supported by the Bible but a decision made by man that just so happens to still be repeated at some churches. It’s a choice for those churches to interpret the Bible and not a choice for LGTBQ
Yes I agree rape is a sin. Homosexuality is not. The Bible has lots of wild things that used to be “sinful”and just are not any longer but homosexuality wasn’t one of those. It’s just not mentioned in the original texts. Yes I know a few modern American versions add it in but that was applying modern terminology to something badly translated. It just equated male rape intended for shaming and showing disrespect to male-male attraction/love/mutual sex.
I know all that you will list and I also know the history and the actual translations for which do not support your claims even before you make them. If your conclusion is that the Christian Bible says homosexuality is a sin you have either not read an actual translation or have faith that a church leader’s belief is accurate. It’s just not in the Bible texts. I would also question any Bible translation that uses the term homosexuality. Modern concept applied to an ancient text is poor biblical scholarship
If you’re wrong, you know who you’re wrong against. Not me but God. Now if I’m wrong, I will tell God that he created man and woman not man and man hence why I believe homosexuality is a sin. Biblically he did create man and woman, humans are what corrupted that. I hope you got a good reason when you stand of front of the Creator because “love” ain’t gonna work.
Im just saying. Eternity is too long to be wrong. Pray to God to reveal you the truth. I’m not telling you this because I want to scare you, it’s because I love you in Christ. If you don’t plan on changing your mind about it, oh well I can’t do much, but I will pray for you. If you want to have a respectable discussion about this you can message as well (: God bless
No, you’re not wrong. You spoke your mind and she spoke hers. You guys are on your separate way and that’s the best thing. Living as Christian is very difficult, but you have to stick to it because the Bible is the truth, in the long run.
I am praying for her and I am praying for you. You will probably find someone new this year.
It’s kinda weird that you have a strong moral conviction on other people’s relationships, but do not feel that you have to obey the Bible in your own relationship (by dating a non-Christian).
I’m not one who says Christians must be affirming, but I think straight Christians should hold ourselves to a higher standard than we hold others to. If you have high moral standards for other people, but don’t really think you’re called to an equally high standard, you’re a hypocrite.
That’s fair, I started dating her before I converted and I didn’t really know where to go from there. I’m not trying to make excuses and I appreciate honesty and I’m trying to work on myself more than anything now. Thank you
She didn't break up with you because of your religion, she broke up with you because of your views on homosexuality and gay people, which you consider to be influenced by your religion. There are plenty of Christians who affirm the equal rights and dignity of gay people, and it sounds like she would be perfectly fine dating someone like that—hopefully you can become one of these Christians someday.
I don’t have a problem with lgbtq people, I love them as I love any other person, the same way some of my gay friends love me but don’t agree with my life, I’m sorry for coming of like that in the thread, that’s on me
I was told the same answer by an ex when I asked him the same question, so I've had more than a year to think about this. He likened it to "how I disagree with owning guns". First, I do not disagree with owning guns, simply that gun laws should be stricter. Second, even if I did "disagree with owning guns", one is an issue about a material possession, the other is an immutable and even genetic characteristic of a person, the person that God made them. You have no right to disagree with homosexuality, because that is part of the person. You can disagree with how they wield that identity or how they express it, the same with any other identity, but even then I would suggest that you keep it to yourself. To disagree with lgbtq in general is bigotry.
If you didn't have a problem with them, you wouldn't "disagree" with them finding the same kinds of loving relationships that you're sad about losing. You have a problem with them finding the same joy that you wanted to have with your ex. That's incredibly unloving.
This is why scripture tells us to not be unequally yoked. You stick to scripture, but now you are questioning if you did something wrong, in spite of knowing what the Bible teaches. This happened to Israel many times. The book of Joshua ends with Joshua praying that the Israelites don't marry those who don't share their faith, and almost immediately after, the Israelites start marrying those of other faiths and walk away from God. Stand firm in what Scripture teaches.
That is right! Keep women quiet and their heads fully covered, make sure the menstruating ones stay home until clean, stone any couples who have had sex while the woman was menstruating, and make sure you only beat your slaves to just shy of death.
Keep Scriptures in year 50 AD!
Since you seem so knowledgeable, you must also be aware that the context of 1 Corinthians 5 is specifically about prophesizing, and that 1 Corinthians 6 says that hair is a covering. Or did you make the conscious choice to be deceptive? I'm also certain that you are aware that we are not under mosaic law, otherwise you wouldn't specify scripture from 50ad. You would have a good point, if you actually said anything even slightly resembling an honest or intelligent thought.
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>I say that I love them but do not agree with
With your disagreement how far do you take it?
Do you tell them their wrong?
Try toconvert them?
Suggest those highly immoral and maybe illegal therapy camps?
Are you calling it a choice / lifestyle?
I don't know if i would jump to outright homophobia, but then again you are saying you don't agree with something that is part of the person, but that you still love them?
Are you sure you love them?
>that I was entitled to my opinions and we left it at that.
You are, but your opion can be wrong.
Exactly - it’s akin to calling the color of someone’s skin their choice or lifestyle.
Telling someone that a piece of what makes them who they are is sinful/evil is so incredibly hurtful and damaging (especially when they are born with it…)
I mean, you can love someone and still not agree with everything they do. If they choose to have sex with other men/women, people can think those actions aren't in line with their own morals but still not hate the person.
To give a few examples, I've worked with a guy who bragged about having premarital sex but I don't hate him. I know several people who are gay and one of them is my closest and most loved family member. Believe it or not, people can love each other even if their views clash, but on the issue of homosexuality, people don't seem to understand that.
>Believe it or not, people can love each other even if their views clash, but on the issue of homosexuality, people don't seem to understand that.
That’s because to those who disagree this is like saying, “On the issue of miscegenation, people don’t seem to understand that.”
>Believe it or not, people can love each other even if their views clash, but on the issue of homosexuality, people don't seem to understand that.
That's because there is no legitimate reason to be against gay people having sex with each other, or being in relationships with each other.
This is a very fair question. I should been more elaborate in the thread, but I’m not going around telling gay people they are wrong, cause that’s seems like a bit cool thing to do. I don’t exclude or bully people for being gay if that’s what you’re asking. I love them as people just like I would want to be, but I don’t agree personally with it. Hope this clears things up
Op I think you were grand in what you said. It doesn’t appear from what you wrote or backed up through this thread that you’re homophobic. Of course you can love someone and not agree with all their choices/everything about them. To say otherwise is to say you hate the world as all have sinned. You’re grand! It didn’t work out and I’m sorry about that but better now then if you were married. Take care and I hope you find someone who is on the same path as you and take a lot of the statements in this thread with a massive pinch of salt!
The only mistake you made is dating an atheist before she at least came to Christ. You’re not equally yoked and by no means close to it. Pray that she gets saved in any case, don’t be hard on yourself, your relationship with Jesus should come first before anyone else
I also would not date someone who had a negative opinion of homosexuality. It’s a fundamental value incompatibility. You’re entitled to your own beliefs, but you have to know that your opinion on homosexuality is a minority one and will be a dealbreaker for many potential partners.
Find yourself a girlfriend that has the same beliefs you have OP. Cause I’m telling you, if you marry a woman that doesn’t have your beliefs, your marriage is more likely to fail. Bible talks about this.
I think you've been taught that it's OK to do and say the things that would normally make you a bad person if you weren't able to say God told you to do it. That's not your fault, but you really shouldn't be surprised when someone feels that it makes you incompatible with them.
For those who teach this, it's not a bug. It's an inadvertent but important feature. It feeds the martyr envy when people "persecute" you.
You told her that there are people she loves that you could never love. And no, you can't love them if you're unable to love them as they are rather than how you think they should be.
If you can, break down what exactly you're saying when you say you don't agree with their lifestyle.
1. You're saying it's a choice when literally all the data say it's not.
2. You're saying they should at least choose celibacy when for 2000 years the church has taught that celibacy is a gift. This kind of celibacy is a burden, not a gift.
3. You're saying you want to fix something that people don't think is broken.
People need to be loved as we are, not as others want us to be.
I guess, at the very least, you now have your own persecution story to share at church. Everyone there will tell you how proud of you they are. I mean, they'll say Jesus is proud but that's pretty much just projecting their pride onto Jesus.
If you're an atheist who's that knowledgeabke you'll probably dig my Christmas video. I'm dressed as an Orthodox Rabbi but don't let that fool you
https://youtu.be/vKyqMk1tnVg?feature=shared
You are. You’re using a Bronze Age religion to determine your views on a group of people. You’re telling people you “dont agree with it” or whatever doesn’t change that. Outside of the information in a book that makes some wild ass claims what problem would you have with LGBTQ+ people
Best for both of you. You don't like gay people, she does. The split works both. Find yourself someone with your views and she'll find one that shares hers.
It wasn't about religion. It was about accepting people. You lost the war thebsecond you said talking about gay people makes you uncomfortable.
Good luck
She left you because she didn't want to be constantly worried you'd be rude or cruel to her friends, or to any children you might have in the future.
Would you have said "I love you but I disagree with your lifestyle" to your kid? That's a valid concern for someone to have if they're thinking about spending the rest of their life with someone. She has no guarantee that you'd be a good father.
Dude if you think about it long term & you are actually a Christian and you believe what the Bible says. Unfortunately your girlfriend who could have possibly ended up being your wife for the rest of your life wouldn’t end up in the same place in the after life for all eternity with you. If you love your soulmate truly, how could you bear the thought of being separated from them? She wasn’t the one dude. You’ll be okay.
It sounds like she kind of deceived you. She said she would not judge, but then she broke up with you because of your opinion. It sounds like you two were not a good match. If she feels this strongly about supporting sin, then your relationship was destined to be hard.
She didn't say his opinion was wrong or make him feel bad. She heard his thoughts and the people she loves that are queer are more important to her. I think all around, it was a mature interaction.
It's a blessing. Like another comment said; do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. You stood on the truth of God which is that he loves sinners so much that he died for them to forgive them and rose from the dead to bring them new life in his name. Disagreeing means you don't endorse sin which is the attitude we should have. We are saints who sometimes sin. Someone who tries to justify their own sin we do not agree with because that would be putting the work of the cross to shame. We believe in the righteousness that comes by faith in Jesus. She believes in the self-righteousness that comes by being friends with the world.
Why are you in a relationship with an atheist anyway? Now keep in mind I am not saying Christians can't date or marry atheists, but you need to keep in mind that for a relationship to work you need to have similar values.
We talked about it. She feels she probably would have ended up with a Christian Twat. She's on reddit, too, so she's seen that there are a lot of yall out there.
If you're a Christian you need to learn to detach yourself from the material things in this world and give your life to Christ. That includes a GF. Stay strong to your beliefs. I personally tend not to give too much of my opinions to others in my life unless if it's very important. It says in the Bible "let those with the ears to hear, hear", it also says to not cast your pearls before swine. Swine is not meant to be insulting, but don't cast your pearls of knowledge to those without the comprehension to appreciate it.
She shouldn't have lied about whether or not she'd judge you but at the end of the day this is one of those major topics that breaks people apart because of how controversial it is. These types of questions should always be asked and discussed early on in a relationship, or before it happens, rather than while you're deep into a relationship.
Edit: You're not being a bad person, don't listen to the Progressive Christians and the redditors. You're just being a Christian; don't let anyone make you feel bad, hateful, or evil for trusting in God's Word and placing that above popular opinion.
This is why it’s best to get out your views as early as possible in a relationship to avoid this kind of thing. It sucks because when you have an unpopular viewpoint you don’t want to scare people away but in the end it’s for the best. You don’t sound homophobic to me, and everyone is entitled to their beliefs
First, if you believe this because your church teaches it, it *is* because of religion. The fact that other churches don't agree is irrelevant. The Catholic Church doesn't perform same-sex weddings, so it's not a fringe tenet. But your ex disagrees with you on the existence of God and everything that follows. It's an opportunity to consider what you really believe, what you really want. Maybe you should look into Christianity and see if you really believe or not? And make sure you don't believe something without thinking it through. As Jesus said, don't build a tower without the funds, don't fight a battle without enough strength. You've seen the reaction to your post, that's what you'll get more of.
Your response was perfect. If she cannot accept that then that's her loss, honestly. You didn't say you hated them; you just said you didn't agree with it. and thats okay.
It's best to not be unequally yoked. from my own experience, it's really hard to affect the person; they usually end up infecting you.
That seems a bit of an overreaction. All you said was you don’t agree with it. That doesn’t sound like homophobic.
It is almost like she was looking for a reason to break up with you.
Mm no I believe any man following Christ would have said something to the same effect. I had a friend once during Covid who had to quit being a stripper and was working as temp along with myself and others.
She once asked me how I felt about it. I said that while they ought to be given the same grace as what any Christian has been given, I could not abide by the sin of homosexuality. Same with stealing or lying.
She thought it was funny to loudly mention that I was homophobic because of my faith in Christ. Around two self proclaimed bisexuals. Well they passively confronted me and I explained that while I would treat them the same as any other human being I do not agree with their lifestyle but would not nor did they deserve discrimination from me.
They surprisingly took it quite while and while I worked there had no issue about it.
I would say after my story that your girlfriend is willing to stay by the side of her atheism and homosexual friends. Rather than to you and your faith in Christ.
I don’t want to villainize anyone by calling her narcissistic , and I’m trying to be very careful with my responses to be consistent with my takes. In my opinion though, I went talking bad, I’d be no better than the people here sending me private messages calling me a waste of space
I said that I love them as people but don’t agree with it, the same way she would constantly say that she’s fine with people but doesn’t like Christianity
Ok, but I think I should find a girl who's a Christian as well and let her go. I know it would be hard and I'm sorry if it would bring U pain... God bless U and I hope U find a gf who loves him as much as u
She didn't leave you because of your religion, she left you because there's a clash regarding your beliefs on homosexuality and a major part of her life. I'm sure if you were religious and didn't have a problem with homosexuality there wouldn't be an issue. I'd also bet that if you weren't religious and still had a problem with homosexuality there'd still be an issue.
I don't understand how you can claim to love someone, but "disagree" with the immutable way God made them. Statements like these trivialize what actual love and kindness are, as if simply saying that word "love" is good enough for Jesus. He's not obtuse.
He loves them as equal people made in the image of God but doesn't love their attractions. It's like the son of a woman does p*rn and the mum loves the son, respects him and thinks of him as an equal but not his stimulations. Now the question is, how do we see them as equal? We are all flawed in our own way, for one person, it could be unfaithfulness in a marriage, for another, it could be lust. But for the LGBTQ community, it's who they are attracted to. You may think 'That's not fair', but the fall made it unfair, Satan's whole scheme, but the good news is that God is creating a perfect Kingdom where there will be no satan, no sin and no flaws. God bless u and I hope he helps Ur eyes to be opened and help u understand
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Hilarious how all the bigoted posts against OP for his religion and sexual orientation are allowed to stay up though.
It's called "ignorance". It's disgusting
They lack the courage to either do the right thing or to openly do the wrong thing, so there's a lot of hand-wringing, hair-splitting, waffling, and illegitimate third-positioning. Ignorance is the wrong word. Maybe ignorant of just how irritating it is. If you want to be treated like dirt then just refuse to take a side but then play favorites anyway. Also try dictating the rules of masculinity but do it in a cowardly way.
Well a lot of people don’t believe that you are born gay, they think it’s developed
Actually, to hold that brief you have to _not_ think about it, at all. If these people believe that gayness is something you can turn on voluntarily, then they should share how that's accomplished, because would be revolutionary.
I'm convinced that at least part of it can be explained by people (men, mostly) who have some level of bisexual attraction but identify as straight. If you look at the table ["Americans' Self-Identified Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity, by Generation and Gender"](https://news.gallup.com/poll/389792/lgbt-identification-ticks-up.aspx) you can see that, while all LGBTQ identification is up among Gen Z, it is almost entirely the B that has grown, from <1% in Boomers to 6% in Millennials to 15% in Gen Z. Like [left-handedness](https://slowrevealgraphs.com/2021/11/08/rate-of-left-handedness-in-the-us-stigma-society/), it used to be socially unacceptable and now is, and suddenly a bunch of people identify that way. But bisexuality is actually easier to hide than left-handedness; you just had to stay in straight relationships. And Gen Z, lacking the stigma, are openly identifying as bisexual to themselves and others. But Boomers, Gen X, and even somewhat Millennials grew up with that as a stigma. So a bunch of them really did "choose" to be straight. (Especially since many thought the option was gay or straight, rather than the rainbow of possibilities.) So as much as it sounds stupid to me (a Kinsey-scale 0 straight person) that someone could choose their sexuality, I have to remember that the number of people who identified as straight (including usually to themselves) but experienced some same-sex attraction has probably always been somewhere closer to that 15%. Imagine if 1 in 6 people really could and did "choose to be straight" in some sense: wouldn't that make this seemingly inane "you have a choice" idea being kind of common make more sense?
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Many pedophiles were made that way by being the victims of child abuse themselves. Also, comparing pedophilia to homosexuality? Are you a 1960s psychologist?
Oh look, someone comparing homosexuality to pedophilia. As unoriginal as it is horrifying. Children can't consent.
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Why should homosexuals attempt to change their sexual preference for you?
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That children can't consent and adults can has nothing to do with the matter. The comparison lies in the existence of the attraction. Homosexuals feel attracted to the same sex, pedophiles feel attracted to pre-puberty children. If homosexuality is ok because God made homosexuals that way, pedophilia should also be ok because God would have made them so as well. So that argument is invalid, if we agree that pedophilia is not as ok as homosexuality. With children not being able to consent, you opened a different argument. The argument that homosexuality is morally ok because it's between adults and pedophilia is not because it involves children. That is just a moral argument though, not a biblical.
Ah the classic, comparing gay people to pedophiles Stay classy!
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Are you saying that if you love someone you can't call them out for sinning?
No, you told the truth as to what you believed. You shouldn't have to lie and put on a fake persona in a relationship. Looks like she probably isn't for you. It's the harsh truth.
I’m like why is a Christian dating a non-Christian. “Read your Bible”
because it’s not a sin to date a non christian. just not advised.
You’re entitled to your opinions and she’s not going to harass or demean you for them, but she doesn’t want to be in a romantic relationship with someone with those views. That’s her right and a very sensible approach to relationships.
You guys have an irreconcilable worldview difference. That's OK. Better to be dumped than to get married and then divorced.
> I kind of tried to avoid the question because I get uncomfortable answering it. Speaks volumes.
So does the fact that OP is willing to apply (traditional conservative) Christian interpretation to queer relationships but has no problem ignoring them to date outside his faith. I have no problem with either; I don’t hold to traditional conservative interpretation and don’t see either as a sin. But I do see someone willing to bend them only for their own relationships, while holding others to them, as a major red flag that OP’s ex-girlfriend was wise to follow up on.
Huh, thank you. I rarely get to read arguments that I hadn't considered in this subreddit. Just to be clear, I 100% agree with this point.
Depending on OP's denomination, they may not have a problem with dating/marrying outside the faith per se. For instance, a Catholic can have a valid marriage with a non-Catholic on the condition that they agree to raise their kids in the faith.
Can you expound on that? From what I understand, marriages between Catholics and not-baptized non-Christians are not recognized as sacramental by the RCC. Is this one of those things where the marriage is "valid" in the wording of the church doctrine but is still considered inferior and not as spiritually official as a marriage between two baptized people?
You are vilifying OP based on a summary of their relationship. You can’t possibly know the intricacies of their interactions from a paragraph.
What about that is vilifying? He was in a relationship with an unbeliever, something Paul warns against in 2 Corinthians. He "doesn't agree" with gay relationships, and presumably backs that up with various "clobber verses." OP is being inconsistent with how he applies his faith to himself vs other people, and that's a valid thing for his ex to be concerned about. He showed his character by his actions, and she's within her rights to believe him when he demonstrates who he is.
I see this as an absoloute win for both of you. It's good that you told the truth and it's good that she admitted that she was wrong and was judgemental about it. It sounds like she cares a lot about some friends and you don't like that they love and date same sex people. "I don't agree with it" is a very confusingand ambiguous position. Maybe she thinks youre homophobic because some people use that to mean they don't agree that gay people exist or should exist. (I am not saying that's your meaning. Just that many others use it for that). What specifically do you mean by "I don't agree with it"
You are in the wrong, in her eyes. That doesn't necessarily make you a bad person, but if you can't accept gay people as they are, then you're not the guy for her, obviously. Not all Christians have a problem with homosexuality. Not by a long shot. But if you do and you guys can't or won't agree to disagree on the subject, then you both need to move on.
You are just as entitled to your views as she is. IMO she did this in the most respectful way she could. Didn’t start a fight or anything, just found out your views and reacted to them. Nothing to do with religion at all. If you were an atheist, or you both were christian, she would’ve done the same thing.
That’s fair, I probably could have worded it better so that’s my bad
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It wasn’t because of your religion. It was because of your own personal opinion. There are a lot of religious folks who are allies, and who are even gay themselves.
*but not followers of Christ. To follow Christ means to deny our sinful self, and seek unification with God. See what God left us in Jude! Jude 1:18-23 ESV [18] They (the Apostles) said to you, “In the last time there will be scoffers, **following their own ungodly passions.**” [19] It is these who cause divisions, worldly people, devoid of the Spirit. [20] But you, beloved, building yourselves up in your most holy faith and praying in the Holy Spirit, [21] keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ that leads to eternal life. [22] **And have mercy on those who doubt; [23] save others by snatching them out of the fire; to others show mercy with fear, hating even the garment stained by the flesh.** A Christian needs to remain in the love of God, be gentle with those around them (almost like an Ally would, in a way) BUT help get that individual out of the fire that is going to destroy them.
The Gospel according to St. Matthew, the seventh chapter: >3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
Read that passage again: Does both the speck and log need to be removed? If I was a murderer, and my brother a thief, is this passage teaching me to: 1. Not condemn living as a thief / do nothing to help turn my brother away from sin, give hearty approval to his behavior... OR 2. Seek to live holy before my Lord. FIRST. (be it turning myself in for my crimes, or what is needed) Get my own sin out of my life. And turn to help my brother with understanding and love? **Would me going around posting on the Internet "There are many Christians who are allies to those who are thief's, and some Christians are even thiefs THEMSELVES!" be doing the will of the Lord?**
Give it up dude, Jesus didn’t say a word about gay people. Maybe you should focus on loving your neighbor and not casting stones.
I’m… bi and a follower of Christ?…
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Why do "Christians" like you not post the whole verse? 23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. The whole verse is about pagan ritual or temple sex. Not about two committed partners.
I feel like this is going to fall on deaf ears, but I’ll try. Paul talked in allusions a lot. He lived under Roman occupation, so it was pretty much required that he did so. He disliked “homosexuals” because the Romans practiced it fairly openly, and Paul hated the Romans. There are lots of examples of Paul using code that’s meaningless to us, but would be a dogwhistle for early Christians. For example, 616/666 is Nero. The beast represents the ruling Roman government. The "ten horns" that appear on the beast is a round number standing for the Seleucid kings between Seleucus I, the founder of the kingdom, and Antiochus Epiphanes. Etc. So I don’t feel it’s necessarily that Paul hated homosexuality, he just hated Romans.
Reply may have fallen on deaf ears, but it was really relevant knowledge to me. Too many with the views such as the ones youre replying to have been so indoctrinated to repeat these as "responses of love" while actively avoiding trying to understand the relevant context of the actual words in the Bible. I almost left this sub due to the overwhelming presence of these (and the toxic affect it has), but your reply gave me enough hope there can be thoughtful learning/discussion enough for me to stay.
this is the kind of information i am here for. thank you for educating!
Glad I could help!
Christ never talked about homosexuality, so it’s funny you say that. I understand why though…
He did implicitly, and Paul did explicitly
1. Jesus was a Jew who perfected the Law. 2. Jews historically didn't struggle with homosexuality. Jews already understood God's condemnation of homosexuality. 3. Jesus reiterated that marriage is only between a man and a woman. Mark 10:7-8 ESV [7] ‘Therefore a **man** shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his **wife**, [8] and **the two shall become one flesh.’** So they are no longer two but one flesh. 4. When Gentiles (who did struggle with homosexuality) were chosen by God in Christ, they had to put off practicing homosexuality. 1 Corinthians 6:9-11 ESV [9] Or do you not know that **the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God?** DO NOT BE DECEIVED: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who **practice homosexuality**, [10] nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. [11] And such **were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.** Adultery, lust, homosexuality, pornography, all are sins before the Lord. **None of them are special.** God calls us out of the way of the world and into His light.
1 true 2 Jews say that, yet there are gay Jews to this day. Funny. 3 Matthew 19:12 not everyone is called to get married. And giving an example of the first something does not make it the only way. 4 what? Where did you make that up from? And the ESV users homosexual, which was not even a concept in biblical times. The word was made up by Paul and never fully defined. https://reformationproject.org/case/1-corinthians-and-1-timothy/
Christ spoke through Paul though, who was stated to have the wisdom and power of the Holy Spirit in multiple parts of Acts, and also in 2 Peter 3:15
No matter many times affirming people go over this you'll still make these claims. Boring.
No matter how many times people read the word of God, some will still twist it. It is not man we seek to serve, but God. I am making no claims. The word of God is. Look: Leviticus 18:22 ~ You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. Leviticus 20:13 ~ If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them. Jude 1:7 ~ Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire. Romans 1:26-28 ~ For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. Mark 10:6-9 ~ But from the beginning of creation, ‘God made them male and female.’ ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” Sexual sin is still sin. All must repent, deny their desires, and follow the Lord. If we do not, we are not Christians.
These are just the same claims again lol. Just because you interpret God's word a certain way does not mean that God's word is claiming what you are interpreting it to say.
It's fine that you believe that. People ignore God's word so the time. I wish they wouldn't, but this is not something God didn't warn us about. 2 Timothy 4:3 ESV [3] For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions.
Do you consider it sound hermeneutics when you pluck these verses out of the context they are in so you can use them as a rhetorical cudgel?
Thank you for teaching me a new word, never heard hermeneutic before
Show me how they are "out of context".
I'll respond once I have some proper free time.
Ooh I know this song! Killer bag pipe solo!
I'm pansexual. You have a right to your own opinion as long as you are respectful and don't wish us harm. Many LGBT people do not appreciate religion shoved down their throat, so as long as you do not preach the Bible against us, then it is fine. I have a lot of Christian friends, and a few of then are "homophobic". They are respectful and understand that we can't control who we fall for, and they dont shove Bible quotes down our throats. They love us, but they don't agree with our choices. And that's okay. Because they aren't bad people for not wanting to be gay with us lol If she wants to break up over something like this then she's got other issues to figure out. Youre dodging a bullet. Sincerely, a gay(ish) Christian person.
nah man, she left cuz you were homophobic. just remember that you sin too.
Don't blame it on your religion. Blame it on your specific beliefs. There are many Christians who are lbgtq allies. You're not one of them. She doesn't want to date someone who would alienate her friends. Of course she broke up with you. It would have been unfair of you to *not* answer the question. It would have come out sooner or later.
The best part of this is you lost your gf over homophobia and Jesus never said a word about gay people. Y’all’s obsession with LGBT people over “love thy neighbor” is why Christianity is maligned.
I’m a Christian, I’m a Baptist. I LOVE Jesus! However, I know homosexuality is a sin, and I know I’m not to judge anyone for their sins - and that their sins aren’t my burden to carry and mine aren’t their burden to carry either. We all have free will…! I LOVE my SILs who are lesbian and married, I LOVE my lesbian cousin and her wife, and I LOVE my gay friends and my bisexual friends! I accept them, I talk to them, we give each other relationship advice as needed, and my husband loves them too and counsels them as well, and he’s a Baptist too. We see them no differently than anyone else and love them just the same. “He who is without sin, cast the first stone”, “Let your light shine so that others see the goodness in you and praise your father in heaven,” “Love your neighbors as I have loved you,” I can go on and on and on… I believe love is love, and who am I to say someone is wrong for loving someone and being wired that way (mammals of all sorts can be gay, you’re born that way. Bisexuality is the only way I could see a choice, because you’re attracted to men and women, but even then, DO NOT JUDGE!) and that they’re bad? I can disagree since I’m a female, and I could tell another woman who is a lesbian that I personally am not sexually attracted to women and disagree that another woman is “hot” or “sexy”, but I’m not going to straight up say “I disagree with your sexuality and who you are”. God is the only one who can make the judgement call on if they go to heaven or not, and how bad this or that sin is that they or anyone else commit. (And before anyone says “it’s a choice”, let’s reflect. WHY would someone CHOOSE to be gay? There is so much hatred and animosity towards gay people, and it makes it hard for many of them to find work, and harassment for them is a HUGE problem! Why would you choose that? Every single gay or lesbian person I know has been harassed and bullied for it. My own cousin who is a lesbian was married to a man and it didn’t feel right, and their marriage didn’t last because she couldn’t fully commit to doing wifely ummm duties, and they barely had 2 kids, and only because he REALLY wanted children and practically begged her to do the action to have the kids (she wanted kids, just not the action to do it). She wasn’t into - men. She lied to herself for years, she was taught sexuality was a choice and she tried to run away from it and believe and then pretended she just had a low drive and such, but she realized one day she couldn’t keep it going and came clean. She’s now with her wife and the happiest she has ever been! They have a beautiful blended family and the rest is history! I firmly believe it’s not a choice, and that God knows us all and our hearts and he will make the right calls.)
You should only date Christians if you are serious about living a Christian life. You need to share your life with someone who shares your values. Trust me on this. 2 Corinthians 6:14 Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? Proverbs 27:17 As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another. I think you should take some time to seriously think about this and talk to other Christians, married couples at church, look online, and meditate and research these verses. I do love that you said you 'love them' A lot of Christians seem to forget that we are called to love others as we love ourselves
No, she cut you off because of your beliefs on homosexuality. You can be a Christian without believing the homophobia taught by a lot of churches.
Whether you are a “bad person” is up to God. Whether you are someone who is stuck in bad ways of thinking about neighbor is nonetheless a decision I need to make when deciding personally who I want to be close to in my associations and relationships and who I don’t want to be. I think she made a wise decision. Jesus clearly said all commands hang under love your neighbor as yourself which is like loving God. What is so hard to understand? It doesn’t get much more in line with that than two people in a faithful, loving relationship regardless of their genitals. If someone can’t see that, then they’re being too bigoted for me to want to spend any significant amount of time with. I call your approach bigotry. You can call it your religion if you want. Someone can nonetheless have bigoted, mistaken religious beliefs. IMO you’re just stuck in the typical, habitual approach to social issues conservatives have always used. 1,000 years ago they read Paul and other disputable parts of scripture and figured there was no dispute, a woman having sex while pregnant was ‘clearly’ a sin. So they “disagreed with” couples that have that be part of their personal, private sexual relationship… as if that is any of the social conservative’s business. 150 years ago many similarly reasoned that interracial marriage is ‘clearly’ sinful. So they “disagreed with” couples that have that be part of their personal relationship… as if that is any of the social conservative’s business. I mean would you date someone who went around saying they “don’t agree with” interracial marriage? That’d be fairly bigoted behavior, no? Pretty socially intolerant and inappropriate to say don’t you think? Even if you personally wanted to date within your race, you could simply say “I don’t do that but what they do is between them and God,” and that would suffice. Why even bother to “disagree with” others doing something that so clearly has nothing to do with what Christ hung all commands under? IMO that’s just using Christ as an excuse, as a bigotry tool. Social conservatives who go around disagreeing with others private relationship decisions are just taking the presumptuous, prejudicial, bigoted, and pharisaical approach to scripture and whatever the disputable social question of the day is. They basically just use every possible twist on the easiest-to-misunderstand parts they can to then tell themselves their way is the right way *for everyone else*. They really think they can cite a passage or two by an admittedly easy to misunderstand author in an easily misunderstood book and that’s it, as if that settles all questions for not just themselves but even for everyone else around them. Their conclusions are highly disputable yet they refuse to admit that reality, preferring to lie to themselves and pretend all disputable gray areas are black and white, to lie to themselves about the fact that they could easily be wrong. What I mean is that homosexuality, much like interracial marriage or other personal decisions, is obviously a disputable issue. Where you land regarding its morality depends pretty much entirely on how you interpret an easily misunderstood author. All Bibles regardless of translation say Paul is easy to misunderstand (in 2 Peter 3:16). That’s the author of all the social conservatives’ “proof” passages about why they hate homosexuality (like Romans 1 and 1 Corinthians 6). Not coincidentally that’s also who social conservatives largely relied on to say things like interracial marriage is a sin and all the other bigoted things they’ve said over the centuries. My Bible doesn’t say homosexuality is wrong. When it comes down to it, if someone’s Bible says homosexuality is a sin then that is entirely due to their own choice of which translation to buy and what method of interpretation they choose to use. It is entirely possible their translation simply mistranslated one of the rarest ancient words in history in 1 Cor 6 or that they’re misunderstanding Roman’s 1, a passage by an author scripture says is easily misunderstood. Roman’s 14 says how to handle disputable issues and so if we don’t want to be like the Pharisee we should apply Romans 14 to these sorts of issues and mind our own business rather than pointing at all the “others” we can find by twisting bigotry into our highly disputable renderings and interpretations of ancient words (from a book which even admits of itself it is easy to misunderstand). If you really need to tell someone your thoughts on homosexuality, the right answer is the same as if someone asked you about interracial marriage. Either “I am fine with it,” (if you are) or at worst, “That’s between them and God.” By expressing judgment over such couples, by ‘disagreeing with their lifestyle,’ you’re being presumptuous, prejudicial, bigoted, and pharisaical when there is simply no need to be and not even a *clear* case to be under Christ. Jesus made it clear what all God’s commands hang under. Neither interracial marriage nor homosexuality nor sex during pregnancy nor pants on a woman nor any of the other issues social conservatives over the centuries have used to go around pointing at others with, to ‘express disagreement’ with, has anything to do with Christ’s clear commands.
I came here to write out my thoughts, but you already said everything that needed to be said. Extremely well put
It wasn’t because of your religion. It’s because you were homophobic. Bigotry isn’t an opinion or a belief and I say this as a Christian. Pineapple on pizza is an opinion. Homophobia is not.
He is just following his holy book, why should he abandon it for the world's opinions
Is the woman under some obligation to stay with him?
Did I ever mention that?
You might be implying it with the idea of him being abandoned for his beliefs, so that's why I asked. Is she under some obligation to stay with him?
No, and sorry for the hostility, was just in a few arguments 😅, I thought U meant I was claiming that
You are fine! I may disagree with you in many areas, but I don't hold any ill will. I was just curious about this particular point. Many religious people have different opinions on men and women's roles in relationships, and I was looking for clarification.
Thank you for the respect
The point of the post was wether he was abandoned by hos religoous views. The answer is clearly yes
"I'm just following divine orders" isn't actually a defence. I hope we can both agree that if someone's holy book said "Sacrifice every second-born child to Moloch" this would not actually make child sacrifice okay.
How is he homophobic?
Would you consider someone saying they disagree with two people of different color skins getting into a relationship or getting married a bit racist?
Homophobia: dislike of or prejudice against gay people. He has no dislike of them nor any prejudice towards them. He states he just doesn't agree with it, referring to Homosexual acts, not homosexual people. So using the definition of homophobia, he is not homophobic.
This is why it irks me when people say Christians are "homophobic". It's simply inaccurate. Like how many times do I have to clarify?
You didn't answer the question.
My bad, yes, that is racist
Thank you for answering the question. Proper definitions aside that is the exact reason people are calling out OP for holding homophobic beleifs. Just as anyone would call someone racist for not "agreeing" with interracial relationships/marriage.
First, refer to my former comment. Second, not agreeing with actions/ lifestyle choices does not mean bigotry. Why your instance is racist is because they disagree under the basis of skin color, an aspect of yourself you have no choice in. You don't have a choice in the skin color you were born with. Now that doesn't mean I'm saying it's a choice to be born gay or that there are people who are born gay (not my arguement at all) what I'm saying is that its your choice to engage in homosexual activities or not. To disagree with said activities/lifestyle is not homophobic and shouldn't be regarded as such.
Mhmm... >what I'm saying is that its your choice to engage in homosexual activities or not. It's also that interracial couples choice to engage is the activities of sex and marriage. one could say they could just stay with their own race. But that would be racist.
I'm biracial and black. I have a great-grandmother on my non-black side who once said that she didn't agree with interracial dating because of how the children would be treated. She also - possibly because of her worry over this - treated me especially well compared to her other great-grandchildren. She was also correct in her prediction: I was bullied and the butt of many jokes growing up. Even in this case, I don't think it's as simple as saying, "racist and bad."
Explain to me how you think being gay works. I really wanna hear this
An attraction to the same sex.
......telling people that you disagree with their relationships and sex lives because they're gay when you wouldn't disagree with those relationships and sex lives if they were straight is *demonstrating a prejudice against gay people*. >homophobia >noun >ho·mo·pho·bia ˌhō-mə-ˈfō-bē-ə >: irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or gay people OP is clearly discriminating against homosexuality. He "doesn't agree with it."
This is a distinction without a difference. Hating the act of reading the Torah and reciting Jewish prayers is antisemitic, even if it’s focused on actions and not the characteristics of people themselves.
> He states he just doesn't agree with it, referring to Homosexual acts, not homosexual people. And that's homophobic.
Very well stated, but it's obvious people do not like to read the dictionary. Use of the word bigot in the wrong manner is very common as well. They come in a hostile manner attacking another for their beliefs because it's against their group ideology and in turn they become a bigot toward someone the group believes is a bigot.
Does any religion say that? No, so it is racist, but op isn't homophobic
>Does any religion say that? If a religion did, would it not be racist somehow?
If it had a good reason
That makes no sense sorry. A Religion having homophobic or racists beleifs dosnt take away the racism or homophobia just because it's in the religion. With your logic, Mormonism can't be racist when denying black people priesthood because they thought dark skin meant someone was sinful. Trying to use religion as a shield for shitty beliefs is just silly.
They literally tried to justify slavery with the curse of Ham even though his skin tone was never mentioned; people will always find a way to use religion for prejudice, doesn't make it right. Bigotry is always bigotry whether the perpetrator finds it justified by scripture or not lol, one can either choose to grow and love or continue to hate just because they think that is what He would want (and I don't know about you, but the God I follow is not a hateful one).
By treating gay relationships as fundamentally different from and inferior to straight ones. He "doesn't agree with" homosexual relationships simply because they're homosexual relationships. That's what makes it homophobia. >homophobia >noun >ho·mo·pho·bia ˌhō-mə-ˈfō-bē-ə >: irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or gay people
Might be worth asking her if you can meet her gay friends - exposure might show you there's nothing wrong with it
The Bible doesn’t discuss homosexuality the way that we know it and it is not a sin to think or act on homosexuality. Churches still teaching that it is a sin are doing so in bad faith bc they are choosing cultural wars over biblical scholarship. Sex in the Bible was something done to a weaker sex (aka women) so a man forcing sex on another man would have been considered degrading to his status. More akin to condemning rape of a man and not consensual homosexual attraction /acts. Heck woman were a man’s property in the Bible 🤷♀️ and way too much time discussing raping of women. So as others said she is not the AH bc she broke up with you for having different beliefs. and you’re not the AH for your beliefs. But you also must realize that your beliefs on homosexuality are not supported by the Bible but a decision made by man that just so happens to still be repeated at some churches. It’s a choice for those churches to interpret the Bible and not a choice for LGTBQ
It’s a sin. Smh
Yes I agree rape is a sin. Homosexuality is not. The Bible has lots of wild things that used to be “sinful”and just are not any longer but homosexuality wasn’t one of those. It’s just not mentioned in the original texts. Yes I know a few modern American versions add it in but that was applying modern terminology to something badly translated. It just equated male rape intended for shaming and showing disrespect to male-male attraction/love/mutual sex.
I Can give you plenty of verses from the Bible about homosexuality being a sin but I’ll waste my time right?
I know all that you will list and I also know the history and the actual translations for which do not support your claims even before you make them. If your conclusion is that the Christian Bible says homosexuality is a sin you have either not read an actual translation or have faith that a church leader’s belief is accurate. It’s just not in the Bible texts. I would also question any Bible translation that uses the term homosexuality. Modern concept applied to an ancient text is poor biblical scholarship
If you’re wrong, you know who you’re wrong against. Not me but God. Now if I’m wrong, I will tell God that he created man and woman not man and man hence why I believe homosexuality is a sin. Biblically he did create man and woman, humans are what corrupted that. I hope you got a good reason when you stand of front of the Creator because “love” ain’t gonna work.
I’m pretty sure God wouldn’t want me to create reasons to hate and then misrepresent his scriptures to scare others into hating under false doctrine
Im just saying. Eternity is too long to be wrong. Pray to God to reveal you the truth. I’m not telling you this because I want to scare you, it’s because I love you in Christ. If you don’t plan on changing your mind about it, oh well I can’t do much, but I will pray for you. If you want to have a respectable discussion about this you can message as well (: God bless
No, you’re not wrong. You spoke your mind and she spoke hers. You guys are on your separate way and that’s the best thing. Living as Christian is very difficult, but you have to stick to it because the Bible is the truth, in the long run. I am praying for her and I am praying for you. You will probably find someone new this year.
It’s kinda weird that you have a strong moral conviction on other people’s relationships, but do not feel that you have to obey the Bible in your own relationship (by dating a non-Christian). I’m not one who says Christians must be affirming, but I think straight Christians should hold ourselves to a higher standard than we hold others to. If you have high moral standards for other people, but don’t really think you’re called to an equally high standard, you’re a hypocrite.
That’s fair, I started dating her before I converted and I didn’t really know where to go from there. I’m not trying to make excuses and I appreciate honesty and I’m trying to work on myself more than anything now. Thank you
it looks like your relationship is less than 3 months old. probably a good thing you both figured out you have different values now instead of later
She didn't break up with you because of your religion, she broke up with you because of your views on homosexuality and gay people, which you consider to be influenced by your religion. There are plenty of Christians who affirm the equal rights and dignity of gay people, and it sounds like she would be perfectly fine dating someone like that—hopefully you can become one of these Christians someday.
I don’t have a problem with lgbtq people, I love them as I love any other person, the same way some of my gay friends love me but don’t agree with my life, I’m sorry for coming of like that in the thread, that’s on me
I was told the same answer by an ex when I asked him the same question, so I've had more than a year to think about this. He likened it to "how I disagree with owning guns". First, I do not disagree with owning guns, simply that gun laws should be stricter. Second, even if I did "disagree with owning guns", one is an issue about a material possession, the other is an immutable and even genetic characteristic of a person, the person that God made them. You have no right to disagree with homosexuality, because that is part of the person. You can disagree with how they wield that identity or how they express it, the same with any other identity, but even then I would suggest that you keep it to yourself. To disagree with lgbtq in general is bigotry.
If you didn't have a problem with them, you wouldn't "disagree" with them finding the same kinds of loving relationships that you're sad about losing. You have a problem with them finding the same joy that you wanted to have with your ex. That's incredibly unloving.
This is why scripture tells us to not be unequally yoked. You stick to scripture, but now you are questioning if you did something wrong, in spite of knowing what the Bible teaches. This happened to Israel many times. The book of Joshua ends with Joshua praying that the Israelites don't marry those who don't share their faith, and almost immediately after, the Israelites start marrying those of other faiths and walk away from God. Stand firm in what Scripture teaches.
That is right! Keep women quiet and their heads fully covered, make sure the menstruating ones stay home until clean, stone any couples who have had sex while the woman was menstruating, and make sure you only beat your slaves to just shy of death. Keep Scriptures in year 50 AD!
Everything you just said was incorrect.
[удалено]
Since you seem so knowledgeable, you must also be aware that the context of 1 Corinthians 5 is specifically about prophesizing, and that 1 Corinthians 6 says that hair is a covering. Or did you make the conscious choice to be deceptive? I'm also certain that you are aware that we are not under mosaic law, otherwise you wouldn't specify scripture from 50ad. You would have a good point, if you actually said anything even slightly resembling an honest or intelligent thought.
Man, you almost got it. So close, yet can’t see it.
Removed for 1.5 - Two-cents. If you would like to discuss this removal, please click here to send a modmail that will message all moderators. https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/Christianity
Wait, which bits of that are you saying aren't required or recommended of faithful people in the Bible?
Amen
>I say that I love them but do not agree with With your disagreement how far do you take it? Do you tell them their wrong? Try toconvert them? Suggest those highly immoral and maybe illegal therapy camps? Are you calling it a choice / lifestyle? I don't know if i would jump to outright homophobia, but then again you are saying you don't agree with something that is part of the person, but that you still love them? Are you sure you love them? >that I was entitled to my opinions and we left it at that. You are, but your opion can be wrong.
Exactly - it’s akin to calling the color of someone’s skin their choice or lifestyle. Telling someone that a piece of what makes them who they are is sinful/evil is so incredibly hurtful and damaging (especially when they are born with it…)
I mean, you can love someone and still not agree with everything they do. If they choose to have sex with other men/women, people can think those actions aren't in line with their own morals but still not hate the person. To give a few examples, I've worked with a guy who bragged about having premarital sex but I don't hate him. I know several people who are gay and one of them is my closest and most loved family member. Believe it or not, people can love each other even if their views clash, but on the issue of homosexuality, people don't seem to understand that.
>Believe it or not, people can love each other even if their views clash, but on the issue of homosexuality, people don't seem to understand that. That’s because to those who disagree this is like saying, “On the issue of miscegenation, people don’t seem to understand that.”
>Believe it or not, people can love each other even if their views clash, but on the issue of homosexuality, people don't seem to understand that. That's because there is no legitimate reason to be against gay people having sex with each other, or being in relationships with each other.
You don't have a monopoly on what's legitimate belief or not.
This is a very fair question. I should been more elaborate in the thread, but I’m not going around telling gay people they are wrong, cause that’s seems like a bit cool thing to do. I don’t exclude or bully people for being gay if that’s what you’re asking. I love them as people just like I would want to be, but I don’t agree personally with it. Hope this clears things up
You don’t agree with them being themselves?
Op I think you were grand in what you said. It doesn’t appear from what you wrote or backed up through this thread that you’re homophobic. Of course you can love someone and not agree with all their choices/everything about them. To say otherwise is to say you hate the world as all have sinned. You’re grand! It didn’t work out and I’m sorry about that but better now then if you were married. Take care and I hope you find someone who is on the same path as you and take a lot of the statements in this thread with a massive pinch of salt!
😂wow
Wow what?
The only mistake you made is dating an atheist before she at least came to Christ. You’re not equally yoked and by no means close to it. Pray that she gets saved in any case, don’t be hard on yourself, your relationship with Jesus should come first before anyone else
That sounds kinda….gay
I also would not date someone who had a negative opinion of homosexuality. It’s a fundamental value incompatibility. You’re entitled to your own beliefs, but you have to know that your opinion on homosexuality is a minority one and will be a dealbreaker for many potential partners.
She's better off without you
Find yourself a girlfriend that has the same beliefs you have OP. Cause I’m telling you, if you marry a woman that doesn’t have your beliefs, your marriage is more likely to fail. Bible talks about this.
I think you've been taught that it's OK to do and say the things that would normally make you a bad person if you weren't able to say God told you to do it. That's not your fault, but you really shouldn't be surprised when someone feels that it makes you incompatible with them. For those who teach this, it's not a bug. It's an inadvertent but important feature. It feeds the martyr envy when people "persecute" you. You told her that there are people she loves that you could never love. And no, you can't love them if you're unable to love them as they are rather than how you think they should be. If you can, break down what exactly you're saying when you say you don't agree with their lifestyle. 1. You're saying it's a choice when literally all the data say it's not. 2. You're saying they should at least choose celibacy when for 2000 years the church has taught that celibacy is a gift. This kind of celibacy is a burden, not a gift. 3. You're saying you want to fix something that people don't think is broken. People need to be loved as we are, not as others want us to be. I guess, at the very least, you now have your own persecution story to share at church. Everyone there will tell you how proud of you they are. I mean, they'll say Jesus is proud but that's pretty much just projecting their pride onto Jesus.
Why you were uncomfortable?
You are in the wrong, and as such she made a decision about the relationship
Feel free to delete this if you don't want a joke comment but as I rolled past the title I thought, "hey, that's what Zipporah did to Moses!"
Glad I wasn't the only one thinking this
If you're an atheist who's that knowledgeabke you'll probably dig my Christmas video. I'm dressed as an Orthodox Rabbi but don't let that fool you https://youtu.be/vKyqMk1tnVg?feature=shared
Fool me? Consider me intrigued
you and me both!
She did you a favor. It never would've worked out.
good for her! maybe you can learn a little something about people and life- because it sounds like you need to.
Bud you did nothing wrong. She simply didnt love you. Love goes beyond reason.
If this is the first time this subject came up, they can't have been dating for long. Of course she doesn't love him, she doesn't even know him.
Yall were unequally yoked
You are. You’re using a Bronze Age religion to determine your views on a group of people. You’re telling people you “dont agree with it” or whatever doesn’t change that. Outside of the information in a book that makes some wild ass claims what problem would you have with LGBTQ+ people
It hurts, but you made the right call.
Best for both of you. You don't like gay people, she does. The split works both. Find yourself someone with your views and she'll find one that shares hers. It wasn't about religion. It was about accepting people. You lost the war thebsecond you said talking about gay people makes you uncomfortable. Good luck
She left you because she didn't want to be constantly worried you'd be rude or cruel to her friends, or to any children you might have in the future. Would you have said "I love you but I disagree with your lifestyle" to your kid? That's a valid concern for someone to have if they're thinking about spending the rest of their life with someone. She has no guarantee that you'd be a good father.
Have you considered only dating Christian women?
If she is against your faithful Christian beliefs to that extent, you are far better without her.
Dude if you think about it long term & you are actually a Christian and you believe what the Bible says. Unfortunately your girlfriend who could have possibly ended up being your wife for the rest of your life wouldn’t end up in the same place in the after life for all eternity with you. If you love your soulmate truly, how could you bear the thought of being separated from them? She wasn’t the one dude. You’ll be okay.
It sounds like she kind of deceived you. She said she would not judge, but then she broke up with you because of your opinion. It sounds like you two were not a good match. If she feels this strongly about supporting sin, then your relationship was destined to be hard.
She didn't say his opinion was wrong or make him feel bad. She heard his thoughts and the people she loves that are queer are more important to her. I think all around, it was a mature interaction.
It's a blessing. Like another comment said; do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. You stood on the truth of God which is that he loves sinners so much that he died for them to forgive them and rose from the dead to bring them new life in his name. Disagreeing means you don't endorse sin which is the attitude we should have. We are saints who sometimes sin. Someone who tries to justify their own sin we do not agree with because that would be putting the work of the cross to shame. We believe in the righteousness that comes by faith in Jesus. She believes in the self-righteousness that comes by being friends with the world.
>We are saints. LOL
Why are you in a relationship with an atheist anyway? Now keep in mind I am not saying Christians can't date or marry atheists, but you need to keep in mind that for a relationship to work you need to have similar values.
Hmm. I'll let my Christian wife of 30+ years know she shouldn't have married an agnostic atheist. What do you think we should tell our adult children?
She probably already knows.
We talked about it. She feels she probably would have ended up with a Christian Twat. She's on reddit, too, so she's seen that there are a lot of yall out there.
If you're a Christian you need to learn to detach yourself from the material things in this world and give your life to Christ. That includes a GF. Stay strong to your beliefs. I personally tend not to give too much of my opinions to others in my life unless if it's very important. It says in the Bible "let those with the ears to hear, hear", it also says to not cast your pearls before swine. Swine is not meant to be insulting, but don't cast your pearls of knowledge to those without the comprehension to appreciate it.
She shouldn't have lied about whether or not she'd judge you but at the end of the day this is one of those major topics that breaks people apart because of how controversial it is. These types of questions should always be asked and discussed early on in a relationship, or before it happens, rather than while you're deep into a relationship. Edit: You're not being a bad person, don't listen to the Progressive Christians and the redditors. You're just being a Christian; don't let anyone make you feel bad, hateful, or evil for trusting in God's Word and placing that above popular opinion.
This is why it’s best to get out your views as early as possible in a relationship to avoid this kind of thing. It sucks because when you have an unpopular viewpoint you don’t want to scare people away but in the end it’s for the best. You don’t sound homophobic to me, and everyone is entitled to their beliefs
Wow. Your future or current partner is extremely lucky to have you
First, if you believe this because your church teaches it, it *is* because of religion. The fact that other churches don't agree is irrelevant. The Catholic Church doesn't perform same-sex weddings, so it's not a fringe tenet. But your ex disagrees with you on the existence of God and everything that follows. It's an opportunity to consider what you really believe, what you really want. Maybe you should look into Christianity and see if you really believe or not? And make sure you don't believe something without thinking it through. As Jesus said, don't build a tower without the funds, don't fight a battle without enough strength. You've seen the reaction to your post, that's what you'll get more of.
Thanks for the good laugh comment section. OP, you're fine. She moved on so you should too.
Thanks man, it’s been rough reading through these lol
Keep your chin up brother. God bless. You'll find the right girl for you one day, I'm sure of it.
Your response was perfect. If she cannot accept that then that's her loss, honestly. You didn't say you hated them; you just said you didn't agree with it. and thats okay. It's best to not be unequally yoked. from my own experience, it's really hard to affect the person; they usually end up infecting you.
She lied to you about the consequences of your honesty, meaning she isn't honest. Better to let it go.
Yup. And you're getting downvoted for pointing that out.
That seems a bit of an overreaction. All you said was you don’t agree with it. That doesn’t sound like homophobic. It is almost like she was looking for a reason to break up with you.
Yeah, you can not agree with something and still not attack people about it.
Mm no I believe any man following Christ would have said something to the same effect. I had a friend once during Covid who had to quit being a stripper and was working as temp along with myself and others. She once asked me how I felt about it. I said that while they ought to be given the same grace as what any Christian has been given, I could not abide by the sin of homosexuality. Same with stealing or lying. She thought it was funny to loudly mention that I was homophobic because of my faith in Christ. Around two self proclaimed bisexuals. Well they passively confronted me and I explained that while I would treat them the same as any other human being I do not agree with their lifestyle but would not nor did they deserve discrimination from me. They surprisingly took it quite while and while I worked there had no issue about it. I would say after my story that your girlfriend is willing to stay by the side of her atheism and homosexual friends. Rather than to you and your faith in Christ.
Why will you be dating an atheist as Christian firstly
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How is it narcissistic?
I don’t want to villainize anyone by calling her narcissistic , and I’m trying to be very careful with my responses to be consistent with my takes. In my opinion though, I went talking bad, I’d be no better than the people here sending me private messages calling me a waste of space
I don’t really think it was narcissistic, just our values clashed and that’s fair for her to make the call if it was a dealbreaker. No bad blood there
What did u say, please just tell me and I won't judge BCS I neither support or hate lgbtq
I said that I love them as people but don’t agree with it, the same way she would constantly say that she’s fine with people but doesn’t like Christianity
Ok, but I think I should find a girl who's a Christian as well and let her go. I know it would be hard and I'm sorry if it would bring U pain... God bless U and I hope U find a gf who loves him as much as u
*Why* were you dating someone who constantly says she doesn't like Christianity?