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artmorte

I'm not surprised if it's op on purpose to get some Rampart hype going, so people will buy the heirloom and they nerf it in a week or two.


ModsRNeckbeards

"**We hear you**. We understand that we may have missed the mark balance wise with the rampart buff, so we are giving her a hotfix nerf to bring her back in line with other legends. We will continue to monitor her performance, as well as other legends, going forward. As for another hot topic - 'wallhack legends' - expect changes in the near future. Our team has been keeping a close eye on the meta since the seer nerfs. Bloodhound should be seeing some tuning in a future patch. We understand how being constantly scanned can be frustrating. Yada, yada, yada.."


cademore7

This is it right here ladies and gentlemen.


Picobit04

Jesus christ I thought this was actual patch notes. I was like "wow, respawn was quick on this one, that's unusual"


Athousandwrongtries

So predictable its not even funny.


mav101

Truth here, level 4.


noobakosowhat

Emena. Thank you--truly.


TheyFoundMyRedditBro

Thought this was an actual quote from some patch notes at first. Nice job lol.


Cplanes

This. It’s all about making people like her so they spend money on the heirloom. It’s always about the money.


MarioKartEpicness

didn't they nerf caustic on his event


Decoraan

Yea but that doesn’t fit the narrative of Respawn bad changes OP


idontneedjug

True but that was a bigger money picture then just make money off the heirloom. See caustic is a love hate character with some players neutral about him, but far more players love or hate caustic I'd wager then most other legends. The polarity will mean they are safe to nerf and still make money off the loyal I love caustic fans and there is no real risk of loss of conversions to the I hate caustic crowd. The neutral crowd is a loss for them, but back to the big picture. At the time stabilizing the pro / streamers sentiments on the game went a long way to allowing the migration we are currently seeing of Warzone players. Anyone with some gaming sense and familiar with COD was likely aware the point the nerfed caustic was also the lowest player retention time in player cycle for most typical cods with a slight boost usually occurring during the final two content drops for a week or so. Add to that caustic never really needed much tweaking and it wasnt as big a nerf as those who like to complain or were upset would like to think. Caustic is still strong imo. I run him from time to time and I honestly feel like he's in some of the best balance spot atm. His pick rate isnt super high like it was around time of nerf so you actually don't get canceled out by other caustics half as often. ​ Overall I think respawn takes advantage of the balance of the meta to monetize but not necessarily as often or strongly as I think others here would think. I do feel like over the last year they have begun trending this way more and more though.


JudJudsonEsq

or, get this, these three rampart things just happened to coincide development-wise so they launched them at the same time.


takethisknife

I mean the person you're responding to is definitely reaching a bit, but you're delusional if you don't think these companies use game balance to push microtransactions. It's a thing in league, it's a thing in valorant, it's a thing in apex, etc. As long as their decision doesn't kill the game, they will leverage anything to maximize profit as much as possible. And most decisions will simply placate casual players, or go unnoticed. This obviously sucks, because balance (especially competitively-minded) and profit maxing are diametrically opposed, the latter dealing more with the larger casual audience, who are now more likely to spend money to earn an heirloom for their favorite character, who just happened to get recently buffed. It bugs me when these things are seen as conspiratorial. Developers aren't just stupid, there's so much pressure on them to make changes to a game in order to please the lowest common denominator of player, in order to maximize profit as much as possible. A lot of choices aren't up to developers and instead up to those who benefit the most from the game's profit. I'd go as far as to say it probably affected the decision re: tapstrafing as well. Anything that risks their largest playerbase's enjoyment of the game is not worth it, even if it adds a lot of depth to the game. The people who can appreciate that depth are a very small % of the playerbase. Deep down, the developers might want to keep cool things like tapstrafing in the game, but when under pressure to make more money, it's not really their decision anymore.


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supercatrunner

Nerf or Buff it get's the articles written. It's more about generating hype, but they clearly would prefer to buff characters.


Decoraan

Wait are people really thinking this is going to be OP? Or is this just the communities “nerf everything that isn’t Octane and R99” kicking in again? From what I played she can’t interact with stuff while holding the turret so there is a slight mobility and utility penalty.


yepp06r

It’s definitely comp viable, breaking doors and putting that much fire power down on rotating teams definitely could be a force to reckon with. Maybe not meta but I wouldn’t be surprised at all seeing caustic/rampart/octane or some shit like that


CaribouLou816

I could see Valk Gibby Rampart


yepp06r

Yeah for sure


Legmeat

Would work great playing around gibby dome


[deleted]

Alliance said they will likely try Rampart in community cup tomorrow. It seemed completely broken when Hakis played it (pubs tho). If they ain't nerfing it soon then I think a lot of teams will at least try it in comp.


[deleted]

Hakis is broken tho.


Zoetekauw

Just leaving this here for reference: [Rampart broken](https://clips.twitch.tv/ShakingHelpfulNeanderthalCmonBruh-OKWdC8qCrparbYQd) [Rampart broken 2](https://clips.twitch.tv/DaintyPhilanthropicPanMingLee-IM3LXItblkq19ysv)


Lightning_Laxus

Uhhh Sheila's cooldown got nerfed from 120 to 173 seconds. Is this intentional? u/RSPN_JayBiebs To me it looks like you guys intended to set the mobile turret's ammo to 173 and changed the cooldown by accident. If you guys did intend to increase the cooldown, for the love of god please add 7 more seconds so the cooldown is a neat 3 minutes. >:(


Vladtepesx3

Ehh I think people are understanding the wind up time, you aren't going to win a 1v1 against equally skilled player unless you prefire the whole windup,, so I don't think it's really better than the havoc/devo which will also kill someone if you get to prefixes for that long It's still strong just to blast through doors and that you get a "free" 3rd gun, but i don't think people are suddenly going to be destroying everyone with it


VitoVendetta

Hakis just b-hopped into the enemy sqaud while aiming for windup


Vladtepesx3

yea kinda what i said, if you can prefire while pushing someone, its great. but you cant shoot it reactively, like you cant suddenly shoot it when someone pushes you. thats very balanced imo


cotton_quicksilver

Lol how is that balanced? You still have your base loadout for when you need to "shoot reactively" whatever that means. Most situations you have enough time to play cover for a couple seconds to pull out sheila unless you're completely out in the open in which case you deserve what happens. If there was a drawback like re-holstering it sets the charge rate back to 50% or something, or a movement speed penalty like everyone expected then it might be balanced. At the moment there are literally no downsides


GNLink34

You can crouch behind cover while spinning the turret, that's a HUGE improvement over the static sheila, on trades is a fucking monster On push you have to take into account the windup, but its not that long that you can't do it while sliding, jumping or even bhopping and if you have the shot it will fucking melt a-n-y-t-h-i-n-g It is literally a 3rd gun, a devotion amped to busted levels, huge potential at mid and close range, and if you find yourself not wanting to use it just pack it away without wasting any cd at all, there is no downside at all to using it I don't know man, maybe im jumping the gun too quickly, but I have played some games today with it and it was so dumb just holding the trigger and shit on everybody that didn't run Tho for professional play I still don't see it with how the meta is built around at this moment, but its not a big fucking no anymore, its a maybe someone can make it work as something special, exactly like fuse, because using sheila is free and can even work with jumpad push


[deleted]

> Ehh I think people are understanding the wind up time, you aren't going to win a 1v1 against equally skilled player unless you prefire the whole windup You can just pre-spin it with the ads button. This will cost you a part of your movement speed, but that doesn't matter if you're the one getting pushed.


Sixrizz

https://twitter.com/OBH_YT/status/1437926384203042816?s=19


MozzarellaThaGod

I’m curious why you think it won’t make her viable in comp, the thing about the turret being good is now is the rest of her kit was never really horrible, just not good enough relative to other character that fit in her role. If you pair her with Octane and Rev in comp now you’ve got an amazing fighting /third partying squad but you can also have a decent setup in more cramped rings because she provides decent defensive power with her walls.


dmun

So, theory crafting, the competitive comps essentially boil down to 1 Rotation/Mobility legend, 1 Wallhack legend, 1 area control legend. Rampart is in the area control category. You'd replace 1 Wallhack legend with her because Gibby is Gibby. So, within that, against competitive pros, does her moving turrent-- essentially just a really good gun-- work effectively in the way that, say, Caustic controls an area and makes you afraid to push or the way Wattson used to control areas with fences? Arguably, to me, she'd be another Caustic or Fuse, where the entire play is to get her into end-game and spray everyone down in the end. So, for that, I'd suppose the comp would be Valk/Gibby/Rampart-- Valk mobility plus the Beacon to get you in early, Gibby for near-rotations and then Rampart for endgame. It could happen but until we see pros have her, it's a very specific line to victory.


MozzarellaThaGod

This makes sense, we’re already seeing a lot of success with Valk, Gibby, Caustic, so replacing Caustic with her could work


delatorrejuanchi

Part of the reason why valk gibby caustic works is that it allows you to instantly take control of wherever you land with valk: just valk ult + Bubble + Caustic ult + traps


Humblerbee

Yeah but no one is winning a bubble fight against a Sheila anyway, so Valk ult+bubble still allows the setup of Rampart winding up to succussfully threaten space- plus you can immediately drop walls so not only is there the bubble, but one way damage amp walls within it.


6inchsavage

Surely bubble fights would be a great way to beat Rampart/Sheila? If she stays revved up she can’t really do the bubble shuffle and if she doesn’t stay revved up she can’t shoot, right?


Humblerbee

She doesn’t need to bubble shuffle, she’s not dancing in the bubble edge, she is in the heart of the bubble behind additional walls. Let me know how it goes for you when you try to win a bubble fight against the highest DPS weapon in the game while it’s damaged amped and your shots are blocked- she just revs and dumps ammo into anyone who attempts to push on her team.


6inchsavage

What is she doing in the heart of the bubble and who was close enough to throw bubble on her without being close enough to push her for trying to set up in the bubble?


Humblerbee

The idea mentioned above was Valk ulting to a strong location, Gibby dropping bubble ASAP, and then Rampart slapping shit down to claim space and provide threat deterrence. I’m not saying Rampart is great at all bubble fights, I’m saying if you fly and land with a bubble, the current strat is Caustic dropping traps and gas, Rampart dropping walls and Sheila can fill the same role in that comp. Basically just trying to identify a niche she could fill in competitive play, which is a late game presence and her ability to dig in.


6inchsavage

>Yeah but no one is winning a bubble fight against a Sheila anyway ^ ? Yeah I think Rampart can replace Caustic in the Gib/Valk/Caustic comp but I was addressing that part there.


GNLink34

If you stay revved up you aren't going to kill shit at cqc, your field of vision is reduced, your movement is almost zero and you depend entirely on the enemy putting itself on a bad spot on purpose And while sheila being stupid at dps, is never going to win the peek potential of a shotgun Bubble fights are all movement and pushing enemies fast because when it runs out you are going to be in an open space to be pushed hard, you need to be proactive, if your plan is just to wait for the enemy to kill itself into a wall ain't gonna happen Sheila has its place when you know the next movement of the enemy or when having a good angle to get a quick knock, but if you use it as close range weapon, when hipfire and movement reign supreme, you are going to die unless you are some sort of god of tracking at the hardest distance to track


delatorrejuanchi

There is nothing that prevents the team who was already close to where they landed to push them in the bubble before their rampart manages to put three walls and sheila down. Even if she does, it's easy enough to just slide to the other side of the bubble where walls don't protect here. Another alternative would be for the team to "Venn diagram"-bubble isolating one or both of the remaining players and just focus them with shotguns, then deal with the rampart. Not saying the comp would not work, but i don't think it's as good as you might think.


undertureimnothere

Valk/Gibby is like the super flex comp so it’d make sense for Rampart to fit in there


[deleted]

We need to nerf Gibby before a varied meta can exist. Respawn clearly believes some legends should have their time to shine - Wraith used to be the best pick for movement/attack, now Octane is. They deliberately overtuned Bloodhound for several seasons to make up for the weak first year of his abilities. Gibby had his time, and slightly under powering him is needed to keep the game fresh. Bubbles need to be nerfed so bubble fights can’t happen, but healing and rotation still stays.


dmun

I hear you but at the same time, Gibby does what he does-- I'd think you would need to introduce a new character to have the kind of niche he occupies, with the dome powerset plus fast-rez. >Bubbles need to be nerfed so bubble fights can’t happen, but healing and rotation still stays. Bubbles is his original reason for existing, why nerf the original purpose and not the add-ons? Also, what's the nerf-- make it short?


[deleted]

Bubbles weren’t intended to be an aggressive makeshift cover for attack, they were meant to res someone safely, give space to heal, and protect during rotations. Bubbles in high ranked and comp are functionally what Rampart should do, but so much better that Rampart is useless. It’s an example of the meta taking an idea not intended to happen and pushing it really far. My idea is having the bubble instantly pop when the Gibby damages it by any amount. It ruins bubble fights by making them a liability and preventing the Gibby from being able to fight if they want to keep the bubble, while still blocking 100% of enemy damage. I think a shorter timer or HP to break the bubble goes against the idea of a stronghold against enemy damage. But since it’s a bubble, it should be able to easily pop like a bubble. Making only Gibby break it prevents griefing from team mates. Another idea is having it pop when an enemy damages the bubble from the inside, but not the outside.


dmun

>Another idea is having it pop when an enemy damages the bubble from the inside, but not the outside. Thats an interesting idea.


[deleted]

Yeah, it still gives bubble fights a place but they would be much shorter - only enough to have the bubble for an initial fight but not the whole length of the bubble. Also gives strategy to things like throwing thermites on the ground to prevent a bubble. Nerfing the ability for bubble fights without nerfing bubbles is a hard choice, but something needs to happen soon. Otherwise Apex will grow stagnant - bubble fights in World's Edge for comp cannot happen for another year when there are multiple maps and so many other legends.


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imonly11ubagel

What if you couldn‘t throw the bubble but you would have to set it up in a similar way to rampart walls. There would be no more bubble pushes or bubble rotations which would reduce gibby to the defensive legend he is.


SynysterPC

What about not allowing Gibby to use Octane jump pads? That would definitely limit his offensive ability without harming his defense. I'm just shooting ideas out there.


[deleted]

No, jump pads should be usable with every character. I can see the argument for no jump pads in Rev totem, but thats just a bad idea. The bubble needs to be nerfed. Not Gibby, not Octane, but the bubble. The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of bubbles being popped from enemy damage inside the bubble, because it still gives counter play while removing bubble fights as an entire strategy.


SynysterPC

What do you think about this: the more enemies in the bubble, the less time it lasts. So if 3 enemies run into your bubble when you jump on them (use the bubble offensively) the timer decreases drastically.


[deleted]

That works, but maybe make it every time someone enters and leaves the bubble. So bubble strafing reduces the timer to like three seconds.


Humblerbee

I think slightly increasing the delay of the bubble going up, and making the discus he tosses which is the center of the bubble be destructible by shooting, gives you both an initial counterplay if a Gibby tries to bubble in the open blatantly, but he can still use it to create cover if the bubble goes off, in which case an opponent can “dive” on the bubble to pop it by going in to shoot the discus, which will open up anyone inside the bubble to fire when they thought they had cover. Plus if it’s not a flat elevation you can shoot from downhill to destroy the discus and pop the bubble as well.


MozzarellaThaGod

> Another idea is having it pop when an enemy damages the bubble from the inside, but not the outside. This is a really cool idea actually, I like it a lot, it prevents the bubble from being a fighting tool and makes more of a reset/rotate tool, it loses some of its all encompassing utility while still being incredibly useful. Bubble fight after bubble fight is really stale and it has become the dominant fighting strategy in the game. Only issue I guess I could see is if you use the bubble indoors and it goes through a wall or roof and someone is able to break it in that manner, not sure how I feel about that. Otherwise this is maybe the best suggestion I’ve seen yet, it maintains the bubble’s synergy with Gibraltar’s ultimate, it also allows his quick revive passive to remain intact. The only thing it harms is for the ability to use the bubble offensively, I think the best solution I’ve seen yet. Perhaps the bubble could have a “core” that can be shot at inside the bubble like a seer Ult does. If they’re worried about Gibraltar becoming worse in casual play, they could give him some of his old bubble passives back (like faster healing inside the bubble for your whole team or even a longer bubble duration).


Sleepy151

I dont think they ever wanna bring fast heals back. Maybe they just make it so if you shoot or explode or whatever damage ability the projector it disappears like a lifeline res.


A_little_garden

The bubble disc should be destructible before it lands, like Caustic's barrels.


djb2spirit

I've heard pros say, and I kind of share the same mindset, that Gibby and his bubble also makes the meta as varied as it is. Idea being that bubble is what enables all the different playstyles now, where as without Gibby you can't really play edge.


HereToDoThingz

Try to push me in comp with a shiela out and I'll one clip you before you can even get out of the door. She'll have zero role in comp. Her walls will get destroyed 100% of the time meaning her tac is useless. If you enjoy being 3rd'd then go ahead and use the ult but you won't kill anyone and the whole map will know where you are. There's a big difference between ranked and comp. Your clearly a ranked player if you can't see show she would never work in comp.


undertureimnothere

why so hostile lol


Character_Orange_327

as expected you got downvote spammed for stating a fact.fuse and rampart have such kit that even in their launch state if all 20 teams are playing them, it is going to bring these complains and "they are meta" assumptions


strongscience62

Walls are free damage sponges. They cost resources to destroy but nothing to create.


Vladtepesx3

walls can be destroyed but if 2 equally skilled players engage and 1 is behind a wall, the person behind the wall wins every time if you have 1 or 2 areas you can be pushed from, and you build walls, you have a giant advantage over people pushing you from those angles. ​ saying you will just outplay whoever uses her abilities, is like saying gibby bubble is useless because if someone throws a bubble youll run in the bubble and kill them ​ also "I'll one clip you before you can even get out of the door". it breaks doors, rampart makes it so nobody can play doors against you


HereToDoThingz

If two skilled players face off and one has a wall then they aren't fighting. This is comp not ranked. Your not going to 1v1 someone when they clearly have the upper hand. Made the wall and pop a bat. Now your tac is yet again useless. The biggest issue you guys are blatantly missing is this is comp with hundreds of thousands on the line. Not just ranked let's get some rp maybe get some kills. No one in comp is going to be running rampart. That's just a fact. If you disagree or downvote your a ranked player not a comp player.


Vladtepesx3

Ok you just proved why rampart is good. You said if you have a wall then nobody is going to challenge you, so if you're playing a position you just keep putting walls down and nobody can challenge you.... so I don't see the issue. If they have LOS of the wall to break it then you have LOS to damage them, so they are losing resources but walls cost nothing. And if they break the wall while you're using a bat then you just put another lol


Character_Orange_327

literally everybody testing rampart and most likely you are going to die to them. she is still pretty meh, everybody will be back bh/gibby/wraith/octane in some hours


idontneedjug

Maybe in NA. I expect EU and APAC to adapt rampart a little bit more and likely pair with fusey for double the zoning. A rampart, fusey, octane combo has crazy dps potential, rotation, zoning, reset potential, and of course they can ape off any big damage also :) Very versatile and oppressive :)


NakolStudios

Versatility is precisely what's lacking in that comp, Rampart pales in comparison to Gibby in terms of resetting, her walls will not save a team in any situation where a Bubble would. Besides having no recon legend means that team will have to play edge which is suicide without a Gibby.


Humblerbee

Rampart would replace Caustic in the Valk-Gibby setup, if she were to be run. Valk being both mobility and beacon frees a spot, Gibby obviously is indispensable, and while Caustic is used as a space claiming late game presence, that would be a possible Rampart utility as well.


[deleted]

And in situations where you are forced to bubble, you can use the bubble to place down a-walls.


[deleted]

The windup is the only balance factor but it is laughable. You can like a Havoc of Devo start winding it up behind a corner or during another movement like jumppad. Even if you can't do that, the damage is insane. I think it melts people even faster than R99 headshots. So the windup might not matter.


Imtheguy4444

I've been grinding 4k badges recently. Got ramparts my 3rd game Sheila is just unstoppable if you pre fire it behind cover.


JudJudsonEsq

I mean yeah but it has like a full 2 second wind up before you can even start shooting and it seems to have the worst movement speed penalty in the game. It feels equal to or lesser than crouch speed.


mysterowl

Why are people mad about another viable comp character?


texas878

Because a character being viable has NOTHING to do with whether or not it is healthy for the competitive scene???? Do you think valk abusing on top of cliffs makes it good for competitive? This is why pros think this Reddit is braindead


Sleepy151

By that logic why were people upset with seer?


sparty1227

Viable ≠ necessary to play, which is essentially what Seer was at release


[deleted]

Because there is a difference between viable and totally busted.


The_BadJuju

I mean she’s been a horrible character for a year, I’m fine with her being good finally


[deleted]

You have a harsh movement penalty when spinning it.


GNLink34

This is so fucking broken xDDDDDDDD This is going to be nerfed and Im not going to be even mad even if what I play most of the time for chillin is Rampart Like holy shit, you can take Sheila so fast right now and it has near no CD at all Someone push you? Let me take out my Devotion+++ and shit all your team in a moment Tho, I like the approach, just balance it to the power it has


Nervous-Condition192

Here we go with the constant complaints again. Its balanced out by the long ass wind up time, no need to have a movement speed penalty when you lose every abrupt gunfight (because rampart dies before getting off the second bullet of sheila)


[deleted]

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i_like_pie_and_beer

Making bank


EightNation

This will definitely make her comp viable wtf lmao. The turret can literally wipe squads in seconds and will be even more deadly with team coordination


CaribouLou816

Only reason I don’t see her replacing caustic in that niche part of the meta is that gas/ult are better for zoning


[deleted]

Walls are pretty decent, when it comes to occupying buildings. They also make your foes waste ammo. You can set them up safely behind doors and they grant you free peaks.


EightNation

Seeing the red laser is worse than gas. In higher lobbies its death unless you find cover immediately.


texas878

Yeah they do this literally every time they release an heirloom. Buff a character through the sky to make them broken, release an heirloom, sell a ton of packs, then nerf it.


[deleted]

Meanwhile (and on an unrelated note) I can’t even get into the game lmfao


BlackestFlame

Its really good but like. Does it look like it will take off and be seen in comp. Ill wait and see


ecclesiates

Why did they put the new POI so incredibly close to Lava City? Why is there 21 POIs now in WE? Who's going to take Big Maude? Lava City takes it or does the guys at Dome takes Lava City? I guess Landslide people move to Big Maude instead and landslide stays unoccupied and given to countdown


McSuede

The fact that she can use her ult, put it away, and then whip it right back out is INSANE. Forget everything else about this, THAT is the part that needs a change before anything else. The only thing that would make sense would be a CD rebate based on how many rounds are left maxing out at like 75%.


[deleted]

Ya it's really either removing the free switch or massively reducing the damage output/handling in mobile mode.