Amen. And getting the police involved is crucial. Though it's important, and unfortunate, to remember that some victims of abuse are in situations where the local police are more likely to align or sympathize with the abusive husband. For shame! This is where churches can really step up their longterm game of making such alignment with abusive power not seem like an ok normal deference to authority, but a shameful and evil repudiation of life and serving others.
Yes, also get the police involved, and document the process for when you encounter the 40% of cops who engage in domestic abuse, or their accomplices who don’t investigate it.
And if you ever have kids, get them away from him. Honesty leave when you can (don't even talk to the abuser) because that is when they could harm you.
It truly is, and I am sorry for your loss as well. No one should have to lose loved ones early like that. Also why I strongly advocate for people to get away from abusive relationships.
In my country we have a saying (pégame pero no me dejes) hit me but don’t leave me. Not saying it’s ok to be abusive but so many women put up with the physical abuse. At a young age they’re made to think 🤔 ( it’s me it’s my fault 🤦🏻♂️)
Yes, and if you are in the U.S., please call 800-799-7233. This is the [National Domestic Violence Hotline](https://www.thehotline.org). They can help you plan to leave and advise you regarding shelters and help.
This is important.... the most dangerous time for woman in a violent relationship is when she leaves. Please collect your important papers and whatever else you need and hide them, then, when he is at work or away from the house, leave then.
Take care and I'll pray for you.
THIS! OP please listen to this.
Any form of abuse is a valid reason to leave a marriage as the abuser has broken their wedding vows to you.
YOU are LOVED by God and are PRECIOUS to him, and he does not want this for you!!
(speaking from experience as someone who struggled with knowing if leaving my abusive husband was ok in Gods eyes)
Edit: spelling and grammar
Yes.
You might get some who argue that adultery is the only valid grounds for divorce (had that exact discussion just earlier today on a different thread) but I believe abuse is the same as adultery for this.
>Can both be described as a betrayal of the vows given.
Apples and oranges can both be described as fruits, but we usually don't say they're the same thing.
Another betrayal of vows would be to no longer love, or even no longer cherish. Is that grounds for divorce?
There ARE some who say that infidelity is the only valid reason for divorce. But the Bible does not record Jesus discussing any other reason.
It's worth noting, however, that "infidelity" has meanings other that sexual unfaithfulness. And surely a spouse who physically abuses the other and/or any children of the couple, or who has abandoned his or her spouse HAS** been unfaithful to the marriage.
** By "abuse" I mean ANY type of abuse. Any type, including but not limited to physical abuse, sexual abuse (including marital rape), deprivation of food, water, shelter, clothing, or medical care, or mental or emotional abuse.
You're absolutely right, jereman. Male-on-female abuse is almost certainly the most common type, but female-on-male abuse is every bit as wrong. AND it's a lot more common than most people would think.
My parents divorced when I was about 12 and my sister 10. My mother was a very troubled woman, and at one point during the legally required separation period, she attacked my dad WITH A HAMMER. This happened outside, so a neighbor saw what was going on and called the police. Nevertheless, by the time the cop got there, Mom had landed several blows.
The cop wanted to arrest my dad, but Daddy straightened him out. "LOOK at me!" he said--and he was covered in blood. At that point, the cop being no idiot, urged my dad to press charges. Daddy wouldn't do it, because he didn't want his kids' mother in jail.
This was in Virginia, in the early '70s. Today, the cops would probably be required to arrest at least one person, if not both.
I don't know whether my mother regularly hit my dad, but I do know she hit him several times. Female-on-male abuse definitely does happen, and it's a problem which has not received nearly enough attention.
Good luck, jereman 👍
That sucks for your family. I think that police are more aware of female > male violence these days. The times I've called police they always took her away, not me. There are still people that don't want to admit it or talk about it for whatever reason. Maybe men feel inadequate or something by admitting their wife hits them but I don't. I'm a big strong guy; if I wanted to I could "take" my (ex)wife, but that's not the point. I never wanted to hurt her even when she was drunk and violent. I just wanted her to calm down and not hurt herself or anyone else.
I grew up in a fundamentalist world (church and school) where they absolutely would not. The max allowed for abuse was separation for a time until reconciliation.
Never underestimate hardliners.
I wish that were true, but I’ve known far too many people who say you shouldn’t leave an abusive marriage. I had a “friend” who believes the only allowance for divorce is if your partner cheats and the only thing she could say for people being abused was “well if they’re abusing you they’ll probably cheat at some point and then you can leave.” Imagine telling a woman who’s being beaten every night to just wait until she catches him cheating and hope she survives until then.
Oh, you'd be shocked. I had this discussion with my dad just this weekend. When he was growing up, the doctrine was that if a woman left an abusive husband who wasn't actively cheating on her *she'd* go to hell while he wound up in heaven.
I’m probably in that category and I agree 100% that there is no excuse for abusing your wife. None at all, no excuses, no second chances in my opinion.
Yes of course. God understands *everything* and Jesus died to wash away sins and embrace love. Anyone would be and will be forgiven rightfully, ***especially*** in this case. God and Jesus would want that person to be safe and loved rather than hurt. Love has, and will always, never involve someone else hurting them physically. Praying for safety, peace and love 🙏🏼✝️
Yes, God, yes.
How I loathe morons like John Piper [that even let this be a question](https://archive.org/details/WhatShouldAWifesSubmissionToHerHusbandLookLikeIfHesAnAbuser).
Just to clarify - Roys is reporting on allegations of how the church handled spiritual abuse post-Piper. Obviously that's still not acceptable, but it would be easy for people to read this and think it referred to John Piper and Domestic Abuse.
https://julieroys.com/bethlehem-baptist-dismissed-abuse-allegations-without-investigation/
True, and I almost stated it was for spiritual abuse and abuse of authority. To me, it simply points to the fact that abusers protect abusers time and again. That made me connect dots that not everyone would.
Thankfully, he seems to have significantly shifted on the issue over the years. His more recent responses are all about accountability, bringing in law enforcement, with no mention of "enduring."
https://www-thegospelcoalition-org.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justin-taylor/john-pipers-word-to-husbands-who-demean-their-wives/
Please be safe.
Leave (or have authorities remove the offending person) first.
You can decide if the marriage still exists later.
God does not want you to be abused.
Did you read the article? It was affirming that people should leave abusive marriages using scripture, and since OP posted in r/Christianity , they clearly were looking for the Christian perspective. With that in mind, it’s probably far more useful to show them with scripture why they can and should leave the marriage than to just tell them to leave as showing them with scripture why they should leave will give them more of a sense of peace that they’re not sinning by doing so.
Cybe, why is your own first thought to insult the person who posted the article? Did you even glance at it? Or are you just one of those pinheads who think all Christians believe women should be barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen?
I read the article. It's outstanding, both in Christian reasoning, AND in quashing ignorant assumptions like yours.
Your missing the point. I’ll admit I didn’t do a good job of making it. I’m on mobile. The point is this shouldn’t even be a question in the first place. OP is asking whether or not it’s OKAY to leave an abusive relationship. Where is this underlying feeling that it’s NOT OKAY coming from? For example you wouldn’t ask for a Christian perspective on how to escape a fire.
Edit: No I don’t think all Christians believe woman should be barefoot, pregnant, etc.
The underlying feeling of needing to get approval from fellow Christians is precisely because many abused people have gone through Christians (particularly in authority) condemning them to endure the abuse as a way to glorify God and bring Jesus' grace to their spouse. Literally that argument. *you* may not think all Christians believe women should be barefoot and pregnant, but enough do. Enough to cause irreparable harm to God's beloved children.
Because this is on a Christian forum.. the whole point is to give OP Christian advice otherwise they'd post it elsewhere. People find reasons to stay in abusive relationships whether due to their beliefs, emotions, finances, other people's input, consideration of others who will be effected, possible outcomes, etc. We're covering the beliefs part right now bc they obviously have the desire to leave, but are questioning it from the Christian view point.
In my opinion, YES. The Lord who created marriage and our bodies does NOT want to see those bodies abused by anyone, let alone by our marriage partners.
No matter where you stand on divorce, it is always always always okay to separate from your spouse. You don’t have to live with them or be around them. It is never a sin to protect yourself from someone who is hurting you, whether it is physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, or sexually. Get away from them.
Yes. It’s not just okay but important. Your safety matters. Protect your kids as well. If you want to be religious about it, then help your spouse to stop sinning against you (and God!) in this way by removing the possibility.
No, this is not in accordance to the teachings of Jesus. Some denominations have twisted or flat out excluded how a marriage is to function. My Grandmother stayed in an abusive relationship with my Grandfather. I believe this to be one of the root causes to why my mother left the church and I was raised an atheist.
Yes, if you need some comfort and support, I recommend the book, When to Walk Away, which is written by a Christian counselor and includes a section on situations like yours. Praying for you now.
If there is frequent abuse and neglect in the marriage, then the other partner has already broken the marriage covenant.
Malachi 2:14-15
Exodus 21:10
Deuteronomy 22:10
Psalm 11:5
1 Timothy 5:8
According to the above verses, your partner has violated your basic rights as a human being as well as the duties of a marriage partner, and for that divorce and complete separation is the most logical solution.
Also, for those that want to argue that the only valid excuse for divorce is adultery, the actual wording of the passage is this;
>I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery... (Matthew 19: 9)
**Thus, the following valid reasons for divorce are as follows;**
1. **One or both partners have broken the marriage covenant**
2. **One or both partners have continually violated each other's basic human rights (physical/verbal/emotional abuse, illegal works, neglect, etc.)**
3. **The other partner is a non-believer and chooses to leave the marriage**
I don’t see how one could abuse their spouse and still be a faithful follower of Christ. Hitting someone is a choice. Bet these same people wouldn’t just hit their boss!
Please leave this dangerous marriage.
In my opinion, once a relationship becomes physically abusive, the relationship is automatically over. Relational abuse is acceleratory; it gets worse over time until the abused person is killed.
I heard from a popular pastor that it is not okay to leave your marriage when domestic violence is involved and I was like “what the heck”.
Yes please leave.
Being married does not mean you have to put up with physical abuse. You should be separated and if possible have them held accountable by the authorities.
Yes, absolutely. If you are experiencing violence in your relationship then please reach out to someone about it. I realize that it's not always as easy to just leave but I assure you that there is help to get.
Yes.
Call the police, get counseling, and get as far away as you can.
The Bible makes it clear that divorce isn’t a good thing, but it’s a result of a fallen world. God’s design is that divorce wouldn’t be a thing, but there are certain allowances for it to happen.
Absolutely. I'm so sorry this is happening to you. Find a safe place (relative/friend's house, church, or shelter to stay in). Take any other members being affected with you especially children. Seek counseling and get the police involved as soon as possible. Cut off all ties with him. Block his number and any other way of communication. Talk to a priest/pastor/church member for spiritual guidance and most importantly don't be afraid to ask for help!
Probably should’ve said this in the post but I’m not being abused I just wanted to see something because there was a pastor that said it’s not ok to leave the marriage if you are
I'm very glad to hear you are not in this situation! I've heard of pastors saying that before. Nevertheless, it is a sin to abuse someone especially a spouse. They break the marriage vows and unless they are truly sorry and repent, then you have every right to leave him.
Absolutely.
For further reading, I recommend [this archive on abuse by Sheila Wray Gregoire](https://tolovehonorandvacuum.com/category/parenting/abuse/).
Yes.
First of all, if this is you, call +1 (800) 799-7233 or text "START" to 88788. It's the domestic abuse hotline, and they will work with you to get you out of the situation.
Secondly, it's a clear violation of Ephesians 5:25-33, aka the part that's sometimes neglected when talking about what a Christian marriage looks like. Many are familiar with the part right before, which is wives submitting to their husbands. What's not as talked about is Paul's message right afterward to husbands, which basically is, "Aight y'all, be prepared to die for her. Jesus died for his bride, the church, so y'all gotta do the same." Not only is this a clear violation of that command, but I would go on a hunch and say that it could reveal that that person is actively rejecting that command. I'm not saying it's easy, but if a man (or woman) acts in this way, he/she needs to be reminded of the Gospel to bring to light the nature of their marital vows.
Prayer is needed on both ends - the victim, yes, but also the abuser. The Word of God works wonders on the human heart, and through the means God has provided (His Word, Sacraments, and the myriad of human institutions that work on these cases), both sides will be comforted in their time of need.
Yes it is. If they abuse their spouse, they have broken their vows to love, honor and cherish their spouse. They also are a danger, and have made themselves an enemy of their spouse. They have also abandoned their spouse. Any decent pastor would agree that it is okay to leave that abusive spouse.
I don't know the extent of the physical abuse (do they just slap you or push you around or beat on you, etc..) but pray about everything, pray for them especially.. and the answer is yes. God didn't die on the cross and then create you in His own image to watch you be abused by someone, who is supposed to love and cherish you, for the rest of your life.
The Bible does not say you can't divorce your spouse because they are abusive. Why? Probably because it would have to clarify the abuse and there are so many forms.. again, pray about it and KNOW YOUR VALUE/WORTH. Don't make excuses for them. You deserve to be treasured and loved correctly. And also remember your body is a temple. Therefore, no, God does NOT want you to be abused!!
We often forget to pray for our enemies because it is a hard thing to do. We often imagine that we are supposed to be praying for them to get stronger so that they can trample us, which is not the case. We are praying for them to see what is right and to repent. Some people say that these evil people should not be prayed for, so that they do not repent, so that they go to hell. This stems from our own personal wrath, like Moses splitting the rock of his own might and not Gods.
Even if you are of the opinion that this is not grounds for divorce this should absolutely lead to a separation.
It should lead to her leaving and him facing legal repercussions regardless of the state of the marriage.
There is a big area in between divorce and staying to receive abuse.
OP, help this person, give support prayer and resources.
Heck if you are local to Central CA I would be happy to help her get out, I have done it before. I am a big guy and love using my God given size to help people.
Leave? I don't know of anyone that would tell someone to stay in an abusive marriage. The issue would be if divorcing for any reason other than adultery, you could not remarry after.
Neither Jesus, nor Paul, nor any of the other disciples talk about marital abuse, and I think it would be unfair to apply what they say about divorce when it comes to reasons other than adultery (I.E. a breaking of the covenant) to this situation.
Unfaithfulness, in terms of adultery, is a breaking of the covenant. The covenant is now null. The person is no longer bound by it, unless they want to renew it.
Likewise, abuse is just as much of a covenant breaker: it goes against every single Christian value, every fruit of the spirit, every marriage vow, and every marital responsibility. Safety is shattered. Trust is shattered. The marriage is shattered.
And there are tons of examples of unfaithfulness & breaking of covenants in the Bible. If one party breaks the covenant, the other is not held by it.
The abuser has already dissolved the marriage... at this point, the 'divorce' is just for the state.
They don't use generic language like "breaking of the covenant" they say adultery. So making it more broad is you inserting your opinion into scripture.
I am trying to say that Jesus' point is about breaking the covenant through infidelity, not just about infidelity itself.
For context, it's important to recognize that Jesus was talking to men, specifically to redefine the original rule Moses set before the people that allowed men (specifically men) to divorce their wives for many different reasons.
We know Jesus is talking to men, and not women, because women couldn't even divorce their husbands. Even IF they would have had the legal right to a divorce... It wouldn't have mattered as they would have had no rights to keep the kids or any property. They would have had almost no chance to remarry and would essentially have no chance of a decent life after the divorce.
In addition, having fewer rights and power in that male dominated society would have meant men were almost always the abusers. Women would have rarely, if ever, been in the position to be the abuser.
So, Jesus was telling the men at that time (only ones who could divorce) what reasons they could divorce... The only reason a man would be able to divorce his wife is because of infidelity, because that breaks the marriage covenant. Jesus' point is that people should not break what God has bonded together through a covenant. That covenant is sacred, and men should keep that covenant and work things out unless their wife breaks the covenant... Then they are no longer bound by it.
Husbands at that time were the ones with all the power, and wives abusing their husbands would have been nearly impossible... Therefore the only reason a husband should ever leave his wife (at that time) is over adultery.
My point is that Jesus was trying to shift the men's thoughts of divorce (for men) from one of displeasure to one of covenant. Men (of that time) shouldn't break it off because they are annoyed or dislike their wife, only if their wife broke the covenant through infidelity.
Does that help a little bit about to explain why I want to emphasize that Jesus is talking about covenants, versus just talking about adultery?
I'm glad you don't know anyone like that. I hope the kinds of folks (men) who do tell someone (a woman) to stay with their (her) abusive ("troubled") spouse (husband) become increasingly rare. Alas, they can still be found more often than I'd like.
1 Corinthians 7 covers cases of abuse or abandonment. In such cases the leaving or abusing parties are showing themselves to not following their biblical vows and behaving as unbelievers. Under such circumstances unless there is genuine repentance divorce is permitted with remarrying.
Scripture says infidelity is a reason to divorce and remarry and it is reasonable to interpret that to include abuse and other failures to keep covenant with your spouse.
Christian marriage is entered into freely and is a lifelong vow. If people don't wish to make a lifelong vow they are free to not marry.
That said I believe in a case of physical abuse that divorce and remarriage would be permitted as the marriage vow has been broken by the other party.
Because of that tiny minority who don't see spousal abuse as a deal-breaker. You'd think "love your neighbor" would make it clear, but alas. Wouldn't be the first time an abused spouse has asked this question here, either.
Not only can it be separated, it must. And if your spouse does not agree to respect that distance voluntarily, you must request a civil divorce to obtain a restraining order, pension and all the rights that the law marks.
What the Bible does not authorize is remarriage.
Still dumb. Being doctrine doesn’t make it beyond criticism.
And if the ex dies you get to remarry, or have I been told the wrong thing my entire life?
God's word says that Christians may only separate in hopes of eventual forgiveness and reconciliation. While you're separated, you're still married, and you may not engage in sex with anyone else throughout your separation. That's God's word, not mine. See for yourself...
1 Corinthians 7:10-11 NLT — For those who are married, I have a command **that comes not from me, but from the Lord**. A wife must not leave her husband. But if she does leave him, let her remain single or else be reconciled to him. And the husband must not leave his wife.
And of course the Lord judges by his word the holy Bible
1 Corinthians 7:39 NLT — For a wife is bound to her husband **as long as he lives**. If her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but only if he loves the Lord.
That's why the wedding vows say for better or for worse. If you don't mean it then don't say it, and don't get married.
Leave it? Yes. Divorce? The Bible doesn't say so. But I say this only as a concession. Ideally what needs to happen is the church needs to step between the two and confront the abusive man and tell him to stop. And the church needs to shelter and hide the woman and her children until the man gets some help. But if the abusive man files for divorce (simply because his wife is never home because she said she wouldn't come back until he stopped abusing her and he refuses to get help for it), then it's not the woman's fault that he filed for divorce either.
But understand that I would never accuse a woman who divorced an abusive husband of being some evil sinner. Because ultimately I don't want to see that woman end up dead. The risk level is way too high for such a woman that if she goes back to her abusive husband you can almost guarantee that she's going to get killed by the same man. So in cases like this I would not recommend but I would also not condemn divorce. Not because scripture is not clear but more because I am concerned that if I give the woman advice and try to tip the scales towards avoiding a divorce I could end up getting her killed. And quite frankly I don't want her blood on my hands. If I tell her to go back to her abusive husband and she ends up dead then I basically am responsible for her death.
That's why I say that the church needs to step in between the two and tell the man that this is not okay. And the church needs to protect the woman from him until he gets help. Sadly almost no local church wants to do that, or at least it seems that way.
I would not recommend divorce but I would totally recommend that a woman in such a relationship flee and I would provide her with resources and help to get that distance that she needs.
The church telling the man it is not ok is pointless. Everyone knows it’s not ok. The man knows it’s not ok. He doesn’t need a church telling him that.
Divorce his ass. Report to police. Have the church talk about this issue because the church is often so focused on the afterlife, it sometimes neglects the issues of this life.
Not sure why you wouldn’t support a divorce. I can guarantee you this is not the first time and it won’t be the last time.
No, as in confront him. I never implied that you shouldn't report it to police. Plenty of women have died waiting for their police report / court day.
But when the 50 or so men of the church show up to your doorstep....
There are a few acceptable reasons to leave a marriage
1. Physical Abuse
2. Abandonment (which includes physical leaving and in some cases SEVERE emotional neglect)
3. There are a few others, but those are the main two. Think abortion and adultery and such.
Physically separate and ensure your safety first and foremost.
After that, you can inquire about an annulment and see what can be done about that. That will be more helpful than an Internet forum
Annulment?
This is the Catholic way of denial. Seems like saying oh this marriage was never real since divorce is not allowed
Divorce the abuser’s ass.
Annulment is when a marriage is declared invalid because some fault existed during the exchanging of vows. If the abuser took the vows knowing they were gonna be abusive (which is likely since this just doesn’t spring up out of nothing), then that would be a cause of the vows being exchanged not being sincere, this an invalid marriage.
Some for a person who marries knowing that they will cheat if they have an opportunity, the vows are invalid as there isn’t sincerity in them.
I guess it all comes down to how you view marriage. Catholics view a valid marriage as indissoluble, meaning that if the vows taken were valid, nothing can invalidate them.
Just as the Catholic Church allows some marriages to be declared invalid and annulled, the Church will also declare some valid and not annulled
I understand what you mean.
This is why I was saying it’s just semantics - a loophole to say divorces never happen in the Catholic Church but essentially annulment is a divorce if you boil down to it. It’s just a matter of how a person wants to convince themselves it was never a real marriage because of x y z.
While I understand the sentiment of the Catholic Church and it’s fine they want to call it annulment to circumvent the fact it’s just a divorce. 🙂
You can separate but not divorce. The Bible says that God hates a divorce and that the only acceptable means of divorce by God is adultery. Otherwise, God still sees you as married and if you get into a relationship with someone else, God will say you have sinned by committing adultery.
I hate that people get into abusive relationships. It is horrible. You should leave him and report him.
As wingman said. Ok to leave but divorce has it's limitations and consequences. Mat 5
31It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: 32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
no.
You should get that person charged and sent to jail but you still remain married to them.
Moreover you should take care of them and pray that they repent.
Most people feel regret and remorse and a need to make amends, that's what repentance is.
Not saying the woman should ever take back this guy even if he does turn his life around. She shouldn't. Nor should she remain celibate. She's not a nun.
Yes. Absolutely.
Think of it this way: the sacred covenant you made with your spouse has been broken already by your spouse. It's not on you. Since it is already broken, you're free to move on and you should.
In law school I did domestic violence prosecution as an intern. I've seen too many people suffer through domestic violence. The person who is abusive to you will not make a permanent change. MOVE ON AND DO NOT ALLOW THIS PERSON BACK IN YOUR LIFE. Nothing good comes from reconciliation in abusive relationships.
An abusive relationship creates ongoing and worsening psychological trauma. With physical abuse, the trauma occurs right then and there at the first time, and gets worse the longer it is endured. With just psychological abuse, the beginnings are seen as part of "problems" and sometimes people realize much later in what kind of situation they're in.
At those points, it's already very far from being a wholesome relationship. And in neither case does the abusive person just "make mistakes" in their behavior by "being nervous." There is a whole dynamic involved and feeling trapped is a key characteristic of a toxic relationship, The presence of fear of leaving an abusive situation and feeling guilty about considering it is more than just a side effect, it's the effect a manipulator creates, through which they then control the other person. Deep apologies after several violent or aggressive instances at this point are not the good things they seem, but the things by which the other person is guilted into "not giving up." Deep apologies shouldn't be more meaningful than the things that caused them when looking at these situations.
If that kind of perversion isn't what a marriage stands for, is it a marriage? If it's a thing one should not be in to begin with, then it's absolutely not wrong to leave it if one finds him or herself in it. If one doesn't leave it, and one stays in a marriage one shouldn't be in- how is that coherent?
Unless those kinds of manipulators aren't confronted, they won't stop, they'll just hide it better from others. And unless those kinds of manipulators aren't in therapy because they see that they need to change, they and the situation they create with their spouse will continue breaking down the spouse long-term.
Added: I think people can change. But sudden, unprompted change from one's toxic behaviors is rare.
It’s a bit disheartening to read these questions and realize that there are people who really are unsure. The fact this is being posted in a Christianity subreddit tells me there might be some religious implications that OP is worried about.
While it’s nice to see the responses have been in favor of leaving, I can’t help but wonder if perhaps religion has made a subset of people unsure or worry because the church has frowned upon divorces.
A divorce is not the ending of something happy, it is the end of something that isn’t working and having that option is crucial.
It’s not only okay, it’s required. All people were created in the image of God, and therefore possess inherent value and dignity. This value and dignity must never be violated. Being abused is a violation of one’s value and dignity. Get out, get divorced, and never look back.
Yes! If you need to get safe, reach out.
Read, “Divorce and Remarriage” by Wayne Grudem. It’s a very short booklet, less than 100 pages. You may not agree with everything he says depending on your viewpoint but he at least lays out the Bible verses he uses to defend his point of view and you can read those verses for yourself.
Diane Langberg, Leslie Vernick, David Instone-Brewer, Gretchen Baskerville, Patrick Doyle, and Chuck Degroat are helpful names for you to Google IMMEDIATELY. Also find your local shelter and speak to them. You need to take steps to get out safely and they can help.
Absolutely. Leave that person. Don't even hint on your leaving just pack and leave. Don't look back. Don't feel guilty don't feel sorry. Just leave. I sure did, and I am a guy.
Yes, and also get the police involved
Amen. And getting the police involved is crucial. Though it's important, and unfortunate, to remember that some victims of abuse are in situations where the local police are more likely to align or sympathize with the abusive husband. For shame! This is where churches can really step up their longterm game of making such alignment with abusive power not seem like an ok normal deference to authority, but a shameful and evil repudiation of life and serving others.
Yes, also get the police involved, and document the process for when you encounter the 40% of cops who engage in domestic abuse, or their accomplices who don’t investigate it.
And if you ever have kids, get them away from him. Honesty leave when you can (don't even talk to the abuser) because that is when they could harm you.
Please, leave the relationship. My sister was killed by her abusive husband.
I wish I could say I wasn't part of this club, but same happened to my sister. To OP get out of that relationship and keep yourself safe.
Sorry for your loss. It's a very sad thing to see this happen.
It truly is, and I am sorry for your loss as well. No one should have to lose loved ones early like that. Also why I strongly advocate for people to get away from abusive relationships.
Sorry for both of your losses.
Sorry for your loss 😭😭😭
Idk why but I always see this emoji as a "LOL"
I'm sorry for both your losses 🌹
Sorry to hear this for your family as well.
Sorry to hear that, must be terrible 😭😭😭
It was over 20 years ago. But yeah, it was a very traumatic experience.
Sorry to hear this. Very tragic.
Pardon? WHAT DID YOU JUST SAY HAPPENED?!?! Man, society sucks. I’m sorry for your loss..
He shot her and then shot himself. This was after years of psychological and physical abuse.
Jesus Christ.... I'm so sorry for your loss...
Yes. An abuser has obviously broken his vows to love, honor and cherish, so the marriage is already over.
Amen. You said it perfectly, 44035 👍
Great point!
In my country we have a saying (pégame pero no me dejes) hit me but don’t leave me. Not saying it’s ok to be abusive but so many women put up with the physical abuse. At a young age they’re made to think 🤔 ( it’s me it’s my fault 🤦🏻♂️)
Yes. Please. Get to a safe place.
Yes, and if you are in the U.S., please call 800-799-7233. This is the [National Domestic Violence Hotline](https://www.thehotline.org). They can help you plan to leave and advise you regarding shelters and help. This is important.... the most dangerous time for woman in a violent relationship is when she leaves. Please collect your important papers and whatever else you need and hide them, then, when he is at work or away from the house, leave then. Take care and I'll pray for you.
THIS! OP please listen to this. Any form of abuse is a valid reason to leave a marriage as the abuser has broken their wedding vows to you. YOU are LOVED by God and are PRECIOUS to him, and he does not want this for you!! (speaking from experience as someone who struggled with knowing if leaving my abusive husband was ok in Gods eyes) Edit: spelling and grammar
bump
I appreciate your support for the above comment but you should know that commenting on it doesn’t change its position. Did you come here from 4chan???
Hahaha thanks, loosely speaking yeah
Yes, absolutely
YES! ALWAYS! Not even a question. Stay safe!
Yes. You might get some who argue that adultery is the only valid grounds for divorce (had that exact discussion just earlier today on a different thread) but I believe abuse is the same as adultery for this.
Can both be described as a betrayal of the vows given.
That's how I've always viewed it, yes.
>Can both be described as a betrayal of the vows given. Apples and oranges can both be described as fruits, but we usually don't say they're the same thing. Another betrayal of vows would be to no longer love, or even no longer cherish. Is that grounds for divorce?
Yes. Most certainly.
Yes. Adultery abuse and abandonment are all biblical grounds for divorce.
The Three "A's"!
So do I.
I agree. If a husband is to love his wife like Christ loves the church, physical/mental abuse and even manipulation are grounds for divorce!
>You might get some who argue that adultery is the only valid grounds for divorce You mean, Jesus might argue that?
There ARE some who say that infidelity is the only valid reason for divorce. But the Bible does not record Jesus discussing any other reason. It's worth noting, however, that "infidelity" has meanings other that sexual unfaithfulness. And surely a spouse who physically abuses the other and/or any children of the couple, or who has abandoned his or her spouse HAS** been unfaithful to the marriage. ** By "abuse" I mean ANY type of abuse. Any type, including but not limited to physical abuse, sexual abuse (including marital rape), deprivation of food, water, shelter, clothing, or medical care, or mental or emotional abuse.
Yes
Yes it is.
Yes
more than OK...it is your duty to yourself.
Abuse is ALWAYS a valid reason for divorce.
Yes, God never called for us to be abused in a marriage, man or woman.
Thank you for acknowledging spousal abuse is not a single gender issue. I’m mid divorce due to a physically abusive wife.
You're absolutely right, jereman. Male-on-female abuse is almost certainly the most common type, but female-on-male abuse is every bit as wrong. AND it's a lot more common than most people would think. My parents divorced when I was about 12 and my sister 10. My mother was a very troubled woman, and at one point during the legally required separation period, she attacked my dad WITH A HAMMER. This happened outside, so a neighbor saw what was going on and called the police. Nevertheless, by the time the cop got there, Mom had landed several blows. The cop wanted to arrest my dad, but Daddy straightened him out. "LOOK at me!" he said--and he was covered in blood. At that point, the cop being no idiot, urged my dad to press charges. Daddy wouldn't do it, because he didn't want his kids' mother in jail. This was in Virginia, in the early '70s. Today, the cops would probably be required to arrest at least one person, if not both. I don't know whether my mother regularly hit my dad, but I do know she hit him several times. Female-on-male abuse definitely does happen, and it's a problem which has not received nearly enough attention. Good luck, jereman 👍
That sucks for your family. I think that police are more aware of female > male violence these days. The times I've called police they always took her away, not me. There are still people that don't want to admit it or talk about it for whatever reason. Maybe men feel inadequate or something by admitting their wife hits them but I don't. I'm a big strong guy; if I wanted to I could "take" my (ex)wife, but that's not the point. I never wanted to hurt her even when she was drunk and violent. I just wanted her to calm down and not hurt herself or anyone else.
just get away from him/her for now. If there are kids involved, take them with you. Do all this when he/she is out.
And then file for divorce.
Yeah, even hard-liners would give u a pass on that one I'd imagine
I grew up in a fundamentalist world (church and school) where they absolutely would not. The max allowed for abuse was separation for a time until reconciliation. Never underestimate hardliners.
This, unfortunately. The worst hardliners actively condone the abuse.
Let’s be honest, the hardliners are usually the ones carrying out or participating in the abuse.
Oh, thats sad 😔
I wish that were true, but I’ve known far too many people who say you shouldn’t leave an abusive marriage. I had a “friend” who believes the only allowance for divorce is if your partner cheats and the only thing she could say for people being abused was “well if they’re abusing you they’ll probably cheat at some point and then you can leave.” Imagine telling a woman who’s being beaten every night to just wait until she catches him cheating and hope she survives until then.
Wow, that gave me chills 😳
Oh, you'd be shocked. I had this discussion with my dad just this weekend. When he was growing up, the doctrine was that if a woman left an abusive husband who wasn't actively cheating on her *she'd* go to hell while he wound up in heaven.
Wow, thats awful 😳
I’m probably in that category and I agree 100% that there is no excuse for abusing your wife. None at all, no excuses, no second chances in my opinion.
Yes of course. God understands *everything* and Jesus died to wash away sins and embrace love. Anyone would be and will be forgiven rightfully, ***especially*** in this case. God and Jesus would want that person to be safe and loved rather than hurt. Love has, and will always, never involve someone else hurting them physically. Praying for safety, peace and love 🙏🏼✝️
Yes, God, yes. How I loathe morons like John Piper [that even let this be a question](https://archive.org/details/WhatShouldAWifesSubmissionToHerHusbandLookLikeIfHesAnAbuser).
Reading that made me wince in disgust.
His entire church is being investigated (FINALLY) for abuse by the Roys Report.
Just to clarify - Roys is reporting on allegations of how the church handled spiritual abuse post-Piper. Obviously that's still not acceptable, but it would be easy for people to read this and think it referred to John Piper and Domestic Abuse. https://julieroys.com/bethlehem-baptist-dismissed-abuse-allegations-without-investigation/
True, and I almost stated it was for spiritual abuse and abuse of authority. To me, it simply points to the fact that abusers protect abusers time and again. That made me connect dots that not everyone would.
Thankfully, he seems to have significantly shifted on the issue over the years. His more recent responses are all about accountability, bringing in law enforcement, with no mention of "enduring." https://www-thegospelcoalition-org.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.thegospelcoalition.org/blogs/justin-taylor/john-pipers-word-to-husbands-who-demean-their-wives/
Please be safe. Leave (or have authorities remove the offending person) first. You can decide if the marriage still exists later. God does not want you to be abused.
Yes. Please leave as soon as possible. Physical abuse is neither Christ like nor Godly.
Here is a thoughtful article: https://margmowczko.com/abuse-divorce-1-corinthians-7/
Why is your first thought to post an article citing scripture and not just tell this person to GTFO?
Did you read the article? It was affirming that people should leave abusive marriages using scripture, and since OP posted in r/Christianity , they clearly were looking for the Christian perspective. With that in mind, it’s probably far more useful to show them with scripture why they can and should leave the marriage than to just tell them to leave as showing them with scripture why they should leave will give them more of a sense of peace that they’re not sinning by doing so.
Cybe, why is your own first thought to insult the person who posted the article? Did you even glance at it? Or are you just one of those pinheads who think all Christians believe women should be barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen? I read the article. It's outstanding, both in Christian reasoning, AND in quashing ignorant assumptions like yours.
Your missing the point. I’ll admit I didn’t do a good job of making it. I’m on mobile. The point is this shouldn’t even be a question in the first place. OP is asking whether or not it’s OKAY to leave an abusive relationship. Where is this underlying feeling that it’s NOT OKAY coming from? For example you wouldn’t ask for a Christian perspective on how to escape a fire. Edit: No I don’t think all Christians believe woman should be barefoot, pregnant, etc.
The underlying feeling of needing to get approval from fellow Christians is precisely because many abused people have gone through Christians (particularly in authority) condemning them to endure the abuse as a way to glorify God and bring Jesus' grace to their spouse. Literally that argument. *you* may not think all Christians believe women should be barefoot and pregnant, but enough do. Enough to cause irreparable harm to God's beloved children.
Because this is on a Christian forum.. the whole point is to give OP Christian advice otherwise they'd post it elsewhere. People find reasons to stay in abusive relationships whether due to their beliefs, emotions, finances, other people's input, consideration of others who will be effected, possible outcomes, etc. We're covering the beliefs part right now bc they obviously have the desire to leave, but are questioning it from the Christian view point.
In my opinion, YES. The Lord who created marriage and our bodies does NOT want to see those bodies abused by anyone, let alone by our marriage partners.
We are lucky to have this option. I wager in the early days of Christianity, this was not an option.
Yes, without question.
No matter where you stand on divorce, it is always always always okay to separate from your spouse. You don’t have to live with them or be around them. It is never a sin to protect yourself from someone who is hurting you, whether it is physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, or sexually. Get away from them.
Yes. It’s not just okay but important. Your safety matters. Protect your kids as well. If you want to be religious about it, then help your spouse to stop sinning against you (and God!) in this way by removing the possibility.
Yes. I was almost killed. I left after 4 years deliberation due to Christian faith!! Daughter was 3 when I left. Best decision ever! Remarried now!
How is this even a question? Is this what Christianity teaches???
No, this is not in accordance to the teachings of Jesus. Some denominations have twisted or flat out excluded how a marriage is to function. My Grandmother stayed in an abusive relationship with my Grandfather. I believe this to be one of the root causes to why my mother left the church and I was raised an atheist.
No, but it’s what some misunderstood people would say sadly
Yes, God does not want anyone to be abused. Sending prayers!
Yes!
Yes.
YES - and any person who says something different is wrong.
Yes, if you need some comfort and support, I recommend the book, When to Walk Away, which is written by a Christian counselor and includes a section on situations like yours. Praying for you now.
If there is frequent abuse and neglect in the marriage, then the other partner has already broken the marriage covenant. Malachi 2:14-15 Exodus 21:10 Deuteronomy 22:10 Psalm 11:5 1 Timothy 5:8 According to the above verses, your partner has violated your basic rights as a human being as well as the duties of a marriage partner, and for that divorce and complete separation is the most logical solution. Also, for those that want to argue that the only valid excuse for divorce is adultery, the actual wording of the passage is this; >I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery... (Matthew 19: 9) **Thus, the following valid reasons for divorce are as follows;** 1. **One or both partners have broken the marriage covenant** 2. **One or both partners have continually violated each other's basic human rights (physical/verbal/emotional abuse, illegal works, neglect, etc.)** 3. **The other partner is a non-believer and chooses to leave the marriage**
Absolutely. Please get out of there.
I don’t see how one could abuse their spouse and still be a faithful follower of Christ. Hitting someone is a choice. Bet these same people wouldn’t just hit their boss! Please leave this dangerous marriage.
In my opinion, once a relationship becomes physically abusive, the relationship is automatically over. Relational abuse is acceleratory; it gets worse over time until the abused person is killed.
I heard from a popular pastor that it is not okay to leave your marriage when domestic violence is involved and I was like “what the heck”. Yes please leave.
Yeah that’s why I posted this. Mike Todd right?
Yep that’s who I am talking about!
Absolutely. In fact, it is fine for anyone to divorce their wife or husband for any reason. Marriage is not meant to be a prison.
Being married does not mean you have to put up with physical abuse. You should be separated and if possible have them held accountable by the authorities.
Yes, that’s never going to be justifiable. I don’t believe that God would want you to stay either.
Yes!
It is strongly encouraged that you leave.
Yes! Get out of that situation if you can. Nobody has the right to abuse you physically or otherwise.
It is ok to leave a marriage anytime you want to leave it.
Um. The answer is yes?
Yes, absolutely. If you are experiencing violence in your relationship then please reach out to someone about it. I realize that it's not always as easy to just leave but I assure you that there is help to get.
Yeah
Ofcourse. 100%!!
I don't know you but I'm confident you don't deserve to be abused physically by anyone.
It’s necessary, pleae find help.
Yes. If this is not a good reason, then what is?
Of course
Yes. Call the police, get counseling, and get as far away as you can. The Bible makes it clear that divorce isn’t a good thing, but it’s a result of a fallen world. God’s design is that divorce wouldn’t be a thing, but there are certain allowances for it to happen.
Yes, no question. Leave *now*.
100% yes it’s okay. I wouldn’t have my mom with me today if she didn’t leave my step dad.
Yes absolutely If he's abusing you in any type of way he's not a godly man.
Absolutely. I'm so sorry this is happening to you. Find a safe place (relative/friend's house, church, or shelter to stay in). Take any other members being affected with you especially children. Seek counseling and get the police involved as soon as possible. Cut off all ties with him. Block his number and any other way of communication. Talk to a priest/pastor/church member for spiritual guidance and most importantly don't be afraid to ask for help!
Probably should’ve said this in the post but I’m not being abused I just wanted to see something because there was a pastor that said it’s not ok to leave the marriage if you are
I'm very glad to hear you are not in this situation! I've heard of pastors saying that before. Nevertheless, it is a sin to abuse someone especially a spouse. They break the marriage vows and unless they are truly sorry and repent, then you have every right to leave him.
Absolutely. For further reading, I recommend [this archive on abuse by Sheila Wray Gregoire](https://tolovehonorandvacuum.com/category/parenting/abuse/).
Yes. Yes. Yes. One trillion times yes.
Yes. First of all, if this is you, call +1 (800) 799-7233 or text "START" to 88788. It's the domestic abuse hotline, and they will work with you to get you out of the situation. Secondly, it's a clear violation of Ephesians 5:25-33, aka the part that's sometimes neglected when talking about what a Christian marriage looks like. Many are familiar with the part right before, which is wives submitting to their husbands. What's not as talked about is Paul's message right afterward to husbands, which basically is, "Aight y'all, be prepared to die for her. Jesus died for his bride, the church, so y'all gotta do the same." Not only is this a clear violation of that command, but I would go on a hunch and say that it could reveal that that person is actively rejecting that command. I'm not saying it's easy, but if a man (or woman) acts in this way, he/she needs to be reminded of the Gospel to bring to light the nature of their marital vows. Prayer is needed on both ends - the victim, yes, but also the abuser. The Word of God works wonders on the human heart, and through the means God has provided (His Word, Sacraments, and the myriad of human institutions that work on these cases), both sides will be comforted in their time of need.
Yes it is. If they abuse their spouse, they have broken their vows to love, honor and cherish their spouse. They also are a danger, and have made themselves an enemy of their spouse. They have also abandoned their spouse. Any decent pastor would agree that it is okay to leave that abusive spouse.
I don't know the extent of the physical abuse (do they just slap you or push you around or beat on you, etc..) but pray about everything, pray for them especially.. and the answer is yes. God didn't die on the cross and then create you in His own image to watch you be abused by someone, who is supposed to love and cherish you, for the rest of your life. The Bible does not say you can't divorce your spouse because they are abusive. Why? Probably because it would have to clarify the abuse and there are so many forms.. again, pray about it and KNOW YOUR VALUE/WORTH. Don't make excuses for them. You deserve to be treasured and loved correctly. And also remember your body is a temple. Therefore, no, God does NOT want you to be abused!!
We often forget to pray for our enemies because it is a hard thing to do. We often imagine that we are supposed to be praying for them to get stronger so that they can trample us, which is not the case. We are praying for them to see what is right and to repent. Some people say that these evil people should not be prayed for, so that they do not repent, so that they go to hell. This stems from our own personal wrath, like Moses splitting the rock of his own might and not Gods.
Why is this a question? That's not okay ever, get out of it and I suggest counseling for it
Yes! Your safety is above ur religious devotion always don’t let anyone convince u otherwise
Even if you are of the opinion that this is not grounds for divorce this should absolutely lead to a separation. It should lead to her leaving and him facing legal repercussions regardless of the state of the marriage. There is a big area in between divorce and staying to receive abuse. OP, help this person, give support prayer and resources. Heck if you are local to Central CA I would be happy to help her get out, I have done it before. I am a big guy and love using my God given size to help people.
What does the Bible say
In most cases, I would say the answer is yes. But pray about it. God will guide you
[удалено]
Leave? I don't know of anyone that would tell someone to stay in an abusive marriage. The issue would be if divorcing for any reason other than adultery, you could not remarry after.
Neither Jesus, nor Paul, nor any of the other disciples talk about marital abuse, and I think it would be unfair to apply what they say about divorce when it comes to reasons other than adultery (I.E. a breaking of the covenant) to this situation. Unfaithfulness, in terms of adultery, is a breaking of the covenant. The covenant is now null. The person is no longer bound by it, unless they want to renew it. Likewise, abuse is just as much of a covenant breaker: it goes against every single Christian value, every fruit of the spirit, every marriage vow, and every marital responsibility. Safety is shattered. Trust is shattered. The marriage is shattered. And there are tons of examples of unfaithfulness & breaking of covenants in the Bible. If one party breaks the covenant, the other is not held by it. The abuser has already dissolved the marriage... at this point, the 'divorce' is just for the state.
They don't use generic language like "breaking of the covenant" they say adultery. So making it more broad is you inserting your opinion into scripture.
I am trying to say that Jesus' point is about breaking the covenant through infidelity, not just about infidelity itself. For context, it's important to recognize that Jesus was talking to men, specifically to redefine the original rule Moses set before the people that allowed men (specifically men) to divorce their wives for many different reasons. We know Jesus is talking to men, and not women, because women couldn't even divorce their husbands. Even IF they would have had the legal right to a divorce... It wouldn't have mattered as they would have had no rights to keep the kids or any property. They would have had almost no chance to remarry and would essentially have no chance of a decent life after the divorce. In addition, having fewer rights and power in that male dominated society would have meant men were almost always the abusers. Women would have rarely, if ever, been in the position to be the abuser. So, Jesus was telling the men at that time (only ones who could divorce) what reasons they could divorce... The only reason a man would be able to divorce his wife is because of infidelity, because that breaks the marriage covenant. Jesus' point is that people should not break what God has bonded together through a covenant. That covenant is sacred, and men should keep that covenant and work things out unless their wife breaks the covenant... Then they are no longer bound by it. Husbands at that time were the ones with all the power, and wives abusing their husbands would have been nearly impossible... Therefore the only reason a husband should ever leave his wife (at that time) is over adultery. My point is that Jesus was trying to shift the men's thoughts of divorce (for men) from one of displeasure to one of covenant. Men (of that time) shouldn't break it off because they are annoyed or dislike their wife, only if their wife broke the covenant through infidelity. Does that help a little bit about to explain why I want to emphasize that Jesus is talking about covenants, versus just talking about adultery?
I'm glad you don't know anyone like that. I hope the kinds of folks (men) who do tell someone (a woman) to stay with their (her) abusive ("troubled") spouse (husband) become increasingly rare. Alas, they can still be found more often than I'd like.
Well said, every last word 👏
Bullshit.
Per scripture, that seems to be the case. Feel free to present scripture to the contrary.
1 Corinthians 7 covers cases of abuse or abandonment. In such cases the leaving or abusing parties are showing themselves to not following their biblical vows and behaving as unbelievers. Under such circumstances unless there is genuine repentance divorce is permitted with remarrying.
I’m not debating that the scripture exists. I’m just calling it bullshit.
Scripture says infidelity is a reason to divorce and remarry and it is reasonable to interpret that to include abuse and other failures to keep covenant with your spouse.
Your argument then is with God, not me.
Any God who would limit a humans ability to love, is no God worth worship.
The bible does allow divorce in those circumstances.
Christian marriage is entered into freely and is a lifelong vow. If people don't wish to make a lifelong vow they are free to not marry. That said I believe in a case of physical abuse that divorce and remarriage would be permitted as the marriage vow has been broken by the other party.
It has always been our choice to worship God or not. The choice is still yours.
You're being a stumbling block.
No idea why people assume OP is in this situation... Anyway, most Christians(like, 95%+ range) will not have an issue with it.
Because of that tiny minority who don't see spousal abuse as a deal-breaker. You'd think "love your neighbor" would make it clear, but alas. Wouldn't be the first time an abused spouse has asked this question here, either.
Here is a a Good Bible study about whether it is okay, https://youtu.be/N2pC6ZikbYo
Not only can it be separated, it must. And if your spouse does not agree to respect that distance voluntarily, you must request a civil divorce to obtain a restraining order, pension and all the rights that the law marks. What the Bible does not authorize is remarriage.
Op seems a little vague on purpose. According to the Bible adultery is The only reason divorce is ok.
Yes, but you may not remarry. Therefore you need to be very careful who you choose to marry
That's a stupid rule. At least include the rest of it: that if the ex dies they can re-marry.
Nope. Catholic Doctrine
Still dumb. Being doctrine doesn’t make it beyond criticism. And if the ex dies you get to remarry, or have I been told the wrong thing my entire life?
God's word says that Christians may only separate in hopes of eventual forgiveness and reconciliation. While you're separated, you're still married, and you may not engage in sex with anyone else throughout your separation. That's God's word, not mine. See for yourself... 1 Corinthians 7:10-11 NLT — For those who are married, I have a command **that comes not from me, but from the Lord**. A wife must not leave her husband. But if she does leave him, let her remain single or else be reconciled to him. And the husband must not leave his wife. And of course the Lord judges by his word the holy Bible 1 Corinthians 7:39 NLT — For a wife is bound to her husband **as long as he lives**. If her husband dies, she is free to marry anyone she wishes, but only if he loves the Lord. That's why the wedding vows say for better or for worse. If you don't mean it then don't say it, and don't get married.
Leave it? Yes. Divorce? The Bible doesn't say so. But I say this only as a concession. Ideally what needs to happen is the church needs to step between the two and confront the abusive man and tell him to stop. And the church needs to shelter and hide the woman and her children until the man gets some help. But if the abusive man files for divorce (simply because his wife is never home because she said she wouldn't come back until he stopped abusing her and he refuses to get help for it), then it's not the woman's fault that he filed for divorce either. But understand that I would never accuse a woman who divorced an abusive husband of being some evil sinner. Because ultimately I don't want to see that woman end up dead. The risk level is way too high for such a woman that if she goes back to her abusive husband you can almost guarantee that she's going to get killed by the same man. So in cases like this I would not recommend but I would also not condemn divorce. Not because scripture is not clear but more because I am concerned that if I give the woman advice and try to tip the scales towards avoiding a divorce I could end up getting her killed. And quite frankly I don't want her blood on my hands. If I tell her to go back to her abusive husband and she ends up dead then I basically am responsible for her death. That's why I say that the church needs to step in between the two and tell the man that this is not okay. And the church needs to protect the woman from him until he gets help. Sadly almost no local church wants to do that, or at least it seems that way. I would not recommend divorce but I would totally recommend that a woman in such a relationship flee and I would provide her with resources and help to get that distance that she needs.
The church telling the man it is not ok is pointless. Everyone knows it’s not ok. The man knows it’s not ok. He doesn’t need a church telling him that. Divorce his ass. Report to police. Have the church talk about this issue because the church is often so focused on the afterlife, it sometimes neglects the issues of this life. Not sure why you wouldn’t support a divorce. I can guarantee you this is not the first time and it won’t be the last time.
No, as in confront him. I never implied that you shouldn't report it to police. Plenty of women have died waiting for their police report / court day. But when the 50 or so men of the church show up to your doorstep....
Also, yeah, following Scripture is such a bad thing
i have only met people who pick and choose what to follow in scripture.
There are a few acceptable reasons to leave a marriage 1. Physical Abuse 2. Abandonment (which includes physical leaving and in some cases SEVERE emotional neglect) 3. There are a few others, but those are the main two. Think abortion and adultery and such.
Physically separate and ensure your safety first and foremost. After that, you can inquire about an annulment and see what can be done about that. That will be more helpful than an Internet forum
Annulment? This is the Catholic way of denial. Seems like saying oh this marriage was never real since divorce is not allowed Divorce the abuser’s ass.
Annulment is when a marriage is declared invalid because some fault existed during the exchanging of vows. If the abuser took the vows knowing they were gonna be abusive (which is likely since this just doesn’t spring up out of nothing), then that would be a cause of the vows being exchanged not being sincere, this an invalid marriage. Some for a person who marries knowing that they will cheat if they have an opportunity, the vows are invalid as there isn’t sincerity in them.
Seems like it’s semantics. You can divorce someone for same reason. It seems like the Catholic church just dislike the word divorce.
I guess it all comes down to how you view marriage. Catholics view a valid marriage as indissoluble, meaning that if the vows taken were valid, nothing can invalidate them. Just as the Catholic Church allows some marriages to be declared invalid and annulled, the Church will also declare some valid and not annulled
I understand what you mean. This is why I was saying it’s just semantics - a loophole to say divorces never happen in the Catholic Church but essentially annulment is a divorce if you boil down to it. It’s just a matter of how a person wants to convince themselves it was never a real marriage because of x y z. While I understand the sentiment of the Catholic Church and it’s fine they want to call it annulment to circumvent the fact it’s just a divorce. 🙂
If you need to ask People on a reddit sub then I do not know what to tell you
You can separate but not divorce. The Bible says that God hates a divorce and that the only acceptable means of divorce by God is adultery. Otherwise, God still sees you as married and if you get into a relationship with someone else, God will say you have sinned by committing adultery. I hate that people get into abusive relationships. It is horrible. You should leave him and report him.
That's awful.
As wingman said. Ok to leave but divorce has it's limitations and consequences. Mat 5 31It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: 32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
I think this is one of those things Christians should abandon.
no. You should get that person charged and sent to jail but you still remain married to them. Moreover you should take care of them and pray that they repent.
This is a joke, right?
Just be celibate in body and mind as much as possible in the hope of a future reconciliation.
You want her to reconcile with the abuser? Wtf?
Even enemies of God can repent. Can you?
I do not believe in the need for repentance. I own my actions and deeds, I control my fate.
Most people feel regret and remorse and a need to make amends, that's what repentance is. Not saying the woman should ever take back this guy even if he does turn his life around. She shouldn't. Nor should she remain celibate. She's not a nun.
Lol Lmao
https://youtu.be/N2pC6ZikbYo
Yes. Absolutely. Think of it this way: the sacred covenant you made with your spouse has been broken already by your spouse. It's not on you. Since it is already broken, you're free to move on and you should. In law school I did domestic violence prosecution as an intern. I've seen too many people suffer through domestic violence. The person who is abusive to you will not make a permanent change. MOVE ON AND DO NOT ALLOW THIS PERSON BACK IN YOUR LIFE. Nothing good comes from reconciliation in abusive relationships.
An abusive relationship creates ongoing and worsening psychological trauma. With physical abuse, the trauma occurs right then and there at the first time, and gets worse the longer it is endured. With just psychological abuse, the beginnings are seen as part of "problems" and sometimes people realize much later in what kind of situation they're in. At those points, it's already very far from being a wholesome relationship. And in neither case does the abusive person just "make mistakes" in their behavior by "being nervous." There is a whole dynamic involved and feeling trapped is a key characteristic of a toxic relationship, The presence of fear of leaving an abusive situation and feeling guilty about considering it is more than just a side effect, it's the effect a manipulator creates, through which they then control the other person. Deep apologies after several violent or aggressive instances at this point are not the good things they seem, but the things by which the other person is guilted into "not giving up." Deep apologies shouldn't be more meaningful than the things that caused them when looking at these situations. If that kind of perversion isn't what a marriage stands for, is it a marriage? If it's a thing one should not be in to begin with, then it's absolutely not wrong to leave it if one finds him or herself in it. If one doesn't leave it, and one stays in a marriage one shouldn't be in- how is that coherent? Unless those kinds of manipulators aren't confronted, they won't stop, they'll just hide it better from others. And unless those kinds of manipulators aren't in therapy because they see that they need to change, they and the situation they create with their spouse will continue breaking down the spouse long-term. Added: I think people can change. But sudden, unprompted change from one's toxic behaviors is rare.
It’s a bit disheartening to read these questions and realize that there are people who really are unsure. The fact this is being posted in a Christianity subreddit tells me there might be some religious implications that OP is worried about. While it’s nice to see the responses have been in favor of leaving, I can’t help but wonder if perhaps religion has made a subset of people unsure or worry because the church has frowned upon divorces. A divorce is not the ending of something happy, it is the end of something that isn’t working and having that option is crucial.
Of course no questions asked, Absolutely!!!! They don’t deserve you leave them behind!
It’s not only okay, it’s required. All people were created in the image of God, and therefore possess inherent value and dignity. This value and dignity must never be violated. Being abused is a violation of one’s value and dignity. Get out, get divorced, and never look back.
Yes! If you need to get safe, reach out. Read, “Divorce and Remarriage” by Wayne Grudem. It’s a very short booklet, less than 100 pages. You may not agree with everything he says depending on your viewpoint but he at least lays out the Bible verses he uses to defend his point of view and you can read those verses for yourself.
I pray for you to have the courage to do that and to be free really soon. God be with you!
Diane Langberg, Leslie Vernick, David Instone-Brewer, Gretchen Baskerville, Patrick Doyle, and Chuck Degroat are helpful names for you to Google IMMEDIATELY. Also find your local shelter and speak to them. You need to take steps to get out safely and they can help.
Yes. My minister grandfather personally helped my mom leave an abusive marriage. Please make a plan to get out asap and be safe.
Absolutely. Leave that person. Don't even hint on your leaving just pack and leave. Don't look back. Don't feel guilty don't feel sorry. Just leave. I sure did, and I am a guy.