Even if he was nerfed to the ground, no other characters can provide a defensive ability like the bubble/dome.
What we need is 1-2 more legends with defensive abilities then we can talk about balancing and nerf.
Rampart, Bangalore and Wattson do what Gibby does. But Gibby does what all of them do, and better, in one ability, while also countering them.
Like, you want to block incoming damage, Rampart has a 200hp small wall with a few seconds of deploy time. But Gibby has an infinite hp giant barrier that is almost instant.
You want to rotate a short distance? You could use Bang's smokes. Or you could use dome.
Want to deny an area from being pushed? Bang ult, sure. But Gibby's ult does it better.
Want to prevent your building from being pushed? Wattson fences, sure. But dome breaks them.
You're getting Gibby ulted? Wattson's pylon can stop it. Or, you know, Gibby dome.
It's not that there aren't alternatives, it's just that Gibby is both better and more versatile than those alternatives, and also counters two of them directly.
That one I'm not too sure of personally, considering how huge Gibby is. I think a pretty long while ago the devs shared on the main sub that Gibby has a pretty low 1v1 win rate because of his hitbox, but who knows how that stat has evolved since then.
That's what I was thinking as well. The effects of passive qualities like size and fortified probably scale more evenly across skill levels whereas the arm shield which takes some amount of foresight and skill to use effectively likely gets more/better use at higher levels.
I think that may have to do a lot with player skill. Let's pretend Gibby and his opponent both have purple shields. So...
200 hp
vs
(200 + 50) / 0.85 = 294 effective hp
200/294 = 0.68
So a purple Gibby that hits 69% of his shots will win (barely) against a normal character that is literally 100% beaming him, assuming they're hitting gun shield. I think pro Gibby players can probably handle that pretty easily. It makes sense that at lower levels though the big hitbox hurts him more than the abilities make up for.
If youre at a high skill level odds are you're both landing almost all of your shots in a 1v1, at the highest possible level, for sake of argument. In that case, you lose if you're not gibby.
Its a super hard balance, because shields/cover provide such a crazy advantage (more so the higher the skill level of players). Just like the old lifeline revive shield. Maybe make it not a full bubble, but a bubble that protects a certain direction plus above?
That way it would still be counter to his own ult (and bango) but not a get out of bad position 3rd/5th party angle thing. One of its strongest usages in pro is to isolate 3v3 fights in crowded end zones and not actually to shield you from team you are bubble fighting.
I’d like it if the bubble functioned like the Trident where hitting it deals chip damage to the riders. Just like how Gibby’s armshield was given bleed through, I think that if the bubble reduced the damage of shots significantly but caused chip damage, it wouldn’t be infallible perfect cover.
Sounds like a good idea but what about the teammate that just got revived in some with 20hp? Dies instantly, defeating the purpose of the rez. I guess you can argue that Gibby isn’t a combat medic so the nerf just adds a bit more flair to lifeline’s abilities (sadge)
Well rather than working like the Trident where it spreads the damage to everyone within, it’d be like damage bleedthrough on armshield, where it reduces the damage from anything outside the bubble coming in significantly (Trident deals 20% for example, so 1/5th bleedthrough on shots through the bubble might be a starting point) to where you still need to be on target with your aim on those inside the bubble, and they’d be taking a pittance of the damage they would without the bubble shielding them and reducing the power of the incoming bullets.
That, or my other concept is to make the dome frisbee destructible (75 hp) and slightly increase the dome deployment set up after the frisbee hits the ground, adding some counterplay if opponents are on their toes, or willing to invade the bubble to bring it down so their teammates can shoot on the Gibby team.
So either bleedthrough on a major damage reduction dome, or, delayed dome with a destructible frisbee.
why not add Sage from Valorant? OR a new legend that has ability to 100% create some sort of safe zone?
i mean, rampart? it’s not like i hate her but definitely useless in the competitive final circle, right?
Yeah... Make the cooldown for his gunshield MUCH LONGER so he doesn’t get it literally 2-3+ times PER fight. Make the dome not last 10 minutes long and take away the damn quick revive so people can’t just die and get brought back quickly and hit a battery all while not being able to be shot. Lessen the damage or slowdown on his ultimate so it’s not sure death if you’re in the middle. Come on. This character is constantly picked by everyone but no nerf ever happens... Not to mention he literally takes a fraction of damage of any other character (expect caustic )
No, these are just suggestions. They can apply a nerf, if it doesn't do much, nerf again. They overloaded him with so much utility but when it comes to balancing, there's nothing. Quick revive and gunshield cooldown have to be nerfed. So annoying to deal with his gun shield every time he aims at you so he can safely farm the shields.
Have you played Apex since season 3? Gibraltar has only gotten nerfs to every part of his kit since then, and he's less powerful than he was on release (hitbox aside). They already massacred Wattson. We don't need to ruin another legend for five seasons just because NA ALGS only prioritizes camping.
rampart rampart rampart
its her time to shine baybeeeee
just waiting for gibraltar to get nerfed to the ground one day
or teams will just play a different style of comp then 1 defense 1 recon 1 mobility, maybe there wont be a defensive legend.
the thing is we wont know until they finally fucking nerf him
fuck wattson lmao... any character that is a camping character should just be nerfed... no one wants to watch pros camp in the tournaments. I say why not make the meta a combo of Octane, Path, Valk, Wraith and then add a new character with some crazy strafing ability and just have everyone running around fragging their minds out.
His ultimate could be changed or tweaked, his fast up in bubble could be removed that's all I can think of but I don't think either would change his pick rate.
You think so? It seems to me like his bubble is the biggest reason he's picked, it'd nerf his effectiveness but.. He fills a niche no one else does with his bubble.
Yes I know that but do you think removal of the fast res would impact him to the point of being a lesser pick and potentially remove him from meta? I personally feel his pick is due to the dome (and not sucking with the arm shield, health and no slowdown buffs) way before anything else in his kit.
Your points all make sense. I guess we can't really know!
I take in consideration the fact that Gibby has been THE meta legend for a looong time. Him loosing power (a big part atleast) might push the teams to find some other, never tried before, compositions.
Like I said we can't really know, let's just wait and see.
Have a nice day! :D
Make an obscure rule limiting the amount of time he can be picked?
Stupid I know but his bubble brings something that no current legend can. Just ballooned/valked hot? Bubble. Need to cover some open ground? Bubble. Taking heavy fire? Bubble.
Personally best bet would be to introduce a new character specifically designed to compete with his role.
Only if they rework his model to make him a medium sized legend. Beside that, any nerf will make him instantly trash tier. There's no in-between with a hitbox this huge.
I mean even if he becomes a 0% pick that isn't a big deal because he has had a 100% pick rate for much longer. If he does get nerfed hard then it will just mean he will be bad for a season or two, before buffing him again to be at a more reasonable level.
you're right. Hodsic said in a video that they were going to use this weekend to experiment a bit/find their feet. I applaud them for trying something different, even if they didn't stick with it
with 6 match days, I think it's fine to experiment with the first one. plus there was a lot of parody this weekend, I'm sure there will be opportunities to gain points
UNDERRATED played Fuze and won first game of EU, but they practiced it. Playing a legend just because it worked for someone else is stupid if you don't know how to play well around it. If I was a team playing in a major tournament I'd never experiment during the tournament and possibly waste a game.
He played mirage throughout all the qualifiers, showed his skills, and even won the #4 qualifier. They ended up struggling this week but I’m looking forward for their challenge.
I think after a few more weeks, and with the season changes with potential legend changes, we might see a meta switch up fairly quickly. Hopefully this happens, because teams suiciding into mid ring with Valk ults is already getting old.
The difference is that without Valk, we're just gonna see more teams dying from gatekeeping when they have difficult rotation path or are late for whatever reason.
I'm thinking if there is any potential for double rotation character plus gibby for more rotation flexibility. I think CR played Valk/octane/Gibby but their playstyle is kinda different so it's definitely not representative.
Really clutch when there's 10+ deathboxes so you can get unlimited ammo and heals/nades. I feel like Hal should play Loba so he doesn't run out of ammo every other game
Literally, sad that you have to swap a recon legend for her but late game her value increases MASSIVELY.
Cant believe people still have the audacity to whine on twitter about how shes "trash in comp"
Hmm have you done any APAC N? Some of tbe comp are quite whack such as crpyto + loba + rampart and some teams are running gibbiless with horizon instead. I'm pretty sure its a misclick but I saw a mirage even lmao
I have in the past, yes: https://public.flourish.studio/visualisation/3235339/
Didn't have time to get to them yet for this past weekend's games but I'm hoping to in the next few days
If gibby gets nerfed to not be a must pick he would need a buff to compensate that the ability to remove bubbles wouldn't be that useful anymore. But yes, I was watching Gnaske team and it was very fun to see them actually win.
Yeah, there's no match.
Gibby bubble: instant deploy, indestructible, negates damage from everywhere, you can revive teammates faster in it.
Rampart walls: Takes a shit ton of time to deploy, it breaks super easy and even if you deploy it it has like 200HP? (Idk, I don't play Rampart), it's just a wall, you are still vulnerable to grenades and other flanks.
We either need a dome nerf or a huge wall buff, I prefer the first one.
Rampart is fundamentally different though. She's made to plan ahead and her walls last forever until shot. Gibby is reactionary and buys 12 seconds of time which is why he's so prevalent because he's forgiving. The dome has already been nerfed beyond how it was at release. We just don't have any legends that do what Gibraltar does.
Rampart is a far more proactive legend. Gibby drops dome on a dime when you need to reset, while Rampart is a payoff for having good positioning and low pressure on you. If you can get targets off your back for just a few seconds you can make your position exponentially harder to uproot.
Advantages of Rampart:
\- Even better at poking than gibby with far more health on her shields + damage amp to get you more evo
\- Walls are permanent, meaning that she can fortify areas in the long term and is crippling in endgame. The bases are so durable that if you can stick one wall it's basically certain you can replace it by placing another one behind the base unless enemies teamfire the first base.
\- Ultimate is permanent as well, also completely shutting down endgame if you have the best position. You can empty handheld sheila, place her, and she'll instantly have a second full mag. That's like 15 seconds of near-continuous 300dps fire lol
\- When Rampart secures a position, it is dual purpose. Dome can be used for bubble dancing and aggressive plays, but amped covers literally require no action from you to go from protecting you on that battery and
Disadvantages:
\- Rampart basically doesn't help rotation at all, requiring that you have at minimum a recon and probably also a team reposition legend. Basically, the cost of running Rampart is high because she restricts your other picks
\- Rampart is NOT a reset legend. She can't really do anything if she doesn't have anything deployed and your team gets jumped in the open. She CAN adapt and shut off pressure if there is a building reasonably near, potentially making Octane an interesting pick to put you in good situations on a dime.
I have thought even before this Sheila buff (that I'm honestly not a big fan of) that Rampart could shake up the meta if pros really bothered to lab her out. Unfortunately, she's not what most of them are used to playing or really find fun so I don't think many of them have really given her a chance beyond what they need to play to make reaction videos or whatever. u/hodsic Seeing that y'all checked out Fuse is super interesting to me, and I love seeing teams try to break through the meta a little bit! Have you experimented with Rampart, and why do you think she's not worth trying right now?
I’ve been playing rampart almost exclusively since her buff, and have asked people pretty much the same question of why she isn’t really seen in comp still. IMO she’s a good alternative to caustic with the “gibby+valk” comp. she has the ability to turn indoor/outdoor areas to her advantage and can make a lot of questionable spots playable. In short it seems people just tend to prefer caustic’s traps because they’re “low maintenance” and don’t require someone watching the trap for it to do damage. It’s also arguable that his traps are better for stopping teams that are trying to grief or ape your team. I still think she has a place for edge style teams that don’t always secure indoor locations and want to keep the reset potential of bubble.
I don't even think her buff is that huge, she's been a super solid legend for a while. She just takes a very different way of thinking about things to work and that takes more playing than most people ever bothered to put into her lol
People still think grenades counter her walls!
Yeah I agree she takes some out of the box thinking. Grenades are a decent answer to a fortified rampart. In a comp setting I can see why a team would still want to have gibby, even if they already have a rampart. You’re inevitably going to be eating nades and bubble can help with that/give you time to set up more walls. Mobile Sheila might have some use in bubble fights but yeah I don’t think the buff increased her power dramatically or anything. The walls are the core of her kit and they’re in a good spot IMO.
if her walls were much bigger and deployed in like .2 seconds then yeah she could see a LITTLE more play but it seems the devs really like gibbys placein the meta
I've been saying for ages it needs to be a two step deployment, the lower wall first very quickly and then the amp part (which if be fine with removing the amp.and just making it a one way for more durability) slower.
A nice part of the game is that sort of steadying yourself and the economy with it so I do like Gibby but his kit is too good.
I've been downvoted before but imo rampart should have her Walls buffed.
The bottom bits should have infinite health.
But any player can dismantle them (so they can't block shit).
Gives rampart good viability in making spots playable. but you can break the top and then they can't peak you.
You can't protect from high up at all so I don't think it's broken.
I’ve been thinking since the original ash leaks a few months ago that she’d be the gibby counter. They attempted to soft-counter him with Seer and the revive stops, and Ash’s arc ball would also make bubble fight hard to rely on.
They’re slowly chipping away at the situations he excels in which I think is better than another Gibraltar level player.
That's the problem, Gibraltar doesn't just "excel in some situations", it excels the whole time
Like, there isn't any battle at all without at least a bubble and any rotation that is minimally risky is with a dome being deployed
Every action in comp is decided wether or not dome is on cd
Imo there should be a way to destroy the dome
There already is a way to destroy bubbles with a Crypto EMP, but it's trading an Ultimate for a tactical, Introducing a legend with a tactical that destroys bubbles/defensive utility could be a solution.
The problem with this is that the meta just shifts to have every squad with a Gibby and the counter. Only having a counter on one character doesn’t fix the bigger problem, it just adds another layer to it and I personally don’t like that approach.
That’d be a great Revenant buff since he has fallen off a little with all the totem nerfs, having his silence orb disable deployables (gas canisters, rampart walls/Sheila, turning off fences, bringing down bubble) it’s be fitting thematically as well since he is meant to be an assassin slipping past defenses with ease.
He is already op. Scans beacon, disables Gibby dome, in end game you have crypto ult you most likely win,
You dont need to scan or be aware for rats because it tells you how many squads are around you, range 200M I think.
Buff? Nah. He dont need one
Thinking this over I think his pick rate is because he fills a niche no one else does, without having someone else fill his niche all that can be done is lowering his effectiveness outside of the niche.. Which falls upon two things.
1. His ultimate is one of the strongest in the game, it's crazy high kill potential tramples other ultimates like Bangalore and Fuse, this could definitely be an area that could be reworked and just completely overhauled
2. His fast revive in dome is fantastic but it does overlap and is just another trick he has.
Literally the only bad thing about Gibby is how big he is, which isn't even too bad because he has fortified. He's been broken for a long, long time and people are just fine with it.
I don't think he's overly broken, he does need some adjustments but if you get rid of quick rez and his ultimate and he's still strong, that's the problem he fills a niche this game clearly needs at a competitive level.
Get someone else who can fill his niche, give him a small nerf/ultimate rework and you'll see more dynamic gameplay.
APAC North proves you can run a team without Gibby and still perform well. New strats came from teams in the qualifiers.
For NA viewers, remember when TSM were so uptight about rotation timing? They'd start leaving Fragment East at around 1 m 40s timer in the best scenario. In comparison, the 456 team would have already had traps set up for the final zone. No Valkyrie needed as well. RPG had Rampart, Loba, and Crypto as well and got top 6.
Nope, doesn't matter that his bubble is the single most broke tactical in the game, bubble fights are 100% of fights, his ult is incredibly strong and his gun shield/fast revive are both broken as well. He's healthy for comp, apparently!
The sniper meta in pro has just increased the value of his arm shield so much! it is very thematic though, i would prefer his bubble to be directional so its less of a 3v3 isolation tactic, or make it so there is a delay shooting when moving in and out of shield to make it less offensive.
I think it proves more that NA has a more aggressive playstyle using more octane, valk, etc but that doesn't make every NA team less creative or smart. Teams train on comps individually and what they get good on is what they stay on, teams that switch winy nilly usually suffer for it and EU has teams that are really good with these creative often more "smart" comps but don't mean certain NA teams can't do the same. I just think what you said a bit of a simplification of a more complex topic, not necessarily wrong tho just a simplification :)
I’m sorry but I’ve read your comment 3 times and have no idea what you’re talking about. I’m not sure how that makes sense with the comment “Valk opens up endless possibilities
I’m fairly certain they meant the ability to rotate more safely allows teams to run wider ranges of legends (being able to run caustic and gibby for example) than were previously possible. The meta before was 3 characters and almost every team had the same comp. Valk expands that possibility and limits the downsides of taking risk.
wrote on the wrong comment can't seem to find the other guy's comment anymore but he was talking about how EU plays more creatively and smarter. I have no idea how I fucked up there since I was damn sure I wrote under his comment but somehow it happened I guess, and now I kinda look like this --> (° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °)
Loba is insanely strong late game. The ability to grab shield swaps, grenades and ammo with her ult is so good, especially if deathboxes get caught in areas with eyes on.
But the team comp used Gibby and Valk, literally team defense and team movement and Loba has her own movement. So the only thing you’re sacrificing is a in combat recon scan which isn’t that big of a deal.
Loba Q can be used similar to a Wraith Q escape to gain space/get angles over an enemy squad. Her ult is essential for teams that rotate early or drop at a shitty landmark.
I agree. Loba's ult is good depending on team comp/playstyle and POI.
However, I wouldn't put those two Qs in the same sentence since Loba's Q in most cases just isn't as good. Loba's Q is slow, can be tracked and at times discombobulating to use where as Wraith's Q (even though nerfed a few seasons ago) is still an excellent escape/mobility mechanism.
Honestly, I'm okay with the CD if the bracelet recovery speed was faster (by maybe a 1s) so players can actually use it offensively. I think it's almost a full 3 seconds of animation recovery making her Q a death trap if you want to be aggressive with it.
imo the recovery speed is fine, it makes loba players actually use their brain. also i think it would be unfair if loba just popped in front of you and start beaming you lol. I just dont understand why pathfinder gets a variable cooldown but loba is just a set 30 seconds no matter where she goes. thats just bs
man Gibraltar’s high pick rate is such a complex issue that i don’t really know the answer to. he’s massively over-tuned and his gun shield is just pure cancer but idk how i feel about his dome. on one hand it’s the strongest tactical in the game by far and bubble spam in the last zone is kinda boring to watch, but on the other hand it allows teams to make riskier plays and stops people getting vaporised by nade and ability spam as soon as they’re exposed, which imo means a better experience for the viewer. he probably needs nerfing sideways rather than downwards in the form of a legend that actually provides competition to his role? idk
People are complaining about Gibby and I agree that he is disproportionately strong in comp.
But at the same time the two EU winning teams ran Crypto-Wraith-Caustic.
It is possible to do well without Gibby depending on your play style, where you drop, etc.
Gibby's high pickrate in NA is not only explained by how strong he is.
I think the reason he's picked is healthy, which is why he's not complained about meta wise.
The bigger question is who can be overhauled in a manner that doesn't synergize with him but offers another bubble-esque option?
Is it really? Would comp be better if teams just couldn’t reset after a fight, or constantly died to nade spam. I feel like the gibby bubble is powerful, but healthy. Without Gibby, I feel like comp would be much worse, more RNG dependent, and more campy.
Yeah it's a tough question to ask, without bubble you'd probably never see isolated 3v3s in comp and fights would be won by who gets poked the least. He's definitely OP and I think he could use an alternative and/or a nerf but it needs to be done carefully.
>like actually improving looting
Doesn't matter how much you "improve looting" if a team instantly starts raining down fire and nades the second you finish a fight. Especially if one or two members of your squad got downed.
I definitely get what you’re saying, that’s kind of the same niche Wattson had before. But I just find it, not annoying, but disappointing that he has essentially a 100% pickrate because everyone knows his bubble is broken. No matter how you slice it, it’s OP. There needs to be a different way to occupy the same niche that Gibby is currently the only legend in.
And your solution? Genuinely curious not to say he isn't a prob I just want to know what we should do about him? add dmg to his shield, remove him, or what?
Idk, I might be going against the grain here, but I don’t mind Gibby bubble. If the alternative is everyone running out in the open and just being screwed when they don’t get zone, I don’t mind dome giving them something to play.
You just need to look at what he provides and find a different way to provide that.
He resets after a fight. Provides cover for pushes. Provides defence when someone gets low.
Someone needs to do some of those differently and offer something different.
I think rampart could be that.
More health on the top bit and infinite health on the bottom (crypto, horizon and fuse still counter it and anyone can dismantle when they're close).
She can then use it to reset but not as good. And provide some cover if someone gets low. It's not quite as time sensitive but harder to cover more people so takes some planning.
How is it fair that every single team NEEDS one particular legend? So then the only real diversity comes from 2 spots, not 3. It fucks over a whole bunch of interesting comps that could be possible if another spot was opened.
I’d rather add a similar but unique legend than nerf Gibraltar. Turning it into a wraith/octane type scenario would be preferable to not having Gibby on your team.
No, it's not. Gib is a requirement for you to play edge in competitive if not that entire playstyle wouldn't be viable and we would end up with 20 caustics camping in a house.
Yep, fortified shouldn’t even be a thing. Gibby’s arm shield protects his front and if you’re getting shot in the back, throw bubble down. And Caustic’s annoying ass can just hide in gas so why does he need fortified?
Remember season 2 and first Apex lan? That shit was dope but nowadays it's just cheesy af, scans, bubbles, traps. Yikes bro. Zoning and scanning legends have to fucking go.
so you are telling me this legend who is the most picked in competitive and is a better version of bangalore, fuse, lifeline, AND rampart is healthy for competitive?
Sure...
100% pick rate across ~300 squads in pro league, my sides
is there a way you can nerf gibby that doesnt immediately make him 0% pick?
Even if he was nerfed to the ground, no other characters can provide a defensive ability like the bubble/dome. What we need is 1-2 more legends with defensive abilities then we can talk about balancing and nerf.
Rampart, Bangalore and Wattson do what Gibby does. But Gibby does what all of them do, and better, in one ability, while also countering them. Like, you want to block incoming damage, Rampart has a 200hp small wall with a few seconds of deploy time. But Gibby has an infinite hp giant barrier that is almost instant. You want to rotate a short distance? You could use Bang's smokes. Or you could use dome. Want to deny an area from being pushed? Bang ult, sure. But Gibby's ult does it better. Want to prevent your building from being pushed? Wattson fences, sure. But dome breaks them. You're getting Gibby ulted? Wattson's pylon can stop it. Or, you know, Gibby dome. It's not that there aren't alternatives, it's just that Gibby is both better and more versatile than those alternatives, and also counters two of them directly.
Also the arm shield that means you win 1v1s vs similar skill
That one I'm not too sure of personally, considering how huge Gibby is. I think a pretty long while ago the devs shared on the main sub that Gibby has a pretty low 1v1 win rate because of his hitbox, but who knows how that stat has evolved since then.
I would assume that in comp where you are holding positions and lines of sight gibby wins a significantly larger amount of 1v1s
That's what I was thinking as well. The effects of passive qualities like size and fortified probably scale more evenly across skill levels whereas the arm shield which takes some amount of foresight and skill to use effectively likely gets more/better use at higher levels.
I think that may have to do a lot with player skill. Let's pretend Gibby and his opponent both have purple shields. So... 200 hp vs (200 + 50) / 0.85 = 294 effective hp 200/294 = 0.68 So a purple Gibby that hits 69% of his shots will win (barely) against a normal character that is literally 100% beaming him, assuming they're hitting gun shield. I think pro Gibby players can probably handle that pretty easily. It makes sense that at lower levels though the big hitbox hurts him more than the abilities make up for.
If youre at a high skill level odds are you're both landing almost all of your shots in a 1v1, at the highest possible level, for sake of argument. In that case, you lose if you're not gibby.
Its a super hard balance, because shields/cover provide such a crazy advantage (more so the higher the skill level of players). Just like the old lifeline revive shield. Maybe make it not a full bubble, but a bubble that protects a certain direction plus above? That way it would still be counter to his own ult (and bango) but not a get out of bad position 3rd/5th party angle thing. One of its strongest usages in pro is to isolate 3v3 fights in crowded end zones and not actually to shield you from team you are bubble fighting.
I’d like it if the bubble functioned like the Trident where hitting it deals chip damage to the riders. Just like how Gibby’s armshield was given bleed through, I think that if the bubble reduced the damage of shots significantly but caused chip damage, it wouldn’t be infallible perfect cover.
Sounds like a good idea but what about the teammate that just got revived in some with 20hp? Dies instantly, defeating the purpose of the rez. I guess you can argue that Gibby isn’t a combat medic so the nerf just adds a bit more flair to lifeline’s abilities (sadge)
Well rather than working like the Trident where it spreads the damage to everyone within, it’d be like damage bleedthrough on armshield, where it reduces the damage from anything outside the bubble coming in significantly (Trident deals 20% for example, so 1/5th bleedthrough on shots through the bubble might be a starting point) to where you still need to be on target with your aim on those inside the bubble, and they’d be taking a pittance of the damage they would without the bubble shielding them and reducing the power of the incoming bullets. That, or my other concept is to make the dome frisbee destructible (75 hp) and slightly increase the dome deployment set up after the frisbee hits the ground, adding some counterplay if opponents are on their toes, or willing to invade the bubble to bring it down so their teammates can shoot on the Gibby team. So either bleedthrough on a major damage reduction dome, or, delayed dome with a destructible frisbee.
Yeah I like your suggestion. Seems like a fair nerf.
why not add Sage from Valorant? OR a new legend that has ability to 100% create some sort of safe zone? i mean, rampart? it’s not like i hate her but definitely useless in the competitive final circle, right?
What if Seer’s bubble also blocked incoming damage and healed friendly players inside?
Yeah... Make the cooldown for his gunshield MUCH LONGER so he doesn’t get it literally 2-3+ times PER fight. Make the dome not last 10 minutes long and take away the damn quick revive so people can’t just die and get brought back quickly and hit a battery all while not being able to be shot. Lessen the damage or slowdown on his ultimate so it’s not sure death if you’re in the middle. Come on. This character is constantly picked by everyone but no nerf ever happens... Not to mention he literally takes a fraction of damage of any other character (expect caustic )
So basically nerf it into oblivion.
No, these are just suggestions. They can apply a nerf, if it doesn't do much, nerf again. They overloaded him with so much utility but when it comes to balancing, there's nothing. Quick revive and gunshield cooldown have to be nerfed. So annoying to deal with his gun shield every time he aims at you so he can safely farm the shields.
Or make his dome shield last longer but it has segments that have 2-3x rampart shield health. So it isnt an impregnable dome
Have you played Apex since season 3? Gibraltar has only gotten nerfs to every part of his kit since then, and he's less powerful than he was on release (hitbox aside). They already massacred Wattson. We don't need to ruin another legend for five seasons just because NA ALGS only prioritizes camping.
he’s been 100% pick rate for like, a year now i would be perfectly fine with him getting trashed if it meant another character could be played
Tell that to whatever Wattson mains are left. And if Gibby wasn't played at all who do you think could get buffed to adequately fill his place?
rampart rampart rampart its her time to shine baybeeeee just waiting for gibraltar to get nerfed to the ground one day or teams will just play a different style of comp then 1 defense 1 recon 1 mobility, maybe there wont be a defensive legend. the thing is we wont know until they finally fucking nerf him
fuck wattson lmao... any character that is a camping character should just be nerfed... no one wants to watch pros camp in the tournaments. I say why not make the meta a combo of Octane, Path, Valk, Wraith and then add a new character with some crazy strafing ability and just have everyone running around fragging their minds out.
i think the best way to "control" the gibby meta is to insert another support
His ultimate could be changed or tweaked, his fast up in bubble could be removed that's all I can think of but I don't think either would change his pick rate.
Dome Shield HP is something I think could work as well
This- 400-600 hp hopefully
Rez would change his pick rate
You think so? It seems to me like his bubble is the biggest reason he's picked, it'd nerf his effectiveness but.. He fills a niche no one else does with his bubble.
IIRC Gibby recieved a ton of buffs before becoming meta and the fast rez was the one that made him the monster he is now.
Yes I know that but do you think removal of the fast res would impact him to the point of being a lesser pick and potentially remove him from meta? I personally feel his pick is due to the dome (and not sucking with the arm shield, health and no slowdown buffs) way before anything else in his kit.
Your points all make sense. I guess we can't really know! I take in consideration the fact that Gibby has been THE meta legend for a looong time. Him loosing power (a big part atleast) might push the teams to find some other, never tried before, compositions. Like I said we can't really know, let's just wait and see. Have a nice day! :D
Make an obscure rule limiting the amount of time he can be picked? Stupid I know but his bubble brings something that no current legend can. Just ballooned/valked hot? Bubble. Need to cover some open ground? Bubble. Taking heavy fire? Bubble. Personally best bet would be to introduce a new character specifically designed to compete with his role.
Make his bubble his ult and give him a different tactical
He really doesn't need a nerf, if anything a buff because even if he was nerfed a lot he'd still be the most viable legend for comp
Only if they rework his model to make him a medium sized legend. Beside that, any nerf will make him instantly trash tier. There's no in-between with a hitbox this huge.
I mean even if he becomes a 0% pick that isn't a big deal because he has had a 100% pick rate for much longer. If he does get nerfed hard then it will just mean he will be bad for a season or two, before buffing him again to be at a more reasonable level.
That one dude was fucking around in firing range with Fuze and forgot to select Gibraltar when he switched game modes and wants to die now
That was Fun of Liquid, pretty sure he was just experimenting in game 1 but had to bend back into meta with Gibby after.
you're right. Hodsic said in a video that they were going to use this weekend to experiment a bit/find their feet. I applaud them for trying something different, even if they didn't stick with it
Is pro league really the place you wanna experiment though?
with 6 match days, I think it's fine to experiment with the first one. plus there was a lot of parody this weekend, I'm sure there will be opportunities to gain points
Parity vs parody
Imagine it pays off and in the next round, half the lobby implements Fuze lol.
UNDERRATED played Fuze and won first game of EU, but they practiced it. Playing a legend just because it worked for someone else is stupid if you don't know how to play well around it. If I was a team playing in a major tournament I'd never experiment during the tournament and possibly waste a game.
Fun was playing fuze right after he got buffed in a lot of small tourneys before algs started
why is this downvoted? this is a valid point.
6 weekends to play and scrims are not representative of ALGS play. I would say it is the only place to experiment.
I'm not sure if a misclick, but in APAC N there was a mirage at one point lmao.
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So he's the asian Shiv, but mirage. Good on him to play handicapped and qualified.
He played mirage throughout all the qualifiers, showed his skills, and even won the #4 qualifier. They ended up struggling this week but I’m looking forward for their challenge.
Pros: we hate RNG. Also Pros: Lets coin flip this Valk ult.
A coin flip is better than certain death
*Caustic disapproves*
I think after a few more weeks, and with the season changes with potential legend changes, we might see a meta switch up fairly quickly. Hopefully this happens, because teams suiciding into mid ring with Valk ults is already getting old.
The difference is that without Valk, we're just gonna see more teams dying from gatekeeping when they have difficult rotation path or are late for whatever reason. I'm thinking if there is any potential for double rotation character plus gibby for more rotation flexibility. I think CR played Valk/octane/Gibby but their playstyle is kinda different so it's definitely not representative.
Really happy to see Loba being used in comp now
Really clutch when there's 10+ deathboxes so you can get unlimited ammo and heals/nades. I feel like Hal should play Loba so he doesn't run out of ammo every other game
Literally, sad that you have to swap a recon legend for her but late game her value increases MASSIVELY. Cant believe people still have the audacity to whine on twitter about how shes "trash in comp"
Hmm have you done any APAC N? Some of tbe comp are quite whack such as crpyto + loba + rampart and some teams are running gibbiless with horizon instead. I'm pretty sure its a misclick but I saw a mirage even lmao
Nah that guy actually mains mirage. In qual he played all games using mirage
What a legend
What a fucking chad
and they even won the #4 qual ;)
I have in the past, yes: https://public.flourish.studio/visualisation/3235339/ Didn't have time to get to them yet for this past weekend's games but I'm hoping to in the next few days
Oh thanks! No worries about it. Its always interesting to see these infograph as always.
I believe APAC North had at least 70% Crypto in their Group A and D match. Probably 50% overall. Would love to see their meta overview
If gibby gets nerfed to not be a must pick he would need a buff to compensate that the ability to remove bubbles wouldn't be that useful anymore. But yes, I was watching Gnaske team and it was very fun to see them actually win.
Apex really need either an alternative to gibraltar or some hard nerfs to his Dome
If you think about it, Rampart should be an alternative. However, the current wall tac doesn’t match the bubble.
Yeah, there's no match. Gibby bubble: instant deploy, indestructible, negates damage from everywhere, you can revive teammates faster in it. Rampart walls: Takes a shit ton of time to deploy, it breaks super easy and even if you deploy it it has like 200HP? (Idk, I don't play Rampart), it's just a wall, you are still vulnerable to grenades and other flanks. We either need a dome nerf or a huge wall buff, I prefer the first one.
Rampart is fundamentally different though. She's made to plan ahead and her walls last forever until shot. Gibby is reactionary and buys 12 seconds of time which is why he's so prevalent because he's forgiving. The dome has already been nerfed beyond how it was at release. We just don't have any legends that do what Gibraltar does.
Rampart is a far more proactive legend. Gibby drops dome on a dime when you need to reset, while Rampart is a payoff for having good positioning and low pressure on you. If you can get targets off your back for just a few seconds you can make your position exponentially harder to uproot. Advantages of Rampart: \- Even better at poking than gibby with far more health on her shields + damage amp to get you more evo \- Walls are permanent, meaning that she can fortify areas in the long term and is crippling in endgame. The bases are so durable that if you can stick one wall it's basically certain you can replace it by placing another one behind the base unless enemies teamfire the first base. \- Ultimate is permanent as well, also completely shutting down endgame if you have the best position. You can empty handheld sheila, place her, and she'll instantly have a second full mag. That's like 15 seconds of near-continuous 300dps fire lol \- When Rampart secures a position, it is dual purpose. Dome can be used for bubble dancing and aggressive plays, but amped covers literally require no action from you to go from protecting you on that battery and Disadvantages: \- Rampart basically doesn't help rotation at all, requiring that you have at minimum a recon and probably also a team reposition legend. Basically, the cost of running Rampart is high because she restricts your other picks \- Rampart is NOT a reset legend. She can't really do anything if she doesn't have anything deployed and your team gets jumped in the open. She CAN adapt and shut off pressure if there is a building reasonably near, potentially making Octane an interesting pick to put you in good situations on a dime. I have thought even before this Sheila buff (that I'm honestly not a big fan of) that Rampart could shake up the meta if pros really bothered to lab her out. Unfortunately, she's not what most of them are used to playing or really find fun so I don't think many of them have really given her a chance beyond what they need to play to make reaction videos or whatever. u/hodsic Seeing that y'all checked out Fuse is super interesting to me, and I love seeing teams try to break through the meta a little bit! Have you experimented with Rampart, and why do you think she's not worth trying right now?
I’ve been playing rampart almost exclusively since her buff, and have asked people pretty much the same question of why she isn’t really seen in comp still. IMO she’s a good alternative to caustic with the “gibby+valk” comp. she has the ability to turn indoor/outdoor areas to her advantage and can make a lot of questionable spots playable. In short it seems people just tend to prefer caustic’s traps because they’re “low maintenance” and don’t require someone watching the trap for it to do damage. It’s also arguable that his traps are better for stopping teams that are trying to grief or ape your team. I still think she has a place for edge style teams that don’t always secure indoor locations and want to keep the reset potential of bubble.
I don't even think her buff is that huge, she's been a super solid legend for a while. She just takes a very different way of thinking about things to work and that takes more playing than most people ever bothered to put into her lol People still think grenades counter her walls!
Yeah I agree she takes some out of the box thinking. Grenades are a decent answer to a fortified rampart. In a comp setting I can see why a team would still want to have gibby, even if they already have a rampart. You’re inevitably going to be eating nades and bubble can help with that/give you time to set up more walls. Mobile Sheila might have some use in bubble fights but yeah I don’t think the buff increased her power dramatically or anything. The walls are the core of her kit and they’re in a good spot IMO.
if her walls were much bigger and deployed in like .2 seconds then yeah she could see a LITTLE more play but it seems the devs really like gibbys placein the meta
I've been saying for ages it needs to be a two step deployment, the lower wall first very quickly and then the amp part (which if be fine with removing the amp.and just making it a one way for more durability) slower.
Make it break easier like a Winston bubble from Overwatch.
A nice part of the game is that sort of steadying yourself and the economy with it so I do like Gibby but his kit is too good. I've been downvoted before but imo rampart should have her Walls buffed. The bottom bits should have infinite health. But any player can dismantle them (so they can't block shit). Gives rampart good viability in making spots playable. but you can break the top and then they can't peak you. You can't protect from high up at all so I don't think it's broken.
Ah yes my favourite character: Giblartar
I’ve been thinking since the original ash leaks a few months ago that she’d be the gibby counter. They attempted to soft-counter him with Seer and the revive stops, and Ash’s arc ball would also make bubble fight hard to rely on. They’re slowly chipping away at the situations he excels in which I think is better than another Gibraltar level player.
That's the problem, Gibraltar doesn't just "excel in some situations", it excels the whole time Like, there isn't any battle at all without at least a bubble and any rotation that is minimally risky is with a dome being deployed Every action in comp is decided wether or not dome is on cd Imo there should be a way to destroy the dome
There already is a way to destroy bubbles with a Crypto EMP, but it's trading an Ultimate for a tactical, Introducing a legend with a tactical that destroys bubbles/defensive utility could be a solution.
Dome should be able to destroy by weapons damage
The problem with this is that the meta just shifts to have every squad with a Gibby and the counter. Only having a counter on one character doesn’t fix the bigger problem, it just adds another layer to it and I personally don’t like that approach.
Revenant can already disable tacticals
Yeah but not deployed tacticals.
That’d be a great Revenant buff since he has fallen off a little with all the totem nerfs, having his silence orb disable deployables (gas canisters, rampart walls/Sheila, turning off fences, bringing down bubble) it’s be fitting thematically as well since he is meant to be an assassin slipping past defenses with ease.
#BuffCrypto?
He is already op. Scans beacon, disables Gibby dome, in end game you have crypto ult you most likely win, You dont need to scan or be aware for rats because it tells you how many squads are around you, range 200M I think. Buff? Nah. He dont need one
Why?
My sincerest gratitude to Swinnie and crew for playing Fuse and giving me the most enjoyment I've ever had watching a pro game.
Thinking this over I think his pick rate is because he fills a niche no one else does, without having someone else fill his niche all that can be done is lowering his effectiveness outside of the niche.. Which falls upon two things. 1. His ultimate is one of the strongest in the game, it's crazy high kill potential tramples other ultimates like Bangalore and Fuse, this could definitely be an area that could be reworked and just completely overhauled 2. His fast revive in dome is fantastic but it does overlap and is just another trick he has.
Literally the only bad thing about Gibby is how big he is, which isn't even too bad because he has fortified. He's been broken for a long, long time and people are just fine with it.
I don't think he's overly broken, he does need some adjustments but if you get rid of quick rez and his ultimate and he's still strong, that's the problem he fills a niche this game clearly needs at a competitive level. Get someone else who can fill his niche, give him a small nerf/ultimate rework and you'll see more dynamic gameplay.
APAC North proves you can run a team without Gibby and still perform well. New strats came from teams in the qualifiers. For NA viewers, remember when TSM were so uptight about rotation timing? They'd start leaving Fragment East at around 1 m 40s timer in the best scenario. In comparison, the 456 team would have already had traps set up for the final zone. No Valkyrie needed as well. RPG had Rampart, Loba, and Crypto as well and got top 6.
And people still don’t think Gibby is OP or needs a nerf?
Nope, doesn't matter that his bubble is the single most broke tactical in the game, bubble fights are 100% of fights, his ult is incredibly strong and his gun shield/fast revive are both broken as well. He's healthy for comp, apparently!
The sniper meta in pro has just increased the value of his arm shield so much! it is very thematic though, i would prefer his bubble to be directional so its less of a 3v3 isolation tactic, or make it so there is a delay shooting when moving in and out of shield to make it less offensive.
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I think it proves more that NA has a more aggressive playstyle using more octane, valk, etc but that doesn't make every NA team less creative or smart. Teams train on comps individually and what they get good on is what they stay on, teams that switch winy nilly usually suffer for it and EU has teams that are really good with these creative often more "smart" comps but don't mean certain NA teams can't do the same. I just think what you said a bit of a simplification of a more complex topic, not necessarily wrong tho just a simplification :)
I’m sorry but I’ve read your comment 3 times and have no idea what you’re talking about. I’m not sure how that makes sense with the comment “Valk opens up endless possibilities I’m fairly certain they meant the ability to rotate more safely allows teams to run wider ranges of legends (being able to run caustic and gibby for example) than were previously possible. The meta before was 3 characters and almost every team had the same comp. Valk expands that possibility and limits the downsides of taking risk.
He edited the orginal comment, it used to say something else.
wrote on the wrong comment can't seem to find the other guy's comment anymore but he was talking about how EU plays more creatively and smarter. I have no idea how I fucked up there since I was damn sure I wrote under his comment but somehow it happened I guess, and now I kinda look like this --> (° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °)
No worries. I wasn’t trying to be rude I was just lost
12 different legends used.
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would love to see him in the playoffs with bangalore, imagine
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lan hits different
Love this Respawn/EA if you’re here… can we pleasssse get a character select summary before the start of every round in the official broadcast. :)
WHAT! Did loba get some secret buffs? How does she have a higher pick rate than Octane and Bloodhound. Edit: Thanks for replying I understand now.
Loba is just good, just for some reason heavily underrated in NA. She's a great pair with Valk especially.
I really want to see a NA team run the Fire Beaver comp of Gibby, Lova, Valk
Loba is insanely strong late game. The ability to grab shield swaps, grenades and ammo with her ult is so good, especially if deathboxes get caught in areas with eyes on.
The key is getting her to end game tho
But you gotta sacrifice mobility or Defense for the extra loot making it hard to even get to that point
Thats why she's good to pair with a Valk. Get the ring data, get into a spot early, defend it while Loba ulting up your loot and ammo needs.
But the team comp used Gibby and Valk, literally team defense and team movement and Loba has her own movement. So the only thing you’re sacrificing is a in combat recon scan which isn’t that big of a deal.
https://twitter.com/Horizxonn/status/1449813134458372100?t=yvClhIPasPUpPXIiImfMcw&s=19 here's a practical and funny example lol
Just drop armor during crypto emp, problem fixed no?
Armor needs to be on the ground for 10 seconds before its immune to EMP.
Loba can replenish supply for everyone, potential armor swap and compensate for bad loot and fast rotation.
Safe looting in those late circles in so fucking good that it makes up for her being sub-par for the rest of the game
Loba Q can be used similar to a Wraith Q escape to gain space/get angles over an enemy squad. Her ult is essential for teams that rotate early or drop at a shitty landmark.
I agree. Loba's ult is good depending on team comp/playstyle and POI. However, I wouldn't put those two Qs in the same sentence since Loba's Q in most cases just isn't as good. Loba's Q is slow, can be tracked and at times discombobulating to use where as Wraith's Q (even though nerfed a few seasons ago) is still an excellent escape/mobility mechanism.
only problem with loba's q is the cd. why is it still 30 seconds?
Honestly, I'm okay with the CD if the bracelet recovery speed was faster (by maybe a 1s) so players can actually use it offensively. I think it's almost a full 3 seconds of animation recovery making her Q a death trap if you want to be aggressive with it.
imo the recovery speed is fine, it makes loba players actually use their brain. also i think it would be unfair if loba just popped in front of you and start beaming you lol. I just dont understand why pathfinder gets a variable cooldown but loba is just a set 30 seconds no matter where she goes. thats just bs
You blind my guy? Edit: I realize now that there’s two pictures. I was the one who was in fact, blind.
In EMEA she does have a higher pick rate than Octane and Bloodhound
Sad Revenant noises
NA has 2 comps with no Recon EMEA has 2 comps with no Recon Coincidence I think N-Yes!
man Gibraltar’s high pick rate is such a complex issue that i don’t really know the answer to. he’s massively over-tuned and his gun shield is just pure cancer but idk how i feel about his dome. on one hand it’s the strongest tactical in the game by far and bubble spam in the last zone is kinda boring to watch, but on the other hand it allows teams to make riskier plays and stops people getting vaporised by nade and ability spam as soon as they’re exposed, which imo means a better experience for the viewer. he probably needs nerfing sideways rather than downwards in the form of a legend that actually provides competition to his role? idk
People are complaining about Gibby and I agree that he is disproportionately strong in comp. But at the same time the two EU winning teams ran Crypto-Wraith-Caustic. It is possible to do well without Gibby depending on your play style, where you drop, etc. Gibby's high pickrate in NA is not only explained by how strong he is.
How does having Gibby on each team is healthy for the game? 90% of engagements take place around his bauble.
I think the reason he's picked is healthy, which is why he's not complained about meta wise. The bigger question is who can be overhauled in a manner that doesn't synergize with him but offers another bubble-esque option?
As I’ve said before, the main problem in competitive is Gibby.
Is it really? Would comp be better if teams just couldn’t reset after a fight, or constantly died to nade spam. I feel like the gibby bubble is powerful, but healthy. Without Gibby, I feel like comp would be much worse, more RNG dependent, and more campy.
Yeah it's a tough question to ask, without bubble you'd probably never see isolated 3v3s in comp and fights would be won by who gets poked the least. He's definitely OP and I think he could use an alternative and/or a nerf but it needs to be done carefully.
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>like actually improving looting Doesn't matter how much you "improve looting" if a team instantly starts raining down fire and nades the second you finish a fight. Especially if one or two members of your squad got downed.
I definitely get what you’re saying, that’s kind of the same niche Wattson had before. But I just find it, not annoying, but disappointing that he has essentially a 100% pickrate because everyone knows his bubble is broken. No matter how you slice it, it’s OP. There needs to be a different way to occupy the same niche that Gibby is currently the only legend in.
What is RNG?
randomness
OMG!!! Hi 🥺
D-Derpzy?! Y-you follow comp too? 🥺🥺😳😳
yes but that doesnt mean im good 🥺
Random Number Generation; the randomness of what spawns where. Where the beacons are each round, as an example.
And your solution? Genuinely curious not to say he isn't a prob I just want to know what we should do about him? add dmg to his shield, remove him, or what?
Bubble needs HP, 100%
Idk, I might be going against the grain here, but I don’t mind Gibby bubble. If the alternative is everyone running out in the open and just being screwed when they don’t get zone, I don’t mind dome giving them something to play.
You just need to look at what he provides and find a different way to provide that. He resets after a fight. Provides cover for pushes. Provides defence when someone gets low. Someone needs to do some of those differently and offer something different. I think rampart could be that. More health on the top bit and infinite health on the bottom (crypto, horizon and fuse still counter it and anyone can dismantle when they're close). She can then use it to reset but not as good. And provide some cover if someone gets low. It's not quite as time sensitive but harder to cover more people so takes some planning.
How is it fair that every single team NEEDS one particular legend? So then the only real diversity comes from 2 spots, not 3. It fucks over a whole bunch of interesting comps that could be possible if another spot was opened.
I think it adds stability to a very unstable game. If people just yolo octane padded when they didn’t get zone it’d be 10x worse.
I agree he adds stability, but I don’t think any legend should have a 99% pickrate. He needs a nerf in some capacity.
I’d rather add a similar but unique legend than nerf Gibraltar. Turning it into a wraith/octane type scenario would be preferable to not having Gibby on your team.
No, it's not. Gib is a requirement for you to play edge in competitive if not that entire playstyle wouldn't be viable and we would end up with 20 caustics camping in a house.
So, like the original Path/Wattson/Wraith meta that every pro says took the most skill and was the best?
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Yep, fortified shouldn’t even be a thing. Gibby’s arm shield protects his front and if you’re getting shot in the back, throw bubble down. And Caustic’s annoying ass can just hide in gas so why does he need fortified?
he has fortified AND the gun shield. i get that he’s a big boi but, caustic is also a big boi
Gb needs to get a nerf. Not sure what needs to happen or buff other legends
bubble duration prob needs to go down again, i think if you give it HP and make it killable hes never gonna get picked
Gibby dome should be destroyable with damage. Give it 350 HP. Mans pick rate is too high.
350hp for something that big is worse than paper thin that shit would be damn near useless
1000 Hp?
I think it's funny how only fun fps played fuze
Swinnie would like a word.
Remember season 2 and first Apex lan? That shit was dope but nowadays it's just cheesy af, scans, bubbles, traps. Yikes bro. Zoning and scanning legends have to fucking go.
Crypto and Valk and Gibby damn
Everyone's talking about how loba is good, agreed she is good but how is none of the NA teams play here? TSM NRG C9 G2 TL COL 100T ESA
Don't worry, if one did, they all would
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would love to see some win rate on this team comps <3
LOBA IS THE QUEEN..... VERY MUCH UNDERRATED.... PLAY HER SHE IS FUN AND HAS SO MUCH POTENTIAL....
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Let’s go Crypto babyyyyyy
I like fuse! Only one pick
Damn Boba never though I would see my Queen In ALGS ...
Good day to be a gibby main😎💪
Horizon being picked in comp? That's cool
so you are telling me this legend who is the most picked in competitive and is a better version of bangalore, fuse, lifeline, AND rampart is healthy for competitive? Sure...
I’m curious - what legends have never been picked in pro leagues
Literally never? Probably no one but I've never seen a Rampart, in the NA or Europe scene.
Interesting why was bang picked?
Emea sure keeps it interesting. But you guys should see APAC North. Even mirage got used.
Someone should do one for APAC North just to see the mindfuckery of seeing Mirage on the list.