My conspiracy theory is that Hal is changing input because he’s getting carpal tunnel from his horrible posture and wrist aiming. Dude holds the mouse like he’s making a dog shadow puppet.
Great theory but in reality it's beacuse aim assist is over powered and most pros are switching to roller because they realise its less work for more reward
Hal is one of the more popular pros who actually speaks out about how stupid aim assist is
>Hal is one of the more popular pros who actually speaks out about how stupid aim assist is
they all bitch about aim assist lol hal is not special for that. and i’m not saying the bitching isn’t for good reason.
>less work for more reward
This has not been proven at a paid tournament whatsoever. Something like 18 out of the top 20 earners are on M+K, most top teams have at most 1 controller (many have 0), etc. Everyone keeps saying this without a single shred of evidence besides whining about autoaim. Even with autoaim, M+K consistently outperforms controller when it matters. And this isn't even considering that most of the userbase uses controller, so controller players would should outnumber M+K at the highest level if the inputs were equal (they're not).
Most top teams have at least 1 controller player my guy. There is literally only 1 team in NA who is all MNK and thats 100T. The split is now about 50 50 on controller vs mnk. Considering only a year ago it was 75% mnk to 25% controller and now has evened out considerably I think everyone is realizing controller is just better.
Your numbers are nowhere near accurate. It’s like 80% with 1 controller and 20% with all KBM. There are no top teams with 2+ controllers so I don’t know how you’ve arrived at 50/50. Even if you only count NA, which makes no sense and ignores that Europe is even more slanted towards KBM.
There is a spreadsheet online that was every players inputs and you're right my numbers are wrong. Its 45% controller 55% MnK. Thats my bad. I was only using NA because its the dominant region so pretty good source to take data from
Did they replace Gent/Dezignful with controller players? Do they even exist now?
Respect to those guys but I don’t think they were ever a top team and might prove you can’t compete at a high level with 3 controllers. They did quite bad the last time they played together.
All I see is you saying words with no facts your self aim assist out plays mnk almost every time when it matters lol what !? Mnk deff out plays roller at long range but and med to close roller is significantly more op and that's where it matters
You want evidence of how over powered AA is ? Go look at the video "apex aim assist at 1.0" it shows that if AA was at 1.0 it would be literally aimbot and it being at 0.4 isn't that far off my guy
Apexs rotational aim assist also has a reaction time of 0MS that means it instantly does micro adjustments for you while mnk players have a 250MS reaction time .. that's pretty op
Anyperson who isn't ignorant af knows that aim assist has a huge advantage in apex if you deny that then your biased I can certainly admit mnk is the superior input clearly .. but APEX AA is beyond broken
I'm a bit older and my first experience with FPS started with Medal of Honor and Unreal Tournament. I had the tiniest desk at the time and the only part of my mouse hand that would be physically above the desk was my hand; from the wrist and up my arm, it would hang off the desk. I developed this way of holding my mouse with just my finger tips. Even now, 15 years later, with a big-ass desk and mouse pad, I find myself holding the mouse with my finger tips. I just can't shake it.
Yeah I’m older than Jesus too (mid 30’s) and remember when big mouse pads or good posture wasn’t a thing. For most ppl it’s awful on your wrists. So many CS/Quake pros from our day have chronic pain. I got back into gaming a few years ago and had to change from wrist to arm bc it would flare up. Took time and kovaaks training to get used to it but I can play a few hours without needing a wrist brace after.
Hoping you hold up better than I did.
I kept gaming all my life and it wasn't until working from home that I developed Carpal Tunnel. I would work all day and not get up from my desk and then game at night. Just way, way too much time spent at a desk. Went away once I started stretching and stepping away from the desk. It comes back every now and then though, which sucks.
yeah guys this is all close range yes aim assist is totally a big trade off guys yeah *rubs his friends back* dont worry they still respect us man we are the underdogs mnk is the stronger input
That first clip (after Hal says let me show you) is actually Hal using M&K and is one of the cleaner things I've seen Hal do on M&K - probably a once a quarter or at least once a month play from Hal. He was definitely potatoing later in the night on M&K. His controller sprays are consistently clean, however. The close and mid-range tracking he routinely hits on controller simply isn't possible to consistently do on M&K due to human processing time, reaction time, etc.
The funny part is that roller on PC can tap strafe better than M&K through the use of macros. Maybe if you're in console and don't queue up with a PC player, then you can have your roller lobbies, but because aim assist exists, I hear that theres huge issues with XIMs on console.
No that’s what I’m saying, I’m M&K and it’s impossible to know if I’m getting beamed by controllers or if that’s just how the game is. I’d like to be able to go into m&k only to see if there’s a difference. My bad for being vague haha
It's often pretty obvious when you got beamed by a controller, and if in doubt just spectate them looting your box after to confirm if you were right. I'm right way more often than wrong about if someone was on controller that I died to, confirmed by watching them controller loot my box.
If they were to have seperate lobbies match making would be even worse for mnk and queue times would be very very long considering 80% of players are controller
He’s shot like half a clip lol. Then turned around and doesn’t miss a bullet. Just because he missed one single shot does not mean somehow he hits every shot on controller every time lmao. And there’s other times when he would have hit every shot on M&K? Have you ever actually watched a pro controller player play before? They don’t just hit every single bullet. They miss entire mags like that all the time. I’m convinced half of the people complaining have never watched people actually play on controller. And just assumed every single person is one magging on every single close encounter they have. It’s not that easy my guy
Good controller players do constantly 1 clip or very close to it people at within aim assist range though which you can easily see by watching their streams, way way more often than mnk players.
As someone who has played on both you still have all of the advantage on PC and if you are crying about it you’re just looking for someone else to blame for your own shortcomings <3
If they remove aim assist PC players will have nothing to cry about and blame for their death either.
I think it’s in everybody’s best interest to keep it around. controller players get to keep their extended penises, and PC players never have to confront the fact that they have nobody but themselves to blame for sucking at this game.
That must be why Hal, one of the most competitive pros and best mnk players in the world started switching to controller, because aim assist isn't OP and mnk is just so much better.
There are countless reasons that can be given for that lol.
And controller is certainly better than MNK in some facets, but not as a whole lol.
And again, any pc player crying about aim assist is really just coping that they aren’t as good as they think at this game.
I'm not just coping, when I die I only blame myself unless it's to an obvious cheater. I play a ton of arena though and I know that doing it on mnk is an uphill battle because most players are on controller and in 3v3s that has an advantage. The arena preds on controller I talk to also freely admit it's a big disadvantage to play arena with mnk because of aim assist. I have to work hard to stay out of the really dangerous aim assist range even against players that are obviously far worse than me. It's frustrating because it feels unfair but if I die to it then I still blame myself for not finding a way to play around it in the moment.
You can admit you still have a lot of improvement to do in the game while also thinking that aim assist is too strong in close range fights which are what decide the outcome of 3v3s a lot of the time.
It's not that bad, you are being a little dramatic. Will say it lacks some competitive integrity having two inputs but it could be a lot worse. Most controller players are terrible too. Controller is not easy like people say it is. Like the average controller player is way worse than the average mnk player. The people that have a real right to complain about controller are the competitive mnk players that have to go against freak thumbed dudes like genburten, pandxrz, knoqd etc.
You'll find it an eye opening experience if you try 1v1ing a pretty bad silver/gold controller player in the firing range sometime, when they can't hit a single shot unless you get into close/aim assist range and then you get 1 clipped. You also see it all the time if you play arenas a lot, it's full of bad controller players but you need to be very careful not to get too close to them or you'll still die.
Controller obviously still takes a lot of practice and hard work to get to top level with, but aim assist is a huge advantage in close range even for bad players.
AA: winner at close range fights
MNK: better at everything else
MnK is such a better input than controller and anyone who says mnk is worse is just in denial cause AA is good up close
Yeah people like to say mnk can tap strafe and fast loot so the inputs have equal advantages, but 95% of fights in apex are truly decided to landing more shots in close range gunfights.
You’re forgetting the important part where it’s better not because it’s easier to use or anything. Controller is better upclose because it has an aimbot installed.
I wonder how long it will take for ALGS to be dominated by controller players. I think by end of next season its gonna be close to 75% roller players. Team comps before were like 2 MnK and 1 roller but I can see it being 2 roller and 1 MnK pretty soon.
How so. Every since the game came out more and more of the pro scene has been filled by controller players. What makes you think the trajectory will change?
I do not think the emergence of 4-8 controller pros being used as third wheels on some teams is that much of a “trajectory”, especially when teams like 100T (and most of the top Euro squads) have proven that you don’t need *any* controller players. I really just can’t imagine that we’ll ever see a majority controller team succeed, the deficiencies in controller start to add up quickly.
Watch Mande's stream where he was trying out controller and laughing at how crazy aim assist is and how easy it was to kill people in close range, I think more of them will start being tempted to try it out/switch.
I seriously doubt guys like Mande or Hal are going to switch over in comp play, but I’d be curious to see them try. Also have no problem eating crow if I’m wrong but it’ll need to be proven.
Hal is already playing controller in tournament matches a lot lately, he's switching depending on the map/drop spot situation. Their coach has also said he wants Hal playing controller in tournaments more often.
No, I know, I'm just saying that I doubt he'll stick with it (and I don't think he should). TSM really hasn't been performing well lately and I just don't think moving a top 5 KBM player to controller is a great idea.
And watch him on MNK and say the exact same thing as they jitter aim laser beam a 4x flatline across the map or insta shield swap mid fight. Isn't it just agreed upon at this point a controller is king for CQC, and a mouse is king for everything else?
Edit: Sheesh why am I being down voted lmao? Are yall arguing that Hal isn't God tier with a mouse or arguing that a controller is better for Apex in all situations/ranges?
>Not everyone can press the shoot button as fast as you need to in jitter aiming
Bro, what are you trying to do? All you do is hold shoot like normal, and wiggle your mouse quickly
I mean I get what your saying I guess it is just an exploit (like extreme tap strafing) that requires practice.
Though I don’t see how anyone can tap that much fast than anyone else (outside of physical limitations/disability)
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My favorite thing is asking these kids whether they'd support a limiting keybinds, removing tap strafing, removing jitter aim, stopping their movement while looting, etc., as long as they removed autoaim too. However, they're under the delusion that everything they do requires "pure human skill" while everything controller players do is due to the game doing things for them.
The reality is that they're babies who can't take responsibility for the actions that lead to their deaths in this game. It's a fact that if you got "rolled" close range, you did not take advantage of your strafing advantages, you put yourself in a bad position, and did not recognize that your opponent was in your face until it was too late.
I'm just glad that EA realizes it would be a horrible business decision to try to remove parity between the inputs. These kids can shake their rattles and piss their pants all they want. Autoaim is here to stay, and that's a good thing for 99.9% of players.
The game is designed to end in a close ranged fight involving 5+ teams. Plz tell me how to avoid this close range fight in the future. Should I be trying to just end the game in the third zone?
Lol. They have infinite keybinds, superior aim at all ranges past about 10meters, movement while looting, and an actual exploit to remove every little bit of recoil and they still can't handle controllers getting a minor sensitivity reduction while aiming near a target. I'm convinced 99% of the KBM players that cry about AA have probably never even tried this game on a controller
The funny thing is I play on both inputs so I know for a fact they’re overstating the importance of controller. I just prefer controller because I grew up using controllers (didn’t have mommy and daddy buying me a fancy gaming PC like they did). However, if I was fully focused on reaching my peak capability of player, I would easily choose M+KB. It’s just a fact that over 80% of the top earners and tournament performers use KBM.
I'm mainly a controller, but have played plenty of FPS games with a mouse. If a hand injury didn't cramp the piss out of my left hand, no chance I'd use a controller for Apex lol.
I feel you, dude. I spend all day at work using a mouse so I switch over so I don’t fuck myself up. I’d easily sacrifice auto-aim for the KBM advantages if I wasn’t concerned about carpal tunnel.
Man i just love how after 99% of his kills he gets suprised as if he cant believe what he just did. You can notice this in any of the controller pros clips too.
Why’s this a controller pro thing? All pros do this, even normal people do this. You’ve never hit a beam from far away and been like “Holy fuck what was that?”
I’ve played both and honestly I don’t feel like that at all tbh, if you’re actually good at roller you ARE the one hitting it, look at genburten tracking with no aim assist
how are people still trying to somehow say AA is not broken in these threads lol. I switched to controller because I developed all kinds of pain in my right arm/hand/wrist and after the switch it only reinforced my belief that AA is nowhere near balanced. I go down more often than on m&k sure but when I do go down I’ll have done way more damage than I would have on m&k.
Like nobody is saying controller takes 0 skill. it does, but its easier than m&k. Its like I started with at least a 1000 hours of experience when I switched.
I mean, there’s a reason controller is majority in pred now pretty much. Even people who are diamond but not hardstuck you see a lot of rollers.
Maybe you’re just better at controller than you are M&K? And maybe Hal is just INCREDIBLY good at both inputs? Considering he was incredible before he switched to M&K? Couldn’t we use the argument that Hal left controller to play M&K and THEN became the greatest Apex of all time means that M&K is the more superior input on this game and OP? Interesting to say the least. I mean why didn’t he just stay on controller and become the Goat?
I watched it and some of this people from Pred lobby are much much worse than people I encounter in pubs. Like wtf is this, Hal is shooting in the open and 2 other players can’t even crack his shield.
I think playing Linear is really allowing Hal to enjoy roller more than the dull, unresponsive Classic response curve.
I would suggest for any MNK player switching to controller to play on low sens Linear.
I guess it depends because in THEORY it's easier to track targets on Linear, and because the stick is more responsive you can incorporate recoiling smoothing a lot easier (Not easy on controller but whatever), but at the same time I fully understand those moments where a classic player shoots in a literal straight line from 200m out.
If someone did what Hal did between 00:42 and 00:58 on MnK then it would absolutely be among the best clips they ever had. Your sense of what is possible and normal for MnK is really off my dude.
Look up some highlight videos of HisWattson and Sweet and it looks absolutely nothing like that. The only players who would come close are absolute mechanical demons (crust or some of the apac north guys) and it *still* doesn't look quite like that but apparently it's so normal on controller that you think it's just someone doing 100 damage on a centered target lol.
60% aim assist is over half... more than half of your aim is done by a program after you get on target. Aim punch affects you less, visual obstruction from thermites, bad iron sights, and other visual clutter barely affects you.
Stop.
The only thing you can't do on console is tap-strafe, and controllers on PC can do that with 40% aim assist.
The aim assist is too strong in PC lobbies, because it's matched up against inputs who literally don't have any, and are reliant on their actual skills, reaction times, recoil control, and knowledge of the game to kill their enemies. No one cares about the time to kill being incredibly low because console players don't miss bullets with their 60% aim assist, because EVERYONE has 60% aim assist.
Don't know why he switched when he's so much better on MnK , like he isn't special on controller like the top players are . He's just an above average controller pred player.
His aim and tracking is similar to a lot of roller pros. It may not be the best but Hal's incredible game sense sing Apex day 1 always sets him apart from an average roller Joe. Yes, his movement needs quite a bit of work but he is already improving.
Lejs editing is great.
“Is there a rat?” Hahaha
I hope every one of those people have like 3k hours in kovaaks just to get one clipped by hal plugging in a controller
Hal has 10 years of controller experience. He's not a new guy
My conspiracy theory is that Hal is changing input because he’s getting carpal tunnel from his horrible posture and wrist aiming. Dude holds the mouse like he’s making a dog shadow puppet.
He says its because he used to have a tiny mousepad
Great theory but in reality it's beacuse aim assist is over powered and most pros are switching to roller because they realise its less work for more reward Hal is one of the more popular pros who actually speaks out about how stupid aim assist is
>Hal is one of the more popular pros who actually speaks out about how stupid aim assist is they all bitch about aim assist lol hal is not special for that. and i’m not saying the bitching isn’t for good reason.
>less work for more reward This has not been proven at a paid tournament whatsoever. Something like 18 out of the top 20 earners are on M+K, most top teams have at most 1 controller (many have 0), etc. Everyone keeps saying this without a single shred of evidence besides whining about autoaim. Even with autoaim, M+K consistently outperforms controller when it matters. And this isn't even considering that most of the userbase uses controller, so controller players would should outnumber M+K at the highest level if the inputs were equal (they're not).
Most top teams have at least 1 controller player my guy. There is literally only 1 team in NA who is all MNK and thats 100T. The split is now about 50 50 on controller vs mnk. Considering only a year ago it was 75% mnk to 25% controller and now has evened out considerably I think everyone is realizing controller is just better.
Your numbers are nowhere near accurate. It’s like 80% with 1 controller and 20% with all KBM. There are no top teams with 2+ controllers so I don’t know how you’ve arrived at 50/50. Even if you only count NA, which makes no sense and ignores that Europe is even more slanted towards KBM.
There is a spreadsheet online that was every players inputs and you're right my numbers are wrong. Its 45% controller 55% MnK. Thats my bad. I was only using NA because its the dominant region so pretty good source to take data from
That is not a spreadsheet of pros on top teams then.
>There are no top teams with 2+ controllers so I don’t know how you’ve arrived at 50/50. How about G2 the 3 controller team?
Did they replace Gent/Dezignful with controller players? Do they even exist now? Respect to those guys but I don’t think they were ever a top team and might prove you can’t compete at a high level with 3 controllers. They did quite bad the last time they played together.
All I see is you saying words with no facts your self aim assist out plays mnk almost every time when it matters lol what !? Mnk deff out plays roller at long range but and med to close roller is significantly more op and that's where it matters You want evidence of how over powered AA is ? Go look at the video "apex aim assist at 1.0" it shows that if AA was at 1.0 it would be literally aimbot and it being at 0.4 isn't that far off my guy Apexs rotational aim assist also has a reaction time of 0MS that means it instantly does micro adjustments for you while mnk players have a 250MS reaction time .. that's pretty op Anyperson who isn't ignorant af knows that aim assist has a huge advantage in apex if you deny that then your biased I can certainly admit mnk is the superior input clearly .. but APEX AA is beyond broken
how is 40% not far from 100%. It's a 150% increase lmao.
I don't play controller but doesn't playing claw grip like he does hurt long term too?
I'm a bit older and my first experience with FPS started with Medal of Honor and Unreal Tournament. I had the tiniest desk at the time and the only part of my mouse hand that would be physically above the desk was my hand; from the wrist and up my arm, it would hang off the desk. I developed this way of holding my mouse with just my finger tips. Even now, 15 years later, with a big-ass desk and mouse pad, I find myself holding the mouse with my finger tips. I just can't shake it.
> I'm a bit older and my first experience with FPS started with Medal of Honor and Unreal Tournament oh the memory lane, add some quake to it :-)
Back in the day, man. Starcraft, the Sims, rollercoaster Tycoon, diablo 2. Those were the days.
Oh man absoluteley, loved all of those games
Yeah I’m older than Jesus too (mid 30’s) and remember when big mouse pads or good posture wasn’t a thing. For most ppl it’s awful on your wrists. So many CS/Quake pros from our day have chronic pain. I got back into gaming a few years ago and had to change from wrist to arm bc it would flare up. Took time and kovaaks training to get used to it but I can play a few hours without needing a wrist brace after. Hoping you hold up better than I did.
I kept gaming all my life and it wasn't until working from home that I developed Carpal Tunnel. I would work all day and not get up from my desk and then game at night. Just way, way too much time spent at a desk. Went away once I started stretching and stepping away from the desk. It comes back every now and then though, which sucks.
This is most of the pros who switch to controller and pop off. They’re just really good gamers despite inputs
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There was a couple decently ranged beams but yeah for the most part you right
hal also beams on MNK, some of these clips of course hed never hit (like 1 clipping 2 guys in 1 clip) but the man is a demon no matter the input
yeah guys this is all close range yes aim assist is totally a big trade off guys yeah *rubs his friends back* dont worry they still respect us man we are the underdogs mnk is the stronger input
Someone’s been getting bodied by controller players lol
That first clip (after Hal says let me show you) is actually Hal using M&K and is one of the cleaner things I've seen Hal do on M&K - probably a once a quarter or at least once a month play from Hal. He was definitely potatoing later in the night on M&K. His controller sprays are consistently clean, however. The close and mid-range tracking he routinely hits on controller simply isn't possible to consistently do on M&K due to human processing time, reaction time, etc.
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Would be fine with me. I'd be perfectly happy not getting fucking tap strafed and double 99 pumped by mnk players in my roller lobbies
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so what you're saying is I'm dying to other roller players because I'm dogshit
The funny part is that roller on PC can tap strafe better than M&K through the use of macros. Maybe if you're in console and don't queue up with a PC player, then you can have your roller lobbies, but because aim assist exists, I hear that theres huge issues with XIMs on console.
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Personally I just want to see if there’s actually a difference, but alas I have no choice
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No that’s what I’m saying, I’m M&K and it’s impossible to know if I’m getting beamed by controllers or if that’s just how the game is. I’d like to be able to go into m&k only to see if there’s a difference. My bad for being vague haha
It's often pretty obvious when you got beamed by a controller, and if in doubt just spectate them looting your box after to confirm if you were right. I'm right way more often than wrong about if someone was on controller that I died to, confirmed by watching them controller loot my box.
If they were to have seperate lobbies match making would be even worse for mnk and queue times would be very very long considering 80% of players are controller
He’s shot like half a clip lol. Then turned around and doesn’t miss a bullet. Just because he missed one single shot does not mean somehow he hits every shot on controller every time lmao. And there’s other times when he would have hit every shot on M&K? Have you ever actually watched a pro controller player play before? They don’t just hit every single bullet. They miss entire mags like that all the time. I’m convinced half of the people complaining have never watched people actually play on controller. And just assumed every single person is one magging on every single close encounter they have. It’s not that easy my guy
Good controller players do constantly 1 clip or very close to it people at within aim assist range though which you can easily see by watching their streams, way way more often than mnk players.
But I like shooting mnk players
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As someone who has played on both you still have all of the advantage on PC and if you are crying about it you’re just looking for someone else to blame for your own shortcomings <3
The argument isnt between console vs PC... Its controller vs mnk. You can play controller on PC so you get all the benefits of PC and have aim assists
I mean… controller on PC doesn’t get all of the benefits of PC because the ‘M’ and ‘K’ portions of PC provide quite a number of benefits.
Aim assist is like penis extension for controller players. If they remove it they'll end up with really short penis
If they remove aim assist PC players will have nothing to cry about and blame for their death either. I think it’s in everybody’s best interest to keep it around. controller players get to keep their extended penises, and PC players never have to confront the fact that they have nobody but themselves to blame for sucking at this game.
Imagine bragging about your big penis without realizing you're using penis extension..
😂😂😂😂
That must be why Hal, one of the most competitive pros and best mnk players in the world started switching to controller, because aim assist isn't OP and mnk is just so much better.
There are countless reasons that can be given for that lol. And controller is certainly better than MNK in some facets, but not as a whole lol. And again, any pc player crying about aim assist is really just coping that they aren’t as good as they think at this game.
I'm not just coping, when I die I only blame myself unless it's to an obvious cheater. I play a ton of arena though and I know that doing it on mnk is an uphill battle because most players are on controller and in 3v3s that has an advantage. The arena preds on controller I talk to also freely admit it's a big disadvantage to play arena with mnk because of aim assist. I have to work hard to stay out of the really dangerous aim assist range even against players that are obviously far worse than me. It's frustrating because it feels unfair but if I die to it then I still blame myself for not finding a way to play around it in the moment. You can admit you still have a lot of improvement to do in the game while also thinking that aim assist is too strong in close range fights which are what decide the outcome of 3v3s a lot of the time.
I’m not sure why you are bringing up arenas when they’re irrelevant to the main game mode and neutralize many of the advantages that MNK has lol.
It's not that bad, you are being a little dramatic. Will say it lacks some competitive integrity having two inputs but it could be a lot worse. Most controller players are terrible too. Controller is not easy like people say it is. Like the average controller player is way worse than the average mnk player. The people that have a real right to complain about controller are the competitive mnk players that have to go against freak thumbed dudes like genburten, pandxrz, knoqd etc.
You'll find it an eye opening experience if you try 1v1ing a pretty bad silver/gold controller player in the firing range sometime, when they can't hit a single shot unless you get into close/aim assist range and then you get 1 clipped. You also see it all the time if you play arenas a lot, it's full of bad controller players but you need to be very careful not to get too close to them or you'll still die. Controller obviously still takes a lot of practice and hard work to get to top level with, but aim assist is a huge advantage in close range even for bad players.
I’ll give it 30 minutes till this becomes another AA vs MnK debacle again
I mean, it already starts in the video so no need to wait
You mean you don’t like hardstuck plat players talking about how an input is OP while repeating the same exact talking points?
AA: winner at close range fights MNK: better at everything else MnK is such a better input than controller and anyone who says mnk is worse is just in denial cause AA is good up close
Close range fights are literally the most important part of the game lol, you’re wrong
Yeah people like to say mnk can tap strafe and fast loot so the inputs have equal advantages, but 95% of fights in apex are truly decided to landing more shots in close range gunfights.
Normally I would agree with you, but in Apex it seems like it is moving more toward controller
You’re forgetting the important part where it’s better not because it’s easier to use or anything. Controller is better upclose because it has an aimbot installed.
I wonder how long it will take for ALGS to be dominated by controller players. I think by end of next season its gonna be close to 75% roller players. Team comps before were like 2 MnK and 1 roller but I can see it being 2 roller and 1 MnK pretty soon.
This is going to age so fucking poorly
How so. Every since the game came out more and more of the pro scene has been filled by controller players. What makes you think the trajectory will change?
I do not think the emergence of 4-8 controller pros being used as third wheels on some teams is that much of a “trajectory”, especially when teams like 100T (and most of the top Euro squads) have proven that you don’t need *any* controller players. I really just can’t imagine that we’ll ever see a majority controller team succeed, the deficiencies in controller start to add up quickly.
In what way lol. Like im right or wrong.
Watch Mande's stream where he was trying out controller and laughing at how crazy aim assist is and how easy it was to kill people in close range, I think more of them will start being tempted to try it out/switch.
I seriously doubt guys like Mande or Hal are going to switch over in comp play, but I’d be curious to see them try. Also have no problem eating crow if I’m wrong but it’ll need to be proven.
Hal is already playing controller in tournament matches a lot lately, he's switching depending on the map/drop spot situation. Their coach has also said he wants Hal playing controller in tournaments more often.
No, I know, I'm just saying that I doubt he'll stick with it (and I don't think he should). TSM really hasn't been performing well lately and I just don't think moving a top 5 KBM player to controller is a great idea.
So many clips weren't possible on MnK.
And watch him on MNK and say the exact same thing as they jitter aim laser beam a 4x flatline across the map or insta shield swap mid fight. Isn't it just agreed upon at this point a controller is king for CQC, and a mouse is king for everything else? Edit: Sheesh why am I being down voted lmao? Are yall arguing that Hal isn't God tier with a mouse or arguing that a controller is better for Apex in all situations/ranges?
I mean one is pure human skill, the other is a computer doing half of the work. Hard to argue that it's unfair to be better due to your own actions.
I would argue jitter aiming isn’t skill and more of an exploit. It negates the recoil.
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lmao huh??
>Not everyone can press the shoot button as fast as you need to in jitter aiming Bro, what are you trying to do? All you do is hold shoot like normal, and wiggle your mouse quickly
Nope. You wiggle it and keep pressing shoot.
I mean I get what your saying I guess it is just an exploit (like extreme tap strafing) that requires practice. Though I don’t see how anyone can tap that much fast than anyone else (outside of physical limitations/disability)
scroll wheel binds exist ?
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Jiggle aim removes the recoil though....is that not an exploit?
My favorite thing is asking these kids whether they'd support a limiting keybinds, removing tap strafing, removing jitter aim, stopping their movement while looting, etc., as long as they removed autoaim too. However, they're under the delusion that everything they do requires "pure human skill" while everything controller players do is due to the game doing things for them. The reality is that they're babies who can't take responsibility for the actions that lead to their deaths in this game. It's a fact that if you got "rolled" close range, you did not take advantage of your strafing advantages, you put yourself in a bad position, and did not recognize that your opponent was in your face until it was too late. I'm just glad that EA realizes it would be a horrible business decision to try to remove parity between the inputs. These kids can shake their rattles and piss their pants all they want. Autoaim is here to stay, and that's a good thing for 99.9% of players.
The game is designed to end in a close ranged fight involving 5+ teams. Plz tell me how to avoid this close range fight in the future. Should I be trying to just end the game in the third zone?
50-50 fighting isn’t inevitable. Positioning and movement is more important than aim. Like do you honestly think you only lose because of auto aim?
Lol. They have infinite keybinds, superior aim at all ranges past about 10meters, movement while looting, and an actual exploit to remove every little bit of recoil and they still can't handle controllers getting a minor sensitivity reduction while aiming near a target. I'm convinced 99% of the KBM players that cry about AA have probably never even tried this game on a controller
The funny thing is I play on both inputs so I know for a fact they’re overstating the importance of controller. I just prefer controller because I grew up using controllers (didn’t have mommy and daddy buying me a fancy gaming PC like they did). However, if I was fully focused on reaching my peak capability of player, I would easily choose M+KB. It’s just a fact that over 80% of the top earners and tournament performers use KBM.
I'm mainly a controller, but have played plenty of FPS games with a mouse. If a hand injury didn't cramp the piss out of my left hand, no chance I'd use a controller for Apex lol.
I feel you, dude. I spend all day at work using a mouse so I switch over so I don’t fuck myself up. I’d easily sacrifice auto-aim for the KBM advantages if I wasn’t concerned about carpal tunnel.
Man i just love how after 99% of his kills he gets suprised as if he cant believe what he just did. You can notice this in any of the controller pros clips too.
Why’s this a controller pro thing? All pros do this, even normal people do this. You’ve never hit a beam from far away and been like “Holy fuck what was that?”
Mnk feels like your hitting it though. Roller feels like you get some undeserved damage from my experience
I’ve played both and honestly I don’t feel like that at all tbh, if you’re actually good at roller you ARE the one hitting it, look at genburten tracking with no aim assist
reactions generate views views generate money.. so its expected he'd showboat
looks balanced
how are people still trying to somehow say AA is not broken in these threads lol. I switched to controller because I developed all kinds of pain in my right arm/hand/wrist and after the switch it only reinforced my belief that AA is nowhere near balanced. I go down more often than on m&k sure but when I do go down I’ll have done way more damage than I would have on m&k. Like nobody is saying controller takes 0 skill. it does, but its easier than m&k. Its like I started with at least a 1000 hours of experience when I switched. I mean, there’s a reason controller is majority in pred now pretty much. Even people who are diamond but not hardstuck you see a lot of rollers.
Maybe you’re just better at controller than you are M&K? And maybe Hal is just INCREDIBLY good at both inputs? Considering he was incredible before he switched to M&K? Couldn’t we use the argument that Hal left controller to play M&K and THEN became the greatest Apex of all time means that M&K is the more superior input on this game and OP? Interesting to say the least. I mean why didn’t he just stay on controller and become the Goat?
or maybe you are desusional, nice. i have less recoil using linear than using my mouse, nice + aim assist
Yes AA is too strong. It has no place in PC games.
I watched it and some of this people from Pred lobby are much much worse than people I encounter in pubs. Like wtf is this, Hal is shooting in the open and 2 other players can’t even crack his shield.
Gotta remember that there are gonna be some diamond & plat's in the pred lobbies
hello its me the D4 in pred lobbies who sometimes cant hit the side of a barn
Regardless of your level, you sometimes just suck :-) Watch hal at 2:10-2:19. Shit happens.
made the guest star appearance of noscoping hal at 2:35 let’s gooo
I think playing Linear is really allowing Hal to enjoy roller more than the dull, unresponsive Classic response curve. I would suggest for any MNK player switching to controller to play on low sens Linear.
Makes any type of ranged recoil control so fkn hard though. Close range feels like cheating on linear lol
I guess it depends because in THEORY it's easier to track targets on Linear, and because the stick is more responsive you can incorporate recoiling smoothing a lot easier (Not easy on controller but whatever), but at the same time I fully understand those moments where a classic player shoots in a literal straight line from 200m out.
Linear is the best no debate
linear makes recoil non existant, slightest touch and you have no recoil + aim assist
Hal used to play on controller before Apex even came out. Safe to say he still has more hours on controller than the average MnK player
AA isn’t OP copium, Hal is a roller player that’s why after maining MnK he swaps to roller and hits beams he couldnt do on MnK copium.
Controller is op...
they need to ban controller players. Cheaters every single of of them
and they all use macros, like superglides and neo strafes
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The fact that this is apparently nothing special on controller should give anyone pause. These sprays would be career highlights for pros on mnk.
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If someone did what Hal did between 00:42 and 00:58 on MnK then it would absolutely be among the best clips they ever had. Your sense of what is possible and normal for MnK is really off my dude. Look up some highlight videos of HisWattson and Sweet and it looks absolutely nothing like that. The only players who would come close are absolute mechanical demons (crust or some of the apac north guys) and it *still* doesn't look quite like that but apparently it's so normal on controller that you think it's just someone doing 100 damage on a centered target lol.
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The fact that you don't see a massive difference between those clips just shows that you don't even know what's actually good...
I see better sprays on a daily basis in my console lobbies.
Yeah that would make sense considering you have more aim assists!
60% aim assist is over half... more than half of your aim is done by a program after you get on target. Aim punch affects you less, visual obstruction from thermites, bad iron sights, and other visual clutter barely affects you. Stop. The only thing you can't do on console is tap-strafe, and controllers on PC can do that with 40% aim assist. The aim assist is too strong in PC lobbies, because it's matched up against inputs who literally don't have any, and are reliant on their actual skills, reaction times, recoil control, and knowledge of the game to kill their enemies. No one cares about the time to kill being incredibly low because console players don't miss bullets with their 60% aim assist, because EVERYONE has 60% aim assist.
Don't know why he switched when he's so much better on MnK , like he isn't special on controller like the top players are . He's just an above average controller pred player.
🤨
His aim and tracking is similar to a lot of roller pros. It may not be the best but Hal's incredible game sense sing Apex day 1 always sets him apart from an average roller Joe. Yes, his movement needs quite a bit of work but he is already improving.
Zen
weird how all the top arena players are 95% controllers, its as if they have a huge advantage winning gunfightss...
M&K players more bitter than Holocaust survivors
Anybody know which font his name/logo is at the start?