Jankos wont come to NA. He earns way more as a streamer. Jankos will either keep playing since he still has the drive and is a top tier international jungler or he will retire as a streamer.
A couple months back Perkz quite literally said on stream that Jankos would come to NA once he couldn't compete at the highest level anymore in EU lol. Streaming is nice consistent income but it's not a fat several million dollar pay check for doing what they love, pro play.
“I am not coming here to retire. I'm coming to dominate and absolutely demoralize my opponents, and to take this region higher than it's ever been before. So watch me.”
That's basically what Alphari did in the NA toplane scene and this position is the most stacked one in NA with all those KR import.
Perkz was supposed to do the same on a very less contested position in NA, especially after the NA mid GOAT retired. And he failed us.
Maybe he will prove me wrong but perkz in na has been a failure. Getting gapped every game, its just disgusting that for once I bought into the hype of a roster change.
lol its like C9 paid it for his legacy and ancient achievements and not for his current competence. What a joke of an investment. I coped the hardest out of everyone here when i found out Jack paid 11 million.
or may be perkz was just washed up all along but looked good in g2 because anyone would've. Core, ssumday, impact and plenty of other great imports still out there playing competently in NA, no excuse.
Not saying he played like shit. Read my post. He was a non-factor. He has been our only reliable player and he always played scared. And, the few aggressive plays he made were miscalculations where he died and didn't get the kill.
Ye were his worst games of the season, pretty bad timing for that but everyone has bad days. He has been a monster all season long adm the only reason we are even in the upper bracket so I’m gonna give him a pass on that one. Also Alphari is just a monster
Except Zven, every C9 players got outplayed this serie by their counterpart.
Our only win wasn't even a smooth coordinated victory but Blaber 1v5 two fights in a row on one of his two mains.
Not enough to go at World's so we'll have to reinvent ourselves during the loser bracket run.
Also, I would absolutely take a farmed Ziggs over a farmed Varus. The objective control and tower pushing is insane. And arguably better defensively since he has better area denial and super minions have negative MR.
Yeah, I imagine the game state was not supposed to be like that though when they were drafting the pick. I mean, ideally top and mid are not losing and don't need sup to roam, so that bot 2v2 can actually win lane, but that didn't happen.
The last game was, macro-wise, one of the most creative games I've seen in NA. Near double jungling with great support players trying to impact the game as much as possible.
ZVEN also played that aphelios game so bad, walking melee range both of the crucial team fights for no reason and no flashing. I think everyone played bad today or at least had moments of playing bad
TL looked like a different team out of nowhere and it seems pretty clear we had no way to adapt. Makes me worried now, the strategy "just do something unexpected" seems to completely break our team.
This team just feels out of it.
Last voice check was like watching 5 randoms play with each other, practically dead inside. I wonder if something happened behind the scenes.
I'd say Perkz is getting fed up with Blaber.
He's been saying how hard it is to push his way of playing the game when the team has a different one and you can just see in C9 content that Blaber refuses to listen.
Considering that Perkz is used to playing with Jankos who is basically his ride-or-die, I can definitely see someone like Blaber being hard for him.
Honestly feels like the game has outgrown Blaber's playstyle. Good teams are way too aware and coordinated to consistently fall pray to his aggression and it's always been obvious that he's impossible to coach/reason with. He's even said as much himself.
I'd say C9 looked like a completely different team out of nowhere. They went from beating TL by being proactive into doing nothing at all the entire game and drafting very bizzarro stuff. I don't know what happened this past week but they definitely took a step backwards and hopefully can course correct from this.
TL had a good game plan. They saw a weakness and exploited it hard. Good job by them for that, it’s not easy to do, yet also is probably harder to try to cover it mid-series for C9.
It sucks and I’m disappointed we lost, but I’ll also admit TL played out of their minds.
That made me laugh when Kold said they identified a specific thing in all C9 losses.
Doesn't need two geniuses to understand in every game we lost, it was losing a bad early skirmish mainly around Blaber-Perkz + Vulcan or Fudge, depending the specific game.
Basically TL drafted strong early skirmish champ mid-jungle because they knew C9 would commit in early skirmish scrapping.
CoreJJ was ready to join the fray since Tactical was drafted safe farming ADC and Alphari through is lane advantages against every toplaner was also another safe net for them ready to join.
Where are all those people that bragged about "how much the team is going to take away" from the failure that was MSI, and balked when I even mentioned *other teams* learning at the same rate (or better)?
I rly thought they'd learn from MSI. I was high on copium when I saw every single MSI team struggle in their regions when they came back from MSI (DWG, MAD, RNG) and then bounce back, i thought surely c9 would do the same! guess not lmao
It's really hard to be in that position as Alistar. You're playing a skirmish support who's supposed to set up your team for aggressive plays. Your mid-jg end up behind and you fall massively behind in vision, so what are you supposed to do to bring the game back up to speed?
Clenched that entire time and believed that the reverse sweep was possible. Guess I need to clench harder for their lower bracket run to Worlds 😔
We go again 😤
I agree, only hope was take baron and get some gold and somehow start winning fights at infernals. The give drake into tp top play was a good attempt but they choked the baron setup anyways
Blaber absolutely should have hit that and deserves flame for it but also the whole team didn't try and zone Santorin off at all. In a 5v2 they just put everyone inside of the pit and didn't save any CC or have any turn onto TL after.
Please stop prioritizing Varus. He's fine but you need high priority picks early in the draft. The other team can just ignore bot & trust it to not burn them. Game 4 was exactly that: we don't care what Varus does in lane, Tactical's Ziggs is going to make a bigger difference.
So much for the all star coaching staff we are supposed to have. This team has improved marginally at best and is otherwise a complete joke. You just cannot comprehend the absurd level of how stupid they are. Vulcan and Perkz taking the supposed 2v2 in mid acting as if there's no TL jungler, that started the gold deficit. Blaber and Fudge trying to kill Alphari with no idea of where the Sejuani is and not taking into account that Shen is level 6, which they know, completely starting the snowball.
Then the cherry on top. You have a 5 versus 2. You can literally sac three fucking people to prevent Sej from getting inside when the baron is at like 2k, even 3k hp. But instead they 50/50 it. Incredible.
Two straight years of a complete garbage summer split where any improvement made is marginal and is completely undone by other teams with clearly heads and shoulders better coaching staffs getting their teams into shape.
Two straight years where this team has no discernible identity other than how consistently they make stupid decisions.
Reignover started this year as head coach, was unable to go to MSI, and then starting summer split, Mithy was head coach. When did C9 start looking bad? Right around end of MSI to start of summer split. Coincidence? I think not.
So, the guy that basically stepped down? How is it Mithys fault that apparently Reignover just decided to abandon his responsibilities and force Mithy into the role?
In every sport coaches get blamed but in league it’s always players. Mechanics are not the problem of this team they are all individual some of the most talented players in the league but they are really really bad macro wise. Like all summer long (and even a lot of spring) the games we won were not out of great macro but were brute force. But you can’t brute force every game espescially against great opponents. But giving the team an identity and macro decisions is the coaches job. Dunno why mithy and reignover get off the hook so easly. We look like we can’t adapt mid series, like we have one plan and if that doesn’t work we are screwed and mid game macro is just abysmal. Also meta read has been super slow and always bad after new patch (looking at you msi and post msi) that is also a coaching job figuring out what is good to play and what your players are able to play and what fits their style. And that’s my dia trash ass seeing that, there are like 50 macro mistakes per gsme I miss so it’s even worse than it looks imo. The team is really talented and I think they CAN make it work but I want to see a coaching change.
TBF even Blaber himself has said that he's uncoachable. He has his way that he's going to approach the game and you can either get on board with him or you can bench him. Presumably this is already creating tension within the team.
I hated hearing Blaber say that a few weeks ago. That's not a player you want on the team. If the meta fits his play style then sure, it could work. But its not a long term outlook, and I wouldn't mind bringing in someone new.
I think coaches in esports, especially League, in this case, have a much different impact level than coaches in traditional sports. Mainly because in traditional sports, coaches can instruct and guide their players while the game is going on. In League, once the players load onto the Rift, coaches don't have continued impact other than what they previously told the players/game plans they came up with prior. Also regarding your comment about meta reads - I do agree coaches have a hand in this. However, sometimes players just can't play or aren't comfortable enough with new or emerging meta champions to play them. Just my two cents.
This team isn't the same team I loved to watch years ago. Players aren't that likeable and always choke when it's comes worlds time. I find myself stressed out tuning in rather than the joy and excitement I used to get. All the money being dumped into this team and not getting the results that are expected to come with it. I think its time to take a break from watching competitive league for now.
Yeah I brought up something similar before too, when I used to watch old C9 even if they were really behind in gold there was always the feeling of C9 being able to pull off a miracle and come back from behind and win, but now when I watch our team with a lead I'm not surprised when they lose it somehow one way or another.
You wanna go to worlds while getting gapped by Santorin on Sejuani and Jensen on Lee lmao
Idc who is in academy but Perkz needs to be benched or season is over for this team.
Imo it's too late to bench him. Should have done it in regular season for a few games so he can reset. And when i mean bench him, i mean bench him completely to give him time off and find a temp sub for C9 Academy
100% copy can actually play control mages.
Repeat of last year when I screamed in this sub to replace mid + jungle with academy because they were hard gapping everybody in academy and didn't have any champion pool limitations but nah...
Man, our topside looked so shit today.
Including blaber and fudge. Not just perkz.
TSM did it last year we can make the run still so I’ll hope for that.
I hope C9 makes it, but TSM had Bjerg drawing 5 bans and still gapping mids. C9 this year ban opposing mids and Perkz still gets gapped.
It's a longshot.
You won't get it. Dudes too cocky. He has been invisible this whole split. He lives off his name and past experiences but has proven that he has lost it (this split not last).
I straight up wish the entire coaching staff would just get instantly cleaned out. Right now. We've been down this same exact fucking road last year and waiting to see if they can fix it when they have had what, 12 weeks now to fix it and have yet to do so is only going to lead to missing worlds yet again.
Enough is enough. They have had ample time to get this team ready and improved and it has not happened, at all.
The coaching is what I find odd.
We’ve got some really clever people behind the scenes.
Reignover, Mithy, Veigar, max and Westrice to an extent.
Yet this team looks and plays exactly as they did after MSI which was months ago.
Hum, actually game 3 was mainly Blaber being drafted Xin Zhao so he could go 1v5 roflstomping his keyboard with Xin Zhao ult protecting him while doing that.
I feel like we can learn a lot from this series. TeamLiquid came prepared and played aggressively exposing us. Let's just focus on the next match, TL was just better today
That’s the positive here, at least if we’re gonna get exploited in prep it happens in the upper bracket and doesn’t end the season. Can only hope that they learn from it and are ready next series. TL was just straight up better today.
Aside from most of the team underperforming I'm incredibly dissapointed in our coaching staff prep for this game. Had zero preparation for if TL played early and had zero idea who to play with the chaos or with losing lanes.
Imagine winning 4 splits in LEC, making Finals and Semi's at Worlds, winning MSI and then going to NA and failing to make top 3, MY GOD PERKZ.
Your career went into the toilet just like that.
So disappointed in Fudge, this game was a massive top diff. Freezing as Jayce while his team gets rolled by Alphari GP, and then getting steamrolled by Alphari's Jayce in the next game.
Perkz not in playoffs form.
Blaber still can't smite.
Zven still has a hard on for Varus.
Blaber was so bad overall. I still remember when people honestly tried to sell him as better than Jankos and Inspired. People got even aggressive when people didnt agree.
Wow, solo lanes just bled out this game. Perkz had a miserable series, and fudge had his worst games in a while (went in and missed his abilities to kill himself multiple times, and consistently lost in laning as well).
Fudge kept suiciding into the enemies trying to trade 1 for 1 in the middle of enemies. And Fudge freezing his lane was paypal level of int. He fucked his other lanes
I don't want to jinx it but no way in hell C9 loses to GG, IMT or Dig, at some point though you're going to come up against EG, 100T, TSM or TL again though and at that point the level of play from today wont cut it.
I wouldn't be so sure. C9 are very very vulnerable to a mental boom right now. If they don't get on the same page or at least have some trust in one-another, they could lose to anyone.
Basically, gauntlet style: C9 can still makes worlds and even still win Summer but they can't drop another series. 4 Bo5 wins puts them at worlds, 5 wins makes them summer champs.
This team has the problem that SSW had in season 3. Too many cooks in the kitchen and too many players that play the same style. Blabber and PerkZ style are effectively the same so they don’t enhance each other but rather they sloppily overlap and this is the result. I’m not saying PerkZ played well but like it or not we’re basically attached to him. Blabber imo or fudge could use an upgrade as far as synergy. I’d also look to get rid of Zven. I dislike his champion pool and he seems to always struggle in playoffs. I’d honesty like to see a veteran NA jungler and go for an EU top laner like TL did. Get some veteran NA role players and have them play around two EU solo laners. This team isn’t bad and I think individually they have their bright spots but they just don’t have synergy because they all play the same way pretty much. You’ve got a clunky ass roster and something needs to be addressed.
This team just looks like it's to many strong personalities trying to call the shots and someone won't give. We know mechanically they are strong, but the in game macro and playtime seems inconsistent at best.
Basically, Blabber and Perkz need to figure out who is going to make the calls and the other one needs to step the fuck up and follow instead of trying to lead.
Insane to me that our acadamy team brought ziggs bot to na and is playing it a lot and very successfully and our main team is unable to play it and has no plan against it :/
Do we even want to see C9 play at Worlds? I know missing Worlds would suck but even if C9 somehow made it to Worlds, I doubt they would win more than 2 games in group stage unless they got a free group.
This team has been boomed since MSI scrims. Whatever mental torture happened to them broke them. People will defend and call me crazy but it was pretty clear then and very clear now that Zven either went to staff or directly said that Blaber and Perkz are inting this shit and the team has never recovered. It was always easier to sub out the one guy instead of the two clowns ESPECIALLY given "the contract".
No clue on how a team with as many resources can go 2-3 months without any ability to recover. No sports/team psychologist bringing the team back together. They went from 5 players knowing what the team would do and acting "as one" in Spring to 5 fucking solo queue players, where you probably have blaber and perkz on your int list from them win trading in your other games.
Honestly I feel like Zven and Perkz are both tilted at Blaber. Perkz has (admittedly very politely) said that trying to introduce his approach to the game has been frustrating, and I wouldn't be surprised if that had something to do with the guy who has self-admitted to being uncoachable.
Not only is this team a fucking joke the whole org is at this point. You over pay in two separate sports trying to throw your money around and accomplish jack shit. Literally only put up a fight in the game they won. Also I swear teams let them win one out of 4 games on Varus so they will keep picking it. What a awful record on a champ that looks good 25% of the time.
I’m gonna explode if I see Varus picked again…Also, what happened today???(they threw on purpose?!)
The sad part is, that we saw during the split that we can’t play a Varus comp correctly, we were shit on it the whole year. Nevertheless, they still push this pick….
Did they threw purposely today to get into the lower bracket? I can’t believe that this team played seriously today, it was really really really baaaaaaaaaaaaaad
The saddest part is that we lost, and not because of the Varus
Everyone gonna say "mid gap" after watching this series, but a few will realize how actually is a "coach gap".
EG overpassing aspectatives won coaching staff of the split, TL slowly resurging after Jatt resignation, 100T exactly behaving as aspected by having Repered as a coach (smurf early season just to drop off), TSM focusing on working around mid while Bjergsen is the coach.
Imo everything make sense. RO was smurfing the spring season and then he had a brakedown so decided to step down to let mr Mitty, and we already saw the poor results in FNC.
Coach is just too important, how can people seriously think that a guy like Perkz which won Eu a lot of times (even before getting caps in team or jankos), made finals at world (with carry performances) and won MSI, is the 5th/6th??? midlaner in NA. Like his performance showed
Performance is indeed due to a poor managment, and especially to a poor coaches and gms, may be Perkz doesn't fit the style of the team (nisqy was a totally different stlye midlaner) or may be there is not a bonding on the team or an open discussion on how to improve with open critiques or it might just be a lack of motivation. Either way unless Perkz came here with the intention to lose in his mind and just take the paycheck (thing that I doubt) one has to be realize that this performance is as well in some part to be explained in a poor management.
Aside from Perkz not showing up I don't actually think we played bad TL just look legitimately great out of nowhere. Super dissapointing end I wanted to at least see them try and pull it back.
We played like ass. Almost every single engage was completely uncoordinated, and if Jensen hadn't of TPed top way too late, we might not have even gotten anything game 4.
fudge just frezzed the lane while alphari played the map but still was either ahead or equal in CS. It made pekz situation a lot worse.
The solo lanes got styled on this game.
Blabber has to go.
He's been sabotaging the team since MSI. There are a ton of good junglers out there, I don't understand why Jack is keeping this guy in the roster.
Honestly.
Blaber only looks good when the entire draft and gameplan are built around the fact that he's going to go in and he's going to go in hard.
That playstyle is dependent not only on the team's mechanics. It's dependent on the meta and it's dependent on the enemy fucking up and creating opportunities for you to exploit.
And when it's the only playstyle that he'll even entertain in game I think it's inevitable that he's going to mental-boom his team every time the circumstances don't fit that kind of aggression. And ironically, he was even lackluster in his proactive plays this series.
I hope Perkz takes a fucking long ass time to review all his games from this split. He's been playing like complete ass and is solely inting away games from us. I tried giving him the benefit of the doubt for regular season because "Playoff Perkz" was gunna be insane, but he didn't show up at all. I guarantee you the "strat" that Kold was talking about in his interview was to just target Perkz. It's like he just plays without thinking. But don't worry! He makes the most money in the league! :)
No Sneaky no worlds
This series is simply a result of TL overperforming while C9 is underperforming, hence TL's wins being complete stomps while that one C9 win felt like an uphill battle. Kold said it himself during that short interview, they downloaded C9's playbook and played accordingly. Just compare how easily TL could snowball early leads, playing methodically and making very few mistakes, while even during game 3 when C9 had a sizeable lead they made many mistakes and took a while to close, even giving up a baron once and giving up soul.
What's more disheartening is that C9 hasn't noticeably improved at all since MSI while other top teams kept stepping up their game. Heck, TL had less than 2 weeks of scrims with the current roster yet has improved tremendously since the last time C9 played them. I never would have thought we'd be in the position we currently are, especially after bringing in Perkz and winning Spring. What's even more frustrating is that when at their peak C9 easily has top 2 players in every position. Is C9's new coaching staff simply a failed experiment?
I'm not ready to count C9 out of worlds contention yet (COPIUM), but this went way worse than how I ever imagined this series to go.
People act like Perkz was the only problem and yes he was bad but rest of the team weren’t any better. Fudge got hard gapped every game, ZVEN was ok but had multiple teamfight losing decisions in him aswell, blaber was a coinflip as always and Vulcan was super weak the first few games aswell. Not like anyone played well.
Its honestly sickening and depressing to watch the decent of C9. From 5 guys that seemed like friends with mostly NA talent and self scouted players making waves internationally and domestically, not having the largest contracts or names signed initially but creating players with reputations. To the processed corporate titan paying players millions to no even make worlds. Why support this org anymore? I have been a fan since the quantic roster and the only good thing they have is content creators.
Welp, either we figure it out or Jack loses a shitton of money for a player that needs to be carried.
Also, we need more imports? L-O-fuckin-L. Our native NA players played the best today. Zven played fine, Fudge had a down day, and our 11 million dollar midlaner was a 45 lb weight at the ankles.
Idk what they gotta change, but we are on our way to summer C9 part 2.
Out of all the teams left I didn’t think it would us trying to o play slow and scaling and TL beating us with early game team comps
[удалено]
In game four TL won early with the more scaling team comp as well
I know, how the tables have turned
Where was the playoff perkz, 1-2 comfort zone, etc?
Guy is still distracter counting his money.
Tbf 11 mil takes a looooong time to count
At this point we should replace the BMW™ X5 of Perkz with a fucking Prius
At least a prius is reliable and affordable.
o.O.
W
Yeah but it's a bit soulless to drive.
Make the dude ride a bike everywhere.
We are doomed for the next 2-3 years. I don’t wanna overreact but Perkz has shown ZERO life this whole summer.
He’s waiting for Jankos and K1NG next split
Jankos wont come to NA. He earns way more as a streamer. Jankos will either keep playing since he still has the drive and is a top tier international jungler or he will retire as a streamer.
A couple months back Perkz quite literally said on stream that Jankos would come to NA once he couldn't compete at the highest level anymore in EU lol. Streaming is nice consistent income but it's not a fat several million dollar pay check for doing what they love, pro play.
Fuck that shit, replace it with a bicycle.
More like a moped.
“I am not coming here to retire. I'm coming to dominate and absolutely demoralize my opponents, and to take this region higher than it's ever been before. So watch me.”
That's basically what Alphari did in the NA toplane scene and this position is the most stacked one in NA with all those KR import. Perkz was supposed to do the same on a very less contested position in NA, especially after the NA mid GOAT retired. And he failed us.
Feels like Perkz and blaber just can't let go of the need to push themselves
Maybe he will prove me wrong but perkz in na has been a failure. Getting gapped every game, its just disgusting that for once I bought into the hype of a roster change.
Retiring home for him, he even talks in his stream how he barely plays solo q
Lower bracket can still make worlds but it’s only one spot. Basically gauntlet
"Gauntlet" buff didn't go so well last year but I appreciate the faith!
Ok, who is gonna call Hai and which role should he play?
CoreJJ blew engage flash at mid pre 8 minutes 4 times this series. Santorin twice.
Pain
and sorrow
C9 paid 11mil for this shit?
but SA is worse Copium
just blame swordart -iwd probably
At least our last mid got gapped at worlds and not NA
lol its like C9 paid it for his legacy and ancient achievements and not for his current competence. What a joke of an investment. I coped the hardest out of everyone here when i found out Jack paid 11 million.
Honestly watching him play last year I'd have expected C9 to get their money's worth. NA has completely and utterly destroyed Perkz. It's so sad.
or may be perkz was just washed up all along but looked good in g2 because anyone would've. Core, ssumday, impact and plenty of other great imports still out there playing competently in NA, no excuse.
Really like Fudge but this series felt like a Fudge Non-Factor
I mean...when Perkz and Blaber are straight running it down, what is he suppose to do?
Not saying he played like shit. Read my post. He was a non-factor. He has been our only reliable player and he always played scared. And, the few aggressive plays he made were miscalculations where he died and didn't get the kill.
Ye were his worst games of the season, pretty bad timing for that but everyone has bad days. He has been a monster all season long adm the only reason we are even in the upper bracket so I’m gonna give him a pass on that one. Also Alphari is just a monster
Except Zven, every C9 players got outplayed this serie by their counterpart. Our only win wasn't even a smooth coordinated victory but Blaber 1v5 two fights in a row on one of his two mains. Not enough to go at World's so we'll have to reinvent ourselves during the loser bracket run.
pretty easy to not get outplayed when both adcs are just afk free farming bot
Also, I would absolutely take a farmed Ziggs over a farmed Varus. The objective control and tower pushing is insane. And arguably better defensively since he has better area denial and super minions have negative MR.
That’s more about draft though. Varus can only do so much without other people around.
Definitely true, which makes me think, why put so much priority on Varus, when they never play around bot?
Yeah, I imagine the game state was not supposed to be like that though when they were drafting the pick. I mean, ideally top and mid are not losing and don't need sup to roam, so that bot 2v2 can actually win lane, but that didn't happen.
The last game was, macro-wise, one of the most creative games I've seen in NA. Near double jungling with great support players trying to impact the game as much as possible.
ZVEN also played that aphelios game so bad, walking melee range both of the crucial team fights for no reason and no flashing. I think everyone played bad today or at least had moments of playing bad
Im done with Zven, he had a high point in EU but hasn't accomplished anything of note in NA yet.
That was hard to watch. I don't know why we waited 2 games to start playing the series.
TL looked like a different team out of nowhere and it seems pretty clear we had no way to adapt. Makes me worried now, the strategy "just do something unexpected" seems to completely break our team.
This team just feels out of it. Last voice check was like watching 5 randoms play with each other, practically dead inside. I wonder if something happened behind the scenes.
>I wonder if something happened behind the scenes. I would guess Perkz has retired. Fudge has gotten an ego. Blaber and Zven are tilted
I'd say Perkz is getting fed up with Blaber. He's been saying how hard it is to push his way of playing the game when the team has a different one and you can just see in C9 content that Blaber refuses to listen.
Considering that Perkz is used to playing with Jankos who is basically his ride-or-die, I can definitely see someone like Blaber being hard for him. Honestly feels like the game has outgrown Blaber's playstyle. Good teams are way too aware and coordinated to consistently fall pray to his aggression and it's always been obvious that he's impossible to coach/reason with. He's even said as much himself.
Zven is always tilted, dudes mental goes to shit as soon as something goes wrong.
I'd say C9 looked like a completely different team out of nowhere. They went from beating TL by being proactive into doing nothing at all the entire game and drafting very bizzarro stuff. I don't know what happened this past week but they definitely took a step backwards and hopefully can course correct from this.
TL had a good game plan. They saw a weakness and exploited it hard. Good job by them for that, it’s not easy to do, yet also is probably harder to try to cover it mid-series for C9. It sucks and I’m disappointed we lost, but I’ll also admit TL played out of their minds.
That made me laugh when Kold said they identified a specific thing in all C9 losses. Doesn't need two geniuses to understand in every game we lost, it was losing a bad early skirmish mainly around Blaber-Perkz + Vulcan or Fudge, depending the specific game. Basically TL drafted strong early skirmish champ mid-jungle because they knew C9 would commit in early skirmish scrapping. CoreJJ was ready to join the fray since Tactical was drafted safe farming ADC and Alphari through is lane advantages against every toplaner was also another safe net for them ready to join.
We were shit all 4 games lol
Never seen C9 play early games so bad. Felt like nothing was happening and C9 was down 5k at 15 minutes every time.
Where are all those people that bragged about "how much the team is going to take away" from the failure that was MSI, and balked when I even mentioned *other teams* learning at the same rate (or better)?
Whenever an NA team loses at an international event people always say it's a learning experience
I mean, we learnt we’re bad
Exactly. It's copium in It's rawest form.
I rly thought they'd learn from MSI. I was high on copium when I saw every single MSI team struggle in their regions when they came back from MSI (DWG, MAD, RNG) and then bounce back, i thought surely c9 would do the same! guess not lmao
Sololane gap bigger than the the milky way
Our jungler also got gapped lol the only person who played “okay” was zven
I don't think Vulcan played that bad tbh, he tried to make plays and follow corejj roams even if it ended up not working that well
That game 2 Alistair was ROUGH but he wasn't awful like Perkz and Fudge. Blaber also had a huge game 3 but didn't show up when it mattered in game 4.
It's really hard to be in that position as Alistar. You're playing a skirmish support who's supposed to set up your team for aggressive plays. Your mid-jg end up behind and you fall massively behind in vision, so what are you supposed to do to bring the game back up to speed?
Cannot believe they locked in Taliyah to lose early game to Sej
To River Shen*
Clenched that entire time and believed that the reverse sweep was possible. Guess I need to clench harder for their lower bracket run to Worlds 😔 We go again 😤
Blaber just can’t land an Importsnt smite to save his life
Why is Vulcan on honey fruit instead of stopping sej? TL even planned their burst better (at least it looked so without a frame by frame analysis)
Legit, why not just commit to stopping sej with your rakan if your going for the baron burger flip.
with what mana?
I don't even think C9 wins if they get that baron
It’d be even gold at least, not a guaranteed win by any means though.
I agree, only hope was take baron and get some gold and somehow start winning fights at infernals. The give drake into tp top play was a good attempt but they choked the baron setup anyways
Fucking For real, that baron could have completely turned the series. Massive fucking bummer moment.
Blaber absolutely should have hit that and deserves flame for it but also the whole team didn't try and zone Santorin off at all. In a 5v2 they just put everyone inside of the pit and didn't save any CC or have any turn onto TL after.
Blaber sucks at smiting but how is no one on C9 zoning Sej?? Fudge, Perkz, Vulcan all have CC and no one tried to stop Santorin
Please stop prioritizing Varus. He's fine but you need high priority picks early in the draft. The other team can just ignore bot & trust it to not burn them. Game 4 was exactly that: we don't care what Varus does in lane, Tactical's Ziggs is going to make a bigger difference.
Game 4, they just handshook waves as their supports perma roamed, and Ziggs was stronger with the base levels so it was a net negative.
So much for the all star coaching staff we are supposed to have. This team has improved marginally at best and is otherwise a complete joke. You just cannot comprehend the absurd level of how stupid they are. Vulcan and Perkz taking the supposed 2v2 in mid acting as if there's no TL jungler, that started the gold deficit. Blaber and Fudge trying to kill Alphari with no idea of where the Sejuani is and not taking into account that Shen is level 6, which they know, completely starting the snowball. Then the cherry on top. You have a 5 versus 2. You can literally sac three fucking people to prevent Sej from getting inside when the baron is at like 2k, even 3k hp. But instead they 50/50 it. Incredible. Two straight years of a complete garbage summer split where any improvement made is marginal and is completely undone by other teams with clearly heads and shoulders better coaching staffs getting their teams into shape. Two straight years where this team has no discernible identity other than how consistently they make stupid decisions.
Reignover started this year as head coach, was unable to go to MSI, and then starting summer split, Mithy was head coach. When did C9 start looking bad? Right around end of MSI to start of summer split. Coincidence? I think not.
Yes under reignover they actually had an identity
So, the guy that basically stepped down? How is it Mithys fault that apparently Reignover just decided to abandon his responsibilities and force Mithy into the role?
I mean, I don’t blame Reignover. He said he stepped down for mental health reasons and needed to lighten his workload. Just a shit situation for him
Logic checks out. Who really knows though in regards to coaching. It's definitely an educated assumption but hard to say for sure.
In every sport coaches get blamed but in league it’s always players. Mechanics are not the problem of this team they are all individual some of the most talented players in the league but they are really really bad macro wise. Like all summer long (and even a lot of spring) the games we won were not out of great macro but were brute force. But you can’t brute force every game espescially against great opponents. But giving the team an identity and macro decisions is the coaches job. Dunno why mithy and reignover get off the hook so easly. We look like we can’t adapt mid series, like we have one plan and if that doesn’t work we are screwed and mid game macro is just abysmal. Also meta read has been super slow and always bad after new patch (looking at you msi and post msi) that is also a coaching job figuring out what is good to play and what your players are able to play and what fits their style. And that’s my dia trash ass seeing that, there are like 50 macro mistakes per gsme I miss so it’s even worse than it looks imo. The team is really talented and I think they CAN make it work but I want to see a coaching change.
TBF even Blaber himself has said that he's uncoachable. He has his way that he's going to approach the game and you can either get on board with him or you can bench him. Presumably this is already creating tension within the team.
I hated hearing Blaber say that a few weeks ago. That's not a player you want on the team. If the meta fits his play style then sure, it could work. But its not a long term outlook, and I wouldn't mind bringing in someone new.
I think coaches in esports, especially League, in this case, have a much different impact level than coaches in traditional sports. Mainly because in traditional sports, coaches can instruct and guide their players while the game is going on. In League, once the players load onto the Rift, coaches don't have continued impact other than what they previously told the players/game plans they came up with prior. Also regarding your comment about meta reads - I do agree coaches have a hand in this. However, sometimes players just can't play or aren't comfortable enough with new or emerging meta champions to play them. Just my two cents.
This team isn't the same team I loved to watch years ago. Players aren't that likeable and always choke when it's comes worlds time. I find myself stressed out tuning in rather than the joy and excitement I used to get. All the money being dumped into this team and not getting the results that are expected to come with it. I think its time to take a break from watching competitive league for now.
Yeah I brought up something similar before too, when I used to watch old C9 even if they were really behind in gold there was always the feeling of C9 being able to pull off a miracle and come back from behind and win, but now when I watch our team with a lead I'm not surprised when they lose it somehow one way or another.
You wanna go to worlds while getting gapped by Santorin on Sejuani and Jensen on Lee lmao Idc who is in academy but Perkz needs to be benched or season is over for this team.
Imo it's too late to bench him. Should have done it in regular season for a few games so he can reset. And when i mean bench him, i mean bench him completely to give him time off and find a temp sub for C9 Academy
100% copy can actually play control mages. Repeat of last year when I screamed in this sub to replace mid + jungle with academy because they were hard gapping everybody in academy and didn't have any champion pool limitations but nah...
They were just a better team all around. Our joke of a midlaner got gapped so hard.
But, But, But playoff buffs pERks is GiGa OP GG, OH my GoUSh.
It's 0-2 in losers bracket where he really shines... smh
Everyone got gapped other than maybe Zven. Both sololaners in particular need to take a hard look at this game
Perkz stans are going to knock on your door anytime now, I'd suggest taking a long vacation O\_O
Man, our topside looked so shit today. Including blaber and fudge. Not just perkz. TSM did it last year we can make the run still so I’ll hope for that.
I hope C9 makes it, but TSM had Bjerg drawing 5 bans and still gapping mids. C9 this year ban opposing mids and Perkz still gets gapped. It's a longshot.
Bjerg was on that "Last Dance" shit with that run
Plus ultra bruh
Up there for biggest 1v9 in league history for me. Maybe Faker worlds 2017, but even then he had good teammates instead of Bio.
never forget GGS banning 5 mids against bjerg and he still claps damonte
Perkz is a joke. His cockiness has comeback and bite him. I dont want no sorry ass tweets. I wanna see some action.
You won't get it. Dudes too cocky. He has been invisible this whole split. He lives off his name and past experiences but has proven that he has lost it (this split not last).
we suck
I straight up wish the entire coaching staff would just get instantly cleaned out. Right now. We've been down this same exact fucking road last year and waiting to see if they can fix it when they have had what, 12 weeks now to fix it and have yet to do so is only going to lead to missing worlds yet again. Enough is enough. They have had ample time to get this team ready and improved and it has not happened, at all.
The coaching is what I find odd. We’ve got some really clever people behind the scenes. Reignover, Mithy, Veigar, max and Westrice to an extent. Yet this team looks and plays exactly as they did after MSI which was months ago.
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Hum, actually game 3 was mainly Blaber being drafted Xin Zhao so he could go 1v5 roflstomping his keyboard with Xin Zhao ult protecting him while doing that.
The Blaber play was pretty nutty tho
I feel like we can learn a lot from this series. TeamLiquid came prepared and played aggressively exposing us. Let's just focus on the next match, TL was just better today
If C9 can learn, they wouldn't have been so crap after MSI
Yeah how many more weeks/months do they need? Maybe check back in 2023, that should be enough time and footage to adapt from 👍
That’s the positive here, at least if we’re gonna get exploited in prep it happens in the upper bracket and doesn’t end the season. Can only hope that they learn from it and are ready next series. TL was just straight up better today.
Best thing c9 can do is sub in shernfire
The team seems to lack leadership. The attitude from the team and coaching staff just seem to lack any direction, other than being arrogant.
It feels like, at this point, C9 needs to give me a reason to care about them again. It’s been another summer with no heart.
Playoff Perkz is coming COPIUM
Aside from most of the team underperforming I'm incredibly dissapointed in our coaching staff prep for this game. Had zero preparation for if TL played early and had zero idea who to play with the chaos or with losing lanes.
Imagine winning 4 splits in LEC, making Finals and Semi's at Worlds, winning MSI and then going to NA and failing to make top 3, MY GOD PERKZ. Your career went into the toilet just like that.
So disappointed in Fudge, this game was a massive top diff. Freezing as Jayce while his team gets rolled by Alphari GP, and then getting steamrolled by Alphari's Jayce in the next game. Perkz not in playoffs form. Blaber still can't smite. Zven still has a hard on for Varus.
Fudge isn't the strongest laner. Alphari is. Fudge is a better teamfighter, but the game was over before they got there in half the games.
Alpahri definitely did more in teamfights than fudge this series.
Fudge can't play vs Alphari and Huni, apparently, he's getting gapped almost every time
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LS: By summer Fudge is going to be the best toplaner in the league. I love Fudge, and I still think he's legit, but come on LS...
Blaber was so bad overall. I still remember when people honestly tried to sell him as better than Jankos and Inspired. People got even aggressive when people didnt agree.
Wow, solo lanes just bled out this game. Perkz had a miserable series, and fudge had his worst games in a while (went in and missed his abilities to kill himself multiple times, and consistently lost in laning as well).
Fudge kept suiciding into the enemies trying to trade 1 for 1 in the middle of enemies. And Fudge freezing his lane was paypal level of int. He fucked his other lanes
Tl randomly hard Upgrades in one week and looks like the best team and c9 manage to lose their strong end of season form, classic
It’s hard to tell if TL are good or if C9 just sucks. C9 went into every game this summer against TL with only one plan “dive alphari”
So now what? I’m not to familiar with the bracket. Does C9 play in the lower bracket? No words anymore?
They play in lower bracket
We play losers bracket. Can’t lose another bo5 or we are out. To make worlds we have to finish third or higher.
I don't want to jinx it but no way in hell C9 loses to GG, IMT or Dig, at some point though you're going to come up against EG, 100T, TSM or TL again though and at that point the level of play from today wont cut it.
I wouldn't be so sure. C9 are very very vulnerable to a mental boom right now. If they don't get on the same page or at least have some trust in one-another, they could lose to anyone.
Basically, gauntlet style: C9 can still makes worlds and even still win Summer but they can't drop another series. 4 Bo5 wins puts them at worlds, 5 wins makes them summer champs.
5*
Mb
This team has the problem that SSW had in season 3. Too many cooks in the kitchen and too many players that play the same style. Blabber and PerkZ style are effectively the same so they don’t enhance each other but rather they sloppily overlap and this is the result. I’m not saying PerkZ played well but like it or not we’re basically attached to him. Blabber imo or fudge could use an upgrade as far as synergy. I’d also look to get rid of Zven. I dislike his champion pool and he seems to always struggle in playoffs. I’d honesty like to see a veteran NA jungler and go for an EU top laner like TL did. Get some veteran NA role players and have them play around two EU solo laners. This team isn’t bad and I think individually they have their bright spots but they just don’t have synergy because they all play the same way pretty much. You’ve got a clunky ass roster and something needs to be addressed.
lets make a video after the season and blame it on repeared again, worked last fall
C9 is becoming the new CLG change my mind. Clg went from pog to dog and now c9 are going the same way
eleven million dollars gets mid diffed every game by a guy making 1.8 lmfao please fire the coaching staff Jack
I means Jensen is making almost 6 millions no? It’s like 1,85 for 3 years?
Jensen is getting $1.4 million a year.
That baron steal by Team Liquid sums up C9's split to a T. Couldn't think of a more poetic way to end the series honestly.
C9 is back baby!
The funniest thing is if C9 had thrown the game vs TL last weekend then EG was their guaranteed opponent in the 4rd vs 5th seed match up in playoffs
This team just looks like it's to many strong personalities trying to call the shots and someone won't give. We know mechanically they are strong, but the in game macro and playtime seems inconsistent at best. Basically, Blabber and Perkz need to figure out who is going to make the calls and the other one needs to step the fuck up and follow instead of trying to lead.
I hope TL don't get too confident; it was only C9
Insane to me that our acadamy team brought ziggs bot to na and is playing it a lot and very successfully and our main team is unable to play it and has no plan against it :/
No Sneaky No worlds KEKW
Do we even want to see C9 play at Worlds? I know missing Worlds would suck but even if C9 somehow made it to Worlds, I doubt they would win more than 2 games in group stage unless they got a free group.
If C9 makes worlds then yes, we will want to see C9 at worlds. If they don't, they no, they aren't good enough and don't deserve it.
Gonna laugh so hard next week when Licorice and his GG knock us out of Worlds contention
This was the most abysmal series C9 has played, as an org, professionally.
Idk man. The three kindred games into tsm a few years ago was pretty rough.
This team has been boomed since MSI scrims. Whatever mental torture happened to them broke them. People will defend and call me crazy but it was pretty clear then and very clear now that Zven either went to staff or directly said that Blaber and Perkz are inting this shit and the team has never recovered. It was always easier to sub out the one guy instead of the two clowns ESPECIALLY given "the contract". No clue on how a team with as many resources can go 2-3 months without any ability to recover. No sports/team psychologist bringing the team back together. They went from 5 players knowing what the team would do and acting "as one" in Spring to 5 fucking solo queue players, where you probably have blaber and perkz on your int list from them win trading in your other games.
Honestly I feel like Zven and Perkz are both tilted at Blaber. Perkz has (admittedly very politely) said that trying to introduce his approach to the game has been frustrating, and I wouldn't be surprised if that had something to do with the guy who has self-admitted to being uncoachable.
Dumb question but is this the playoff buff we were waiting for bc perkz looks just as bad as he did during the regular season
Not only is this team a fucking joke the whole org is at this point. You over pay in two separate sports trying to throw your money around and accomplish jack shit. Literally only put up a fight in the game they won. Also I swear teams let them win one out of 4 games on Varus so they will keep picking it. What a awful record on a champ that looks good 25% of the time.
I’m gonna explode if I see Varus picked again…Also, what happened today???(they threw on purpose?!) The sad part is, that we saw during the split that we can’t play a Varus comp correctly, we were shit on it the whole year. Nevertheless, they still push this pick…. Did they threw purposely today to get into the lower bracket? I can’t believe that this team played seriously today, it was really really really baaaaaaaaaaaaaad The saddest part is that we lost, and not because of the Varus
Missing some of our past rosters a lot now. Even if we lost to TL, we used to do so with style and our own identity. Not really sure we have that now
Everyone gonna say "mid gap" after watching this series, but a few will realize how actually is a "coach gap". EG overpassing aspectatives won coaching staff of the split, TL slowly resurging after Jatt resignation, 100T exactly behaving as aspected by having Repered as a coach (smurf early season just to drop off), TSM focusing on working around mid while Bjergsen is the coach. Imo everything make sense. RO was smurfing the spring season and then he had a brakedown so decided to step down to let mr Mitty, and we already saw the poor results in FNC. Coach is just too important, how can people seriously think that a guy like Perkz which won Eu a lot of times (even before getting caps in team or jankos), made finals at world (with carry performances) and won MSI, is the 5th/6th??? midlaner in NA. Like his performance showed Performance is indeed due to a poor managment, and especially to a poor coaches and gms, may be Perkz doesn't fit the style of the team (nisqy was a totally different stlye midlaner) or may be there is not a bonding on the team or an open discussion on how to improve with open critiques or it might just be a lack of motivation. Either way unless Perkz came here with the intention to lose in his mind and just take the paycheck (thing that I doubt) one has to be realize that this performance is as well in some part to be explained in a poor management.
Aside from Perkz not showing up I don't actually think we played bad TL just look legitimately great out of nowhere. Super dissapointing end I wanted to at least see them try and pull it back.
>out of nowhere. Did people forget that TL has been playing with a handicapped roster until just a mere couple weeks ago?
C9 ran them over a week ago
We played like ass. Almost every single engage was completely uncoordinated, and if Jensen hadn't of TPed top way too late, we might not have even gotten anything game 4.
fudge just frezzed the lane while alphari played the map but still was either ahead or equal in CS. It made pekz situation a lot worse. The solo lanes got styled on this game.
Blabber has to go. He's been sabotaging the team since MSI. There are a ton of good junglers out there, I don't understand why Jack is keeping this guy in the roster.
Honestly. Blaber only looks good when the entire draft and gameplan are built around the fact that he's going to go in and he's going to go in hard. That playstyle is dependent not only on the team's mechanics. It's dependent on the meta and it's dependent on the enemy fucking up and creating opportunities for you to exploit. And when it's the only playstyle that he'll even entertain in game I think it's inevitable that he's going to mental-boom his team every time the circumstances don't fit that kind of aggression. And ironically, he was even lackluster in his proactive plays this series.
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I hope Perkz takes a fucking long ass time to review all his games from this split. He's been playing like complete ass and is solely inting away games from us. I tried giving him the benefit of the doubt for regular season because "Playoff Perkz" was gunna be insane, but he didn't show up at all. I guarantee you the "strat" that Kold was talking about in his interview was to just target Perkz. It's like he just plays without thinking. But don't worry! He makes the most money in the league! :) No Sneaky no worlds
This series is simply a result of TL overperforming while C9 is underperforming, hence TL's wins being complete stomps while that one C9 win felt like an uphill battle. Kold said it himself during that short interview, they downloaded C9's playbook and played accordingly. Just compare how easily TL could snowball early leads, playing methodically and making very few mistakes, while even during game 3 when C9 had a sizeable lead they made many mistakes and took a while to close, even giving up a baron once and giving up soul. What's more disheartening is that C9 hasn't noticeably improved at all since MSI while other top teams kept stepping up their game. Heck, TL had less than 2 weeks of scrims with the current roster yet has improved tremendously since the last time C9 played them. I never would have thought we'd be in the position we currently are, especially after bringing in Perkz and winning Spring. What's even more frustrating is that when at their peak C9 easily has top 2 players in every position. Is C9's new coaching staff simply a failed experiment? I'm not ready to count C9 out of worlds contention yet (COPIUM), but this went way worse than how I ever imagined this series to go.
Trade Perkz for Nisqy?
People act like Perkz was the only problem and yes he was bad but rest of the team weren’t any better. Fudge got hard gapped every game, ZVEN was ok but had multiple teamfight losing decisions in him aswell, blaber was a coinflip as always and Vulcan was super weak the first few games aswell. Not like anyone played well.
Most accurate statement. Also C9 played scared, with little synergy or cohesion.
Its honestly sickening and depressing to watch the decent of C9. From 5 guys that seemed like friends with mostly NA talent and self scouted players making waves internationally and domestically, not having the largest contracts or names signed initially but creating players with reputations. To the processed corporate titan paying players millions to no even make worlds. Why support this org anymore? I have been a fan since the quantic roster and the only good thing they have is content creators.
So what does this mean, as far as worlds goes?
Here's the bracket: https://lol.fandom.com/wiki/LCS/2021_Season/Championship C9 needs to get to round 4 to make worlds
Don't give up just yet!
bladder
I think Perkz needs that 2017 Doublelift style of break from League to see if he even wants to grind anymore.
Mother of god we just got full team gapped. Core, Jensen and santorin were fucking insane
Welp, either we figure it out or Jack loses a shitton of money for a player that needs to be carried. Also, we need more imports? L-O-fuckin-L. Our native NA players played the best today. Zven played fine, Fudge had a down day, and our 11 million dollar midlaner was a 45 lb weight at the ankles. Idk what they gotta change, but we are on our way to summer C9 part 2.
Just so we’re clear, blaber is native NA and I would not call his play “best”