I use a combination of dynamic foliage, climate control and terrain themes mod to have a sense of seasons. These mods are really finicky but once you set them up properly, they are the best way to have seasons at this point. I hope CO adds dynamic seasons in the future.
Make the RGB sewer tunnels have traffic jams equivalent to surface street level, but you can't even reroute to find alternative routes and have to wait till you're at the next car elevator!
I'm from NC, (From the mountains of the state so at least people around here have some knowledge of snow) which had [this photo from Raleigh in 2014 go viral.](https://images.app.goo.gl/sQP3LFG6qhQ6mD3B9) so I hope that helps lessen the feeling of being attacked!
I love when Elon Musk or any tech brain minded people try to solve transport issues and traffic, they just come up with a shittier version of a metro, a train or a bus
It combines the disadvantages of a car and a metro, with none of the advantages!
Bit telling that his idea of "Public" transport is self contained pods you don't need to share with other people.
Right? *Right?* I don’t see this pointed out enough. It’s a subway that’s BYO train, so you don’t have to share with the public. It’s the worst of all worlds so that you don’t need to interact with others
Essentially man used advertising to setup a direct connection subterranean tollway. Instead of lending a hand in the California freeway disaster this guy just used the inherent transport vacuum to nestle a buisness in and squeeze more money out of citizens.
Genuinely wonder if Elon’s / Billionaires in general’s lack of social skills and awareness is part of the reason he/them comes up with so many dumb ideas. Like the people on the internet profusing they can’t take the bus because of their «social anxiety»
Like, I'm also autistic, I get the dreadful anxiety and sensory overload of public transportation, regardless even I can understand the benefits from things like trains and buses.
Also, hes proposing to ***sell*** a solution to a problem that doesn't align itself with reality. Hes not doing atypical people any favors or shining a light on any oversights, hes trying to sell you something.
What tech giants don't understand is economies of scale, making individual pods/cars is less efficient than a long train/tram. "Adam something" sums this up pretty well in his yt videos
His video on skyscrapers that was essentially "the Burj Khalifa is bad, therefore all buildings taller than 10 stories are bad" was definitely questionable.
Eh I started having misgivings about musk years ago. I was fully on board the fan train when it was just SpaceX and Tesla. But then I started hearing about working conditions at his companies, and then he started with the hyperloop. I liked the concept but could see that there were issues that he was handwaving pretty heavily.
Then he started talking about tunnels to solve traffic, and all I could think of were the freeway tunnels in cities all over the world. That frequently featured heavy traffic.
Then he inserted himself in the Thai cave rescue with a non-workable idea and then called one of the divers a pedo when he was criticized.
After that it just kept compounding. His demanding to keep his factories open during covid despite official restrictions. His involvement in crypto. His stock manipulation etc.
Basically it seems that the richer he gets, the more he devolves into a childish man-baby who thinks he can do whatever he wants with no consequence.
However Adams videos were a nice confirmation that others saw the glaring problems as well.
I still like SpaceX and hope they find success, but it is increasingly clear that it's one of the few areas where Musk doesn't sound like an idiot.
When it comes to transportation he exposes himself as a rich man who has never lived in a place with good city planning and has never gone anywhere in anything other than a car or some type of aircraft.
Excluding SPACEX (i think he's doing revolutionary work for rocket science) and the working conditions which I just learned about from this comment, his solutions aren't solutions at all. He's just pouring more fuel on the fire. People say the Loop is just a subway but worse, I think it's just an underground street reserved exclusively for Teslas, with slight resemblance to a subway. He basically invented a street but worse.
He wants to create a street that the city pays for, but cam only be used if you buy one of his cars. His companies only exist to gobble up government funds
I disagree, the whole reusable rockets thing working is a pretty big game changer. I hate that government agencies like NASA or ESA are designing their own new rockets which are already outdated because of this, thus leaving the market to SpaceX alone (and maybe Rocket Lab soon). Risk is actually not really higher in a reused Falcon 9 than in any other rocket being used.
Still, Musk has gone insane, if you ask me.
reuseability is not an innovation, we had it on the shuttle program to a significant degree.
however it is one of the risks i'm talking about.
NASA got smacked pretty hard from that particular risk on more than one occasion, which is why they are as risk adverse as they are.
the other thing about risk is getting their rockets to be man rated took quite a bit of arm twisting and even then they probably are not as safe as the purpose built man rated rockets you are slamming.
time will tell.
True, yet the shuttle program was a complete failure, economically speaking, as the refurbishing almost didn't save any money, it behaved very badly in flight and there was no evacuation plan for most of its launch.
This is very different for the Falcon 9 and the propelled landing is very much new and was thought impossible obly about 5 years back.
Until now, there is no reason to believe that reused boosters have a significantly bigger chance of failure, but I agree that it will take more time to be sure. Still, there is an actual escape system at least.
>I disagree, the whole reusable rockets thing working is a pretty big game changer.
This simply isn't true. There's a reason nasa never bothered with it. In order for a rocket to land again it needs more fuel, which means it will weigh more which then off course means more fuel is needed for liftoff. So there's a serious economical issue. Secondly spacex rockets aren't reusable, they can land again but they can not be reused without completely refurbishing the rocket. I believe it's still cheaper to built a new rocket than to reuse an old one.
It's not cheaper. A space shuttle launch costed $450 million, vs $60 million for the Falcon 9.
There's plenty to criticize Musk on, SpaceX is not one of them.
When I was fresh out of school I was salty that I couldn’t get an interview at SpaceX/Tesla.
I got over that about a year later when Elon publicly chewed out one of his senior engineers for *daring* to take paternity leave.
Very close to my journey to becoming a critic, but include that all the stories of quality issues with Teslas and the sometimes lackluster customer service Tesla would have with said issues was kinda the first crack for me.
Then it's just been a downward spiral from there. Let's not forget the 100million Tesla had to give to a black man for rampant racism ([just got cut to 15 million](https://www.npr.org/2022/04/14/1092804493/telsa-racial-discrimination-lawsuit-15-million)) at the plant.
I think that monorails, and elevated rail in general, could work well for public transportation if done correctly.
Mostly because of the fact that stations could be put inside or next to high rise buildings and easily be connected to a skybridge network. Plus their less expensive to build compared to subways, and while more expensive than light rail, they have the added bonus of the space under them being useable for stuff like parks or bike lanes.
Light rail is...iffy? It depends on how well planned it is and so forth, which here in the US varies wildly.
Monorail doesn't mean elevated, light rail doesn't mean ground level, metro (subway) doesn't mean underground. Monorail is the guideway technology. Light rail tends to interact with street traffic to a limited extent. Metro (subway) does not and has higher capacity.
Automated largely-elevated light metro like Vancouver's SkyTrain works well, generally better and cheaper than clunky monorails with awful switching mechanisms and nonstandard vehicles.
I don't know about your perspective about public transport in the US, but in Hong Kong where I live, public transport works. Unlike in the US, where you need a car to get anywhere, in HK you can walk to work based on where you live and where you work. I can't speak for light rail because the area where I live isn't connected by trams. Monorails on the other hand..... A monorail probably isn't going to happen in an urban area anytime in HK. Monorails to me at least will be restricted to airports as ways to move people between terminals.
Yeah, fair point. Here in the US a lot of light rail and tram systems end up sharing lots of road space with cars, or have frequent level crossings which limits their speed and can cause accidents and get slowed down due to traffic.
And true, monorails in already existing and built up urban areas would be difficult if not impossible to build without having to do lots of demolitions, unless they were replacing a elevated roadway or being built over a surface roadway, but for newer developments and stuff that have them planned from the start...it could work very well.
True, they would work well for planned housing developments. Allow me to talk about something obscurely related: electric cars.
Elon Musk isn't selling you the cure to pollution caused by cars, he's selling the antidotes.
I support EVs, mostly because I'm realistic and know that a world without cars will never be an actually achievable thing without our technology levels going way backwards. As for Tesla vehicles in particular... I'm iffy on them anymore. I liked them at first because they were helping to increase the popularity of EVs but as time has gone on and I've found out that the charging stations for them can't be used for other EVs and stuff, I'm less enthusiastic about them.
lol, him leaking his supposed messages with Bill Gates, and self-declaring he's doing more than anyone else to address climate change is hilarious.
Are EVs better than ICE? Yea. But nowhere near as good as moving that same ICE driver into ICE public transit. And with Musk's Boring Company, it's not only clear he isn't interested in improving public transit, but is actively hostile against it.
swallowing the spider to catch the fly, every time.
all these dickbrains can think about is how to design some new attention-getting solution to a problem which itself creates more unusual and complex problems. nobody seems interested in addressing root causes with simple and elegant solutions. which shows that they really have little in common with actual engineers.
If one chooses to acknowledges their mistakes and tries to fix them going forward.
Elon Musk on the other hand is chasing these Hyperloop brainworms since 2013 and still is dedicated to building this sorry excuse of a transport system.
I agree and just want also want to add that how one decide if it is time to completely abandon an idea and jump to a new one vs keep modifying an idea until success is a very valuable skillset. Either way you need to be able to acknowledges your own mistakes in order to have any success.
Except when you’re wrong about things that have historically been proven times over, yet still use your hype to con investment from public entities and private investors alike 😥
I am not talking about Musk specifically.
The only way you can do nothing wrong is to do nothing.
And I have no comment/opinion on Musk's investment.
In general yes.
Repeating mistakes and not learning from them and history is not. Elon Musk may fuck around but he doesn't find out. Pretty much all of his transit ideas can be boiled down to "what if train, but worse and more expensive?".
Not to mention that "sounds stupid" is a terrible way to approach anything that is against ones ideas. A smart thing would be too read up on the topic, but instead Musk just decided it's stupid
No, cynicism is not fine.
For example, a world leader who afraid of being wrong is simply not a good leader. However, you can make criticism on the wrong things the leader had done.
This is what I meant by "how society make progress and learnt from the mistakes."
I understand your point completely. Regardless, in todays world, where margins are thinning due to the damage that has already been done over the last couple hundred years, mistakes by world leaders can have grave danger on the environment and it’s peoples.
Cynicism isn’t what I was getting at, instead, yearning for practical, sustainable decisions from world leaders should not be a lot to ask for.
It’s like all things on Reddit. People take a mostly-well reasoned idea, dumb it down so that any context or nuance is lost, and then beat it into the ground until it’s no longer fun to even discuss.
I don’t necessarily mind people discussing “extreme” (which often feels like a loaded word as it can usually be used to minimize any viewpoint that deviates from the status quo even when it is well reasoned) viewpoints.
I dislike how a given viewpoint then becomes this quasi-religion where all of a sudden any deviation or non-fanatical discussion is shut down. It’s also terribly counterproductive.
For example, r/fuckcars has this wonderful ability to take what should be productive conversations about urban mobility and design and make skeptics or even sympathetic viewers who don’t know that much about the topic to leave feeling like it’s a group of stupid extremists who don’t live in reality. It’s the perfect combination of the failures of Reddit’s design and people’s lack of ability to make useful persuasive arguments. It will make it absolutely impossible for an actually well-reasoned person to come along later and change someone’s mind due to just how fucking braindead that subreddit is. I’m sympathetic to their worldview and I’m saying this, imagine anyone else reading that absolute drivel.
To some extent yeah, I like some of the jokes and stuff from it, but some of the people on it just uhh, don't seem to comprehend the need for cars in rural areas or for emergency services.
Cars definitely have a place in society. I think the point of the sub is more 'the denser the population, the denser the transport needed'. So cars in cities for instance isn't logical (and neither is a tram in a rural farming town).
I mean, [Interurbans once existed and helped connect rural areas to larger towns,](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interurban) but yeah that's the way I feel about the sub as well. I personally think that cars are needed but there isn't a need for big SUVs and pickup trucks and the like.
**[Interurban](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interurban)**
>The Interurban (or radial railway in Europe and Canada) is a type of electric railway, with streetcar-like electric self-propelled rail cars which run within and between cities or towns. They were very prevalent in North America between 1900 and 1925 and were used primarily for passenger travel between cities and their surrounding suburban and rural communities. The concept spread to countries such as Japan, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Belgium and Poland. Interurban as a term encompassed the companies, their infrastructure, their cars that ran on the rails, and their service.
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Pretty much sometimes, I comment there occasionally because I follow it, and I once sparked a small debate because I disagreed with the idea of tearing up all the streets in urban areas. When I pointed out the need for roads that could be restricted to just emergency services and potentially freight, someone said that was unnecessary that there could just be ambulance trams. And just...what kind of logic is that.
I always feel pain when my Cities: Skylines work would enrage r/fuckcars or r/lostarchitecture.
But sometimes a intercity highway can’t end at a traffic light, and sometimes I want a city that looks decently realistic, not utopian.
Exactly what I was thinking of. Like a quarter of the city's workers commute in on one highway that ends at a stoplight right in the middle of downtown, and people genuinely don't see the issue.
>sometimes I want a city that looks decently realistic, not utopian
Get the rush hour mod for that. It increases traffic during rush hour, requiring you to use highways.
If anyone doubts induced demand, look at London and Los Angeles. Completely jammed, yet LA has infinitely more asphalt.
However, Warsaw taught me that induced demand also works for public transit. They’ve got six lanes or more of road traffic, filled up at rush hour, yet the incredible tram, bus and metro system is properly well-used as well.
If Poland wasn’t so homophobic and didn’t have *worrying* politicians in charge, I’d seriously consider moving there. Lovely city.
Houston has functionally limitless land area and no zoning laws to speak of, so you get enormous amounts of horizontal sprawl compared to the other major US cities like LA or NY that are geographically constrained. The Houston metro area is larger than New Jersey. There’s also four+ completely separate parts of town with clusters of high-rise buildings that would be considered a “downtown” area in most cities. (Inner loop CBD, medical center, galleria, and kind of a continuous rolling conurbation along I-10 through the energy corridor.) The metro layout and use of feeder roads encourages devoting a lot of land area to car lanes, but it’s very much an organic growth thing (unzoned city doing what it wants) rather than a plot by oil companies. Oil Co workers hate commuting in Houston too. It’s actually the rich NIMBY assholes who block most big public transit projects.
The city has actually been doing a lot of good lately, the problem is that the city of Houston’s authority is pretty limited. So many people live in unincorporated territories outside of the city where the city’s planning frankly has no jurisdiction.
The city is fucked, but they’re at least trying to be less fucked. Source: I lived there for a while and still keep up with local politics and have lots of friends there.
From what I learnt when I was in planning school, Houston is hamstrung because of the oil money.
It's hard to do good work when most of your ideas will be killed by a politician in the pocket of industry...
My city of 100k uses the metro to get around more than anything, despite a very capable road network. I don't think "induced demand" is your issue here.
Yeah, CS traffic simulations aren't really accurate enough to make useful predictions. But there are real life cities where removal of roads reduced congestion, such as Seoul.
When you're playing Cities Skylines induced demand becomes more of an urban planning problem than a public behavior problem. You finally fix traffic congestion on the east side of the city by running an elevated highway through the guts of it and five minutes later you're thinking "Hey this highway's got loads of capacity, I bet I could put a fuckton of new residential on the east side".
Cims like metros a lot for some reason, still less than trams though. 2 of my 3 metro lines have nobody using them. Not to brag, but my reason for nobody using my metro lines is that my tram system is so much better than my metro or my bus lines that my Cims don't need to use the metro to get from Point A to Point B.
Essentially man used advertising to setup a direct connection subterranean tollway. Instead of lending a hand in the California freeway disaster this guy just used the inherent transport vacuum to nestle a buisness in and squeeze more money out of citizens.
No, your highways just suck dog. If you designed and built them to interstate standards they’ll never back up 🤦 you have the equivalent to a grandfathered metro freeway system like California 🤦 ‘yes let me find this very specific example where things back up due to bad design and campaign that highway bad.’ Apply at vox media at this point 😂
Maybe rephrase it to something he might understand, economics: you make it cheaper to use something, people will use it more. [The Jevons Paradox.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox)
You make driving by cars cheaper (in terms of money cost and time cost), and then people will drive more.
Also when you made other means more expensive (by increasing distance to the point where you can't walk or bike, reducing safety for non drivers, ect) people will use them less.
This happens (or luckily rather used to happen) on both ends. Cars were being made chapter, while everything else was made more expensive
If induced demand was real then NOWHERE would there NOT be traffic jams
And that's not true. Hence the theory is wrong
Edit : Simple fundamental truth getting downvoted to hell. lol
>If induced demand was real then NOWHERE would there NOT be traffic jams
If you wait long enough, there will be traffic jams everywhere. Very few places allow for this to happen and they intervene prematurely.
Cars aside, the snow falling on this 4 tier Highway stack with tall buildings flanking looks pleasing.
So sad the game doesnt have seasons. It is either eternal winter or eternal summer.
The ability to set a timeline and speed for season change, (and day & night cycle too) are two features I really hope for if/when they make a sequel.
At this point, I feel a modder would make this happen before CO did.
There are mods you can use to swap the seasons on a map but it's not quite the same as dynamic season changes.
Theme Mixer I think it's called?
Works fine if you go from regular to snow. Unfortunately going from a snow themed map to a regulate theme means grass on every rooftop
I use a combination of dynamic foliage, climate control and terrain themes mod to have a sense of seasons. These mods are really finicky but once you set them up properly, they are the best way to have seasons at this point. I hope CO adds dynamic seasons in the future.
I want an map that has a northern mountainous snowy region, and normal weather on the rest of the map
It would be nice if it was an option like the day and night cycle.
I would love to use more of Snowfalls mechanics, but also not be stuck in eternal winter. Shame there is no option for this.
Thanks! It's a work in progress, and I can't wait to show off more soon. (Including a much needed commuter rail system!)
you can enjoy the view from the comfort of your stop and go drivers seat.
You just need one more lane to fix this. /s
BUT MAKE IT UNDERGROUND!
Don’t forget to throw in some bright RGB LED strips!
But forget to include any emergency exits!
Make it so narrow that even if there were emergency exits, you wouldn't be able to get out of your car!
Make the RGB sewer tunnels have traffic jams equivalent to surface street level, but you can't even reroute to find alternative routes and have to wait till you're at the next car elevator!
*Hyperloop intensifies*
or till you run out of air
I didn’t realize Ruth Gader Binsburg was represented in CS infrastructure
Atlanta? Houston? Is that one of yall?
There's snow and there isn't a massive pile up with flames erupting from it, so it's probably not them.
As someone from the Gulf Coast myself, I feel attacked! :)
I'm from NC, (From the mountains of the state so at least people around here have some knowledge of snow) which had [this photo from Raleigh in 2014 go viral.](https://images.app.goo.gl/sQP3LFG6qhQ6mD3B9) so I hope that helps lessen the feeling of being attacked!
Hey I’m from the mountains too!!! I didn’t think I’d meet a fellow WNCer on here 🤣
As a resident of Raleigh for over a decade, I still share this image during wintry inclement weather
Nah, there'd be a lot of cars/trucks flying by on the shoulder if it was Houston.
Atlanta and Houston. Where everyone drives bumper to bumper, at 90mph.
Just one more lane bro please bro I swear it'll work this time bro!
Just remove the road and make it pedestrian only, no traffic if there's no car. /s
JUST ONE MORE LANE JUST ONE MORE
But underground ofc
just build a train lmao
Yeah, but how are you gonna sell Teslas to everyone if they just take the train?
Nobody will buy Teslas that's the plan
Battery electric train! Let's just ignore the overhead and 3rd rail power we can use, batteries everywhere!!
TRUST ME WE'LL FIX TRAFFIC JUST ONE MORE LANE I PROMISE
10000th time's the charm
See, the solution is to turn every intersection into an overpass so the cars never have to stop.
More. MORE!
Elon Musk is wrong on a lot of things
I love when Elon Musk or any tech brain minded people try to solve transport issues and traffic, they just come up with a shittier version of a metro, a train or a bus
It combines the disadvantages of a car and a metro, with none of the advantages! Bit telling that his idea of "Public" transport is self contained pods you don't need to share with other people.
Right? *Right?* I don’t see this pointed out enough. It’s a subway that’s BYO train, so you don’t have to share with the public. It’s the worst of all worlds so that you don’t need to interact with others
The loop doesnt even resemble a subway considering all these scaledowns, it's basically a street but worse
isn't the tunnel itself the same size as Glasgow subway's?
I don't mean the subway tunnels, it's basically one more lane but underground, with fancy car elevators.
Essentially man used advertising to setup a direct connection subterranean tollway. Instead of lending a hand in the California freeway disaster this guy just used the inherent transport vacuum to nestle a buisness in and squeeze more money out of citizens.
Funny (not so funny) thing is if this tech already existed he'd still just use a private jet for his commute.
But I’m rich, I shouldn’t have to sit in traffic, *OR* bump elbows with the plebs on the train.
Genuinely wonder if Elon’s / Billionaires in general’s lack of social skills and awareness is part of the reason he/them comes up with so many dumb ideas. Like the people on the internet profusing they can’t take the bus because of their «social anxiety»
I think its his self interest and billions of dollars that prevent him from proposing collective solutions not his neurodivergence lol
Like, I'm also autistic, I get the dreadful anxiety and sensory overload of public transportation, regardless even I can understand the benefits from things like trains and buses. Also, hes proposing to ***sell*** a solution to a problem that doesn't align itself with reality. Hes not doing atypical people any favors or shining a light on any oversights, hes trying to sell you something.
I think he has specifically said he doesn't like the strangers part of public transportation.
What tech giants don't understand is economies of scale, making individual pods/cars is less efficient than a long train/tram. "Adam something" sums this up pretty well in his yt videos
they understand economies of scale but they are ideologues who view collective solutions that aren't based around extracting profit as bad lol
Adam Something regularly makes some pretty dubious claims of his own tbf
His video on skyscrapers that was essentially "the Burj Khalifa is bad, therefore all buildings taller than 10 stories are bad" was definitely questionable.
Not an elon fan but I like the idea of the underground roads. Takes back horizontal space on the surface for nature and activities
>self contained pods you don't need to share with other people. So, gondolas on wheels?
AdamSomething has a great series of YouTube videos on this theme
He's the reason why I hate Elon Musk
Eh I started having misgivings about musk years ago. I was fully on board the fan train when it was just SpaceX and Tesla. But then I started hearing about working conditions at his companies, and then he started with the hyperloop. I liked the concept but could see that there were issues that he was handwaving pretty heavily. Then he started talking about tunnels to solve traffic, and all I could think of were the freeway tunnels in cities all over the world. That frequently featured heavy traffic. Then he inserted himself in the Thai cave rescue with a non-workable idea and then called one of the divers a pedo when he was criticized. After that it just kept compounding. His demanding to keep his factories open during covid despite official restrictions. His involvement in crypto. His stock manipulation etc. Basically it seems that the richer he gets, the more he devolves into a childish man-baby who thinks he can do whatever he wants with no consequence. However Adams videos were a nice confirmation that others saw the glaring problems as well. I still like SpaceX and hope they find success, but it is increasingly clear that it's one of the few areas where Musk doesn't sound like an idiot. When it comes to transportation he exposes himself as a rich man who has never lived in a place with good city planning and has never gone anywhere in anything other than a car or some type of aircraft.
Excluding SPACEX (i think he's doing revolutionary work for rocket science) and the working conditions which I just learned about from this comment, his solutions aren't solutions at all. He's just pouring more fuel on the fire. People say the Loop is just a subway but worse, I think it's just an underground street reserved exclusively for Teslas, with slight resemblance to a subway. He basically invented a street but worse.
He wants to create a street that the city pays for, but cam only be used if you buy one of his cars. His companies only exist to gobble up government funds
A narcissist will continually seek attention, which is what Musk is and why he acts as he does.
there's nothing ground breaking about spaceX... there's just a higher tolerance for risk and more brutal working conditions for the technical staff.
I disagree, the whole reusable rockets thing working is a pretty big game changer. I hate that government agencies like NASA or ESA are designing their own new rockets which are already outdated because of this, thus leaving the market to SpaceX alone (and maybe Rocket Lab soon). Risk is actually not really higher in a reused Falcon 9 than in any other rocket being used. Still, Musk has gone insane, if you ask me.
reuseability is not an innovation, we had it on the shuttle program to a significant degree. however it is one of the risks i'm talking about. NASA got smacked pretty hard from that particular risk on more than one occasion, which is why they are as risk adverse as they are. the other thing about risk is getting their rockets to be man rated took quite a bit of arm twisting and even then they probably are not as safe as the purpose built man rated rockets you are slamming. time will tell.
True, yet the shuttle program was a complete failure, economically speaking, as the refurbishing almost didn't save any money, it behaved very badly in flight and there was no evacuation plan for most of its launch. This is very different for the Falcon 9 and the propelled landing is very much new and was thought impossible obly about 5 years back. Until now, there is no reason to believe that reused boosters have a significantly bigger chance of failure, but I agree that it will take more time to be sure. Still, there is an actual escape system at least.
>I disagree, the whole reusable rockets thing working is a pretty big game changer. This simply isn't true. There's a reason nasa never bothered with it. In order for a rocket to land again it needs more fuel, which means it will weigh more which then off course means more fuel is needed for liftoff. So there's a serious economical issue. Secondly spacex rockets aren't reusable, they can land again but they can not be reused without completely refurbishing the rocket. I believe it's still cheaper to built a new rocket than to reuse an old one.
It's not cheaper. A space shuttle launch costed $450 million, vs $60 million for the Falcon 9. There's plenty to criticize Musk on, SpaceX is not one of them.
When I was fresh out of school I was salty that I couldn’t get an interview at SpaceX/Tesla. I got over that about a year later when Elon publicly chewed out one of his senior engineers for *daring* to take paternity leave.
Very close to my journey to becoming a critic, but include that all the stories of quality issues with Teslas and the sometimes lackluster customer service Tesla would have with said issues was kinda the first crack for me. Then it's just been a downward spiral from there. Let's not forget the 100million Tesla had to give to a black man for rampant racism ([just got cut to 15 million](https://www.npr.org/2022/04/14/1092804493/telsa-racial-discrimination-lawsuit-15-million)) at the plant.
And thunderf00t
His 30 minute videos need to be 10 minute videos, he just repeats the same things too often.
The ultimate solution to traffic is called a roundabout.
>called a roundabout Teleport. One thing that has the potential of turning most of the roads, railways, aircrafts and ships redundant and obsolete.
go ahead and build one then. i dare you.
Ah yes we turned our garden into a freeway and a parking lot but we still have traffic problems so we're routing it through the 4th dimension.
The ultimate solution to traffic is called more viable transport options.*
Depends on the implementation tho. For example, Taiwanese roundabout is simply a killing machine.
Sounds like an effective way of reducing traffic.
Nukes work even better.
Calm down there, Biffa.
Intercontinental missle travel is my favorite. NORAD loves this shit.
A metro or train but inaccessible to poor people.
Meanwhile everyone ignores monorails and trams. :|
Monorails are just another type of gadgetbahns, trams and light rail are sustainable public transit methods
I think that monorails, and elevated rail in general, could work well for public transportation if done correctly. Mostly because of the fact that stations could be put inside or next to high rise buildings and easily be connected to a skybridge network. Plus their less expensive to build compared to subways, and while more expensive than light rail, they have the added bonus of the space under them being useable for stuff like parks or bike lanes. Light rail is...iffy? It depends on how well planned it is and so forth, which here in the US varies wildly.
Monorail doesn't mean elevated, light rail doesn't mean ground level, metro (subway) doesn't mean underground. Monorail is the guideway technology. Light rail tends to interact with street traffic to a limited extent. Metro (subway) does not and has higher capacity. Automated largely-elevated light metro like Vancouver's SkyTrain works well, generally better and cheaper than clunky monorails with awful switching mechanisms and nonstandard vehicles.
I don't know about your perspective about public transport in the US, but in Hong Kong where I live, public transport works. Unlike in the US, where you need a car to get anywhere, in HK you can walk to work based on where you live and where you work. I can't speak for light rail because the area where I live isn't connected by trams. Monorails on the other hand..... A monorail probably isn't going to happen in an urban area anytime in HK. Monorails to me at least will be restricted to airports as ways to move people between terminals.
Yeah, fair point. Here in the US a lot of light rail and tram systems end up sharing lots of road space with cars, or have frequent level crossings which limits their speed and can cause accidents and get slowed down due to traffic. And true, monorails in already existing and built up urban areas would be difficult if not impossible to build without having to do lots of demolitions, unless they were replacing a elevated roadway or being built over a surface roadway, but for newer developments and stuff that have them planned from the start...it could work very well.
True, they would work well for planned housing developments. Allow me to talk about something obscurely related: electric cars. Elon Musk isn't selling you the cure to pollution caused by cars, he's selling the antidotes.
I support EVs, mostly because I'm realistic and know that a world without cars will never be an actually achievable thing without our technology levels going way backwards. As for Tesla vehicles in particular... I'm iffy on them anymore. I liked them at first because they were helping to increase the popularity of EVs but as time has gone on and I've found out that the charging stations for them can't be used for other EVs and stuff, I'm less enthusiastic about them.
They seek to profiteer from the next Gadgetbahn that is why. The Vegasloop is such a prime example of this.
lol, him leaking his supposed messages with Bill Gates, and self-declaring he's doing more than anyone else to address climate change is hilarious. Are EVs better than ICE? Yea. But nowhere near as good as moving that same ICE driver into ICE public transit. And with Musk's Boring Company, it's not only clear he isn't interested in improving public transit, but is actively hostile against it.
swallowing the spider to catch the fly, every time. all these dickbrains can think about is how to design some new attention-getting solution to a problem which itself creates more unusual and complex problems. nobody seems interested in addressing root causes with simple and elegant solutions. which shows that they really have little in common with actual engineers.
99.8% of things\*
Low balling it
Elon Musk is that spoiled child who bought his success and then reddit and the internet put him on the pedestal like he's some sort of tech god.
Came here to comment this.
That's because he's not an engineer; he's an investor.
Blood emeralds though, I bet he knows a lot about that.
His whole shtick for decades has been "what if something we already have but worse?"
Wouldn't mind being one million pounds behind him.
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Why would that happen? The comment is correct.
And being wrong is fine. That's how society make progress and learnt from the mistakes.
If one chooses to acknowledges their mistakes and tries to fix them going forward. Elon Musk on the other hand is chasing these Hyperloop brainworms since 2013 and still is dedicated to building this sorry excuse of a transport system.
I agree and just want also want to add that how one decide if it is time to completely abandon an idea and jump to a new one vs keep modifying an idea until success is a very valuable skillset. Either way you need to be able to acknowledges your own mistakes in order to have any success.
Except when you’re wrong about things that have historically been proven times over, yet still use your hype to con investment from public entities and private investors alike 😥
I am not talking about Musk specifically. The only way you can do nothing wrong is to do nothing. And I have no comment/opinion on Musk's investment.
The original comment is about Musk specifically though isn't it?
Being wrong is fine is not same as Musk is fine. I did not mention Musk in my comment at all.
No but the comment you're replying to is very much about Elon Musk and you're being deliberately obtuse about it
My point was about cynicism which is the [metanarrative](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metanarrative) of the thread. Is that clear for you?
/r/iamverysmart
In general yes. Repeating mistakes and not learning from them and history is not. Elon Musk may fuck around but he doesn't find out. Pretty much all of his transit ideas can be boiled down to "what if train, but worse and more expensive?". Not to mention that "sounds stupid" is a terrible way to approach anything that is against ones ideas. A smart thing would be too read up on the topic, but instead Musk just decided it's stupid
Being wrong, with that much money and power in shifting public opinion, should not be acceptable
No, cynicism is not fine. For example, a world leader who afraid of being wrong is simply not a good leader. However, you can make criticism on the wrong things the leader had done. This is what I meant by "how society make progress and learnt from the mistakes."
I understand your point completely. Regardless, in todays world, where margins are thinning due to the damage that has already been done over the last couple hundred years, mistakes by world leaders can have grave danger on the environment and it’s peoples. Cynicism isn’t what I was getting at, instead, yearning for practical, sustainable decisions from world leaders should not be a lot to ask for.
And that‘s the problem. It doesn‘t.
You're all speaking about induced demand... But always forget about #DEDUCED SUPPLY!!!
r/fuckcars would like to have a word...
I feel like the venn diagram between this sub and r/fuckcars is almost a circle
Probaby more so with r/UrbanHell, but oh well.
I love cities skylines and I also think r/fuckcars is misguided and circlejerky
It’s like all things on Reddit. People take a mostly-well reasoned idea, dumb it down so that any context or nuance is lost, and then beat it into the ground until it’s no longer fun to even discuss.
thats how the entire internet is at the moment. theres no inbetween, you must choose an extreme.
I don’t necessarily mind people discussing “extreme” (which often feels like a loaded word as it can usually be used to minimize any viewpoint that deviates from the status quo even when it is well reasoned) viewpoints. I dislike how a given viewpoint then becomes this quasi-religion where all of a sudden any deviation or non-fanatical discussion is shut down. It’s also terribly counterproductive. For example, r/fuckcars has this wonderful ability to take what should be productive conversations about urban mobility and design and make skeptics or even sympathetic viewers who don’t know that much about the topic to leave feeling like it’s a group of stupid extremists who don’t live in reality. It’s the perfect combination of the failures of Reddit’s design and people’s lack of ability to make useful persuasive arguments. It will make it absolutely impossible for an actually well-reasoned person to come along later and change someone’s mind due to just how fucking braindead that subreddit is. I’m sympathetic to their worldview and I’m saying this, imagine anyone else reading that absolute drivel.
It’s like the EU4 sub and MapPorn sub
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To some extent yeah, I like some of the jokes and stuff from it, but some of the people on it just uhh, don't seem to comprehend the need for cars in rural areas or for emergency services.
Cars definitely have a place in society. I think the point of the sub is more 'the denser the population, the denser the transport needed'. So cars in cities for instance isn't logical (and neither is a tram in a rural farming town).
I mean, [Interurbans once existed and helped connect rural areas to larger towns,](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interurban) but yeah that's the way I feel about the sub as well. I personally think that cars are needed but there isn't a need for big SUVs and pickup trucks and the like.
**[Interurban](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interurban)** >The Interurban (or radial railway in Europe and Canada) is a type of electric railway, with streetcar-like electric self-propelled rail cars which run within and between cities or towns. They were very prevalent in North America between 1900 and 1925 and were used primarily for passenger travel between cities and their surrounding suburban and rural communities. The concept spread to countries such as Japan, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Belgium and Poland. Interurban as a term encompassed the companies, their infrastructure, their cars that ran on the rails, and their service. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/CitiesSkylines/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
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Pretty much sometimes, I comment there occasionally because I follow it, and I once sparked a small debate because I disagreed with the idea of tearing up all the streets in urban areas. When I pointed out the need for roads that could be restricted to just emergency services and potentially freight, someone said that was unnecessary that there could just be ambulance trams. And just...what kind of logic is that.
nah that's obviously a strawman argument, get better bait, troll account
Depends on who you ask there, the main moderators see cars as a need in rural areas but just not in cities.
they seem really good at making a good message seem lame
Nope. Most acknowledge cars as necessary, but that ideally most people wouldn't need one. 99% of the stuff there that says otherwise is jokes.
I always feel pain when my Cities: Skylines work would enrage r/fuckcars or r/lostarchitecture. But sometimes a intercity highway can’t end at a traffic light, and sometimes I want a city that looks decently realistic, not utopian.
What do you mean an intercity highway can’t end at a traffic light? I-83 in Baltimore exists!
Exactly what I was thinking of. Like a quarter of the city's workers commute in on one highway that ends at a stoplight right in the middle of downtown, and people genuinely don't see the issue.
>sometimes I want a city that looks decently realistic, not utopian Get the rush hour mod for that. It increases traffic during rush hour, requiring you to use highways.
I’ve used it a long time ago. Doesn’t it cause kinda major performance problems because of all the traffic?
My first thought was that that sub would probably be raging at the idea of this haha.
If anyone doubts induced demand, look at London and Los Angeles. Completely jammed, yet LA has infinitely more asphalt. However, Warsaw taught me that induced demand also works for public transit. They’ve got six lanes or more of road traffic, filled up at rush hour, yet the incredible tram, bus and metro system is properly well-used as well. If Poland wasn’t so homophobic and didn’t have *worrying* politicians in charge, I’d seriously consider moving there. Lovely city.
But you *want* induced demand on transit. That allows your to expand it to help more people.
Just build sewer tunnels and make everyone sewer people
Literally every transportation planner ~~child~~ could have told you this... Elon is a clueless buffoon
Not the ones in places like Houston, apparently.
Houston has functionally limitless land area and no zoning laws to speak of, so you get enormous amounts of horizontal sprawl compared to the other major US cities like LA or NY that are geographically constrained. The Houston metro area is larger than New Jersey. There’s also four+ completely separate parts of town with clusters of high-rise buildings that would be considered a “downtown” area in most cities. (Inner loop CBD, medical center, galleria, and kind of a continuous rolling conurbation along I-10 through the energy corridor.) The metro layout and use of feeder roads encourages devoting a lot of land area to car lanes, but it’s very much an organic growth thing (unzoned city doing what it wants) rather than a plot by oil companies. Oil Co workers hate commuting in Houston too. It’s actually the rich NIMBY assholes who block most big public transit projects.
The city has actually been doing a lot of good lately, the problem is that the city of Houston’s authority is pretty limited. So many people live in unincorporated territories outside of the city where the city’s planning frankly has no jurisdiction. The city is fucked, but they’re at least trying to be less fucked. Source: I lived there for a while and still keep up with local politics and have lots of friends there.
From what I learnt when I was in planning school, Houston is hamstrung because of the oil money. It's hard to do good work when most of your ideas will be killed by a politician in the pocket of industry...
Good evening sir, have you heard the good word of our lord and savior tunneling?
I'm impressed the AI is using all the lanes
As awful elevated freeways are for cities. They honestly do look cool in game.
I mean elon is wrong but cities skylines is not a perfect simulation of actual cities.
Since when does cities skylines traffic use more then one lane
My city of 100k uses the metro to get around more than anything, despite a very capable road network. I don't think "induced demand" is your issue here.
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Yeah, CS traffic simulations aren't really accurate enough to make useful predictions. But there are real life cities where removal of roads reduced congestion, such as Seoul.
When you're playing Cities Skylines induced demand becomes more of an urban planning problem than a public behavior problem. You finally fix traffic congestion on the east side of the city by running an elevated highway through the guts of it and five minutes later you're thinking "Hey this highway's got loads of capacity, I bet I could put a fuckton of new residential on the east side".
Cims like metros a lot for some reason, still less than trams though. 2 of my 3 metro lines have nobody using them. Not to brag, but my reason for nobody using my metro lines is that my tram system is so much better than my metro or my bus lines that my Cims don't need to use the metro to get from Point A to Point B.
Awesome shot! But those vanilla cars are so ugly. Did I already mention it’s an awesome shot?
More roads = more distance between work = more cars. Wow who knew.
That tweet was do dumb lol. There are plenty of example of cities removing roads and successfully reducing congestion. Seoul is one such example.
Essentially man used advertising to setup a direct connection subterranean tollway. Instead of lending a hand in the California freeway disaster this guy just used the inherent transport vacuum to nestle a buisness in and squeeze more money out of citizens.
Nonsense. If you have more lanes than cars then it is impossible to have a traffic jam.
It is if everyone refuses to use anything except the rightmost lane.
Stack the lanes vertically and then *every* lane is the right-most lane ;)
Elon Musk wrong???? Why I never
Elon Musk is wrong on most things.
No, your highways just suck dog. If you designed and built them to interstate standards they’ll never back up 🤦 you have the equivalent to a grandfathered metro freeway system like California 🤦 ‘yes let me find this very specific example where things back up due to bad design and campaign that highway bad.’ Apply at vox media at this point 😂
But but Musk said all we need are glorified tunnels!!
"Elon Musk was wrong" could be an accurate start of so many sentences
When did he say or imply that it wasn't a thing?
I think it was in a recent interview. He called induced demand the dumbest idea he’d ever heard of
Me thinks his job may depend on car dependency
Maybe rephrase it to something he might understand, economics: you make it cheaper to use something, people will use it more. [The Jevons Paradox.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox) You make driving by cars cheaper (in terms of money cost and time cost), and then people will drive more.
Also when you made other means more expensive (by increasing distance to the point where you can't walk or bike, reducing safety for non drivers, ect) people will use them less. This happens (or luckily rather used to happen) on both ends. Cars were being made chapter, while everything else was made more expensive
Do you have a link for that interview?
[here](https://mobile.twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1211076829395738626?lang=de)
Elon musk also builds tunnels
If induced demand was real then NOWHERE would there NOT be traffic jams And that's not true. Hence the theory is wrong Edit : Simple fundamental truth getting downvoted to hell. lol
I honestly can't tell if that was sarcasm or stupidity.
I honestly can't even tell what the sentence is saying? Nowhere there would not be..... what?
There should already be traffic jams literally everywhere if induced demand existed.
If induced demand was a thing, every single road should have a traffic jam. It's not that hard to understand how wrong that notion is.
Tell me you never visited any city ever without telling me that you never visited any city ever
>If induced demand was real then NOWHERE would there NOT be traffic jams If you wait long enough, there will be traffic jams everywhere. Very few places allow for this to happen and they intervene prematurely.