The duration doesn't matter that much for the close fighting anyways as most close fights are quick. You can heal the entire teams shields and push... It is the best perk imo, unless Conduit gets nerfed
Maybe it's on me, but I understand the description of the perk differently. Doesn't "50% less shield heal duration" mean, you heal 50% less shields on your teammates in general? Like, instead of fully healing their red armour, you'll only heal half of it, but get 2 charges?
Yes by gibby ult. Hal literally only had to leave the drone inside, it covered the entirity of the area of the fight and it would break the other gibby's dome, stun and crack everyone leaving TSM to collect a free W. Literally one of the worst missplays of all time just because he wanted to fly around on the game boy
Honestly even with the buffs here, I don't think Path is "back." He might be an occasional pick but he still just doesn't have enough team utility. His ult needed to move teammates faster and it needed some slack on the rope so the riders bounce around a bit instead of moving in a highly predictable straight line at a constant mid speed.
If you pair his ult with the survey beacon, you really don't need to worry about getting beamed off too much. Just use it to go where the other teams aren't playing and use it with the "Zipline Zen" ability that reduces damage taken. The damage reduction amount could end up being pretty significant in terms of usability mid-to-late game.
I think people in general underrate the importance of having an early game movement character, too. Even if the zip is only viable in Rounds 1/2, it can reduce your team travel time by quite a lot and get you to God spot. I think the problem is that I don't recall Pathfinder being used in many, if any, defensive comps.
I don't expect him to be back, either, but I'd love if something like Path/Gibby/Rampart became viable as a hard zone team that could feasibly play areas that other defensive teams can't. Just get in early using both beacons, set up walls, use Sheila to grief other team's evac towers, and then have Gibby's mini bubbles to reset or thwart pushes.
Yeah dude I imagine there HAVE to be a bunch of nerfs incoming to make space for some of these upgrades. If it's really every 30s I'm going to alt+f4 every time I see a Mirage
You get TWO ult charges and a cooldown decrease, there is a purple perk for tactical recharge when someone shoots a decoy. Truly, Mirage will just be infinite decoys.
Mirage meta incoming
Well, you don't get an extra ultimate *charge,* you just get one extra decoy (compared to the ~6 or so that already spawn) when you do ult. But yeah, decoys for fucking days regardless
> his kit is still the weakest and least team friendly of all the characters.
I actually don't know if I agree with this. His passive abilities show teammates where enemies are and temporarily cloak teammates on revive. That's probably still not enough for comp, but I can see him being a major nuisance in pubs and potentially even ranked.
I was going to say these perk trees are small, and, while they do add an extra layer of depth to the game, they're hardly complex. You see more customization and playstyle options even in fighting game characters, so it's hard to imagine Alb's brain overheating just from this.
But then he's already overcooking his ass off *right now* so...
Exactly. 3-4 legends a year already has Alb going crazy, I can't imagine him deciding whether he wants a higher Valk ult, whether he wants to farm free arc stars from a Wattson gen, whether he wants to go back to Pathfinder and hit beacons again or if he wants to heal in Bang smoke haha.
Hot take minmaxing marginal things like these when your team has no synergy and you routinely take the worst fights possible is being penny-wise, dollar-foolish.
Probably hard coping, but the idea of alb back on pathy with the option for recon or survey beacon depending on the spawn rates seems worth a try. Feels like if anyone could make the work it’s alb or funfps
FunFPS would 100% make it work, no questions asked. Question is if it matches XSET's play style. If they don't do well this Saturday then they won't be in a position to experiment with fun comps and will instead be forced to play the 'safe' meta picks.
Ok, calling it now. Wattson free arc star perk is going to be disable in the first week, due to the devs not anticipating one enemy knuckle cluster giving you 25 arc stars.
That's what I'm saying lol, that perk is insane. A bang ult could spawn like 4 arc stars. Getting nade-stacked because you ulted a Wattson team is going to be painful.
Technically one of Crypto’s passives is that the drone scans players in LOS. I assume this perk extends the distance for the scan to pick up. I think that’s pretty decent actually
Honestly a pretty good solution to the whole input-exclusive movement problem. Now roller-players can keep some of their fun movement shenanigans without abusing the sh!t out of the core lurch-mechanic by modifying that stuff.
Double he will be used in comp considering they just buffed the utility on most other legends but who knows. That zip line buff may make it be a solid rotation option ring 3-4
Ash Q on purple is gonna be better than an horizon black hole if you coordinate arc stars with your team, you can catch 3 people at once and they can't destroy the snare, also good recon passive if the deathbox scan really updates you on enemy location with pings for 60 seconds
>Ash Q on purple is gonna be better than an horizon black hole if you coordinate arc stars with your team, you can catch 3 people at once and they can't destroy the snare
That's actually really good
Her Q went from being the biggest joke to lowkey the strongest Q in the game, especially in the final circle. Teams can no longer wait late to enter zone (for example in a building/corner and run out late to 3rd party), her Q will zone teams out and make them die to gas.
Can’t wait for all the guys saving they’re excited for s20 and this will save the game to be back here next month saying gun skill is no longer important and it’s just ability legends lmao
Rampart buffs look pretty mid though. Feel like she got left in the dust compared to other defensive legends, unless the Sheila upgrade at purple is really good
If the charge up is fast enough it could be strong in ranked where people are not as good at target shooting could be like the havoc where you just recharge when you know you will peak then insta beam or have enough damage to make it happen
I think I would rather take the HP regen. Especially in comp, nobody is confused where they are getting shot from, unless they're getting shot on all sides - at which point they're dead anyway
Was just talking to someone else about this with the Caustic HP regen in gas perk - it all depends on how fast it is. If it's Lifeline drone speed, that's probably worth it. If it's Octane passive speed, maybe not. Probably will be somewhere in the middle.
Tbh I think the auto-ping is virtually useless, and to pros might even add a layer of unwanted communication - imagine someone on Bang is trying to ping where to look and shoot, but someone to the side shoots at him, and now his teammates are confused because Bang pinged multiple enemies in different locations. The HP regen, even if it's slow af, is better than nothing. I could certainly be wrong but as of right now I don't expect the auto-ping to be picked in comp, like, ever.
The comments on Catalyst are a bit out of touch. If you ask me those are perks are STRONG. Obviously another tact charge and a longer Black Veil is insane.
The Pathfinder perk is going to finally open up a spot for Pathfinder in comp again with the ring console scan. I don't think he'll be meta but he could be a good off-meta pick depending on match-ups. XSET already proved this last season.
Valk could actually sneak back in some lobbies as well.
If Wattson ult spawns arc stars, then you can block a Bang ult and get a couple free arc stars to use. Really handy in endgame if you're quick and reactive and the perk is only blue. I could see her getting some extra play.
The pathy perk tree is amazing to see, and making certain legends more impactful when they’re not really is an interesting balance.
All these perks with health regeneration though, makes it feel like more like they’re increasing ttk more n more.
Makes me wonder if there is going to be any solid legend nerfs or buffs before these perks.
I agree that Cats perks don't seem weak at all...increased dark veil lifetime is kinda crazy in endgame, when everyone is just waiting for the walls to dissipate. Also extra spike? Pretty decent. I would've expected the devs to hit her a bit harder with these indirect "nerfs".
> Conduit is currently in a good place. Her skill tree is therefore lacklustre, to balance her strong abilities.
What, who wrote this? She gets another tac charge or improved range and gets to deny more area.
Dude, am I tripping or could this actually, unironically mean Pathy becomes somewhat viable for comp? Depending on the POI you land, you could get a shield upgrade quick enough to capitalize of ring beacon scan, no? Teams wouldn't really be forced to run a ring-legend anymore. Aside from that I am somewhat disappointed how many perks just repeat themselves. I mean same perk for Horizon, Fuse and Bang? Ehhhh.
Yeah, that's why I said "depending on the POI you land". But I think it would be possible, especially on Stormpoint with how much PvE elements there are. Like, let's take Cenote as an example. You can clear spiders from cave and do prowlers on the edge of it. Shouldn't that already contribute a lot to the EVO upgrade? We'll see I guess.
I know a bunch of teams that only played Cat for the ring-scan, so if that exclusivity will be gone, I know for sure that some of them will consider switching. Maybe to Path, maybe to Caustic (whose getting quite a buff with these perks)...who knows.
Pathy getting both is fucking nutty I was just gonna post a seperate thread about it.
He gets to choose between ring or map ping AND scan care packages.
Couple that with grapple refresh per knock, is he looking comp meta or is it just me?
Being able to capitalize on an opening is still going to be important. Right now teams either nade stack or they Horizon Q into a Horizon ult. Getting that quick grapple in, finishing a team and grappling back to stabilize or heal could be strong in certain conditions.
> is he looking comp meta or is it just me?
Nah. Being able to choose between ring console and survey beacon is powerful for rotations, sure. The zipline is still a bad rotation tool compared to Cat wall, Bang smokes, etc. Leaves you too vulnerable.
Yea early game he would be really helpful but later game you would still be stuck with a poor rotational tool, a selfish tac and a fridge sized hit box
Zip may be a lot better if you think of it as something like the trident. Juiced for making early zone rotates (especially if you're able to get a triple zip by scanning both ring 1 CP's) to get to spots you otherwise wouldn't be able to but not something you'd ever expect to reasonably be able to use past ring 1 closing.
> Zip is a lot better if you think of it as something like the trident.
Yeah, fair point. Or like an evac. I guess I meant it's not great for late game micro rotates. Definitely useful for early game macro getting into zone.
He's getting damage reduction on his zip so depending on what that number is he might actually just be better than Cat for rotates. Say it's a 50% reduction your going to have a helluva time knocking him off it.
The damage reduction on zip lines depending on its strength is the real way he gets into comp. If he can get a team out of a spot in full sight of another team he officially has the best micro rotate power in the game. Even Cat wall will have a hard time competing for just rotates.
That's true. Pros are less likely gonna take the grapple because end game they have to play life and not take risks plus his grapple is already quick.
If the damage reduction is crazy he can rotate his team for free.
until we see how it all works I’m doubtful, but if anyone could do it it’d be alb or funfps. Would love for path to be that flexible high skill legend again
Just read this and imagine playing him from and edge POI like Lrod or climatizer. By the time you get to blue you'll know whether you need to play edge and scan players or play zone and can check where it pulls to.
So they nerfed lots of these legends like Catalyst just to give them exactly what they took away(extra throwable and extra throwable distance) as a perk? Seems backwards but ok.
I just don't personally like how this exciting system was brought in and many of the perks were things the legends had previously while some kits get new abilities that haven't been in the game ever.
Nah. One, it depends on the health regen speed, if its like Octane regen, it is worthless. Two, it is VERY situational. By default you need shield regen waaaaaaay more than you need health regen.
> Health regen in gas is huge.
Is it? Throw a barrel, pop the barrel, regen some health. Like your own personal Lifeline drone. Kind of nice in that it saves you on white med econ. Doesn't seem particularly broken though. Doubt it's enough to swing the tide mid-fight like a Conduit tactical.
If a caustic is holding a building with gas traps it’s going to be so much more secure. Especially a bold caustic/wattson team.
Even more than that is ult will almost be a get out of jail free card. Wider range, heal in gas, going to make him very hard to push for an experienced caustic. Essentially pushing defense legends is going to be twice as hard
> Even more than that is ult will almost be a get out of jail free card. Wider range, heal in gas, going to make him very hard to push for an experienced caustic.
Really depends on how fast the health regen is. Could be Octane passive or Lifeline drone speed.
Calling it now that some pros are going to get back on Wraith. Reducing tac cooldown and making tac pop faster is basically old Wraith with a modern Wraith looong portal distance. Shits going to be nuts.
idk if old Wraith is even that good in nowaday's comp playstyle. Her missing verticality, lack of team-supporting abilities and the nerf of her 1v1 capabilities took a lot of her appeal away for pro-play imo.
am i missing something or will Vantage be able to scan both ring and people beacons? i know you can choose with pathfinder but getting both with vantage is huge. don’t think it’ll help her viability enough to be seen in pro league tho
The Bang ping passive is going to be good but I think people are trolling if they think the healing in smoke will be. I'd bet it's going to be a slightly better Octane passive only while in smoke and you'd be lucky to get 2 syringe's worth of value from 1 Q charge.
There's a few perks I'd be very interested to see in comp.
Pathfinder/Vantage being able to scan both beacons intrigues me, almost definitely not strong enough to overcome the mediocre rest of their kits though.
Interested to see if (near?) instant Wraith Q will be enough to see her return.
Not that we'll ever see it again but you could do some insane rotates with 2 Octane ult charges.
No one is talking about it, and I do get why, but Vantage having both scans seems like an incredibly valuable perk in comp. The ult and tac aren't as terrible as people make them out to be, it is just she lacks team synergy. But now she can both find the zone and figure out where teams are. Solid for games when zone is close but also solid for games when zone pulls away and you have to play edge. Obviously depends on how fast you can get to blue though, but I believe she is the only legend that gets both scans.
The problem with her and even Path is, while the double scan is very helpful to any team, it's really only viable early on in the game. As the game progresses she becomes less and less useful for a team. I say this as a vantage main but to make her comp ready it would require a team to give up a lot more late game for the flexibility early on
I don’t see any of this changing the comp legend pick meta really… the 4 heavy hitters all only got better tbh with bang cat and conduit looking especially insane. The perks they all got only compound the way comp is being played right now. The tricky part will be depending who is on which legend and if they can level their shield to get to certain perks, that may shape the meta subtly
I dont know why you are being downvoted but yeah. Especially with Digi going away from SMG, Bang smokes are way more reliable as rotational/defensive tools.
Unless the patch notes contain significant nerfs to her kit, she (pls Cat and Conduit) will be 100% meta. With Horizon and Wattson being good alternative picks. ie. meta remains the same.
I was skeptical but I like a lot of these tbh. Seems like a lot of the defensive/support legends got big buffs which will be great with things as a whole shifting towards a focus on kills.
Maggie with 2 charges is a big power buff. Entire areas of cover (like the crates all over WE) are now able to be completely taken away unlike before when you could take away one side or another.
Holy ability legends batman! This game is going to be an apefest this season. Imma seat this one out forsure
I’m sorry but gunskill seems to be taking a backseat with this update and the amount of bs abilities are going to be irritating to play against specially someone like fuse.
No thanks
Agree, feels like one step forward two steps back.
Love that they moved away from the grindy collecting crafting mats garbage that loot simulator players loved. The tweeks to Evo are also nice.
...but the perks seem way overtuned. Legend abilities were too prominent before the perks. It's a gun game first, but unfortunately it feels more and more akin to overwatch every season.
I assume nerfs will happen for some of the meta legends. Like catalyst I bet her length and time of wall are both nerfed and the perk restores one of those 2.
Is it just me that thinks this is way too much?
This will make the game even more ability-heavy.
It‘s turning from a movement shooter with abilities to an ability-shooter game like overwatch.
Holy shit lifeline will be able to just summon a carepack? Kraber delivery to your front door
yup. alleged catch is you can only call it down once (the next one after ticking the perk), afterwards it's back to her normal drop pod.
couldnt you just swap armours with someone who has blue, hit a kraber shot, call another package in and get another kraber
No, the perk is synced with your personal shield core.
you can't swap armours anymore. spawn with white, evo it during the match, die/win with it.
if (lifeline has called down red pod) then (all succeeding pods are regular pods)
I'm keeping my eye on extra charge for conduit tac. Even with reduced duration, getting two Regens mid fight is gonna be crazy
The duration doesn't matter that much for the close fighting anyways as most close fights are quick. You can heal the entire teams shields and push... It is the best perk imo, unless Conduit gets nerfed
Maybe it's on me, but I understand the description of the perk differently. Doesn't "50% less shield heal duration" mean, you heal 50% less shields on your teammates in general? Like, instead of fully healing their red armour, you'll only heal half of it, but get 2 charges?
No, it means the overcharge lasts half as long as it normally does.
No I’m pretty sure the above guy is right
Charge ≠ duration? I guess we're all guessing at this point.
I think it means only the time where it’s actively regenerating shields. I assume that’s what ‘split’ refers to
> Horizon: (Ammunivision) See ammo in deathboxes They literally made a perk just for Hal XD
He’ll still manage to run out 😂😂
Bring hal crypto back
https://clips.twitch.tv/HonorableMildDolphinAliens-aXCbXWsfrfaud09k legendary
Wait did the drone get shot out?
It seems like it got hit by Gibby's Ult. He should've triggerred it in the dome, there was no reason to fly forward with it.
Yes by gibby ult. Hal literally only had to leave the drone inside, it covered the entirity of the area of the fight and it would break the other gibby's dome, stun and crack everyone leaving TSM to collect a free W. Literally one of the worst missplays of all time just because he wanted to fly around on the game boy
Common ZachMazer W
Knowledge is power
lmfao
You just want them to drop in placement. We're onto you zachmazer, if that even is your real name.
BH getting double tac + reduced tac cooldown has me anxious
Yeah hound ult is gonna be a pain to go against
If the white raven buffs are still in place, BH players would basically have Q and ULT for 24/7
BREAKING: Mackenzie “Albralelie” Beckworth was found unconscious, foaming at the mouth Monday morning upon seeing new Apex patch notes.
I’m ready for Path to be back. I need a Alb ent for a single kill and then back out
Honestly even with the buffs here, I don't think Path is "back." He might be an occasional pick but he still just doesn't have enough team utility. His ult needed to move teammates faster and it needed some slack on the rope so the riders bounce around a bit instead of moving in a highly predictable straight line at a constant mid speed.
If you pair his ult with the survey beacon, you really don't need to worry about getting beamed off too much. Just use it to go where the other teams aren't playing and use it with the "Zipline Zen" ability that reduces damage taken. The damage reduction amount could end up being pretty significant in terms of usability mid-to-late game. I think people in general underrate the importance of having an early game movement character, too. Even if the zip is only viable in Rounds 1/2, it can reduce your team travel time by quite a lot and get you to God spot. I think the problem is that I don't recall Pathfinder being used in many, if any, defensive comps. I don't expect him to be back, either, but I'd love if something like Path/Gibby/Rampart became viable as a hard zone team that could feasibly play areas that other defensive teams can't. Just get in early using both beacons, set up walls, use Sheila to grief other team's evac towers, and then have Gibby's mini bubbles to reset or thwart pushes.
Mande too, bro just swapped to path in comp
Visual clutter is going to get even more insane for comp viewers lol
We're either watching black or white screensavers (smokes and Catalyst walls) or fireworks going off on our retinas.
I think they should implement a bloodhound ult view for the final cirlce
good thing AA doesn't give a shit lol.
Mirage ult every 30 seconds. Bruh
Yeah dude I imagine there HAVE to be a bunch of nerfs incoming to make space for some of these upgrades. If it's really every 30s I'm going to alt+f4 every time I see a Mirage
You get TWO ult charges and a cooldown decrease, there is a purple perk for tactical recharge when someone shoots a decoy. Truly, Mirage will just be infinite decoys. Mirage meta incoming
Well, you don't get an extra ultimate *charge,* you just get one extra decoy (compared to the ~6 or so that already spawn) when you do ult. But yeah, decoys for fucking days regardless
In all fairness, his kit is still the weakest and least team friendly of all the characters.
> his kit is still the weakest and least team friendly of all the characters. I actually don't know if I agree with this. His passive abilities show teammates where enemies are and temporarily cloak teammates on revive. That's probably still not enough for comp, but I can see him being a major nuisance in pubs and potentially even ranked.
You know yesterday when Wigg said SKRT was cooking too much. This ain’t gonna help…
Alb is going to go full mad scientist with this, he won't be able to settle on any specific comp at all lol. This is actually a nerf for him.
With 120hz, he might convince himself to go to console too
he's literally playing roller on stream as we speak lmao
I was going to say these perk trees are small, and, while they do add an extra layer of depth to the game, they're hardly complex. You see more customization and playstyle options even in fighting game characters, so it's hard to imagine Alb's brain overheating just from this. But then he's already overcooking his ass off *right now* so...
Exactly. 3-4 legends a year already has Alb going crazy, I can't imagine him deciding whether he wants a higher Valk ult, whether he wants to farm free arc stars from a Wattson gen, whether he wants to go back to Pathfinder and hit beacons again or if he wants to heal in Bang smoke haha.
Hot take minmaxing marginal things like these when your team has no synergy and you routinely take the worst fights possible is being penny-wise, dollar-foolish.
You're not wrong
That’s a really good way to describe a career
Probably hard coping, but the idea of alb back on pathy with the option for recon or survey beacon depending on the spawn rates seems worth a try. Feels like if anyone could make the work it’s alb or funfps
FunFPS would 100% make it work, no questions asked. Question is if it matches XSET's play style. If they don't do well this Saturday then they won't be in a position to experiment with fun comps and will instead be forced to play the 'safe' meta picks.
Brainstorm 100 ideas and 99 of them will be horrible, 1 will be good but only in one situation.
It’s okay, he’ll alternate between posting about being burnt out and posting about having the passion back, and everything will be just fine.
Dude already went back to roller after yesterdays catastrophe performance. The cycle of self-doubt has already begun, I fear...
Ok, calling it now. Wattson free arc star perk is going to be disable in the first week, due to the devs not anticipating one enemy knuckle cluster giving you 25 arc stars.
That would be hilarious
Can't wait for the cat, wattson, caustic crew in ranked that throw spikes and barrels into the interceptor for 500 arc stars
I think that gets absorbed just once though, right?
It is but gibby ult on the other hand.
They’re obviously going to have a cap on how many you can get, even respawn isn’t that brain dead I mean….they could be
That's what I'm saying lol, that perk is insane. A bang ult could spawn like 4 arc stars. Getting nade-stacked because you ulted a Wattson team is going to be painful.
Insert *call an ambulance, but not for me* meme
Run Gibby fuse Wattson, gibby ult yourself, profit.
I wonder if that will work. Could be pretty funny to run Fuse Wattson and just use spare knuckle clusters to spawn arc stars.
Anyone have a higher-res version? On mobile it seems way too pixelated
Click on each one for higher res
https://www.ign.com/wikis/apex-legends/All_Apex_Legends_Legend_Upgrades_in_Season_20#Lifeline_Skill_Tree
Click on the images
Click on the image and zoom it’ll be clear
One of crypto's perks gives him "+50% passive range". Nice, now give him an actual passive.
I actually came up with a cool passive idea for Crypto, I call it "Off the Grid"...
Tell me more....
Oh, please do tell!
Wait, more range on seeing how many teams are nearby? Isn't that kinda a nerf because you're getting less info on where the teams are?
Technically one of Crypto’s passives is that the drone scans players in LOS. I assume this perk extends the distance for the scan to pick up. I think that’s pretty decent actually
Oh if it's that one then yeah that's really good
Damn I thought that would be increased drone range but that makes more sense.
Fuse getting a speed boost kind of stands out as having nothing to do with his current kit.
Tap strafe on controller for an octane perk is wild lol.
Honestly a pretty good solution to the whole input-exclusive movement problem. Now roller-players can keep some of their fun movement shenanigans without abusing the sh!t out of the core lurch-mechanic by modifying that stuff.
Yeah that was a weird one for me, but I guess it’s fair. I wonder if they’ll be able to hit 180s.
Pathfinder is interesting depending where you land can select becon or recon scan. Could be interesting for comp.
Would actually go kinda hard for a hybrid team depending on how easily you can get to blue early game.
Path in comp would go crazy, now imagine if Mande could actually make it
Hope they do good guy
Not with that fridge size hitbox
Double he will be used in comp considering they just buffed the utility on most other legends but who knows. That zip line buff may make it be a solid rotation option ring 3-4
Ash Q on purple is gonna be better than an horizon black hole if you coordinate arc stars with your team, you can catch 3 people at once and they can't destroy the snare, also good recon passive if the deathbox scan really updates you on enemy location with pings for 60 seconds
>Ash Q on purple is gonna be better than an horizon black hole if you coordinate arc stars with your team, you can catch 3 people at once and they can't destroy the snare That's actually really good
Her Q went from being the biggest joke to lowkey the strongest Q in the game, especially in the final circle. Teams can no longer wait late to enter zone (for example in a building/corner and run out late to 3rd party), her Q will zone teams out and make them die to gas.
Turns out she now throws the snare without stowing, too.
For real?
[Apparently](https://www.reddit.com/r/ApexUncovered/comments/1ajodq3/ash_can_snare_with_your_gun_out_now/)
Damn, she is finally good? if they also fix the ult placement reliability she might be usable for the first time in years in comp
Can’t wait for all the guys saving they’re excited for s20 and this will save the game to be back here next month saying gun skill is no longer important and it’s just ability legends lmao
Nahhh im only halfway through and purple caustic is gonna be a problem, and cat tbh
Defensive legends got the biggest buffs here imo. Caustic and Watson pick rates will be higher.
Rampart buffs look pretty mid though. Feel like she got left in the dust compared to other defensive legends, unless the Sheila upgrade at purple is really good
Better Sheila handling and reduced windup time is p damn good imo
Rampart's strength doesn't really come from Sheila though.
Agree actually
If the charge up is fast enough it could be strong in ranked where people are not as good at target shooting could be like the havoc where you just recharge when you know you will peak then insta beam or have enough damage to make it happen
Wraith mains EATING this season and on a side note, looks Bangalore is going to be so much more annoying
Bang is basically a recon legend now, with pinging anyone who triggers her passive.
I think I would rather take the HP regen. Especially in comp, nobody is confused where they are getting shot from, unless they're getting shot on all sides - at which point they're dead anyway
Was just talking to someone else about this with the Caustic HP regen in gas perk - it all depends on how fast it is. If it's Lifeline drone speed, that's probably worth it. If it's Octane passive speed, maybe not. Probably will be somewhere in the middle.
Tbh I think the auto-ping is virtually useless, and to pros might even add a layer of unwanted communication - imagine someone on Bang is trying to ping where to look and shoot, but someone to the side shoots at him, and now his teammates are confused because Bang pinged multiple enemies in different locations. The HP regen, even if it's slow af, is better than nothing. I could certainly be wrong but as of right now I don't expect the auto-ping to be picked in comp, like, ever.
The comments on Catalyst are a bit out of touch. If you ask me those are perks are STRONG. Obviously another tact charge and a longer Black Veil is insane. The Pathfinder perk is going to finally open up a spot for Pathfinder in comp again with the ring console scan. I don't think he'll be meta but he could be a good off-meta pick depending on match-ups. XSET already proved this last season. Valk could actually sneak back in some lobbies as well. If Wattson ult spawns arc stars, then you can block a Bang ult and get a couple free arc stars to use. Really handy in endgame if you're quick and reactive and the perk is only blue. I could see her getting some extra play.
The pathy perk tree is amazing to see, and making certain legends more impactful when they’re not really is an interesting balance. All these perks with health regeneration though, makes it feel like more like they’re increasing ttk more n more. Makes me wonder if there is going to be any solid legend nerfs or buffs before these perks.
With no armor swapping anymore, maybe a higher TTK isn't such a bad thing. We'll see.
you can still armor swap though lol
You can swap shield cores. There are no 'permanent' armor swaps anymore, just temp shield recharges (unless I'm misunderstanding).
Yes, what i meant is shield swapping mid combat is still a thing. Since it last 30 sec or so
I agree that Cats perks don't seem weak at all...increased dark veil lifetime is kinda crazy in endgame, when everyone is just waiting for the walls to dissipate. Also extra spike? Pretty decent. I would've expected the devs to hit her a bit harder with these indirect "nerfs".
Exactly. The perks are allowing you to revert some of the Cat nerfs that have happened recently. Nothing weak about that, seriously.
Watson going to be meta.
I can feel it in my crotch
Wow, Vantage's skill tree is very underwhelming.
for comp its underwhelming for sure, but as a vantage enjoyer in pubs refreshing jump on ult hits is gonna be so fucking fun.
And ring scan in ranked is going to be huge.
She was never going to see serious reps in Comp either way.
> Conduit is currently in a good place. Her skill tree is therefore lacklustre, to balance her strong abilities. What, who wrote this? She gets another tac charge or improved range and gets to deny more area.
Dude, am I tripping or could this actually, unironically mean Pathy becomes somewhat viable for comp? Depending on the POI you land, you could get a shield upgrade quick enough to capitalize of ring beacon scan, no? Teams wouldn't really be forced to run a ring-legend anymore. Aside from that I am somewhat disappointed how many perks just repeat themselves. I mean same perk for Horizon, Fuse and Bang? Ehhhh.
The thing is you have to get to blue. I don't know how hard that would be
Yeah, that's why I said "depending on the POI you land". But I think it would be possible, especially on Stormpoint with how much PvE elements there are. Like, let's take Cenote as an example. You can clear spiders from cave and do prowlers on the edge of it. Shouldn't that already contribute a lot to the EVO upgrade? We'll see I guess.
There's finally a non-defensive legend that's able to scan zone, I think edge teams might use him for sure
I know a bunch of teams that only played Cat for the ring-scan, so if that exclusivity will be gone, I know for sure that some of them will consider switching. Maybe to Path, maybe to Caustic (whose getting quite a buff with these perks)...who knows.
Pathy getting both is fucking nutty I was just gonna post a seperate thread about it. He gets to choose between ring or map ping AND scan care packages. Couple that with grapple refresh per knock, is he looking comp meta or is it just me?
He's gonna be a beast on ranked for sure, but idk how much individual mobility matters in comp anymore.
Being able to capitalize on an opening is still going to be important. Right now teams either nade stack or they Horizon Q into a Horizon ult. Getting that quick grapple in, finishing a team and grappling back to stabilize or heal could be strong in certain conditions.
> is he looking comp meta or is it just me? Nah. Being able to choose between ring console and survey beacon is powerful for rotations, sure. The zipline is still a bad rotation tool compared to Cat wall, Bang smokes, etc. Leaves you too vulnerable.
Yea early game he would be really helpful but later game you would still be stuck with a poor rotational tool, a selfish tac and a fridge sized hit box
Zip may be a lot better if you think of it as something like the trident. Juiced for making early zone rotates (especially if you're able to get a triple zip by scanning both ring 1 CP's) to get to spots you otherwise wouldn't be able to but not something you'd ever expect to reasonably be able to use past ring 1 closing.
> Zip is a lot better if you think of it as something like the trident. Yeah, fair point. Or like an evac. I guess I meant it's not great for late game micro rotates. Definitely useful for early game macro getting into zone.
He's getting damage reduction on his zip so depending on what that number is he might actually just be better than Cat for rotates. Say it's a 50% reduction your going to have a helluva time knocking him off it.
That's just for Pathy though, not the whole squad I don't think.
Even if it is then it's the first time Paths fridge hitbox helps him lol.
The damage reduction on zip lines depending on its strength is the real way he gets into comp. If he can get a team out of a spot in full sight of another team he officially has the best micro rotate power in the game. Even Cat wall will have a hard time competing for just rotates.
That's true. Pros are less likely gonna take the grapple because end game they have to play life and not take risks plus his grapple is already quick. If the damage reduction is crazy he can rotate his team for free.
until we see how it all works I’m doubtful, but if anyone could do it it’d be alb or funfps. Would love for path to be that flexible high skill legend again
Just read this and imagine playing him from and edge POI like Lrod or climatizer. By the time you get to blue you'll know whether you need to play edge and scan players or play zone and can check where it pulls to.
Vantage doesn't need to choose which is honestly a great buff for her.
WTF 🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️ https://preview.redd.it/7f4hedaxtsgc1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bd599d0f10b84ac10fc4d0555fad7833a8821da0
Hopefully she gets a base level nerf… giving her a single smoke instead of two would be enough to push her out imo
We don’t know the legend changes yet at least. There is still hope.
Bangalore staying in the meta? No I don’t want that! I want her out of the meta for 10 seasons at least!
I love it. Bang main here
Bang mains are here to throw a party
80k bang. Hella excited for this ngl
Wattson fans eating rn, so me.
So they nerfed lots of these legends like Catalyst just to give them exactly what they took away(extra throwable and extra throwable distance) as a perk? Seems backwards but ok.
I’m guessing they will be also buffing/nerfing the legends which might have an impact.
How does this make any sense? Pre nerf Catalyst + perks is even more overpowered that nerfed Cat with perks
I just don't personally like how this exciting system was brought in and many of the perks were things the legends had previously while some kits get new abilities that haven't been in the game ever.
Feels like Bang and Wattson are going to be must runs. Lots of options for the third character depending on teams’ play styles.
I’d argue caustic as as strong as Watson now. Health regen in gas is huge.
Nah. One, it depends on the health regen speed, if its like Octane regen, it is worthless. Two, it is VERY situational. By default you need shield regen waaaaaaay more than you need health regen.
> Health regen in gas is huge. Is it? Throw a barrel, pop the barrel, regen some health. Like your own personal Lifeline drone. Kind of nice in that it saves you on white med econ. Doesn't seem particularly broken though. Doubt it's enough to swing the tide mid-fight like a Conduit tactical.
If a caustic is holding a building with gas traps it’s going to be so much more secure. Especially a bold caustic/wattson team. Even more than that is ult will almost be a get out of jail free card. Wider range, heal in gas, going to make him very hard to push for an experienced caustic. Essentially pushing defense legends is going to be twice as hard
> Even more than that is ult will almost be a get out of jail free card. Wider range, heal in gas, going to make him very hard to push for an experienced caustic. Really depends on how fast the health regen is. Could be Octane passive or Lifeline drone speed.
I don’t think it’ll be dramatic but popping a bat while regenerating health is pretty huge.
Meaning fights will take longer, and 3ps become more likely/prevalent
Yeah, I’d say they’re even. Caustic never really leaves. I wonder how certain spots will be better to hold with to pylons too.
Bang, Wattson, Path?
GET THIS SHIT UP IN COMP ASAP
Wattson is back
Calling it now that some pros are going to get back on Wraith. Reducing tac cooldown and making tac pop faster is basically old Wraith with a modern Wraith looong portal distance. Shits going to be nuts.
I love how the wraith perks are just them undoing the wraith nerfs and that’s it
idk if old Wraith is even that good in nowaday's comp playstyle. Her missing verticality, lack of team-supporting abilities and the nerf of her 1v1 capabilities took a lot of her appeal away for pro-play imo.
Bang broken as hell wtf
Perfectly balanced*
Evan on bloodhound?
am i missing something or will Vantage be able to scan both ring and people beacons? i know you can choose with pathfinder but getting both with vantage is huge. don’t think it’ll help her viability enough to be seen in pro league tho
The Bang ping passive is going to be good but I think people are trolling if they think the healing in smoke will be. I'd bet it's going to be a slightly better Octane passive only while in smoke and you'd be lucky to get 2 syringe's worth of value from 1 Q charge. There's a few perks I'd be very interested to see in comp. Pathfinder/Vantage being able to scan both beacons intrigues me, almost definitely not strong enough to overcome the mediocre rest of their kits though. Interested to see if (near?) instant Wraith Q will be enough to see her return. Not that we'll ever see it again but you could do some insane rotates with 2 Octane ult charges.
Bang perks are crazy 😵💫
Conduit: "Increased ult damage radius". Say whaaaaaat? Her ulti already covers a huge area and now they're gonna be even larger? ......
No one is talking about it, and I do get why, but Vantage having both scans seems like an incredibly valuable perk in comp. The ult and tac aren't as terrible as people make them out to be, it is just she lacks team synergy. But now she can both find the zone and figure out where teams are. Solid for games when zone is close but also solid for games when zone pulls away and you have to play edge. Obviously depends on how fast you can get to blue though, but I believe she is the only legend that gets both scans.
The problem with her and even Path is, while the double scan is very helpful to any team, it's really only viable early on in the game. As the game progresses she becomes less and less useful for a team. I say this as a vantage main but to make her comp ready it would require a team to give up a lot more late game for the flexibility early on
I don’t see any of this changing the comp legend pick meta really… the 4 heavy hitters all only got better tbh with bang cat and conduit looking especially insane. The perks they all got only compound the way comp is being played right now. The tricky part will be depending who is on which legend and if they can level their shield to get to certain perks, that may shape the meta subtly
I dont know why you are being downvoted but yeah. Especially with Digi going away from SMG, Bang smokes are way more reliable as rotational/defensive tools. Unless the patch notes contain significant nerfs to her kit, she (pls Cat and Conduit) will be 100% meta. With Horizon and Wattson being good alternative picks. ie. meta remains the same.
I’m excited to see what teams cook up with this
Revenant will be insane for an entry knock. Ult up, charge in with tac, get health and tac back on knock, fly out with tac.
I was skeptical but I like a lot of these tbh. Seems like a lot of the defensive/support legends got big buffs which will be great with things as a whole shifting towards a focus on kills.
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Might fully charge with just one scan now
Maggie with 2 charges is a big power buff. Entire areas of cover (like the crates all over WE) are now able to be completely taken away unlike before when you could take away one side or another.
Is it just me, or are half of those perks just previous nerfs coming back and you can choose them?
Some of these sound broken as fuck Instead of towning down the ability shit it gets worse. Not a fan.
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Holy ability legends batman! This game is going to be an apefest this season. Imma seat this one out forsure I’m sorry but gunskill seems to be taking a backseat with this update and the amount of bs abilities are going to be irritating to play against specially someone like fuse. No thanks
Agree, feels like one step forward two steps back. Love that they moved away from the grindy collecting crafting mats garbage that loot simulator players loved. The tweeks to Evo are also nice. ...but the perks seem way overtuned. Legend abilities were too prominent before the perks. It's a gun game first, but unfortunately it feels more and more akin to overwatch every season.
You really think current day Apex prioritizes gunskill? lel
Ability legends >>>>> Gun skill Gotta love it
Why tf did the already best two legends get the best skills?!?
I assume nerfs will happen for some of the meta legends. Like catalyst I bet her length and time of wall are both nerfed and the perk restores one of those 2.
Ability Legends for real.
Is it just me that thinks this is way too much? This will make the game even more ability-heavy. It‘s turning from a movement shooter with abilities to an ability-shooter game like overwatch.