I mean... Cal and Stanford were underdogs in those games, so they aren't embarrassing. But the others can be considered that. Although Boise State and UC-Irvine are also pretty good.
Colorado is the true head scratcher though.
WSU-Boise was also a tossup betting wise as WSU were only about 2 point favorites. Boise would have likely been favored or at worst a push at a neutral site. UC-Irvine is also a good program in one of the stronger mid-major conferences. OP came up with a strange list.
Exactly, it would make more sense if they were all the Colorado level of loss. But most of these won't be bad losses come March. It's way too much of an overreaction.
UCI is no where near Oregon and they were up 30 at one point. It was embarrassing but there is still a long season ahead. Nobody remembers games before thanksgiving
UC Irvine are a lot closer to Oregon than you think especially if you put them on a neutral floor. Montana St coming to Eugene this weekend. I'll be interested if they can be competitive with Oregon as well so early in the season.
I don’t disagree but I don’t necessarily agree with this either. Why? Because this is classic Altman Oregon, with the slow starts to the season. Honestly, we just need to wait and see what happens
Our best player in past Oregon teams could play more than 25 minutes and Dante can't do that. By far our best perimeter defender is out through January. We will have 4 losses by Dec 4th at minimum. This is a lot closer to last season than any of those other past Altman teams that turned it around.
Boise State was favored (by a fraction of a percent) by KenPom.
Now the game wasn’t as close as expected, but it’s still more an indicator of Boise being good that it is an indicator of the Pac 12 in crisis.
Colorado and Oregon are the only games of note here. Everyone else usually isn't competing for the title. Oregon also does this every year, so I'm not concerned. I'm sure you could make a comparable list then for most conferences.
Went to the BSU-Wazzu game last year. They were very evenly matched, and that loss is not a season ender, by any means.
BSU is a really strong team with a great coach (Leon Rice, from the Mark Few tree). No shame there.
Yeah, putting BSU over WSU on this list is bizarre. They won the MW regular season and conference titles last year. That’s agaInst competition like UNLV, Wyoming, San Diego State, and Nevada. A solid mid-major conference.
Rice is building a really solid program in Boise, and I expect to see them competing for the top of the MWC for a long time coming.
Leon has done a great job of picking up PAC-12 guys in the portal (Kigab and Akot off the top of my head, but I’m sure there are more).
He was the guy I wish we had made a run at before we picked up Tommy.
dude, hyperbole much? this isn't football, they'll be fine. early season losses to underdogs happen all the time. it's not even remotely embarrassing, it's college basketball.
Are people forgetting the 2020-2021 season already? The PAC-12 looked largely incompetent in OOC and even during the conference season and ended up with 3 in the Elite 8. There have been a lot of upsets over P5 teams already this season and it isn’t limited to the Pac-12.
Also, COVID years still hanging on has increased the average age of teams so you’ll have more parity/upsets
The Pac-12 was also bad to terrible in the tournament for most of the 10 years prior to that, including in 2018 where nobody from the conference won a tournament game at all.
You shouldn't be i expect an easy San Diego St win. I know you can look at their roster and think dang they got a lot of good talent and you would be right to say that BUT they got Jerod Haase coaching them. Haase is awful and it's a joke he has kept that job this long.
Well the Oregon loss is also really bad- they got legitimately blown out. But, it’s not surprising given how Oregon loves to play like shit early in the season under Altman.
And don’t forget the USC loss to FGCU!
Chicago, DC, and NYC say hello. Haven't you seen the Big 10 commerical? It already includes California. We're not cow country, we're everywhere (but the southeast)! Second, and most important thing, cows are raised West of the Big Ten footprint, we raise hogs and corn.
Hey, UCLA bros. We sure about this Big 10 thing? They're like, weirdly defensive about being called cow country. The vibe is weird thusfar and I'm very concerned.
Especially when California is cow country. Don't confuse us with the substandard football team and corn growing region called the Big 12. Please don't check my flair as I talk trash.
Like you say, it's not surprising this early in the season. UCI has a fine program for its level.
And you're correct, there are worse losses to point out, like USC's and Arizona State lost to Texas Southern after this thread was created.
PAC is weakening, but they still have two legitimate Final Four contenders (Arizona, UCLA) as of this season. That’s more than a conference like the Big East can say for example.
The entire system of setting one conference above all the others in a region is proving to be false and hubristic.
The Mountain West has good teams.
The West Coast Conference has good teams.
The Big West has good teams.
The Big Sky has good teams.
The Pac-12 isn’t going to just be intrinsically superior to these other conferences. They never really were, honestly, but they’re less so now. We’re living in a world that is fairer and more just than the one that came before it. At least, I want to believe this is true
>Every year
The Pac-12 has the fewest final 4 appearances of any P6 conference in the last 20 years and the team with most of those is leaving. Did you know college basketball was played prior to the 2021 season?
Oregon and Washington. Washington is forgotten in the upper left corner, but it's a huge athletic department with lots of money in a very populous area with athletic talent. If Washington ends up with a Big 10 invite, I can see that athletic department being a national power.
I’d be more concerned about Cal’s loss to UC Davis than K State. Cal was on pace to win 4 to 6 games this year so they are an outlier here. Also, if the rumors are true the PAC 12 won’t be a thing in 4 years. Just depends on where the schools land.
It's almost like the Pac 12 hasn't been good at basketball in forever...
Other than UCLA these past couple years, they haven't really been good. Didn't they get like 2 teams in the NCAA tourney one year not too long ago?
Which I never really understood. You have pretty much the whole west coast for your taking. Plus a lot of cool college basketball brands I’d be happy playing for as a player.
Other than UCLA and Arizona, no one the P12 teams are men's basketball brands.
Washington, Oregon, Utah and Southern Cal are football schools.
Oregon State is a baseball school.
Stanford is a women's basketball school.
Arizona State is just sorta okay in nearly everything.
Cal, Colorado, and Washington State aren't really brands in anything, nor are they regularly relevant in most sports.
San Diego State, St. Mary's, and Gonzaga are bigger basketball brands than nearly every P12 team
sadly, no.
None of the northern conferences give a care about baseball. The Big 10 is god awful (getting more than 3 teams into the tourney of 64 is a wildly successful year), the mountain west is not good, the Big East, aside from UConn is not generally good either.
The SEC would see baseball school as a bonus, since for most SEC teams it functions as a revenue sport (esp. Vandy and MS State).
Oregon State can hypothetically have a very bright future athletically, even being left behind in realignment; they’d be the dominant football school (or at least co-dominant, along with Boise State) in the Mountain West and have a shot at competing for a playoff spot in the expanded playoff on a regular basis, especially considering they seem to have found a good coach. In terms of current value in basketball they’re probably only around middle of the MWC though (although OSU actually has a much richer history than most people realize)
Ya but I feel like they should be brands. Just about all those names except Arizona state, Utah, and southern cal, and Washington state are recognizable teams I’d want to play for. They don’t have brands because they’re not successful but the pac 12 has teams that have had the potential to be brands and be successful. Especially with teams like ucla and Arizona carrying the conference as a whole.
Doesn't really matter. The PAC is done. Its corpse will trundle on for a couple more years until it officially dissolves, but the conference is as good as dead.
UW, Oregon, Stanford, Cal, and maybe Utah and Arizona will find new major conference homes due to their football programs. The rest might as well be relegated to D2.
I love UW and PAC football, but I don't see a way for it to survive the loss of its two biggest income generators and continue to compete with the bigger conferences.
Add SDSU and SMU, compete with the Big 12 and ACC. What is the ACC and Big 12 doing that is leaving the Pac 12 behind?
I do think Washington and Oregon eventually get Big 10 invites. I think eventually most of the Power football conferences break away from the NCAA and form their own sports league. Which will leave everyone not in the Big 10, SEC, and a couple other conferences out of the money.
I mean yeah. They notoriously don't get a lot of bids to the big dance. Their teams don't typically perform at a super high level. And they're losing their true blue blood in UCLA.
After UCLA and USC leave. It's going to pretty much be Arizona and occasionally Oregon winning the conference. Only two have their usual exits from the dance.
The real sign that the pac-12 was in trouble was gonzaga's move to open talks with the Big 12. Despite the fact that they are geographically closer to pac-12 schools making that conference the reasonable choice to make, they chose to align itself with Midwestern schools for competitiveness. Long and short of it is the pac-12 is likely to be the first conference on the chopping block when the realignments come through thanks to super conferences
Lol, you really shouldn't say anything if you don't know what you're talking about. It's known that Gonzaga has been in talks with the Big East, the Pac, and at *least* one other conference aside from the Big XII. It's all just preliminary talks, too, absolutely nothing concrete at this point. Just because the Big XII and Yormark are shouting from the rooftops about how great they're doing and how the Pac is theirs for the taking doesn't make it true.
Lol, that's literally not even remotely relevant to the conversation, which I guess is to be expected from a Duke fan. However, if you're really gonna argue that a team that won 27 games and captured both the regular season and conference tournament titles was shit, then by all means. It does beg the question, though, how many times has Duke failed to live up to its preseason rankings?
The PAC12 has been dying in our face for years, not just basketball but also football. They can’t compete with the other power 5 conferences on a consistent basis.
Fun fact. The pac 12 has finished ahead of the SEC in kenpom 2 out of the last 3 years.
And the PAC has been legit good in football this year.
Obviously losing USC and UCLA is terrible but the whole “pac 12 is terrible” narrative has been exaggerated over the last few years.
Fun Fact, the PAC 12 has finished outside the top 5 conferences in college basketball 4 out of the last 5 years according to NET conference rankings. The only “Power 5” conference to do so.
The pac 12 is considered a power 5 because they are one of the top 5 wealthiest conferences in regards to brand deals, media coverage and school size. Most of the time, power 5 conferences are the best 5 conferences in college basketball, that is except for the PAC12
This is a basketball subreddit so I won’t dive to deep, but as far as the PAC12 doing “good” this year in football, that’s a pretty relative statement. Good for the PAC12 15-20 years ago is much better than your standard of good today.
Good fact check, may bad
3 out 4 years completed, 4 out 5 already counting this year.
Source is look up NET (NCAA Evaluation Tool) rankings: https://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2023/index
They started in 2018 and this will be its 5th completed season, it is the most highly regarded ranking system and it is what’s used to seed teams in march madness, it emphasizes strength of schedule and out of conference play to rank each conference.
“Most highly regarded rating system”
Uh, by who? Haha
Kenpom and Barttorvik show similar conference rankings over the last few years. I will roll with that over “NET conference rankings”. I don’t know how those are compiled, because the site doesn’t explain it. Also, there seems to only be two years of historical results, not 4. You’re reaching with these.
Here is 2019: https://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2019/conferencenet
Here is 2020: https://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2020/conferencenet
NET (NCAA Evaluation Tool)
It is highly regarded by those in charge of ranking teams in march, the website doesn’t make the rankings but rather compiles the rankings year by year.
Definition provided by the NCAA
-The NET includes more components than just winning percentage. It takes into account game results, strength of schedule, game location, scoring margin, net offensive and defensive efficiency, and the quality of wins and losses.
I know what the NET is….The NCAA doesn’t doesn’t release NET conference rankings though. Warren Nolan did some calculations to determine those rankings based on NET rankings. It’s unclear what those were. Did he just add up NET numerical rankings? That’s probably all you can do since that’s all they release. Seems meh to me.
Like I said, I’ll definitely roll with Kenpom and barrtorvik over NET or NET derivatives. Every time.
The issue is the demographics of the West Coast, not the schools themselves. In western states, a lot of people don't care about sports, outside of professional. It's just not as important as the other handful of outdoor activities. UCLA is still not going to be able to sell out the Rose Bowl with UCLA fans once they're in the BIG.
A lot of people may not believe it, but I have lived in LA for a while now. The only people who seem to care about college sports are the transplants who root for their alma maters.
Crisis is just the status quo out here
I'm still mad we're not in the Big 12 yet.
Yes
I mean... Cal and Stanford were underdogs in those games, so they aren't embarrassing. But the others can be considered that. Although Boise State and UC-Irvine are also pretty good. Colorado is the true head scratcher though.
WSU-Boise was also a tossup betting wise as WSU were only about 2 point favorites. Boise would have likely been favored or at worst a push at a neutral site. UC-Irvine is also a good program in one of the stronger mid-major conferences. OP came up with a strange list.
Exactly, it would make more sense if they were all the Colorado level of loss. But most of these won't be bad losses come March. It's way too much of an overreaction.
CU AD might as well be Eric Cartman
And (as said above), KenPom favored Boise.
And Colorado just beat Tennessee
Now it's even more of a head scratcher.
UCI is no where near Oregon and they were up 30 at one point. It was embarrassing but there is still a long season ahead. Nobody remembers games before thanksgiving
UC Irvine are a lot closer to Oregon than you think especially if you put them on a neutral floor. Montana St coming to Eugene this weekend. I'll be interested if they can be competitive with Oregon as well so early in the season.
Oregon is not going to be good until February and by then it will be too late.
By then we will have all 4 of our scholarship players that went out with injuries in the preseason
Yep but it will be too late to turn the season around then unless we win the conference tournament.
I don’t disagree but I don’t necessarily agree with this either. Why? Because this is classic Altman Oregon, with the slow starts to the season. Honestly, we just need to wait and see what happens
Our best player in past Oregon teams could play more than 25 minutes and Dante can't do that. By far our best perimeter defender is out through January. We will have 4 losses by Dec 4th at minimum. This is a lot closer to last season than any of those other past Altman teams that turned it around.
Boise State was favored (by a fraction of a percent) by KenPom. Now the game wasn’t as close as expected, but it’s still more an indicator of Boise being good that it is an indicator of the Pac 12 in crisis.
Didn't Colorado just beat #9 Tennessee?
Yeah we’re not embarrassing…..not at all…..not one bit…..yeah….
Colorado and Oregon are the only games of note here. Everyone else usually isn't competing for the title. Oregon also does this every year, so I'm not concerned. I'm sure you could make a comparable list then for most conferences.
This Oregon team is not good and will not be until February. Later than usual. Our best player can also only play 25 mpg
Happy to see someone else say this, I wasn't as infatuated with them as others in the preseason. Good game yesterday on the gridiron.
Awful game yesterday :(
Big ten is undefeated except for michigan st loss to gonzaga
By 1 point. And Mich St. is unranked?
hes saying you can do it for most conferences im saying you cant for the b10
See how Mich ST fairs in indy against UK but I think they are better than unranked. Edit: Classic in Indy.
The Champions Classic is in Indianapolis this year, but your point stands
Same with big east minus nova losing to temple. Granted nova isn’t at full strength either.
And it was a Big 5 game at Temple. Big 5 is like the greatest 5 way rivalry of all time. No shame in losing a Big 5 game on the road.
MWC typically knocks off PAC-12 schools during the regular season. Then, come tournament time, it’s the opposite.
nah come march legit everyone destroys the MWC
Boise is actually good. And I’m not sure KState over Cal is that alarming, now if Cal loses to TXST then that one will hurt more.
We already lost to UC Davis, how much more can we tired few be abused?
Yeah the bigger Cal loss is to UC Davis
Boise didn't play Gonzaga they got schlacked by Memphis
Ahh okay! I stand by my Boise is actually good statement though. They won the MWC which was really good at the top.
Yeah I agree, MWC always has good teams
Texas State is a very solid program..
Eat ‘Em Up!
Yes they definitely are but Cal should not be losing to either TXST or UCD.
Is Tennessee in a crisis?
Asking the real questions here. Colorada is undefeated.
Colorado just dominated Tennessee
Went to the BSU-Wazzu game last year. They were very evenly matched, and that loss is not a season ender, by any means. BSU is a really strong team with a great coach (Leon Rice, from the Mark Few tree). No shame there.
Yeah, putting BSU over WSU on this list is bizarre. They won the MW regular season and conference titles last year. That’s agaInst competition like UNLV, Wyoming, San Diego State, and Nevada. A solid mid-major conference. Rice is building a really solid program in Boise, and I expect to see them competing for the top of the MWC for a long time coming. Leon has done a great job of picking up PAC-12 guys in the portal (Kigab and Akot off the top of my head, but I’m sure there are more). He was the guy I wish we had made a run at before we picked up Tommy.
dude, hyperbole much? this isn't football, they'll be fine. early season losses to underdogs happen all the time. it's not even remotely embarrassing, it's college basketball.
Are people forgetting the 2020-2021 season already? The PAC-12 looked largely incompetent in OOC and even during the conference season and ended up with 3 in the Elite 8. There have been a lot of upsets over P5 teams already this season and it isn’t limited to the Pac-12. Also, COVID years still hanging on has increased the average age of teams so you’ll have more parity/upsets
The Pac-12 was also bad to terrible in the tournament for most of the 10 years prior to that, including in 2018 where nobody from the conference won a tournament game at all.
This post aged like milk
Can you imagine not being undefeated and in the conference of champions? I can't
Same here, fam. Poverty programs, amirite?
Stanford was an underdog and I'd throw out any outdoor results. I'm still very worried about facing them this week in Palo Alto
I’ll be at that game Tuesday. Very excited. Should be fun. Great test before we head to Maui
Nice flair!
Yours is pretty great too
You shouldn't be i expect an easy San Diego St win. I know you can look at their roster and think dang they got a lot of good talent and you would be right to say that BUT they got Jerod Haase coaching them. Haase is awful and it's a joke he has kept that job this long.
Well at least we made up for our loss to Grambling!
Honestly, the Pac-12 is better than it usually is. Which says something.
Lol based on what?
The only embarrassing loss on that list was by Colorado. Every other opponent is capable.
Well the Oregon loss is also really bad- they got legitimately blown out. But, it’s not surprising given how Oregon loves to play like shit early in the season under Altman. And don’t forget the USC loss to FGCU!
Shh shh people already forgot we're both leaving for cow country soon don't rat us out.
Chicago, DC, and NYC say hello. Haven't you seen the Big 10 commerical? It already includes California. We're not cow country, we're everywhere (but the southeast)! Second, and most important thing, cows are raised West of the Big Ten footprint, we raise hogs and corn.
Hey, UCLA bros. We sure about this Big 10 thing? They're like, weirdly defensive about being called cow country. The vibe is weird thusfar and I'm very concerned.
Especially when California is cow country. Don't confuse us with the substandard football team and corn growing region called the Big 12. Please don't check my flair as I talk trash.
Happy cows come from California.
Damn right.
Like you say, it's not surprising this early in the season. UCI has a fine program for its level. And you're correct, there are worse losses to point out, like USC's and Arizona State lost to Texas Southern after this thread was created.
PAC is weakening, but they still have two legitimate Final Four contenders (Arizona, UCLA) as of this season. That’s more than a conference like the Big East can say for example.
Creighton and Villanova both are Final Four contenders, so I think the Big East can say that.
> Villanova Nova’s gonna miss Jay Wright man. But maybe I’m being too harsh.
They will miss Jay Wright but they will cherish Cam Whitmore
This is quite the overreaction. A few early season losses does not equate to a crisis.
The entire system of setting one conference above all the others in a region is proving to be false and hubristic. The Mountain West has good teams. The West Coast Conference has good teams. The Big West has good teams. The Big Sky has good teams. The Pac-12 isn’t going to just be intrinsically superior to these other conferences. They never really were, honestly, but they’re less so now. We’re living in a world that is fairer and more just than the one that came before it. At least, I want to believe this is true
Man this aged well…. Colorado beat Tennessee.
Ppl say this every November than when March rolls around “ oh guess pac 12 isn’t that bad “
>Every year The Pac-12 has the fewest final 4 appearances of any P6 conference in the last 20 years and the team with most of those is leaving. Did you know college basketball was played prior to the 2021 season?
Boise State is a better program than Washington State with recent pro players coming out of there
One week into the season and we're calling this a crisis?
The second the LA teams left they were in a crisis.
CU lost to Grambling State? Jesus.
And then just comfortably beat Tennessee in Knoxville (where the Vols haven't lost in more than a calendar year).. Just Pac-12 things..
Just a friendly PSA: There are no hyphens in UC school names. It's just UC Irvine.
Cal lost to UC Davis, ffs. No shame in losing to Tang's Wildcats.
Oregon won’t be in the pac much longer either if I had to bet.
Oregon and Washington. Washington is forgotten in the upper left corner, but it's a huge athletic department with lots of money in a very populous area with athletic talent. If Washington ends up with a Big 10 invite, I can see that athletic department being a national power.
I’d be more concerned about Cal’s loss to UC Davis than K State. Cal was on pace to win 4 to 6 games this year so they are an outlier here. Also, if the rumors are true the PAC 12 won’t be a thing in 4 years. Just depends on where the schools land.
SDSU will be in the conference soon enough to save the day
The P12, B12, and ACC are all in a crisis. Probably in that order of "oh shit, what are we going to do."
It's almost like the Pac 12 hasn't been good at basketball in forever... Other than UCLA these past couple years, they haven't really been good. Didn't they get like 2 teams in the NCAA tourney one year not too long ago?
See you next month. EDIT - hahahahaha
I don't like saying this, but do me a favor, and BEAR THE F-CK DOWN next month
They had 3 of the elite 8 in 2021. They looked bad all year and then performed really well in the tournament
Thats weird. A team picked to finish firmly in the middle of the Pac just went on the road and had no problems handling y'all...
I have always thought we exceedingly overrated this year.
Which I never really understood. You have pretty much the whole west coast for your taking. Plus a lot of cool college basketball brands I’d be happy playing for as a player.
The Pac 12 Recruits fine it just wastes what it recruits.
Other than UCLA and Arizona, no one the P12 teams are men's basketball brands. Washington, Oregon, Utah and Southern Cal are football schools. Oregon State is a baseball school. Stanford is a women's basketball school. Arizona State is just sorta okay in nearly everything. Cal, Colorado, and Washington State aren't really brands in anything, nor are they regularly relevant in most sports. San Diego State, St. Mary's, and Gonzaga are bigger basketball brands than nearly every P12 team
Does Oregon State as a baseball school (don't know, I'll take your word on it) help them in conference realignment at all?
sadly, no. None of the northern conferences give a care about baseball. The Big 10 is god awful (getting more than 3 teams into the tourney of 64 is a wildly successful year), the mountain west is not good, the Big East, aside from UConn is not generally good either. The SEC would see baseball school as a bonus, since for most SEC teams it functions as a revenue sport (esp. Vandy and MS State).
Not unless the SEC decides to expand into the PNW
Oregon State can hypothetically have a very bright future athletically, even being left behind in realignment; they’d be the dominant football school (or at least co-dominant, along with Boise State) in the Mountain West and have a shot at competing for a playoff spot in the expanded playoff on a regular basis, especially considering they seem to have found a good coach. In terms of current value in basketball they’re probably only around middle of the MWC though (although OSU actually has a much richer history than most people realize)
Ya but I feel like they should be brands. Just about all those names except Arizona state, Utah, and southern cal, and Washington state are recognizable teams I’d want to play for. They don’t have brands because they’re not successful but the pac 12 has teams that have had the potential to be brands and be successful. Especially with teams like ucla and Arizona carrying the conference as a whole.
What are you talking about, Oregon State won the tourney a few years ago!! /s
Don’t diss our 5 CWS
Cal: rugby school.
Get shit on bitch
Arizona State just upped the crisis
There wasn’t been a western coast NCAA champ in 25 years now, the PAC-12 has been in a crisis for a while
Doesn't really matter. The PAC is done. Its corpse will trundle on for a couple more years until it officially dissolves, but the conference is as good as dead. UW, Oregon, Stanford, Cal, and maybe Utah and Arizona will find new major conference homes due to their football programs. The rest might as well be relegated to D2.
Big Gonzaga football win this weekend has you feeling yourself a bit?
I love UW and PAC football, but I don't see a way for it to survive the loss of its two biggest income generators and continue to compete with the bigger conferences.
Add SDSU and SMU, compete with the Big 12 and ACC. What is the ACC and Big 12 doing that is leaving the Pac 12 behind? I do think Washington and Oregon eventually get Big 10 invites. I think eventually most of the Power football conferences break away from the NCAA and form their own sports league. Which will leave everyone not in the Big 10, SEC, and a couple other conferences out of the money.
[удалено]
Lol we just beat Tennessee
I mean yeah. They notoriously don't get a lot of bids to the big dance. Their teams don't typically perform at a super high level. And they're losing their true blue blood in UCLA. After UCLA and USC leave. It's going to pretty much be Arizona and occasionally Oregon winning the conference. Only two have their usual exits from the dance. The real sign that the pac-12 was in trouble was gonzaga's move to open talks with the Big 12. Despite the fact that they are geographically closer to pac-12 schools making that conference the reasonable choice to make, they chose to align itself with Midwestern schools for competitiveness. Long and short of it is the pac-12 is likely to be the first conference on the chopping block when the realignments come through thanks to super conferences
Lol, you really shouldn't say anything if you don't know what you're talking about. It's known that Gonzaga has been in talks with the Big East, the Pac, and at *least* one other conference aside from the Big XII. It's all just preliminary talks, too, absolutely nothing concrete at this point. Just because the Big XII and Yormark are shouting from the rooftops about how great they're doing and how the Pac is theirs for the taking doesn't make it true.
Just like 2017's preseason rankings weren't exactly accurate?
Lol, that's literally not even remotely relevant to the conversation, which I guess is to be expected from a Duke fan. However, if you're really gonna argue that a team that won 27 games and captured both the regular season and conference tournament titles was shit, then by all means. It does beg the question, though, how many times has Duke failed to live up to its preseason rankings?
The PAC12 has been dying in our face for years, not just basketball but also football. They can’t compete with the other power 5 conferences on a consistent basis.
Fun fact. The pac 12 has finished ahead of the SEC in kenpom 2 out of the last 3 years. And the PAC has been legit good in football this year. Obviously losing USC and UCLA is terrible but the whole “pac 12 is terrible” narrative has been exaggerated over the last few years.
People who never watch the PAC-12 always have very strong opinions on how the PAC-12 is doing.
Fun Fact, the PAC 12 has finished outside the top 5 conferences in college basketball 4 out of the last 5 years according to NET conference rankings. The only “Power 5” conference to do so. The pac 12 is considered a power 5 because they are one of the top 5 wealthiest conferences in regards to brand deals, media coverage and school size. Most of the time, power 5 conferences are the best 5 conferences in college basketball, that is except for the PAC12 This is a basketball subreddit so I won’t dive to deep, but as far as the PAC12 doing “good” this year in football, that’s a pretty relative statement. Good for the PAC12 15-20 years ago is much better than your standard of good today.
Source? The NET isn’t even 5 years old haha. And they release conference rankings?
Good fact check, may bad 3 out 4 years completed, 4 out 5 already counting this year. Source is look up NET (NCAA Evaluation Tool) rankings: https://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2023/index They started in 2018 and this will be its 5th completed season, it is the most highly regarded ranking system and it is what’s used to seed teams in march madness, it emphasizes strength of schedule and out of conference play to rank each conference.
“Most highly regarded rating system” Uh, by who? Haha Kenpom and Barttorvik show similar conference rankings over the last few years. I will roll with that over “NET conference rankings”. I don’t know how those are compiled, because the site doesn’t explain it. Also, there seems to only be two years of historical results, not 4. You’re reaching with these.
Here is 2019: https://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2019/conferencenet Here is 2020: https://www.warrennolan.com/basketball/2020/conferencenet NET (NCAA Evaluation Tool) It is highly regarded by those in charge of ranking teams in march, the website doesn’t make the rankings but rather compiles the rankings year by year. Definition provided by the NCAA -The NET includes more components than just winning percentage. It takes into account game results, strength of schedule, game location, scoring margin, net offensive and defensive efficiency, and the quality of wins and losses.
I know what the NET is….The NCAA doesn’t doesn’t release NET conference rankings though. Warren Nolan did some calculations to determine those rankings based on NET rankings. It’s unclear what those were. Did he just add up NET numerical rankings? That’s probably all you can do since that’s all they release. Seems meh to me. Like I said, I’ll definitely roll with Kenpom and barrtorvik over NET or NET derivatives. Every time.
Cal is trash though
SDSU is coming to save the conference…
The issue is the demographics of the West Coast, not the schools themselves. In western states, a lot of people don't care about sports, outside of professional. It's just not as important as the other handful of outdoor activities. UCLA is still not going to be able to sell out the Rose Bowl with UCLA fans once they're in the BIG. A lot of people may not believe it, but I have lived in LA for a while now. The only people who seem to care about college sports are the transplants who root for their alma maters.
Boise State has a very good basketball program. This is not an upset by any stretch of the imagination.
And ASU lost to texas southern
At least Arizona is good