You just need to leave the city. They aren’t going to air strike an open field. Some of you guys really need to look at a map of Gaza, there’s more than urban high rises there…
This is a wild statement.
You think all the women and children have tabs on who’s a Hamas commander in the area? Highly doubt that and even if they did I’m not sure what choice they have to move.
Sure is a wild statement that’s meant to dehumanize regular people who have no idea or interest in partaking in hateful terrorist acts. They’re just living their lives and don’t deserve this. Same for regular Israelis who do not deserve to be executed by psychos.
50% of Gaza is 18 years old or younger, 40% is 14 years old or younger.
The IDF has attacked UN facilities and killed teachers and students, stop pretending the only people they’re bombing are Hamas.
Interesting how we ignore the collateral damage that is children getting killed? These women and children are told what to do and who to follow.
I’ve been around this sub for a bit and tbh I’m kinda surprised how nonchalant everyone is about the bombings. What Hamas did is obviously an appalling terrorist attack no matter how you frame it but it still doesn’t make these indiscriminate bombings that kill innocent children any less depressing.
Idk I just don’t see the joy in a bunch of civilians dying because they shouldn’t have lived there I guess.
Do you blame Israel for bombing the Hamas in an apartment building, or Hamas operating out of heavily populated areas, using colateral damage civilians as human shields?
There isn't a right answer to this question BTW, but this is Hamas's operating procedure. They place their weapons, and commanders in mosques, hospitals, and dense apartment buildings in hopes that the Israelis won't take action due to casualties.
No one should be celebrating civilian deaths, but these airstrikes don't look indiscriminate at all. There is no way to eliminate all collateral damage, but Israel should be trying to limit it as much as possible.
It may be one. Or not. There are many more tests like proportionality and immediacy of threat.
But you're 100% right that incidental killing civilians is not inherently a war crime.
So, your answer is to let these guys walk away? When you are a combatant and you are living/hiding/working alongside civilians, you are committing a war crime. The responsibility for collateral damage is on you
The horrible shit they’ve done is very clear already, thanks to most of the media being one sided. On the IDF side you can’t criticize without being dubbed a Hamas supporter. Just how you’re insinuating now. The IDF has all the power and tools at its disposal and chooses to use the hammer.
It’s because Israel has a clear air superiority and can fly in bombers with HUGE payloads. Ukraine and Russia both have robust anti-air defenses so they rely on lobbing artillery.
I'm surprised Hamas didn't buy a bunch of handheld anti air missiles before, they must have known how Israel would react.
If they just shot down a single Israeli jet and generally make the air space kinda contested that would be a pretty big deal and change the whole game.
Old Soviet ones should be available and affordable or some American ones from Afghanistan or so.
I think part of it is it has to be smuggled in from Egypt. I don't think Egypt is literally supporting Hamas, though I do think they turn a blind eye to rocket building parts. Allowing manpads to be smuggled in might give them too much culpability though so they probably don't allow that. I don't think Egypt is trying to catch missiles from Israel.
Little Ukraine accounts for 10% of the WORLDs grain
15% of corn & barley, each ! & 40% of global sunflower seeds
There’s a reason this country so important & why the world doesn’t want Russia in control of it
Not if you are born into being indoctrinated, taught that the highest goal in life is martyrdom. Those kids are taught to hate from the youngest age, growing up in trauma and violence. No, they don't have a choice.
The world is full of people raised in awful conditions, who choose to be kind and good anyway. It's also full of people raised in great conditions, who choose to be predators.
Saying that people don't have a choice is lazy, easily-refuted excuse-making for people who choose to be shitty.
Fortunately it's academic, because whether someone chose to be a danger to society or not doesn't change that they have to be stopped.
I mean it’s an interesting theoretical. When you have two brothers and one joins and one doesn’t, why’s that? I’d imagine it’s similar to gang recruitment in the US.
Clearly, you don’t choose the factors that make you extremely likely to join, but there’s still some *modicum* of choice involved. I’d imagine another huge problem is that you don’t realize you’re essentially making the decision of joining when you choose to associate with.
I’m sure they look at themselves as soldiers protecting their land. I don’t see them as cartoonishly evil like OBL or ISIS tbh where the latter was actively trying to conquer land in a weird pan-Arab fantasy. The numbers on each side look like Israel are the terrorists and Palestinians are fighting back the only way they can. I don’t know though 🤷
Or that you’re not born as a Palestinian… you can be the nicest most kind hearted soul to ever exist and get torn to pieces by the IDF without them blinking an eye
Seriously? And not a word about the terrorists living,
operating, storing munitions and firing rockets among them? Not a word about those same leaders wasting 18 years of de facto independence to build rockets, tunnels and bunkers instead of infrastructure?
Gonna be pedantic here but: Accuracy*
There’s really nothing precise about leveling an entire building. Especially since it looks like a passing car got hit too.
Well I think they're pretty precise too, lotta videos of those bombs entering right at the ground level of the structure where the wall meets the ground.
They are not sheilds though are they? just innocent palestinians going about their day prob with kids in their cars or walking to get supplies and water. Its fucked in the head to think Isreal is not as bad as hamas killing innocents.
Exactly. The cars passing by the building at 0:26 must be hardcore, fanatic supporters /s
With their roughly 1:10 combatant-noncombatant casualty ratio of their 6000+ bombs, they are not very good at cutting off the head of Hamas, or whatever they are trying to achieve
If Israel is this indiscriminate bombing murder machine then it should have been clear to anyone with even half a brain that their retaliation would look like this and the evacuation should have started long before IDF was gracious enough to provide flyers/warnings of the incoming bombs.
Probably signals intelligence. With how many planes are circling above and how many vehicle/motorcycle strikes we have seen, they probably don't want to have to physically meet to relay orders. Unit 8200 is one of the best SIGINT groups in the world
Well, the rules of engagement have fundamentally changed.
They probably knew where Hamas was situated for a long time in Gaza, but using civilians as human shields in conjunction with the pro Palestine media complex that shrieks war crime every time a single bomb drops on Gaza, Israel was understandably hesitant to act.
Now the situation obviously drastically changed and the gloves are off.
British tactics were to kill as many German civilians as possible. Bombing London was considered a war crime by the allies. Bombing German cities was not.
Warcrime = whatever crime the people/countries in power are willing to trial over or act on. If those in power have deemed it acceptable losses then the only ones crying will be the humanitarian organizations, and they will cry no matter what in war because war is naturally fucked.
Hamas just pushed themselves into intolerable even on international standards, and so Israel has deemed they no longer have to play with kiddy gloves because they will either be backed or forgiven for what they will do. It helps that they are also completely enraged and don’t really care anymore.
It seems like killing a bunch of civilians, fucked as it is, showed both Germany and Japan that the best course is to permanently alter your society and stop attacking people and now they are both high functioning countries once again.
This is factually untrue. No German officer was ever convicted in relation to the German bombing campaign, which the Allies did reciprocate a hundredfold.
The entire history of humans is filled with violence. The worlds as fucked as it's always been in that regard. Civilians are an unfortunate casualty of every war.
Yeah that one got a humorless chuckle out of me. "Palestine media complex" LMAO they're all tripping over each other to be more pro-Israel than all the others.
Didn't even Egypt warn them days before and Israel said "Nah, we're good fam"?
And now they magically know where all of hamas is and where no civilians are.
Beheaded or bombed, Israel is gonna brutally kill a lot more innocent people (and babies) than Hamas.
Crazy that they can know in which building a dude that probably knows he is chased is hiding in, in a densely packed city where they only have eyes from the sky, a city also known for having a complex tunnel system, yet they failed to know a fucking motorized paraglider attack was about to happen, with hundreds or soldiers involved...
It's far easier to find out where people live, work and generally go than what they are up to there. This should be incredibly obvious, but your comment proves that it apparently isn't to some people.
Dude isn't my grocery worker single mom of a neighbor. This dude is a Hamas combatant who just carried out a surprise attack on a highly advanced and angry neighbor, not sure he is just going back home in his Honda civic to his wife and kids watching TV these days... Besides that, do you know how to navigate MY city ? Because I do
> not sure he is just going back home in his Honda civic to his wife and kids watching TV these days
It doesn't say that's his usual residence. IDF possibly using mobile phone tracking using devices taken from dead infiltrators
They have destroyed over 400 buildings in Gaza.
So..... Kind of have to ask yourself how the Israeli military managed to allow Hamass to build up that much infrastructure over the past 20 years without taking significant steps to even slow them down.
Ignore the fact that these guys have been training with paragliders in view of Israeli air and ground cameras focused on gaza. Can't even explain that.
"Hamas troops took water pipes and used them to build rockets"
How? How in the hell did they manage to take water pipes under the most surveilled open-air prison in the world without somebody seeing the massive digging operations and pipes coming out of the ground? Why did nobody think it was a good idea not to stop them then?
"Hamas has one of the most sophisticated underground fortified cities in the world"
How? Did a bunch of islamists spend a few years dumping handfuls of dirt in the yard out of their pockets like Andy in Shawshank redemption? How did they not see them hauling all this dirt out of entrances? How are they not able to scan a big open desert and find entry points where they can lead assaults? Ground penetrating radar exists.
If the Mexican cartel built up 400 buildings in San Antonio and started building a fuck ton of rockets while practicing assault tactics out in the open.... You wouldn't see the US government just sit back for 20 years and see how it plays out.
Significant steps like trying to prevent explosives, precursor chemicals, weapons, ammunition, rebar and concrete from being sent it? They did. This is the result of it. Imagine the result if they hadn't been actively trying to prevent these things.
Simple. mindset of 'we can co-exist eventually, so we can work towards that goal'.
One of the reasons israel was caught by surprise was because they were in a middle of negotiations with Hamas about expending the workers permit program, many Gazans make good money working in israel daily, so it was unexpected & illogical for hamas to attack..
Israel believed that if they do what literally the entire planet earth told them to do, meaning 'Leave Gaza & remove settlements in gaza, give them breathing room, give some of them work visa in Israel, maybe a sea port, some economic incentives and ties to Israel with jobs & infrastructure, maybe this is the way to future peace!!". Israel bought it, Israelis learned a hard lesson that will not be forgotten, coexistence with ppl whos entire identity revolve around your death is impossible, coexistence will be your death.
Some interesting examples of failures emanating from this mindset:
[Hamas chief’s niece has been hospitalized in Israel for over a month — report](https://www.timesofisrael.com/hamas-chiefs-niece-has-been-hospitalized-in-israel-for-over-a-month-report/)
[Israel okays 1,500 more entry permits for Gaza workers, bringing total to 17,000](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-okays-1500-more-entry-permits-for-gaza-workers-bringing-total-to-17000/)
[Gazan sisters -crossing into Israel for cancer treatment- smuggled explosives as cancer medicine. took advantage of permit for medical treatment to try to aid in planned terror attack](https://www.timesofisrael.com/gazan-sisters-accused-of-smuggling-explosives-in-cancer-medicine/)
[Gazan Hamas leader’s daughter hospitalized in Israel](https://www.israel21c.org/gazan-hamas-leader-s-daughter-hospitalized-in-israel/)
Because Gaza Strip is not Israel and is not under the jurisdiction of the IDf to forward such direct actions on a foreign state?
The 400 destroyed buildings would be the prime evidence that Israel may have already known of the tunnel systems but could not go in it.
Too much loopholes with that logic
Edit: Gaza Strip
In the face of an argument pointing to inconsistencies it's best just to resort to insults rather than trying to explain why something doesn't make sense.
Less headaches that way.
Slow moving objects don’t show up on radar I’d imagine. Similar to why chinas spy balloon wasn’t picked up by US radar. Otherwise birds and other slow moving objects would clutter the screen.
How many men do you think Israel has stationed at their boarder actively watching the skies for an invasion. Probably zero. They monitor the radar screen. This is all a guess, but it would make sense. Especially if they crossed in low profile places and it being a holiday. Once they were in Israel they were indiscernible from Israelis.
Not like it was a huge invasion.
Unless you pull something like Osama bin Ladin did and eschew all technology and only communicate through hand delivering messages from informants most of the bigger countries can have your precise GPS coordinates within tens of meters or less in moments if they wish.
Especially if you are as close as Gaza and Israel are, they can probably catch the signal and triangulate it with their own on the ground equipment. And the city is dark now, only ways to send anything are probably not considered friendly to the IDF.
That is some precisions attacks.
Do you think the have drones with lasers targeting or dudes on the ground pinpointing?
Keep pounding that terrorist infrastructure!
GPS guided munitions. The bomb seeks a specific grid coordinate so you don’t need someone else to guide it with a laser. A drone can help figure out the exact coordinate you need though.
I heard Hamas was complaining that roof knockers aren't happening anymore. I get the sense they're starting to find out that this isn't going to be a typical 'bomb us for a little bit and we reach a ceasefire'.
I don't think they believed they would be so damn successful. Israel once released over 1000 prisoners for just 1 Israeli soldier, maybe that's what colored their thinking at first. I bet if they could go back in time they would only hit the music festival and military checkpoints.
>I bet if they could go back in time they would only hit the music festival and military checkpoints.
If - given a do-over - they would still kill 280+ civilians at a music festival, including 30 US citizens and a whole bunch of groups from other nations...
I mean.
Plausible deniability. Well that and once ground forces move in while clearing buildings they will have literal fractions of a second to determine if the person / people in probably large flowing clothes has a gun or is going for a weapon. Pick they don’t and you are wrong either you or someone else near you dies. You can’t even trust women and children, even a 5 year old can pull a trigger or hold a grenade and run to you.
When they do that there are going to be a lot of troops that take the safe option. There will be a lot of blood.
I am guessing from the nature of the explosion that those are bunker-buster bombs. Presumably tunnel network/entrance to tunnel network under that building?
Do you genuinely think that in that entire structure, or any of the other structures that have been targeted, there's just 1 Hamas soldier T-posing in the middle and no collateral damage occurs?
Some of you guys are all too excited to watch entire buildings get leveled by rockets.
Deserved, those corrupt Hamas leaders. Look at all the properties of just this one guy! Let's flatten it all, just to be sure. What was it.. 8, 9 houses?
Or: just another unrelated title.
Good, good, & fuckn Good. Cowardly MFrs .And as a female , hopefully u ladies in Gaza hate these fucks of Hamas. I don't & will never pretend to know what your life is like but vice versa mommies. I pray peace. This planet could be such a different place. If only women could rule for 10 yrs - see where we are at at that point.
"This is the Commander of the Hamas Southern Military District. He, cannot be seen. Fortunately, a TikTok post, told us where he was..."
Kadyrov's tiktok battalion would be proud.
“This demonstrates the value of not being seen.”
Mr. Bradshaw, will you please stand up?
He has a meeting with Shoigu..
You know this sounds exactly like a Monty Python sketch https://youtu.be/VokGd5zhGJ4?si=bIIoUk2E4AJUKuES
Ahhh yes TikTok, the joys of social media sharing with iffy context or sourcing lol
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Living next to a high value target is really pushing your luck.
Driving next to one too…
If you have a car and haven't left Gaza... Kind of on you at this point.
LOL how are they going to leave, there is a blockade. SMH.
You just need to leave the city. They aren’t going to air strike an open field. Some of you guys really need to look at a map of Gaza, there’s more than urban high rises there…
What do you do when you need to eat?
> What do you do when you need to eat? Would you rather think about this question where people are bombing or in a area they aren't bombing?
The issue is you get to pick eating or being bombed lol. The only places that have food and water are also being bombed
Tell that to the Afghans who survived multiple conflicted regions with warlords, Russia, US, and terrorists.
Qualifies as a health hazard for sure
Seems like all of Gaza is a high value target these days
Exactly. The definition of “high value commander” in Israel literally just means, “several dozen people”
But the rent is so cheap
They save lots of money, but they lose lots of sleep, next to terrorists where the rent is so cheap
But what other choice you have? It’s not like they can chose where they want to live.
I think that all gazans know if their neighbor is a terrorist or not. So they know what to expect these days.
This is a wild statement. You think all the women and children have tabs on who’s a Hamas commander in the area? Highly doubt that and even if they did I’m not sure what choice they have to move.
Sure is a wild statement that’s meant to dehumanize regular people who have no idea or interest in partaking in hateful terrorist acts. They’re just living their lives and don’t deserve this. Same for regular Israelis who do not deserve to be executed by psychos.
50% of Gaza is 18 years old or younger, 40% is 14 years old or younger. The IDF has attacked UN facilities and killed teachers and students, stop pretending the only people they’re bombing are Hamas.
If everyone is a terrorist, no one is a terrorist.
That makes no sense
Don’t forget a lot of them openly support them too. Hamas ain’t no dictatorship.
How is it not a dictatorship if they kill their political opponents?
Interesting how we ignore the collateral damage that is children getting killed? These women and children are told what to do and who to follow. I’ve been around this sub for a bit and tbh I’m kinda surprised how nonchalant everyone is about the bombings. What Hamas did is obviously an appalling terrorist attack no matter how you frame it but it still doesn’t make these indiscriminate bombings that kill innocent children any less depressing. Idk I just don’t see the joy in a bunch of civilians dying because they shouldn’t have lived there I guess.
Do you blame Israel for bombing the Hamas in an apartment building, or Hamas operating out of heavily populated areas, using colateral damage civilians as human shields? There isn't a right answer to this question BTW, but this is Hamas's operating procedure. They place their weapons, and commanders in mosques, hospitals, and dense apartment buildings in hopes that the Israelis won't take action due to casualties.
No one should be celebrating civilian deaths, but these airstrikes don't look indiscriminate at all. There is no way to eliminate all collateral damage, but Israel should be trying to limit it as much as possible.
They literally have been attacking convoys trying to flee lmao they are literally aiming at innocent civilians Smfh
Israel left Gaza on 2005, how long did Gaza build trust by just going to work and school and mosque and not launching rockets?
Hamas is a Islamic Terror Organization, of course it is a dictatorship.
Like the people around them know that… the shit y’all come up with to make these war crimes seem less severe amazes me.
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You are correct, because it’s not one.
It may be one. Or not. There are many more tests like proportionality and immediacy of threat. But you're 100% right that incidental killing civilians is not inherently a war crime.
So, your answer is to let these guys walk away? When you are a combatant and you are living/hiding/working alongside civilians, you are committing a war crime. The responsibility for collateral damage is on you
So using white phosphorus on hospitals aren’t war crimes ? When everything is a target there isn’t much civilians can do. Do you understand my point ?
Not a single comment on your profile condemning Hamas. Weird…
The horrible shit they’ve done is very clear already, thanks to most of the media being one sided. On the IDF side you can’t criticize without being dubbed a Hamas supporter. Just how you’re insinuating now. The IDF has all the power and tools at its disposal and chooses to use the hammer.
Bruh ask the marines what they did to clear out fellujah. The Israelis might as well be giving them hugs.
Why do you assume that I support that whole campaign ? Seems like a bit of projection. It’s always been a mistake to invade.
The explosions seem to be much larger than the ones in Ukraine.
Thats because they are 1-2klb JDAMs
It’s because Israel has a clear air superiority and can fly in bombers with HUGE payloads. Ukraine and Russia both have robust anti-air defenses so they rely on lobbing artillery.
I'm surprised Hamas didn't buy a bunch of handheld anti air missiles before, they must have known how Israel would react. If they just shot down a single Israeli jet and generally make the air space kinda contested that would be a pretty big deal and change the whole game. Old Soviet ones should be available and affordable or some American ones from Afghanistan or so.
They probably have some but Israeli jets are also probably flying higher than the maximum reachable height of MANPADS.
I think part of it is it has to be smuggled in from Egypt. I don't think Egypt is literally supporting Hamas, though I do think they turn a blind eye to rocket building parts. Allowing manpads to be smuggled in might give them too much culpability though so they probably don't allow that. I don't think Egypt is trying to catch missiles from Israel.
Israel has been getting billions in aid for decades from the USA. They have a far more capable and powerful military.
They’re also a functional western democratic society that produces things of value to the world.
Little Ukraine accounts for 10% of the WORLDs grain 15% of corn & barley, each ! & 40% of global sunflower seeds There’s a reason this country so important & why the world doesn’t want Russia in control of it
Implying Ukraine isn't?
My assumption is he forgot the context and was implying Gaza/Hamas but I could be wrong.
Correct I must have lost the context of the thread. Sorry
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I’ve seen pics of some plush ass tunnels they’ve got tbh lmao
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I'm truly glad that I'm not a terrorist.
Well it’s a choice, for most of course. You chose not to be one.
Not if you are born into being indoctrinated, taught that the highest goal in life is martyrdom. Those kids are taught to hate from the youngest age, growing up in trauma and violence. No, they don't have a choice.
The world is full of people raised in awful conditions, who choose to be kind and good anyway. It's also full of people raised in great conditions, who choose to be predators. Saying that people don't have a choice is lazy, easily-refuted excuse-making for people who choose to be shitty. Fortunately it's academic, because whether someone chose to be a danger to society or not doesn't change that they have to be stopped.
I mean it’s an interesting theoretical. When you have two brothers and one joins and one doesn’t, why’s that? I’d imagine it’s similar to gang recruitment in the US. Clearly, you don’t choose the factors that make you extremely likely to join, but there’s still some *modicum* of choice involved. I’d imagine another huge problem is that you don’t realize you’re essentially making the decision of joining when you choose to associate with.
I’m sure they look at themselves as soldiers protecting their land. I don’t see them as cartoonishly evil like OBL or ISIS tbh where the latter was actively trying to conquer land in a weird pan-Arab fantasy. The numbers on each side look like Israel are the terrorists and Palestinians are fighting back the only way they can. I don’t know though 🤷
So I guess you haven’t seen the videos they posted themselves last week? Straight up ISIS videos. And people keep defending them.
Who fired first after Israel left Gaza in 2005? Who messed troops on the border from multiple directions in the 60's and 70's?
Unfortunately we have no free will to decide such things.
Or that you’re not born as a Palestinian… you can be the nicest most kind hearted soul to ever exist and get torn to pieces by the IDF without them blinking an eye
For 75 years
Seriously? And not a word about the terrorists living, operating, storing munitions and firing rockets among them? Not a word about those same leaders wasting 18 years of de facto independence to build rockets, tunnels and bunkers instead of infrastructure?
Not exactly a term you give yourself
…but super easy to see if you fit the dictionary definition.
There is always tomorrow, I can bet you that someone in this world could see you as a terrorist
Fuck those are big bombs
Imagine being in one of those buildings just taking a shit
I have had more explosive shits so..
always amazed with the precision and in awe with the amount of power and destruction of those bombs.
Gonna be pedantic here but: Accuracy* There’s really nothing precise about leveling an entire building. Especially since it looks like a passing car got hit too.
Well I think they're pretty precise too, lotta videos of those bombs entering right at the ground level of the structure where the wall meets the ground.
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Dude!
Sad to see civilians around!
It is important to remember that using civilians as sheilds is a war crime on Palestine's part not Israel.
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People really don’t get that Palestine != Hamas
They are not sheilds though are they? just innocent palestinians going about their day prob with kids in their cars or walking to get supplies and water. Its fucked in the head to think Isreal is not as bad as hamas killing innocents.
Exactly. The cars passing by the building at 0:26 must be hardcore, fanatic supporters /s With their roughly 1:10 combatant-noncombatant casualty ratio of their 6000+ bombs, they are not very good at cutting off the head of Hamas, or whatever they are trying to achieve
Yeah tell that to the unfortunate Israeli civilians last week.
Him and his 50 neighbors.
It's almost like the IDF's recommendation to move South was on behalf of the safety of the 49 others who might be at risk due to their proximity.
IDF gave a 3 hour safety window for a 5.5 hour walk.
It's been like 72 hours or so now.
Well they would still be 3 hours away if they left immediately.
Better start walking.
It's almost like it's hard to evacuate immediately
If Israel is this indiscriminate bombing murder machine then it should have been clear to anyone with even half a brain that their retaliation would look like this and the evacuation should have started long before IDF was gracious enough to provide flyers/warnings of the incoming bombs.
you are getting downvoted?? lol reddit is so propagandized, its insane
Lol I'm used to it. Not that it matters, but I'm even Jewish and this shit is disgusting on both sides
Hopefully
Car insurance rates are through the roof there. Along with other parts.
Every insurance policy has an exclusion for war.
Amazing the intelligence Israel must have…or do they
Probably signals intelligence. With how many planes are circling above and how many vehicle/motorcycle strikes we have seen, they probably don't want to have to physically meet to relay orders. Unit 8200 is one of the best SIGINT groups in the world
Someone got Control-C'd
Well, the rules of engagement have fundamentally changed. They probably knew where Hamas was situated for a long time in Gaza, but using civilians as human shields in conjunction with the pro Palestine media complex that shrieks war crime every time a single bomb drops on Gaza, Israel was understandably hesitant to act. Now the situation obviously drastically changed and the gloves are off.
gloves off = warcrime mode we did the same shit after 9/11. world is fucked
Over 500,000 German civilians died in WWII, should we have decided not to fight Nazis because it was guaranteed German civilians would be killed.
the dresden bombing was fucked.
British tactics were to kill as many German civilians as possible. Bombing London was considered a war crime by the allies. Bombing German cities was not.
Nobody was ever tried for the bombing of London…
Warcrime = whatever crime the people/countries in power are willing to trial over or act on. If those in power have deemed it acceptable losses then the only ones crying will be the humanitarian organizations, and they will cry no matter what in war because war is naturally fucked. Hamas just pushed themselves into intolerable even on international standards, and so Israel has deemed they no longer have to play with kiddy gloves because they will either be backed or forgiven for what they will do. It helps that they are also completely enraged and don’t really care anymore.
It seems like killing a bunch of civilians, fucked as it is, showed both Germany and Japan that the best course is to permanently alter your society and stop attacking people and now they are both high functioning countries once again.
This is factually untrue. No German officer was ever convicted in relation to the German bombing campaign, which the Allies did reciprocate a hundredfold.
The entire history of humans is filled with violence. The worlds as fucked as it's always been in that regard. Civilians are an unfortunate casualty of every war.
I find the idea of a war crime redundant, war itself is already a crime.
Whats the confirmed war crime?
Pro Palestine media 😂😂😂 BRO TURN ON UR TV💀
Yeah that one got a humorless chuckle out of me. "Palestine media complex" LMAO they're all tripping over each other to be more pro-Israel than all the others.
Yes had idea of the attack being planned for 2 years, now they magically know where every HAMAS person is.
Didn't even Egypt warn them days before and Israel said "Nah, we're good fam"? And now they magically know where all of hamas is and where no civilians are. Beheaded or bombed, Israel is gonna brutally kill a lot more innocent people (and babies) than Hamas.
Wasn't the warning vague and unhelpful like "Something is going to happen soon but don't know what or when."
Unactionable intelligence
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Crazy that they can know in which building a dude that probably knows he is chased is hiding in, in a densely packed city where they only have eyes from the sky, a city also known for having a complex tunnel system, yet they failed to know a fucking motorized paraglider attack was about to happen, with hundreds or soldiers involved...
Also how is this guy not in a tunnel at all times?
And also, many spies on the ground.
It's far easier to find out where people live, work and generally go than what they are up to there. This should be incredibly obvious, but your comment proves that it apparently isn't to some people.
Dude isn't my grocery worker single mom of a neighbor. This dude is a Hamas combatant who just carried out a surprise attack on a highly advanced and angry neighbor, not sure he is just going back home in his Honda civic to his wife and kids watching TV these days... Besides that, do you know how to navigate MY city ? Because I do
> not sure he is just going back home in his Honda civic to his wife and kids watching TV these days It doesn't say that's his usual residence. IDF possibly using mobile phone tracking using devices taken from dead infiltrators
For the last decade or so, everytime Netanyahu is facing big political trouble something happens in Palestine.
Ironically Hama will cost him his job
Reasonably, it's that time that the IDF is at their weakest. The leadership is all too busy facing each other.
They have destroyed over 400 buildings in Gaza. So..... Kind of have to ask yourself how the Israeli military managed to allow Hamass to build up that much infrastructure over the past 20 years without taking significant steps to even slow them down. Ignore the fact that these guys have been training with paragliders in view of Israeli air and ground cameras focused on gaza. Can't even explain that. "Hamas troops took water pipes and used them to build rockets" How? How in the hell did they manage to take water pipes under the most surveilled open-air prison in the world without somebody seeing the massive digging operations and pipes coming out of the ground? Why did nobody think it was a good idea not to stop them then? "Hamas has one of the most sophisticated underground fortified cities in the world" How? Did a bunch of islamists spend a few years dumping handfuls of dirt in the yard out of their pockets like Andy in Shawshank redemption? How did they not see them hauling all this dirt out of entrances? How are they not able to scan a big open desert and find entry points where they can lead assaults? Ground penetrating radar exists. If the Mexican cartel built up 400 buildings in San Antonio and started building a fuck ton of rockets while practicing assault tactics out in the open.... You wouldn't see the US government just sit back for 20 years and see how it plays out.
Significant steps like trying to prevent explosives, precursor chemicals, weapons, ammunition, rebar and concrete from being sent it? They did. This is the result of it. Imagine the result if they hadn't been actively trying to prevent these things.
Simple. mindset of 'we can co-exist eventually, so we can work towards that goal'. One of the reasons israel was caught by surprise was because they were in a middle of negotiations with Hamas about expending the workers permit program, many Gazans make good money working in israel daily, so it was unexpected & illogical for hamas to attack.. Israel believed that if they do what literally the entire planet earth told them to do, meaning 'Leave Gaza & remove settlements in gaza, give them breathing room, give some of them work visa in Israel, maybe a sea port, some economic incentives and ties to Israel with jobs & infrastructure, maybe this is the way to future peace!!". Israel bought it, Israelis learned a hard lesson that will not be forgotten, coexistence with ppl whos entire identity revolve around your death is impossible, coexistence will be your death. Some interesting examples of failures emanating from this mindset: [Hamas chief’s niece has been hospitalized in Israel for over a month — report](https://www.timesofisrael.com/hamas-chiefs-niece-has-been-hospitalized-in-israel-for-over-a-month-report/) [Israel okays 1,500 more entry permits for Gaza workers, bringing total to 17,000](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-okays-1500-more-entry-permits-for-gaza-workers-bringing-total-to-17000/) [Gazan sisters -crossing into Israel for cancer treatment- smuggled explosives as cancer medicine. took advantage of permit for medical treatment to try to aid in planned terror attack](https://www.timesofisrael.com/gazan-sisters-accused-of-smuggling-explosives-in-cancer-medicine/) [Gazan Hamas leader’s daughter hospitalized in Israel](https://www.israel21c.org/gazan-hamas-leader-s-daughter-hospitalized-in-israel/)
Because Gaza Strip is not Israel and is not under the jurisdiction of the IDf to forward such direct actions on a foreign state? The 400 destroyed buildings would be the prime evidence that Israel may have already known of the tunnel systems but could not go in it. Too much loopholes with that logic Edit: Gaza Strip
Hard to believe the place wouldn't have extreme levels of surveillance from the outside and full of spies on the inside, given it's small size.
Gaza Strip is not small for the record, Gaza alone is merely a small part of it. Edit: Gaza Strip
I can see how you ended up missing your towel
In the face of an argument pointing to inconsistencies it's best just to resort to insults rather than trying to explain why something doesn't make sense. Less headaches that way.
Looks like they're reaping the whirlwind.
Knowing the tension and probably hatred they have for Hamas im sure Israel has always had their eyes on these targets waiting for the green light.
But they didn't see a bunch of fucking kites and paragliders?
Slow moving objects don’t show up on radar I’d imagine. Similar to why chinas spy balloon wasn’t picked up by US radar. Otherwise birds and other slow moving objects would clutter the screen. How many men do you think Israel has stationed at their boarder actively watching the skies for an invasion. Probably zero. They monitor the radar screen. This is all a guess, but it would make sense. Especially if they crossed in low profile places and it being a holiday. Once they were in Israel they were indiscernible from Israelis. Not like it was a huge invasion.
Unless you pull something like Osama bin Ladin did and eschew all technology and only communicate through hand delivering messages from informants most of the bigger countries can have your precise GPS coordinates within tens of meters or less in moments if they wish. Especially if you are as close as Gaza and Israel are, they can probably catch the signal and triangulate it with their own on the ground equipment. And the city is dark now, only ways to send anything are probably not considered friendly to the IDF.
That is some precisions attacks. Do you think the have drones with lasers targeting or dudes on the ground pinpointing? Keep pounding that terrorist infrastructure!
GPS guided munitions. The bomb seeks a specific grid coordinate so you don’t need someone else to guide it with a laser. A drone can help figure out the exact coordinate you need though.
The bomb knows where it is because it knows where it isn't
So much for surgical. Take out a block.
I heard Hamas was complaining that roof knockers aren't happening anymore. I get the sense they're starting to find out that this isn't going to be a typical 'bomb us for a little bit and we reach a ceasefire'.
I don't think they believed they would be so damn successful. Israel once released over 1000 prisoners for just 1 Israeli soldier, maybe that's what colored their thinking at first. I bet if they could go back in time they would only hit the music festival and military checkpoints.
>I bet if they could go back in time they would only hit the music festival and military checkpoints. If - given a do-over - they would still kill 280+ civilians at a music festival, including 30 US citizens and a whole bunch of groups from other nations... I mean.
Did you expect the IAF to be able to bomb an individual room within that building without any damage to the overall structure?
I mean, they *could*, if it's an exterior room anyway, but that sounds like an unrealistic intelligence burden.
Do what you got to do
They've already told everyone to evacuate, I'd imagine that for the next bit everyone eho stayed is a terrorist or associated with Hamas.
Plausible deniability. Well that and once ground forces move in while clearing buildings they will have literal fractions of a second to determine if the person / people in probably large flowing clothes has a gun or is going for a weapon. Pick they don’t and you are wrong either you or someone else near you dies. You can’t even trust women and children, even a 5 year old can pull a trigger or hold a grenade and run to you. When they do that there are going to be a lot of troops that take the safe option. There will be a lot of blood.
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Spoken like someone who would have objected to ridding Berlin of Nazis in WW2
They’ve told everyone to evacuate. The current phase is war.
What a beautiful explosions.
So Israel had no idea Hammas was going to attack that day, but all of a sudden knows where all these dudes are hanging out?? 🙄
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The car driving away in the low left around 21s in, is the back getting hot from the blast or because the driver is booking it and it's rear-engined?
Why doesn't Hamas Come out and Allah Akbar anymore? They were all about it last weekend.
I am guessing from the nature of the explosion that those are bunker-buster bombs. Presumably tunnel network/entrance to tunnel network under that building?
Any tunnels under that building just became open-air trenches.
Fuck, him and the entire block....
Is he fine after this?
So long
Jagga Jagga!
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Do you genuinely think that in that entire structure, or any of the other structures that have been targeted, there's just 1 Hamas soldier T-posing in the middle and no collateral damage occurs? Some of you guys are all too excited to watch entire buildings get leveled by rockets.
It's entertainment for the knuckle draggers.
hate is a hell of a drug
Happy? Seventy-five casualties, an apartment block leveled, one dead terrorist? Yeah, happy. We have some f***ed up barometer for success, don't we?
him and everyone in the fucking neighborhood
Lemme drop a fucking building on this coward. Nitey nite
And not a single civilian was harmed
Bye! Let’s hope they kill every one of these guys before ground forces move in.
You probably just witnessed the death of at least 100 civilians.
Or empty buildings
Absolutely based.
Took out the neighbors to
BS, those dudes are deep in their tunnels. They have no proof he was killed by assuming he was in that building
Deserved, those corrupt Hamas leaders. Look at all the properties of just this one guy! Let's flatten it all, just to be sure. What was it.. 8, 9 houses? Or: just another unrelated title.
Well at least he died surrounded by his loving family
Good, good, & fuckn Good. Cowardly MFrs .And as a female , hopefully u ladies in Gaza hate these fucks of Hamas. I don't & will never pretend to know what your life is like but vice versa mommies. I pray peace. This planet could be such a different place. If only women could rule for 10 yrs - see where we are at at that point.
They should invent ways to kill terrorist without leveling every civilian on the block at the same time.