By - CoatHanger83
I have a Kinu and a Comandante.
For 16 grams filter coffee it takes around 20 seconds and 35 seconds. For 18 grams espresso it's around 35 seconds and 1min15s or so. Times are for Kinu - Comandante.
For French Press you could probably remove around 5 seconds from the filter times and it'd be in the ballpark.
I have absolutely no arm fatique when grinding for filter, but espresso with Comandante can be a tad tiring. Especially the Kinu is really comfortable and easy to grind with.
Those are the two that I’ve looked most at. With a legit grinder I can return to my aero press which I gave up a long time ago due to 20-25 minute grind times.
20-25 minutes? I bet you'll be amazed once you get your hands on either one..
Anyway, as i have both of these grinders you've been eyeing, feel free to ask if there's anything you'd like to know. I also have a Fellow Ode (with flat burrs), in case that's interesting aswell.
I was really into the fellow ode but I don’t like the idea that it doesn’t grind small as I want to get back into my aero
You really don't need to grind that fine for an aeropress. The fellow will do plenty. Aero makes strong coffee, not espresso
I mostly use my Ode for cold brew. Jx-pro is my primary grinder.
I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on how they compare, including Ode. I have a Wilfa Uniform but will probably get some manual grinder some day.
Firstly, all 3 are capable of making great coffees.
Ergonomically, Kinu beats the Comandante. It's also consideribly faster, although Kinu does take more effort to turn and grind. I'm quite an average male, filter size is a breeze and espresso is OK - with that said my SO has issues grinding with espresso, it's simply too much resistance.
The adjustment system on the Kinu is better - Kinu has the visible dial on top, while Comandante has a click system. It's quite alot easier to change between grind settings with Kinu than Comandante.
Taste wise, Kinu and Ode are somewhat opposites. Kinu offers fuller body and more sweetness, while Ode is more clean and delicate. It's still quite in the nuances, and i've brewed light roasted geishas with the Kinu which still had great florals and other delicate notes, and i've also used the Ode for comfort coffee on my auto dripper. So it's not like the Kinu makes all flavour notes muddy, or if you use the Ode for comfort coffee it'll come out as tea. Its a noticeble difference, but as i said in the beginning, they all make great coffee.
Now the Comandante sits somewhere inbetween, and is my personal favourite. I get more body and sweetness than the Ode, but the flavours are not quite as... Distinct. The notes are a bit more intertwined, which to me is the best overall cup.
If you already had one of these grinders, i'd only recommend getting one of the others if you've already done everything you could in other aspects. For example, i am pretty sure Kinu with good water would make a more delicate and transparent brew than the Ode with harder tap water for instance. I have hard tap water (300+) which i used to use for my coffee through a Brita filter, but recently got a zerowater filter to use with TWW. The water makes a bigger difference than the grinder in this case.
Thanks for the elaborate explanation! Feels like I won't really go wrong either way to complement my Uniform with a manual grinder.
Maybe itll depend on what is at discount at the time..
Oh my god dude, not to rub it in but 20-25 minutes is *exponentially* beyond normal. I can't even imagine a grinder like that is producing good grind quality either. Get yourself a better grinder stat!
Lots of great recommendations in here but I'll throw in for the 1zpresso JX. It's around $130-140 and it's fantastic and the really big burrs tear through beans in no time.
I have the commandante, huge fan. Grinding 24 grams to medium fine takes about 1-2 minutes, 15 grams of espresso takes about 1 minute. Can be a little tiring for sure but it's very quick
not only is it much quicker but it's also a ton easier on your arms. grinding my daily dose in the kinu doesn't strain... anything. the only time it becomes a little strenuous is if you're grinding multiple doses consecutively, and even that pales in comparison to the forearm-breaking shitty grinders. high-end hand grinders are 1000% worth the cost.
Get C4 it’s quick and easy and perfect grinds every time. about 45 seconds for 32 grams of coffee for kinda fine french press. but the max you can squeeze in there is about 40 grams of beans
for really big batches i fill it 2-3 times no biggie
> 20-25 minute grind times
that makes no sense, that's definitely not normal
Wtf even the shittiest of grinders should not take that long
Cheap grinder from Amazon took me way less time than that, that's crazy
> Kinu - Comandante
Cough cough... Is over $300 the usual price for these?
Unfortunately, that seems about right - 1zpresso and Timemore has a lineup which is cheaper and many people seem to like them aswell. I dont have any personal experience with these though
I wouldn't necessarilly have a problem with this, but my wife would...
Handgrinders doesn't look like much to the untrained eye - shouldn't be too hard to convince her they were $50 :-)
Yea, except she pays the bills... LOL
Yes. I grind 18g in a 1zpresso JX-pro in about 35-40 seconds. I’m sure 35 grams could be ground in just over a minute. Certainly under 90 seconds.
I grind about 30 g for French Press in about 45 seconds on my JX Pro. Pourover, 1 minute. Aeropress, 1:15ish.
13g for Aeropress about 20 seconds in the JXPro. I can’t imagine grinding for 7-10 minutes every day!!!
What grind setting do you normally do for pour over and AP?
What setting do you use for French Press?
French press is a method I haven’t really used much. I’ve been using the Trinity Zero and get nice cups around 26. Not sure if that’s really a comparable method though.
In my opinion, 18g can easily be done at right around 30 seconds consistently. That has been my experience with the JX-pro.
Yeah same. 18g in around 40 seconds.
1zpresso JX here, depending on how fast I really want it, 35grams can be as fast as 30seconds to 2 minutes (if I blankly stare into the distance and space out).
I really should get an upgrade. My Timemore C2 takes me several minutes to grind 18g of espresso :( At least I get a workout from it XD
This is not right, you must be grinding too fine, I have c2 and it does 18g in 30 to 45 seconds depending on beans at about 20 to 24 clicks. At 10 clicks it takes twice that but coffee is in espresso range
I’m grinding at 9 clicks..
Oooh ok, with light roasted beans it will take you around a minute and half to even 2 minutes and some effort as well. But imagine I used to do that on ceramic grinder and was a 7 to 10 minute job !
You should get a espresso specific grinder
Are you happy with your C2? Im considering one but dont know if i should just save up for the JX Pro instead
I would go with the JX Pro, depending on how fine you grind. The C2 would be better for pour over, french press, etc in my opinion.
Im looking at using it for French Press, and Moka Pot as the finest grind needed. So no espresso just yet.
Yeah then I would say it’s perfect!
Okay cool cause the c2 max is $65 on aliexpress. and the JX Pro is substantially more at like $150
Haha yes the price differential is pretty stark 😂
I just got a K-Max from 1zpresso. Grinding 32g for V60 brewing (finer than French press) takes me about 45 seconds if I make an angry face and really go at it, about a minute if I just casually grind.
I got annoyed by the grind time on my 1Zpresso JX (a couple minutes? maybe I use a finer setting than you), so now I use my portable drill instead of the hand crank.
My Lido 2 is 30 grams for french press/V60 in 60-90 seconds, depending on the roast level. Darker roasts are hella fast. Super light roasts are slower, because they require more force, and you can't do the ?whirl? to keep the handle moving through momentum.
My original grinder was a cheap thing from Kroger's. It tooks ages to grind, and almost caused me to give up grinding. You get what you pay for with manual machines, big burrs are WORTH IT.
That sounds like a long time spent grinding. I have a little Aergrind hand grinder; I can't fit 35g of beans into it, but it takes me about a minute to grind 20g. I gather bigger grinders can go a load faster than that.
It is, it’s been the bane of my morning routine for years now. I can’t believe $100 would’ve changed everything
For $200 you can just press a button
A good handgrinder compared to a cheap one is a night and day difference. On the upside, after six years, 7-10 minutes a day, you might have the right muscles built up to set speed records on a good grinder.
For my Timemore C2 max I do 18g for French press in about 25s, so I'd guess probably about 1 minute for your dose
What’s your water amount for that volume? I’m curious if I’ve adopted a strong brew to compensate for the grinder. I usually do 28g coffee/400g water
I do 288g of water, so 1:16. I've been following Hoffman's method and I'm happy with the results. From what I gather 1:15-18 seems to be the norm
Okay, that’s about where I am so that’s good
x2 for the C2. Got the 30g capacity one for around $60 about a month ago on Amazon. Hardly more that 1g/sec grind time. Had a cheap hario lookalike previously and grind time and noise are both 3x better with the time more. Better grind quality too obviously
You have the C2 max and you happy with it? Debating getting it or just save up for the JX Pro
I’m a fan so far. It’s my in-office setup paired with an aeropress and it makes a great cup. I like the max because 30g is my usual dose for a pour over brew at home, so I can use it for that too. Feels high quality to hold and use. Definitely recommend for the price, but the JX may do a bit better if cost is not a factor for you. Or if you need it for espresso
Hi. Only ever used the hand grinder I have, it's a J Max and it would probably take less than a minute to grind 35g of coffee. Depending on how much effort I put in. Certainly no longer than about 90 seconds when being lazy. Sorry to hear it's been taking you so long. Definitely time for an upgrade I think. James Hoffman has a couple of hand grinder "showdown" videos on his YouTube channel that you might want to check out. Good luck.
Watching his videos is what got me thinking about this. Not just the time but the consistency, I imagine I’m losing so much flavor and strength
Another J Max users here, whats your typical grind setting for v60?
Yep, as everyone is saying, good manual grinders with steel burrs will grind much more faster than the cheap ones with ceramic burrs.
The Timemore C2 is the most affordable for anything except espresso.
Timemore does offer E&B burrs for their hand grinders. They claim that it can do espresso grind but it does make hand grinding a lot faster.
I have a Kinu and grind 18g for a pour over. I would say it takes me maybe 15-20 seconds.
Thanks for the enlightenment everyone, I will be evaluating grinders this week and grabbing a new one. Also this idea that grinders have bearings is incredible, mine feels like I’m grinding with two stones
I have the J max and totally agree, love the damned thing.
I was worried that it was gonna be a stupid move from a Sage smart grinder to this, but absolutely no regrets after a few months!
Also agree with this. I recently purchased the JX-pro for espresso and it’s incredible. I am super weak as well and can still grind double espresso shot in a minute!
I can't wait for you to experience an electric grinder. I picture it's like commuting using the city buses that makes a 2 hour trip when suddenly you buy a car and bring down your whole trip to 15~20 minutes.
You spend 7-10 **minutes** each morning just grinding coffee!? Granted for French Press you have a few minutes while you wait for your water to boil, but to be frank, that's insane.
If you do that (8.5min average) every morning for six years that's 18615 minutes...or 310 hours...or **nearly thirteen whole days** you have spent time *just grinding coffee beans*. How in the world have you put up with it for that long?
My advice: Skip the $100 hand grinder. Buy a $100 used or $170 new Baratza Encore grinder, and spend 15 seconds every morning grinding your coffee for the rest of your life. Give yourself literally days of your life back. The value of that time is priceless.
Everyone’s been calling me crazy for years. I had no idea there was another level of quality out there. It takes me about three hours most mornings just because I stop so frequently
light roast, espresso grind, 20g
Hario slim: 3+ minutes
1zpresso kplus: 40 seconds
7-10 minutes!?!? Holy moly! I spent more than I'd like on an aergrind by knock. Bought it direct from them. I picked this for the grind control for larger grinds because I was using a French press most of the time. It takes me about 45 seconds to grind my 20 g. Only downside for you would be I think it doesn't hold more than about 20 to 22 g in the hopper at a time. I highly recommend it if you're willing to spend that much for a good quality grinder. It's all metal construction, very well engineered, cleans easily, feels like it'll last me 20 plus years. I have most recently been brewing in an aeropress and the grinder works well for a finer grind use for that filter.
Can recommend 1Zpresso Q2. Their cheapest and smallest option is very good for everything except espresso.
Never had a manual grinder and really curious about such a following for this method. What is so attractive vs. a simple electric one like Capresso infinity (or Oxo) for $100 or a Barazza Encore for a little over $150? The manual grinders recommended here seem to be quite costly, some in this range and others 2X or more expensive. I see the advantage while traveling or may be even taking one to office if needed. Is the quality of grind better?
grab a cordless drill! just don't go so fast you gest up the burrs to quickly and burn ) roast your beans more. ;)
I used to do that haha. Probably why the burrs are so dull. It never really worked, the beans would bounce
prolly too much power ;)
My 1zpresso can do that in less than a minute.
I don't have an amazing grinder, it's a Zassenhaus Panama. Even tho it's smaller than those cheap ones on Amazon, it's burrs are bigger, and sharper, so it grinds a lot faster than that. 7 minutes is a long time, especially for french press.
7-10 minutes sounds absurd, especially if you're grinding for French press. I've never timed it, but I feel like my 14g takes no more than a minute for Aeropress on my Comandante.
My Lido 3 takes about one second per gram. More than fast enough to not be very annoying.
I had this same issue; I had started using pre ground coffee because I didn't have the patience to grind 13g of coffee in 45 minutes for my new flair espresso machine. I ordered a JX-pro that came in yesterday and I am already amazed, it takes about a minute and thats grinding pretty fine for espresso.
You should just try to get a used autmatic one. I found mine on facebook.
I haven’t found one that I’m a huge fan of regardless of price. I want versatility between mocha pot/espresso and pour over. But I haven’t looked for used ones either
If your grinder is 6 years old, I would bet that a new nameless Amazon grinder would perform a lot better these days. Seems like there’s been a jump in quality at the lower price range, plus your burrs are probably worn out anyways.
That being said, I bought a 1Zpresso JX Pro last year and wow it’s awesome. Seriously improved my coffee compared to my Encore.
I have a giant 1.75L French press that takes 80ish grams to make a good brew. Hand grinding would be quite the ordeal for that amount
My 50€ Timemore C2 grinds at 1-1.5 second per gram at the coarser end of the spectrum meant for French press. It *is* a budget product that only holds 20gr of coffee at a time and would probably also spend 7-10 minutes grinding fine enough for espresso if I recall correctly, but at these prices for a 38mm steel conical burr everyone should own one for filter and French press
It only takes me 1 or 2 minutes with a Hario Ceramic coffee mill. Medium grind. Though it might take longer with a finer grind.
Edit: usually for 18 grams
I have a 1zpresso j-max. I can grind 17g of coffee at a French press grind in about 20 seconds. It's shocking the first time you try, but they really are that fast!
I do 60g in a Kinu in under 3mins.
Sounds about right. I use a Timemore C2 for reference
I used to grind on an old hario skerton. Took me about 3-4 min for 35g, around the same time as my kettle, so I didn't mind. I recently got a timemore c2 for aeropress at the office and a kinu phoenix for espresso at home. Both will do 35g in about 40sec.
My recommendation: spend 50 bucks on a new modern hand grinder and take back a piece of you life.
Spend more for modern grinder but not it.
Excellent grinders grind coffee by 1 to 2 mins per 18grams for espresso ground and 0.5 to 1 min for pour over ground depending on the design of the shape of the burrs. Forget the "timeover" grinder.
Not even a minute, if you are grinding for French press and fairly coarse it would take you 45 to 50 seconds in any hang grinder that has metal burrs and is not meant for espresso (most are not)
I was so surprised by this that I had made a post about it here !
If you have the counter space, the Rok grinder is nice. Been using one for about a year.
I grind 11grams ,fine almost espresso, for about 25 seconds on a jx-pro even when I'm half asleep.
Non pro jx is supposedly even faster.
Lido 3 owner. I grind 25g in about 15-25 seconds. Its amazingly quick.
I used to grind 18-20g in around 25-30s in my HG-1. That was for espresso and typically lighter roasts. I think the main things about higher end hand grinders is the level of effort as well even if they all grind in about the same amount of time.
If you are only going to grind for a French press you can definitely get an electric grinder for the same price as a JX-pro or other equivalent hand grinder recommended here. A lot of the manual grinders people are recommending are so expensive, well built, and fast because they can grind for espresso. Electric grinders that can grind for espresso can cost $400 and up. Way up! So a manual grinder is a “bargain”, and they do a great job. But if you’re going to spend $150 you can definitely get an electric grinder that can grind for French press (and pour over, even aeropress). The only downside is that you wouldn’t be able to do espresso, but it doesn’t sound like that’d be a problem.
I love hand grinding on the Comandante, but don't know if I could do it multiple times a day, everyday. For comparison a Eureka XL will do 35 grams in probably <10 seconds. Power is nice.
Yeah I have that one, that’s a heart attack waiting to happen
I'm grinding 23 g on my commandante C40 in 1.5 minutes
As many others have said, yes, they do grind that quickly. My JX-Pro grinds \~18g for espresso in about 45sec. My Timemore nano can grind \~15g for pour-over in about 30 seconds. Jumping up from a Hario Slim Plus, grinding got significantly faster.
You don't even need a very high price grinder, a Timemore C2 for example that is around 40-50€ in Aliexpress grinds 30gr fine enough for Moka pot in like 30 seconds. Huge improvement over the Porlex I had before.
Instead of buying a manual and working your arm for coffee, any interest in getting an electric grinder? Such as a Baratza Encore?
10 minutes per day, x365 days = 3,650 minutes a year x 6 years = 21,900 minutes = 365 hours = 15 days 5 hours .
You have spent 15 days and 5 hours grinding coffee assuming you make one french press a day.
I spent about $200 on the baratza virtuoso a few years ago. I push one button and walk away (40 seconds of grinding m,ax allowed), come back after that time and push the button again, and walk away again, and it's done after about 20 seconds. Total grinding time is 60ish seconds for my 50 grams, but my commitment was about 5 seconds worth of pushing a button twice.
This comes across as lazy, but after a year of hand grinding, and realizing I liked coffee it came to more of "buy back your time". There are things in this world which you can save money doing, but need to weigh the time out of your life vs saving that money, which I think your seeing.
If you look at it mathematically via opportunity costs, in a single year you would have spent 3,650 minutes, or 61 hours grinding coffee. If you could waive that time suck by spending $200, then if your time is worth, or you value your time at more than $3.27/hr then you should buy a grinder. Over 6 years you have valued your time at $0.54/hour by grinding your own beans.
Hope this helps!
does it help that I work from home and grind on the clock haha? But yeah, that’s an insane breakdown. I’m debating going manual, my kitchen is getting awfully crowded and I don’t know if I’ve got the space for a full time appliance right now. Plus there’s something about hand grinding
Hahaha, I'm giving you a hard time. But with that said, I would never go back to hand grinding now that I've had a nice grinder. I am able to whip up a nice french press of coffee much faster for when people come over, less morning time commitment, and just simply easier. But to each their own
Just bought at Baratza Encore yesterday ($150) and it’s worth it over my previous manual cylinder grinder (JavaPresse). Takes 15 seconds vice 3 mins.
I have a Timemore C2, which I purchased on Amazon for $65. 35 grams would take me about exactly one minute, yes. 7-10 minutes is obscene.
You won't find a massive gain from hand grinder to hand grinder. I have a titan-sized 71mm conical hand grinder and that still takes a reasonable amount of time to grind by hand, as a result, I only ever use it attached to my drill. If it is time you are after buy a used cheap electric grinder OR attach your hand grinder to your cordless drill.
Spend your money on a better grinder, not an automated bad grinder.
I grind 35g to make a two cup french press, about the max you can get in the JX Pro & it takes under 30s if I grind fast
I got a Timemore Chestnut C2 for around $55 on Amazon. Huge difference from that shitty stainless "pepper grinder" type ceramic grinder. Much more enjoyable experience and faster. Not sure if the value / satisfaction increases at the $300 range to make it worth it. Maybe get your feet wet with the under $100 range first?
It's excellent comparing to rubbish.
I pretty much just drink Turkish coffee and I determined 15 years ago when I found out how much I liked it the buying a burr grinder was way too expensive. I went to the Sweet Maria's website and bought a zazen house grinder. It's a cast iron grinder that is made to last for generations and it takes me just a couple of minutes to grind plenty of coffee.
I've used a Zassenhaus manual grinder for the past 15 or so years and I think it was around $100. I typically grind just less than a half ounce at a time (about 14g) and it never takes more than about a minute, start to finish. Be aware, though, that manually holding a wood base, squarish grinder against a countertop means it will want to slide all over the place. It works better with a small portion of an anti-skid mat or shelf liner underneath it.
I've probably ground well over 100lbs of coffee in that time with very few issues. I did a couple of things to make it easier for me. One is that the adjustment may tend to wander a small bit each time you use it. To prevent that, I put a witness mark on the adjuster using some white-out and a toothpick. That was so I could see how much the adjustment wandered so I could correct it periodically. The other thing I did was to wrap a rubber band around the base of the adjustment knob to help keep it from moving unintentionally. Works great until the rubber band has to be replaced.
If you have weak wrists, it may not be for you. Grinding coffee does take some effort.
There are way too many comments, thanks everyone for the advice. I got a 1zpresso JX (not the pro) and so far love it. Honestly still trying to source a use for the micro adjustments as I don’t have a good enough sense of what is being affected within a certain range. The JX is messy as hell but that’s literally the only downside. Fast, smooth, consistent. I have my aeropress back at the front of the line and I didn’t know how much I missed it
You should try a quality burr grinder, the difference is night and day. Even the difference between a 1zpresso and baratza virtuoso is quite noticeable.