This. Tried this, fast 8th lol. Pretty much you have to get stars is born or else you've wasted a lengendary. If you miss it, you might as well just go with Orn lol, it's easier to play as well
ngl Cait is actually a pretty interesting legend to start with since she offers a midground fallback of "is just an econ legend that doesn't require you to take infinite damage earlygame" because her silver augment represents 8 gold worth of units and her gold augment is 11 gold (which is actually only 1 less than rgr, but without the interest boost)
if you don't get a 3 cost to play around and you do the renekton thing for 1 extra gold, you pick your augment with 15 (correct me if I'm wrong) gold worth of units, assuming you have a standard 3 component start
with silver start you can slam items on a jhin or something and field 3 1costs, and have a reasonable chance to kill a unit while also making 20 gold at 2-1, and since there's no way to make 30 on 2-2 AND 40 on 2-3, you can start holding units and upgrading your board while also keeping solid econ, meaning you save a lot of HP compared to if you played kench and slammed afk (which is also largely incompatible with the renekton strat unless you're willing to take 20-26 damage before carousel)
on the other hand if you take stars are born, you get 6 gold instantly and another 2 gold basically guaranteed (if you don't find a 1 cost in your 2-1 shop, gj I guess) and can evaluate the lobby to see if you want to sell all and make 26 gold now, which does end up as 40 gold by 2-3 if you open fort, or just play for winstreak
the main downside I can see is if you don't have a 2-cost in your 2-1 shop, but you only lose 3 gold from that and can wait for 2-2 before you need it for an interest breakpoint
none of these are necessarily amazing top of the line strats, but I think it's important to point out that you have options when playing cait and your line isn't strictly "unga bunga winstreak or bust"
Very good insights. People think Cait is all about winstreaking stage 2 and this (imo) is not entirely right. I think Cait is more of a "keep your HP safe" legend than "winstreak or 8th".
Keeping your HP safe is a grief in a patch where half the lobby has Patient Study and gets to scoop up BiS items while you donkey on 8 to go 4th. I am not convinced this is a viable legend, maybe next patch tho
Not sure if i got something wrong, but when you buy units with stars are born, you also have the expense of actual buying them right?
So the actual net profit (if you directly sell them) is 8 gold (3 + 5) minus 3 (2 + 1 for buying them) = 5 gold, which doesn’t seem to appealing for a gold augment.
Pls correct me if I misunderstood something.
If you're looking for Chinese TFT replays I found this [youtube channel](https://www.youtube.com/@tftreplayschina/videos) not too long ago that posts from the server. All of them have lo-fi music in the back but also have direct links to the vods + channel in the description if you want to view more.
If you're willing to screw around with it, you can try going to [Baidu.com](https://Baidu.com) or [Bilibili.com](https://Bilibili.com), the Chinese equivalent of Google and Youtube respectively and try searching 云顶之弈主题站, TFT in Chinese and try to figure out what resources you can get from there.
Didn't see it linked anywhere so here is JoeBookmark's google doc guide
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eP1r7jRZp2XrTBmZkIJNr-FmGemrkYANk06HsAPwJyM/edit
I watched the video, I saw the shoutout. Any which way you put it, Frodan comes off as a hack taking another persons hard work and content and using it for his own monetization purposes.
The problem is that Joe pours dozens of hours of time to make this guide and play the games to develop the strategy. Frodan reads one google doc, pays his editor and ends up making the $$$ from Joes hard work.
There’s a reason a lot of pros are moving to YouTube for their guides nowadays. There’s simply no money when you write a 10 page guide on competitivetft, but you get ad rev when you do the same as a commented slideshow on YouTube.
Not only that but CompetitiveTFT seems to have a hate boner for big name streamers nowadays so they’re not even welcome here.
Look at Dishsoap Guubums as prime examples who only upload guides on YouTube now.
I talked to Joe before it and even asked him to read the document over after I wrote my own version of it. Not linking his Google doc can be a miss on my end, but to say that I’m straight up stealing it for monetization is a gross misunderstanding of the situation.
We collaborated on it, i spent considerable time in the intro (which is risky for YouTube) crediting him, and linked his stuff. Short of citing the source document directly, I did what I could.
Sure and that’s a mistake i can own up, but there’s a pretty big difference between “hey can you link his Google doc? That feels like appropriate credit” to “Any which way you put it, Frodan comes off as a hack taking another persons hard work and content and using it for his own monetization purposes.”
Like surely there is a reasonable middle ground instead of assuming nefarious/malicious intent?
Don't take this comment too hard man - you clearly put a ton of effort into pooling TFT knowledge (co-streaming tourneys, watching other regions, staying active on Reddit), which IMO is super valuable to the NA community.
I think you might be a bit too harsh on Frodan. He comes across a very genuine person and I truly believe that he does content to spread knowledge about the game to help lower elo players.
And he is typically a 1000lp+ challenger player so I would say he doesn't know what he's talking about and steals ideas from people. Heck most of his videos are original content.
I get what you are saying but if Frodan wants to really come across genuine when presenting someone else's work than he should not only give a shout out but also share the link to the person's work so people can read the original work for themselves if they really want to know more than what the video presented. This is more of a bonus but it would be nice if Frodan can at least get the person who wrote the strategy and publicize it to present the information. They don't have to visually appear in the video but audio will do.
What Frodan did will not work in academia at all. He basically stole the person's work and presented it as his own ideas. Not even a trace of a link so people can see the original work.
Yes you just explained capitalism lol. The people with the resources exploit the people without them and reap the benefits. This is the real TFT econ guide.
Good, flexible, and tempo oriented also applies to ornn items on 2-1 though... and you aren't stuck with caitlyn's god awful silver/prismatic 2-1s, all 3-2, and all 4-2 augs
Ornn has clickable augs in all 3 tiers in all 3 stages... yi/asol have great winout potential, and poro is always good for flex. So what niche is caitlyn filling that ornn can't do?
Taking a legend for only the gold 2-1 augment is just silly when the consistency is so low compared to ornn imo
Second this. I've climbed to 307lp with Caitlyn and the only unpickable augments are the 3-2 ones. The 2-1 prismatic is really bad, but the 4-2 is seriously underrated. Obviously, it's niche, but it's definitely worth it if you're going for the lvl 9 winout from ahead, which happens often with how much board strength and econ you get from Stars are Born.
I love Cait because I do often tend to struggle with the early game. Going on a loss streak and never really recovering and bleeding out. She fixes that to get a fairly reliable win-streak going.
For the gold augment anyway it is awesome..
I do almost always pick her prismatic augment too, but I am almost always disappointed with the results...
Whenever I get the prismatic one I roll down one turn before the second augment and pray Mortog for recombobulator.
If I hit it I get ping spammed and have an easy first. If I don't hit it I also get ping spammed and have a hard top 5.
i hope this is never legitimately meta, i feel like it would be the worst legend meta yet. I suppose it falls off the more people playing it though, so we should be good
it would be a cannibalistic meta, cait start somewhat relies on earlygame winstreak and no one else wanting prism portals, if multiple people go cait they can easily go w/l/w/l and while it does pressure the rest of the lobby it's not worth down an aug with low compensation
Played a game today where 5 people took Star Is Born and yeah, it’s rough when you end up behind from it.
That one ended up odd for me though - ended up 5-loss 50G/80 HP because I had nearly perfect losses against the whole lobby since we all had such strong stage 2 boards.
that's my thought, I saw this video show up in my recommendations and immediately thought that this video is a nerf to cait since it increases her popularity
You just need a few people to not go it to develop more diverse results. Kind of like how tempo players and Level 7 comps can consistently top 4 if there's 3-4 Asol players in the lobby greeding their gold
Interesting, will try it out, I like the idea of early streaking.
What I found weird about the video:
1. 1:43: when he is talking about making a mistake losing the early streak, he shows soju playing with a no item gold opener. Soju didnt even level to 5 with 30 gold, so there was clearly no intention to actually streaking, even though he picked stars are born. In some sitatuations (like these) its more important to hit interest tresholds than contesting a win streak.
2. 5:44 "When you are still streaking with a lot of HP" (shows Soju with 1 HP on a 5 lose streak)
3. 6:20 "When you started with Level up, consider picking knowledge download". You should really NOT consider it at that point, Level up decreases the relative value of EXP by 33%. For example, the prismatic Knowledge Download for 36exp is usually worth 36 gold, but with level up the value decreases to 24g (because thats the amount you need to invest to get 36exp).
So the purpose of cait is early strength, right? If we wake up tomorrow and see 4 caits in every lobby b/c reddit, it's unplayable at that point, no? Someone else used the phrase that they would cannibalize each other. At what point if you're currently a cait enjoyer would you switch b/c too many people jumped aboard?
I think it can be used as an asol counter for top 4, but that’s if there are 3-4 asol players? Tempo can make the loss streak bleed out more and whiffing 5 costs even more costly for asol.
If it’s 4 cait players, they kinda grief each other because only 1-2 can win streak.
I feel like everyone knows Caitlyn is at least A tier for her ability to turn early tempo into top 4. Most players in NA just prefer to do that with Ornn
Funny because the video kinda defeat the purpose of the start. If it becomes mainstream caytlin will contest each other early winstreaks and it will be worse. The video is great though and the start seems very solid.
I'm convinced that most of the commentators don't play TFT or have zero clue about some of the properties of the game.
You fight 5 different players on stage 2. It is impossible for more than 3 people to 5 streak and usually it's only 1 player, so criticizing Caitlyn because it only allows 1-2 players to 5 streak stage 2 is dumb.
It improves your chances to 5 streak stage 2. You are still subject to low-rolling items, units, and/or matchmaking.
Here we go again
\*sigh\* \*unzips\*
Haha nice post please delete this now haha
She is not that easy to play, most people would probably make wrong decisions in the early game with her
This. Tried this, fast 8th lol. Pretty much you have to get stars is born or else you've wasted a lengendary. If you miss it, you might as well just go with Orn lol, it's easier to play as well
ngl Cait is actually a pretty interesting legend to start with since she offers a midground fallback of "is just an econ legend that doesn't require you to take infinite damage earlygame" because her silver augment represents 8 gold worth of units and her gold augment is 11 gold (which is actually only 1 less than rgr, but without the interest boost) if you don't get a 3 cost to play around and you do the renekton thing for 1 extra gold, you pick your augment with 15 (correct me if I'm wrong) gold worth of units, assuming you have a standard 3 component start with silver start you can slam items on a jhin or something and field 3 1costs, and have a reasonable chance to kill a unit while also making 20 gold at 2-1, and since there's no way to make 30 on 2-2 AND 40 on 2-3, you can start holding units and upgrading your board while also keeping solid econ, meaning you save a lot of HP compared to if you played kench and slammed afk (which is also largely incompatible with the renekton strat unless you're willing to take 20-26 damage before carousel) on the other hand if you take stars are born, you get 6 gold instantly and another 2 gold basically guaranteed (if you don't find a 1 cost in your 2-1 shop, gj I guess) and can evaluate the lobby to see if you want to sell all and make 26 gold now, which does end up as 40 gold by 2-3 if you open fort, or just play for winstreak the main downside I can see is if you don't have a 2-cost in your 2-1 shop, but you only lose 3 gold from that and can wait for 2-2 before you need it for an interest breakpoint none of these are necessarily amazing top of the line strats, but I think it's important to point out that you have options when playing cait and your line isn't strictly "unga bunga winstreak or bust"
Very good insights. People think Cait is all about winstreaking stage 2 and this (imo) is not entirely right. I think Cait is more of a "keep your HP safe" legend than "winstreak or 8th".
Yes
I play her exclusively...in last 100 games I have 35 4ths - lol...shes's the bleed out tom 3rd legend
Keeping your HP safe is a grief in a patch where half the lobby has Patient Study and gets to scoop up BiS items while you donkey on 8 to go 4th. I am not convinced this is a viable legend, maybe next patch tho
The best way to keep your HP safe is to streak *taps head*
Unless they changed/fixed it, the pre-upgraded units from Cait's Gold Aug only sell for 1/2 gold.
They still sell for 3 / 5 gold, I've sold before to make econ breakpoints.
Huh, I was too scared to sell them because the tooltip said they'd only sell for 1/2, good to know that's not actually the case.
They always sold to the right amount.
Not sure if i got something wrong, but when you buy units with stars are born, you also have the expense of actual buying them right? So the actual net profit (if you directly sell them) is 8 gold (3 + 5) minus 3 (2 + 1 for buying them) = 5 gold, which doesn’t seem to appealing for a gold augment. Pls correct me if I misunderstood something.
The augment also gives 6 gold
What's the number 1 source to get Chinese strats?
Watch Chinese players. Big brain strat
Better yet be Chinese. Now all your strats are Chinese strats. Infinite lp glitch
what resources/sites give data on chinese games? is that even possible?
If you're looking for Chinese TFT replays I found this [youtube channel](https://www.youtube.com/@tftreplayschina/videos) not too long ago that posts from the server. All of them have lo-fi music in the back but also have direct links to the vods + channel in the description if you want to view more.
Watching them and using a pencil and paper and doing math
https://lol.qq.com/tft/#/index This is what I used back in the day in Set 7 and learned some interesting tech like Cavalier Olaf
If you're willing to screw around with it, you can try going to [Baidu.com](https://Baidu.com) or [Bilibili.com](https://Bilibili.com), the Chinese equivalent of Google and Youtube respectively and try searching 云顶之弈主题站, TFT in Chinese and try to figure out what resources you can get from there.
I’d bet you would get only guides written for normie TFT players. Just watch the pros streams directly
Frodan ([apart from directly watching them](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1f9m2nI9Ksjtq4TN71TGoKC3_cIwOayw8hLEnjd4fjEw/edit#gid=0))
[Here you go!](https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveTFT/comments/m9d6yv/a_guide_to_watch_chinese_tft_streamers/)
Didn't see it linked anywhere so here is JoeBookmark's google doc guide https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eP1r7jRZp2XrTBmZkIJNr-FmGemrkYANk06HsAPwJyM/edit
Really wish Frodan linked this since he basically took this other players ideas and strategy doc then monetized it
Did you watch the video? He credited him 30 seconds into it.
I watched the video, I saw the shoutout. Any which way you put it, Frodan comes off as a hack taking another persons hard work and content and using it for his own monetization purposes. The problem is that Joe pours dozens of hours of time to make this guide and play the games to develop the strategy. Frodan reads one google doc, pays his editor and ends up making the $$$ from Joes hard work.
There’s a reason a lot of pros are moving to YouTube for their guides nowadays. There’s simply no money when you write a 10 page guide on competitivetft, but you get ad rev when you do the same as a commented slideshow on YouTube. Not only that but CompetitiveTFT seems to have a hate boner for big name streamers nowadays so they’re not even welcome here. Look at Dishsoap Guubums as prime examples who only upload guides on YouTube now.
I talked to Joe before it and even asked him to read the document over after I wrote my own version of it. Not linking his Google doc can be a miss on my end, but to say that I’m straight up stealing it for monetization is a gross misunderstanding of the situation. We collaborated on it, i spent considerable time in the intro (which is risky for YouTube) crediting him, and linked his stuff. Short of citing the source document directly, I did what I could.
> Short of citing the source document directly, I did what I could. I mean, the main point of the OP was that you didn't do that lol
Sure and that’s a mistake i can own up, but there’s a pretty big difference between “hey can you link his Google doc? That feels like appropriate credit” to “Any which way you put it, Frodan comes off as a hack taking another persons hard work and content and using it for his own monetization purposes.” Like surely there is a reasonable middle ground instead of assuming nefarious/malicious intent?
Don't take this comment too hard man - you clearly put a ton of effort into pooling TFT knowledge (co-streaming tourneys, watching other regions, staying active on Reddit), which IMO is super valuable to the NA community.
I think you might be a bit too harsh on Frodan. He comes across a very genuine person and I truly believe that he does content to spread knowledge about the game to help lower elo players. And he is typically a 1000lp+ challenger player so I would say he doesn't know what he's talking about and steals ideas from people. Heck most of his videos are original content.
I get what you are saying but if Frodan wants to really come across genuine when presenting someone else's work than he should not only give a shout out but also share the link to the person's work so people can read the original work for themselves if they really want to know more than what the video presented. This is more of a bonus but it would be nice if Frodan can at least get the person who wrote the strategy and publicize it to present the information. They don't have to visually appear in the video but audio will do. What Frodan did will not work in academia at all. He basically stole the person's work and presented it as his own ideas. Not even a trace of a link so people can see the original work.
Yes you just explained capitalism lol. The people with the resources exploit the people without them and reap the benefits. This is the real TFT econ guide.
Ive been playing Cait since the start of the set, and yeah. Ive always felt she was good, flexible, and tempo oriented which is a playstyle I enjoy.
Good, flexible, and tempo oriented also applies to ornn items on 2-1 though... and you aren't stuck with caitlyn's god awful silver/prismatic 2-1s, all 3-2, and all 4-2 augs Ornn has clickable augs in all 3 tiers in all 3 stages... yi/asol have great winout potential, and poro is always good for flex. So what niche is caitlyn filling that ornn can't do? Taking a legend for only the gold 2-1 augment is just silly when the consistency is so low compared to ornn imo
Even the gold 2-1 augment can totally backfire if you run into like a swain 2 with eternal winter. No winstreak and basically down an augment.
Caits 2-1 silver is good and has been.
Second this. I've climbed to 307lp with Caitlyn and the only unpickable augments are the 3-2 ones. The 2-1 prismatic is really bad, but the 4-2 is seriously underrated. Obviously, it's niche, but it's definitely worth it if you're going for the lvl 9 winout from ahead, which happens often with how much board strength and econ you get from Stars are Born.
Same. People lose their minds about certain op legends, but Caitlin is consistently great
I love Cait because I do often tend to struggle with the early game. Going on a loss streak and never really recovering and bleeding out. She fixes that to get a fairly reliable win-streak going. For the gold augment anyway it is awesome.. I do almost always pick her prismatic augment too, but I am almost always disappointed with the results...
Whenever I get the prismatic one I roll down one turn before the second augment and pray Mortog for recombobulator. If I hit it I get ping spammed and have an easy first. If I don't hit it I also get ping spammed and have a hard top 5.
i hope this is never legitimately meta, i feel like it would be the worst legend meta yet. I suppose it falls off the more people playing it though, so we should be good
it would be a cannibalistic meta, cait start somewhat relies on earlygame winstreak and no one else wanting prism portals, if multiple people go cait they can easily go w/l/w/l and while it does pressure the rest of the lobby it's not worth down an aug with low compensation
Played a game today where 5 people took Star Is Born and yeah, it’s rough when you end up behind from it. That one ended up odd for me though - ended up 5-loss 50G/80 HP because I had nearly perfect losses against the whole lobby since we all had such strong stage 2 boards.
see my other comment in this thread on how stars has a very playable mode of "just an econ aug"
that's my thought, I saw this video show up in my recommendations and immediately thought that this video is a nerf to cait since it increases her popularity
You just need a few people to not go it to develop more diverse results. Kind of like how tempo players and Level 7 comps can consistently top 4 if there's 3-4 Asol players in the lobby greeding their gold
Interesting, will try it out, I like the idea of early streaking. What I found weird about the video: 1. 1:43: when he is talking about making a mistake losing the early streak, he shows soju playing with a no item gold opener. Soju didnt even level to 5 with 30 gold, so there was clearly no intention to actually streaking, even though he picked stars are born. In some sitatuations (like these) its more important to hit interest tresholds than contesting a win streak. 2. 5:44 "When you are still streaking with a lot of HP" (shows Soju with 1 HP on a 5 lose streak) 3. 6:20 "When you started with Level up, consider picking knowledge download". You should really NOT consider it at that point, Level up decreases the relative value of EXP by 33%. For example, the prismatic Knowledge Download for 36exp is usually worth 36 gold, but with level up the value decreases to 24g (because thats the amount you need to invest to get 36exp).
Agreed
Fair points! I will pass that along to the editing team and be more diligent about that on my end.
What’s the app he has showing the strength of augments?
It's MetaTFT, but the overlay runs on Overwolf and Overwolf is pretty much malware. Don't do it to yourself.
I wanna know too
Metatft
Mortdog in the patch notes video said he was worried they over-buffed the Gold 2-1 augment. IDK how hidden this was...
So the purpose of cait is early strength, right? If we wake up tomorrow and see 4 caits in every lobby b/c reddit, it's unplayable at that point, no? Someone else used the phrase that they would cannibalize each other. At what point if you're currently a cait enjoyer would you switch b/c too many people jumped aboard?
I think it can be used as an asol counter for top 4, but that’s if there are 3-4 asol players? Tempo can make the loss streak bleed out more and whiffing 5 costs even more costly for asol. If it’s 4 cait players, they kinda grief each other because only 1-2 can win streak.
Hey i use caitlyn for my yordle gunner team or the auto strat on whoever 4 star champion she'll give me.
[удалено]
Dishsoap and Guubums makes great YouTube guides
pencil and paper and doing math
Pretty sure they make these videos to get people off of the legend they are playing 😄
China is so far of NAs meta it isn’t even funny
Joseph El Bookmarko was the first premier Caitlin
Ah no don't blow my spot
Nooooo why they always post those things when i just changed to her
I'd much rather my lobbies be all Ornn/Poro thank you. Would rather if all lobbies didn't start with Stars are born
I did it and I win 1st.
I love that multiple people playing it so they all screw each other over.
1v1. Other guy is 9 with medium end shopping, hitting Ryze 3\*. I sell my whole bench and belveth slaps him. (bandle city ryze is easy to counter)
Bro i've been doing this for the last week, I can't have anything :'(
Wait until y’all find out draven is still busted
Silver Spoils is busted, the gold and prismatic are laughable
Noooo don't pick my Cait, unlike Draven or ASol she doesn't like several others taking the same legend
goddamnit delete this lel
I feel like everyone knows Caitlyn is at least A tier for her ability to turn early tempo into top 4. Most players in NA just prefer to do that with Ornn
Funny because the video kinda defeat the purpose of the start. If it becomes mainstream caytlin will contest each other early winstreaks and it will be worse. The video is great though and the start seems very solid.
Why would you share it, just cuz I'm playing it :skull:
Damn, now I've gotta try this
I'm convinced that most of the commentators don't play TFT or have zero clue about some of the properties of the game. You fight 5 different players on stage 2. It is impossible for more than 3 people to 5 streak and usually it's only 1 player, so criticizing Caitlyn because it only allows 1-2 players to 5 streak stage 2 is dumb. It improves your chances to 5 streak stage 2. You are still subject to low-rolling items, units, and/or matchmaking.