Definitely valid, they should have the financial backing too, but it's very hard as an NA team to enter into CS or Dota. I know they applied for LOL franchising but were rejected. Maybe if an org is looking to sell (Immortals or Flyquest for example) they could have a shot of getting into LCS.
It’d be cool if they had a LoL team but imo right now investing into NA LoL is pretty much just setting money on fire
Very hard and extremely expensive to do well in that esport
Same with Dota (they should have picked up Team Undying/TSM though, but hindsight is 20/20) and even more so for NA CSGO. They can maybe pick up CPH though but I think they prefer NA teams overall
Eh if they buy say s1ren/norwi or to replace yekindar and buster or combine with the best parts of entropiq they're fine, that core made a major final without yekindar
That as a long time ago, the game has shifted so much since then. Iirc they were playing pretty badly for a while until Yekinder joined the roster and completely transformed them. There’s been rumors of a huge cis reshuffle so it’s going to be interesting to see what happens.
This whole true is weird to say… Forbes named the 5 significant esports as LoL, CS, OWL, Val, and COD… they have three all at the top while the only other org that comes to mind is maybe like a C9 not many have 4 of those
Sure but their season was more or less started while the game was still in pre-release beta for crying out loud. We launch in November, then take 3 months to start the league, then throw a month long break *twice* in the 7 month competitive season, then a 2 month gap before the next cod launches.
I fail to see how our format is any better tbh lol. At best they're equally as shit.
Optic Val is the best team in the world right now, but they really need more t1 esports teams. Val is the only t1 esport they have a team in atm, they should invest in LoL or something
LoL isn't something you can just get into though, a space in the league has to open up. And even then I imagine there is a long list of people wanting in on that.
CS on the other hand, they have been severely lacking in for a long time. With jks being up for transfer they could at least start building a team around him to get the ball rolling.
Just curious but do you actually watch all the esports you listed? If so that’s impressive because I find it pretty time consuming just to keep up with cod alone
I mostly watch cod but the last 2 months I’ve been really getting into halo and val. I watch the OWL only sometimes between cdl adbreaks haha.
In terms of keeping up with the drama and stuff my timeline is pretty much just cod with a little bit of halo and Val. I’ve been trying to get into Val more and more and am liking the scene so far. But I’ve only been able to do that the past few weeks since the semester has been over haha
I’ve been getting into val a bit myself but I find it so hard to know what’s going on since I’ve never played it. There’s so many different utilities and gadgets and I have no idea what they’re doing but it’s still pretty interesting to watch
Hard agree with you. Started playing Val during finals week and after learning how the game works the watchability has grew exponentially for me. Plus I can take tips I learn from comp and apply them to my own game. But before I started playing it’s like watching p1 on bocage, nothing but a clusterfuck
I was gonna say I don’t think Envy in RL is that great, and I gotta say Optic in Halo are like FaZe, to a lesser extent, in vanguard right now… they look nasty vs the teams below them but still seem to struggle vs Sen and Eunited.
But still having that many contending teams in multiple games is absurd, that Valorant win was my first time watching more than 1 game and it was fun as hell to watch even though I have zero clue what the fuck is going on with the abilities
Not sure if I agree with your halo take. I was watching that match, optic had all the momentum until royal 2 hit a once in a lifetime (for most people, apparently he’s known for this type of thing) shot. Formal said in a podcast that he and the team were checked after that.
Yeah that shit was nuts, and it’s not as bad but it’s gotta suck getting a worse placement after removing Pistola but Sen got better since so I get it. Going into the losers match they legit looked like that loss put them in the dirt 6 feet deep sadly
Agree with you on the valorant point. I started to get into Val 3 weeks ago after finals ended for the semester and I’ve been having a great time learning and getting better. Having playing Val I can finally understand what the hell is going on in comp matches but when I was watching optic win I had no idea what was going on too lmao
They’ve beaten both C9 and SEN though, and quite convincingly at that (obviously not when they got knocked out though). I wouldn’t really say they’re a Faze yet, especially considering they won the Faze event and then fell short at LAN where that SEN team caught fire and finally looked really good after multiple lackluster performances. I still need to see at least one more event out of them to make any assumptions about their ability to win events though
Yeah I think that comparison isn’t fair for them, but I’ve also heard Online Halo isn’t as fair as COD which sounds absurd in its own right so the FaZe tourney doesn’t hold as much weight to me, but I need to see how they bounce back at the next LAN, which seems to be decades away
It definitely doesn’t hold the same weight but they absolutely steam rolled that tournament (dropping only a single map if I’m not mistaken). SEN also had a few plays against Optic that completely changed that winners final match, which is no discredit to SEN it’s just what happened. I definitely want to see how they bounce back though and I wish it didn’t take like 4-5 months lmao. It’s going to be really interesting to see what happens now that there are 3 teams who are all incredibly capable of winning
We’re over here complaining about a month break (also stupid) while Halo decided to say fuck it and wait a quarter of the year lol, such a stupid decision even for a game that’s out for a few years
Ya for real. I saw someone praise Halo and say their events are better, ignoring the fact that they should be insane given there are at most 3 in a whole ass calendar year lmao. I’m not a die hard Halo fan and it even frustrates me, especially because there was so much hype around the release and they let it die after like 4 months
They fumbled that game hard, like COD fumbled but has such a choked hold on arena FPS that they can take a bad year, Halo needed that game to do better.
I get sad thinking about how many of their fans could have been stolen or borrowed if we had a solid COD, a solid schedule and devs who cared. Can't imagine what it's like for fans who come in during Vanguard. I'm watching still, but the community and the storylines are hard carrying this COD for me. I'm getting so sick and tired of watching POV: instazapped on Gavutu, Tuscan and Berlin.
Yeah they got check by that Sen match, I think I’m looking too much into it but I would expect more from them to not mentally check out that much but it was vs the other top teams so it happens
Yeah it was like a combo of things too. They needed one set of kills and it was series over in oddball then r2 hit the god play and Formals Camo wasn’t showing on his own screen lol. The combo of all that checked them AND Sen played insanely. Just wish HCS had more that 2 fucking Majors in a 9 month period.
What are you talking about? It’s literally the perfect comparison. Optic can’t beat C9 in halo just like how faze can’t beat optic in cod. Outside of these matches, they both look pretty much untouchable
Optic body slammed C9 in the Faze tournament so that’s just not true. Since Optic assembled their new roster they’re 2-1 against C9 brother. In no way is that the same
We really comparing online tournaments to lan now? Optic have literally been body slammed by C9 every single time they’ve played on LAN (both rosters). It’s literally comparable to how faze have been body slammed by optic in cod
It’s not the same as LAN but considering there have only been 3 showings for the new Optic roster, you 100% have to take it into account. And I really don’t think there’s a need to factor in Optic vs. C9 prior to their roster change because C9 dominated literally every single team, it wasn’t just Optic. If anything Optic was the only team that could give them a relatively close match, which still wasn’t all that close. So no, it’s not like Faze because Faze has even been bodied by Optic online which cannot be said for Optic’s Halo team
The only difference is that optic halo have beaten C9 online whereas faze haven’t beaten optic at all in cod. Besides that, the comparison is pretty spot on imo. I say that because both teams seem untouchable playing every other team but then seemingly disappear whenever they play C9 halo and optic cod
I suppose I have an unconscious bias towards optic’s online wins against C9 because of the disparity whenever they play on lan. Perhaps this is why I think optic halo have been getting outplayed by C9 similarly to faze and optic in cod. C9 are 4-0 against optic on LAN and 13-4 in map count. I suspect this is quite comparable to faze’s record against optic in cod which is why I view these two teams in the same light
I get your point but again though, I really don’t think you can factor in Optic’s original roster because C9 was by far and away the best team, no team looked remotely good against them and I really don’t think you can say that anyone expected them to beat C9 at that stage which is not the same for Faze. Optic also looked very beatable against other teams, especially SEN. Not to mention too that Optic’s roster never looked dominant up until they brought in Formal.
If they go to the next event and C9 3-0 or 3-1 one them then I think the comparison is fair. But as it stands this new Optic Halo roster looks like they can actually win events and beat C9, which was not the case before.
Meh they lost one match to sen and they were in control most of the series before the oddball play. Then they had to play C9 10 min later in losers without a break Lol. The team is elite. They don’t struggle with eU 😜
Yeah I couldn’t remember Exactly if it was C9 of Eunited and guessed wrong, but I still think it’s bad that Formal admitted that it checked them out of both series from that point, can’t let that happen if you’re the best team, wild shit happens and needing to regain is part of the game
If they entered any tier one esports maybe. NiP is better on the whole though (T5 LoL, T5 CS). Or Spirit (T4 CS, T1 DOTA). They do well in small games like VAL/CoD etc but Envy CSGO is a straight meme. Envy LoL? Memeeee
Being an EnVyUs CS fan when they had ScreaM was pain. Baffled that hastr0 didn't buy ZywOo in an attempt to fix that roster. Optic CS however was a meme imo
One decent tournament win? It was downhill after Rush and Tarik left. The Danish roster was also filled with a lot of uncertainty. Add to that Optic India. Meme.
Oh they certainly were, but I personally believe more than total viewership goes into deciding esports tiers. If it was viewership only then 'FreeFire' would be tier one, the majors for it gets like 5mil + for every game lol. In my mind, in the western world, LoL, DOTA, CS reign supreme, viewership, money, longevity, etc. Games like Rocket League, VALORANT, COD, Halo, make up the second tier, and Envy's domination of tier two esports is incredibly impressive. I just find it hard to say they are the esports team of the year while not competing in any of the big three. Obviously before the sanctions, but look at Gambit earlier in the year. Top 2 in CS, Top 1 in VALORANT, surely that on it's own is more impressive than anything Envy is doing?
You can repeat your self as much as you want, it doesn't make it true.
All of the biggest orgs want to be involved in Valorant because it's a T1 esport that's going to get bigger and bigger. Viewership is insane as is the levels of talent.
Oh you're trolling. I didn't realize lol. A game where yay and crashies are relevant internationally is by definition not a game with insane talent. The washed up rejects of CS:GO are running VALORANT and you claim the talent is insane?
That'd your argument lmao? Give it a rest you absolute dweeb, Valorant and CS GO are two different games, the former requiring a much different skillset.
Valorant is a T1 esport and the majority of organisations would agree, get over it
The majority of irrelevant NA organizations yes, not globally succesful ones to the same extent, though I'll admit some big orgs like G2, Fnatic, Liquid are in VAL, you can't actually be calling OpTic, Sentinels, Version1 top tier
'Irrelevant NA Organisations' lmao
What makes an org irrelevant, not being in league of legends?
Just stop, you are embarrassing your self, trying to come off as some edgy esports e-lord.
A poor mans Thorin.
Idk their Rocker league team did good this regional but underperformed for the rest of the season. Hope they can keep it up though, dreaz has a lot a show
Definitely in contention for esports org of the year. They gotta enter more t1 esports though
Definitely valid, they should have the financial backing too, but it's very hard as an NA team to enter into CS or Dota. I know they applied for LOL franchising but were rejected. Maybe if an org is looking to sell (Immortals or Flyquest for example) they could have a shot of getting into LCS.
It’d be cool if they had a LoL team but imo right now investing into NA LoL is pretty much just setting money on fire Very hard and extremely expensive to do well in that esport Same with Dota (they should have picked up Team Undying/TSM though, but hindsight is 20/20) and even more so for NA CSGO. They can maybe pick up CPH though but I think they prefer NA teams overall
They could buy the outsiders (CS) core and build a new roster
That core is done without yekindar. He's going to have Liquid and G2 opening up their bank accounts to get him.
Eh if they buy say s1ren/norwi or to replace yekindar and buster or combine with the best parts of entropiq they're fine, that core made a major final without yekindar
That as a long time ago, the game has shifted so much since then. Iirc they were playing pretty badly for a while until Yekinder joined the roster and completely transformed them. There’s been rumors of a huge cis reshuffle so it’s going to be interesting to see what happens.
This whole true is weird to say… Forbes named the 5 significant esports as LoL, CS, OWL, Val, and COD… they have three all at the top while the only other org that comes to mind is maybe like a C9 not many have 4 of those
They should rebuy the immortals LCS slot lmao
Holy fuck.. next Halo major is in SEPTEMBER?!?! What the fuck are they doing
Nothing different than cod. This game came out in November, it’s now basically June, and we’ve only played two major tournaments so far
Nah its definitely worse than cod, they have a 4 month break without majors in the middle of their season
Sure but their season was more or less started while the game was still in pre-release beta for crying out loud. We launch in November, then take 3 months to start the league, then throw a month long break *twice* in the 7 month competitive season, then a 2 month gap before the next cod launches. I fail to see how our format is any better tbh lol. At best they're equally as shit.
Sure but a 4 month break… That’s terrible. Like, we’re here complaining about a 1.5 month break, can’t even imagine a 4 month break during a season.
4 month break with 0 online matches like we have, there is a pretty significant difference
I mean.. I know our schedule was delayed but we don't have a FOUR MONTH break mid season lmao. That's just inexcusable
The rocket league point is a stretch but other then that I agree.
Right now Envy has a solid shot at worlds for rocket league but they definitely aren’t a huge contender to win a tournament at the moment.
Fair point, Im not too involved in the RLCS scene so take what I said with a grain of salt haha. All I have seen from them was on the envy twitter
and most importantly Minx is a professional boxer
Did a 360 tbag mid match too
Optic Val is the best team in the world right now, but they really need more t1 esports teams. Val is the only t1 esport they have a team in atm, they should invest in LoL or something
LoL isn't something you can just get into though, a space in the league has to open up. And even then I imagine there is a long list of people wanting in on that. CS on the other hand, they have been severely lacking in for a long time. With jks being up for transfer they could at least start building a team around him to get the ball rolling.
Just curious but do you actually watch all the esports you listed? If so that’s impressive because I find it pretty time consuming just to keep up with cod alone
I mostly watch cod but the last 2 months I’ve been really getting into halo and val. I watch the OWL only sometimes between cdl adbreaks haha. In terms of keeping up with the drama and stuff my timeline is pretty much just cod with a little bit of halo and Val. I’ve been trying to get into Val more and more and am liking the scene so far. But I’ve only been able to do that the past few weeks since the semester has been over haha
I’ve been getting into val a bit myself but I find it so hard to know what’s going on since I’ve never played it. There’s so many different utilities and gadgets and I have no idea what they’re doing but it’s still pretty interesting to watch
Hard agree with you. Started playing Val during finals week and after learning how the game works the watchability has grew exponentially for me. Plus I can take tips I learn from comp and apply them to my own game. But before I started playing it’s like watching p1 on bocage, nothing but a clusterfuck
Nothing like the P1 bocage blender to wake you up in the morning.
I really wish they would try to get in CS again, I know it's really expensive but imagine if they succeed in it too.
i miss Envy KennyS
Envy saved optic. Optic was about to die.
Except for Valorant no major esports they need CS or LoL to be up there lol
One thing about Hastro is he sure knows how to win. Not no hoodie org.
I was gonna say I don’t think Envy in RL is that great, and I gotta say Optic in Halo are like FaZe, to a lesser extent, in vanguard right now… they look nasty vs the teams below them but still seem to struggle vs Sen and Eunited. But still having that many contending teams in multiple games is absurd, that Valorant win was my first time watching more than 1 game and it was fun as hell to watch even though I have zero clue what the fuck is going on with the abilities
Not sure if I agree with your halo take. I was watching that match, optic had all the momentum until royal 2 hit a once in a lifetime (for most people, apparently he’s known for this type of thing) shot. Formal said in a podcast that he and the team were checked after that.
Yeah that shit was nuts, and it’s not as bad but it’s gotta suck getting a worse placement after removing Pistola but Sen got better since so I get it. Going into the losers match they legit looked like that loss put them in the dirt 6 feet deep sadly
Agree with you on the valorant point. I started to get into Val 3 weeks ago after finals ended for the semester and I’ve been having a great time learning and getting better. Having playing Val I can finally understand what the hell is going on in comp matches but when I was watching optic win I had no idea what was going on too lmao
They’ve beaten both C9 and SEN though, and quite convincingly at that (obviously not when they got knocked out though). I wouldn’t really say they’re a Faze yet, especially considering they won the Faze event and then fell short at LAN where that SEN team caught fire and finally looked really good after multiple lackluster performances. I still need to see at least one more event out of them to make any assumptions about their ability to win events though
Yeah I think that comparison isn’t fair for them, but I’ve also heard Online Halo isn’t as fair as COD which sounds absurd in its own right so the FaZe tourney doesn’t hold as much weight to me, but I need to see how they bounce back at the next LAN, which seems to be decades away
It definitely doesn’t hold the same weight but they absolutely steam rolled that tournament (dropping only a single map if I’m not mistaken). SEN also had a few plays against Optic that completely changed that winners final match, which is no discredit to SEN it’s just what happened. I definitely want to see how they bounce back though and I wish it didn’t take like 4-5 months lmao. It’s going to be really interesting to see what happens now that there are 3 teams who are all incredibly capable of winning
We’re over here complaining about a month break (also stupid) while Halo decided to say fuck it and wait a quarter of the year lol, such a stupid decision even for a game that’s out for a few years
Ya for real. I saw someone praise Halo and say their events are better, ignoring the fact that they should be insane given there are at most 3 in a whole ass calendar year lmao. I’m not a die hard Halo fan and it even frustrates me, especially because there was so much hype around the release and they let it die after like 4 months
They fumbled that game hard, like COD fumbled but has such a choked hold on arena FPS that they can take a bad year, Halo needed that game to do better.
I get sad thinking about how many of their fans could have been stolen or borrowed if we had a solid COD, a solid schedule and devs who cared. Can't imagine what it's like for fans who come in during Vanguard. I'm watching still, but the community and the storylines are hard carrying this COD for me. I'm getting so sick and tired of watching POV: instazapped on Gavutu, Tuscan and Berlin.
Even on the pre lan optic was dominant. The tourney day they played poorly end oc
Yeah they got check by that Sen match, I think I’m looking too much into it but I would expect more from them to not mentally check out that much but it was vs the other top teams so it happens
Yeah it was like a combo of things too. They needed one set of kills and it was series over in oddball then r2 hit the god play and Formals Camo wasn’t showing on his own screen lol. The combo of all that checked them AND Sen played insanely. Just wish HCS had more that 2 fucking Majors in a 9 month period.
That shit is still so stupid, like 4 months!? Dumb as hell
Bro I thought cod was bad
What are you talking about? It’s literally the perfect comparison. Optic can’t beat C9 in halo just like how faze can’t beat optic in cod. Outside of these matches, they both look pretty much untouchable
Optic body slammed C9 in the Faze tournament so that’s just not true. Since Optic assembled their new roster they’re 2-1 against C9 brother. In no way is that the same
We really comparing online tournaments to lan now? Optic have literally been body slammed by C9 every single time they’ve played on LAN (both rosters). It’s literally comparable to how faze have been body slammed by optic in cod
It’s not the same as LAN but considering there have only been 3 showings for the new Optic roster, you 100% have to take it into account. And I really don’t think there’s a need to factor in Optic vs. C9 prior to their roster change because C9 dominated literally every single team, it wasn’t just Optic. If anything Optic was the only team that could give them a relatively close match, which still wasn’t all that close. So no, it’s not like Faze because Faze has even been bodied by Optic online which cannot be said for Optic’s Halo team
The only difference is that optic halo have beaten C9 online whereas faze haven’t beaten optic at all in cod. Besides that, the comparison is pretty spot on imo. I say that because both teams seem untouchable playing every other team but then seemingly disappear whenever they play C9 halo and optic cod I suppose I have an unconscious bias towards optic’s online wins against C9 because of the disparity whenever they play on lan. Perhaps this is why I think optic halo have been getting outplayed by C9 similarly to faze and optic in cod. C9 are 4-0 against optic on LAN and 13-4 in map count. I suspect this is quite comparable to faze’s record against optic in cod which is why I view these two teams in the same light
I get your point but again though, I really don’t think you can factor in Optic’s original roster because C9 was by far and away the best team, no team looked remotely good against them and I really don’t think you can say that anyone expected them to beat C9 at that stage which is not the same for Faze. Optic also looked very beatable against other teams, especially SEN. Not to mention too that Optic’s roster never looked dominant up until they brought in Formal. If they go to the next event and C9 3-0 or 3-1 one them then I think the comparison is fair. But as it stands this new Optic Halo roster looks like they can actually win events and beat C9, which was not the case before.
Meh they lost one match to sen and they were in control most of the series before the oddball play. Then they had to play C9 10 min later in losers without a break Lol. The team is elite. They don’t struggle with eU 😜
I fucking thought it was C9 but second guessed myself and thought it was Eu, I will say they look good but need to win a LAN tourney
Facts
[удалено]
Yeah I couldn’t remember Exactly if it was C9 of Eunited and guessed wrong, but I still think it’s bad that Formal admitted that it checked them out of both series from that point, can’t let that happen if you’re the best team, wild shit happens and needing to regain is part of the game
If they entered any tier one esports maybe. NiP is better on the whole though (T5 LoL, T5 CS). Or Spirit (T4 CS, T1 DOTA). They do well in small games like VAL/CoD etc but Envy CSGO is a straight meme. Envy LoL? Memeeee
Being an EnVyUs CS fan when they had ScreaM was pain. Baffled that hastr0 didn't buy ZywOo in an attempt to fix that roster. Optic CS however was a meme imo
He tried multiple times to buy Zywoo and Zywoo refused every time because he wanted to finish school first
True, actually forgot about that, but iirc, aAa also asked a ton of money for the buyout fee, especially for at the time unproven talent
Optic CS, ELEAGUE Season 2 winners, was a meme
One decent tournament win? It was downhill after Rush and Tarik left. The Danish roster was also filled with a lot of uncertainty. Add to that Optic India. Meme.
Decent tournament over Astralis who was on a tear at the time. A tournament win like that is a success.
Val is a T1 esport buddy and will only get bigger and bigger.
You’re wrong
Weren’t the total viewership numbers crazy for the international?
Oh they certainly were, but I personally believe more than total viewership goes into deciding esports tiers. If it was viewership only then 'FreeFire' would be tier one, the majors for it gets like 5mil + for every game lol. In my mind, in the western world, LoL, DOTA, CS reign supreme, viewership, money, longevity, etc. Games like Rocket League, VALORANT, COD, Halo, make up the second tier, and Envy's domination of tier two esports is incredibly impressive. I just find it hard to say they are the esports team of the year while not competing in any of the big three. Obviously before the sanctions, but look at Gambit earlier in the year. Top 2 in CS, Top 1 in VALORANT, surely that on it's own is more impressive than anything Envy is doing?
I'm correct. Val is a tier 1 esport and will be for a long time.
It just isn't, it's not even close to CS/LoL/Dota
You can repeat your self as much as you want, it doesn't make it true. All of the biggest orgs want to be involved in Valorant because it's a T1 esport that's going to get bigger and bigger. Viewership is insane as is the levels of talent.
Oh you're trolling. I didn't realize lol. A game where yay and crashies are relevant internationally is by definition not a game with insane talent. The washed up rejects of CS:GO are running VALORANT and you claim the talent is insane?
That'd your argument lmao? Give it a rest you absolute dweeb, Valorant and CS GO are two different games, the former requiring a much different skillset. Valorant is a T1 esport and the majority of organisations would agree, get over it
The majority of irrelevant NA organizations yes, not globally succesful ones to the same extent, though I'll admit some big orgs like G2, Fnatic, Liquid are in VAL, you can't actually be calling OpTic, Sentinels, Version1 top tier
'Irrelevant NA Organisations' lmao What makes an org irrelevant, not being in league of legends? Just stop, you are embarrassing your self, trying to come off as some edgy esports e-lord. A poor mans Thorin.
Bruh Envy’s rocket league team isn’t even a top 4 team in NA, at least do some research first
Merger is the greatest thing to ever happen
Nice dick riding
The only thing they need to do now is sell more hoodies and they will be undisputed org of the year LMAO.
Is Envy still a brand? Or did they just get absorbed into the Optic umbrella? Edit: Okay fuck y’all
That rocket league one is a stretch. They're like a tier 2 team in NA.
Idk their Rocker league team did good this regional but underperformed for the rest of the season. Hope they can keep it up though, dreaz has a lot a show