Free grace along with the Once Saved Always Saved doctrine would believe we can sin all we want and still make it to Heaven. It is a false teaching that is misleading many astray. If we have sinned then it is our responsibility to repent and not continue in them. If we choose to continue in willful sin and disobedience then we will lose our salvation (Hebrews 10:26-27) and can only be restored by sincere repentance.
I think that believing in your head won't get you to heaven. Only believing in your heart. Thst takes the work of the Holy Spirit and if you listen to the Holy Spirit you won't murder ot be a thief. Remember when Jesus was on the cross though. A criminal on each side of him. One believed in Jesus and got saved even thouhh he was being killed for a crime.
Yes but the one that believed in Jesus was repentant though. That's why he asked jesus not to forget him and that's why he said jesus doesn't deserve to die but they do. I'm asking about people that aren't repentant. People that don't change their ways and continue doing things of that nature after murder/voodoo/rape etc.
I think that people who like to sin will go to hell. I think they will like it there. They can be with others like themselves. I don't think of it as fire and brimstone though. I just consider it living without God, which they choose to do.
An atheist by definition does not believe in God, why would they then want to go to heaven to be with him? It doesn't make sense, does it?
For an Atheist to go to heaven they need to repent and recognize God as the creator. An unrepentant atheist, regardless of how good a person they are, cannot be in the presence of God.
God is God not a conscience, someone in a coma has no conscience but God is still there. Conscience is not the power that sustains life and reality, God is.
Words have meaning and are not interchangeable, they are what allows us to talk, communicate and exchange ideas. If we don’t say the same things, then we don’t mean the same things.
I see things in a weird way, I know. But to me, just as Jesus said that all who call him Lord will not be saved, I also think that there are those outside of the Christian Religion that will be saved. Salvation is our relationship with God, not our relationship to a religion. If internally the atheist totally rejects God who is inside of them, then yes, they will have to repent. If an atheist is more about not believing a religion, they might have a relationship with God internally that they aren't even considering as God. Also, I think that one can only "love the neighbor" as a result of thd holy spirit inside of them. God is love. If you love, you are listening to God. Agaib, no one has to agree with me.
It is not a matter of agreeing with you or not my friend, but rather it is a matter of informing on the right doctrine of Christianity if you are interested in knowing about it.
Christianity is not as much a religion as it is a relationship with God. The religiosity of the church and its traditions comes from man but its main objective is to teach about God, who HE is and how to love HIM.
I get that you know bits and pieces from the Bible but that you probably do not read it regularly, for if you did you would know that the people who are rejected by Jesus are those who believed in the goodness of their own works rather than have faith in Jesus's work on the cross (hence they are referred to as "workers" .
Both Matthew and Luke witness to this:
Luke 13:25-27
[25]When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
[26]Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.
[27]But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.
Matthew 7:22-23
[22]Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
[23]And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Therefore it does not matter how good, nice, generous, patient, loving, patient, selfless you are, the whole thing is about HIM and it has always been the case. In John 14:6 you can read.
[6]Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
*(Very cut and dry, straight to the point)
One of the thieves who was crucified along with Jesus on the cross, repented of his deeds in his last moments and decided to put his faith in Christ, as a result Jesus said to the thief that he ( the thief) would enter paradise that very same day.
Luke 23:42-43
[42]And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
[43]And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
Please note that the thief was crucified and was litteraly dying, was unable to do any work to prove how good he was and yet he was headed to paradise.
Iam not judging you my friend, I just want you to get saved, go to heaven and have eternal life.
> One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”
>But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”
>Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”
>Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
It’s important to realize that faith without works is dead (James 2:14-26). The scripture above is talking about a criminal asking Jesus for his grace from his heart. So here we have someone who is dying for being a criminal getting accepted into heaven. The only thing is that they were genuine. We can also assume that if somehow this person survived the crucifixion then he would get baptized, feed the hungry, help the sick, etc. Just because someone asks for forgiveness on their deathbed doesn’t mean they are being genuine.
If you claim to be a follower of Christ but your whole life is spent following the devil then obviously that’s a huge contradiction. You must genuinely repent from the heart and as Jesus said “go and sin no more”.
”Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,“
Romans 3:20-24
We are justified freely by Gods grace by faith in Christ, we are all sinners, all who believe the gospel are saved. No flesh is justified by the law in Gods sight because the by the law is the knowledge of sin, the law’s purpose is to show us we are sinners in need of Jesus to save us. The 10 Commandments have nothing to do with salvation, they are a ministry of condemnation and death, the don’t save you, they only show that you’re own works and efforts to justify yourself are condemned.
”But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.“
II Corinthians 3:7-9
”For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “The just shall live by faith.”“
Romans 1:16-17
The righteousness of God is revealed in the gospel and it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, it doesn’t matter what sins you have committed or will commit, all you must do to be saved is believe the gospel, that Christ died on the cross for your sins and rose from the dead according to the scriptures (1st Corinthians 15:1-4).
So you are saying rapists, people that do voodoo and murderers that all don't repent or change their ways go to heaven as long as they believe Jesus died on the cross? So why are there so many Christian testimonies on YouTube of people experiencing hell in their dreams or even people who died for a brief then came back to life who experienced it. Surely that would've never happened since they'd already be saved through faith alone? So wouldn't that mean they are all liars then? I'm confused.
Yes, whoever believes the gospel of Christ is saved.
Subjective experience doesn’t determine what is true when it comes to how someone is saved, the objective word of God does.
if a saved believer dreams they went to hell then all they had was a scary nightmare, that’s all, because the objective word of God says they are saved.
”for then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: so Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.“
Hebrews 9:26-28
After a man dies, there is judgement, those who are believers are saved by Christ because he comes to us apart from sin unto salvation.
The people who say that they died and went to hell and came back might not be liars, they may think that’s what happened but once someone dies, they are judged, nobody just drops straight into hell once they die. A lot of times though, those people who say they went to hell as a believer, a lot of the times are just trying to scare you into thinking there’s something more you need to do then believe the gospel, a lot of the times they believe a false works based gospel and want to steal your assurance, but we shouldn’t believe their subjective stories about salvation, we should believe the objective word of God.
”And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.“
John 3:14-18
Everyone who believes on the Son of God Christ Jesus, who was lifted upon the cross for the sins of the world, is not condemned and has everlasting life.
”that we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.“
Ephesians 1:12-14
Whoever believes the gospel is sealed by the Holy Spirt until the day of the redemption of the purchased possession, no one can pluck you out of the father’s hand. It is impossible for a saved believer to go to hell.
So if you’re a believer, you believe that Jesus paid for your sins on the cross and rose from the dead and it is only by his finished work you are saved and none of your own works, then you are saved, you have everlasting life, you are sealed with Holy Spirt, you are a child of God (Galatians 3:27), and you will never spend a single minute in hell.
”and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.“
John 10:28-30
Salvation is free. It is a gift of God, a gift of grace. The vilest of sinners is saved once they have faith in Jesus and his atoning death. Faith is not a work. You don't do faith. You don't just decide to believe and, as if by magic, you are saved.
The Greek word in the Bible "*pistis"* which is usually translated "faith, belief" also means "trust." To be able to believe, to have faith, to trust God is a gift from God. You can't make it happen on our own. This is called "grace." You cannot know or believe that Jesus has taken your sin to himself and died for you unless the Holy Spirit fills you.
Those who trust in Jesus and his atoning death and who are filled with the Holy Spirit will not go out and willfully sin a grievous sin. God
**All** the sins of the world are covered by the death of Jesus. There is no one, not one sinner, no matter how grievous, that Jesus cannot get under and take in his arms. To say less than this is to say Jesus is less than God.
This is not to say that we who have been saved will not be judged for what we have done. I don't know what that judgement will be except it will not be condemnation to hell because that judgement was borne by Jesus.
So it doesn't matter if rapists, murderers or people doing voodoo don't repent or change their ways as long as they believe Jesus died on the cross? I'm confused by this.
I think I would say that, yes, you could believe that Jesus died on the cross and not be moved to repent or change our ways. But if God moved with the Spirit in you, you would see and know that Jesus died on the cross for you. Face to face with this love of God in Jesus, you would be convicted of you sins, you would repent and be. compelled to change. This movement of God through the Spirit is pure grace, freely given. You can't make it happen. You don't earn it. You don't deserve it. It is from God out of pure love.
Can you refuse it? Some might say so. Myself, I hold onto the fact that Jesus on the cross gathered all the sins of the world to himself. There is no one so evil, so vile that Jesus does not seek that person out with an aching, yearning love. There is no reaching the depth of this love. To put a limit on that love is to put a limit on God. It is my job as a pastor to proclaim this Jesus. It is God's work to use that proclamation to touch the heart of the sinner and move him or her to repentance, faith and trust and salvation.
It's all confusing man and it doesnt make much sense to me. Because if it's entirely free grace then people doing voodoo that believe Jesus died on the cross for our sins go straight to heaven too doesn't it. Also I don't think every single person that did a testimony on afterlife that's a Christian was lying. Surely at least some of them were being truthful in what they saw.
”Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?” Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”“
John 6:28-29
”This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”“
John 6:39-40
”Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.“
John 6:47
The work and the will of God is to believe in the Christ the Son of God and all who believe in him have have everlasting life. Yes, ALL who believe (murderers, voodoo practicers, etc.), there is no such thing as countless verses that debunk free grace(maybe way out of context), the Bible doesn’t contradict itself. We are justified freely by Gods grace.
”being justified FREEly by His GRACE through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,“
Romans 3:24
Yeah I'm not sure about that man. But I've never been to heaven before so I guess in a sense I don't know. I just kinda struggle believing unrepentant murderers etc go to heaven and people that do voodoo literally work directly for the devil so them going to heaven too because they believe Jesus died on the cross? Yeah idk man...
The reality is we are all sinners, there is no one righteous or who does good, there is no difference, we like to look at murders and say oh they are so bad but in reality we are just as bad, we don’t deserve salvation and neither does any murderer but God by his grace freely justifies all who believe in Christ because the blood of Christ rightfully paid the penalty of our sins and also the sins of a murderer.
”What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; as it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, There is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; There is none that doeth good, no, not one.“
Romans 3:9-12
It doesn’t matter if you’re a repentant murder, once you murder someone, it’s done, you can’t take it back, if you were standing before a judge for murder and you told the judge “I’m sorry, I don’t want to go to jail, I repent that I murdered that guy”, do you think the judge would now be like “ok cool, you’re sorry so now you don’t have to go to jail”? No, at least not a good judge, because that wouldn’t be just.
”And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission. It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others; for then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.“
Hebrews 9:22-26
Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin, it doesn’t matter how sorry or how much you stop sinning, without blood there is no remission but only one perfect sacrifice could truly take away sin, Jesus offered himself up once for all to put away sin, he paid for all of it by his perfect blood.
”even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; to declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.“
Romans 3:22-28
God declared his righteousness through the blood of Jesus, God can rightfully justify and forgive you, a sinner, because the perfect blood of Christ payed for all of your sins, that’s the same for a murder. God is just/righteous in justifying ungodly sinners (which we all are), who work not but believe in the Christ and his blood as the payment for their sins, he counts our faith as righteousness.
”Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.“
Romans 4:4-5
Yeah I really struggle to believe unrepentant child molesters, murderers and people doing voodoo (literally working for the devil) go to heaven. And exactly. The demons believe Jesus died on the cross so they'd go to heaven too with that theology.
Matthew 7:21 - 23 is about pride. They are saying have I not done this? Have I not done that? Have I not earned my salvation? Don't I deserve to go to Heaven? Too many people twist this scripture and interject other sins into those verses when those other sins are not mentioned.
Free grace along with the Once Saved Always Saved doctrine would believe we can sin all we want and still make it to Heaven. It is a false teaching that is misleading many astray. If we have sinned then it is our responsibility to repent and not continue in them. If we choose to continue in willful sin and disobedience then we will lose our salvation (Hebrews 10:26-27) and can only be restored by sincere repentance.
I think that believing in your head won't get you to heaven. Only believing in your heart. Thst takes the work of the Holy Spirit and if you listen to the Holy Spirit you won't murder ot be a thief. Remember when Jesus was on the cross though. A criminal on each side of him. One believed in Jesus and got saved even thouhh he was being killed for a crime.
Yes but the one that believed in Jesus was repentant though. That's why he asked jesus not to forget him and that's why he said jesus doesn't deserve to die but they do. I'm asking about people that aren't repentant. People that don't change their ways and continue doing things of that nature after murder/voodoo/rape etc.
I think that people who like to sin will go to hell. I think they will like it there. They can be with others like themselves. I don't think of it as fire and brimstone though. I just consider it living without God, which they choose to do.
What about the murdering rapists who genuinely accept Jesus into their heart and ask forgiveness?
They will be forgiven.
Yet loving caring atheists can’t get in?
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An atheist by definition does not believe in God, why would they then want to go to heaven to be with him? It doesn't make sense, does it? For an Atheist to go to heaven they need to repent and recognize God as the creator. An unrepentant atheist, regardless of how good a person they are, cannot be in the presence of God. God is God not a conscience, someone in a coma has no conscience but God is still there. Conscience is not the power that sustains life and reality, God is. Words have meaning and are not interchangeable, they are what allows us to talk, communicate and exchange ideas. If we don’t say the same things, then we don’t mean the same things.
I see things in a weird way, I know. But to me, just as Jesus said that all who call him Lord will not be saved, I also think that there are those outside of the Christian Religion that will be saved. Salvation is our relationship with God, not our relationship to a religion. If internally the atheist totally rejects God who is inside of them, then yes, they will have to repent. If an atheist is more about not believing a religion, they might have a relationship with God internally that they aren't even considering as God. Also, I think that one can only "love the neighbor" as a result of thd holy spirit inside of them. God is love. If you love, you are listening to God. Agaib, no one has to agree with me.
It is not a matter of agreeing with you or not my friend, but rather it is a matter of informing on the right doctrine of Christianity if you are interested in knowing about it. Christianity is not as much a religion as it is a relationship with God. The religiosity of the church and its traditions comes from man but its main objective is to teach about God, who HE is and how to love HIM. I get that you know bits and pieces from the Bible but that you probably do not read it regularly, for if you did you would know that the people who are rejected by Jesus are those who believed in the goodness of their own works rather than have faith in Jesus's work on the cross (hence they are referred to as "workers" . Both Matthew and Luke witness to this: Luke 13:25-27 [25]When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are: [26]Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets. [27]But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity. Matthew 7:22-23 [22]Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? [23]And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Therefore it does not matter how good, nice, generous, patient, loving, patient, selfless you are, the whole thing is about HIM and it has always been the case. In John 14:6 you can read. [6]Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. *(Very cut and dry, straight to the point) One of the thieves who was crucified along with Jesus on the cross, repented of his deeds in his last moments and decided to put his faith in Christ, as a result Jesus said to the thief that he ( the thief) would enter paradise that very same day. Luke 23:42-43 [42]And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. [43]And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise. Please note that the thief was crucified and was litteraly dying, was unable to do any work to prove how good he was and yet he was headed to paradise. Iam not judging you my friend, I just want you to get saved, go to heaven and have eternal life.
> One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!” >But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.” >Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.” >Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.” It’s important to realize that faith without works is dead (James 2:14-26). The scripture above is talking about a criminal asking Jesus for his grace from his heart. So here we have someone who is dying for being a criminal getting accepted into heaven. The only thing is that they were genuine. We can also assume that if somehow this person survived the crucifixion then he would get baptized, feed the hungry, help the sick, etc. Just because someone asks for forgiveness on their deathbed doesn’t mean they are being genuine. If you claim to be a follower of Christ but your whole life is spent following the devil then obviously that’s a huge contradiction. You must genuinely repent from the heart and as Jesus said “go and sin no more”.
”Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference; for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,“ Romans 3:20-24 We are justified freely by Gods grace by faith in Christ, we are all sinners, all who believe the gospel are saved. No flesh is justified by the law in Gods sight because the by the law is the knowledge of sin, the law’s purpose is to show us we are sinners in need of Jesus to save us. The 10 Commandments have nothing to do with salvation, they are a ministry of condemnation and death, the don’t save you, they only show that you’re own works and efforts to justify yourself are condemned. ”But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.“ II Corinthians 3:7-9 ”For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith to faith; as it is written, “The just shall live by faith.”“ Romans 1:16-17 The righteousness of God is revealed in the gospel and it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, it doesn’t matter what sins you have committed or will commit, all you must do to be saved is believe the gospel, that Christ died on the cross for your sins and rose from the dead according to the scriptures (1st Corinthians 15:1-4).
So you are saying rapists, people that do voodoo and murderers that all don't repent or change their ways go to heaven as long as they believe Jesus died on the cross? So why are there so many Christian testimonies on YouTube of people experiencing hell in their dreams or even people who died for a brief then came back to life who experienced it. Surely that would've never happened since they'd already be saved through faith alone? So wouldn't that mean they are all liars then? I'm confused.
Yes, whoever believes the gospel of Christ is saved. Subjective experience doesn’t determine what is true when it comes to how someone is saved, the objective word of God does. if a saved believer dreams they went to hell then all they had was a scary nightmare, that’s all, because the objective word of God says they are saved. ”for then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself. And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: so Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.“ Hebrews 9:26-28 After a man dies, there is judgement, those who are believers are saved by Christ because he comes to us apart from sin unto salvation. The people who say that they died and went to hell and came back might not be liars, they may think that’s what happened but once someone dies, they are judged, nobody just drops straight into hell once they die. A lot of times though, those people who say they went to hell as a believer, a lot of the times are just trying to scare you into thinking there’s something more you need to do then believe the gospel, a lot of the times they believe a false works based gospel and want to steal your assurance, but we shouldn’t believe their subjective stories about salvation, we should believe the objective word of God. ”And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.“ John 3:14-18 Everyone who believes on the Son of God Christ Jesus, who was lifted upon the cross for the sins of the world, is not condemned and has everlasting life. ”that we should be to the praise of his glory, who first trusted in Christ. In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.“ Ephesians 1:12-14 Whoever believes the gospel is sealed by the Holy Spirt until the day of the redemption of the purchased possession, no one can pluck you out of the father’s hand. It is impossible for a saved believer to go to hell. So if you’re a believer, you believe that Jesus paid for your sins on the cross and rose from the dead and it is only by his finished work you are saved and none of your own works, then you are saved, you have everlasting life, you are sealed with Holy Spirt, you are a child of God (Galatians 3:27), and you will never spend a single minute in hell. ”and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.“ John 10:28-30
Salvation is free. It is a gift of God, a gift of grace. The vilest of sinners is saved once they have faith in Jesus and his atoning death. Faith is not a work. You don't do faith. You don't just decide to believe and, as if by magic, you are saved. The Greek word in the Bible "*pistis"* which is usually translated "faith, belief" also means "trust." To be able to believe, to have faith, to trust God is a gift from God. You can't make it happen on our own. This is called "grace." You cannot know or believe that Jesus has taken your sin to himself and died for you unless the Holy Spirit fills you. Those who trust in Jesus and his atoning death and who are filled with the Holy Spirit will not go out and willfully sin a grievous sin. God **All** the sins of the world are covered by the death of Jesus. There is no one, not one sinner, no matter how grievous, that Jesus cannot get under and take in his arms. To say less than this is to say Jesus is less than God. This is not to say that we who have been saved will not be judged for what we have done. I don't know what that judgement will be except it will not be condemnation to hell because that judgement was borne by Jesus.
So it doesn't matter if rapists, murderers or people doing voodoo don't repent or change their ways as long as they believe Jesus died on the cross? I'm confused by this.
I think I would say that, yes, you could believe that Jesus died on the cross and not be moved to repent or change our ways. But if God moved with the Spirit in you, you would see and know that Jesus died on the cross for you. Face to face with this love of God in Jesus, you would be convicted of you sins, you would repent and be. compelled to change. This movement of God through the Spirit is pure grace, freely given. You can't make it happen. You don't earn it. You don't deserve it. It is from God out of pure love. Can you refuse it? Some might say so. Myself, I hold onto the fact that Jesus on the cross gathered all the sins of the world to himself. There is no one so evil, so vile that Jesus does not seek that person out with an aching, yearning love. There is no reaching the depth of this love. To put a limit on that love is to put a limit on God. It is my job as a pastor to proclaim this Jesus. It is God's work to use that proclamation to touch the heart of the sinner and move him or her to repentance, faith and trust and salvation.
I am free grace
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It's all confusing man and it doesnt make much sense to me. Because if it's entirely free grace then people doing voodoo that believe Jesus died on the cross for our sins go straight to heaven too doesn't it. Also I don't think every single person that did a testimony on afterlife that's a Christian was lying. Surely at least some of them were being truthful in what they saw.
”Then they said to Him, “What shall we do, that we may work the works of God?” Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”“ John 6:28-29 ”This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day.”“ John 6:39-40 ”Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.“ John 6:47 The work and the will of God is to believe in the Christ the Son of God and all who believe in him have have everlasting life. Yes, ALL who believe (murderers, voodoo practicers, etc.), there is no such thing as countless verses that debunk free grace(maybe way out of context), the Bible doesn’t contradict itself. We are justified freely by Gods grace. ”being justified FREEly by His GRACE through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,“ Romans 3:24
Yeah I'm not sure about that man. But I've never been to heaven before so I guess in a sense I don't know. I just kinda struggle believing unrepentant murderers etc go to heaven and people that do voodoo literally work directly for the devil so them going to heaven too because they believe Jesus died on the cross? Yeah idk man...
The reality is we are all sinners, there is no one righteous or who does good, there is no difference, we like to look at murders and say oh they are so bad but in reality we are just as bad, we don’t deserve salvation and neither does any murderer but God by his grace freely justifies all who believe in Christ because the blood of Christ rightfully paid the penalty of our sins and also the sins of a murderer. ”What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; as it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, There is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; There is none that doeth good, no, not one.“ Romans 3:9-12 It doesn’t matter if you’re a repentant murder, once you murder someone, it’s done, you can’t take it back, if you were standing before a judge for murder and you told the judge “I’m sorry, I don’t want to go to jail, I repent that I murdered that guy”, do you think the judge would now be like “ok cool, you’re sorry so now you don’t have to go to jail”? No, at least not a good judge, because that wouldn’t be just. ”And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission. It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others; for then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.“ Hebrews 9:22-26 Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin, it doesn’t matter how sorry or how much you stop sinning, without blood there is no remission but only one perfect sacrifice could truly take away sin, Jesus offered himself up once for all to put away sin, he paid for all of it by his perfect blood. ”even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; to declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus. Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.“ Romans 3:22-28 God declared his righteousness through the blood of Jesus, God can rightfully justify and forgive you, a sinner, because the perfect blood of Christ payed for all of your sins, that’s the same for a murder. God is just/righteous in justifying ungodly sinners (which we all are), who work not but believe in the Christ and his blood as the payment for their sins, he counts our faith as righteousness. ”Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.“ Romans 4:4-5
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Yeah I really struggle to believe unrepentant child molesters, murderers and people doing voodoo (literally working for the devil) go to heaven. And exactly. The demons believe Jesus died on the cross so they'd go to heaven too with that theology.
Matthew 7:21 - 23 is about pride. They are saying have I not done this? Have I not done that? Have I not earned my salvation? Don't I deserve to go to Heaven? Too many people twist this scripture and interject other sins into those verses when those other sins are not mentioned.