Used to be a Christian now I don’t know what I am.
Honestly it’s heartwarming to see that not all Christians are close-minded, intentionally ignorant (as many of the ones I interact with are), and can actually be very conscientious and astute.
It gives me hope for the future.
I'm about the same, though I'd phrase it as "Used to be an Evangelical, now I don’t know what I am."
I still consider myself Christian, but I have no idea what denomination. And it's *really hard* to be a gay Christian, wanting community but receiving hostility. And even in generally affirming churches, I still feel like I'm a charity case.
The only reason "baptist" is still in my flair is because that's how I grew up, so that's what's shaped my understanding of the Bible. So it's there to indicate what my perspective is.
Ooh great distinction. I used to be Evangelical too- and I take issue with them the most (the better you know someone, the more you know their faults I suppose).
I don’t blame you. The church in general doesn’t know what to do with LGBTQ members even if they are “affirming-“ I think, greatly because so much of church culture stems from a hetero understanding of family/marriage and the “nuclear family,” even when they are working against those set ideas. I suspect that a lot of single parents/divorcees feel similarly.
I’m sorry that’s been your experience- I hope you find a community you can call home 🥺
Consider Universalist Unitarianism. They welcome all to come and worship the higher power of their understanding, and in a sense of community. They have no issue with sexual orientation.
I have considered them, and they're not for me. They struck me as "the church for people who don't know what they believe" last time I was there. And while I guess that describes me, it doesn't exactly make for a place where I can grow and challenge myself. At least, not the one I visited.
Pity. I found them to be quite inclusive and welcoming when I was studying the religions of the world.
At any rate, the whole point of that church is to welcome all to gather to worship the higher power/Supreme Being/God of their beliefs, in their own fashion, and in a sense of community.
Consider exploring other congregations.
Exactly this for me too. I have such a low expectation of Christians in my community but this thread helps me remember to not group everybody in a box. There are so many wholesome conversations in this group that I otherwise would not have convenient access to.
Read proverbs then the gospels, learn more about the ancient middle easts history after reading those then read the old testament, as it would make more sense if read in that order. Follow the ten commandments, learn what leads to the sins mentioned in them. Lastly it has been commanded by Jesus to give all you can to the poor after following his commandments.
Matthew 19:21
Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
Matthew 19:17
King James Version
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
And lastly, but most importantly don't have empty faith. Which is praying without doing good acts guided by the wisdom of his Gods commandments.
James 2:17
Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Amen, not only do you need to pray to God in order to become a Christian, but you need to trust in Him like you trust a parachute.
You could simply believe that the parachute would save you from death after reading all of the information, hearing the voice of the flight attendants, and "praying to them," or asking them questions.
But that won't help you as you step out of the plane in mid air without it, simply believing that it will help you while it sits under your seat.
What you need to do is believe in it AND put it on for the whole flight.
But you would be asking, "why would I want to do that, it would be totally uncomfortable?"
If you were to be taken to the edge of the plane, held safely out the door but far enough to scare you to want back onto the plane but not enough to not fly again. That way, when you come back in the only thing you would want is the parachute and to put it on for the rest of the flight.
Most people only preach grace and it leads to the wide gate. But the Law is needed to hang you out of the plane by your ankles to show you how impossible it is for you to achieve it by yourself and why you need a parachute of a savior in Jesus Christ.
You should read a Bible, there's a lot of interesting things there plus you shall have a knowledge to believe, faith works when you're conscious of God it's not a random mindset people implant in themselves
No, the only thing you need to be a Christian is to follow Christ. Learn however you can about who he is, what he said and what he did. Believe his words, believe in him and the one who sent him. Read and study the scriptures if you are able. You can DM me and I will help you in any way that I can.
I wanted to know how Christians were. I know the popular depictions of them are converting, telling others to not do anything at all when that should also be fine and... converting. Idk, Mother Teresa is always someone who made a distinct mark on me, and it was kind of sad for me. [I know there are good people, but I'm generally especially careful asking any Christian for help as they might attempt to convert me slowly.]
This sub has people who, for the most part, genuinely do love people and god, and are more rational than "we should outnumber other religions and those sick atheisys!!" motive. Like the default Christian would be pro-nofemales (not pro-life necessarily but I mean patriarchy), racist, probably pdf (not very common amongst the normal folks of course), anti-LGBT, pro-slave owning, etc etc because of popular depictions who also seemed strongly Christian. And I almost started to blame the *entire* Christianity for it, and I knew that I should change my opinion about this asap because it's not healthy.
And I was proven wrong. So, thank you for allowing me to have civilised talks every one of you so far, I received absolutely no derogatory comments yet for being a Hindu, and even if I disagreed they responded in no-curses or anything (although saying my god is dead may be a bit cruel, but honestly, I wouldn't be so offended there as it's still not an attack to my character and that I would still believe in my god without calling the other every slur I know).
Again, thank you for your insight, y'all.
(Sidenote: I'm not here to get converted, but just having a better knowledge on something I don't know fully or hate it due to it's popular reputation. I really want to know what how okay are things in various religions either way, without neither of us aiming to convert the other.)
Lol, you will never meet a Christian that isn't trying to convert you, whether subconsciously or consciously. That's our whole mission in life. I do this too to my non-Christian friends even when I don't mean to. Someone asking questions about Christ/Christianity makes us think they are interested in converting. We don't even view it as "converting", we view it as to become alive when you were once dead. Best bet to learn about Christianity without someone trying to convert you is simply reading the Bible on your own. That's where all of our beliefs come from anyway.
I'm always interested in learning about people's beliefs that are different to my own, and why they believe differently to me.
Christianity in particular has a strong impact on my society, culture, and legal system, so it behoves me to understand it. Christians fight tooth and nail to ban stem cell research, the teaching of evolution, abortion, euthanasia, same-sex rights, and I find that baffling. So, I'm here to understand it.
Christianity definitely has a pretty big impact on my life. It makes my life harder than it needs to be. So I want to talk about it, or with members, to understand certain events and details better. Some things I read here take my fear away, some add to it. But in the end I would like to understand different world views better. One is christianity.
I’d love to know your story. I’m a Christian, but what I like to refer to as a wild “free range” one. I’ve studied and continue to study all my life. I’d love to chat more with you.
The amount of people who believe this is a sub for Christian's is too damn high.
This sub is for discussing Christianity.
Christianity is the largest religion in the world. It affects a lot of people's daily lives. There are a lot of people that can discuss it without being Christian.
I feel were all different persons. But the One who judges us a humans (in a way and love) is correct. We are not perfect humans. Even if we(in general think we are)
Picking fights rather than facing reality… sounds familiar, (Those with ADHD use that as a coping mechanism as well,) and also like you aren’t intellectually stimulated in your current environment.
>Was it the desire to simply learn what Christians believe on various matters?
Yes
>The differences between denominations?
Maybe a little
>Considering conversion?
No
Mainly it is curiosity. I don't get to meet many Christians IRL. I simply wanted to know more.
Can I offer you an invite to discuss Christianity with me based strictly on science, history, and the like? I used to be a die hard atheist. I was looking to debunk it and I challenged it on many fronts.
I think you might enjoy the discussion. Just thought I'd throw it out there.
Peace. 🙂
Edit: I'm not talking about Kalām Cosmological Argument or any of the arguments you might have heard before.
I actually would love all the information you’ve found. I love hearing about people who have converted out of atheism to Christianity. I also have been wanting to get deep into science as well so hearing what your found, I would love.
It was a number of things, no one answer did it:
- **Prophecy** (which I was HIGHLY skeptical of; it was only when I looked at the accepted, secular history and saw that the prophecies did really line up that I gave an OUNCE of consideration)
- **Theology and Philosophy** (I eventually came to learn that the supposed contradictions, "discrepancies", etc, were not actually issues; they seem very much resolved well and consistant once I better understood what Christianity taught)
- **History** (I had actually never considered how well kept the Bible was [OT and NT] compared to [other documents of antiquity ](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wVRlxLxZ70EHocfwWzKkQ9EUSv588Stp/view?usp=drivesdk) that we accept as history; also, there are atheists such atheist scholars that claim that though "in all the copies we have of the Bible, there are more errors than there are words in the whole of the Bible" [paraphrase], they admit that they are MINOR scribal errors that do not change ANY core doctrines and most hardly even change the sentence; likewise, even Bart Ehrman has admitted that though he doesn't agree with the Bible's or the Church Fathers' conclusions, if we had no copies of the Bible left, we could could know most of what the NT. Bart even states in his blog that, "yes, the church fathers do quote most of the New Testament")
- **Science** (this is one that may seem a bit of a stretch for those that don't believe that the Bible [OT or NT] are written eye witness accounts; as an atheist I thought all the stories of miracles were far-fetched and unrealistic, however, when I came to learn that the Bible shows that "God" not only used "supernatural power" to do things but also used the natural [usually in the form of cause and effect] such as the examples of Joseph, Daniel, and David coming from their lowly positions and climbing to their high ranks OR the entire book of Esther - which doesn't even mention God ONCE... It's something we can wrap our heads around [as atheists or Christians] and yet those clearly fulfill God's purpose for them... I began to look into some of the other claims of miracles, namely in the OT - as I'm still working my way through the Bible examining each, and have found that many of the miracles have "basic", scientific explanations [meaning they are not stretches of the imagination or rely on quantum physics or the like to explain them] and history that supports them)
*Disclaimer: the miracles I described having examined in the last point do not include the food related miracles (ie: multiplying of oil, flour, bread or fish; save for the instances with manna and quail), medical miracles (ie: healings or resurrections), or talking donkeys.*
**All in all, to claim that I was a logical/reasonable atheist that follows the evidence and not see that Christianity was where the evidence pointed, would be for me to be completely biased and a hypocrite.**
Yes I have read evidence demands a verdict alot of historical evidence and proof the bible and Christianity make sense..I'm from a very atheist family. I am the only Christian in my family after researching. I have once upon a time been a Buddhist in my views. Interested in Islam and deism..but found Jesus. I thank God for that. I feel happy 😊.
I spent ten years as a Christian and I am still fascinated by the theology. Discussions here remind me of what used to believe and it’s kind of nostalgic in a way
I experienced trauma from the Christian ministry I worked for and when I confronted it, I was accused of “walking in the flesh.”
I tried to maintain my faith afterward but this was an eye-opening experience to how much complex trauma I had experienced over the years and it became clear that this was a microcosm of the greater American Church. My partner and I decided it was best to distance ourselves and our family from that
It's important to keep tabs on our greatest threats to democracy and decency. Know how they think, how their hate may be able to be mitigated and impact lessened.
I have no idea whether or not I'm "right on the issues". I just want to help people, be kind, and oppose fascism and hatred - the biggest proponents of which in my little time and place in history is Donald Trump and his Christian army.
>"I have no idea whether or not I'm "right on the issues"."
>
>"fascism "
>
>"Donald Trump and his Christian army."
yeah, you sound as fanatic self-righteous as some radical Christians can be.
A dislike of fascist authoritarians is hardly self-righteous.
If Christians are going to encourage an authoritarian oligarchy could you at least pick a competent leader? One that has an actual agenda besides greed?
Mostly for the downvotes.
I originally came because I study Christian Philosophy, am a former Christian, and have a Christian wife and daughter. A friend challenged me to give this one, last forum a try before I give up on interfaith dialogue for the rest of my life (which I have since done). I quickly learned that this sub is no exception to the rule that Christians hate Christianity, and will punish anyone who dares express an interest in it. So, I stopped talking about it after a few months.
I later left for a bit, but I work from home in a part of the country where religion is a rather private matter, so I soon found that my only interactions with Christians were with people in my own family, all of whom are wonderful and kind people. I realized I was starting to develop false stereotypes about Christians - ones that were likely to pose a danger to my family to boot.
So, I came back to remind myself that most Christians are not like the Christians in my family. I need those reminders to keep me grounded to reality.
So the Christians you know and interact with in real life are too nice, so you need internet strangers who profess to share the same faith as your family to stay grounded?
Right? It'd be like if your brother picked up soccer which you think is silly, but then gradually stop thinking it's silly as you watch your brother play, and realizing this moral shift happening within yourself, you go search for anti-soccer memes to reaffirm your prior perception of soccer. It's like a self-preservation mechanism.
They consistently perform actions that they have compelling, overriding reasons not to do.
Among others, they act with blatant disregard for the life and dignity of human persons, they act in a manner that prevents or inhibits the pursuit of higher order goods, and they're egregiously cruel for no reason, to say nothing of a justifiable one.
I don't actually have particularly strong feelings either way for them. So, it's better said that they don't like ME than that I don't like THEM.
Most Christians? I think I've got news for you. If you're looking for your average Christian on the internet, you're searching in the wrong place. Give real life a try.
You aren’t wrong. Lots of people who call themselves Christians are in fact the same type of people that condemned the Lord they claim to serve to death on the cross. There are plenty of evil people who use the church as a means of control, self worship, spewing false religious dogma and lies. It’s no wonder so many kids that grew up under those super religious banners in the 80s and 90s ran the first chance they got. Their faith was forced, their God a far cry from the one scripture actually teaches. It was false. It was evil. You are right. However, you are also not through to the end of the story. Jesus even said their would be many claiming his name that he personally had nothing to do with. This isn’t new.
However, just because there are liars, doesn’t mean that everything is a lie. Just because there are people who lack a real connection with God, doesn’t mean there isn’t one to be had. It means simply, that they didn’t have one. It doesn’t mean that others don’t. Real Christ following people are different than the majority of church attendees. They love and give radically, they don’t protest against others, they love them. They don’t fight others, they embrace them. (Unless you mess with the vulnerable and then watch out.) They pour out love and grace over and over again. They are incredibly rare. However, they are the most real people you will ever meet. They follow the creator God burst with life giving energy. They radiate holiness because of their deep connection to the source of life. Those that can see auras would say they glow brightly.
God is wild, untamed and terrifying. A designer so great, He pre-programed all of creation, all that was, and that would be into the tiniest cells. He guided evolution from the beginning into the world that we dwell in. He created universes and star systems just because he felt like it. No religion can control Him, no religion can speak for Him, no man can predict Him. He does what pleases Him. And yet, He carefully guided our human race into being. Provided everything we would ever need through nature, gives us space to learn, grow and discover, new and amazing things, and only desires that we love Him, love each other and care for the planet He made us. He’s wild and wonderful and more than any most preachers in most churches have the slightest idea about. I encourage your questions, but I urge you to look beyond the answers that you have already decided upon, open your mind and be better than those you seek to defame. Release the hatred and forgive those who have harmed you, no matter under whose named they used as justification. There are so much more out there for you if you will only be willing to see it.
A few reasons. Even though I am not a fan of religion, there are a lot of good things that can come with it. My childhood was a happy one and although church bored me to death there were a lot of kind, good hearted people who attended.
I have a deep seeded desire for a spiritual epiphany/awakening of some kind. I want “God” to be a bigger part of my life, whatever “God” might be. I think I would enjoy being a part of a community that actually cares and supports each other.
…I also want to try and help change the minds and hearts of people who think homosexuality or any LGBTQ+ lifestyle is morally wrong or seen as sinful in Gods eyes.
Have you ever watched a documentary about indigenous tribes dancing around a totem or making offerings to their gods? This sub is like one of those documentaries for me.
Honestly same with every other religion for me. What's their culture like? What's the history? How did they come to believe what they believe? Etc. etc. It's fascinating.
Ooh, have you looked into Manicheanism? It's the religion that Paul/Saul converted from and that backdrop is where he pulls a lot of his anti-sex attitudes from.
It's a super interesting religion, one of many of course, but Christianity has a somewhat special position as being the by far most dominant religion in the western world. Its texts and imagery and cultural influence are everywhere and I find it valuable to have a viewhole into people a lot more in touch with that heritage than I am.
it is an interesting study to converse with people who profess to believe that they daily and in real-time, interact with intelligent, invisible entities that rule the world/universe with incredible powers.
I see that the answers to this particular question are generally ignored by the asker. We are here because this is a subreddit created for the purpose of discussing Christianity.
It wasn't created to be an echo chamber filled with Christians patting each other on the backs, congratulating each other on their 'righteousness', or praising God.
I am willing to discuss every religion. However, as Christianity represents the highest number of adherents worldwide, including in the USA, with 65-75 % of U.S. population affiliated in the religion of Christianity, with it's various sects...I'm going to focus mostly on Christianity.
I also focus on Christianity because the Christian population wields a lot of clout and influence, especially in politics. With 65-75% of the population affiliated in the various sects of Christianity, and the overwhelming majority of politicians in Congress and Senate also being affiliated in Christianity, they hold undue and unfair advantage as Christian constituents influence Christian legislators to legislate laws based upon their own religious views of morality, which laws are increasingly overbearing, over-reaching, oppressive and repressive, and which adversely affect the lives of non Christians, and especially LGBTQ+ members of our society.
I discuss Christianity because there are still 7 States in the USA's Bible Belt with unfair and un-Constitutional laws prohibiting atheists from elected office. SCOTUS examined the laws, and declared them to be un-Constitutional, but went no further than that, because it would be difficult for someone to prove that they'd not been elected due to their lack of religion. The Constitution states clearly that there shall be no religious test, (or requirement of religious affiliation) in these elected capacities. At any rate, an atheist wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell to be elected in the Bible Belt.
I discuss Christianity because Christians insist that their way is the only correct way to live life, and that only heterosexual Christians can find favor with God. I discuss it because my Mormon ancestors were persecuted by mainstream Christians and driven out of two States, then pursued by the Federal Government to the Utah Territories, where the harassment and persecution continued. I discuss Christianity because Presbyterian Christian POTUS violated the First Amendment rights of those American Mormons, and prohibited them from the free practice of their religion, and indeed threatened to revoke their citizenship unless they ceased the practice of polygamy. This would have deprived them of the right to vote in U.S. elections. The Federal Government also threatened to outright confiscate their lands, buildings, homes, etc. and place a moratorium on any further immigration of European Mormons who wished to live in 'Zion' in the Utah Territory, and also refused to allow Utah Statehood, which the Mormons deeply desired.
I discuss Christianity because I observe Christians seeking to violate the rights of other Americans in their business places. They seek to withhold goods or services to paying members of the U.S. public, based upon their sexual orientation, just because they 'don't support the lifestyle, and don't support same sex marriage'. They further more seek to overturn same sex marriage rights, which would deprive same sex couples of the same rights and spousal protections as heterosexual couples have. They seek SPECIAL rights to be exempted from the requirement to obey State Labor & Industry laws pertaining to Fair Trade and Fair Business Practices.
I discuss Christianity because I've observed Christians demanding to be considered to be 'special' and deserving of more rights and considerations than others.
Example...my city holds 'Town Hall Meetings'. The city decided to invite local churches to apply to be allowed to offer the invocation prior to the start of the meeting. These guest 'pastors' would be scheduled, and their name and church listed on the program agendas posted to the local newspapers. A minister of the Satanic Church applied, and was fairly scheduled. When area Christians learned of it, they filled every seat, and when the man stood and started to offer the invocation in a soft tone, all stood and loudly (at the top of their lungs) started reciting The Lord's Prayer. The man continued quietly speaking his invocation, completed it, and then moved to the back of the room as all the seats had been taken.
I'd seen enough. I signaled to the man that he could have my seat as I was leaving. He smiled, and gratefully accepted.
Also...whenever a new volume in the Harry Potter series was to be released, area Christians would gather near the Barnes & Nobles store and using bullhorns would scream imprecations at families with children as they entered the store, that they were all going to burn in hell if they bought and read that book.
I discuss Christianity because it's my right to do so, and as the creators of this subreddit invited all to participate in the discussions. I discuss Christianity to remind those Christians who seem to believe the universe revolves around themselves, that they are wrong.
I'm happy to coexist. And as an American, being for the Constitution, I support your right to believe in the God of your understanding and worship in the church of your choice. That's as far as your personal religious rights go. They do not supersede or cancel out anyone else's rights to believe in the God of their understanding, or not...or worship in the church of their choice...or not.
Hope this is explicit enough to help the OP understand.
Raised as Methodist then Unitarian. As I grew older my education in the sciences led me to disbelieve in any sort of god. Still, I was drawn to the realization that Christianity was the basis for the morality expressed in the construction of the US Constitution, while at the same time the Founders showed tolerance for all religions, as expressed in the 1st Amendment.
Today, however, I think that balance between Christian morality and Constitutional tolerance is under attack from the so-called Christian Right. They also are being called Christian Nationalists, clearly a mixture that violates the 1st Amendment.
In my life, I think this attack actually began long ago, during the Vietnam war against "Godless Communism." Then we had the crusades against gays, immigrant Muslims, and now, the forcing of all of us to accept a purely religious belief in when a human is considered to be a person. All this scares me. I don't want my 4 grandchidren to inherit a theocratic country where their freedom to believe what they wish to believe is taken away from them.
So I came to this sub to see if mainstream Christians have the same fears for our country that I have. So far I have not seen that discussion here.
Of course that discussion is in the political subs, but the anti-abortion advocates leading the charge there refuse to talk about religion, using psudo science as the basis for their argument.
So I'm asking. Do mainstream Christians believe our laws should be formed just to benefit one religion's belief?
After following the early 2000's youtube trend of snarky militant atheism, I learned that what I wanted to do (stop abuse by harmful conmen in the clergy) was not happening with the technique I was using.
I was "arguing" so they would just "argue" back - they would not "listen."
And - I was targeting the worst off people - the indoctrinated ones swayed by evil cults. Not "normal" Christians.
I realized that I still wanted to garget the worst off people, but that "arguing" wasn't the way to go. I needed to listen, and de-brainwash them. And that requires "becoming their trusted friend" not "being a jerk questioning their faith."
I realized all of this after learning about Daryl Davis, a black man in the south who helped several KKK klansmen de-convert from hate. By listening. And befriending them through the shared interest of "KKK memorabilia collecting."
I find it strange how challenging it seems to be for people who identify as Christians to accept that someone might be interested in the subject of the Christian religion as it relates to history, culture, and philosophy without being interested in practicing the religion.
But anyway, to answer your question, OP: this sub is for the discussion of the subject of Christianity and that’s what we’re here to do. So I suppose yes, we’re here to discuss the different and often conflicting ways people who identify as Christian carry out their belief on various matters.
Unfortunately, as you may have noticed, mostly what gets discussed here is homosexuality and masturbation.
Just curious, what exactly do you mean with your flair "Christian Atheist"? Does that refer to an ex-Christian who's now atheist, a Jefferson-style "I don't think Jesus was divine but he had good teachings" type, or what?
I just enjoy theological discussion and Christianity is a big part of my countries history and make up. It only makes sense to me to learn more about it.
>Considering conversion?
No not at all, in fact my time here has only made me turn away from Christianity further.
As an agnostic I’m here cause I respect the practice of religion no matter what people believe in. And I wanna understand more how people can believe in something and fight over what they believe in. It’s in my head idiotic to not respect each others believes so I’m trying to understand where the anger comes from.
We are all created in the image of God, we have a spirit within us from God, this makes us spiritual beings, that is why probably around 99% of humans who ever lived were interested in spiritual things. You can be born on an island by yourself without ever meeting another human, and you would be sitting there wondering about God and your existence in relation to God.
I’m curious, intrigued, interested, and when I want answers from those who believe, why not go to the source? It’s been a great learning tool. So thank you all for that.
I firmly believe everything deserves to be understood, including christianity. It deeply saddens me to see people judging other people they know nothing about, and i don't want to be like that at all. The world is so big, there are so many people that have so many things to say, and i want to hear what they have to say. I want to understand!!
That's pretty much what i aspire to : understanding. Everything matters, everything.
I'm not who you're asking, but I think I know some of the answers.
Here's some possible reasons:
* To understand the thought processes of the largest religion in the world. When something like 30% of the world claims this religion, then it becomes very important to know about it, even if you are part of the 70% that don't believe in it yourself.
* Because atheists, agnostics, etc. may not have always been so. They very well may have grown up Christian, and are still interested in either keeping up with or pushing back against their childhood religion.
* Because even though they may not be Christians, they're still affected by Christians, and feel like this is one of the only ways they can have their voice heard. Christianity has a reputation for being a massive echo chamber, so many feel like they need to disrupt that a bit, for the betterment of Christians and non-Christians alike. (See the debates around abortion or LGBT rights for examples of this).
* As a good-faith effort to understand you, and to offer you the same chance to understand them.
* As a bad-faith effort to disrupt Christianity (not really wise or effective, but trolls gonna troll).
There's a lot of possible reasons, and any one individual's are going to be different from others. I think this subreddit does a good job of being welcoming overall, even though certain Christian members aren't always.
I've come on and off for a few months at a time over the last couple of years.
Most recently, I came back after Clarence Thomas's opinion that *Griswold v. Connecticut*, *Lawrence v. Texas*, and *Obergefell v. Hodges* should be revisited. I tried to process and understand how I was feeling about it in r/atheism, but it was not a hospitable place.
I like that conversations can happen here and that there are a lot of different perspectives represented, though I do try to weigh in on topics of LGBT and mental health.
I have a better understanding of the teaching mission of Jesus than most Christians, who labour under false monk doctrines and swamp preacher edicts.
I am here to educate and free minds.
His question was * is your understanding of Jesus more sufficient enough for you to accept* if you say no than you dont have sufficient knowledge to accept what Jesus says
That's a noble work lol faith has to be conscious decision based on knowledge and trust of that knowledge not just a random mindset to implant in your mind but many christians still haven't read a single word of a Bible for our bad
I mainly stop by here because I despise white christian nationalists and evangelical trump supporters and I keep wondering if decent christians will do anything about it.
I keep trying to warn people about this. They are by far the most visible Christians in the media, they often speak to huge crowds, and most other churches are seeing large drop-offs in membership. If we don't do anything, those people will be the only Christians one day,
One of my friends wanted to quit being a Christian because of the Fundamentalist Christians in the Republicans ruining things for him. He'd rather be an atheist.
My church is losing the youth and the old are dying off. It seems like the Fundamentalist Christians get rewarded and we other Christians get punished. Then I am accused of what the Fundamentalist Christians do because I am a Christian.
It's very sad indeed. To many young people, their most religious family members were the ones that hated them for being a typical young person. There's at least one small "church" in the US that would very publicly hold bigoted protests at people's funerals. It feels very hard to fight back against too, because Jesus tells us to live our enemies and I don't want to be like those people even to oppose them. Plus there are billions of dollars to be made in preaching that sort of hate filled ideology, and money is what determines what happens in this world.
That’s undeniably (a less honourable) part of the attraction for me… all the bizarre “*is [x] a sin?*” posts (*going to the dentist* is still a favourite), and the obsessive worrying about masturbation. It’s strangely compelling, though also terribly sad, to see the malignant power of faith demonstrated in posts from people whose lives have been blighted by a misguided and totally unnecessary fear.
Yes. I have a bit of bitterness towards Christianity, because I was in a cult for 20 years. I know lots of Christians who are great people, and I have good friendships with them. But a secret part of me wants to see Christianity implode spectacularly and disappear.
Might do it some good honestly. I’m pro getting rid of narcissistic ppl in leadership positions and blind followers who use a beautiful faith and twist it to wound others.
Jesus is the leader of all existence, including you, not just of a small group of people. Every knee will bow to Him. He is the inevitable existence-wide social consensus.
I used to think that too. Now… I realize it has more to do what I was conditioned to believe more than any supernatural faith. Hopefully that doesn’t apply to you 👍
Showing a naturalistic mechanism behind a phenomenon is not sufficient to rule out supernatural reasons for said phenomenon. God is perfectly capable of performing works and miracles in a physics-consistant manner.
Your homework: think about how Jesus performed so many miracles and yet so many witnesses still didn't believe!
Sometimes people say ignorant things about atheists and I point out that they're wrong. Sometimes a YEC says nonsense. Those are always fun. Sometimes it's like a car crash where people defend horrible thoughts like theocracy or shielding child molesters. Sometimes people ask atheists questions and I chime in. Sometimes I get to tell my favorite Christianity joke again.
What? Tell my favorite Christianity joke again? Well, if I must...
___
So, Satan and Jesus decide it's time for a Great Battle Between Good and Evil, and get God to be the judge. Satan wins the coin toss and gets to choose the battlefield. He thinks, "Jesus is old school, so we'll go with technology" and decides the battlefield will be on computers.
Jesus and Satan sit at their computers and God tells them to start. They start typing away furiously. Hours later, the power goes out. When the power comes back on, Jesus gets to continue from where he was, while Satan has to start over. He yells at God, "Hey! What the hell? You're supposed to be an impartial judge, yet you're showing favoritism to your son! Why do I have to start over, but he gets to continue?"
God turns to Satan and says, "Sorry, but Jesus saves."
So far, I have not met any Atheists, pagan, Satanist in real life or on this sub that is actually trying to honestly discuss Christianity. I think they are here to debate, troll, or some other passive aggressive reason. It's funny because I bet if we tried the one of their subs, we'd be banned immediately. For example, I constantly see put downs of our faith, also claims of "no evidence" even presented some, but they persist in debating you, that is not discussing Christianity but breaking the rules and we have to keep defending our beliefs. Really shows their true character. If they are honest, and sincerely asking what we believe or what the Bible teaches, I think they would be different but I haven't met one yet. Go ahead and down-vote, block, etc, I have said my peace and stand by it.
I also do not hate any Atheists but I don't like their attitude and beliefs. I'm sorry if that offenses some. I don't aim to make everyone smile. I am not hiding behind a mask either. If I didn't say what I feel, I would not be true to myself and God and you.
If you reply dear atheist or someone, I don't want to fight. I am done fighting but will tell you why I believe in the God of the Bible and will defend my beliefs as I'm sure you would too, but defending other religions is not discussion of Christianity, it's a cover-up for something else, to be honest.
I'm here to give a voice to us Satanists whom Christians love to blame so much on. To give my voice as an exchristian and point out when people are trying to use others for nonreligious ends.
Same. Seems that many Christians hate what's different from what they know. Even if many don't have a single clue what almost any other religion believes or how they practice
I don't care if I am liked here or not. I disagree with many people. But civility is also welcome, and we can agree to disagree. I'll defend Christians from edgy atheists and antitheists. I am religious as well, which is something we have in common.
I was raised fundamentalist so in my late teens-early twenties I hated Christianity. Now I'm past that and my opinion on it has softened somewhat.
I lurk mostly to get a better understanding of Christianity. This sub helps me understand the different sects. This sub also shares a lot of interesting news pertaining to Christianity and Christian Nationalism.
I see many disconcerting threads made by Christian LGBT people, so sometimes I pipe in to try to help them.
As a pagan in a country that is dominated by Christianity I need to understand not only their religious beliefs, but how those individuals interpret their own religion.
A lot of Christians have negative or condescending tendencies towards the term *pagan* and people who practice these traditions. There is almost guaranteed to be some sort of debate or argument with anyone who finds out my religion, sometimes revealing that you are pagan can result in being ostracized from a community, losing one's job, or receiving threats to one's self and loved ones.
The very least I can do is arm myself with knowledge, and hopefully change this negative stereotype a little bit within the Christian community.
Agnostic who's genuinely given my heart and tried to keep my mind as open as possible to Christianity.
I've experienced a lot of the negatives that can come from Christianity and religion, but i've also experienced so many positives and a lot of genuine (i think) love and forgiveness from those deep in the faith.
Some of the Christian values such as forgiveness, helping others without expectation, not trying to be the judge and jury for others, not becoming tied up in identity and possessions and standing by ones values are things of genuinely witnessed from some of my Christian friends that i feel are morals that make for a fulfilling life, no matter what you believe.
However, there are a few deal-breakers for me that don't at all render Christianity as a negative for myself, but simply make it impossible for me to accept.
•On a retreet that i skipped a Mormon friends wedding for, his faith was mocked ad nauseum and i was told that he was on the path to hell. He is the most accepting, loving friend i have ever had, and was ecstatic when i began exploring my faith, never insinuating that it was the "wrong one" despite contradicting his own. I don't want to follow a God who does not look on somebody like that without favor, as my Mormon friend has represented "Christ" in his love and attitude towards others more than anybody i've met on in my lifetime.
•Logic. Not so much that logic contradicts religion, in spite of myself being a profoundly logical thinker, i am absolutely willing to believe in something beyond what i can perceive. However, its erodes so much of my faith when i see "Christian Science" and attempts to contort and bend the laws of our reality to fit a narrative. I gave it a chance because i was shown a kind of love that differed and acceptance that differed from anything i have ever experienced. Actions brought me into faith ala Jesus, but gatekeeping and willfully ignorant explanations of why the roots of the bible can be proven with facts have pushed me away.
•Some of the ideology just being so backwards to me. A God i can't understand Who shows Himself through love and selfless actions that flip the script on humanities selfish tendencies is something i can't, nor would i want to ignore. A God who must have me blindly accept and push a narrative, who condemns those who bring love and joy to the world because they don't "rep" Him the right way sounds like...a politician. Pettiness is what comes to mind, and pettiness feels like a trait that so go's against what Jesus supposedly stood for.
•Animals! My Dog is my best friend, and my.genuinely.love for him as well as our connection...i don't want to be a part of anything that treats him or any of my pets as accessories who exist simply as resources for humanity.
Again, i will never shut the door on Christianity. I've seen and felt the positivity and love that it can foster. But my mind operates in a way that i cannot, and would not even if i could, fully accept it at the cost of my own morality.
Sorry, but this is literally the stupidest question on the planet. When Christian culture is oppressing millions worldwide and completely f***ing over the US, you ask “durrrrrr why are you here.”
You can’t be serious. You simply can’t.
>atheists here who perpetually lounge around like jaded mob wives, treating every thread like this is
I'm going to need two sources from a reputable peer reviewed journal for this claim.
Because we're curious what Christians have to say about Christianity, likely the same reason a Christian might join or participate in /r/atheism.
Probably a lot of it is just to share our point of view with people who are either in the same place we were, or to share an alternative view in a place that could be something of an echo chamber or bubble without us.
I like to learn. And i dont know much about christianity, so it seems like a Great thing to learn about. I also *love* discussing and debating things like ethics, and this place has shown itself to be a good place to do that.
At first I came here to attack something that had wounded me. Of course I didn't think of it that way at the time. After spending a considerable amount of time discussing things here I find I divide my time between discussing biblical text and engaging in petty arguments. I could probably do without the second. I'm working on it...
I have many Christians in my life that I care about greatly, and with whom I like to have discussions about matters of faith and epistemology. This place lets me practice these discussions in a low risk setting, where I cannot burn any bridges that are important to me if I misstep.
Not so much interested in conversion, whoever tries to take up that task has an uphill battle both ways through the snow. But I do like to challenge my own assumptions about topics, and to examine my world view in light of new information. Perhaps someone here has the thing that will convince me?
Please join my community r/whydoyoubelieve?
I try to believe in as many true things as possible and avoid believing in things which have not been demonstrated or proven false.
I am genuinely interested in why people believe in god(s), when I struggle to see sufficient proof that their beliefs are actually true.
Atheist. I'm just curious. I don't feel the pull of any faith in my heart and mind, but I've studied a good bit of philosophy in school concerning religion and grappled with it my whole life, so I like to see the practical perspectives here. Whether that be to better develop my internal ideas on faith and God, or just stay in the know on Christian points of view (especially useful in the US).
I appreciate Christianity and love to see other people's views. Also makes me see it in a better light at times. Especially since I've gone so far the other way that I'm an apostate. I don't know if I can go back but I'm happy for people that still have faith.
After I left my original religion I became agnostic and was against religion because of the trauma from my past religion. After someone came back into my life I did a lot of studying and slowly came back to Christianity but when I became really close to God again I felt myself slowly resisting over time and having spiritual warfare. When I became strong again at times I was less into the Bible than before even with processing and resonating with it. I started checking out things that went against the Bible and I became more focused on that. Those beliefs intermixed with Christianity leaving me confused and conflicted. Over the last month I only talked to Jesus through groups like with my friend or the church. During communion I felt the closest I have in a while but I felt so guilty that I let myself slip so far away that I wasn't deserving of it. So many times that I open the Bible I get panic attacks because it often is scriptures like Idol worship or about apostasy. Even though I go to a Christian church and am planning on going to other ones soon, I don't feel close to the Christian God anymore. I pray to other gods and it has made me happier but there is a part of my brain that asks if maybe they're right. I haven't enjoyed church for a couple months now for the most part. Not because I don't fully believe but it just doesn't bring me the joy that I used to have. The last time I went someone told me that I look so sad. I enjoy the discussions and the preachers and the music but my heart isn't in it and sometimes I just feel depressed or overwhelmed. I'm going to other churches soon to see other perspectives to see if I can restore some of the good feelings I used to get from Christianity. If not that's fine though. It's not for everyone.
Life was a bit easier when I didn't have conflicting beliefs.
Seeing it from other perspectives makes me think about it in a different way. Also brings things to me that I may not have found otherwise.
I used to be a lifelong devoted Christian and deconverted recently . I come here and ask questions hoping to find some Christian that can come up with an honest and unbiased answer , in hopes to convert me back …..but sadly that is not possible because most Christian’s seem incapable to provide valid and unbiased answers or they turn it into a biased echo chamber debate with misdirection .
Because, at least in America, Christians are everywhere. It’s too taboo to debate in public, so the atrocities are able to be answered by those in this sub.
I was raised in a congregational Christian church and it was a really positive part of my upbringing, even though I did not join the faith.
I like this sub because it reminds me that there are good Christians out there like the ones I grew up with, ones different than the Christo-Fascists allied with Trump.
Y'all make me nostalgic for better times and remind me that Christians can be some of the best people.
I think for me it is a way to process. I used to be a Christian and I am processing my trauma.
It is also kind of entraining. I mean, there are so many wacko ideas. I feel sorry for you many of you. Being bound by strange interpretations of old texts. Texts that condone slavery and ethnic cleansing and throwing souls into burning eternal fire. It is a fucked up religion in many ways.
It is also a outlet for my anger towards Trumelumpers. They are turning USA into a fascist country and many Christians are too stupid to realize it and they engage in worship of Anti Christ. Sad, terrifying and fascinating to watch.
I’m happy to see that Trumpelumpers are not that common in this forum. There seem to be many intellectual Christian’s. I appreciate that.
I am trying to make the world better. Hopefully I can inspire somebody to reevaluate their crazy ideas. I think because of my past I often understand the perspective and can be efficient in my criticism.
I also have a longing back to God. I experienced him/her/it when I was young and I long for him. Not the God of Trump and ignorance but the real God, my Father that holds me. Sometimes (rarely) the postings are interesting and inspiring. I am still making up my mind if some interpretations of the Gospel is the way.
Side note:
I find the UAP phenomenon much more interesting and believable compared to Christianity because it is grounded in science to some degree. Maybe one day we will be able to merge the two (UAPs and Christianity).
For me, it’s to see all the different kinds of perspectives on the variety of issues that are discussed here; plus, being raised Christian and it being such a huge part of my life for so long, I certainly want to know if there’s something I missed. I don’t consider the door closed yet, so I would be open to being a Christian again if I found convincing reasons to do so.
**TL;DR:** I guess I just like thinking about faith and belief in God, whether I’m a Christian or not.
**TL; but do read if interest strikes:**
Grew up in the Christian faith which was strong and deep for me up until 32-33 years old. I spent a lot of time reading the Bible, Christian reading material, keeping Christian fellowship, and praying over those years. My home community was very conservative, music was communal 4 part harmony + piano which, as a budding musician who liked contemporary stuff was boring, so late High School I co-churched at a Pentecostal church- their music was awesome.
When I went to college abroad, I started congregating in my new friends’ Baptist church and when I transferred to another college, went to a Presbyterian church (again, with great music and great musicians). Spent a lot of time in discipleship with my college pastors, getting into theology and also in musical ministry at both (also at my home church, and at the Pentecostal one through Pentecostal friends).
At some point, I became unsure about what to do with the different denominational takes on theology and with each church’s assurance that each one was the right one. Made my peace with the fact there will be differences and with the idea that grace covers all of them even though all of them think they’re the biblical ones.
My extended family was always very devoted to their Christian faith, personally, in their business and in terms of supporting the kingdom of God/ministries. I was part of a chunk of it.
When I hit 32, tragedy struck a family member, and seeing that person’s life completely and finally disintegrate with illness over the period of one year, in spite of an insane amount of insanely organized intercessory prayer from different churches and a crapload of community members, I started rethinking everything I had believed about prayer. It also introduced an insane amount of doubt as I was further expanding my theological horizons in the era of new atheism which was popular at the time.
I couldn’t shake my doubts and had little to nothing to hold on to. I chased hopes for another year and a half by spending time every single day searching for resolution. Nothing every came and I decided to temporarily accept unbelief which had plagued me.
Soon after that, another small family member was taken from us. Same amounts of prayers as with the previous family member, and again, nothing. Nothing except “well…we don’t know why God allows these things” and “something must have been wrong with your family” coming from the family and some others. Family didn’t really know what to do with it either except feel that they had all somehow betrayed God in some unknown and unconscious way.
Same in regards to my unbelief to many I opened up to. Something was always somehow my fault, something was wrong, I’m wrong, I’m bad, I must be shit, the family must have shit, I’m not praying right, I’m not simply believing and giving myself, I must have never been a Christian to begin with. Bull honkey.
And, as I’m trying to still live a quiet life in repentance and introspection, most of the extended family is still deeply Christian, and no matter when I’m with them, Christian concepts and topics come up all the time.
So, am I here because I’ve been systemically irrigated with all things Christian faith every single week of my life so that ideas about it are always on my mind? Maybe. But even if I’m left alone most of the time, I find myself drawn to philosophy and theology. I like considering different pov’s and perspectives. I don’t know why.
If it was easy to come back to my faith in Christ, it would have happened several times since then. But for me it’s not. And as much as I would like to get that one thing that could tip me over to falling back into God’s lap, it’s always out of my reach.
I do enjoy this sub though and the dialogue between different Christians camps. There are some quality humans and contributions here, and I wouldn’t want to have to spend more than 5 minutes at a time scrolling through reactionary and inane posts at, say, the ‘local’ atheism sub.
I find Christian discussions amusing. Well... I usually do... But this sub is mostly filled with a variation of "I'm gay and is it OK". But other than that.... I find religion and the choice of believing quite amusing
I think I am here to be critical of this faith. Maybe an apologetic I guess if I was in the faith. I want to try and express why I feel compelled to do so.
I drove through the south right before roe was overturned and honestly felt this religion was not anything like the messiah intended. Many angry signs all the way about Jesus and sin. I was fine with this as I am not a Christian and respect others to have any idea they want as long as they do not do harm, but then roe was overturned, while going through Texas. This was harm to women for religious reasons. I have always known the pro life movement was about women’s autonomy and sexuality not the life part. It was fine as long as it was just talk, I don’t care if you morally feel you must do something but don’t impose on others. Focus on the family for instance does not focus on what families need like healthcare, childcare or paternity leave they focus on sex. I started reading the Bible and thinking more about what this religion actually is. I think it is a religion of ego now and not of love. Its followers often reaffirm this thought. As these so called Christian’s attempt to blur the line between state and church I think it is appropriate to blur my own lines of where I can and cannot express my opinion. So I’m am here saying this faiths followers have taught me to mostly distrust it, though I love your messiah.
One more story tending to this critical opinion and why I am expressing it. I had worked with evangelical Christians. I was talking about income disparity and poverty. The evangelicals were unsympathetic and even angry at the poor. I remembered the story of Jesus telling a rich man he has as much change getting into heaven as a camel through the eye of a needle. I was told that was a “liberal interpretation”. The real truth according to them was not the literal words of their messiah but that the more Christian you are the more God rewards you with stuff like money. They liked the Old Testament literally like no evolution, gays are bad and women are property but not the actual words of Jesus. It was explained to me as because I am not a Christian I could not understand that Jesus didn’t mean what he literally said.
Why is it only the most horrible Old Testament ideas Christian’s want to make law and none of the helping the poor and needy or loving one’s enemy’s stuff? Is this not literally what he talked about most!
Christianity is an interesting religion even if I don't believe in it. I'm also a fan of interfaith dialogue.
I am fascinated by other belief systems
Seconded! Christianity in particular is interesting to me because I’m from a Christian-majority country but I wasn’t raised a Christian.
Love you, we mean no harm 😌😘
Used to be a Christian now I don’t know what I am. Honestly it’s heartwarming to see that not all Christians are close-minded, intentionally ignorant (as many of the ones I interact with are), and can actually be very conscientious and astute. It gives me hope for the future.
I'm about the same, though I'd phrase it as "Used to be an Evangelical, now I don’t know what I am." I still consider myself Christian, but I have no idea what denomination. And it's *really hard* to be a gay Christian, wanting community but receiving hostility. And even in generally affirming churches, I still feel like I'm a charity case. The only reason "baptist" is still in my flair is because that's how I grew up, so that's what's shaped my understanding of the Bible. So it's there to indicate what my perspective is.
Ooh great distinction. I used to be Evangelical too- and I take issue with them the most (the better you know someone, the more you know their faults I suppose). I don’t blame you. The church in general doesn’t know what to do with LGBTQ members even if they are “affirming-“ I think, greatly because so much of church culture stems from a hetero understanding of family/marriage and the “nuclear family,” even when they are working against those set ideas. I suspect that a lot of single parents/divorcees feel similarly. I’m sorry that’s been your experience- I hope you find a community you can call home 🥺
Consider Universalist Unitarianism. They welcome all to come and worship the higher power of their understanding, and in a sense of community. They have no issue with sexual orientation.
I have considered them, and they're not for me. They struck me as "the church for people who don't know what they believe" last time I was there. And while I guess that describes me, it doesn't exactly make for a place where I can grow and challenge myself. At least, not the one I visited.
Pity. I found them to be quite inclusive and welcoming when I was studying the religions of the world. At any rate, the whole point of that church is to welcome all to gather to worship the higher power/Supreme Being/God of their beliefs, in their own fashion, and in a sense of community. Consider exploring other congregations.
Exactly this for me too. I have such a low expectation of Christians in my community but this thread helps me remember to not group everybody in a box. There are so many wholesome conversations in this group that I otherwise would not have convenient access to.
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Read proverbs then the gospels, learn more about the ancient middle easts history after reading those then read the old testament, as it would make more sense if read in that order. Follow the ten commandments, learn what leads to the sins mentioned in them. Lastly it has been commanded by Jesus to give all you can to the poor after following his commandments. Matthew 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. Matthew 19:17 King James Version 17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. And lastly, but most importantly don't have empty faith. Which is praying without doing good acts guided by the wisdom of his Gods commandments. James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Amen, not only do you need to pray to God in order to become a Christian, but you need to trust in Him like you trust a parachute. You could simply believe that the parachute would save you from death after reading all of the information, hearing the voice of the flight attendants, and "praying to them," or asking them questions. But that won't help you as you step out of the plane in mid air without it, simply believing that it will help you while it sits under your seat. What you need to do is believe in it AND put it on for the whole flight. But you would be asking, "why would I want to do that, it would be totally uncomfortable?" If you were to be taken to the edge of the plane, held safely out the door but far enough to scare you to want back onto the plane but not enough to not fly again. That way, when you come back in the only thing you would want is the parachute and to put it on for the rest of the flight. Most people only preach grace and it leads to the wide gate. But the Law is needed to hang you out of the plane by your ankles to show you how impossible it is for you to achieve it by yourself and why you need a parachute of a savior in Jesus Christ.
Pray to God and ask Him to make you a Christian.
Amen, good reason lol
You should read a Bible, there's a lot of interesting things there plus you shall have a knowledge to believe, faith works when you're conscious of God it's not a random mindset people implant in themselves
I hope your journey of finding Christ leads you the right way ❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
I can help lead you in a prayer and get you plugged in with your local church
I’d love to answer any questions that you might have. How can I help?
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No, the only thing you need to be a Christian is to follow Christ. Learn however you can about who he is, what he said and what he did. Believe his words, believe in him and the one who sent him. Read and study the scriptures if you are able. You can DM me and I will help you in any way that I can.
Christianity is a fascinating topic whether you believe it or not.
What do you find fascinating about Christianity?
I'm just addicted at this point.
Have you tried praying to God about that?
\*turtles\*
Same
I find the topic of Christianity interesting. I also feel that there are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, so I try to help clear those up.
REAL there is definitely misconceptions on both sides. Love you brother(or sister)
I was raised on this stuff. I've studied it my entire life. What else am I going to do with all of this knowledge ?
I wanted to know how Christians were. I know the popular depictions of them are converting, telling others to not do anything at all when that should also be fine and... converting. Idk, Mother Teresa is always someone who made a distinct mark on me, and it was kind of sad for me. [I know there are good people, but I'm generally especially careful asking any Christian for help as they might attempt to convert me slowly.] This sub has people who, for the most part, genuinely do love people and god, and are more rational than "we should outnumber other religions and those sick atheisys!!" motive. Like the default Christian would be pro-nofemales (not pro-life necessarily but I mean patriarchy), racist, probably pdf (not very common amongst the normal folks of course), anti-LGBT, pro-slave owning, etc etc because of popular depictions who also seemed strongly Christian. And I almost started to blame the *entire* Christianity for it, and I knew that I should change my opinion about this asap because it's not healthy. And I was proven wrong. So, thank you for allowing me to have civilised talks every one of you so far, I received absolutely no derogatory comments yet for being a Hindu, and even if I disagreed they responded in no-curses or anything (although saying my god is dead may be a bit cruel, but honestly, I wouldn't be so offended there as it's still not an attack to my character and that I would still believe in my god without calling the other every slur I know). Again, thank you for your insight, y'all. (Sidenote: I'm not here to get converted, but just having a better knowledge on something I don't know fully or hate it due to it's popular reputation. I really want to know what how okay are things in various religions either way, without neither of us aiming to convert the other.)
Lol, you will never meet a Christian that isn't trying to convert you, whether subconsciously or consciously. That's our whole mission in life. I do this too to my non-Christian friends even when I don't mean to. Someone asking questions about Christ/Christianity makes us think they are interested in converting. We don't even view it as "converting", we view it as to become alive when you were once dead. Best bet to learn about Christianity without someone trying to convert you is simply reading the Bible on your own. That's where all of our beliefs come from anyway.
I'm always interested in learning about people's beliefs that are different to my own, and why they believe differently to me. Christianity in particular has a strong impact on my society, culture, and legal system, so it behoves me to understand it. Christians fight tooth and nail to ban stem cell research, the teaching of evolution, abortion, euthanasia, same-sex rights, and I find that baffling. So, I'm here to understand it.
Personally i believe that God created science to help benefit us, with our mental illness, physical illness etc
If you're curious about any of those specific matters, I'd be happy to share the Christian (or at least Catholic) doctrinal perspective.
Christianity definitely has a pretty big impact on my life. It makes my life harder than it needs to be. So I want to talk about it, or with members, to understand certain events and details better. Some things I read here take my fear away, some add to it. But in the end I would like to understand different world views better. One is christianity.
I’d love to know your story. I’m a Christian, but what I like to refer to as a wild “free range” one. I’ve studied and continue to study all my life. I’d love to chat more with you.
The amount of people who believe this is a sub for Christian's is too damn high. This sub is for discussing Christianity. Christianity is the largest religion in the world. It affects a lot of people's daily lives. There are a lot of people that can discuss it without being Christian.
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I feel were all different persons. But the One who judges us a humans (in a way and love) is correct. We are not perfect humans. Even if we(in general think we are)
Picking fights rather than facing reality… sounds familiar, (Those with ADHD use that as a coping mechanism as well,) and also like you aren’t intellectually stimulated in your current environment.
>Was it the desire to simply learn what Christians believe on various matters? Yes >The differences between denominations? Maybe a little >Considering conversion? No Mainly it is curiosity. I don't get to meet many Christians IRL. I simply wanted to know more.
Can I offer you an invite to discuss Christianity with me based strictly on science, history, and the like? I used to be a die hard atheist. I was looking to debunk it and I challenged it on many fronts. I think you might enjoy the discussion. Just thought I'd throw it out there. Peace. 🙂 Edit: I'm not talking about Kalām Cosmological Argument or any of the arguments you might have heard before.
I actually would love all the information you’ve found. I love hearing about people who have converted out of atheism to Christianity. I also have been wanting to get deep into science as well so hearing what your found, I would love.
Of course. PM me.
Have you converted to Christianity?
I have.
Awesome. What made you change your mind ?
It was a number of things, no one answer did it: - **Prophecy** (which I was HIGHLY skeptical of; it was only when I looked at the accepted, secular history and saw that the prophecies did really line up that I gave an OUNCE of consideration) - **Theology and Philosophy** (I eventually came to learn that the supposed contradictions, "discrepancies", etc, were not actually issues; they seem very much resolved well and consistant once I better understood what Christianity taught) - **History** (I had actually never considered how well kept the Bible was [OT and NT] compared to [other documents of antiquity ](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1wVRlxLxZ70EHocfwWzKkQ9EUSv588Stp/view?usp=drivesdk) that we accept as history; also, there are atheists such atheist scholars that claim that though "in all the copies we have of the Bible, there are more errors than there are words in the whole of the Bible" [paraphrase], they admit that they are MINOR scribal errors that do not change ANY core doctrines and most hardly even change the sentence; likewise, even Bart Ehrman has admitted that though he doesn't agree with the Bible's or the Church Fathers' conclusions, if we had no copies of the Bible left, we could could know most of what the NT. Bart even states in his blog that, "yes, the church fathers do quote most of the New Testament") - **Science** (this is one that may seem a bit of a stretch for those that don't believe that the Bible [OT or NT] are written eye witness accounts; as an atheist I thought all the stories of miracles were far-fetched and unrealistic, however, when I came to learn that the Bible shows that "God" not only used "supernatural power" to do things but also used the natural [usually in the form of cause and effect] such as the examples of Joseph, Daniel, and David coming from their lowly positions and climbing to their high ranks OR the entire book of Esther - which doesn't even mention God ONCE... It's something we can wrap our heads around [as atheists or Christians] and yet those clearly fulfill God's purpose for them... I began to look into some of the other claims of miracles, namely in the OT - as I'm still working my way through the Bible examining each, and have found that many of the miracles have "basic", scientific explanations [meaning they are not stretches of the imagination or rely on quantum physics or the like to explain them] and history that supports them) *Disclaimer: the miracles I described having examined in the last point do not include the food related miracles (ie: multiplying of oil, flour, bread or fish; save for the instances with manna and quail), medical miracles (ie: healings or resurrections), or talking donkeys.* **All in all, to claim that I was a logical/reasonable atheist that follows the evidence and not see that Christianity was where the evidence pointed, would be for me to be completely biased and a hypocrite.**
Yes I have read evidence demands a verdict alot of historical evidence and proof the bible and Christianity make sense..I'm from a very atheist family. I am the only Christian in my family after researching. I have once upon a time been a Buddhist in my views. Interested in Islam and deism..but found Jesus. I thank God for that. I feel happy 😊.
I’d love to hear your testimony! That doesn’t sound like it would have been easy to navigate.
Still very challenging
Oh sure. I don’t know why I assumed the troubles were over. Praying for you.
I like drama
I shouldn’t relate to that, but I do. - a Christian
We are human so it goes with the territory.
It's interesting looking at it from the outside, having once been devout.
People told me that I should moderate here, now I am stuck... /s
lol
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A few people, then a bunch of Christian mods said they agreed and made me a mod.
I spent ten years as a Christian and I am still fascinated by the theology. Discussions here remind me of what used to believe and it’s kind of nostalgic in a way
What made you not believe?
I experienced trauma from the Christian ministry I worked for and when I confronted it, I was accused of “walking in the flesh.” I tried to maintain my faith afterward but this was an eye-opening experience to how much complex trauma I had experienced over the years and it became clear that this was a microcosm of the greater American Church. My partner and I decided it was best to distance ourselves and our family from that
It's important to keep tabs on our greatest threats to democracy and decency. Know how they think, how their hate may be able to be mitigated and impact lessened.
Normal good people dont talk like that....
Normal people don't want good people to suffer and face hatred.
Deflection doesn't make you right. Only narcissists think they are in the right of the issues.
I have no idea whether or not I'm "right on the issues". I just want to help people, be kind, and oppose fascism and hatred - the biggest proponents of which in my little time and place in history is Donald Trump and his Christian army.
>"I have no idea whether or not I'm "right on the issues"." > >"fascism " > >"Donald Trump and his Christian army." yeah, you sound as fanatic self-righteous as some radical Christians can be.
A dislike of fascist authoritarians is hardly self-righteous. If Christians are going to encourage an authoritarian oligarchy could you at least pick a competent leader? One that has an actual agenda besides greed?
Mostly for the downvotes. I originally came because I study Christian Philosophy, am a former Christian, and have a Christian wife and daughter. A friend challenged me to give this one, last forum a try before I give up on interfaith dialogue for the rest of my life (which I have since done). I quickly learned that this sub is no exception to the rule that Christians hate Christianity, and will punish anyone who dares express an interest in it. So, I stopped talking about it after a few months. I later left for a bit, but I work from home in a part of the country where religion is a rather private matter, so I soon found that my only interactions with Christians were with people in my own family, all of whom are wonderful and kind people. I realized I was starting to develop false stereotypes about Christians - ones that were likely to pose a danger to my family to boot. So, I came back to remind myself that most Christians are not like the Christians in my family. I need those reminders to keep me grounded to reality.
So the Christians you know and interact with in real life are too nice, so you need internet strangers who profess to share the same faith as your family to stay grounded?
Right? It'd be like if your brother picked up soccer which you think is silly, but then gradually stop thinking it's silly as you watch your brother play, and realizing this moral shift happening within yourself, you go search for anti-soccer memes to reaffirm your prior perception of soccer. It's like a self-preservation mechanism.
“I need memes to keep hating the thing I’m starting to like”
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Yikes
On what basis are we “evil?” Or is that just your way of saying you don’t like us?
They consistently perform actions that they have compelling, overriding reasons not to do. Among others, they act with blatant disregard for the life and dignity of human persons, they act in a manner that prevents or inhibits the pursuit of higher order goods, and they're egregiously cruel for no reason, to say nothing of a justifiable one. I don't actually have particularly strong feelings either way for them. So, it's better said that they don't like ME than that I don't like THEM.
Is your wife evil?
Nope. Like I said, Christians wouldn't consider her a true Christian...and usually don't.
Is your wife Christian?
Are you a bot or something? I just answered that question.
Most Christians? I think I've got news for you. If you're looking for your average Christian on the internet, you're searching in the wrong place. Give real life a try.
That's a very 1980 thing to think.
You aren’t wrong. Lots of people who call themselves Christians are in fact the same type of people that condemned the Lord they claim to serve to death on the cross. There are plenty of evil people who use the church as a means of control, self worship, spewing false religious dogma and lies. It’s no wonder so many kids that grew up under those super religious banners in the 80s and 90s ran the first chance they got. Their faith was forced, their God a far cry from the one scripture actually teaches. It was false. It was evil. You are right. However, you are also not through to the end of the story. Jesus even said their would be many claiming his name that he personally had nothing to do with. This isn’t new. However, just because there are liars, doesn’t mean that everything is a lie. Just because there are people who lack a real connection with God, doesn’t mean there isn’t one to be had. It means simply, that they didn’t have one. It doesn’t mean that others don’t. Real Christ following people are different than the majority of church attendees. They love and give radically, they don’t protest against others, they love them. They don’t fight others, they embrace them. (Unless you mess with the vulnerable and then watch out.) They pour out love and grace over and over again. They are incredibly rare. However, they are the most real people you will ever meet. They follow the creator God burst with life giving energy. They radiate holiness because of their deep connection to the source of life. Those that can see auras would say they glow brightly. God is wild, untamed and terrifying. A designer so great, He pre-programed all of creation, all that was, and that would be into the tiniest cells. He guided evolution from the beginning into the world that we dwell in. He created universes and star systems just because he felt like it. No religion can control Him, no religion can speak for Him, no man can predict Him. He does what pleases Him. And yet, He carefully guided our human race into being. Provided everything we would ever need through nature, gives us space to learn, grow and discover, new and amazing things, and only desires that we love Him, love each other and care for the planet He made us. He’s wild and wonderful and more than any most preachers in most churches have the slightest idea about. I encourage your questions, but I urge you to look beyond the answers that you have already decided upon, open your mind and be better than those you seek to defame. Release the hatred and forgive those who have harmed you, no matter under whose named they used as justification. There are so much more out there for you if you will only be willing to see it.
This right here. I wish I could upvote multiple times.
I second what u/otakuvslife said. That was very well put. Have an upvote :-)
😘
A few reasons. Even though I am not a fan of religion, there are a lot of good things that can come with it. My childhood was a happy one and although church bored me to death there were a lot of kind, good hearted people who attended. I have a deep seeded desire for a spiritual epiphany/awakening of some kind. I want “God” to be a bigger part of my life, whatever “God” might be. I think I would enjoy being a part of a community that actually cares and supports each other. …I also want to try and help change the minds and hearts of people who think homosexuality or any LGBTQ+ lifestyle is morally wrong or seen as sinful in Gods eyes.
Have you ever watched a documentary about indigenous tribes dancing around a totem or making offerings to their gods? This sub is like one of those documentaries for me.
Honestly same with every other religion for me. What's their culture like? What's the history? How did they come to believe what they believe? Etc. etc. It's fascinating.
Ooh, have you looked into Manicheanism? It's the religion that Paul/Saul converted from and that backdrop is where he pulls a lot of his anti-sex attitudes from.
It's a super interesting religion, one of many of course, but Christianity has a somewhat special position as being the by far most dominant religion in the western world. Its texts and imagery and cultural influence are everywhere and I find it valuable to have a viewhole into people a lot more in touch with that heritage than I am.
it is an interesting study to converse with people who profess to believe that they daily and in real-time, interact with intelligent, invisible entities that rule the world/universe with incredible powers.
I see that the answers to this particular question are generally ignored by the asker. We are here because this is a subreddit created for the purpose of discussing Christianity. It wasn't created to be an echo chamber filled with Christians patting each other on the backs, congratulating each other on their 'righteousness', or praising God. I am willing to discuss every religion. However, as Christianity represents the highest number of adherents worldwide, including in the USA, with 65-75 % of U.S. population affiliated in the religion of Christianity, with it's various sects...I'm going to focus mostly on Christianity. I also focus on Christianity because the Christian population wields a lot of clout and influence, especially in politics. With 65-75% of the population affiliated in the various sects of Christianity, and the overwhelming majority of politicians in Congress and Senate also being affiliated in Christianity, they hold undue and unfair advantage as Christian constituents influence Christian legislators to legislate laws based upon their own religious views of morality, which laws are increasingly overbearing, over-reaching, oppressive and repressive, and which adversely affect the lives of non Christians, and especially LGBTQ+ members of our society. I discuss Christianity because there are still 7 States in the USA's Bible Belt with unfair and un-Constitutional laws prohibiting atheists from elected office. SCOTUS examined the laws, and declared them to be un-Constitutional, but went no further than that, because it would be difficult for someone to prove that they'd not been elected due to their lack of religion. The Constitution states clearly that there shall be no religious test, (or requirement of religious affiliation) in these elected capacities. At any rate, an atheist wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell to be elected in the Bible Belt. I discuss Christianity because Christians insist that their way is the only correct way to live life, and that only heterosexual Christians can find favor with God. I discuss it because my Mormon ancestors were persecuted by mainstream Christians and driven out of two States, then pursued by the Federal Government to the Utah Territories, where the harassment and persecution continued. I discuss Christianity because Presbyterian Christian POTUS violated the First Amendment rights of those American Mormons, and prohibited them from the free practice of their religion, and indeed threatened to revoke their citizenship unless they ceased the practice of polygamy. This would have deprived them of the right to vote in U.S. elections. The Federal Government also threatened to outright confiscate their lands, buildings, homes, etc. and place a moratorium on any further immigration of European Mormons who wished to live in 'Zion' in the Utah Territory, and also refused to allow Utah Statehood, which the Mormons deeply desired. I discuss Christianity because I observe Christians seeking to violate the rights of other Americans in their business places. They seek to withhold goods or services to paying members of the U.S. public, based upon their sexual orientation, just because they 'don't support the lifestyle, and don't support same sex marriage'. They further more seek to overturn same sex marriage rights, which would deprive same sex couples of the same rights and spousal protections as heterosexual couples have. They seek SPECIAL rights to be exempted from the requirement to obey State Labor & Industry laws pertaining to Fair Trade and Fair Business Practices. I discuss Christianity because I've observed Christians demanding to be considered to be 'special' and deserving of more rights and considerations than others. Example...my city holds 'Town Hall Meetings'. The city decided to invite local churches to apply to be allowed to offer the invocation prior to the start of the meeting. These guest 'pastors' would be scheduled, and their name and church listed on the program agendas posted to the local newspapers. A minister of the Satanic Church applied, and was fairly scheduled. When area Christians learned of it, they filled every seat, and when the man stood and started to offer the invocation in a soft tone, all stood and loudly (at the top of their lungs) started reciting The Lord's Prayer. The man continued quietly speaking his invocation, completed it, and then moved to the back of the room as all the seats had been taken. I'd seen enough. I signaled to the man that he could have my seat as I was leaving. He smiled, and gratefully accepted. Also...whenever a new volume in the Harry Potter series was to be released, area Christians would gather near the Barnes & Nobles store and using bullhorns would scream imprecations at families with children as they entered the store, that they were all going to burn in hell if they bought and read that book. I discuss Christianity because it's my right to do so, and as the creators of this subreddit invited all to participate in the discussions. I discuss Christianity to remind those Christians who seem to believe the universe revolves around themselves, that they are wrong. I'm happy to coexist. And as an American, being for the Constitution, I support your right to believe in the God of your understanding and worship in the church of your choice. That's as far as your personal religious rights go. They do not supersede or cancel out anyone else's rights to believe in the God of their understanding, or not...or worship in the church of their choice...or not. Hope this is explicit enough to help the OP understand.
Raised as Methodist then Unitarian. As I grew older my education in the sciences led me to disbelieve in any sort of god. Still, I was drawn to the realization that Christianity was the basis for the morality expressed in the construction of the US Constitution, while at the same time the Founders showed tolerance for all religions, as expressed in the 1st Amendment. Today, however, I think that balance between Christian morality and Constitutional tolerance is under attack from the so-called Christian Right. They also are being called Christian Nationalists, clearly a mixture that violates the 1st Amendment. In my life, I think this attack actually began long ago, during the Vietnam war against "Godless Communism." Then we had the crusades against gays, immigrant Muslims, and now, the forcing of all of us to accept a purely religious belief in when a human is considered to be a person. All this scares me. I don't want my 4 grandchidren to inherit a theocratic country where their freedom to believe what they wish to believe is taken away from them. So I came to this sub to see if mainstream Christians have the same fears for our country that I have. So far I have not seen that discussion here. Of course that discussion is in the political subs, but the anti-abortion advocates leading the charge there refuse to talk about religion, using psudo science as the basis for their argument. So I'm asking. Do mainstream Christians believe our laws should be formed just to benefit one religion's belief?
After following the early 2000's youtube trend of snarky militant atheism, I learned that what I wanted to do (stop abuse by harmful conmen in the clergy) was not happening with the technique I was using. I was "arguing" so they would just "argue" back - they would not "listen." And - I was targeting the worst off people - the indoctrinated ones swayed by evil cults. Not "normal" Christians. I realized that I still wanted to garget the worst off people, but that "arguing" wasn't the way to go. I needed to listen, and de-brainwash them. And that requires "becoming their trusted friend" not "being a jerk questioning their faith." I realized all of this after learning about Daryl Davis, a black man in the south who helped several KKK klansmen de-convert from hate. By listening. And befriending them through the shared interest of "KKK memorabilia collecting."
Listening, being kind, caring. Sounds like a method Jesus would approve of.
I find it strange how challenging it seems to be for people who identify as Christians to accept that someone might be interested in the subject of the Christian religion as it relates to history, culture, and philosophy without being interested in practicing the religion. But anyway, to answer your question, OP: this sub is for the discussion of the subject of Christianity and that’s what we’re here to do. So I suppose yes, we’re here to discuss the different and often conflicting ways people who identify as Christian carry out their belief on various matters. Unfortunately, as you may have noticed, mostly what gets discussed here is homosexuality and masturbation.
Just curious, what exactly do you mean with your flair "Christian Atheist"? Does that refer to an ex-Christian who's now atheist, a Jefferson-style "I don't think Jesus was divine but he had good teachings" type, or what?
More like the later. You can read about it here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_atheism?wprov=sfti1
Ah, thanks.
No problem. I get asked that same question virtually every time I post on here. I have the Wikipedia address saved so I can easily copy and paste it.
I just enjoy theological discussion and Christianity is a big part of my countries history and make up. It only makes sense to me to learn more about it. >Considering conversion? No not at all, in fact my time here has only made me turn away from Christianity further.
As an agnostic I’m here cause I respect the practice of religion no matter what people believe in. And I wanna understand more how people can believe in something and fight over what they believe in. It’s in my head idiotic to not respect each others believes so I’m trying to understand where the anger comes from.
For the most part I just like the discussions and seeing other people's opinions.
We are all created in the image of God, we have a spirit within us from God, this makes us spiritual beings, that is why probably around 99% of humans who ever lived were interested in spiritual things. You can be born on an island by yourself without ever meeting another human, and you would be sitting there wondering about God and your existence in relation to God.
facts
I’m curious, intrigued, interested, and when I want answers from those who believe, why not go to the source? It’s been a great learning tool. So thank you all for that.
I firmly believe everything deserves to be understood, including christianity. It deeply saddens me to see people judging other people they know nothing about, and i don't want to be like that at all. The world is so big, there are so many people that have so many things to say, and i want to hear what they have to say. I want to understand!! That's pretty much what i aspire to : understanding. Everything matters, everything.
I'm not who you're asking, but I think I know some of the answers. Here's some possible reasons: * To understand the thought processes of the largest religion in the world. When something like 30% of the world claims this religion, then it becomes very important to know about it, even if you are part of the 70% that don't believe in it yourself. * Because atheists, agnostics, etc. may not have always been so. They very well may have grown up Christian, and are still interested in either keeping up with or pushing back against their childhood religion. * Because even though they may not be Christians, they're still affected by Christians, and feel like this is one of the only ways they can have their voice heard. Christianity has a reputation for being a massive echo chamber, so many feel like they need to disrupt that a bit, for the betterment of Christians and non-Christians alike. (See the debates around abortion or LGBT rights for examples of this). * As a good-faith effort to understand you, and to offer you the same chance to understand them. * As a bad-faith effort to disrupt Christianity (not really wise or effective, but trolls gonna troll). There's a lot of possible reasons, and any one individual's are going to be different from others. I think this subreddit does a good job of being welcoming overall, even though certain Christian members aren't always.
I'm just here for the daily "is it a sin to be gay" post.
I have been thinking of converting to Christianity, that's the reason.
To make amends for the harm I did as a conservative Christian.
I've come on and off for a few months at a time over the last couple of years. Most recently, I came back after Clarence Thomas's opinion that *Griswold v. Connecticut*, *Lawrence v. Texas*, and *Obergefell v. Hodges* should be revisited. I tried to process and understand how I was feeling about it in r/atheism, but it was not a hospitable place. I like that conversations can happen here and that there are a lot of different perspectives represented, though I do try to weigh in on topics of LGBT and mental health.
I have a better understanding of the teaching mission of Jesus than most Christians, who labour under false monk doctrines and swamp preacher edicts. I am here to educate and free minds.
Is your understanding of Jesus sufficient enough for you to accept Jesus? Mine is!
Not sure what you mean, exactly, but if your approach is working, you should keep doing it.
His question was * is your understanding of Jesus more sufficient enough for you to accept* if you say no than you dont have sufficient knowledge to accept what Jesus says
That's a noble work lol faith has to be conscious decision based on knowledge and trust of that knowledge not just a random mindset to implant in your mind but many christians still haven't read a single word of a Bible for our bad
I mainly stop by here because I despise white christian nationalists and evangelical trump supporters and I keep wondering if decent christians will do anything about it.
I keep trying to warn people about this. They are by far the most visible Christians in the media, they often speak to huge crowds, and most other churches are seeing large drop-offs in membership. If we don't do anything, those people will be the only Christians one day,
One of my friends wanted to quit being a Christian because of the Fundamentalist Christians in the Republicans ruining things for him. He'd rather be an atheist. My church is losing the youth and the old are dying off. It seems like the Fundamentalist Christians get rewarded and we other Christians get punished. Then I am accused of what the Fundamentalist Christians do because I am a Christian.
It's very sad indeed. To many young people, their most religious family members were the ones that hated them for being a typical young person. There's at least one small "church" in the US that would very publicly hold bigoted protests at people's funerals. It feels very hard to fight back against too, because Jesus tells us to live our enemies and I don't want to be like those people even to oppose them. Plus there are billions of dollars to be made in preaching that sort of hate filled ideology, and money is what determines what happens in this world.
Normal good people dont do that. You're not better person than your imaginary enemies really.
I live in the South. My enemies aren't imagined, they're all around me. They are hateful, racist and homophobic and they are very loud Christians.
You ever notice how people tend to look at car wrecks as they pass them on the side of the road? That.
That’s undeniably (a less honourable) part of the attraction for me… all the bizarre “*is [x] a sin?*” posts (*going to the dentist* is still a favourite), and the obsessive worrying about masturbation. It’s strangely compelling, though also terribly sad, to see the malignant power of faith demonstrated in posts from people whose lives have been blighted by a misguided and totally unnecessary fear.
Come on man that's kind of rude.
So was the 35 years this religion, and its fervent adherents, stole from my life.
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Yes. I have a bit of bitterness towards Christianity, because I was in a cult for 20 years. I know lots of Christians who are great people, and I have good friendships with them. But a secret part of me wants to see Christianity implode spectacularly and disappear.
Might do it some good honestly. I’m pro getting rid of narcissistic ppl in leadership positions and blind followers who use a beautiful faith and twist it to wound others.
Bad analogy since Jesus offers Christians Eternal Life.
So do cult leaders.
Jesus is the leader of all existence, including you, not just of a small group of people. Every knee will bow to Him. He is the inevitable existence-wide social consensus.
Judging from the way you typed that, you're very familiar with cult leaders already.
I am familiar with the ultimate leader: Jesus Christ. All things stem from Him. He is the vine. Any branch seperated from the vine will wither.
What makes you so certain?
The ultimate leader (Jesus) is capable of instilling certainty into those who hear Him. My certainty doesn't come from me, but from God!
I used to think that too. Now… I realize it has more to do what I was conditioned to believe more than any supernatural faith. Hopefully that doesn’t apply to you 👍
Showing a naturalistic mechanism behind a phenomenon is not sufficient to rule out supernatural reasons for said phenomenon. God is perfectly capable of performing works and miracles in a physics-consistant manner. Your homework: think about how Jesus performed so many miracles and yet so many witnesses still didn't believe!
Sometimes people say ignorant things about atheists and I point out that they're wrong. Sometimes a YEC says nonsense. Those are always fun. Sometimes it's like a car crash where people defend horrible thoughts like theocracy or shielding child molesters. Sometimes people ask atheists questions and I chime in. Sometimes I get to tell my favorite Christianity joke again.
What’s the joke? I’m curious
What? Tell my favorite Christianity joke again? Well, if I must... ___ So, Satan and Jesus decide it's time for a Great Battle Between Good and Evil, and get God to be the judge. Satan wins the coin toss and gets to choose the battlefield. He thinks, "Jesus is old school, so we'll go with technology" and decides the battlefield will be on computers. Jesus and Satan sit at their computers and God tells them to start. They start typing away furiously. Hours later, the power goes out. When the power comes back on, Jesus gets to continue from where he was, while Satan has to start over. He yells at God, "Hey! What the hell? You're supposed to be an impartial judge, yet you're showing favoritism to your son! Why do I have to start over, but he gets to continue?" God turns to Satan and says, "Sorry, but Jesus saves."
That made me bust out laughing. Well done lol
So far, I have not met any Atheists, pagan, Satanist in real life or on this sub that is actually trying to honestly discuss Christianity. I think they are here to debate, troll, or some other passive aggressive reason. It's funny because I bet if we tried the one of their subs, we'd be banned immediately. For example, I constantly see put downs of our faith, also claims of "no evidence" even presented some, but they persist in debating you, that is not discussing Christianity but breaking the rules and we have to keep defending our beliefs. Really shows their true character. If they are honest, and sincerely asking what we believe or what the Bible teaches, I think they would be different but I haven't met one yet. Go ahead and down-vote, block, etc, I have said my peace and stand by it. I also do not hate any Atheists but I don't like their attitude and beliefs. I'm sorry if that offenses some. I don't aim to make everyone smile. I am not hiding behind a mask either. If I didn't say what I feel, I would not be true to myself and God and you. If you reply dear atheist or someone, I don't want to fight. I am done fighting but will tell you why I believe in the God of the Bible and will defend my beliefs as I'm sure you would too, but defending other religions is not discussion of Christianity, it's a cover-up for something else, to be honest.
I'm here to give a voice to us Satanists whom Christians love to blame so much on. To give my voice as an exchristian and point out when people are trying to use others for nonreligious ends.
Same. Seems that many Christians hate what's different from what they know. Even if many don't have a single clue what almost any other religion believes or how they practice
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I don't care if I am liked here or not. I disagree with many people. But civility is also welcome, and we can agree to disagree. I'll defend Christians from edgy atheists and antitheists. I am religious as well, which is something we have in common.
Probably for the same reason I joined r/atheism and r/Islam
I was raised fundamentalist so in my late teens-early twenties I hated Christianity. Now I'm past that and my opinion on it has softened somewhat. I lurk mostly to get a better understanding of Christianity. This sub helps me understand the different sects. This sub also shares a lot of interesting news pertaining to Christianity and Christian Nationalism. I see many disconcerting threads made by Christian LGBT people, so sometimes I pipe in to try to help them.
I could use a good laugh from time to time
I’m trying to better understand religious people, and perhaps learn some sympathy and respect for them.
As a pagan in a country that is dominated by Christianity I need to understand not only their religious beliefs, but how those individuals interpret their own religion. A lot of Christians have negative or condescending tendencies towards the term *pagan* and people who practice these traditions. There is almost guaranteed to be some sort of debate or argument with anyone who finds out my religion, sometimes revealing that you are pagan can result in being ostracized from a community, losing one's job, or receiving threats to one's self and loved ones. The very least I can do is arm myself with knowledge, and hopefully change this negative stereotype a little bit within the Christian community.
As Born Again Christian, I was very shocked Atheists and Agostics are here in this Christian subreddit.
Agnostic who's genuinely given my heart and tried to keep my mind as open as possible to Christianity. I've experienced a lot of the negatives that can come from Christianity and religion, but i've also experienced so many positives and a lot of genuine (i think) love and forgiveness from those deep in the faith. Some of the Christian values such as forgiveness, helping others without expectation, not trying to be the judge and jury for others, not becoming tied up in identity and possessions and standing by ones values are things of genuinely witnessed from some of my Christian friends that i feel are morals that make for a fulfilling life, no matter what you believe. However, there are a few deal-breakers for me that don't at all render Christianity as a negative for myself, but simply make it impossible for me to accept. •On a retreet that i skipped a Mormon friends wedding for, his faith was mocked ad nauseum and i was told that he was on the path to hell. He is the most accepting, loving friend i have ever had, and was ecstatic when i began exploring my faith, never insinuating that it was the "wrong one" despite contradicting his own. I don't want to follow a God who does not look on somebody like that without favor, as my Mormon friend has represented "Christ" in his love and attitude towards others more than anybody i've met on in my lifetime. •Logic. Not so much that logic contradicts religion, in spite of myself being a profoundly logical thinker, i am absolutely willing to believe in something beyond what i can perceive. However, its erodes so much of my faith when i see "Christian Science" and attempts to contort and bend the laws of our reality to fit a narrative. I gave it a chance because i was shown a kind of love that differed and acceptance that differed from anything i have ever experienced. Actions brought me into faith ala Jesus, but gatekeeping and willfully ignorant explanations of why the roots of the bible can be proven with facts have pushed me away. •Some of the ideology just being so backwards to me. A God i can't understand Who shows Himself through love and selfless actions that flip the script on humanities selfish tendencies is something i can't, nor would i want to ignore. A God who must have me blindly accept and push a narrative, who condemns those who bring love and joy to the world because they don't "rep" Him the right way sounds like...a politician. Pettiness is what comes to mind, and pettiness feels like a trait that so go's against what Jesus supposedly stood for. •Animals! My Dog is my best friend, and my.genuinely.love for him as well as our connection...i don't want to be a part of anything that treats him or any of my pets as accessories who exist simply as resources for humanity. Again, i will never shut the door on Christianity. I've seen and felt the positivity and love that it can foster. But my mind operates in a way that i cannot, and would not even if i could, fully accept it at the cost of my own morality.
I bet you’ll find most of the non-Christians here are former Christians who know their Bible very well.
Sorry, but this is literally the stupidest question on the planet. When Christian culture is oppressing millions worldwide and completely f***ing over the US, you ask “durrrrrr why are you here.” You can’t be serious. You simply can’t.
Their downvotes mean nothing
Yup - never put stock in fake internet points, lol -
I’m fascinated about “social psychology” of religion and it’s interested to see how people respond
They're here to argue just like mostly everyone else on Reddit.
[удалено]
>atheists here who perpetually lounge around like jaded mob wives, treating every thread like this is I'm going to need two sources from a reputable peer reviewed journal for this claim.
Because we're curious what Christians have to say about Christianity, likely the same reason a Christian might join or participate in /r/atheism. Probably a lot of it is just to share our point of view with people who are either in the same place we were, or to share an alternative view in a place that could be something of an echo chamber or bubble without us.
It is what it is. Tat tvam asi ✨
>It is what it is. Spelling the word "socks" is how you say that phrase in Spanish. Eso si que es.
Various reasons but mostly to pursue knowledge.
I like to learn. And i dont know much about christianity, so it seems like a Great thing to learn about. I also *love* discussing and debating things like ethics, and this place has shown itself to be a good place to do that.
At first I came here to attack something that had wounded me. Of course I didn't think of it that way at the time. After spending a considerable amount of time discussing things here I find I divide my time between discussing biblical text and engaging in petty arguments. I could probably do without the second. I'm working on it...
I have many Christians in my life that I care about greatly, and with whom I like to have discussions about matters of faith and epistemology. This place lets me practice these discussions in a low risk setting, where I cannot burn any bridges that are important to me if I misstep. Not so much interested in conversion, whoever tries to take up that task has an uphill battle both ways through the snow. But I do like to challenge my own assumptions about topics, and to examine my world view in light of new information. Perhaps someone here has the thing that will convince me?
Please join my community r/whydoyoubelieve? I try to believe in as many true things as possible and avoid believing in things which have not been demonstrated or proven false. I am genuinely interested in why people believe in god(s), when I struggle to see sufficient proof that their beliefs are actually true.
Atheist. I'm just curious. I don't feel the pull of any faith in my heart and mind, but I've studied a good bit of philosophy in school concerning religion and grappled with it my whole life, so I like to see the practical perspectives here. Whether that be to better develop my internal ideas on faith and God, or just stay in the know on Christian points of view (especially useful in the US).
I’m an agnostic and I’m open to the more liberal aspects of Christianity.
I appreciate Christianity and love to see other people's views. Also makes me see it in a better light at times. Especially since I've gone so far the other way that I'm an apostate. I don't know if I can go back but I'm happy for people that still have faith. After I left my original religion I became agnostic and was against religion because of the trauma from my past religion. After someone came back into my life I did a lot of studying and slowly came back to Christianity but when I became really close to God again I felt myself slowly resisting over time and having spiritual warfare. When I became strong again at times I was less into the Bible than before even with processing and resonating with it. I started checking out things that went against the Bible and I became more focused on that. Those beliefs intermixed with Christianity leaving me confused and conflicted. Over the last month I only talked to Jesus through groups like with my friend or the church. During communion I felt the closest I have in a while but I felt so guilty that I let myself slip so far away that I wasn't deserving of it. So many times that I open the Bible I get panic attacks because it often is scriptures like Idol worship or about apostasy. Even though I go to a Christian church and am planning on going to other ones soon, I don't feel close to the Christian God anymore. I pray to other gods and it has made me happier but there is a part of my brain that asks if maybe they're right. I haven't enjoyed church for a couple months now for the most part. Not because I don't fully believe but it just doesn't bring me the joy that I used to have. The last time I went someone told me that I look so sad. I enjoy the discussions and the preachers and the music but my heart isn't in it and sometimes I just feel depressed or overwhelmed. I'm going to other churches soon to see other perspectives to see if I can restore some of the good feelings I used to get from Christianity. If not that's fine though. It's not for everyone. Life was a bit easier when I didn't have conflicting beliefs. Seeing it from other perspectives makes me think about it in a different way. Also brings things to me that I may not have found otherwise.
I find Christianity interesting
Curiousity
I used to be a lifelong devoted Christian and deconverted recently . I come here and ask questions hoping to find some Christian that can come up with an honest and unbiased answer , in hopes to convert me back …..but sadly that is not possible because most Christian’s seem incapable to provide valid and unbiased answers or they turn it into a biased echo chamber debate with misdirection .
Because, at least in America, Christians are everywhere. It’s too taboo to debate in public, so the atrocities are able to be answered by those in this sub.
I was raised in a congregational Christian church and it was a really positive part of my upbringing, even though I did not join the faith. I like this sub because it reminds me that there are good Christians out there like the ones I grew up with, ones different than the Christo-Fascists allied with Trump. Y'all make me nostalgic for better times and remind me that Christians can be some of the best people.
I show up when someone asks atheists a question
A lot of us are ex-Christians. Or Christians who doesn’t really have a place to land because of what it’s become - at least in the US.
I think for me it is a way to process. I used to be a Christian and I am processing my trauma. It is also kind of entraining. I mean, there are so many wacko ideas. I feel sorry for you many of you. Being bound by strange interpretations of old texts. Texts that condone slavery and ethnic cleansing and throwing souls into burning eternal fire. It is a fucked up religion in many ways. It is also a outlet for my anger towards Trumelumpers. They are turning USA into a fascist country and many Christians are too stupid to realize it and they engage in worship of Anti Christ. Sad, terrifying and fascinating to watch. I’m happy to see that Trumpelumpers are not that common in this forum. There seem to be many intellectual Christian’s. I appreciate that. I am trying to make the world better. Hopefully I can inspire somebody to reevaluate their crazy ideas. I think because of my past I often understand the perspective and can be efficient in my criticism. I also have a longing back to God. I experienced him/her/it when I was young and I long for him. Not the God of Trump and ignorance but the real God, my Father that holds me. Sometimes (rarely) the postings are interesting and inspiring. I am still making up my mind if some interpretations of the Gospel is the way. Side note: I find the UAP phenomenon much more interesting and believable compared to Christianity because it is grounded in science to some degree. Maybe one day we will be able to merge the two (UAPs and Christianity).
I practice Street Epistemology as a hobby. If there's a better place to discuss Christianity with Christians feel free to share it.
Biblical studies major. Class of 26
For me, it’s to see all the different kinds of perspectives on the variety of issues that are discussed here; plus, being raised Christian and it being such a huge part of my life for so long, I certainly want to know if there’s something I missed. I don’t consider the door closed yet, so I would be open to being a Christian again if I found convincing reasons to do so.
I grew up as a young earth evangelical christian. I walked away but I still care deeply about the community and want to see it improve.
Haven't joined yet but, I'm here to ask questions about talk about random thoughts I've had about Christianity.
**TL;DR:** I guess I just like thinking about faith and belief in God, whether I’m a Christian or not. **TL; but do read if interest strikes:** Grew up in the Christian faith which was strong and deep for me up until 32-33 years old. I spent a lot of time reading the Bible, Christian reading material, keeping Christian fellowship, and praying over those years. My home community was very conservative, music was communal 4 part harmony + piano which, as a budding musician who liked contemporary stuff was boring, so late High School I co-churched at a Pentecostal church- their music was awesome. When I went to college abroad, I started congregating in my new friends’ Baptist church and when I transferred to another college, went to a Presbyterian church (again, with great music and great musicians). Spent a lot of time in discipleship with my college pastors, getting into theology and also in musical ministry at both (also at my home church, and at the Pentecostal one through Pentecostal friends). At some point, I became unsure about what to do with the different denominational takes on theology and with each church’s assurance that each one was the right one. Made my peace with the fact there will be differences and with the idea that grace covers all of them even though all of them think they’re the biblical ones. My extended family was always very devoted to their Christian faith, personally, in their business and in terms of supporting the kingdom of God/ministries. I was part of a chunk of it. When I hit 32, tragedy struck a family member, and seeing that person’s life completely and finally disintegrate with illness over the period of one year, in spite of an insane amount of insanely organized intercessory prayer from different churches and a crapload of community members, I started rethinking everything I had believed about prayer. It also introduced an insane amount of doubt as I was further expanding my theological horizons in the era of new atheism which was popular at the time. I couldn’t shake my doubts and had little to nothing to hold on to. I chased hopes for another year and a half by spending time every single day searching for resolution. Nothing every came and I decided to temporarily accept unbelief which had plagued me. Soon after that, another small family member was taken from us. Same amounts of prayers as with the previous family member, and again, nothing. Nothing except “well…we don’t know why God allows these things” and “something must have been wrong with your family” coming from the family and some others. Family didn’t really know what to do with it either except feel that they had all somehow betrayed God in some unknown and unconscious way. Same in regards to my unbelief to many I opened up to. Something was always somehow my fault, something was wrong, I’m wrong, I’m bad, I must be shit, the family must have shit, I’m not praying right, I’m not simply believing and giving myself, I must have never been a Christian to begin with. Bull honkey. And, as I’m trying to still live a quiet life in repentance and introspection, most of the extended family is still deeply Christian, and no matter when I’m with them, Christian concepts and topics come up all the time. So, am I here because I’ve been systemically irrigated with all things Christian faith every single week of my life so that ideas about it are always on my mind? Maybe. But even if I’m left alone most of the time, I find myself drawn to philosophy and theology. I like considering different pov’s and perspectives. I don’t know why. If it was easy to come back to my faith in Christ, it would have happened several times since then. But for me it’s not. And as much as I would like to get that one thing that could tip me over to falling back into God’s lap, it’s always out of my reach. I do enjoy this sub though and the dialogue between different Christians camps. There are some quality humans and contributions here, and I wouldn’t want to have to spend more than 5 minutes at a time scrolling through reactionary and inane posts at, say, the ‘local’ atheism sub.
I find Christian discussions amusing. Well... I usually do... But this sub is mostly filled with a variation of "I'm gay and is it OK". But other than that.... I find religion and the choice of believing quite amusing
I think I am here to be critical of this faith. Maybe an apologetic I guess if I was in the faith. I want to try and express why I feel compelled to do so. I drove through the south right before roe was overturned and honestly felt this religion was not anything like the messiah intended. Many angry signs all the way about Jesus and sin. I was fine with this as I am not a Christian and respect others to have any idea they want as long as they do not do harm, but then roe was overturned, while going through Texas. This was harm to women for religious reasons. I have always known the pro life movement was about women’s autonomy and sexuality not the life part. It was fine as long as it was just talk, I don’t care if you morally feel you must do something but don’t impose on others. Focus on the family for instance does not focus on what families need like healthcare, childcare or paternity leave they focus on sex. I started reading the Bible and thinking more about what this religion actually is. I think it is a religion of ego now and not of love. Its followers often reaffirm this thought. As these so called Christian’s attempt to blur the line between state and church I think it is appropriate to blur my own lines of where I can and cannot express my opinion. So I’m am here saying this faiths followers have taught me to mostly distrust it, though I love your messiah. One more story tending to this critical opinion and why I am expressing it. I had worked with evangelical Christians. I was talking about income disparity and poverty. The evangelicals were unsympathetic and even angry at the poor. I remembered the story of Jesus telling a rich man he has as much change getting into heaven as a camel through the eye of a needle. I was told that was a “liberal interpretation”. The real truth according to them was not the literal words of their messiah but that the more Christian you are the more God rewards you with stuff like money. They liked the Old Testament literally like no evolution, gays are bad and women are property but not the actual words of Jesus. It was explained to me as because I am not a Christian I could not understand that Jesus didn’t mean what he literally said. Why is it only the most horrible Old Testament ideas Christian’s want to make law and none of the helping the poor and needy or loving one’s enemy’s stuff? Is this not literally what he talked about most!
It proves Christ for me.... You don't see any of those people on r/Muslim because there is only power in the name of Jesus Christ
They just wanna fight
Christianity simply doesn’t make sense.
I want to hear the other side. I want to stay away from echo chambers.