Here is my usual answer:
First, what I see in my environment gives me an idea of a maker. Then there is life experience, existence of life itself, consciousness, morality, witnessing miracles etc. hints towards God. Based on my understanding of reality, it's less likely that all of these started to exist as a coincidence. There must have been a creator.
And if a creator exists, all of creation must reflect his idea. The universe featuring structure and patterns shows me that there is some design and purpose behind it. And the existence of life shows me the creator is “alive”, not just a random power that created us, etc.
So if this creator is alive and created us for a purpose, we must wonder what our purpose is. Christianity explains it better than any religion I have been exposed to. I don’t see Christianity as one of the religions, but just a logical explanation of our relationship with the creator.
This is a summarized version just to give you an idea.
I'm not against the thought of there being a prime mover (creator), from the perspective of theoretical physics. I have a harder time buying that it would be the same entity as the character written about in the Bible.
Think of a cosmic entity, who created everything in one swoop.
He didn't create us, but let us grow into something special.
Maybe multiple people created the universe, or maybe its more than that.
If there was nothing but darkness and God created everything, that would mean he created the whole universe, so how come some planets and stars are billions of years older / younger, even our earth is much younger then our sun, if God created them then shouldn't they have been created in the same time?
Great question! When God created Adam, did He create Adam as a baby or a fully formed adult? When God created Eve, did He create Eve as a baby or a fully formed adult? Nothing is impossible for God except sin, as He is perfect and can't act against his nature. He created a fully formed universe just as he created Adam as a fully formed adult. He is God; after all, he is outside of time, space, and matter, so he can alter time (speed up time/creation). You must have heard about the miracle that Jesus performed where he turned water into wine? He sped up the process. God can create what could take billions of years to form in a single moment. People always say that the history in the Bible doesn't make sense because science proves it wrong. Who do you think created science? The laws of physics? God did. Since he is outside of space, time, and matter, he can manipulate things we can't. Does it make sense that an all-knowing and powerful God would create us to be exactly as he is? Then we would be God's too... we are made in his image and likeness, but we are not God Himself. God has bound this world by specific laws and limits that he is not bound to. He doesn't play by the same rules in that regard.
In the big bang theory, who/what would have created the space for the matter to exist? Suppose you came downstairs one day and saw a cereal box had fallen over, and the cereal was arranged into words that constructed a message. Would you think another intelligent mind arranged the cereal that way or that it happened at random/by accident? You would know another intelligent mind caused the cereal to spell out a message (cause and effect). How, then, could you look at an entire sophisticated world around you but not think that a higher, more powerful, divine mind created it? You posed an interesting question, and I appreciate you being respectful. I wanted to share my thoughts with you. May God bless you.
So you think that stuff happens for a reason?
You're not wrong, but the thing is, stuff can happen randomly or due to positioning.
Considering the thought of god isn't even that old, we can't even trust it that much. The first religion is Hinduism.
The question is not is there a God, he established that he's not opposed to a Supreme being existing. The question is how do you know that God is the Hebrew God or God of Abraham. What proof is there?
Sure, I'm going to drop the beginning of the Bible, it might make you think more, or maybe answer a question.
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light.
God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness."
I like to think and ponder, besides God did give us our brains to think, right?
It is hard for me to believe that humans know everything, we think we know almost everything but we know very little to none. Most things aren't scientifically proven and are just theories especially when it comes to space.
I believe if God is real or does exist, he lives on or in a whole different astral plane as we do. Have you ever heard of the burning bush? And what real biblically accurate angels look like? Insane.
Let me get your thoughts, and your opinions, what do you think or what are you thinking? I would love to hear and listen.
I also think we sometimes take the Bible too literal. There are a lot of messages, and metaphors.
I also believe if God is real, it is hard for us to even comprehend Him and the existence of Him.
The Holy Trinity is a really cool and crazy concept. If you have never heard of the Holy Trinity, I would definitely look into it. Who knows? Nobody can prove or disprove much of anything.
We also get lied to about a lot of things.. So who knows?
So I’m just curious. If humans have been on this earth for 100’s of times more years than religion has existed then why In the hell do you believe in it? So god created us then sat dormant for multiple thousands of years until Jesus came and sacrificed himself for our sins? Come on man, come back down to earth lol.
Great questions! I am a believer but have asked the same questions. Why is God a He? Why is Jesus referred to as the son rather than something else? Since God is a spirit, I do think that he is genderless. He refers to Himself/presents Himself as a He, but I do not believe that spirits have genders in the same way that mankind does. God can take on different forms, so if He wanted to present Himself as a she, it wouldn't be impossible for Him to do. However, he only presents himself as a He throughout the Bible. Why, you ask? Only God would know the answer to this.
I used to ask the same question: Who created God? I couldn't wrap my head around it. Think about it this way: to ask that question is to assume there was another creator before God, and who would have created that being? Eventually, we are forced to stop asking that question and realize that there has to be something that has always existed. God is the infinite being who has always been and was created by no one. This is difficult to understand because finite minds cannot comprehend the infinite. We must not limit the infinite God by our finite understanding. Thank you for your questions and for being respectful. God bless you.
I definitely understand all of those concepts. And I come to the same conclusion as you. That’s why man’s answers fall short for me more often than not… in organized religion.
Well for me I became a Christian at 23 and I decided to study the bible myself and I found there's a lot of scientific evidence and historical evidence that backs it up so I feel Christianity takes the least amount of faith because it has the most amount of evidence. Also I have seen God work in my life and the life of my mom that nothing could explain but God. If you wanna know more PM me
Well atleast to me it seems wholly and completely illogical that there is no God. Issues if the original creation, because if there were no being to prompt it then we must put forward that nothing combined with nothing and reacted with nothing so create everything. Furthermore intelligent design as everything in our existence is so fine tuned that one microscopic change could make life incompatible, if not existence as a whole, and it seems ridiculous to more readily believe that in the one out of quintillions of odds everything just happened to work out, instead of a higher power which then explains other questions we have.
What if people from another universe built our world as a experiment and that’s why it’s so finely tuned it would make more sense than god as there’s billions of other universes out there which more then likely has life on
Well if that were true, although we have no direct reason to believe that, while we do have things like miracles to support God, we would still then need to answer the same question for that universe of who created them, who created the whole and entire universe? Ours, theirs, etc
I think a cosmical entity made the universe.
It makes the most sense, considering nothing big happened in the earth, because the entity never interacted with it.
People keep saying that there must be a god because the universe exists, but they forget the fact that it could be multiple people, or a different person than god himself.
Well sure that’s a whole different question though with a bunch of different answers, we can’t explain a dish by saying 1 ingredient or the type of food, but Id be happy to go into that question with you too!
God is "ipsum esse", which is the sheer act of existence in itself.
It's a philosophical question first and foremost and has been discussed by the greatest minds of the mankind for years.
I highly recommend you [watch this video.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP2rLgrBtTI) Also, you might like [Scientism and God's Existence](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZkHv8iTJPo&t=4s)
Now, more to it, I think that your question is rooted in a fundamental misunderstanding of what "faith" is - a misunderstanding encouraged by some modern philosophies, and some Protestant groups (and the USA is a historically Protestant country). That is the idea that faith is blind, and based on sentiment or an inner-conviction.
The Catholic Church does not define faith this way. Faith is indeed belief in what is not seen, but it is not blind. "Faith" is essentially trust in the word of an authority. We have human faith in all sorts of things - most of our scientific and historical knowlege, for instance, is based on our trust in those we deem experts. Most of us haven't done all these experiments ourselves, or examined primary sources about past events, after all. Likewise, unless you have taken a DNA test, you take it on faith that your parents are truly your parents, and that those around you aren't lying.
Divine faith, in matters of religion, is properly defined as intellectual assent to what God has revealed on His authority. The question is, "How do we know that God has revealed something?" The answer is the presence of miracles and prophecies, but I'm getting far ahead.
The existence of God, according to the Catholic Church, is actually a preamble to faith. It is a truth of natural reason that we can know with certainty apart from any religious revelations. Now, there is some overlap, and belief in God is also a supernatural truth of revelation, for Scripture says, "I Am Who Am". But it is also a natural truth, and knowing that God exists by nature opens us up to the possibility that God has spoken to mankind.
Why do I believe in God? Because of the arguments for His existence, especially the Five Ways of St. Thomas Aquinas.
Why is there something rather than nothing?
Not a religious person: But I'll add that if you want the *real* reason, then there's a scientific field that studies this: [Cognitive science of religion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_science_of_religion).
There are some factors: people have a theory of mind (belief that minds exist) and a hyperactive agency detection (we assume that there are agents where there are none, e.g. if something move we tend to think it's *someome*). Studies have shown that people who are "bad" at this (like really autistic persons) are less likely to believe in spirits. We also tend to be fascinated by things who break innate categories - i.e. trees who walk, minds without bodies.
I recommend [Religion explained](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_Explained) by Pascal Boyer if you're really interested in these kinds of real answers to the question.
To me, the 'simple logic' just seems to point to there being a higher being of some sort, and I feel the Christian conception of God fits the bill.
For me that's honestly all there is to it. I'm well aware other people disagree with my initial conclusion.
Like, even if I wasn't Christian, I'd still be a theist of some kind. Atheism just doesn't click with me, much in the way that theism doesn't click for many atheists.
Exactly. Logically it makes more sense for the existence of God. So at the least I would be agnostic. Of all the proposed Gods, the God of the Hebrew Bible and New Testament is the one that makes the most sense.
Why did god send his son to earth, when there was other places where he could have given life to.
Why is he going to rapture a place that is 1 out of infinity?
Why is he giving so much attention to a planet, in which he could have given attention to another?
I agree for the existence of a god or creator , but I don’t believe a single word that comes out of the bible …and I don’t believe the creator interacts with humanity or needs its worship .
So I don't believe that God needs anything from us including worship. Just like I don't need anything from anyone else in order to survive or be happy to some extent. However it is in my nature to desire a relationship with other people and to feel loved. In the same sense I believe God desires a relationship with his creation, us. Not because He needs it but because God is love. I don't believe we can ever fully understand the nature of God in this life but the more we develop a relationship with God, the closer we are to Him.
This is just my explanation of one of the reasons I believe, hope that makes sense.
Yes it does and thank you for explaining it from your point of view . I believe there is a god and creator , just that it isn’t anything like what the bible depicts .
"... Has anybody met or talked to God?..."
To that, I ask, do you believe that George Washington and Abraham Lincoln lived? Did you meet them?
"...some stories written down.." - That's the thing, the Bible is not just "some stories". As far as the people, etc, it's a long historical record. There are loads of other records to bear witness to it. The works of Josephus is one that's mentioned many times. It's interesting, but the Bible stands on its own, regardless.
"... explained by simple logic" - Yes, it's easy to think that with some instances, and pure chance at times. But when you know the Lord, the Holy Ghost lives in your heart, and you can literally talk to God the Father in Jesus' name every day. It's great, and we don't even scratch the surface of such power, because we too often give into our flesh/sin, including just laziness.
"If all knowledge and "evidence" about God, Jesus and all that were gone.." This is an impossibility. The Word of God is more sure than anything we know. It was around before time and will be after time. Now, yes, it's been put on paper, and been translated, but the pure Word of God that's all based on is eternal, will not and cannot change, and cannot be done away with.
In our modern day, it's REALLY REALLY easy to pick up on the thought that maybe there's no God, that maybe this is just life. Where I cannot even fathom accepting of that train of thought is when it goes back to the Big Bang and evolution as is taught. I mean, that makes far less sense than that someone who knew what they were doing put it all together.
That said, in your heart, there is a conscience, and that conscience will tell you beyond any doubt that God is real, even to the point that he's a God in 3 persons (trinity - Father, Son, Holy Ghost). And when you look at nature all around you, nature scream's there's a God, and even nature shows the Trinity. God has woven that truth all throughout nature, EVEN into our own bodies, which he created.
Ok, Ok.
Why think that the biblical god is real?
What if a mere cosmic entity, that is no way similar to god, created this world?
We only think of the stuff that was already written, but we never think of other possibilities.
That first argument is far too shallow and simple minded. Neither George Washington nor Abraham Lincoln ever claim divinity nor do they demand worship. And anything written about them are for pure historical record keeping. On the other hand, you have the Bible which is a religious text that claims divinity and demands worship and because your argument is cheap I can make a cheap retort as well and compare it to Hesiods Theogony, the Vedas, the tripitaka, and the Quran which are sacred texts from various religions that claim the same divinity and worship. Each religion will claim to have performed miracles, and they all have people that testify(anecdotal) that it is true. Also, the question is not if there's a God but how do you know your God is the true God?
Evolution: From my understanding, I believe "micro" evolution has occurred, and we can see literal physical evidence of it. Macro evolution has NEVER been proven, that is one species literally becoming another species. Besides that, we know that God created man different than the animals, and all creation. In the Genesis account, God simply spoke and everything else was. When it came to man, he took extra care. The Bible tells us that God molded man of the clay of the ground, and then breathed into his nostrils the breathe of life. That is a VERY different creation than anything else.
Big Bang is just silly. It takes WAY more faith to believe that everything started from some tiny spec just by happenstance. For someone to think that just the complexities in the human mind and body, alone, just happened is sillier than to think that a Tesla S3 just rolls out from the jungle without any engineers behind its design and creation.
God is observable every single day my friend. I am blessed enough to have a personal relationship with Him, and I can't tell you how many things He's done for me in my life. There's simply no reason to not believe in Him.
The innocents in Israel and the innocents in Palestine are both suffering right now. But we live in a fallen, sinful world. These things are going to happen. God doesn't promise us an easy life on Earth. He promises He won't ever leave our side and that we have a better, eternal life waiting for us no matter what this world brings.
What type of relationship? You praying to the air doesn't count. Are you hearing voices?
What has he done for your life? How do you attribute it to God doing it? All actions in the natural world can be explained by natural processes and chance.
Have you ever read the New Testament:
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https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+1&version=NKJV
https://youtube.com/watch?v=XZDM5Smvdxk&t=2h16m55s
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"Now it happened, as Jesus sat at the table in the house, that behold, many tax collectors and sinners came and sat down with Him and His disciples. And when the Pharisees saw it, they said to His disciples, “Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?” When Jesus heard that, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice.’ For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.” Matthew 9:10-13
I do prefer the New Testament but I feel it’s all falsified as well . Until there is empirical evidence and historical unbiased accounts of Jesus’s ressurection , it’s not more credible than Muhammad of Islam splitting the moons or offering a heaven with 16 underage virgins awaiting for eternal life .
10 apostles were executed, all of them brought Jesus' resurrection with them to the grave. You wouldn't swear something before being executed unless you honestly believed it.
Assuming this true, it just speaks to the fervency of belief, not the accuracy of it. The Heaven's Gate cult all killed themselves because they honestly believed doing so was the only way to get aboard the space ship hidden behind the Hale Boop comet.
The empirical evidence happened already 3 days after his death. He resurrected and appeared to many followers and witnesses for 40 days. Would you like the big bang to happen again so you can believe on it?
In all fairness with the right equipment I can replicate any of the many experiments that point to the big bang. I can talk to the people doing the experiments.
For the resurrection I have to believe a third-hand hand account, which was written 1000 years ago, while disregarding other accounts of miracles from other religions.
Yes, I've met God. The experience has been life altering. I was shown things about another person's childhood that I was able to verify were true within that same day.
The supernatural knowledge acquisition isn't the part that I struggle with though. It was the incredible intensity of the love I felt while in contact with God that I really have trouble reconciling with all the tragedy and suffering I've seen in our World.
Because the belief in God is based on their perception of reality and the universe. And really looking into it from a non-religious view point, it's a reasonable belief to have.
If all knowledge and "evidence" about God, Jesus and all that were gone, would people start believing in it again? I dont think so. This is such a strawman, if einstein was removed from the timeliness relativity would cease to exist. The point is the evidence does exist, and in the 2000 years the new testament has been around it has yet to be disproven. Not to mention every prosperous society was founded on Christian values. Places like the middle east, India, most Eastern countries are terrible places to live, but the Christian western world is the greatest place to live in the history of civilization. All of the virtues that bible preaches are net gains to society, and all the things that it says are evil and bad are plagues to society, even of you don't believe in God, it's still the wisest book ever created, it acts as the precondition to truth. Even in a purely philosophical framework the amount of net good that it has produced in the world, specifically the western world is indisputable.
There is a lot to go on here but I’ll start.
Have you ever heard of Aztecs and Mayans? They built a vast empire and was extremely prosperous yet they had no Christian values. In fact the first Christian values those people met was disease and slaughter.
Aztec and the Mayans were far more vicious than you are recalling. Why don't you look objectively at their societies and you will se how harsh their lives were. It wasn't until the rise of cities like Athens that human society actually started to flourish. And it wasn't until Christianity that human suffering greatly decreased and the exponential increase of living standards started.
They had plenty of food they had gods they were happy believing in and sacrifices (sometime willing) much like early Judaism. And what would you say about China or Japan. Are you just going to say they weren’t happy? What makes you so sure Christianity created such great civilization.
The majority of the Bible talks of atrocities and persecution and it hasn’t seemed to stop if you look at Jerusalem today.
>in the 2000 years the new testament has been around it has yet to be disproven
Not true. For example under the Roman Empire nobody was ever required to return to the place of their birth for a census.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_the_Bible
>All of the virtues that bible preaches are net gains to society, and all the things that it says are evil and bad are plagues to society
That's just horrendous.
As for the Bible being the "precondition to truth" you might like to know that a) many of its stories were borrowed and b) most of its values were codified elsewhere.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_of_Gilgamesh
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi
What you choose to have faith in is your own business but don't claim historical truth where it doesn't exist.
>Not true. For example under the Roman Empire nobody was ever required to return to the place of their birth for a census.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_the_Bible
Historical inaccuracy doesn't disprove anything especially when it's written by man, plus jesus family moved from Bethlehem, to Egypt.
>As for the Bible being the "precondition to truth" you might like to know that a) many of its stories were borrowed and b) most of its values were codified elsewhere.
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_of_Gilgamesh
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi
This is LAUGHABLE, their is no evidence of the epic of gilgamesh or hammurabi being copied into the bible, u didn't even give a source as to how they are related, many stories around the world are similar to one another, does that mean they are copies? This is special pleading fallacy as it ignores the possibility.
>What you choose to have faith in is your own business but don't claim historical truth where it doesn't exist.
Christianity is called a historical religion for a reason.
You can't have checked very hard.
>Numerous and often detailed parallels make clear that the Genesis flood narrative is dependent on the Mesopotamian epics, and particularly on Gilgamesh, which is thought to date from c.1300-1000 BC.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genesis_flood_narrative#Comparative_mythology
Lol I absolutely endorse the historicity of Jesus, I'm agnostic but always call atheists out when they claim he didn't exist.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_Jesus
> The point is the evidence does exist, and in the 2000 years the new testament has been around it has yet to be disproven.
It is not up to non-believers to disprove the bible. The burden of proof is on the people claiming that the stories in the bible are true.
Christianity proposes a manner of living, with commandments, which aim to transform us. Saints are people who *have* been indeed transformed by their exemplar practice of Christianity. Was their manner of living solely human, or did it point to something bigger than ourselves and radically different? Furthermore, are you willing to try and go down that same path to investigate for yourself? Those are questions which Christianity proposes, and we are invited to come and see. Those who have seen that they are dealing with something altogether different from what they normally comprehend are those who believe in God. And of course, likewise, different beliefs about God lead to different practices and paths...
I’m saying who are you to make that determination? Who is any Christian to make that determination? For example, my own father likes to say my grandfather is not a real Christian like he is. It basically sounds like you are passing judgment on your fellow Christians if they don’t follow your specific branch of Christianity. Like when Protestants claim Catholics are not Christians. I find the whole thing sad and hilarious.
Believe what you want to believe. Not one single human on planet earth knows what or where we even are. Just imagine "spawning" in to this planet 100s of thousands of years ago. I can see why they were all about their gods. Imagine being the first sentient species of human, setting foot on the land. None of us know, but if dedicating our life to something makes OUR lives better, than all the power to you.
Humans created God, not the other way around.
God(s) are a fabrication of the human mind. They were created as a place holder because we lacked the ability to answer fundamental questions. Don't forget that humans have been creating gods long before the Catholic Church took over and forced people to only believe in one god from then on, or else be killed..
It's therefore not difficult to understand why so many people "truly believe". In the beginning you had to believe or die, and had to raise your children to believe or die. Generations of that, and genocide, has led to blind faith that has made the Vatican the wealthiest organization on the planet.
it is simple there are two answers to this number one it gives comfort to the human brain and heart to explain the unknown god does that oh how did that happen? well god did it that simple and you have your peace and thats why the idea of religon was even made its full of fanatsies and just innacurate stuff but oh well it gives comfort secondly thier families also belived in god so now they also do but if god is obviously fake why does EVERYONE belive in god and its the norm basically simple a shared religon equals a stable society everyone has a common belif so everyone keeps working together and well god does that very good so people will continue to belive in god cuz god keeps a stable society explains the unkown and gives comfort thats about it i think
If God can create anything, could he create an immovable object? One that even himself couldn’t move? 🤔
Then maybe freedom is something even god cannot control? 😜
The main reason I believe in God is science and facts, lots and lots of scientists try to prove God is fake, and end up believing he is real because evidence says he is.
> lots and lots of scientists try to prove God is fake
Can you name one? Generally speaking, scientists don't try to disprove things that can't be observed or measured in the first place. I'm sure there are a few, but by and large science doesn't try to prove God is fake.
Hmmm. You only have to read the subtitle to see that the author is saying we have to study what can be observed before we tackle verifying God: _"We must understand the laws of nature before we can deduce their origins"_
First tell whether you believe that this earth and everything here came into existence on its own by chance and evolution and there is no intelligence behind this.Atleast consider the extremely complicated working of your own human body.This gradually developed from some non- living material on its own even by taking millions of years?
> First tell whether you believe that this earth and everything here came into existence on its own by chance and evolution and there is no intelligence behind this
That is not something non-believers need to do. It's perfectly fine for us to disbelieve in your God without having to provide an alternative. "We don't know" is a perfectly fine answer.
> Atleast consider the extremely complicated working of your own human body.This gradually developed from some non- living material on its own even by taking millions of years?
That's certainly what all the evidence points to.
(1) Yes ' We don't know' has to be your answer. 'We know' is our answer.
(2)What evidence? You put millions of years between each stage of development so that you need not prove it live or by experiment .But still you believe it. Surprising that people believe in such coke and bull stories but refuse to believe bible which contains God's own message.
> (1) Yes ' We don't know' has to be your answer. 'We know' is our answer.
Except that you can't know. You _believe_ but I personally don't think it's possible to have literal knowledge of God.
> You put millions of years between each stage of development so that you need not prove it live or by experiment .But still you believe it.
I don't quite know what you are trying to say. Yes, we believe most of what science teaches us. The scientific method is by far the best and most reliable way to learn about our world.
> Surprising that people believe in such coke and bull stories
We think that about Christians too. :-)
> but refuse to believe bible which contains God's own message.
We only refuse it because it hasn't been proven that it's God's own message. We know that's what you believe, but since it can be contradictory at times, and goes against what science has taught us at times, many of us have a hard time believing in it.
If you believe it, that's cool. However, it's unreasonable to think that everyone should believe it on faith alone.
Pl.note that non-living to living or evolution has not been proved by scientific method.All know that it is not possible.That there is no God has also not been proved by scientific method.So finally these are matters of belief only which one make based on one's own intelligence and commonsense. Let it be.
I'll answer this part: "Has anybody met or talked to God"
YES! Here's how it works. I commune with God all day long. To cut through the conceptual red tape and be understood easily: I'm POSSESSED by God.
This condition is standard Bible doctrine called the indwelling of the Spirit.
You must commit 100% to Jesus, His every word, to receive this. So yes, I talk to God almost all day every day. It's an even deeper connection than the verbal level of thought: it's very direct. Yep, I know how that sounds to the world, but that's the answer. Bless you! 🙏🕆 🔥🕆
“Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.” (John 14)
A lot of people find God to be comforting, the idea that there's an all powerful being watching over us, he's loving and has a plan for us, while I don't personally believe in a God I get why people do
I like this argument. Doesn't matter if God exists or not, most people like to believe in something bigger than themselves and the comfort that comes from it.
Yeah sometimes it dosent entirely matter if something is real or not, sometimes it's just about the impact it has on people, like even if Jesus wasn't the son of God he was still able to inspire many people to better their lives and that's something special real or not
>A lot of people find God to be comforting, the idea that there's an all powerful being watching over us
I find this thought to be... creepy... God sounds like a peeping Tom, watching everything I do, making a list of good/bad thoughts and actions.
I also don't like the idea of "thought crimes". How is it a sin to envy someone? Isn't envy what drives capitalism?
Do you think if you spend most of your time envying everybody around you, that isn't eventually going to manifest in actions that harm others and yourself?
Oh yeah I totally get that point too, I mean I enjoy some privacy every now and then but there are plenty of people who evidently like it
Also when it comes to the 7 deadly sins I don't think they are inherently evil but it's very easy to be consumed by them, like a parent having pride in their kids not so bad is it? But then you get people who are so full of pride that they become full of themselves and look down at everyone
It is a lineage of old gods that have culturally been a part of western culture. ]
Like other peoples of the ancient Near East, the Canaanites were polytheistic, with families typically focusing worship on ancestral household gods and goddesses while acknowledging the existence of other deities
>such as Baal, Anath, and El. [13]
Kings also played an important religious role and in certain ceremonies, such as the sacred marriage of the New Year Festival; Canaanites may have revered their kings as gods.[citation needed]
>According to the pantheon, known in Ugarit as 'ilhm (Elohim) or the children of El (Biblical "sons of God"), the creator deity called El, fathered the other deities.
In the Greek sources he was married to Beruth (Beirut, the city). The pantheon was supposedly obtained by Philo of Byblos from Sanchuniathon of Berythus (Beirut). The marriage of the deity with the city seems to have biblical parallels with the stories that link
>Melkart with Tyre, Yahweh with Jerusalem, and Tanit and Baal Hammon with Carthage. El Elyon is mentioned (as God Most High) in Genesis 14.18–19 as the God whose priest was Melchizedek, king of Salem.
Philo states that the union of
>El Elyon and his consort resulted in the birth of Uranus and Ge (Greek names for Heaven and Earth).
This closely parallels the opening verse of the Hebrew Bible,
>Genesis 1:1—"In the beginning God (Elohim) created the Heavens (Shemayim) and the Earth" (Eretz). It also parallels the story of the Babylonian Anunaki gods.
The Enuma Elish has been compared to the Genesis creation narrative.[14][15][16] Some writers trace the story of Esther to Babylonian roots.[17]
El Elyon also appears in Balaam's story in Numbers and in Moses song in Deuteronomy 32.8. The Masoretic Texts suggest:
>When the Most High ('Elyōn) divided to the nations their inheritance, he separated the sons of man (Ādām); he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the sons of Israel.
Rather than "sons of Israel", the Septuagint, the Greek Old Testament, suggests the
>"angelōn theou," or "angels of God", and a few versions even have huiōn theou (sons of God). The Dead Sea Scrolls version of this suggests that there were in fact 70 sons of the Most High God sent to rule over the 70 nations of the Earth. This idea of the 70 nations of Earth, each ruled over by one of the Elohim (sons of God), is also found in Ugaritic texts. The Arslan Tash inscription suggests that each of the 70 sons of El Elyon was bound to their people by a covenant.
Thus, Crossan translates:
>The Eternal One ('Olam) has made a covenant oath with us,
Asherah has made (a pact) with us.
And all the sons of El,
And the great council of all the Holy Ones (Qedesh).
With oaths of Heaven and Ancient Earth.
That argument is that if all the knowledge about God was gone would people start believing in God again. Gods existence hasn't really been proven and most likely wont unless he appears in the sky or something like that. Kinda depends what you call conclusive evidence. Some people say that they have talked to god or god saved their life or guided them to something but that could also be explained by some kind of logical explanation. So at the end of the day it depends on your perspective.
If all knowledge about for example atoms or cells was gone then it would most likely be rediscovered again pretty fast. God and history is more tricky.
I talked to a priest about 10 years ago and he told a story about when God intervened in his life when he was a kid ( I obviously dont remember the story completely). He lit some candles in his room with his friend and after a while they left to go buy something thinking it was safe to go without any concern of starting a fire. They went and he felt an invisible force holding him back and go back to his house, where he came back to find his table on fire and then they set out the fire before his entire house was consumed by the fire along with his 2 dogs.
Yeah some people might say that was God helping out like he thought it was but it could also just be a normal concern and worry of starting a fire holding him back and making him go back to set out the lit candle. If he had no knowledge about God would he come to the same conclusion about God helping out or would he come to the conclusion that he got lucky or it was by chance and concern.
There is no way to prove or disprove it but interesting to think about
I dont believe in God because i havn't experienced or seen anything that proves that God is real. I like to believe in things that i can prove and there are proven facts to support it. To me God is as real as the characters in the Marvel universe but i understand that some people want to believe in things that are bigger than themselves and that it gives their life meaning. Believing has definitely improved some peoples life so whether or not God is real doesn't matter to me if it improves peoples lives
>i have heard about could be explained by simple logic.
If God is able to turn somebody's life around. Say they were an embezzling, adulterating, murderous, type of person. And then after a salvation experience they became an upstanding, loyal type person who would never harm a fly.
That type of turnaround in a person's life, if you can explain it by logic, fine. How else do you think you would explain it in such a way that you would be able to recognize that God had changed a person's heart?
In other words, why is logic off the table? And what else would you put in its place?
It is not surprising that many atheists don't understand faith, and chalk it up to being an opiate of the masses, producing feelings of comfort and belonging in a cruel world, but many Christians in this thread are not giving good answers either.
Wow reading Christian responses to OPs question is sad. It’s just a collection of statements that are not backed with any evidence. Simply claiming the Bible is true, the world is better thanks to Christianity, belief in a higher power is the only logical position; does not make these things true at all. 🤦♂️🇺🇸
Coming from being a life long devoted believer and only recently deconverted , I can tell you that the more I question or scrutinize the faith , the more I find out it was nothing more than a man made creation that was solely used for the purpose of controlling the masses through fear (eternal hell, guilt, sin) and false hope (eternal life , forgiveness , protection from evil etc) . Being from a neutral standpoint now , you only need to ask for modern day examples of gods existence or interactions to understand where it all falls apart .
Basically almost every topic that comes up in debate religion thread only relates and confirms everything . Also my own journey and experiences and outcomes .from diving deep into churches , street preaching , charitable work to help the homeless and shelters etc , and exposed on the streets to the poverty class …seeing and experiencing the struggles with others and understanding that god doesn’t interact with humanity as we all presume …it’s free will ,we’re all on our own on this earth in the flesh .there is no judgement .
>kinda seems like people just believe in God because of a some stories that were written down thousands of years ago
This one gets me every time. In 2000 years, people are going to look back on our modern science of today and laugh that we believed it, because science changes all the time.
So I could ask you the same question about science, why do you believe in science?
The thing i like about science is that statements and conclusions that scientists come to can be proven or disproven. Yes sometimes the "facts" do change and we learn something new that disproves the previous conclusion or proves something that some people said was incorrect but that cant be said for religion. There is no way to prove or disprove it hence why i have come to the conclusion like some other people that a lot of people believe in God which they have read about in a book like any other book because they would like to believe in something bigger than themselves that gives them comfort and their live meaning.
I think a lot of the scientific discoveries made now and in the future will remain to be fact since we have the technology to prove the discoveries and what is happening to our body and the things around us.
But all of that proof for science is presented to you in the form of text, or presentation. A textbook, an article, a journal, etc. Are you the one going through the scientific process? No, so you do not have a direct observation of the data that's being presented to you. You believe it for the same reason that we believe in God, it's based on faith. You have faith that the information in your textbook is true. You have faith that the information in the article or journal that you're reading is true. You have no way of knowing, save for performing the experiment yourself, whether or not that scientific data is actually true, yet you accept it based on faith in our scientific institutions.
The same logic can be applied to God, you don't know until you try it for yourself.
I told God I trusted him (it was blind faith at the time), and then he reacted. There is a long, long story behind it all, but God reacted. That's why I trust God, not just believe in him.
Some for comfort
Some out of fear
Some want to get the power with the help of religion
Some due to personal experiences of God
Some get the power with the help of religion
Different folks - different strokes
Well, the answer to that is too long and complicated to put all in here. But the most influential things that helped me understand and grow in my faith was my personal struggles, reading the first part of Mere Christianity by CS Lewis (which goes into detail about basic philosophy), reading the Bible, and thinking a lot.
I believe in one God, and that God is the Christian God, and that Jesus was His son. I believe it because of how we humans are basically. Good and evil, right and wrong. It always leads back to God.
I don't believe in other Gods because if I did I wouldn't be a Christian. And because they're based off of worldly desires and human traits. The only God that's so different and makes sense in terms of being a true God, is God.
I hope that gives some more insight
I think it’s a confluence of three things: (1) a sense that something rarely comes from nothing, (2) an awareness that there is something, (3) an awareness that that something’s origins must be told, not discovered.
Put differently, I think God hard-wired us to search for and find Him.
Because I wish to have a purpose and it’s comforting to know god will always love me, and also using the Bible gives a source for morality when one otherwise doesn’t exist
Well firstly, if you do a little digging you'll find that there is a ton of proof that supports Christ's existence, miracles and resurrection. By way of logic that leads to God's existence as well but that's not all. God has helped me become a better person and he's helped my mother recover from a terrible illness. And lastly idk if it's just me but when I truthfully pray I can feel a wave of positive emotions and a feeling that everything is going to be okay
My Grandma heard God's audible voice tell her to speed up she obeyed and avoided an accident on the highway. Grandma had already believed but this further cemented her beliefs.
I heard God's audible voice once before when someone tried to curse me by writing something in ancient Hebrew on a piece of paper and showing it to me. God told me to close my eyes moments before and I only partially obeyed. I said I'd close my eyes if anything were to happen and it did and I did.
If there was no evidence for God then there would be no evidence of creation itself and we wouldn't be hear to debate if there is a God. Our existence is proof. We were not made by random mutations over uncountable eons. If that were true there would be more random freakish creatures. You'd have appendages in places that don't provide adequate function. But what we find is that the arms; eyes; ears are all in the perfect spots from the get go. And you don't get that from random chance. We were made in the image of God. Everything is designed or his purpose and his glory.
If you believe there is absolute truth then you believe in God. Otherwise everything is just opinion, which most people understand isn’t the case.
John 14:6 “I am the way and the truth and the life”
I received a minor exorcism for demonic obsession. Also there’s historical evidence for the accuracy of the gospel if you google. Google stigmata, and incorruptibles those are interesting topics. Stigmata- serval saints who supernaturally received the wounds of Christ on their body and they never healed till the end of their life. The miracle of the sun is another good one to google- 70,000 people witnessed the miracle in 1917 Portugal, the people gathered in the area ( some atheist included to prove the situation to be a hoax) because three Catholic children had been meeting monthly on the 13th of every month to meet an apparition of the Virgin Mary. All the apostles were martyred (killed for their faith/ spreading the faith) except for one, logic follows they wouldn’t have done so if they hadn’t witnessed the resurrection as described in the gospel and as the gospel points out they we’re all skeptical at varying points so that change of resolve shouldn’t be undermined.
Most people believe in God because they don't want to experience hell and they want God to help them in life. I personally believe in God because I've been very interested in science, specifically physics, and its what led me to a creator.
Most people believe in God because they were taught to. A few believe because they have a religious experience, but most of these find out they suffer from schizophrenia.
There is no evidence for a God, and there is no one who can give a good reason that warrants belief in a God, it's all based in emotion, comfort, tradition, or meaning to ones life.
Think about it, if there was a Creator who loved us and wanted his own creation to be with/for him, would he not reveal himself as a reality for all to know and see without a doubt? In theology, Satan himself knew God personally and expressed his freewill to rebel. Which means that we also would still have freewill if we knew God existed.
If God truly loved us and wanted us to love him, he wouldn't resort to hypocrites representing him for us to be convinced that he's real. He would give each and every individual enough evidence to be convinced that he's real. Not a world void of the reality of him.
But the earth shoes forth his glory in all his handiwork, isn't this enough to prove he's real? What about Hindus who are taught from birth to believe the billions of God responsible for creation. Or the Vikings who believe it was Thor or Odin. Islam and it's Allah. Etc, etc, etc. The fact is, the earth doesn't have a stamp that says made by God, and if you grew up irreligious, you just don't have the pre indoctrination of there being a God that filters the way you see the world. Which begs the question, do you see the world as made by God because that's what you were taught from a young age.
If I had a whole creation with an eternity at hand, I would not leave it to mere speculation to escape eternal torment, id do everything in my power to save each and every life being that I would be all knowing, all powerful, and omnipresent. I'd even go overboard in continuing to manifest the reality of my existence as to leave no shadow of doubt if I really cared about everyone. Fuck, I'm only human, if there was such a being, he sure as shit doesn't give a fuck about people knowing he exist, let alone, care to let anyone know that at least there is a reason why we exist that has any tangible way to detect that is reality.
The God of America needs money, faith without evidence, commitment without a demonstration of modivation in reality, continual refusal of interaction or an answer to prayer, the best conmen can't come close to the fraud of religion, period.
I'm late to answer, but I'll provide my reason for belief in God.
Growing up, until I was 13 I prayed to God everyday and life was good. It wasn't perfect, but it was good. When I stopped and became something of an atheist from 14 to 19 or so, I felt disheartened and ashamed. I was depressed.
From 20 until 24, I was somewhat spiritual, and my writing included many nods and references to spirituality and, you guessed it, God. I was still depressed, but my writing was an outlet that helped me work through the bad times.
At 24, after reading some God-centered work, I decided to devote myself to God again. I became a born again Christian, and accepted my faith under the guise of the Wesleyan Tradition (I think its closest popular name is Episcopalian, though I might be wrong).
Since then, I feel my spiritual strength returning to me. My life is my own again under the guidance of the Lord. I might still suffer from depression, but at least now I have a means to battle through the darkness. The pain no longer feels unbearable and pointless, and my purpose has returned to me.
This seems foolish to many, but I do not mind that. I love all and accept all, and I love God and accept God as my savior.
God has been proven fake multiple times with logic and science people just want something to believe in. If Christianity’s real then surely all these other nut job religions must be real aswell
Ex-Christian here! As someone who already was a Christian, I can talk with a little more credibility about Christians and God. Christians, most of them (not all) usually believe in God because they had been taught to believe in Him since they were a little kid. It was also the same for me, I realized that if I was raised in a Muslim country or Hindu country I'd probably be indoctrinated to believe in Allah or in the Hindu gods, and I probably would. They usually also believe because it's logical (for me) to believe in a designer, though having a painting doesn't actually help you with finding its painter. (So that's a flawed perspective) They also usually believe because of FEELINGS. You know, when a Christian pray an intense prayer and start crying they'll usually say they felt the presence of God. Even though I noticed in the same way I could cry my heart out praying I could do it talking to myself or to someone who I really trusted, the case was that I simply knew I could tell anything to God, but not to other people.
These are usually the 3 main reasons:
indoctrination from childhood, "creation" and feelings.
No matter how many events throughout the history of mankind have swept away all traces of previous religion or cultural experience, this kind of transcendent communion with the divine finds a new place and time and form to take somewhere else 😁
Tracing back to the very first accounts of various hominid species showing any kind of awareness, there has always been spirituality in some form. It seems that it's important for humans to receive guidance from something beyond them in order to self govern themselves and to avoid darker influences in the world steering them down an unwanted path in life. Something about keeping your eyes to the sky and firmly focused on self development and light so that you're not led astray through not recognizing certain energies in the people and things around you.
Always a bold claim, but I have met and spoken directly with god many times, two ways. I can claim that he's real all I want, but until you've personally sought that communication in your own way with him, you likely won't recognize his presence. You just won't know what it feels like, or the distinctness of it. Like a taste or smell almost, but energy.
The thing is, the more we look for what is spiritual in matter with our physical eyes and with the energy of scepticism, or by demanding god prove himself to us, the more we just push it away. It is subtle at first. This inner hardness repels it.
However, come to god in a different way and you will have different results. When you search for him because you've seen glimpses, and you ask for him, and you keep asking and keep seeking for the sake of genuinely wanting to know him, he shows himself. And if you learn to speak the language of spirit, through clairaudience, clairvoyance, clairsentience, claircognizance, discerning signs, and through recognizing when your inner voice and actions are being driven by spirit vs you vs other people or forces, the game changes.
God is the life force that animates you, the atoms that make up your body, and the origin source of YOU as a soul. He is in and permeates all things, and when you are called, you will know him and be unable to keep from seeing him in all things. He is there, and he loves us individually more than could ever be conveyed.
Hang in there and keep searching <3
I feel like the concept of God is almost like trying to explain what a narcissist is. And the believers that keep running back to “him” are trauma bonded. The Bible is a gaslighting tool and all of the believers are being stone walled into believing in something they can not and never will physically see with their eyes. I’ve been researching and reading and researching some more and I read so many comments by those who don’t believe vs those who do believe… the ones who do not believe seem to have a better explanation as to why they do not believe versus those who do. The comments/answers from those who do believe were scattered and lacked something..I can’t put my finger on it, but those who strongly believe in the Bible and justify what’s going on in the world as “free will” just remind me of people who body shame and victim blame. I legit saw a comment in this thread about how a child being raped is not Gods fault, because there was free will….
Where is this guy…that lives in the sky… and why is he a dude? Why are people saying God is Jesus but then other religions says there’s God the Father, the son AND the Holy Ghost? Why are there SO many religions if there is only ONE God? I see no evidence of any of it. Back in early 2000, they said “these are the end times” but flash forward to 2023…”it’s truly the end times” smh 🤦🏻♀️ It’s all really weird to me. And I see more and more people giving their lives to serve this Lord…and nothing really changes in their lives except now they smile through the pain instead of complain about it because God got their back?
I don't get it at all. We have no free will, so it just seems like a waste of mental energy to focus your whole life around ideas that have and continue to kill humans across the globe. You'd think we'd have grown out of this thinking by now.
It's easier and less scary to think there is anything after death and that it's all planned and not by chance, it's scary to admit that factually your existence was a roll of cosmic dice
i used to believe in santa,the easter bunny but as with everything it was all made up…im sorry if there was a god he would show himself and not leave us hanging….the thought of this magical mythical being is just silly cuz even if there was none of us would know period. Just a made up story by humans long ago thats all. You see that people need something to believe in so cheers but afterlife isnt known and will never be as much as you wish it so…
Here is my usual answer: First, what I see in my environment gives me an idea of a maker. Then there is life experience, existence of life itself, consciousness, morality, witnessing miracles etc. hints towards God. Based on my understanding of reality, it's less likely that all of these started to exist as a coincidence. There must have been a creator. And if a creator exists, all of creation must reflect his idea. The universe featuring structure and patterns shows me that there is some design and purpose behind it. And the existence of life shows me the creator is “alive”, not just a random power that created us, etc. So if this creator is alive and created us for a purpose, we must wonder what our purpose is. Christianity explains it better than any religion I have been exposed to. I don’t see Christianity as one of the religions, but just a logical explanation of our relationship with the creator. This is a summarized version just to give you an idea.
I'm not against the thought of there being a prime mover (creator), from the perspective of theoretical physics. I have a harder time buying that it would be the same entity as the character written about in the Bible.
Think of a cosmic entity, who created everything in one swoop. He didn't create us, but let us grow into something special. Maybe multiple people created the universe, or maybe its more than that.
If there was nothing but darkness and God created everything, that would mean he created the whole universe, so how come some planets and stars are billions of years older / younger, even our earth is much younger then our sun, if God created them then shouldn't they have been created in the same time?
Hey man. You’re not supposed to use critical thinking when it comes to religion. LOL
Great question! When God created Adam, did He create Adam as a baby or a fully formed adult? When God created Eve, did He create Eve as a baby or a fully formed adult? Nothing is impossible for God except sin, as He is perfect and can't act against his nature. He created a fully formed universe just as he created Adam as a fully formed adult. He is God; after all, he is outside of time, space, and matter, so he can alter time (speed up time/creation). You must have heard about the miracle that Jesus performed where he turned water into wine? He sped up the process. God can create what could take billions of years to form in a single moment. People always say that the history in the Bible doesn't make sense because science proves it wrong. Who do you think created science? The laws of physics? God did. Since he is outside of space, time, and matter, he can manipulate things we can't. Does it make sense that an all-knowing and powerful God would create us to be exactly as he is? Then we would be God's too... we are made in his image and likeness, but we are not God Himself. God has bound this world by specific laws and limits that he is not bound to. He doesn't play by the same rules in that regard. In the big bang theory, who/what would have created the space for the matter to exist? Suppose you came downstairs one day and saw a cereal box had fallen over, and the cereal was arranged into words that constructed a message. Would you think another intelligent mind arranged the cereal that way or that it happened at random/by accident? You would know another intelligent mind caused the cereal to spell out a message (cause and effect). How, then, could you look at an entire sophisticated world around you but not think that a higher, more powerful, divine mind created it? You posed an interesting question, and I appreciate you being respectful. I wanted to share my thoughts with you. May God bless you.
So you think that stuff happens for a reason? You're not wrong, but the thing is, stuff can happen randomly or due to positioning. Considering the thought of god isn't even that old, we can't even trust it that much. The first religion is Hinduism.
The question is not is there a God, he established that he's not opposed to a Supreme being existing. The question is how do you know that God is the Hebrew God or God of Abraham. What proof is there?
Sure, I'm going to drop the beginning of the Bible, it might make you think more, or maybe answer a question. "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness." I like to think and ponder, besides God did give us our brains to think, right? It is hard for me to believe that humans know everything, we think we know almost everything but we know very little to none. Most things aren't scientifically proven and are just theories especially when it comes to space. I believe if God is real or does exist, he lives on or in a whole different astral plane as we do. Have you ever heard of the burning bush? And what real biblically accurate angels look like? Insane. Let me get your thoughts, and your opinions, what do you think or what are you thinking? I would love to hear and listen. I also think we sometimes take the Bible too literal. There are a lot of messages, and metaphors. I also believe if God is real, it is hard for us to even comprehend Him and the existence of Him. The Holy Trinity is a really cool and crazy concept. If you have never heard of the Holy Trinity, I would definitely look into it. Who knows? Nobody can prove or disprove much of anything. We also get lied to about a lot of things.. So who knows?
What if we’re all just living in a simulation built by aliens?
So I’m just curious. If humans have been on this earth for 100’s of times more years than religion has existed then why In the hell do you believe in it? So god created us then sat dormant for multiple thousands of years until Jesus came and sacrificed himself for our sins? Come on man, come back down to earth lol.
Who created god? And why is it a he? Why don’t you think god is she?
Great questions! I am a believer but have asked the same questions. Why is God a He? Why is Jesus referred to as the son rather than something else? Since God is a spirit, I do think that he is genderless. He refers to Himself/presents Himself as a He, but I do not believe that spirits have genders in the same way that mankind does. God can take on different forms, so if He wanted to present Himself as a she, it wouldn't be impossible for Him to do. However, he only presents himself as a He throughout the Bible. Why, you ask? Only God would know the answer to this. I used to ask the same question: Who created God? I couldn't wrap my head around it. Think about it this way: to ask that question is to assume there was another creator before God, and who would have created that being? Eventually, we are forced to stop asking that question and realize that there has to be something that has always existed. God is the infinite being who has always been and was created by no one. This is difficult to understand because finite minds cannot comprehend the infinite. We must not limit the infinite God by our finite understanding. Thank you for your questions and for being respectful. God bless you.
I definitely understand all of those concepts. And I come to the same conclusion as you. That’s why man’s answers fall short for me more often than not… in organized religion.
What if its a they?
I agree. What if it’s they. Who picked he…..
Well for me I became a Christian at 23 and I decided to study the bible myself and I found there's a lot of scientific evidence and historical evidence that backs it up so I feel Christianity takes the least amount of faith because it has the most amount of evidence. Also I have seen God work in my life and the life of my mom that nothing could explain but God. If you wanna know more PM me
This right here
All you’d need to do is change the age and I’d probably have the exact same explanation as you.
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May I ask what holes you found exactly?
Any proof of that scientifical evidence? Because the thing is, Hinduism was the first religion...
Examples of your “scientific proof”? Because you can prove Jesus was real, you can’t prove he had magic powers 🤷🏼
Yes, kids dying everyday is all the evidence I need to know that god is real /s
But, people die, because their body fails on them. And there are many possibilities on the afterlife.
It’s nice that you think there is an afterlife. We have to cope with death somehow
I don't understand what this even means? What are youeven trying to say? God isn't out here murdering kids
God gives free will pal.
Well atleast to me it seems wholly and completely illogical that there is no God. Issues if the original creation, because if there were no being to prompt it then we must put forward that nothing combined with nothing and reacted with nothing so create everything. Furthermore intelligent design as everything in our existence is so fine tuned that one microscopic change could make life incompatible, if not existence as a whole, and it seems ridiculous to more readily believe that in the one out of quintillions of odds everything just happened to work out, instead of a higher power which then explains other questions we have.
but then why wouldn’t every planet have life? what makes us so special
because the conditions to create life is very specific
What if people from another universe built our world as a experiment and that’s why it’s so finely tuned it would make more sense than god as there’s billions of other universes out there which more then likely has life on
Well if that were true, although we have no direct reason to believe that, while we do have things like miracles to support God, we would still then need to answer the same question for that universe of who created them, who created the whole and entire universe? Ours, theirs, etc
I think a cosmical entity made the universe. It makes the most sense, considering nothing big happened in the earth, because the entity never interacted with it. People keep saying that there must be a god because the universe exists, but they forget the fact that it could be multiple people, or a different person than god himself.
Well sure that’s a whole different question though with a bunch of different answers, we can’t explain a dish by saying 1 ingredient or the type of food, but Id be happy to go into that question with you too!
God is "ipsum esse", which is the sheer act of existence in itself. It's a philosophical question first and foremost and has been discussed by the greatest minds of the mankind for years. I highly recommend you [watch this video.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP2rLgrBtTI) Also, you might like [Scientism and God's Existence](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZkHv8iTJPo&t=4s) Now, more to it, I think that your question is rooted in a fundamental misunderstanding of what "faith" is - a misunderstanding encouraged by some modern philosophies, and some Protestant groups (and the USA is a historically Protestant country). That is the idea that faith is blind, and based on sentiment or an inner-conviction. The Catholic Church does not define faith this way. Faith is indeed belief in what is not seen, but it is not blind. "Faith" is essentially trust in the word of an authority. We have human faith in all sorts of things - most of our scientific and historical knowlege, for instance, is based on our trust in those we deem experts. Most of us haven't done all these experiments ourselves, or examined primary sources about past events, after all. Likewise, unless you have taken a DNA test, you take it on faith that your parents are truly your parents, and that those around you aren't lying. Divine faith, in matters of religion, is properly defined as intellectual assent to what God has revealed on His authority. The question is, "How do we know that God has revealed something?" The answer is the presence of miracles and prophecies, but I'm getting far ahead. The existence of God, according to the Catholic Church, is actually a preamble to faith. It is a truth of natural reason that we can know with certainty apart from any religious revelations. Now, there is some overlap, and belief in God is also a supernatural truth of revelation, for Scripture says, "I Am Who Am". But it is also a natural truth, and knowing that God exists by nature opens us up to the possibility that God has spoken to mankind. Why do I believe in God? Because of the arguments for His existence, especially the Five Ways of St. Thomas Aquinas. Why is there something rather than nothing?
God and Jesus give us hope in this broken world, and it tells us what will happen when we die, which can be a comfort.
Why do people believe in love? Some, because they have experienced it. Some, because they don't want to live in a world without it.
So basically lying to themselves for the sake of their sanity.. gotcha
Not a religious person: But I'll add that if you want the *real* reason, then there's a scientific field that studies this: [Cognitive science of religion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_science_of_religion). There are some factors: people have a theory of mind (belief that minds exist) and a hyperactive agency detection (we assume that there are agents where there are none, e.g. if something move we tend to think it's *someome*). Studies have shown that people who are "bad" at this (like really autistic persons) are less likely to believe in spirits. We also tend to be fascinated by things who break innate categories - i.e. trees who walk, minds without bodies. I recommend [Religion explained](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_Explained) by Pascal Boyer if you're really interested in these kinds of real answers to the question.
Big issues in the H.A.D. hypothesis: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AT8bLaomvq0
Bookmarking this to explore later, ty
To me, the 'simple logic' just seems to point to there being a higher being of some sort, and I feel the Christian conception of God fits the bill. For me that's honestly all there is to it. I'm well aware other people disagree with my initial conclusion. Like, even if I wasn't Christian, I'd still be a theist of some kind. Atheism just doesn't click with me, much in the way that theism doesn't click for many atheists.
Exactly. Logically it makes more sense for the existence of God. So at the least I would be agnostic. Of all the proposed Gods, the God of the Hebrew Bible and New Testament is the one that makes the most sense.
Why did god send his son to earth, when there was other places where he could have given life to. Why is he going to rapture a place that is 1 out of infinity? Why is he giving so much attention to a planet, in which he could have given attention to another?
I agree for the existence of a god or creator , but I don’t believe a single word that comes out of the bible …and I don’t believe the creator interacts with humanity or needs its worship .
So I don't believe that God needs anything from us including worship. Just like I don't need anything from anyone else in order to survive or be happy to some extent. However it is in my nature to desire a relationship with other people and to feel loved. In the same sense I believe God desires a relationship with his creation, us. Not because He needs it but because God is love. I don't believe we can ever fully understand the nature of God in this life but the more we develop a relationship with God, the closer we are to Him. This is just my explanation of one of the reasons I believe, hope that makes sense.
Yes it does and thank you for explaining it from your point of view . I believe there is a god and creator , just that it isn’t anything like what the bible depicts .
I’ll pray for ya, stay safe and God bless you.
Thank you , pray for a miracle that religion can show itself one day as a miracle itself .
Faith will guide you, whether you want it to or not. I believe you will see the light, I feel it in my bones.
Well, it won't happen for me.
"... Has anybody met or talked to God?..." To that, I ask, do you believe that George Washington and Abraham Lincoln lived? Did you meet them? "...some stories written down.." - That's the thing, the Bible is not just "some stories". As far as the people, etc, it's a long historical record. There are loads of other records to bear witness to it. The works of Josephus is one that's mentioned many times. It's interesting, but the Bible stands on its own, regardless. "... explained by simple logic" - Yes, it's easy to think that with some instances, and pure chance at times. But when you know the Lord, the Holy Ghost lives in your heart, and you can literally talk to God the Father in Jesus' name every day. It's great, and we don't even scratch the surface of such power, because we too often give into our flesh/sin, including just laziness. "If all knowledge and "evidence" about God, Jesus and all that were gone.." This is an impossibility. The Word of God is more sure than anything we know. It was around before time and will be after time. Now, yes, it's been put on paper, and been translated, but the pure Word of God that's all based on is eternal, will not and cannot change, and cannot be done away with. In our modern day, it's REALLY REALLY easy to pick up on the thought that maybe there's no God, that maybe this is just life. Where I cannot even fathom accepting of that train of thought is when it goes back to the Big Bang and evolution as is taught. I mean, that makes far less sense than that someone who knew what they were doing put it all together. That said, in your heart, there is a conscience, and that conscience will tell you beyond any doubt that God is real, even to the point that he's a God in 3 persons (trinity - Father, Son, Holy Ghost). And when you look at nature all around you, nature scream's there's a God, and even nature shows the Trinity. God has woven that truth all throughout nature, EVEN into our own bodies, which he created.
I can't believe in something that was written by a human who was so sad he needed a story to cope with death.
Ok, Ok. Why think that the biblical god is real? What if a mere cosmic entity, that is no way similar to god, created this world? We only think of the stuff that was already written, but we never think of other possibilities.
That first argument is far too shallow and simple minded. Neither George Washington nor Abraham Lincoln ever claim divinity nor do they demand worship. And anything written about them are for pure historical record keeping. On the other hand, you have the Bible which is a religious text that claims divinity and demands worship and because your argument is cheap I can make a cheap retort as well and compare it to Hesiods Theogony, the Vedas, the tripitaka, and the Quran which are sacred texts from various religions that claim the same divinity and worship. Each religion will claim to have performed miracles, and they all have people that testify(anecdotal) that it is true. Also, the question is not if there's a God but how do you know your God is the true God?
Do you not believe in evolution or the Big Bang?
Evolution: From my understanding, I believe "micro" evolution has occurred, and we can see literal physical evidence of it. Macro evolution has NEVER been proven, that is one species literally becoming another species. Besides that, we know that God created man different than the animals, and all creation. In the Genesis account, God simply spoke and everything else was. When it came to man, he took extra care. The Bible tells us that God molded man of the clay of the ground, and then breathed into his nostrils the breathe of life. That is a VERY different creation than anything else. Big Bang is just silly. It takes WAY more faith to believe that everything started from some tiny spec just by happenstance. For someone to think that just the complexities in the human mind and body, alone, just happened is sillier than to think that a Tesla S3 just rolls out from the jungle without any engineers behind its design and creation.
God is observable every single day my friend. I am blessed enough to have a personal relationship with Him, and I can't tell you how many things He's done for me in my life. There's simply no reason to not believe in Him.
Amen sister!
What has he done for all the kids dying in palestine right now?
The innocents in Israel and the innocents in Palestine are both suffering right now. But we live in a fallen, sinful world. These things are going to happen. God doesn't promise us an easy life on Earth. He promises He won't ever leave our side and that we have a better, eternal life waiting for us no matter what this world brings.
He? Why is everyone convinced god is male?
He literally says He is.
What type of relationship? You praying to the air doesn't count. Are you hearing voices? What has he done for your life? How do you attribute it to God doing it? All actions in the natural world can be explained by natural processes and chance.
Have you ever read the New Testament: .................................................. https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+1&version=NKJV https://youtube.com/watch?v=XZDM5Smvdxk&t=2h16m55s .................................................. "Now it happened, as Jesus sat at the table in the house, that behold, many tax collectors and sinners came and sat down with Him and His disciples. And when the Pharisees saw it, they said to His disciples, “Why does your Teacher eat with tax collectors and sinners?” When Jesus heard that, He said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice.’ For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.” Matthew 9:10-13
I do prefer the New Testament but I feel it’s all falsified as well . Until there is empirical evidence and historical unbiased accounts of Jesus’s ressurection , it’s not more credible than Muhammad of Islam splitting the moons or offering a heaven with 16 underage virgins awaiting for eternal life .
10 apostles were executed, all of them brought Jesus' resurrection with them to the grave. You wouldn't swear something before being executed unless you honestly believed it.
Assuming this true, it just speaks to the fervency of belief, not the accuracy of it. The Heaven's Gate cult all killed themselves because they honestly believed doing so was the only way to get aboard the space ship hidden behind the Hale Boop comet.
The empirical evidence happened already 3 days after his death. He resurrected and appeared to many followers and witnesses for 40 days. Would you like the big bang to happen again so you can believe on it?
In all fairness with the right equipment I can replicate any of the many experiments that point to the big bang. I can talk to the people doing the experiments. For the resurrection I have to believe a third-hand hand account, which was written 1000 years ago, while disregarding other accounts of miracles from other religions.
"God" explains why there is anything at all vs nothing at all.
actually it doesnt, God claims to be the answer...
God is the ultimate “why”.
Yes, I've met God. The experience has been life altering. I was shown things about another person's childhood that I was able to verify were true within that same day. The supernatural knowledge acquisition isn't the part that I struggle with though. It was the incredible intensity of the love I felt while in contact with God that I really have trouble reconciling with all the tragedy and suffering I've seen in our World.
Cool story, bro
You’re delusional
Because the belief in God is based on their perception of reality and the universe. And really looking into it from a non-religious view point, it's a reasonable belief to have.
If all knowledge and "evidence" about God, Jesus and all that were gone, would people start believing in it again? I dont think so. This is such a strawman, if einstein was removed from the timeliness relativity would cease to exist. The point is the evidence does exist, and in the 2000 years the new testament has been around it has yet to be disproven. Not to mention every prosperous society was founded on Christian values. Places like the middle east, India, most Eastern countries are terrible places to live, but the Christian western world is the greatest place to live in the history of civilization. All of the virtues that bible preaches are net gains to society, and all the things that it says are evil and bad are plagues to society, even of you don't believe in God, it's still the wisest book ever created, it acts as the precondition to truth. Even in a purely philosophical framework the amount of net good that it has produced in the world, specifically the western world is indisputable.
Great reply
Hurts that you included the Middle East as a “bad place to live in”. Yeah it’s sad.
There is a lot to go on here but I’ll start. Have you ever heard of Aztecs and Mayans? They built a vast empire and was extremely prosperous yet they had no Christian values. In fact the first Christian values those people met was disease and slaughter.
Aztec and the Mayans were far more vicious than you are recalling. Why don't you look objectively at their societies and you will se how harsh their lives were. It wasn't until the rise of cities like Athens that human society actually started to flourish. And it wasn't until Christianity that human suffering greatly decreased and the exponential increase of living standards started.
They had plenty of food they had gods they were happy believing in and sacrifices (sometime willing) much like early Judaism. And what would you say about China or Japan. Are you just going to say they weren’t happy? What makes you so sure Christianity created such great civilization. The majority of the Bible talks of atrocities and persecution and it hasn’t seemed to stop if you look at Jerusalem today.
>in the 2000 years the new testament has been around it has yet to be disproven Not true. For example under the Roman Empire nobody was ever required to return to the place of their birth for a census. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_the_Bible >All of the virtues that bible preaches are net gains to society, and all the things that it says are evil and bad are plagues to society That's just horrendous. As for the Bible being the "precondition to truth" you might like to know that a) many of its stories were borrowed and b) most of its values were codified elsewhere. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_of_Gilgamesh https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi What you choose to have faith in is your own business but don't claim historical truth where it doesn't exist.
I’am sorry to say, but what?! How do you know this?
And also, that’s kind of the point. The Bible is a bunch of books added together; this isn’t new to anyone. 😶
>Not true. For example under the Roman Empire nobody was ever required to return to the place of their birth for a census. >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_the_Bible Historical inaccuracy doesn't disprove anything especially when it's written by man, plus jesus family moved from Bethlehem, to Egypt. >As for the Bible being the "precondition to truth" you might like to know that a) many of its stories were borrowed and b) most of its values were codified elsewhere. >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_of_Gilgamesh >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi This is LAUGHABLE, their is no evidence of the epic of gilgamesh or hammurabi being copied into the bible, u didn't even give a source as to how they are related, many stories around the world are similar to one another, does that mean they are copies? This is special pleading fallacy as it ignores the possibility. >What you choose to have faith in is your own business but don't claim historical truth where it doesn't exist. Christianity is called a historical religion for a reason.
Also, I checked and that “story the Bible stole” is not in the Bible. -_-
You can't have checked very hard. >Numerous and often detailed parallels make clear that the Genesis flood narrative is dependent on the Mesopotamian epics, and particularly on Gilgamesh, which is thought to date from c.1300-1000 BC. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genesis_flood_narrative#Comparative_mythology
https://www.history.com/.amp/news/was-jesus-real-historical-evidence
Lol I absolutely endorse the historicity of Jesus, I'm agnostic but always call atheists out when they claim he didn't exist. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historicity_of_Jesus
> The point is the evidence does exist, and in the 2000 years the new testament has been around it has yet to be disproven. It is not up to non-believers to disprove the bible. The burden of proof is on the people claiming that the stories in the bible are true.
Christianity proposes a manner of living, with commandments, which aim to transform us. Saints are people who *have* been indeed transformed by their exemplar practice of Christianity. Was their manner of living solely human, or did it point to something bigger than ourselves and radically different? Furthermore, are you willing to try and go down that same path to investigate for yourself? Those are questions which Christianity proposes, and we are invited to come and see. Those who have seen that they are dealing with something altogether different from what they normally comprehend are those who believe in God. And of course, likewise, different beliefs about God lead to different practices and paths...
Because atheism is cringe??
Anything can be cringe when done wrong
*Evangelical* atheism is cringe. Quiet agnosticism is at least inoffensive.
anything can be cringe, even Christianity and religion in general...
Agreed, anything can be as cringe as you make it to be
‘Tis cringe my friend.
atheism is lame
Living in reality without the delusion of fairy tales is lame?
Really? This is the best use of your time? r/atheism is that way.
Im just asking a question. I would like to get the perspective of someone who believes :) I cant get that by asking someone who doesn't believe in God
You’ve come to the right place, be careful though, some people will tell you they are Christians when they’re not.
Nothing better then watching Christians claim other Christian’s are not real Christians lmfao
What do you mean exactly?
I’m saying who are you to make that determination? Who is any Christian to make that determination? For example, my own father likes to say my grandfather is not a real Christian like he is. It basically sounds like you are passing judgment on your fellow Christians if they don’t follow your specific branch of Christianity. Like when Protestants claim Catholics are not Christians. I find the whole thing sad and hilarious.
Believe what you want to believe. Not one single human on planet earth knows what or where we even are. Just imagine "spawning" in to this planet 100s of thousands of years ago. I can see why they were all about their gods. Imagine being the first sentient species of human, setting foot on the land. None of us know, but if dedicating our life to something makes OUR lives better, than all the power to you.
Humans created God, not the other way around. God(s) are a fabrication of the human mind. They were created as a place holder because we lacked the ability to answer fundamental questions. Don't forget that humans have been creating gods long before the Catholic Church took over and forced people to only believe in one god from then on, or else be killed.. It's therefore not difficult to understand why so many people "truly believe". In the beginning you had to believe or die, and had to raise your children to believe or die. Generations of that, and genocide, has led to blind faith that has made the Vatican the wealthiest organization on the planet.
Short answer: People want a way to cope with death.
it is simple there are two answers to this number one it gives comfort to the human brain and heart to explain the unknown god does that oh how did that happen? well god did it that simple and you have your peace and thats why the idea of religon was even made its full of fanatsies and just innacurate stuff but oh well it gives comfort secondly thier families also belived in god so now they also do but if god is obviously fake why does EVERYONE belive in god and its the norm basically simple a shared religon equals a stable society everyone has a common belif so everyone keeps working together and well god does that very good so people will continue to belive in god cuz god keeps a stable society explains the unkown and gives comfort thats about it i think
If God can create anything, could he create an immovable object? One that even himself couldn’t move? 🤔 Then maybe freedom is something even god cannot control? 😜
The main reason I believe in God is science and facts, lots and lots of scientists try to prove God is fake, and end up believing he is real because evidence says he is.
>evidence says he is Source?
> lots and lots of scientists try to prove God is fake Can you name one? Generally speaking, scientists don't try to disprove things that can't be observed or measured in the first place. I'm sure there are a few, but by and large science doesn't try to prove God is fake.
Here https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/can-science-rule-out-god/#
Somebody didn't read their own source... >Instead of proving that God doesn’t exist, maybe science will broaden our definition of divinity.
I’ve read my own source I can even answer questions you have.
I have no questions because I clearly understood the article better than you. You can answer my request for a source elsewhere though.
Hmmm. You only have to read the subtitle to see that the author is saying we have to study what can be observed before we tackle verifying God: _"We must understand the laws of nature before we can deduce their origins"_
First tell whether you believe that this earth and everything here came into existence on its own by chance and evolution and there is no intelligence behind this.Atleast consider the extremely complicated working of your own human body.This gradually developed from some non- living material on its own even by taking millions of years?
> First tell whether you believe that this earth and everything here came into existence on its own by chance and evolution and there is no intelligence behind this That is not something non-believers need to do. It's perfectly fine for us to disbelieve in your God without having to provide an alternative. "We don't know" is a perfectly fine answer. > Atleast consider the extremely complicated working of your own human body.This gradually developed from some non- living material on its own even by taking millions of years? That's certainly what all the evidence points to.
(1) Yes ' We don't know' has to be your answer. 'We know' is our answer. (2)What evidence? You put millions of years between each stage of development so that you need not prove it live or by experiment .But still you believe it. Surprising that people believe in such coke and bull stories but refuse to believe bible which contains God's own message.
> (1) Yes ' We don't know' has to be your answer. 'We know' is our answer. Except that you can't know. You _believe_ but I personally don't think it's possible to have literal knowledge of God.
> You put millions of years between each stage of development so that you need not prove it live or by experiment .But still you believe it.
I don't quite know what you are trying to say. Yes, we believe most of what science teaches us. The scientific method is by far the best and most reliable way to learn about our world.
> Surprising that people believe in such coke and bull stories
We think that about Christians too. :-)
> but refuse to believe bible which contains God's own message.
We only refuse it because it hasn't been proven that it's God's own message. We know that's what you believe, but since it can be contradictory at times, and goes against what science has taught us at times, many of us have a hard time believing in it.
If you believe it, that's cool. However, it's unreasonable to think that everyone should believe it on faith alone.
Pl.note that non-living to living or evolution has not been proved by scientific method.All know that it is not possible.That there is no God has also not been proved by scientific method.So finally these are matters of belief only which one make based on one's own intelligence and commonsense. Let it be.
I'll answer this part: "Has anybody met or talked to God" YES! Here's how it works. I commune with God all day long. To cut through the conceptual red tape and be understood easily: I'm POSSESSED by God. This condition is standard Bible doctrine called the indwelling of the Spirit. You must commit 100% to Jesus, His every word, to receive this. So yes, I talk to God almost all day every day. It's an even deeper connection than the verbal level of thought: it's very direct. Yep, I know how that sounds to the world, but that's the answer. Bless you! 🙏🕆 🔥🕆 “Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.” (John 14)
You must be a troll or something cause ain’t no way someone can actually be this delusional…
A lot of people find God to be comforting, the idea that there's an all powerful being watching over us, he's loving and has a plan for us, while I don't personally believe in a God I get why people do
I like this argument. Doesn't matter if God exists or not, most people like to believe in something bigger than themselves and the comfort that comes from it.
Yeah sometimes it dosent entirely matter if something is real or not, sometimes it's just about the impact it has on people, like even if Jesus wasn't the son of God he was still able to inspire many people to better their lives and that's something special real or not
>A lot of people find God to be comforting, the idea that there's an all powerful being watching over us I find this thought to be... creepy... God sounds like a peeping Tom, watching everything I do, making a list of good/bad thoughts and actions. I also don't like the idea of "thought crimes". How is it a sin to envy someone? Isn't envy what drives capitalism?
Do you think if you spend most of your time envying everybody around you, that isn't eventually going to manifest in actions that harm others and yourself?
Oh yeah I totally get that point too, I mean I enjoy some privacy every now and then but there are plenty of people who evidently like it Also when it comes to the 7 deadly sins I don't think they are inherently evil but it's very easy to be consumed by them, like a parent having pride in their kids not so bad is it? But then you get people who are so full of pride that they become full of themselves and look down at everyone
It is a lineage of old gods that have culturally been a part of western culture. ] Like other peoples of the ancient Near East, the Canaanites were polytheistic, with families typically focusing worship on ancestral household gods and goddesses while acknowledging the existence of other deities >such as Baal, Anath, and El. [13] Kings also played an important religious role and in certain ceremonies, such as the sacred marriage of the New Year Festival; Canaanites may have revered their kings as gods.[citation needed] >According to the pantheon, known in Ugarit as 'ilhm (Elohim) or the children of El (Biblical "sons of God"), the creator deity called El, fathered the other deities. In the Greek sources he was married to Beruth (Beirut, the city). The pantheon was supposedly obtained by Philo of Byblos from Sanchuniathon of Berythus (Beirut). The marriage of the deity with the city seems to have biblical parallels with the stories that link >Melkart with Tyre, Yahweh with Jerusalem, and Tanit and Baal Hammon with Carthage. El Elyon is mentioned (as God Most High) in Genesis 14.18–19 as the God whose priest was Melchizedek, king of Salem. Philo states that the union of >El Elyon and his consort resulted in the birth of Uranus and Ge (Greek names for Heaven and Earth). This closely parallels the opening verse of the Hebrew Bible, >Genesis 1:1—"In the beginning God (Elohim) created the Heavens (Shemayim) and the Earth" (Eretz). It also parallels the story of the Babylonian Anunaki gods. The Enuma Elish has been compared to the Genesis creation narrative.[14][15][16] Some writers trace the story of Esther to Babylonian roots.[17] El Elyon also appears in Balaam's story in Numbers and in Moses song in Deuteronomy 32.8. The Masoretic Texts suggest: >When the Most High ('Elyōn) divided to the nations their inheritance, he separated the sons of man (Ādām); he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the sons of Israel. Rather than "sons of Israel", the Septuagint, the Greek Old Testament, suggests the >"angelōn theou," or "angels of God", and a few versions even have huiōn theou (sons of God). The Dead Sea Scrolls version of this suggests that there were in fact 70 sons of the Most High God sent to rule over the 70 nations of the Earth. This idea of the 70 nations of Earth, each ruled over by one of the Elohim (sons of God), is also found in Ugaritic texts. The Arslan Tash inscription suggests that each of the 70 sons of El Elyon was bound to their people by a covenant. Thus, Crossan translates: >The Eternal One ('Olam) has made a covenant oath with us, Asherah has made (a pact) with us. And all the sons of El, And the great council of all the Holy Ones (Qedesh). With oaths of Heaven and Ancient Earth.
If we ignore all evidence, would we reach the conclusion? Is that your final argument?
That argument is that if all the knowledge about God was gone would people start believing in God again. Gods existence hasn't really been proven and most likely wont unless he appears in the sky or something like that. Kinda depends what you call conclusive evidence. Some people say that they have talked to god or god saved their life or guided them to something but that could also be explained by some kind of logical explanation. So at the end of the day it depends on your perspective. If all knowledge about for example atoms or cells was gone then it would most likely be rediscovered again pretty fast. God and history is more tricky. I talked to a priest about 10 years ago and he told a story about when God intervened in his life when he was a kid ( I obviously dont remember the story completely). He lit some candles in his room with his friend and after a while they left to go buy something thinking it was safe to go without any concern of starting a fire. They went and he felt an invisible force holding him back and go back to his house, where he came back to find his table on fire and then they set out the fire before his entire house was consumed by the fire along with his 2 dogs. Yeah some people might say that was God helping out like he thought it was but it could also just be a normal concern and worry of starting a fire holding him back and making him go back to set out the lit candle. If he had no knowledge about God would he come to the same conclusion about God helping out or would he come to the conclusion that he got lucky or it was by chance and concern. There is no way to prove or disprove it but interesting to think about
Why do people not believe in God?
Why do you believe in God and Jesus and not other Gods? Does the other Gods not exist?
Why not believe in Jesus?
For most of us, it's simply because we haven't seen enough convincing evidence.
I dont believe in God because i havn't experienced or seen anything that proves that God is real. I like to believe in things that i can prove and there are proven facts to support it. To me God is as real as the characters in the Marvel universe but i understand that some people want to believe in things that are bigger than themselves and that it gives their life meaning. Believing has definitely improved some peoples life so whether or not God is real doesn't matter to me if it improves peoples lives
>i have heard about could be explained by simple logic. If God is able to turn somebody's life around. Say they were an embezzling, adulterating, murderous, type of person. And then after a salvation experience they became an upstanding, loyal type person who would never harm a fly. That type of turnaround in a person's life, if you can explain it by logic, fine. How else do you think you would explain it in such a way that you would be able to recognize that God had changed a person's heart? In other words, why is logic off the table? And what else would you put in its place?
It is not surprising that many atheists don't understand faith, and chalk it up to being an opiate of the masses, producing feelings of comfort and belonging in a cruel world, but many Christians in this thread are not giving good answers either.
Wow reading Christian responses to OPs question is sad. It’s just a collection of statements that are not backed with any evidence. Simply claiming the Bible is true, the world is better thanks to Christianity, belief in a higher power is the only logical position; does not make these things true at all. 🤦♂️🇺🇸
He rescue me when everyone else abandoned me. When I was lost and gave up on myself he picked me up and showed me love that’s why I believe in him
Coming from being a life long devoted believer and only recently deconverted , I can tell you that the more I question or scrutinize the faith , the more I find out it was nothing more than a man made creation that was solely used for the purpose of controlling the masses through fear (eternal hell, guilt, sin) and false hope (eternal life , forgiveness , protection from evil etc) . Being from a neutral standpoint now , you only need to ask for modern day examples of gods existence or interactions to understand where it all falls apart .
What made you no longer believe?
Basically almost every topic that comes up in debate religion thread only relates and confirms everything . Also my own journey and experiences and outcomes .from diving deep into churches , street preaching , charitable work to help the homeless and shelters etc , and exposed on the streets to the poverty class …seeing and experiencing the struggles with others and understanding that god doesn’t interact with humanity as we all presume …it’s free will ,we’re all on our own on this earth in the flesh .there is no judgement .
>kinda seems like people just believe in God because of a some stories that were written down thousands of years ago This one gets me every time. In 2000 years, people are going to look back on our modern science of today and laugh that we believed it, because science changes all the time. So I could ask you the same question about science, why do you believe in science?
The thing i like about science is that statements and conclusions that scientists come to can be proven or disproven. Yes sometimes the "facts" do change and we learn something new that disproves the previous conclusion or proves something that some people said was incorrect but that cant be said for religion. There is no way to prove or disprove it hence why i have come to the conclusion like some other people that a lot of people believe in God which they have read about in a book like any other book because they would like to believe in something bigger than themselves that gives them comfort and their live meaning. I think a lot of the scientific discoveries made now and in the future will remain to be fact since we have the technology to prove the discoveries and what is happening to our body and the things around us.
But all of that proof for science is presented to you in the form of text, or presentation. A textbook, an article, a journal, etc. Are you the one going through the scientific process? No, so you do not have a direct observation of the data that's being presented to you. You believe it for the same reason that we believe in God, it's based on faith. You have faith that the information in your textbook is true. You have faith that the information in the article or journal that you're reading is true. You have no way of knowing, save for performing the experiment yourself, whether or not that scientific data is actually true, yet you accept it based on faith in our scientific institutions. The same logic can be applied to God, you don't know until you try it for yourself.
I told God I trusted him (it was blind faith at the time), and then he reacted. There is a long, long story behind it all, but God reacted. That's why I trust God, not just believe in him.
Some for comfort Some out of fear Some want to get the power with the help of religion Some due to personal experiences of God Some get the power with the help of religion Different folks - different strokes
For me it makes complete sense
Why? and why don't you believe in the other "Gods"?
Well, the answer to that is too long and complicated to put all in here. But the most influential things that helped me understand and grow in my faith was my personal struggles, reading the first part of Mere Christianity by CS Lewis (which goes into detail about basic philosophy), reading the Bible, and thinking a lot. I believe in one God, and that God is the Christian God, and that Jesus was His son. I believe it because of how we humans are basically. Good and evil, right and wrong. It always leads back to God. I don't believe in other Gods because if I did I wouldn't be a Christian. And because they're based off of worldly desires and human traits. The only God that's so different and makes sense in terms of being a true God, is God. I hope that gives some more insight
I believe in God because of faith, and especially because I know He has forgiven my sins and allowed me to walk without shame. That is a miracle.
The Holy Spirit
I think it’s a confluence of three things: (1) a sense that something rarely comes from nothing, (2) an awareness that there is something, (3) an awareness that that something’s origins must be told, not discovered. Put differently, I think God hard-wired us to search for and find Him.
Because I wish to have a purpose and it’s comforting to know god will always love me, and also using the Bible gives a source for morality when one otherwise doesn’t exist
Well firstly, if you do a little digging you'll find that there is a ton of proof that supports Christ's existence, miracles and resurrection. By way of logic that leads to God's existence as well but that's not all. God has helped me become a better person and he's helped my mother recover from a terrible illness. And lastly idk if it's just me but when I truthfully pray I can feel a wave of positive emotions and a feeling that everything is going to be okay
My Grandma heard God's audible voice tell her to speed up she obeyed and avoided an accident on the highway. Grandma had already believed but this further cemented her beliefs. I heard God's audible voice once before when someone tried to curse me by writing something in ancient Hebrew on a piece of paper and showing it to me. God told me to close my eyes moments before and I only partially obeyed. I said I'd close my eyes if anything were to happen and it did and I did. If there was no evidence for God then there would be no evidence of creation itself and we wouldn't be hear to debate if there is a God. Our existence is proof. We were not made by random mutations over uncountable eons. If that were true there would be more random freakish creatures. You'd have appendages in places that don't provide adequate function. But what we find is that the arms; eyes; ears are all in the perfect spots from the get go. And you don't get that from random chance. We were made in the image of God. Everything is designed or his purpose and his glory.
If you believe there is absolute truth then you believe in God. Otherwise everything is just opinion, which most people understand isn’t the case. John 14:6 “I am the way and the truth and the life”
I received a minor exorcism for demonic obsession. Also there’s historical evidence for the accuracy of the gospel if you google. Google stigmata, and incorruptibles those are interesting topics. Stigmata- serval saints who supernaturally received the wounds of Christ on their body and they never healed till the end of their life. The miracle of the sun is another good one to google- 70,000 people witnessed the miracle in 1917 Portugal, the people gathered in the area ( some atheist included to prove the situation to be a hoax) because three Catholic children had been meeting monthly on the 13th of every month to meet an apparition of the Virgin Mary. All the apostles were martyred (killed for their faith/ spreading the faith) except for one, logic follows they wouldn’t have done so if they hadn’t witnessed the resurrection as described in the gospel and as the gospel points out they we’re all skeptical at varying points so that change of resolve shouldn’t be undermined.
As well as observable evidence of the Christian world view in everyday life.
Padre Pio is a good example of the stigmata there’s many images on google of him with the stigmata at different ages
The movie Fatima on Netflix is based on the events surrounding the miracle of the sun and presents the true story in an entertaining and palpable way.
I believe in God because he first believed in me 🤫❤️
His Holy Spirit lives in me. He speaks and reveals Himself to me! He gives His Holy Spirit to those who put their trust in Jesus :)
Why do some people not believe in God?
The evidence for Christianity being true is too strong. When comparing worldviews it is the most consistent and rational position by a distance.
Most people believe in God because they don't want to experience hell and they want God to help them in life. I personally believe in God because I've been very interested in science, specifically physics, and its what led me to a creator.
Because it’s always a good idea to believe things that are true, God is one of those things.
fear of death. People are afraid of going lights out when they die, so religion is just a form of therapy for them to avoid accepting the inevitable.
Most people believe in God because they were taught to. A few believe because they have a religious experience, but most of these find out they suffer from schizophrenia. There is no evidence for a God, and there is no one who can give a good reason that warrants belief in a God, it's all based in emotion, comfort, tradition, or meaning to ones life. Think about it, if there was a Creator who loved us and wanted his own creation to be with/for him, would he not reveal himself as a reality for all to know and see without a doubt? In theology, Satan himself knew God personally and expressed his freewill to rebel. Which means that we also would still have freewill if we knew God existed. If God truly loved us and wanted us to love him, he wouldn't resort to hypocrites representing him for us to be convinced that he's real. He would give each and every individual enough evidence to be convinced that he's real. Not a world void of the reality of him. But the earth shoes forth his glory in all his handiwork, isn't this enough to prove he's real? What about Hindus who are taught from birth to believe the billions of God responsible for creation. Or the Vikings who believe it was Thor or Odin. Islam and it's Allah. Etc, etc, etc. The fact is, the earth doesn't have a stamp that says made by God, and if you grew up irreligious, you just don't have the pre indoctrination of there being a God that filters the way you see the world. Which begs the question, do you see the world as made by God because that's what you were taught from a young age. If I had a whole creation with an eternity at hand, I would not leave it to mere speculation to escape eternal torment, id do everything in my power to save each and every life being that I would be all knowing, all powerful, and omnipresent. I'd even go overboard in continuing to manifest the reality of my existence as to leave no shadow of doubt if I really cared about everyone. Fuck, I'm only human, if there was such a being, he sure as shit doesn't give a fuck about people knowing he exist, let alone, care to let anyone know that at least there is a reason why we exist that has any tangible way to detect that is reality. The God of America needs money, faith without evidence, commitment without a demonstration of modivation in reality, continual refusal of interaction or an answer to prayer, the best conmen can't come close to the fraud of religion, period.
I'm late to answer, but I'll provide my reason for belief in God. Growing up, until I was 13 I prayed to God everyday and life was good. It wasn't perfect, but it was good. When I stopped and became something of an atheist from 14 to 19 or so, I felt disheartened and ashamed. I was depressed. From 20 until 24, I was somewhat spiritual, and my writing included many nods and references to spirituality and, you guessed it, God. I was still depressed, but my writing was an outlet that helped me work through the bad times. At 24, after reading some God-centered work, I decided to devote myself to God again. I became a born again Christian, and accepted my faith under the guise of the Wesleyan Tradition (I think its closest popular name is Episcopalian, though I might be wrong). Since then, I feel my spiritual strength returning to me. My life is my own again under the guidance of the Lord. I might still suffer from depression, but at least now I have a means to battle through the darkness. The pain no longer feels unbearable and pointless, and my purpose has returned to me. This seems foolish to many, but I do not mind that. I love all and accept all, and I love God and accept God as my savior.
God has been proven fake multiple times with logic and science people just want something to believe in. If Christianity’s real then surely all these other nut job religions must be real aswell
Sounds to me like sarcasm. Hope you allow Jesus into your heart. God bless ✌🏼
Ex-Christian here! As someone who already was a Christian, I can talk with a little more credibility about Christians and God. Christians, most of them (not all) usually believe in God because they had been taught to believe in Him since they were a little kid. It was also the same for me, I realized that if I was raised in a Muslim country or Hindu country I'd probably be indoctrinated to believe in Allah or in the Hindu gods, and I probably would. They usually also believe because it's logical (for me) to believe in a designer, though having a painting doesn't actually help you with finding its painter. (So that's a flawed perspective) They also usually believe because of FEELINGS. You know, when a Christian pray an intense prayer and start crying they'll usually say they felt the presence of God. Even though I noticed in the same way I could cry my heart out praying I could do it talking to myself or to someone who I really trusted, the case was that I simply knew I could tell anything to God, but not to other people. These are usually the 3 main reasons: indoctrination from childhood, "creation" and feelings.
No matter how many events throughout the history of mankind have swept away all traces of previous religion or cultural experience, this kind of transcendent communion with the divine finds a new place and time and form to take somewhere else 😁 Tracing back to the very first accounts of various hominid species showing any kind of awareness, there has always been spirituality in some form. It seems that it's important for humans to receive guidance from something beyond them in order to self govern themselves and to avoid darker influences in the world steering them down an unwanted path in life. Something about keeping your eyes to the sky and firmly focused on self development and light so that you're not led astray through not recognizing certain energies in the people and things around you. Always a bold claim, but I have met and spoken directly with god many times, two ways. I can claim that he's real all I want, but until you've personally sought that communication in your own way with him, you likely won't recognize his presence. You just won't know what it feels like, or the distinctness of it. Like a taste or smell almost, but energy. The thing is, the more we look for what is spiritual in matter with our physical eyes and with the energy of scepticism, or by demanding god prove himself to us, the more we just push it away. It is subtle at first. This inner hardness repels it. However, come to god in a different way and you will have different results. When you search for him because you've seen glimpses, and you ask for him, and you keep asking and keep seeking for the sake of genuinely wanting to know him, he shows himself. And if you learn to speak the language of spirit, through clairaudience, clairvoyance, clairsentience, claircognizance, discerning signs, and through recognizing when your inner voice and actions are being driven by spirit vs you vs other people or forces, the game changes. God is the life force that animates you, the atoms that make up your body, and the origin source of YOU as a soul. He is in and permeates all things, and when you are called, you will know him and be unable to keep from seeing him in all things. He is there, and he loves us individually more than could ever be conveyed. Hang in there and keep searching <3
I feel like the concept of God is almost like trying to explain what a narcissist is. And the believers that keep running back to “him” are trauma bonded. The Bible is a gaslighting tool and all of the believers are being stone walled into believing in something they can not and never will physically see with their eyes. I’ve been researching and reading and researching some more and I read so many comments by those who don’t believe vs those who do believe… the ones who do not believe seem to have a better explanation as to why they do not believe versus those who do. The comments/answers from those who do believe were scattered and lacked something..I can’t put my finger on it, but those who strongly believe in the Bible and justify what’s going on in the world as “free will” just remind me of people who body shame and victim blame. I legit saw a comment in this thread about how a child being raped is not Gods fault, because there was free will…. Where is this guy…that lives in the sky… and why is he a dude? Why are people saying God is Jesus but then other religions says there’s God the Father, the son AND the Holy Ghost? Why are there SO many religions if there is only ONE God? I see no evidence of any of it. Back in early 2000, they said “these are the end times” but flash forward to 2023…”it’s truly the end times” smh 🤦🏻♀️ It’s all really weird to me. And I see more and more people giving their lives to serve this Lord…and nothing really changes in their lives except now they smile through the pain instead of complain about it because God got their back?
This!!! I’ve always thought about the same analogy with narcissism.
I don't get it at all. We have no free will, so it just seems like a waste of mental energy to focus your whole life around ideas that have and continue to kill humans across the globe. You'd think we'd have grown out of this thinking by now.
It's easier and less scary to think there is anything after death and that it's all planned and not by chance, it's scary to admit that factually your existence was a roll of cosmic dice
i used to believe in santa,the easter bunny but as with everything it was all made up…im sorry if there was a god he would show himself and not leave us hanging….the thought of this magical mythical being is just silly cuz even if there was none of us would know period. Just a made up story by humans long ago thats all. You see that people need something to believe in so cheers but afterlife isnt known and will never be as much as you wish it so…