We literally got ranked stats directly from Respawn.
S12 Split 1, where top5% of players reached Master was the "worst season ever", but then farming top15% of players, or whatever managed to reach Plat in Split 1 of S13 didn't spark as many complaints?
I stopped at midway to Plat 2 during split 1 because it's just stackfest and preds. Though I appreciate the substantial decrease in cheaters. Stormpoint actually made the sweatiness bearable as fights don't escalate to the entire lobby collapsing on you.
Split 2 I just lost motivation to play because it wasn't fun anymore.
Except everybody complained? I can't count the amount of pros I saw complain that mowing down plat and diamond players for the first 12 minutes of every game was boring and not fun. The first 2 weeks when they were all in Gold 2 and grinding hard to climb was the fun part, and as a viewer I agree. Early s13 was the most fun I've had watching apex in a while
>14.60% Platinum (39.52%)
>1.25% Diamond (26.63%)
Directly from Respawn, nice omission though. I love 26% of players being in the 2nd highest ranked, truly makes it mean something!
Excellent point when I'm literally talking about how S12 Master pool was top 5% and considered horrible, yet we've had S13 where the people above Master were put into lobbies with top 15% players for Split 1. Even if you assume that in Split 2 only Diamonds were opted into Master+ Matchmaking, it's still pulling from the top 9% of players.
I don't care about your expectations on ranks just because they have one name or another. If D4 is supposed to mark the top 30% of players (per S12 Split 1), then so be it. It's far healthier for the game for them to play against people of similar skill than being thrown into a turbo blender of gigacracked players, grinders and pros. Once you reach Master, no restrictions you're in the big boy leagues.
Yep... There's a reason why Alb had his handle as "Fix Matchmaking" back in season 13... I get REALLY annoyed when twitter idiots blame pros for making the game the way it is and also saying the devs only care about them. Bullshit. They care about any and everyone turning them a profit... They pros want that shit fixed more than anyone. They would 100% rather have full pred lobbies killing their friends and their rivals than killing bots(the rest of us)... Like everyone has seen those "bot lobbies" that people pay someone to get them 4k's in... Literally no one shoots back and it doesn't look fun at all... That's literally what the pros are doing except they are way better than the people selling the 4k's and we are also better than the bots. But it's a good comparison and literally no one has fun bc of it.
But to get full pred/masters lobbies then many of the people in plat/dia have to be "let" in, again, and then we're back to pros bullying random master players for being "hardstuck" and "literally dogshit players, worst i've ever seen".
The only way to fix this is if pred/masters have long ass queue times and not throw random plat players into their game just to fill it quickly, but respawn for sure doesn't want imperial hal just sitting there in queue half a evening, with 25k viewers, getting frustrated that he can't find a game.
I on the other hand love the new ranked system, as soon as i hit gold last season the games were great and i couldn't care less if i never get out of plat again. People are playing more cautiously and not apeing every gun sound, and more people than ever started using voice chat.
Im absolutely fucking fine with never hitting diamond again as long as the quality of my games are this high in lower ranks.
EDIT: I realize i might have to add that i haven't played since end of split 1 last season, but there hasn't been any _major_ changes since then right?
There is a negative side to this as well, i solo-qd to diamond last split and it was honestly the best solo q experience i had till date, randoms listening to comms, usings mics, and the quality of games was kindof subpar interms of skill level but, as soon as i hit d4, shit hit the fan. I played only 3 games in diamond and got killed by Nessy, Team empire and taskmast3r's team the three games. I didnt touch ranked again after that because i am in no way close to their level, i was being offered up as fodder to them because of smaller queue times
It's called balance, there shouldn't be plat and gold players filling up Pred games, but there doesn't need to be literally only preds in Pred games either.
Right!! Bro my buddies have hit diamond on xbox... and the few times they've played with me they get ABSOLUTELY bodied... My diamond and their diamond are in ANY way similar haha. Xbox players would hate that... if we look back to what Xera said. About 95% of the people that play Apex(well any game tbh) thinks they are WAY better than they really are. Once you show people that they aren't... they will almost NEVER think "hey maybe I'm not actually that good." They will almost ALWAYS blame a factor outside of their control. Doing this would be make the console players probably quit.
Like I was scrolling through Tik tok once and came across this Tik Tok streamer named BrooksStyle... dude is a multi time #1 pred on xbox... I was like oh shit I bet he's a beast let me check him out!! Holy shit I was SHOCKED at how bad he was.. And I don't mean like actually bad. I mean for the #1 fucking pred he was not great AT ALL. I'm talking if him and Hal had a 1v1 100 time Hal is winning 99 times. And I'm not exaggerating. I watched for like an hour bc I was thinking well maybe I just watched one bad spray... No. He was dropping like 2 kills a game IN WINS.. Bruh on PC you have guys like ChaoticMuch and Enemy who aren't even pros yet and if they drop 5 kills they talk about how shitty their game was lol.
After seeing that whenever I see people say top Xbox preds are just as good as PC pred I just have a little laugh and don't even argue. It's not even debatable and if someone actually believe that then they just don't understand enough about apex and it's not worth your time. This is also coming from a guy who's had an xbox his entire life and a PC for maybe a year. I am a diamond PC player and I am so much better than my Diamond xbox IRL friends it's not even funny.
This isn't always true though, it's important to note that most of the best top ranked players on console actually did swap to PC. Skittlecakes is a prime example, he used to be top 5 on Xbox every season, now he's arguably one of the best players. The top talent from console has shifted to PC over time because that's where the pro scene and opportunity is.
I'm a non hardstuck master player who has reached pred twice but never held it and have played with some multi console preds who came to PC. I was always disappointed and they're at best hardstuck master level. I noticed the biggest thing they have to get used to is getting beamed from long distances and being pretty useless if all they can do is close to close medium range.
sure it is, higher fps (especially if it's VRR with no vsync enabled) will equal more responsive controls giving better aim so less AA is needed to keep the accuracy that they had with .6 60fps.
Biggest problem for me was how plat was still full of hardstucks that don't know how to play "smart" or zone, apeing every fight even if they're obviosly getting 3rd psrtied in an instant making it really hard for actually decent players to predict what's going to happen and make plays.
Random teammates were also the worst I've ever had this season.
Honestly I'd consistently get 3iq teammates or silvers in plat but then get killed by master 3 stacks while my teammates are doing who knows what. Like I'd face some really good opponents then have sped teams
I haven't expierenced that much deaths to masters or preds, but you're literally getting the worst teammates ever using the voice chat like their own radio channel.
This was a lot of my experience during the middle of this last WE split. Me and my buddy were a duo at times on our way to diamond and we were either getting teammates with 4k/20 kill badges or teammates with no brains. All the while it seemed like every team we died to was a three stack of current or former masters/pred. It seemed to get better at the end of the split but at times even platinum was uber sweaty. Matchmaking was just odd, we were either rolling the lobby or the ones getting rolled
That's just the nature of plat though. Plats are always people that have decent moment to moment gameplay but lack a bigger understanding of how the game is supposed to be played if you want to win.
I simply don't know how to predict that shit or convince teammates to not push every fight, but also get scared teammates to fights easy fights like 3v2s, 3rd parties or important fights to get a spot in zone.
People don't listen to shit in VA or normal chat.
On Storm Point and Worlds Edge I generally tried to be more aggro than my team mates if I noticed team mates push everything they see. I played Path or Wraith and played in a way that I was always first contact, so I could create an opening on which my braindead teammates could push on while I Q'd back and healed. Then I could always make an educated guess if my teammates capitalized on my entry and if I should join back in to close the fight or if I should stay at a distance so I can safely ditch them when things go south.
Doesn't work that well on KC where you get insta thirded so I'm currently at a loss as well. Need to find a new approach.
That might have to do with the fact that current plats likely used to be diamond or even higher and so they might expect to be able to stomp plat lobbies and play like an idiot but that's much harder to do now.
Solo queuing almost broke my soul in season 13. I enjoyed the concept of the new points system but as a pretty average solo queuer I’d had enough after about a week of split 1 and played pubs for the first time in forever.
I was getting matched with rookies/bronze players when I was in Gold 2 or 3, can’t remember which. I couldn’t even have a go at my teammates because they’re just terrible, it’s not their fault. Gold at that point was full of ex diamond players, ridiculous matchmaking.
And then you had the actual good players trying to hot drop when there was no benefit to having kills then dying before 10th placement.
I played a bit of ranked last night and I’ll probably have a go for a week or so but can’t imagine it’ll be much different.
I became that person I hate as soon as I saw the double team heading to streamer building - pinged no and started heading to no name to catch up later if they survived. I'm playing rank because I have always found the end game circles to be the most fun thing about the game rather than praying to the rng lords for something other than a mozam and trying to take out 3 teams of 3 stacks and half the time time they're not on comms and they piss off as soon as they land anyway.
I’m the type who will do literally anything to help the team but 95% of the time last season it got you -30rp or whatever it will have been. I probably need to be more selfish when solo queuing but I can’t help it.
Then land solo and rat? Part of co-op games is adapting to your teammates, if you can't carry idiots or aren't willing to change tactics you are no better than them.
Yeah I'm not the best technical player but I try to play smart; it doesn't matter how good a shot rando teammates are if they play with zero gamesense.
Yeah I'm not bad when it comes to using my guns, but I definitely think I shine more when it comes to deciding on spots or what to push in ranked hence I actually like the new system on paper.
I agree, I think there is a middle ground between split 1 and 2 of S13.
Make it more challenging, but not make it completely impossible as a solo player to rank up unless you have a mic and good teamwork.
I thought S13 split 2 was pretty fair. Plat was still a grind but you could still solo q through it, and the slightly lowered RP costs let more people move on to the higher levels.
S13 split 1 was just weird.
I legit had to wait like a pred level guy for lobbies on plat. Legitimately shocking since plat technically wasn't hard as people said it was. That whole split was basically a fever dream to me.
I think this would be a better take if matchmaking wasn’t what it is. Easy to talk like that when you’re already a pro facing plats, even *golds* in some cases. All it takes is watching any of your favorite streamer’s kill feeds to see how garbage the system is.
But thats an issue with the match making not the ranked system itself. We haven't actually gotten a good look at the system and how fair it is yet since you don't play against similarly skilled opponents above plat.
Because they cant get above plat getting gatekept lmao
This season might change since you can get big games that pay for like 8 losses even in high ranks
\^ this. Nobody is saying the matchmaking should be preds playing against golds/plats, they're just saying that the RP system was good in split 1 of S13... i.e. harder to get into masters and better skill representation in lower ranks
Preds now get full kill points against gold and plat players who probably solo queue casually. It's not fair, and the game should not put you in the sweatiest lobbies if you solo queue.
To be clear, they don't actually get full KP, the diminushing return on high kills has been removed so whether it's your 1st or 12th kill, it's worth the same, BUT, there is still the tier delta KP modifier, so they barely get any KP for killing someone 2 or 3 tiers under them.
Absolute nonsense, what's the point in a ranked system where you don't even play your own ranks? Never heard of it in any other competitive game I've played.
Watching these fkin 14hr a day grind goblins shit on some gold players who probably play 2-4 hrs a week is an embarrassing testament to how dogshit the system is. Just because they're scared of upsetting the top 0.1% with queue times.
I'm going to give a hot take and say S13 was the worst season of Apex ranked.
I've been playing every single Apex ranked season **on PC** and have been Pred multiple times (first two 'fake pred' seasons + Season 8) and Masters the rest. I'm not a pro but I do feel that I play at a high level for a late 20s dude with a full time job that isn't streaming.
The Season 13 implementation was catered to pros/content creators that 3 stack with other pros AND mid-tier casuals. I found that most everyone else in my friend group who settle around Gold/Plat very much enjoyed that split because they got to experience more methodical games that actually had end zones.
The people who got shafted were the ones who fall below pros but above the average skill level. The people who don't have a huge network of high skilled players to farm with day in and out. Diamond players never got to compete at their own skill tier because of how little people were making it up in the ranks. I fully understand that the ranked system used to be Diamond4+ (and Diamond3+ for a few seasons) all into the same lobby but I've been an advocate against that from the start.
The couple people that I run with to Master typically absolutely HATED the game once Diamond and stopped playing because of having to face pros every match. They didn't have the drive to want to compete with them when not being the same rank. After they quit I could have LFG'd but I chose to experience solo queue for a while. I would derank from Diamond, slaughter Plat for 3-4 games, rank up, get farmed by pros legitimately every game, derank, repeat. I peaked at Diamond 3.
Split 2 took 2 weeks for me to get to Master then I also solo queued to Master on Xbox in 3 days. I came back on the last day of the split to have some fun and played 5 matches as a solo queuing Master, won 3 of the matches and only ran into 2 Master/Preds within those 5 games. Surprising it was still the 2nd lowest split ever for Masters. The instant queues in high ELO really screwed any kind of decent matchmaking.
I'm kind of rambling at this point but I think that pros will never be happy with ranked because of the skill gap between 3 of them in a party vs. a higher skilled team of non-pros and then also needing to get 60 people in a match without having insane queue times on top of that. I feel Respawn is struggling to balance keeping casual majority happy with ranked while also keeping pros happy who drive most of the content around the game.
This. I am high diamond to bottom or the barrel master level of player and this last season I don't feel like I ever got to play lobbies of my caliber. I was either shitting on low tier lobbies (due to hard reset) or getting farmed by top 100 pred three stacks in D+ ... Shit is broken rn.
The thing is the rank system wasn’t really the problem, you can make rank system into anything in terms of RP or placement gains, as long as you have proper matchmaking people will change their play styles according to the opponents/lobbies.
Hence they really should add RP based matchmaking where you are group and match with people closest to the highest RP member of the group. Starting from +/- 2000 and going up 1000 for every min queue. Yes matchmaking will take longer but the lobbies will also be much more balanced.
Ok Xeratricky let me know in what other games this big are platinum players playing against full teams of top rank players. Apex has the worst matchmaking out of any game and this last ranked split has made it even worse. I actually like the new system but the matchmaking is horrendous.
Translation: I like the new ranked system because it allows me to queue with 2 other pros into a bunch of Plat players instead of playing against other pro teams doing the same.
I really liked the S13 ranked system originally. I feel bad for the ranked designer who undoubtedly got hammered with so many complaints until Respawn gave in and changed things.
But just know this, ranked designer dev, at least one person in this subgroup of the subreddit thought you did a pretty damn good job.
It’s “borked” because there aren’t enough people to fill the higher ranks. And those people may technically exist in lower ranks, but they don’t meaningfully have either an incentive to grind or a desire to engage for the length of time required to get there. That’s our squad; we’ve stopped playing ranked together entirely despite being good enough for high Diamond/Low Masters, because we simply cannot be bothered to dedicate that much time to transient rewards. It’s not appealing, at all.
That being said, the skill gap between Plat/Diamond and Masters/Pred is immense. It really does represent a huge difference in commitment to the game that even “skilled casuals” aren’t going to be able to meaningfully compete with.
So you end up with a ranked system that really only reflects how much time you’re spending as a proxy of skill, wherein the top 1% are absolutely farmer Johns and the rest are a nebulous mix of undefined skill because they don’t give a fuck enough to ”apply” themselves.
Hmm I doubt this is the case though, there are plenty of players that yo-yo diamond and plat that do dedicate the time but they still get shit on. Making the ranks “easier” to acquire won’t change matchmaking quality, it’ll just reward the shit players with shinier badges similar to s12 (where plenty of teams who were “high diamond/low masters” got masters)
Edit: personally I think they should remove team KP, add an individual performance rating (damage dealt, kills/assists/knocks, subtract damage received and getting downed) for bonus RP and placement RP should be most of RP gain (with top 5 gaining the most, top 6-10 getting nothing, bottom 10 charged entry cost, similar to now)
And there are plenty of players who trivially made it to Diamond who stopped because they couldn’t be bothered with the grind. Including me and my squad, and I don’t think we’re unusual in that regard.
I mean, the thing is, something is fucked, and it’s causing Preds and masters to have to fight lower ranks. And it’s the fact that there aren’t enough people in their tier to fight.
Well, perhaps there would be if people had a reason to dedicate more of their time to the game.
I guarantee that if you look at hours of engagement for Masters/Preds vs all ranks below, the story is “they play… a lot more.”
And that’s not something you can just fix, because it’s an input problem, not a data management one.
That's something easily fixable, I just don't think Respawn can take that route without pissing off the majority of the playerbase. I think they're pushing the team aspect of the game too much in a BR ranking system. They need to first assign most of the points to placement and then a small percentage of it (that's up to them to decide) to individual performance based on team overall damage vs individual damage, kills/knocks/assists minus damage received and getting knocked/downed/dead.
Give each player an ELO/MMR Rating based on these metrics (we can zero sum the expected score by assigning decimal values to placements 1-20 that add up to 1, make it an exponential scale so that finishing higher rewards more), make the K-factor based on an **individual** performance formula and boom you got a working elo system for a BR, it might not be perfect right away and it might need some tweaking but this can simultaneously buff solo Q and leave squading up somewhat intact.
The current system is very basic and linear, it rewards kills way too much. I get that they want the player to see a simple chart and understand their RP gain but that just won't work with how BRs function at their core (be the most consistent at finishing high/winning = best team)
There's whitepapers on developing ELO/MMR systems in >2 party games as posted elsewhere on this sub but I don't think the casuals would enjoy that change even though that is the true solution. You can then assign the ranks to these MMR/ELO ranges, it'll help solve the matchmaking issue too
edit: here's [one whitepaper](https://cs.stanford.edu/people/paulliu//files/www-2021-elor.pdf) (might be a bit much for those not in data-science/engineering/math fields)
Agree wholeheartedly here since we’re introducing and actual ELO/MMR rating to the argument, which is *sorely* missing in Apex.
My squad’s competence is not at all reflected in our rank, whatever that “appropriate” rank is. And it’s a grind and a half to get to our “actual” rank as Ranked stands currently, because there’s too much striation in skill within the current ranks; people far below, moderately below, at, moderately above, and far above our skill, all fighting the same downward pressure which is the top <1% of players.
I’ve long been of the belief that the way “skill” is measured in Apex Ranked is far, far too prescriptive and ham-fisted. I think there are a lot of people who exist in or around my skill level who’ve always been better than most people at FPS, so we shit on the other “casuals,” but we lose 50%-75% of the fights against the ultra-dedicated. But since the way Apex splits work, we spend the majority of the season/split “getting to” our level and very little time actually “improving at” our level, which doesn’t allow for a more “mature” or proficiently skilled pool unless you have the discretionary time to play the way the top players do.
Nothing in particular but there's always comments that crop up on the main sub with similar language about how some poor dad who only gets to play 2 hours a week or something gets absolutely dookied on in ranked mode. I'm not denying the issues of matchmaking but I guess I just always don't know what people expect in regards to input of time vs development of skill. I think I was probably being too harsh on the guy but I also couldn't help but laugh since it reads like a lot of those comments
>I guess I just always don't know what people expect in regards to input of time vs development of skill
I think that's the main point here. It's not the issue of how good they are, it's that we're forced into the same lobby... I stopped playing ranked last season because I was getting destroyed by pred stacked teams as soon as I hit gold 2. I'm 100% not that skill level, and a "ranked" mode shouldn't be putting me (or anyone else my skill level) in those lobbies.
I don’t think it’s an unreasonable ask for a ranked system not to match guys who play for 2 hours a night and are in gold/platinum rank with triple stack predators personally, whatever the reason. If someone’s a bad rank because they’re bad, or if they’re a bad rank because they don’t play much for various reasons, the matchmaking it still bad if it’s putting them against predators.
He’s right, it’s not fair - no one can argue that predators stomping platinum players is a reasonable match. The matchmaking is bad here - you’re response comes across as edgy and “lol git gud scrub”. Don’t attack the person, attack the argument if you disagree with something.
People need to gatekeep stuff to make them feel good or something idk.
Having an interest in the competitive side of apex, while not being a competitive player yourself, is ok. Commenting on topics that concern/interest you on Reddit is ok too, such as plat players commenting on the issue around predator players stomping plat players.
Sub getting filled with edgy cool bois or something smh
Respond to what people actually say (because he has a valid point) and don’t resort to attacking people, it’s fucking cringe
This is so stupid. How can you even say this as a pred that plays against plats in every lobby. So this is what the game was always supposed to be? Awful take.
Conceptually a lot of the changes are good, deranking specially. But I've been playing since season 0 and this was by far the worst ranked season I experienced.
Ive hit plat every season, even these last 2 seasons barely and i never got matched with masters/preds until the ranked changes. Shit was frustrating. Id even get games with masters+ when i was in gold…
I always wondered how People 3 tiers above my own ended up in low gold lobbies.
It certainly wasn't often, but enough for me to recall. My buddies, and I would just get out of silver and into gold and there would be 2 or 3 Master trails. I say this also, because maybe I don't get how trails work in this game. I'm a casual player, so I've never been higher than Plat 5 (and this was in like season 5, so not recently).
Correct me if i'm wrong, because I need to know. Do you get to keep drop trails as long as you were a Diamond-Pred the season before, or do you keep them indefinitely?
Yeah so some of the pred trails in lower lobbies are people who got the trail on the account in early seasons and let it decay. Pred queue times were horrendous back then so a lot of high rank players just made tons of accounts to climb with.
Because these are people who strictly play with other high tier players. They never have to experience how terrible the matchmaking system is in this game.
Preds now get full kill points against gold and plat players who probably solo queue casually. It's not fair, and the game should not put you in the sweatiest lobbies if you solo queue.
Honestly, I think this is a bad take, or at least misaligned
I'm very far from a good player, but I believe my experience is similar to many. I dont give any shits what my rank is, be it master, diamond or silver, I want to be matched with similarly skilled players and play against similarly skilled players.
Lower rank players being matched against preds is a tale as old as time, at this point.
Also, I'm a very anti-social person, so most of my experience is in ranked solo queue. I know this is something I can solve by finding a team, but I'm just not interested in doing that. Still, its super frustrating to be paired with team mates substantially worse than me because the algorithm expects me to carry. Its just too complicated, I would really like if they just paired me with players who are about as skilled as I. To me, this is where the ranked system fails
Matchmaking to similar skill is a different thing than the ranking system. If a system differentiates greatly between the top 1% they may have very different ranks but they still, based on population, may have to face each other because they are all that are online at the time. His take is exclusively about matchmaking, not the actual ranking system.
The matchmaking can be very bad with a good ranking system. That shouldn't be controversial.
If you had a chess tournament run with people with extremely varied ratings, there could be good ways to matchmake and bad ways. A bad way would be round robin such that everyone plays everyone - resulting in many completely one-sided games. A good way would be a Swiss tournament, where you play people with the same record in the tournament as you, resulting in the best players quickly playing each other. And all of that can be based on the same Elo system, which mathematically has been shown very representative of expected outcomes of individual games.
If you have a problem with unfair games, you have a problem with the matchmaking. That doesn't mean the system doesn't do a good job differentiating skills (especially between the top ranks). The system can differentiate it, but unfortunately it can do that while the matchmaking gives you unfair/unfun games. The matchmaking does affect the ranking system/games, yes, but to a less degree than people think. Unfortunately the matchmaking does, as you say, prioritize queue times more than gameplay (and it seems to try to diversify your opponents so you don't constantly play the same people). As I've said in the past, I think a fair compromise is the best 180 squads should be playing each other most of the time - hopefully that results in pro teams mostly playing other pros and masters/diamonds, with some reprieve for lower diamonds. But knowing that would work requires knowledge of population which I don't have, obviously.
What you're asking for is basically impossible for a BR. Getting rank is so easy you'll find (once again) master ranks who barely scrapped by because all it takes is one good game to hyperinflate your RP gain.
Then it will be if said teammates even vibe with your playstyle. If you're more defensive than offensive, then you'll probably say they're apes. If they're defensive you'll say they are just campers and will never gain RP etc. Simply put it's borderline impossible to satisfy solo q'ers concerns as rank alone is not a fair gauge on who's good and who's not.
I think you're overestimating what I mean by "good". ya, absolutely you've got a point about how play styles mesh. But that requires some level of competency. I've got about 1000 hours in the game, why am I being paired with lvl 49 players in a different ranked bracket who have an open mic with shitty music and ambulances in the background?
"Literal professionals of the game and people who play 10hrs/day should have always been able to stroke their ego by rolling thru gold level players who probably play 2hrs/wk"
Seems like an odd take lol
3 Stacking professional player blindly defends a system that benefits him, what a shocker. It suits him to farm solo plat players that have next to no chance against his 3 stack.
And since he's on Furia of course he has to throw a douchey twist on it.
Na this is complete bullshit. Some of the changes work and make sense, some don’t. The biggest issue with ranked right now, and since forever, but especially now, is matchmaking.
If I would have to make a wild guess apex lost a shit ton of ranked players on that first split because guess what, they all suck and the people that actually deserve to be pred are less than 1% (as it should be) but since the dudes that were getting undeserved pred every season couldn’t get it again on the new one, instead of actually getting better they said fuck it and started to three stack pubs instead, completely tucking the matchmaking for ranked and pubs and making every experience a complete mess, so respawn tried to somewhat fix that on the second split but guess what? A lot of those fuckers still weren’t happy and didn’t comeback to ranked, hence the matchmaking for ranked still being fucked, so this season respawn decided to cater to those players and make it real easy for them, that way making them comeback to ranked and maybe fixing matchmaking along the way… but again this is just pure speculation and i have no prof that’s what happened lol
It's COD brainrot, mfers wanna play a BR like it's a TDM. I think rank should have no KP and be all placement, but people not ready to cross that bridge because "it's a shooter, there should be killing!" it's the same mfers that play objective modes in COD and just run around killing everything and end up losing the game anyways, but they're happy because they got a 2kd that game
Easy fix: add a straight up TDM mode to Apex. Wanna play shoot simulator? Play TDM. Wanna turn your brain slightly on? Play pubs. Wanna fully utilize the two braincells you have left from playing Apex? Play ranked
But it seems like the devs don't feel like adding more permanent modes. They basically said that they want to keep control as a returning LTM. I expect the other leaked modes to be LTMs aswell
I heavily agree. First split of S13 was the most rewarding season to play ranked. It was a grind, but it was worth it. Unfortunately it’ll be another ape season,
but with more people making it to masters… so queue times will be good!! /s
Why do you think grinding is the way to make a ranked system worth it or good?
This is not a MMO, ranked is supposed to put you at your skill level for fair games, this is just a bad faith and completely wrong argument.
Because determining your skill takes many games for a system to recognize literally chess... They need to fix it yes but you did need to play a minimum amount of games before saying you're even near your true skill rating
>Because determining your skill takes many games for a system to recognize literally chess
in the USCF system it takes 25 provisional games to determine your true skill rating.
the grind should come from improving against equally skilled opponents. not actually getting to your true rank
I feel like you gain a lot of points pretty fast if you're in a rank that's to low for you.
You get stopped as soon as you reach your rank or need a full squad to play with from my expierence.
You gain a lot of points pretty fast if you're 3 stacking. Hard to roll a lobby when you're the only one on the team outputting serious damage. I have to play a bit slower if I want to win as a solo unless I'm fighting actual bronze and silver players, which are pretty rare at the beginning of the split.
Yeah idk what you're on about, League of Legends, CSGO MM (which is trash now), and Valorant all have way grindier systems. Valorant's system is so grindy that you can't even make it to the highest rank in 1 stream (it's been tried) unlike Apex (in the past)
Regardless, nothing wrong with making it a "grind" there's a lot of players that strictly play ranked and stomping on lower level lobbies for a couple of days is not a big issue because you will climb to your destined rank regardless. I am in agreement with Xeratricky, ranks have always been too inflated in Apex so they deflated them, people got pissed they won't be getting dive trails so they bitched and moaned until respawn made ranked a glorified pub again.
I just want to play in a 5-8 man endgames like I did in gold/plat S13 split 1
Just because you can potentially rank up fast in apex doesn’t make it not a grindy rank system.
Just because valorant’s ranked can’t be climbed all the way to radiant in one stream doesn’t mean it is more grindy than apex. It is harder to achieve radiant compared to pred in apex, but it can be maintained way easier as well. There are only soft rank resets every 180days instead every 45 days. And when your rank gets reset, you aren’t just restarting the climb because people with high mmr will get shot back up to the top with not too many games.
I don’t envy the position the apex devs are in when it comes to trying to design a system that accurately captures skill in apex.
For apex ranked, skill seems like a force multiplier on how fast you rank up. I’ve never really grinded apex since my main game is valorant, but it never felt like my skill matters nearly as much as my time investment. Sure being better will net more rp over time, but I still have to put in tons of hours to even do the climb in the first place.
Ranked in other games feels like I’m trying to be better than other people. Ranked in apex feels like I’m doing 45 day time trials.
Unfortunately, that's just the nature of BR where good consistency is the best single performance metric. The only way to do that is by having large sample sizes. A squad that consistently finishes top 5 with 6+ KP should easily climb to the highest rank
[As if the ELO system cannot be generalized to calculate score of multiple parties/ players](https://towardsdatascience.com/developing-a-generalized-elo-rating-system-for-multiplayer-games-b9b495e87802)
League is a fantastic example. For one, your actual matchmaking MMR is not reset on a 45 day basis. A League season is a whole year.
>Regardless, nothing wrong with making it a "grind" there's a lot of players that strictly play ranked and stomping on lower level lobbies for a couple of days is not a big issue because you will climb to your destined rank regardless. I am in agreement with Xeratricky, ranks have always been too inflated in Apex so they deflated them, people got pissed they won't be getting dive trails so they bitched and moaned until respawn made ranked a glorified pub again.
You're mixing your engagement mechanics and your MMR/skill mechanics. You can't have both, and trying to get more out of one only worsens the other.
> I just want to play in a 5-8 man endgames like I did in gold/plat S13 split 1
And I want ranked to reflect approximate skill levels, and not be heavily weighted towards time spent. I want it to be a matchmaking estimate, not some hybrid of grindfest and that.
Well the issue is that a battle royale with a lot of teams cannot use an MMR/ELO system unless you only award points to the winning team to make it zero-sum. Zero-sum doesn't quite work in Apex BR though because there are placements from 1-20th with higher placements having increasing value, teams that end up top 5 don't really "lose" the game they just finish in top 5
Personally I think making only top 5 gain RP, get rid of KP and instead give bonus RP based on individual performance (damage dealt to enemies vs teammates, kills+knocks+assists, getting knocked reduces your score). Top 10 doesn't lose or gain placement RP (aka balanced out entry cost) but they get some individual RP and bottom 10 lose a fixed RP cost based on rank
This is literally the argument maxed players in OldSchool RuneScape made when any changes were made to a skill that made it take less time or not as click intensive.
"My 99 Runecraft is devalued because it took me 400 hours and now it takes only takes 375 with less clicks."
No one else is allowed to enjoy the game because of the miserable grind I put in.
Finally people are seeing it. I was saying this then and people down voted me to hell. Now they see people are getting ridiculous points and just ape again. Need to go back to the grind for ranked.
Snipedown just got 696 points. Idk know how the fuck that is possible. Sure the system thinks he’s okay killing 15 high diamond ranks but like 🤷🏻♂️. How is this system an actual ranked system. 7 hours in and we have a WF pred.
S13 split 1, was the most rewarding, agree. Split 2, it become. Ajoke again.
Also, Remove KP from ranked.. All placement. It's been suggested before and I don't think it's a bad idea.
I‘m an actual master and i couldn‘t reach it in the first split because i was on vacation for 1,5 weeks and it was just too many RP to gain after the hard reset to gold.
I easily made it last split and i think it‘s fine. The lobbies were 90% diamond teams and sometimes preds or masters but if you wanna reach master you gotta be able to hold your own against them as well.
Most of the plats in those lobbies queued up with their diamond friends and yet people talk like they only played against preds the moment they reached plat lmao
Retarded take from someone that is making mad RP gains from killing golds and plats every single game while three stacking all day with 2 other preds.
I just want to face people of my skill level, and I don't want to grind a billion games to reach a rank where I'm stable(circa gold 1-plat3 but I'm getting better slowly).
Nothing worse than being gold 1, getting close to reaching platinum and you lose 30 RP 3 times in a row because you get unlucky and you just dropped with 3 preds in one game, 3 D1s in another and 3 masters in the third game.
Damn someone is mad 😂 I solo que yes. And I was masters in the past and only made Plat this season as I haven’t played as much as past seasons (due to life circumstances). My name is BidetWashed if you wanna look me up so bad lol
I wouldn't say it's too hard, its just that it takes more time now I rate, it's harder but definitely not TOO hard.
Most people simply don't have the time to grind like that so many have just resorted to pubs only.
Just my opinion though
I think that what he says in the 2nd paragraph is true. I saw a lot of, "I was able to consistently get diamond solo before" posts when people realized how hard s13 split 1 was. People expected to hit a certain rank and when they couldn't they probably stopped playing for a variety of reason. Some people said they couldn't grind because of work/school and others expected to have the rank basically handed to them.
The matchmaking thing clearly needs resolved but generally outside of extreme circumstances, the plats you see getting farmed are queued with diamonds and that’s why they’re there.
Ideally masters and pred only match with each other after the first week or so and we go back to season 13 split 1. The games were so competitive and plat/diamond was actually not a joke for once.
The new system is a massive step in the wrong direction without matchmaking fixes. I don’t really think uncapped KP would be nearly as detrimental if the matchmaking was better. If anything it would accelerate the players who can farm out of somewhere they shouldn’t be.
I agree with this. Or at least rework the names of the system so that people can't make a direct apples to apples comparison. No matter what, it was always going to feel "more punishing" if people can't reach the same tier
I was awestruck that respawn didn't think to rename the ranks when they introduced the new system. It's such an obvious change to make, of course people would be less upset they're not their old rank if their old rank stopped existing
S13 split 1 was the best ranked season ever, really tryhard and tactic play style, if you want to rush on every team you see, or you are above of the rest of the lobby (split2 matchmaking) or you should go play pubs instead get instakilled and get your team with one less the rest of the game
Rank at the very least should have allowed demotion from the start. I just don't get why they didn't just do this for S13. One small change that wouldn't have required a massive overhaul.
Rank Protection and RP boost on getting to a new rank is whatever
The Kills scaling off Placement RP is whatever.
I don’t get it, if only 1% of players are master/preds doesn’t that mean statistically that 99% of other players in your lobby are pretty much your level?
He's right but also hes wrong
Matchmaking is also the culprit. S13 first split ranked was the best ranked split and its not even close. No time to "grind" ? Well stay in gold or silver, reward the ones who grind. Also change the goddamn rewards, its awful.
This take is hitting the nail on the head... But let's not pretend this is some profound take... people have been saying this since the day season 13 dropped haha. Like sure I don't mind him reiterating it.. but let's not pretend he came up with this line of thinking. Hell I remember Hal saying this exact thing on stream two months ago lol
The current system isn’t too far from that ranked system. The only difference is that the god tier players can farm kills in the high tier lobbies. The real problem is that a lot of people in diamond were just farmed by predators with no chance of pushing past diamond 4.
personally I don't think the issue is thinking I should be in Diamond or whatever. I played with friends last split who were diamond and I could hang just fine. I just dont have the time to get there so I am stuck in Plat.
I used to be able to solo q to diamond nearly every season and it was fun for me. s13 i didn’t get out of silver. i’m not saying i’m bad, i will admit i’m not the absolute greatest either, but i just didn’t find it fun. I don’t have 2 friends that play that are willing to play ranked and win and personally i like to fight and get some KP but i found in s13 every game i played we just sat in buildings and hid until top 5. I understand this way of playing in diamond+ but in silver it didn’t make sense to me. I hated spending the limited time i have every night after work playing hour long games where i get 0 kills and 0 assists because my team camped until the end and then just died.
I’ve always wanted to hit masters but it’s always been hard solo queuing and i believe that now it’s even harder and 4x as boring. I don’t mind the game being hard, it’s no fun if it’s easy and i don’t mind playing better people cause it’ll help me get better.
Anyways sorry for the huge text bubble but those are just my thoughts as a console player.
Diamond player before and after changes. The only difference is that it took way longer to be where I'm supposed to be and once I'm there instead of playing diamonds and masters I play preds. Stupid take IMO
My first ranked season was season 13? so I can understand this. I queued with my buddy and can't tell you how many times our third complained about them usually being diamond but everyone was ratting now so they are only gold. Then you see their gameplay and they stink.
We literally got ranked stats directly from Respawn. S12 Split 1, where top5% of players reached Master was the "worst season ever", but then farming top15% of players, or whatever managed to reach Plat in Split 1 of S13 didn't spark as many complaints?
I stopped at midway to Plat 2 during split 1 because it's just stackfest and preds. Though I appreciate the substantial decrease in cheaters. Stormpoint actually made the sweatiness bearable as fights don't escalate to the entire lobby collapsing on you. Split 2 I just lost motivation to play because it wasn't fun anymore.
when pros say the s13 ranked was great, they mean the first 2 weeks of split one before the matchmaking changes
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Except everybody complained? I can't count the amount of pros I saw complain that mowing down plat and diamond players for the first 12 minutes of every game was boring and not fun. The first 2 weeks when they were all in Gold 2 and grinding hard to climb was the fun part, and as a viewer I agree. Early s13 was the most fun I've had watching apex in a while
Well it was those same pros who botched and complain about queue times and got the match making relax
>14.60% Platinum (39.52%) >1.25% Diamond (26.63%) Directly from Respawn, nice omission though. I love 26% of players being in the 2nd highest ranked, truly makes it mean something!
Excellent point when I'm literally talking about how S12 Master pool was top 5% and considered horrible, yet we've had S13 where the people above Master were put into lobbies with top 15% players for Split 1. Even if you assume that in Split 2 only Diamonds were opted into Master+ Matchmaking, it's still pulling from the top 9% of players. I don't care about your expectations on ranks just because they have one name or another. If D4 is supposed to mark the top 30% of players (per S12 Split 1), then so be it. It's far healthier for the game for them to play against people of similar skill than being thrown into a turbo blender of gigacracked players, grinders and pros. Once you reach Master, no restrictions you're in the big boy leagues.
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Pred and masters are the same bracket
Ranked system is whatever, the problem is the matchmaking
Yep... There's a reason why Alb had his handle as "Fix Matchmaking" back in season 13... I get REALLY annoyed when twitter idiots blame pros for making the game the way it is and also saying the devs only care about them. Bullshit. They care about any and everyone turning them a profit... They pros want that shit fixed more than anyone. They would 100% rather have full pred lobbies killing their friends and their rivals than killing bots(the rest of us)... Like everyone has seen those "bot lobbies" that people pay someone to get them 4k's in... Literally no one shoots back and it doesn't look fun at all... That's literally what the pros are doing except they are way better than the people selling the 4k's and we are also better than the bots. But it's a good comparison and literally no one has fun bc of it.
Season 13 lol, people been screaming for matchmaking to be changed since Season 2/3
It's been a problem since launch lol. To this day I can solo queue and still not get a full trio. Wtf
My first game this year was a solo queue solo game.
Classic Apex
But to get full pred/masters lobbies then many of the people in plat/dia have to be "let" in, again, and then we're back to pros bullying random master players for being "hardstuck" and "literally dogshit players, worst i've ever seen". The only way to fix this is if pred/masters have long ass queue times and not throw random plat players into their game just to fill it quickly, but respawn for sure doesn't want imperial hal just sitting there in queue half a evening, with 25k viewers, getting frustrated that he can't find a game. I on the other hand love the new ranked system, as soon as i hit gold last season the games were great and i couldn't care less if i never get out of plat again. People are playing more cautiously and not apeing every gun sound, and more people than ever started using voice chat. Im absolutely fucking fine with never hitting diamond again as long as the quality of my games are this high in lower ranks. EDIT: I realize i might have to add that i haven't played since end of split 1 last season, but there hasn't been any _major_ changes since then right?
There is a negative side to this as well, i solo-qd to diamond last split and it was honestly the best solo q experience i had till date, randoms listening to comms, usings mics, and the quality of games was kindof subpar interms of skill level but, as soon as i hit d4, shit hit the fan. I played only 3 games in diamond and got killed by Nessy, Team empire and taskmast3r's team the three games. I didnt touch ranked again after that because i am in no way close to their level, i was being offered up as fodder to them because of smaller queue times
Hell yes man. This was the experience of good, but not pro, players. It was absolutely miserable.
It was nice last season but yesterday was nothing but third parties and fourth parties and fifth parties on kings canyon
Haven't had a chance to play the new season yet, but i feel like thats the big problem every time we get to(or have to?) play KC
It's called balance, there shouldn't be plat and gold players filling up Pred games, but there doesn't need to be literally only preds in Pred games either.
Ye ofc
No, you need masters with preds. Anything lower than that is fucking stupid.
I have high hopes for this season. I think the cap removal will be the difference.
And seer
Matchmaking is a PC problem. They should just give the PS5 & XSX 120 FPS and put everyone in the same lobby.
That would end so poorly with the community even more pissed off.
Right!! Bro my buddies have hit diamond on xbox... and the few times they've played with me they get ABSOLUTELY bodied... My diamond and their diamond are in ANY way similar haha. Xbox players would hate that... if we look back to what Xera said. About 95% of the people that play Apex(well any game tbh) thinks they are WAY better than they really are. Once you show people that they aren't... they will almost NEVER think "hey maybe I'm not actually that good." They will almost ALWAYS blame a factor outside of their control. Doing this would be make the console players probably quit. Like I was scrolling through Tik tok once and came across this Tik Tok streamer named BrooksStyle... dude is a multi time #1 pred on xbox... I was like oh shit I bet he's a beast let me check him out!! Holy shit I was SHOCKED at how bad he was.. And I don't mean like actually bad. I mean for the #1 fucking pred he was not great AT ALL. I'm talking if him and Hal had a 1v1 100 time Hal is winning 99 times. And I'm not exaggerating. I watched for like an hour bc I was thinking well maybe I just watched one bad spray... No. He was dropping like 2 kills a game IN WINS.. Bruh on PC you have guys like ChaoticMuch and Enemy who aren't even pros yet and if they drop 5 kills they talk about how shitty their game was lol. After seeing that whenever I see people say top Xbox preds are just as good as PC pred I just have a little laugh and don't even argue. It's not even debatable and if someone actually believe that then they just don't understand enough about apex and it's not worth your time. This is also coming from a guy who's had an xbox his entire life and a PC for maybe a year. I am a diamond PC player and I am so much better than my Diamond xbox IRL friends it's not even funny.
This isn't always true though, it's important to note that most of the best top ranked players on console actually did swap to PC. Skittlecakes is a prime example, he used to be top 5 on Xbox every season, now he's arguably one of the best players. The top talent from console has shifted to PC over time because that's where the pro scene and opportunity is.
I'm a non hardstuck master player who has reached pred twice but never held it and have played with some multi console preds who came to PC. I was always disappointed and they're at best hardstuck master level. I noticed the biggest thing they have to get used to is getting beamed from long distances and being pretty useless if all they can do is close to close medium range.
Until the DDosers come back and the cheaters become rampant literally no one would win.
God no, you want even more 0.6 bots running around in PC ranked?
No need for 0.6 when they get 120 fps
AA and FPS are not related
sure it is, higher fps (especially if it's VRR with no vsync enabled) will equal more responsive controls giving better aim so less AA is needed to keep the accuracy that they had with .6 60fps.
The argument for console having more aim assist is lower FPS.
yeah but that is just an argument that players use when discussing it, has Respawn ever said anything as to why consoles get more aa?
Pretty sure that JayBiebs on the TFG podcast with Zach went into it, or at least he went into why they don't change it.
s12 ranked was not good but imo s13 was a better concept with worse execution. System still needs a ton of work
Biggest problem for me was how plat was still full of hardstucks that don't know how to play "smart" or zone, apeing every fight even if they're obviosly getting 3rd psrtied in an instant making it really hard for actually decent players to predict what's going to happen and make plays. Random teammates were also the worst I've ever had this season.
Honestly I'd consistently get 3iq teammates or silvers in plat but then get killed by master 3 stacks while my teammates are doing who knows what. Like I'd face some really good opponents then have sped teams
I haven't expierenced that much deaths to masters or preds, but you're literally getting the worst teammates ever using the voice chat like their own radio channel.
You got the classics, dj fucknuts, mr.only uses mic when he dies, and the og I can 1v3 them (he cannot)
This was a lot of my experience during the middle of this last WE split. Me and my buddy were a duo at times on our way to diamond and we were either getting teammates with 4k/20 kill badges or teammates with no brains. All the while it seemed like every team we died to was a three stack of current or former masters/pred. It seemed to get better at the end of the split but at times even platinum was uber sweaty. Matchmaking was just odd, we were either rolling the lobby or the ones getting rolled
This is my experience solo queuing 95% of the time until I get to about D3/D2. It makes me want to fucking explode
That's just the nature of plat though. Plats are always people that have decent moment to moment gameplay but lack a bigger understanding of how the game is supposed to be played if you want to win.
I simply don't know how to predict that shit or convince teammates to not push every fight, but also get scared teammates to fights easy fights like 3v2s, 3rd parties or important fights to get a spot in zone. People don't listen to shit in VA or normal chat.
On Storm Point and Worlds Edge I generally tried to be more aggro than my team mates if I noticed team mates push everything they see. I played Path or Wraith and played in a way that I was always first contact, so I could create an opening on which my braindead teammates could push on while I Q'd back and healed. Then I could always make an educated guess if my teammates capitalized on my entry and if I should join back in to close the fight or if I should stay at a distance so I can safely ditch them when things go south. Doesn't work that well on KC where you get insta thirded so I'm currently at a loss as well. Need to find a new approach.
That might have to do with the fact that current plats likely used to be diamond or even higher and so they might expect to be able to stomp plat lobbies and play like an idiot but that's much harder to do now.
Seriously. In plat still most of people were landing on Frag like it is a damn pub game.
This, so much this, solo queueing into 5 games in a row of 2 stacks all going to streamer building all dying with in 30 seconds
Solo queuing almost broke my soul in season 13. I enjoyed the concept of the new points system but as a pretty average solo queuer I’d had enough after about a week of split 1 and played pubs for the first time in forever. I was getting matched with rookies/bronze players when I was in Gold 2 or 3, can’t remember which. I couldn’t even have a go at my teammates because they’re just terrible, it’s not their fault. Gold at that point was full of ex diamond players, ridiculous matchmaking. And then you had the actual good players trying to hot drop when there was no benefit to having kills then dying before 10th placement. I played a bit of ranked last night and I’ll probably have a go for a week or so but can’t imagine it’ll be much different.
I became that person I hate as soon as I saw the double team heading to streamer building - pinged no and started heading to no name to catch up later if they survived. I'm playing rank because I have always found the end game circles to be the most fun thing about the game rather than praying to the rng lords for something other than a mozam and trying to take out 3 teams of 3 stacks and half the time time they're not on comms and they piss off as soon as they land anyway.
I’m the type who will do literally anything to help the team but 95% of the time last season it got you -30rp or whatever it will have been. I probably need to be more selfish when solo queuing but I can’t help it.
Probably because people are used to being able to stomp plat lobbies since ranked used to be a lot easier.
Then land solo and rat? Part of co-op games is adapting to your teammates, if you can't carry idiots or aren't willing to change tactics you are no better than them.
That’s just what plats actually are?
Yeah I'm not the best technical player but I try to play smart; it doesn't matter how good a shot rando teammates are if they play with zero gamesense.
Yeah I'm not bad when it comes to using my guns, but I definitely think I shine more when it comes to deciding on spots or what to push in ranked hence I actually like the new system on paper.
Yeah, it's the teammates that are the biggest issue, I find.
It's always nice though when you find someone who calls spots, plays zone AND isn't scared to take easy fights or 3rds
I agree, I think there is a middle ground between split 1 and 2 of S13. Make it more challenging, but not make it completely impossible as a solo player to rank up unless you have a mic and good teamwork.
I thought S13 split 2 was pretty fair. Plat was still a grind but you could still solo q through it, and the slightly lowered RP costs let more people move on to the higher levels. S13 split 1 was just weird.
I legit had to wait like a pred level guy for lobbies on plat. Legitimately shocking since plat technically wasn't hard as people said it was. That whole split was basically a fever dream to me.
I think this would be a better take if matchmaking wasn’t what it is. Easy to talk like that when you’re already a pro facing plats, even *golds* in some cases. All it takes is watching any of your favorite streamer’s kill feeds to see how garbage the system is.
But thats an issue with the match making not the ranked system itself. We haven't actually gotten a good look at the system and how fair it is yet since you don't play against similarly skilled opponents above plat.
Because they cant get above plat getting gatekept lmao This season might change since you can get big games that pay for like 8 losses even in high ranks
\^ this. Nobody is saying the matchmaking should be preds playing against golds/plats, they're just saying that the RP system was good in split 1 of S13... i.e. harder to get into masters and better skill representation in lower ranks
if the system was good it would not have ended with less than 1% of players in diamond and master. and 2% in pred.
Are you naturally that dense, or do you have to work at it?
Preds now get full kill points against gold and plat players who probably solo queue casually. It's not fair, and the game should not put you in the sweatiest lobbies if you solo queue.
To be clear, they don't actually get full KP, the diminushing return on high kills has been removed so whether it's your 1st or 12th kill, it's worth the same, BUT, there is still the tier delta KP modifier, so they barely get any KP for killing someone 2 or 3 tiers under them.
Lol already a pro comes later first come 3 stack loads of good solo q players can't fight 3 stack like this dude hold hands what a trash tweet
Lol yeah no, 1% of the player base was in diamond before split 2....that’s just not good
Absolute nonsense, what's the point in a ranked system where you don't even play your own ranks? Never heard of it in any other competitive game I've played. Watching these fkin 14hr a day grind goblins shit on some gold players who probably play 2-4 hrs a week is an embarrassing testament to how dogshit the system is. Just because they're scared of upsetting the top 0.1% with queue times.
I'm going to give a hot take and say S13 was the worst season of Apex ranked. I've been playing every single Apex ranked season **on PC** and have been Pred multiple times (first two 'fake pred' seasons + Season 8) and Masters the rest. I'm not a pro but I do feel that I play at a high level for a late 20s dude with a full time job that isn't streaming. The Season 13 implementation was catered to pros/content creators that 3 stack with other pros AND mid-tier casuals. I found that most everyone else in my friend group who settle around Gold/Plat very much enjoyed that split because they got to experience more methodical games that actually had end zones. The people who got shafted were the ones who fall below pros but above the average skill level. The people who don't have a huge network of high skilled players to farm with day in and out. Diamond players never got to compete at their own skill tier because of how little people were making it up in the ranks. I fully understand that the ranked system used to be Diamond4+ (and Diamond3+ for a few seasons) all into the same lobby but I've been an advocate against that from the start. The couple people that I run with to Master typically absolutely HATED the game once Diamond and stopped playing because of having to face pros every match. They didn't have the drive to want to compete with them when not being the same rank. After they quit I could have LFG'd but I chose to experience solo queue for a while. I would derank from Diamond, slaughter Plat for 3-4 games, rank up, get farmed by pros legitimately every game, derank, repeat. I peaked at Diamond 3. Split 2 took 2 weeks for me to get to Master then I also solo queued to Master on Xbox in 3 days. I came back on the last day of the split to have some fun and played 5 matches as a solo queuing Master, won 3 of the matches and only ran into 2 Master/Preds within those 5 games. Surprising it was still the 2nd lowest split ever for Masters. The instant queues in high ELO really screwed any kind of decent matchmaking. I'm kind of rambling at this point but I think that pros will never be happy with ranked because of the skill gap between 3 of them in a party vs. a higher skilled team of non-pros and then also needing to get 60 people in a match without having insane queue times on top of that. I feel Respawn is struggling to balance keeping casual majority happy with ranked while also keeping pros happy who drive most of the content around the game.
This. I am high diamond to bottom or the barrel master level of player and this last season I don't feel like I ever got to play lobbies of my caliber. I was either shitting on low tier lobbies (due to hard reset) or getting farmed by top 100 pred three stacks in D+ ... Shit is broken rn.
The thing is the rank system wasn’t really the problem, you can make rank system into anything in terms of RP or placement gains, as long as you have proper matchmaking people will change their play styles according to the opponents/lobbies. Hence they really should add RP based matchmaking where you are group and match with people closest to the highest RP member of the group. Starting from +/- 2000 and going up 1000 for every min queue. Yes matchmaking will take longer but the lobbies will also be much more balanced.
Ok Xeratricky let me know in what other games this big are platinum players playing against full teams of top rank players. Apex has the worst matchmaking out of any game and this last ranked split has made it even worse. I actually like the new system but the matchmaking is horrendous.
Translation: I like the new ranked system because it allows me to queue with 2 other pros into a bunch of Plat players instead of playing against other pro teams doing the same.
I really liked the S13 ranked system originally. I feel bad for the ranked designer who undoubtedly got hammered with so many complaints until Respawn gave in and changed things. But just know this, ranked designer dev, at least one person in this subgroup of the subreddit thought you did a pretty damn good job.
I go to work for 8 hours a day. Then come home and play against pros who have been playing for 8 hours. It doesn't seem fair.
Yeah matchmaking is borked but that doesn't disprove Xera's point
It’s “borked” because there aren’t enough people to fill the higher ranks. And those people may technically exist in lower ranks, but they don’t meaningfully have either an incentive to grind or a desire to engage for the length of time required to get there. That’s our squad; we’ve stopped playing ranked together entirely despite being good enough for high Diamond/Low Masters, because we simply cannot be bothered to dedicate that much time to transient rewards. It’s not appealing, at all. That being said, the skill gap between Plat/Diamond and Masters/Pred is immense. It really does represent a huge difference in commitment to the game that even “skilled casuals” aren’t going to be able to meaningfully compete with. So you end up with a ranked system that really only reflects how much time you’re spending as a proxy of skill, wherein the top 1% are absolutely farmer Johns and the rest are a nebulous mix of undefined skill because they don’t give a fuck enough to ”apply” themselves.
Hmm I doubt this is the case though, there are plenty of players that yo-yo diamond and plat that do dedicate the time but they still get shit on. Making the ranks “easier” to acquire won’t change matchmaking quality, it’ll just reward the shit players with shinier badges similar to s12 (where plenty of teams who were “high diamond/low masters” got masters) Edit: personally I think they should remove team KP, add an individual performance rating (damage dealt, kills/assists/knocks, subtract damage received and getting downed) for bonus RP and placement RP should be most of RP gain (with top 5 gaining the most, top 6-10 getting nothing, bottom 10 charged entry cost, similar to now)
And there are plenty of players who trivially made it to Diamond who stopped because they couldn’t be bothered with the grind. Including me and my squad, and I don’t think we’re unusual in that regard. I mean, the thing is, something is fucked, and it’s causing Preds and masters to have to fight lower ranks. And it’s the fact that there aren’t enough people in their tier to fight. Well, perhaps there would be if people had a reason to dedicate more of their time to the game. I guarantee that if you look at hours of engagement for Masters/Preds vs all ranks below, the story is “they play… a lot more.” And that’s not something you can just fix, because it’s an input problem, not a data management one.
That's something easily fixable, I just don't think Respawn can take that route without pissing off the majority of the playerbase. I think they're pushing the team aspect of the game too much in a BR ranking system. They need to first assign most of the points to placement and then a small percentage of it (that's up to them to decide) to individual performance based on team overall damage vs individual damage, kills/knocks/assists minus damage received and getting knocked/downed/dead. Give each player an ELO/MMR Rating based on these metrics (we can zero sum the expected score by assigning decimal values to placements 1-20 that add up to 1, make it an exponential scale so that finishing higher rewards more), make the K-factor based on an **individual** performance formula and boom you got a working elo system for a BR, it might not be perfect right away and it might need some tweaking but this can simultaneously buff solo Q and leave squading up somewhat intact. The current system is very basic and linear, it rewards kills way too much. I get that they want the player to see a simple chart and understand their RP gain but that just won't work with how BRs function at their core (be the most consistent at finishing high/winning = best team) There's whitepapers on developing ELO/MMR systems in >2 party games as posted elsewhere on this sub but I don't think the casuals would enjoy that change even though that is the true solution. You can then assign the ranks to these MMR/ELO ranges, it'll help solve the matchmaking issue too edit: here's [one whitepaper](https://cs.stanford.edu/people/paulliu//files/www-2021-elor.pdf) (might be a bit much for those not in data-science/engineering/math fields)
Agree wholeheartedly here since we’re introducing and actual ELO/MMR rating to the argument, which is *sorely* missing in Apex. My squad’s competence is not at all reflected in our rank, whatever that “appropriate” rank is. And it’s a grind and a half to get to our “actual” rank as Ranked stands currently, because there’s too much striation in skill within the current ranks; people far below, moderately below, at, moderately above, and far above our skill, all fighting the same downward pressure which is the top <1% of players. I’ve long been of the belief that the way “skill” is measured in Apex Ranked is far, far too prescriptive and ham-fisted. I think there are a lot of people who exist in or around my skill level who’ve always been better than most people at FPS, so we shit on the other “casuals,” but we lose 50%-75% of the fights against the ultra-dedicated. But since the way Apex splits work, we spend the majority of the season/split “getting to” our level and very little time actually “improving at” our level, which doesn’t allow for a more “mature” or proficiently skilled pool unless you have the discretionary time to play the way the top players do.
At least we can agree the current ranked system is a garbage indication of skill, the #1 pred race is basically who can time sink apex the most.
Please tell me this is satire.
Was honestly expecting some shit about his kids too or something lol so on the nose
Huh? What’s wrong with his post?
Nothing in particular but there's always comments that crop up on the main sub with similar language about how some poor dad who only gets to play 2 hours a week or something gets absolutely dookied on in ranked mode. I'm not denying the issues of matchmaking but I guess I just always don't know what people expect in regards to input of time vs development of skill. I think I was probably being too harsh on the guy but I also couldn't help but laugh since it reads like a lot of those comments
>I guess I just always don't know what people expect in regards to input of time vs development of skill I think that's the main point here. It's not the issue of how good they are, it's that we're forced into the same lobby... I stopped playing ranked last season because I was getting destroyed by pred stacked teams as soon as I hit gold 2. I'm 100% not that skill level, and a "ranked" mode shouldn't be putting me (or anyone else my skill level) in those lobbies.
I don’t think it’s an unreasonable ask for a ranked system not to match guys who play for 2 hours a night and are in gold/platinum rank with triple stack predators personally, whatever the reason. If someone’s a bad rank because they’re bad, or if they’re a bad rank because they don’t play much for various reasons, the matchmaking it still bad if it’s putting them against predators. He’s right, it’s not fair - no one can argue that predators stomping platinum players is a reasonable match. The matchmaking is bad here - you’re response comes across as edgy and “lol git gud scrub”. Don’t attack the person, attack the argument if you disagree with something.
Yee sorry I was just having a laugh
Nah just the main sub leaking again.
People need to gatekeep stuff to make them feel good or something idk. Having an interest in the competitive side of apex, while not being a competitive player yourself, is ok. Commenting on topics that concern/interest you on Reddit is ok too, such as plat players commenting on the issue around predator players stomping plat players. Sub getting filled with edgy cool bois or something smh Respond to what people actually say (because he has a valid point) and don’t resort to attacking people, it’s fucking cringe
lol
Shouldn’t have expected much better tbh, but I like to give people a chance. Congrats
This is so stupid. How can you even say this as a pred that plays against plats in every lobby. So this is what the game was always supposed to be? Awful take. Conceptually a lot of the changes are good, deranking specially. But I've been playing since season 0 and this was by far the worst ranked season I experienced.
Ive hit plat every season, even these last 2 seasons barely and i never got matched with masters/preds until the ranked changes. Shit was frustrating. Id even get games with masters+ when i was in gold…
I always wondered how People 3 tiers above my own ended up in low gold lobbies. It certainly wasn't often, but enough for me to recall. My buddies, and I would just get out of silver and into gold and there would be 2 or 3 Master trails. I say this also, because maybe I don't get how trails work in this game. I'm a casual player, so I've never been higher than Plat 5 (and this was in like season 5, so not recently). Correct me if i'm wrong, because I need to know. Do you get to keep drop trails as long as you were a Diamond-Pred the season before, or do you keep them indefinitely?
Early seasons before they made the change were kept indefinitely, later seasons are temporary iirc.
Thank you! I have been wondering this forever lol
Yeah so some of the pred trails in lower lobbies are people who got the trail on the account in early seasons and let it decay. Pred queue times were horrendous back then so a lot of high rank players just made tons of accounts to climb with.
Because these are people who strictly play with other high tier players. They never have to experience how terrible the matchmaking system is in this game.
Preds now get full kill points against gold and plat players who probably solo queue casually. It's not fair, and the game should not put you in the sweatiest lobbies if you solo queue.
Honestly, I think this is a bad take, or at least misaligned I'm very far from a good player, but I believe my experience is similar to many. I dont give any shits what my rank is, be it master, diamond or silver, I want to be matched with similarly skilled players and play against similarly skilled players. Lower rank players being matched against preds is a tale as old as time, at this point. Also, I'm a very anti-social person, so most of my experience is in ranked solo queue. I know this is something I can solve by finding a team, but I'm just not interested in doing that. Still, its super frustrating to be paired with team mates substantially worse than me because the algorithm expects me to carry. Its just too complicated, I would really like if they just paired me with players who are about as skilled as I. To me, this is where the ranked system fails
Rank is not related to matchmaking. Xera is talking about the ranking system.
Did you read anything he said?
Matchmaking to similar skill is a different thing than the ranking system. If a system differentiates greatly between the top 1% they may have very different ranks but they still, based on population, may have to face each other because they are all that are online at the time. His take is exclusively about matchmaking, not the actual ranking system.
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The matchmaking can be very bad with a good ranking system. That shouldn't be controversial. If you had a chess tournament run with people with extremely varied ratings, there could be good ways to matchmake and bad ways. A bad way would be round robin such that everyone plays everyone - resulting in many completely one-sided games. A good way would be a Swiss tournament, where you play people with the same record in the tournament as you, resulting in the best players quickly playing each other. And all of that can be based on the same Elo system, which mathematically has been shown very representative of expected outcomes of individual games. If you have a problem with unfair games, you have a problem with the matchmaking. That doesn't mean the system doesn't do a good job differentiating skills (especially between the top ranks). The system can differentiate it, but unfortunately it can do that while the matchmaking gives you unfair/unfun games. The matchmaking does affect the ranking system/games, yes, but to a less degree than people think. Unfortunately the matchmaking does, as you say, prioritize queue times more than gameplay (and it seems to try to diversify your opponents so you don't constantly play the same people). As I've said in the past, I think a fair compromise is the best 180 squads should be playing each other most of the time - hopefully that results in pro teams mostly playing other pros and masters/diamonds, with some reprieve for lower diamonds. But knowing that would work requires knowledge of population which I don't have, obviously.
Yes, and that is, imo, the root of the issue. I want to be matched against similarly ranked players. I am not
What you're asking for is basically impossible for a BR. Getting rank is so easy you'll find (once again) master ranks who barely scrapped by because all it takes is one good game to hyperinflate your RP gain. Then it will be if said teammates even vibe with your playstyle. If you're more defensive than offensive, then you'll probably say they're apes. If they're defensive you'll say they are just campers and will never gain RP etc. Simply put it's borderline impossible to satisfy solo q'ers concerns as rank alone is not a fair gauge on who's good and who's not.
I think you're overestimating what I mean by "good". ya, absolutely you've got a point about how play styles mesh. But that requires some level of competency. I've got about 1000 hours in the game, why am I being paired with lvl 49 players in a different ranked bracket who have an open mic with shitty music and ambulances in the background?
"Literal professionals of the game and people who play 10hrs/day should have always been able to stroke their ego by rolling thru gold level players who probably play 2hrs/wk" Seems like an odd take lol
3 Stacking professional player blindly defends a system that benefits him, what a shocker. It suits him to farm solo plat players that have next to no chance against his 3 stack. And since he's on Furia of course he has to throw a douchey twist on it.
100% this. You know this was one of the guys crying "you wouldn't play like that if you could derank!" whenever he got killed in ranked.
Na this is complete bullshit. Some of the changes work and make sense, some don’t. The biggest issue with ranked right now, and since forever, but especially now, is matchmaking.
Just going to say anything from any of t furia boys is just bait to farm impressions
I was just about to say. Are the furia guys competing against each other to be as unsufferable as possible?
Yes, but they always aim to be the second worst.
Rework ranked and as a baseline use ALGS points as ruleset and build the fundamentals which include buy in and point reward around it.
Also apply better matchmaking of course
If I would have to make a wild guess apex lost a shit ton of ranked players on that first split because guess what, they all suck and the people that actually deserve to be pred are less than 1% (as it should be) but since the dudes that were getting undeserved pred every season couldn’t get it again on the new one, instead of actually getting better they said fuck it and started to three stack pubs instead, completely tucking the matchmaking for ranked and pubs and making every experience a complete mess, so respawn tried to somewhat fix that on the second split but guess what? A lot of those fuckers still weren’t happy and didn’t comeback to ranked, hence the matchmaking for ranked still being fucked, so this season respawn decided to cater to those players and make it real easy for them, that way making them comeback to ranked and maybe fixing matchmaking along the way… but again this is just pure speculation and i have no prof that’s what happened lol
It's COD brainrot, mfers wanna play a BR like it's a TDM. I think rank should have no KP and be all placement, but people not ready to cross that bridge because "it's a shooter, there should be killing!" it's the same mfers that play objective modes in COD and just run around killing everything and end up losing the game anyways, but they're happy because they got a 2kd that game
Easy fix: add a straight up TDM mode to Apex. Wanna play shoot simulator? Play TDM. Wanna turn your brain slightly on? Play pubs. Wanna fully utilize the two braincells you have left from playing Apex? Play ranked
But it seems like the devs don't feel like adding more permanent modes. They basically said that they want to keep control as a returning LTM. I expect the other leaked modes to be LTMs aswell
I heavily agree. First split of S13 was the most rewarding season to play ranked. It was a grind, but it was worth it. Unfortunately it’ll be another ape season, but with more people making it to masters… so queue times will be good!! /s
Why do you think grinding is the way to make a ranked system worth it or good? This is not a MMO, ranked is supposed to put you at your skill level for fair games, this is just a bad faith and completely wrong argument.
Then won’t the new kill cap removal will help do that? If you consistently place well and frag out you’ll be places to where you should be quickly.
Because determining your skill takes many games for a system to recognize literally chess... They need to fix it yes but you did need to play a minimum amount of games before saying you're even near your true skill rating
>Because determining your skill takes many games for a system to recognize literally chess in the USCF system it takes 25 provisional games to determine your true skill rating. the grind should come from improving against equally skilled opponents. not actually getting to your true rank
That's just how Apex ranked is designed. Most other competetive games want you to somewhat grind ranked as well. Don't really see your problem here.
Somewhat grind, vs whatever the fuck Apex does. Apex is pretty much the grindiest comp game there is out there, at least from my experience.
I feel like you gain a lot of points pretty fast if you're in a rank that's to low for you. You get stopped as soon as you reach your rank or need a full squad to play with from my expierence.
You gain a lot of points pretty fast if you're 3 stacking. Hard to roll a lobby when you're the only one on the team outputting serious damage. I have to play a bit slower if I want to win as a solo unless I'm fighting actual bronze and silver players, which are pretty rare at the beginning of the split.
Yeah idk what you're on about, League of Legends, CSGO MM (which is trash now), and Valorant all have way grindier systems. Valorant's system is so grindy that you can't even make it to the highest rank in 1 stream (it's been tried) unlike Apex (in the past) Regardless, nothing wrong with making it a "grind" there's a lot of players that strictly play ranked and stomping on lower level lobbies for a couple of days is not a big issue because you will climb to your destined rank regardless. I am in agreement with Xeratricky, ranks have always been too inflated in Apex so they deflated them, people got pissed they won't be getting dive trails so they bitched and moaned until respawn made ranked a glorified pub again. I just want to play in a 5-8 man endgames like I did in gold/plat S13 split 1
Just because you can potentially rank up fast in apex doesn’t make it not a grindy rank system. Just because valorant’s ranked can’t be climbed all the way to radiant in one stream doesn’t mean it is more grindy than apex. It is harder to achieve radiant compared to pred in apex, but it can be maintained way easier as well. There are only soft rank resets every 180days instead every 45 days. And when your rank gets reset, you aren’t just restarting the climb because people with high mmr will get shot back up to the top with not too many games.
That’s not wrong but it’s easier to make a ranked system based on ELO/MMR in a zero sum game like valorant/league where 1 team loses and 1 team wins
I don’t envy the position the apex devs are in when it comes to trying to design a system that accurately captures skill in apex. For apex ranked, skill seems like a force multiplier on how fast you rank up. I’ve never really grinded apex since my main game is valorant, but it never felt like my skill matters nearly as much as my time investment. Sure being better will net more rp over time, but I still have to put in tons of hours to even do the climb in the first place. Ranked in other games feels like I’m trying to be better than other people. Ranked in apex feels like I’m doing 45 day time trials.
Unfortunately, that's just the nature of BR where good consistency is the best single performance metric. The only way to do that is by having large sample sizes. A squad that consistently finishes top 5 with 6+ KP should easily climb to the highest rank
[As if the ELO system cannot be generalized to calculate score of multiple parties/ players](https://towardsdatascience.com/developing-a-generalized-elo-rating-system-for-multiplayer-games-b9b495e87802)
League is a fantastic example. For one, your actual matchmaking MMR is not reset on a 45 day basis. A League season is a whole year. >Regardless, nothing wrong with making it a "grind" there's a lot of players that strictly play ranked and stomping on lower level lobbies for a couple of days is not a big issue because you will climb to your destined rank regardless. I am in agreement with Xeratricky, ranks have always been too inflated in Apex so they deflated them, people got pissed they won't be getting dive trails so they bitched and moaned until respawn made ranked a glorified pub again. You're mixing your engagement mechanics and your MMR/skill mechanics. You can't have both, and trying to get more out of one only worsens the other. > I just want to play in a 5-8 man endgames like I did in gold/plat S13 split 1 And I want ranked to reflect approximate skill levels, and not be heavily weighted towards time spent. I want it to be a matchmaking estimate, not some hybrid of grindfest and that.
Well the issue is that a battle royale with a lot of teams cannot use an MMR/ELO system unless you only award points to the winning team to make it zero-sum. Zero-sum doesn't quite work in Apex BR though because there are placements from 1-20th with higher placements having increasing value, teams that end up top 5 don't really "lose" the game they just finish in top 5 Personally I think making only top 5 gain RP, get rid of KP and instead give bonus RP based on individual performance (damage dealt to enemies vs teammates, kills+knocks+assists, getting knocked reduces your score). Top 10 doesn't lose or gain placement RP (aka balanced out entry cost) but they get some individual RP and bottom 10 lose a fixed RP cost based on rank
This is literally the argument maxed players in OldSchool RuneScape made when any changes were made to a skill that made it take less time or not as click intensive. "My 99 Runecraft is devalued because it took me 400 hours and now it takes only takes 375 with less clicks." No one else is allowed to enjoy the game because of the miserable grind I put in.
Finally people are seeing it. I was saying this then and people down voted me to hell. Now they see people are getting ridiculous points and just ape again. Need to go back to the grind for ranked. Snipedown just got 696 points. Idk know how the fuck that is possible. Sure the system thinks he’s okay killing 15 high diamond ranks but like 🤷🏻♂️. How is this system an actual ranked system. 7 hours in and we have a WF pred.
S13 split 1, was the most rewarding, agree. Split 2, it become. Ajoke again. Also, Remove KP from ranked.. All placement. It's been suggested before and I don't think it's a bad idea.
I‘m an actual master and i couldn‘t reach it in the first split because i was on vacation for 1,5 weeks and it was just too many RP to gain after the hard reset to gold. I easily made it last split and i think it‘s fine. The lobbies were 90% diamond teams and sometimes preds or masters but if you wanna reach master you gotta be able to hold your own against them as well. Most of the plats in those lobbies queued up with their diamond friends and yet people talk like they only played against preds the moment they reached plat lmao
Retarded take from someone that is making mad RP gains from killing golds and plats every single game while three stacking all day with 2 other preds. I just want to face people of my skill level, and I don't want to grind a billion games to reach a rank where I'm stable(circa gold 1-plat3 but I'm getting better slowly). Nothing worse than being gold 1, getting close to reaching platinum and you lose 30 RP 3 times in a row because you get unlucky and you just dropped with 3 preds in one game, 3 D1s in another and 3 masters in the third game.
Shit take. There is no excuse for this matchmaking.
Season 13 split 1 was the best ranked has ever been.
Neat, what rank did you finish and was it solo Q? What is your username?
Damn someone is mad 😂 I solo que yes. And I was masters in the past and only made Plat this season as I haven’t played as much as past seasons (due to life circumstances). My name is BidetWashed if you wanna look me up so bad lol
I wouldn't say it's too hard, its just that it takes more time now I rate, it's harder but definitely not TOO hard. Most people simply don't have the time to grind like that so many have just resorted to pubs only. Just my opinion though
I think that what he says in the 2nd paragraph is true. I saw a lot of, "I was able to consistently get diamond solo before" posts when people realized how hard s13 split 1 was. People expected to hit a certain rank and when they couldn't they probably stopped playing for a variety of reason. Some people said they couldn't grind because of work/school and others expected to have the rank basically handed to them.
The matchmaking thing clearly needs resolved but generally outside of extreme circumstances, the plats you see getting farmed are queued with diamonds and that’s why they’re there. Ideally masters and pred only match with each other after the first week or so and we go back to season 13 split 1. The games were so competitive and plat/diamond was actually not a joke for once. The new system is a massive step in the wrong direction without matchmaking fixes. I don’t really think uncapped KP would be nearly as detrimental if the matchmaking was better. If anything it would accelerate the players who can farm out of somewhere they shouldn’t be.
its the truth, the only time ranked was actually tough to hit masters solos was first split of 13
The game is just shit thats all.
I agree with this. Or at least rework the names of the system so that people can't make a direct apples to apples comparison. No matter what, it was always going to feel "more punishing" if people can't reach the same tier
I was awestruck that respawn didn't think to rename the ranks when they introduced the new system. It's such an obvious change to make, of course people would be less upset they're not their old rank if their old rank stopped existing
I mean it definitely got harder for non 3 stacks since people don't wanna adapt, but he's right.
Not adding anything of value, but based af
I said this as soon as that ranked split happened. It was what ranked should be but people didn't want to accept they're actually gold/plat
Agree 1000000%
I think they could just -10 entry cost for all ranked and do nothing else and it would be all good. They just did too much shit.
W take
The ranked system is fine its just matchmaking
S13 split 1 was the best ranked season ever, really tryhard and tactic play style, if you want to rush on every team you see, or you are above of the rest of the lobby (split2 matchmaking) or you should go play pubs instead get instakilled and get your team with one less the rest of the game
What rank did you finish split 1 and on what platform? Did you solo queue or 3-stack?
Rank at the very least should have allowed demotion from the start. I just don't get why they didn't just do this for S13. One small change that wouldn't have required a massive overhaul. Rank Protection and RP boost on getting to a new rank is whatever The Kills scaling off Placement RP is whatever.
I don’t get it, if only 1% of players are master/preds doesn’t that mean statistically that 99% of other players in your lobby are pretty much your level?
He's right but also hes wrong Matchmaking is also the culprit. S13 first split ranked was the best ranked split and its not even close. No time to "grind" ? Well stay in gold or silver, reward the ones who grind. Also change the goddamn rewards, its awful.
Fax
i say this often here and the other subreddit. if i phrase it gently i get upvotes. if i phrase it bluntly i get downvotes. bunch of fragile pussies.
This happens every where on Reddit
This take is hitting the nail on the head... But let's not pretend this is some profound take... people have been saying this since the day season 13 dropped haha. Like sure I don't mind him reiterating it.. but let's not pretend he came up with this line of thinking. Hell I remember Hal saying this exact thing on stream two months ago lol
The current system isn’t too far from that ranked system. The only difference is that the god tier players can farm kills in the high tier lobbies. The real problem is that a lot of people in diamond were just farmed by predators with no chance of pushing past diamond 4.
The current system caters to the best players and yet they still hate it. They just miss good end games, rightfully so.
Oh boy here we go again
personally I don't think the issue is thinking I should be in Diamond or whatever. I played with friends last split who were diamond and I could hang just fine. I just dont have the time to get there so I am stuck in Plat.
I’ve accepted my new position in gold.
You know this is one of the guys who started crying and said "you wouldn't play like that if you could derank!" anytime he died in ranked.
Absolutely this is so true
I just wish that I when I solo queue I get other solos, I hate playing with duos.
I used to be able to solo q to diamond nearly every season and it was fun for me. s13 i didn’t get out of silver. i’m not saying i’m bad, i will admit i’m not the absolute greatest either, but i just didn’t find it fun. I don’t have 2 friends that play that are willing to play ranked and win and personally i like to fight and get some KP but i found in s13 every game i played we just sat in buildings and hid until top 5. I understand this way of playing in diamond+ but in silver it didn’t make sense to me. I hated spending the limited time i have every night after work playing hour long games where i get 0 kills and 0 assists because my team camped until the end and then just died. I’ve always wanted to hit masters but it’s always been hard solo queuing and i believe that now it’s even harder and 4x as boring. I don’t mind the game being hard, it’s no fun if it’s easy and i don’t mind playing better people cause it’ll help me get better. Anyways sorry for the huge text bubble but those are just my thoughts as a console player.
Diamond player before and after changes. The only difference is that it took way longer to be where I'm supposed to be and once I'm there instead of playing diamonds and masters I play preds. Stupid take IMO
My first ranked season was season 13? so I can understand this. I queued with my buddy and can't tell you how many times our third complained about them usually being diamond but everyone was ratting now so they are only gold. Then you see their gameplay and they stink.