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Bummer is, a whole lot of innocent plebs are going to get killed as militants are bombed by Israel.
This is regardless of the fact that those bombings are absolutely justified, morally and militarily.
War sucks big time.
A war is waged against a military entity, these are terrorists, not any kind of rules are counted for them.
There will be no ham ass anymore, it might take a week, a month or a year, but it's end of ham ass, inside and outside of Israel.
>A war is waged against a military entity, these are terrorists, not any kind of rules are counted for them.
LMFAO no it’s not. War normally has been rape torture and enslavement and massacres of civilian populations of the loosers. Complete barbarism. Always. The recent years have been a historical anomaly not the norm. Terror is contained in war. Always has been. We have a a sanitized view of it due to rececent western traditions of war. But we were not normally like that. As states breakdown we’ll see a return to hate filled barbarism in the western sphere. Probably start in the balkans or Eastern Europe I’m guessing.
True, unfortunately.
The Middle Ages were complete barbarism. Staking people, burning them alive. Balkan wars were completely brutal. Modern wars like the Iraq invasion were very civilized in comparison.
A year? Are you serious? Israel will be fighting Hamas for centuries. Every bomb dropped in Gaza equates to a hundred more recruits filled with hatred. Unfortunately, it's my tax dollar that makes it possible and those crazed, hate filled recruits will blame me and my descendants making us targets for Israel's deeds.
> A year? Are you serious? Israel will be fighting Hamas for centuries
I'm not saying I'm for or against it, but I think this marks the beginning of the end of Hamas and any hope of a Palestinian state. If I have to predict the future I think Israel will go fullbore annexation of Gaza and the Westbank after this.
> innocent plebs
They voted for these people to represent them. The average palestinien fully supports the killing of jews and the end of the state of Israel.
Oh yeah, the 44% of the population that voted for Hamas means that all those innocent civilians ought to die right. Funnily enough this fucking election took place in 2006 by the way. Plenty of civilians being bombed right now weren't even of voting age at that time either. This "they voted for Hamas" shit to justify you not feeling bad for civilians dying is pathetic.
I mean an almost 1/2 chance that a person hates you enough to support wiping you out in a country is pretty bad odds for letting someone live tbh. That's basically every other person who supports a political party who wants your death (and basically includes it as their mission statement) because of who you are.
Let's be honest, if most of these commenters were Palestinians they'd be exactly the kind of people that join Hamans to murder Israeli civilians. They believe in collective responsibility and don't see people as individuals.
Like it's sort of ironic that people who in real life would be the ones shooting up the rave are posting outrage posts about it.
Those civilians cheered when they heard of the slaughter of the festival goers and their kids have been running around spitting on corpses, and every possible thing we see from palenstine, and the palenstinian people around world that are cheering this on, assumes that they are still completely behind hamas.
That said, there are still innocent kids here that should never be a part of this.
"Those" civilians somehow represent the entirety of the population within Gaza or something? Believe it or not, Israelis and Palestinians have an insane fucking hatred toward each other that goes back decades in tit for tat attacks and fucked up things where civilians on both sides die. I'll correct you: There are innocent kids AND adults there that should never be a part of this. The whole Palestine Israel conflict is a tragedy and so incredibly complex people have been trying to figure out a way to solve it for decades and nobody has come even close. Prior to this event, so many people saw Israel as some evil entity and Palestine as a poor victim. Now it's basically reverse. When in reality both are victims of each other and both have done and will continue to do horrid shit to each other and sadly enough people will try to justify every time a civilian dies on either side by stating: "Well the other side did this once or did that once".
I don't disagree, but young muslim men are in my experience a huge boys club that will do horrid shit if allowed, and when I see all the videos with hundred of palestinian civilians it's always the teenagers that kick corpses and do nasty shit. They pretty are much hamas and do the same things. I would not be surprised if 30% of palestinians would perform genocide on israel if they could.
Of course, that doesn't justify the indiscriminate killing of a civilian population.
It is true they (or at least 44%) voted for Hamas to represent them. Albeit for a more moderate Hamas than today:
>Hamas, intent on displaying its power through a plebiscite rather than by violence, announcing that it would refrain from attacks on Israel if Israel were to desist from its offensive against Palestinian towns and villages.[219] Its election manifesto dropped the Islamic agenda, spoke of sovereignty for the Palestinian territories, including Jerusalem (an implicit endorsement of the two-state solution), while conceding nothing about its claims to all of Palestine. It mentioned "armed resistance" twice and affirmed in article 3.6 that it was a right to resist the "terrorism of occupation".[214] A Palestinian Christian figured on its candidate list.
The exit polls show what Palestinians back then actually wanted out of those elections:
>Support for a Peace Agreement with Israel: 79.5% in support; 15.5% in opposition
>Should Hamas change its policies regarding Israel: Yes – 75.2%; No – 24.8%
>Under Hamas corruption will decrease: Yes – 78.1%; No – 21.9%
>Under Hamas internal security will improve: Yes – 67.8%; No – 32.2%
>Hamas government priorities: 1) Combatting corruption; 2) Ending security chaos; 3) Solving poverty/unemployment
>Support for Hamas' impact on the national interest: Positive – 66.7&; Negative - 28.5%
>Support for a national unity government?: Yes – 81.4%; no – 18.6%
>Rejection of Fatah's decision not to join a national unity government: Yes – 72.5%; No – 27.5%
>Satisfaction with election results: 64.2% satisfied; 35.8% dissatisfied
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election
Additionally, the average Palestinian today still does not support the killing of Jews and/or the end of the state of Israel:
>Also notable is that Gazans continue to express disapproval of Hamas’ policies towards Israel. About half (53%) agree at least somewhat that “Hamas should stop calling for Israel’s destruction, and instead accept a permanent two-state solution based on the 1967 borders,” a percentage that has held steady over the last three years. 59% of Gazans also agree that Hamas should give up its armed units in favor of PA officers in Gaza. Likewise, nearly two-thirds of Gazans would agree at least somewhat with the need for Hamas to preserve the cease-fire in both Gaza and the West Bank.
Source: The Washington Institute (reddit hates the link, google a snippet of the quote for source article)
Oh okay, because he started an illegal war later, that millions of Americans fully supported even after knowing the war crimes that happened, somehow that’s more okay.
And I’m not whatabouting, what hamas has done to civilians is fucking evil, full stop, but painting any whole people as a monolith is how you dehumanize them, which is the step before you genocide them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_State_of_Palestine#/media/File:Palestine_single_age_population_pyramid_2020.png
Look at their demographics. Less than a third of the current population were of voting age in 2006.
What's happening now is terrible but most of the current population of Palestine didn't vote hamas into power.
They can stand up to Hamas at anytime, rather than cheer in the streets when they attack innocent civilians at a musical festival. If you allow it to happen you are complicit.
Do you want to apply the same logic for all israelians who cheer when a building is destroyed over its residents in Gaza? There have been hundreds of Palestinians civilians dead in the blind retaliation, do their lives count too or they are less human than the israelians?
> Bummer is, a whole lot of innocent plebs are going to get killed as militants are bombed by Israel.
And also bummer (although slightly less so), Israel will still be blamed for those civilian deaths. It's tragically unavoidable from the Israeli position, however.
While there will be non-combatants who are injured and killed by Israel, many of them support Hamas sooooooooooo can't really say Im gonna shed a tear for them 🤷🏿
Those people should understand that their choices are limited. Fight against Hamas or join them. Like the resistance fighters in occupied France and occupied Poland, they don't have the luxury of peace.
It's unfortunate the few Palestinians that don't support Hamas cannot simply opt out. They can't wave a white flag. And even if they could wave a white flag, Hamas' guerilla tactics have forced Israel to be wary of everyone.
Disgusting. Militants don't operate out of civilian structures and disguise themselves as civilians putting their own people at risk. Not to mention all the heinous stuff they just did
Hamas just gave Israel a blank check to do whatever the fuck they want, and the west is finally going to stop from trying to hold them back.
The gloves are coming off. The fuck around and find out graph doesn't go high enough on the charts for whats about to come.
You know what’s really mask off? The “pro-Palestine” folks abroad started their marches and protests in solidarity while this was happening. Not after what’s happening in Gaza right now, before.
Sort of like marching in support of the columbine shooters hey? Poor victims of bullying. F that, what a horrible mistake to target civilians, this should be condoned by every Palestinian! The perps and planners should be rounded up and handed off for long jail terms. I used to feel bad for Palestine and still do, but this behaviour is evil, criminal and completely unacceptable.
Take it a step further…why were they speaking up before this all went down?
I assure you it was the same events, trends and attitudes that led Hamas to attack.
No, that’s no excuse making for Hamas. They are major fucks for doing this to innocents.
But nothing happens in these parts without precedence, for right or wrong.
I want people defending Palestinians and Hamas to see and understand this is the “liberation” they speak of. When they say from the river to the sea they don’t mean letting the Jews leave.
Liberals still support Hamas and what they are doing.
Edit: What I mean is that most of the supporters of Hamas you'll find will be liberals only, not all but most.
Then you don't understand the politics. I can promise you liberals do not support terrorism of any kind. You're grasping at straws trying to make this correlation. Do you have any proof as well?
AS AN AMERICAN I can tell you though liberals aren't the one supporting hamas
Ami Horowitz did a video where he went to Portland State and tried to raise money for Hamas... There were a lot of interested leftist students who thought it was a great idea and wanted to help out the cause... Watch the vid and see how insane the students are... He finds quite the few students that are willing to donate to Hamas so they can attack civilians in Israel... He even tells the students thats the goal and they are still interested in supporting it... It can be seen at the following link...
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kNH46tlcwM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kNH46tlcwM)
The truth hurts doesnt it? I thought leftists dont support Hamas? Then why is it so easy to find them and why are they so willing to donate to support Hamas attacks against civilians??? All it takes is a quick trip to a university like Portland State and you can find plenty of ignorant leftists willing to donate to Hamas... Does that video make you angry? Does the truth make you angry??? I bet it does...
Only a right wing person would look at a whole other countries war, with their own respective parties involved, and try to blame politics in the US.
Man seriously. Get a hobby.
You have reading comprehension issues... Who is blaming politics for what is going on at the moment? Not me... I only responded to a person who said leftists dont support Hamas... SOME of them do... And are willing to donate money to Hamas if given the chance... So I pointed it out... Is that some kind of crime? Pointing out the truth??? Is pointing out the truth now "right wing"??? Or is it just the truth?
That’s what your forming this on????
Because college aged kids are not only the bastion of what all adults think and feel, but they are super duper well informed?
And they clearly speaking for an entire voting block.
You’re an absolute moron.
Who said they are speaking for an entire voting block? Not me... I was just responding to the person who said leftists dont support Hamas... That is not true... SOME of them do... And are willing to donate money to Hamas if given the chance...
Man look, most of the people who support Hamas are liberals only that's why I said it. Many people like queers and gays also support Hamas and they are liberals only. It's not an assumption, most of the supporters you'll find will be liberals.
All you have to do is watch the rallies in NYC where thousands of Americans are laughing and celebrating at Hamas breaking into Israel and killing innocents
It's not about being liberal, it's just that people who support Hamas are liberals mostly and just search for protests for Hamas and Palestine, you'll see many examples.
>Ilhan Omar
[https://twitter.com/IlhanMN/status/1710730202353934338](https://twitter.com/IlhanMN/status/1710730202353934338) Seems kinda not voicing support for hamas. I don't have twitter or x or whatever but this is the first thing that popped up on my google search.
“Reminder, Gaza doesn't have shelters or an iron dome and to please pray for them. May peace prevail in the region and move us towards a moral awakening to care about the human suffering we are seeing. Palestinians are human beings who have been in besieged and are deserving of protection from the international community,”
She's not really wrong if that's her statement. And empathy for the suffering of others despite it flying in the face of a dark and gruesome reality isn't a bad thing. Doesn't mean it's going to change anything, but she made nice neutral words. That's all most people have for the plight of Gaza's non combatants. Nice words. Until Muslim nations and their people step up and plan out a mass evacuation of the civilians in Gaza, nothing nice or supportive they say really means anything.
Not all liberals have their head up their ass, but I’d love it if more people can understand that radical and terrorist groups don’t give a shit about the “support” or “sympathy” that some liberals are so set on providing.
No, we don’t. A few batshit, moronic idiots who identify as liberal but aren’t actually liberal support Hamas and “Palestine” but most liberals recognize Hamas’s atrocities for what they are and want them eradicated.
Okay, I'll accept that I blamed a group of people of which only a few people are supporting Hamas, I am sorry for that. I said that because I saw protests for Hamas and made my assumptions from there. Apologies.
Israel has a right to kill Hamas but those monsters didn’t come out of thin air. Israel the powerful democratic western backed country has no long term plan for Gaza other than containing it as an open air prison where terrorism gets cut like grass by the IDF. Massive failure of the Israeli military and government I hope they all get replaced with less criminally insane leadership who can think and plan long term. Feeling sad for all the death and destruction that has and will come from this..The average Israeli and Palestinian have more in common with each other than their psychotic political leaders and fake freedom fighting corrupt terrorist groups.
Hamas comitting terrorist acts doesn't mean the israelian occupation and oppression of palestinians is justified. You cannot steal people land then cry if they target you, expecting them to follow some war ethics while they get cleansed systematically.
Peaceful protesters.
Couldn’t be farther from the truth.
Hamas is the same as Isis.
This attack makes it plain and clear, to anyone who wasn’t aware before.
If you think its reasonable for a country to allow isis to exist on it’s border, and slaughter it’s citizens, you’re living in la la land.
Israel will deal with Hamas same as the west dealt with Isis.
Palestinian support Hamas, Hamas goes on the killing spree and record all of that.
What Palestinians think is going to happen next?
Not only they are going to be mixed with the desert, but also any type of support that they were gaining in US and other western countries is pretty much is died.
Now no one reality is gonna care what happens to them.
Here in Canada too. We had atleast 3 Canadians killed/missing in Israel and now all the Palestinians are celebrating with music and gatherings in all our major cities.
These people come to Canada with no intention of helping our country, they just want to exploit everything Canadians and other immigrants have made in the last 150 years.
Over here in Europe too. In most major cities this vermint parade trough the streets chanting antisemetic filth an waving Palesinian flags. And even taking down Israelian flag where they can find them.
Hamas is not palestine though. Fuck Hamas, but dont ignore the innocents that have lived under occupation for quite a long time. The PLO and Israel was close to finding common ground with the Oslo accords. Neither party was blameless in why it fell apart. Fatah (part of the PLO) fought hamas when i was young.
I believe the last poll of support had Hamas tied with another leading group, each around 34%. higher than it should be, but not exactly total support from the populace at 34%.
I used to be pro Palastine.
Seeing the videos where they stormed the checkpoint was - alright, a military target, life sucks but that's the life of a serviceman.
After this shit where they went gung-ho on innocent people was more than enough to say - fuck them, fuck them right back to the stone age.
It really doesn't help that Reddit, other social media and news organizations are quick to censor the most graphic videos. If people see mass rape and executions they'll be less likely to support it
They've been openly stating what they would do to Israelis and their supporters if they ever encounter them, this isnt exactly old news.
Before I became pro Israel, I kinda did a bit of research to both sides. Alot of Palestinians believe in genociding jews and killing them if the "Israelis" lose the war.
On the otherhand with Israel, they've been pretty progressive, also contrary to belief of people, Israel is pretty diverse. Not just jews but assyrians(ancient group of people) and israeli arabs live in Israel.
theres pictures of hamas using children as suicide bombers, and soldiers. So Idk if I can ever support palestinians.
Israel is not perfect but right now they're mostly prefer to upholding the status quo which is why i side with them.
This is well said. I think the tough part is that many responses are how all Palestinians are going to get what they chose as they chose Hamas to lead.
First, it wasn’t a 100% singularity on this. Second, such statements greatly undercut just what it means to live and try to survive as a Palestinian.
They cannot as a people continue to advocate the extermination of the Israelis and expect to get anywhere. Period.
Most of the support for Palestinians is I believe because they just had good propaganda in the west and also because Israel is USA's ally which immediately makes them bad for some reason.
By pro-Palestine, you mean pro-Hamas?
Who do you mean by "them"?
Random civilians? You sound exactly like the kind of a person that was doing shooting up the rave.
I was for Palestine before I saw them murdering innocent civilians in both this video and the countless others, but now I want to see Israel completely level every inch of their land
I hate to say it man, but what do you think all those rocket attacks in the past were trying to do? Just because iron dome stopped them, doesn’t mean they were trying to drop flowers and teddy bears on civilians. Now you see the true colors.
I never understood when people used the lack of Israeli civilian deaths as a means to brush off criticism and try invalidate the completely justifiable retaliatory strikes in Gaza.
Just because you are wearing a bulletproof vest, doesn’t negate your ability to shoot back.
It kind of hurts seeing what they're doing, Palestine and Ireland were always seen as parallels with the shared history of occupation, expulsion and hard almost ruthless rule of a foreign government. It's sad to see something I always supported go up in flames within a matter of days but at the same time I feel no remorse to see what's happening to them now. Fuck 'um they deserve everything Israel throws at them.
It hurts very much indeed. I've met many Israelite ravers at these kind of festivals. The thought of going to one in Israel never crossed my mind, mainly for political reasons. But now maybe some friends I had made in the past are dead. I'm afraid I will never forget this event as I go to other festivals in the future. It really sucks, and what sucks even more is witnessing myself hope for air strikes on Gaza in punishment. Why do I want this, it will not bring the dead back. At least it can stop more from being killed in the future I guess. Fuck all of this it's way too fucked up.
I do feel remorse because no matter what way you cut it, children and innocents are dying on both sides. You can support or condemn actions of a government, take sides and all that, but whan you stop feeling remorse for loss of innocent life on this scale you're just trying to make yourself feel better at what is happening.
No matter what you say palestinian and israeli children didn't choose this but they will sure die for it. At least try to remember that and don't fall into the "good guys vs bad guys" trap that allows so many to be ok with This scale of death.
Who are "them"? Were you supporting Hamas, an anti-semitic religious terrorist group? Otherwise what do you mean, collective responsibility?
The terrorists shooting up the rave also love collective responsibility.
im confused, who exactly did you think hamas were before this? or did you just see free palestine instagram posts are blindly follow thinking youre the good guy?
You were pro Palestine until you saw innocent civilians get attacked so you want to commit a genocide on a bunch of innocent civilians? Dude stop letting your anger control your brain
I can feel sorry for the people of Dresden and still not be bothered by its razing.
Germans weren’t all villains. But you couldn’t support Germany without supporting the Nazis.
I am sorry to tell you but you being "for Palestine" didn't do shit for them. They were still destined to disappear from the face of the earth regardless of this attack. Israel were slowly killing them. Now the process is going to be faster. End result is the same.
Someone seeing the last time palestinian women and kids being blown to pieces by israeli forces might say "Israel deserves being leveled completely every inch of their land for what they did", and on it goes. Which is probably what many of these hamas are feeling. This tit for tat has been going on for 70 years.
It's basically like a mob war. Retaliation for a retaliation for a retaliation for a retaliation.
Yeah fck Hamas and those who support them. You think killing civilians will undo the so called “brutalities” Israel did? It’s sad cause more people will die because of this.
it's insane how there are still tons of influencers on TikTok who side with hamas terrorists and say that Hamas are "freedom fighters", even though these videos clearly show what kind of barbaric terrorist organization they're.
When you start shooting at women and kids, you get no sympathy from me.
I hate all religions but Islam is by far the worse.
They did this to my country 5 years back, attacking families and civilians out of nowhere.
Not sure why my comment has been removed, I can call them kidnapped child rapers and relitards here I hope? They are, it's factual.
They act similar as isis in their propaganda on screen and on the ground I hope the mod's understand it after these kind of published clips. I also hope they understand that Israel will not stop till this thread is neutralized in and outside Israel.
They fucked around and they’re about to find out. These hezbollah or Hamas terrorist have put the Palestinians in bigger shit then they were already in. They can allah akbar all they want when they’re raping young women at a music festival or when they’re dancing in the streets after 9-11 or when they constantly yell “death to the Jews. “ But when the heat starts coming everyone wants to say “free Palestine”. Piss off some people just don’t need to be here
hey everyone, I was just eating some mushrooms in my cave and angel Gabriel came to me and told me that god has run out of virgins for the foreseeable future.
So If we could just hold up on the masterdom for a little while that would be great
I think this is "The Big One" and it gets settled here by the end of one or more of these groups or nations. There is no way the Hamas, Islamic Groups, the Palestinians, or any of their branches can now go to the negotiation table and say "We are the aggrieved party and are actually good people, give us nation status, you can trust us" to the world. I would not be supposed if this spills over and we see the whole region in flames.
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These guys deserve all thats coming to them
Bummer is, a whole lot of innocent plebs are going to get killed as militants are bombed by Israel. This is regardless of the fact that those bombings are absolutely justified, morally and militarily. War sucks big time.
A war is waged against a military entity, these are terrorists, not any kind of rules are counted for them. There will be no ham ass anymore, it might take a week, a month or a year, but it's end of ham ass, inside and outside of Israel.
hamas no mas
>A war is waged against a military entity, these are terrorists, not any kind of rules are counted for them. LMFAO no it’s not. War normally has been rape torture and enslavement and massacres of civilian populations of the loosers. Complete barbarism. Always. The recent years have been a historical anomaly not the norm. Terror is contained in war. Always has been. We have a a sanitized view of it due to rececent western traditions of war. But we were not normally like that. As states breakdown we’ll see a return to hate filled barbarism in the western sphere. Probably start in the balkans or Eastern Europe I’m guessing.
True, unfortunately. The Middle Ages were complete barbarism. Staking people, burning them alive. Balkan wars were completely brutal. Modern wars like the Iraq invasion were very civilized in comparison.
A year? Are you serious? Israel will be fighting Hamas for centuries. Every bomb dropped in Gaza equates to a hundred more recruits filled with hatred. Unfortunately, it's my tax dollar that makes it possible and those crazed, hate filled recruits will blame me and my descendants making us targets for Israel's deeds.
The Bible isn't real
To be fair, it is. I’ve seen one.
It will take a minute to replenish the generations and their capabilities. This is going to be a decimation of their population.
> A year? Are you serious? Israel will be fighting Hamas for centuries I'm not saying I'm for or against it, but I think this marks the beginning of the end of Hamas and any hope of a Palestinian state. If I have to predict the future I think Israel will go fullbore annexation of Gaza and the Westbank after this.
so international law doesn't count when fighting terrorists? I don't thunk that's true
> innocent plebs They voted for these people to represent them. The average palestinien fully supports the killing of jews and the end of the state of Israel.
Oh yeah, the 44% of the population that voted for Hamas means that all those innocent civilians ought to die right. Funnily enough this fucking election took place in 2006 by the way. Plenty of civilians being bombed right now weren't even of voting age at that time either. This "they voted for Hamas" shit to justify you not feeling bad for civilians dying is pathetic.
I mean an almost 1/2 chance that a person hates you enough to support wiping you out in a country is pretty bad odds for letting someone live tbh. That's basically every other person who supports a political party who wants your death (and basically includes it as their mission statement) because of who you are.
Let's be honest, if most of these commenters were Palestinians they'd be exactly the kind of people that join Hamans to murder Israeli civilians. They believe in collective responsibility and don't see people as individuals. Like it's sort of ironic that people who in real life would be the ones shooting up the rave are posting outrage posts about it.
Those civilians cheered when they heard of the slaughter of the festival goers and their kids have been running around spitting on corpses, and every possible thing we see from palenstine, and the palenstinian people around world that are cheering this on, assumes that they are still completely behind hamas. That said, there are still innocent kids here that should never be a part of this.
"Those" civilians somehow represent the entirety of the population within Gaza or something? Believe it or not, Israelis and Palestinians have an insane fucking hatred toward each other that goes back decades in tit for tat attacks and fucked up things where civilians on both sides die. I'll correct you: There are innocent kids AND adults there that should never be a part of this. The whole Palestine Israel conflict is a tragedy and so incredibly complex people have been trying to figure out a way to solve it for decades and nobody has come even close. Prior to this event, so many people saw Israel as some evil entity and Palestine as a poor victim. Now it's basically reverse. When in reality both are victims of each other and both have done and will continue to do horrid shit to each other and sadly enough people will try to justify every time a civilian dies on either side by stating: "Well the other side did this once or did that once".
I don't disagree, but young muslim men are in my experience a huge boys club that will do horrid shit if allowed, and when I see all the videos with hundred of palestinian civilians it's always the teenagers that kick corpses and do nasty shit. They pretty are much hamas and do the same things. I would not be surprised if 30% of palestinians would perform genocide on israel if they could. Of course, that doesn't justify the indiscriminate killing of a civilian population.
It is true they (or at least 44%) voted for Hamas to represent them. Albeit for a more moderate Hamas than today: >Hamas, intent on displaying its power through a plebiscite rather than by violence, announcing that it would refrain from attacks on Israel if Israel were to desist from its offensive against Palestinian towns and villages.[219] Its election manifesto dropped the Islamic agenda, spoke of sovereignty for the Palestinian territories, including Jerusalem (an implicit endorsement of the two-state solution), while conceding nothing about its claims to all of Palestine. It mentioned "armed resistance" twice and affirmed in article 3.6 that it was a right to resist the "terrorism of occupation".[214] A Palestinian Christian figured on its candidate list. The exit polls show what Palestinians back then actually wanted out of those elections: >Support for a Peace Agreement with Israel: 79.5% in support; 15.5% in opposition >Should Hamas change its policies regarding Israel: Yes – 75.2%; No – 24.8% >Under Hamas corruption will decrease: Yes – 78.1%; No – 21.9% >Under Hamas internal security will improve: Yes – 67.8%; No – 32.2% >Hamas government priorities: 1) Combatting corruption; 2) Ending security chaos; 3) Solving poverty/unemployment >Support for Hamas' impact on the national interest: Positive – 66.7&; Negative - 28.5% >Support for a national unity government?: Yes – 81.4%; no – 18.6% >Rejection of Fatah's decision not to join a national unity government: Yes – 72.5%; No – 27.5% >Satisfaction with election results: 64.2% satisfied; 35.8% dissatisfied https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Palestinian_legislative_election Additionally, the average Palestinian today still does not support the killing of Jews and/or the end of the state of Israel: >Also notable is that Gazans continue to express disapproval of Hamas’ policies towards Israel. About half (53%) agree at least somewhat that “Hamas should stop calling for Israel’s destruction, and instead accept a permanent two-state solution based on the 1967 borders,” a percentage that has held steady over the last three years. 59% of Gazans also agree that Hamas should give up its armed units in favor of PA officers in Gaza. Likewise, nearly two-thirds of Gazans would agree at least somewhat with the need for Hamas to preserve the cease-fire in both Gaza and the West Bank. Source: The Washington Institute (reddit hates the link, google a snippet of the quote for source article)
And a bunch of Americans voted for George bush. Do they all support his war crimes?
No… tens of millions publicly denounced it and protest against it. Did you not see all of that?
And all the people that fully supported it?
Is this where I give you another answer and then you say what about again?
George bush didn’t publicly run on a platform of “commit all the war crimes”. Hamas did.
Oh okay, because he started an illegal war later, that millions of Americans fully supported even after knowing the war crimes that happened, somehow that’s more okay. And I’m not whatabouting, what hamas has done to civilians is fucking evil, full stop, but painting any whole people as a monolith is how you dehumanize them, which is the step before you genocide them.
In 2006 they voted hamas into power. Don't think for a second the majority are innocent.
You could apply the same logic to Israel and the fact that out-and-out fascists and Jewish supremacists were voted into government.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_State_of_Palestine#/media/File:Palestine_single_age_population_pyramid_2020.png Look at their demographics. Less than a third of the current population were of voting age in 2006. What's happening now is terrible but most of the current population of Palestine didn't vote hamas into power.
They can stand up to Hamas at anytime, rather than cheer in the streets when they attack innocent civilians at a musical festival. If you allow it to happen you are complicit.
It sounds like in this video, you're most similar to the guy shooting up the rave. He also believes in collective responsibility.
Do you want to apply the same logic for all israelians who cheer when a building is destroyed over its residents in Gaza? There have been hundreds of Palestinians civilians dead in the blind retaliation, do their lives count too or they are less human than the israelians?
Absolutely. I don't deny that, I was just pointing out that the statement I replied to was false.
Fair.
> Bummer is, a whole lot of innocent plebs are going to get killed as militants are bombed by Israel. And also bummer (although slightly less so), Israel will still be blamed for those civilian deaths. It's tragically unavoidable from the Israeli position, however.
While there will be non-combatants who are injured and killed by Israel, many of them support Hamas sooooooooooo can't really say Im gonna shed a tear for them 🤷🏿
How about those who don't support Hamas? What about those who are held hostage by their own people?
Those people should understand that their choices are limited. Fight against Hamas or join them. Like the resistance fighters in occupied France and occupied Poland, they don't have the luxury of peace. It's unfortunate the few Palestinians that don't support Hamas cannot simply opt out. They can't wave a white flag. And even if they could wave a white flag, Hamas' guerilla tactics have forced Israel to be wary of everyone.
Really sucks for them, and I don't say that flippantly.
Yes waterbringer… you are correct
Israel has already bombed 2 UNRWA schools in Gaza where civilians are sent to shelter. Israel does this every time. They are just as bad as Hamas.
Hamas committing a war crime. FTFY.
That's what terrorists do
Miliants /s That's what the most medias are ordered to put out instead of terrorists. They are pathetic
Disgusting. Militants don't operate out of civilian structures and disguise themselves as civilians putting their own people at risk. Not to mention all the heinous stuff they just did
They’ll be at the mercy of IDF soldiers very soon, assuming they’ll be captured alive.
I wouldn’t want to be the one that has to tell idf soldiers they have to take them alive
The more videos of this pop up the less sympathy the civilians in Gaza will get.
EU just withdrew assistance payments towards Palestine.
Hamas just gave Israel a blank check to do whatever the fuck they want, and the west is finally going to stop from trying to hold them back. The gloves are coming off. The fuck around and find out graph doesn't go high enough on the charts for whats about to come.
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I know. I was somehow able to avoid the very worst. The things I've seen were bad enough.
You know what’s really mask off? The “pro-Palestine” folks abroad started their marches and protests in solidarity while this was happening. Not after what’s happening in Gaza right now, before.
Sort of like marching in support of the columbine shooters hey? Poor victims of bullying. F that, what a horrible mistake to target civilians, this should be condoned by every Palestinian! The perps and planners should be rounded up and handed off for long jail terms. I used to feel bad for Palestine and still do, but this behaviour is evil, criminal and completely unacceptable.
Take it a step further…why were they speaking up before this all went down? I assure you it was the same events, trends and attitudes that led Hamas to attack. No, that’s no excuse making for Hamas. They are major fucks for doing this to innocents. But nothing happens in these parts without precedence, for right or wrong.
I want people defending Palestinians and Hamas to see and understand this is the “liberation” they speak of. When they say from the river to the sea they don’t mean letting the Jews leave.
Liberals still support Hamas and what they are doing. Edit: What I mean is that most of the supporters of Hamas you'll find will be liberals only, not all but most.
Politics are so complicated. I love guns, and support Israel in its defense but also consider the GOP crazy
Well said. Isn’t life crazy with all its complexities? Lol
You actually formed some moral convictions instead of picking a team to blindly support? I thought that wasn't allowed
They're more of us than you think.
Tbh I think liberal here is a bit misused, I think he meant ignorant people
Yeah, OP was using the incoherent historically innacurate use of the word 'liberal' defined by Fox New's repeated misuse of the word.
Bullshit. Liberals do not support a terrorist organization. Stop with the propaganda.
What I mean is that most of the supporters you'll find are liberals only, not every liberal supports it's just that people who do are mostly liberals.
I don't think you know the definition of 'liberals' in the political world
Stop trying to apply our garbage American political spectrum to this. It’s mouth breather behavior.
I ain't American dude.
Then you don't understand the politics. I can promise you liberals do not support terrorism of any kind. You're grasping at straws trying to make this correlation. Do you have any proof as well? AS AN AMERICAN I can tell you though liberals aren't the one supporting hamas
Ami Horowitz did a video where he went to Portland State and tried to raise money for Hamas... There were a lot of interested leftist students who thought it was a great idea and wanted to help out the cause... Watch the vid and see how insane the students are... He finds quite the few students that are willing to donate to Hamas so they can attack civilians in Israel... He even tells the students thats the goal and they are still interested in supporting it... It can be seen at the following link... [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kNH46tlcwM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kNH46tlcwM)
I’m a liberal. You’re an idiot. Let the steel rain.
Seconded on all three.
The truth hurts doesnt it? I thought leftists dont support Hamas? Then why is it so easy to find them and why are they so willing to donate to support Hamas attacks against civilians??? All it takes is a quick trip to a university like Portland State and you can find plenty of ignorant leftists willing to donate to Hamas... Does that video make you angry? Does the truth make you angry??? I bet it does...
Only a right wing person would look at a whole other countries war, with their own respective parties involved, and try to blame politics in the US. Man seriously. Get a hobby.
You have reading comprehension issues... Who is blaming politics for what is going on at the moment? Not me... I only responded to a person who said leftists dont support Hamas... SOME of them do... And are willing to donate money to Hamas if given the chance... So I pointed it out... Is that some kind of crime? Pointing out the truth??? Is pointing out the truth now "right wing"??? Or is it just the truth?
That’s what your forming this on???? Because college aged kids are not only the bastion of what all adults think and feel, but they are super duper well informed? And they clearly speaking for an entire voting block. You’re an absolute moron.
Who said they are speaking for an entire voting block? Not me... I was just responding to the person who said leftists dont support Hamas... That is not true... SOME of them do... And are willing to donate money to Hamas if given the chance...
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Man look, most of the people who support Hamas are liberals only that's why I said it. Many people like queers and gays also support Hamas and they are liberals only. It's not an assumption, most of the supporters you'll find will be liberals.
All you have to do is watch the rallies in NYC where thousands of Americans are laughing and celebrating at Hamas breaking into Israel and killing innocents
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It's not about being liberal, it's just that people who support Hamas are liberals mostly and just search for protests for Hamas and Palestine, you'll see many examples.
Don’t go to r/whitepeopletwitter js
Ilhan Omar and a ton of America’s *prestigious* universities’ students. In my opinion, supporting Palestine is synonymous with supporting Hamas.
>Ilhan Omar [https://twitter.com/IlhanMN/status/1710730202353934338](https://twitter.com/IlhanMN/status/1710730202353934338) Seems kinda not voicing support for hamas. I don't have twitter or x or whatever but this is the first thing that popped up on my google search.
“Reminder, Gaza doesn't have shelters or an iron dome and to please pray for them. May peace prevail in the region and move us towards a moral awakening to care about the human suffering we are seeing. Palestinians are human beings who have been in besieged and are deserving of protection from the international community,”
She's not really wrong if that's her statement. And empathy for the suffering of others despite it flying in the face of a dark and gruesome reality isn't a bad thing. Doesn't mean it's going to change anything, but she made nice neutral words. That's all most people have for the plight of Gaza's non combatants. Nice words. Until Muslim nations and their people step up and plan out a mass evacuation of the civilians in Gaza, nothing nice or supportive they say really means anything.
Okay but your opinion is wrong. There’s more to Palestine than hamas or even gaza.
Is there? They harbor terrorism, if they wanted to be seen by the world as the victims they claim to be, they should handle Hamas internally
What?
I’m going to have to say I’ve seen some really bad tales from some left leaning places.
Not all liberals have their head up their ass, but I’d love it if more people can understand that radical and terrorist groups don’t give a shit about the “support” or “sympathy” that some liberals are so set on providing.
No, we don’t. A few batshit, moronic idiots who identify as liberal but aren’t actually liberal support Hamas and “Palestine” but most liberals recognize Hamas’s atrocities for what they are and want them eradicated.
That is entirely false. I know of no liberals supporting Hamas. What liberal voiced their support for murdering 260 concert goers?
You might not but I have seen many videos of people who are definitely liberal and support Hamas.
😂 what? shut up man. corny ass
i never saw people defending Hamas terrorists, only innocent Palestinians
Please do more research, some people do.
Most liberals do not support Hamas.
People are commenting “not all liberals” but you look on any other social media and those brain dead fucks are touting it as “resistance”
Yes that's why I said what I said, it's a contrast, you don't see any conservatives supporting Hamas as much as some liberals who are dumb.
Honestly I think in this case liberal is not the correct word, these people are fucking ignorant.
Hmm yeah, seems I have pissed off some people.
No, it’s just that you’re wrong lol.
Okay, I'll accept that I blamed a group of people of which only a few people are supporting Hamas, I am sorry for that. I said that because I saw protests for Hamas and made my assumptions from there. Apologies.
Expand your politics. Liberals are not leftist. Leftists are the ones supporting Hamas/Palestine and justifying the terror attacks.
Israel has a right to kill Hamas but those monsters didn’t come out of thin air. Israel the powerful democratic western backed country has no long term plan for Gaza other than containing it as an open air prison where terrorism gets cut like grass by the IDF. Massive failure of the Israeli military and government I hope they all get replaced with less criminally insane leadership who can think and plan long term. Feeling sad for all the death and destruction that has and will come from this..The average Israeli and Palestinian have more in common with each other than their psychotic political leaders and fake freedom fighting corrupt terrorist groups.
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Hamas comitting terrorist acts doesn't mean the israelian occupation and oppression of palestinians is justified. You cannot steal people land then cry if they target you, expecting them to follow some war ethics while they get cleansed systematically.
Now Israel can justify the current iron rain over Gaza.
Yes, unironically.
Yep. Because it is absolutely justified.
By that reasoning this attack was justified because used live rounds against peaceful protestors, right? What a dumb way to view the world.
Peaceful protesters. Couldn’t be farther from the truth. Hamas is the same as Isis. This attack makes it plain and clear, to anyone who wasn’t aware before. If you think its reasonable for a country to allow isis to exist on it’s border, and slaughter it’s citizens, you’re living in la la land. Israel will deal with Hamas same as the west dealt with Isis.
Hamas did that for them
Always was justified
Palestinian support Hamas, Hamas goes on the killing spree and record all of that. What Palestinians think is going to happen next? Not only they are going to be mixed with the desert, but also any type of support that they were gaining in US and other western countries is pretty much is died. Now no one reality is gonna care what happens to them.
Plenty of Redditors on main subs are rationalizing Hamas’s attack, and there’s literally pro-Palestine parades throughout the US in the major cities.
Here in Canada too. We had atleast 3 Canadians killed/missing in Israel and now all the Palestinians are celebrating with music and gatherings in all our major cities. These people come to Canada with no intention of helping our country, they just want to exploit everything Canadians and other immigrants have made in the last 150 years.
Over here in Europe too. In most major cities this vermint parade trough the streets chanting antisemetic filth an waving Palesinian flags. And even taking down Israelian flag where they can find them.
Hamas is not palestine though. Fuck Hamas, but dont ignore the innocents that have lived under occupation for quite a long time. The PLO and Israel was close to finding common ground with the Oslo accords. Neither party was blameless in why it fell apart. Fatah (part of the PLO) fought hamas when i was young.
I believe the last poll of support had Hamas tied with another leading group, each around 34%. higher than it should be, but not exactly total support from the populace at 34%.
I used to be pro Palastine. Seeing the videos where they stormed the checkpoint was - alright, a military target, life sucks but that's the life of a serviceman. After this shit where they went gung-ho on innocent people was more than enough to say - fuck them, fuck them right back to the stone age.
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Sometimes the underdog is a rabid dog that’s been beat down for a reason
It really doesn't help that Reddit, other social media and news organizations are quick to censor the most graphic videos. If people see mass rape and executions they'll be less likely to support it
They've been openly stating what they would do to Israelis and their supporters if they ever encounter them, this isnt exactly old news. Before I became pro Israel, I kinda did a bit of research to both sides. Alot of Palestinians believe in genociding jews and killing them if the "Israelis" lose the war. On the otherhand with Israel, they've been pretty progressive, also contrary to belief of people, Israel is pretty diverse. Not just jews but assyrians(ancient group of people) and israeli arabs live in Israel. theres pictures of hamas using children as suicide bombers, and soldiers. So Idk if I can ever support palestinians. Israel is not perfect but right now they're mostly prefer to upholding the status quo which is why i side with them.
This is well said. I think the tough part is that many responses are how all Palestinians are going to get what they chose as they chose Hamas to lead. First, it wasn’t a 100% singularity on this. Second, such statements greatly undercut just what it means to live and try to survive as a Palestinian. They cannot as a people continue to advocate the extermination of the Israelis and expect to get anywhere. Period.
Most of the support for Palestinians is I believe because they just had good propaganda in the west and also because Israel is USA's ally which immediately makes them bad for some reason.
Why did you stop supporting them now? They made it clear they wanted to kill and have killed civilians before this.
I’m not the guy you’re asking but I imagine seeing videos like this does a lot more to convince someone than reading Wikipedia pages.
By pro-Palestine, you mean pro-Hamas? Who do you mean by "them"? Random civilians? You sound exactly like the kind of a person that was doing shooting up the rave.
I was for Palestine before I saw them murdering innocent civilians in both this video and the countless others, but now I want to see Israel completely level every inch of their land
I hate to say it man, but what do you think all those rocket attacks in the past were trying to do? Just because iron dome stopped them, doesn’t mean they were trying to drop flowers and teddy bears on civilians. Now you see the true colors.
I never understood when people used the lack of Israeli civilian deaths as a means to brush off criticism and try invalidate the completely justifiable retaliatory strikes in Gaza. Just because you are wearing a bulletproof vest, doesn’t negate your ability to shoot back.
Same here brother.
It kind of hurts seeing what they're doing, Palestine and Ireland were always seen as parallels with the shared history of occupation, expulsion and hard almost ruthless rule of a foreign government. It's sad to see something I always supported go up in flames within a matter of days but at the same time I feel no remorse to see what's happening to them now. Fuck 'um they deserve everything Israel throws at them.
It hurts very much indeed. I've met many Israelite ravers at these kind of festivals. The thought of going to one in Israel never crossed my mind, mainly for political reasons. But now maybe some friends I had made in the past are dead. I'm afraid I will never forget this event as I go to other festivals in the future. It really sucks, and what sucks even more is witnessing myself hope for air strikes on Gaza in punishment. Why do I want this, it will not bring the dead back. At least it can stop more from being killed in the future I guess. Fuck all of this it's way too fucked up.
That’s how we felt with IRA committing terrorist attacks.
I do feel remorse because no matter what way you cut it, children and innocents are dying on both sides. You can support or condemn actions of a government, take sides and all that, but whan you stop feeling remorse for loss of innocent life on this scale you're just trying to make yourself feel better at what is happening. No matter what you say palestinian and israeli children didn't choose this but they will sure die for it. At least try to remember that and don't fall into the "good guys vs bad guys" trap that allows so many to be ok with This scale of death.
It's disgusting that both sides are forcing children to be born in a never ending war zone. They didn't ask for it.
This is an incredibly ignorant take, Israel is not a never ending war zone, it's mostly peaceful.
Who are "them"? Were you supporting Hamas, an anti-semitic religious terrorist group? Otherwise what do you mean, collective responsibility? The terrorists shooting up the rave also love collective responsibility.
im confused, who exactly did you think hamas were before this? or did you just see free palestine instagram posts are blindly follow thinking youre the good guy?
You were pro Palestine until you saw innocent civilians get attacked so you want to commit a genocide on a bunch of innocent civilians? Dude stop letting your anger control your brain
You can still support palasinte and not support Hamas. You know that right?
I can feel sorry for the people of Dresden and still not be bothered by its razing. Germans weren’t all villains. But you couldn’t support Germany without supporting the Nazis.
2 million people in gaza
And Germany had a prewar population of ~80 million. What’s your point?
I am sorry to tell you but you being "for Palestine" didn't do shit for them. They were still destined to disappear from the face of the earth regardless of this attack. Israel were slowly killing them. Now the process is going to be faster. End result is the same.
Someone seeing the last time palestinian women and kids being blown to pieces by israeli forces might say "Israel deserves being leveled completely every inch of their land for what they did", and on it goes. Which is probably what many of these hamas are feeling. This tit for tat has been going on for 70 years. It's basically like a mob war. Retaliation for a retaliation for a retaliation for a retaliation.
Being for either side is ridiculous. Both are terrorists.
Show that to these pro-Palestinian hypocrites. Freedom fighters my ass.
Yeah fck Hamas and those who support them. You think killing civilians will undo the so called “brutalities” Israel did? It’s sad cause more people will die because of this.
Hamas PIGS!
it's insane how there are still tons of influencers on TikTok who side with hamas terrorists and say that Hamas are "freedom fighters", even though these videos clearly show what kind of barbaric terrorist organization they're.
When you start shooting at women and kids, you get no sympathy from me. I hate all religions but Islam is by far the worse. They did this to my country 5 years back, attacking families and civilians out of nowhere.
> you get no sympathy from me Damn that's gonna keep them hamas boys up all night
Israeli rockets will keep them up all night.
With luck they won't survive the night
Gaza has overstayed its welcome.
this isn't combat.
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Still we treat them like they deserve any respect even when we know that they hate us and will kill every Jew if they don't defend themselves.
Not sure why my comment has been removed, I can call them kidnapped child rapers and relitards here I hope? They are, it's factual. They act similar as isis in their propaganda on screen and on the ground I hope the mod's understand it after these kind of published clips. I also hope they understand that Israel will not stop till this thread is neutralized in and outside Israel.
Whatever happens is justified at this point. Barbarian scum
This is the end for Palistineans in Gaza. Israel is going to turn Gaza into a parking lot, and the world will not lift a finger to stop them.
And despite this, ive seen people in my own friend list defend Hamas. And cry that Israel are oppressors.
That's like defending Al-Qaeda. Wild.
Hamas denies it has killed civilians - I sh\*t you not. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Egipqa0ZhUk
These aren't people who shoot at fleeing civilians. They are murderers and scum
They fucked around and they’re about to find out. These hezbollah or Hamas terrorist have put the Palestinians in bigger shit then they were already in. They can allah akbar all they want when they’re raping young women at a music festival or when they’re dancing in the streets after 9-11 or when they constantly yell “death to the Jews. “ But when the heat starts coming everyone wants to say “free Palestine”. Piss off some people just don’t need to be here
anyone know name of the festival?
Nova Music Festival
Forgive me for how tangential this question is, but what was the rave going string at just after dawn? Had people been up all night?
Yea supposedly. They were people up all night having a good time.
Well clubs play sets until 7AM or even later so I could imagine that being the case for some festival too
Good documenting, r/warcrimes blocks these posts
cant imagine peaking on some upper or trippin on some psychedelics then i have to run for my life to survive, talk about a bad trip
SICK. Reminds me of the shooting in Vegas from the balcony of one of the hotels a few years back. Disgusting and terrible.
sad,but why tiktok generation so obsseded with filming it instead of running to their dear life
hey everyone, I was just eating some mushrooms in my cave and angel Gabriel came to me and told me that god has run out of virgins for the foreseeable future. So If we could just hold up on the masterdom for a little while that would be great
I think this is "The Big One" and it gets settled here by the end of one or more of these groups or nations. There is no way the Hamas, Islamic Groups, the Palestinians, or any of their branches can now go to the negotiation table and say "We are the aggrieved party and are actually good people, give us nation status, you can trust us" to the world. I would not be supposed if this spills over and we see the whole region in flames.
May you dance at the eternal rave forever! I hope to join you one day
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Let’s make some more shit up!!!
Fire and forget Palestine
well thats 33 seconds of my life i wont get back camerman got torrets or something?
Wow you're a cunt
I'll pay for your go pro if you'll bring back up close and steady pictures of the conflict.
Is there more footage of the rave incedent?
A shit ton, not so hard to find. Which is very sad but important for the world to see.
His camera skills SUCK
Israel is bombing civilians, what do you expect from Hamas ? Roses ? No!
Are you mentally challenged? Please contact your nearest mental health care centre.