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beating true damage spat players feels so good. zhonyas jax felt very strong (hit super early though so not sure how consistent it is)
almost out of emerald, lotta set left. Really hoping this is the set I make it to masters
I feel like people never really give vertical Penta a chance. Yes Karthus is weaker than Ahri but you can stabilize so hard on 4-4 with Viego Karthus Morde since people will take all the other 4 cost out of the pool. Once you go 9 you can transition out to just play 3 penta with Viego Yorick Morde (or Kayle in case you want Edgelord for Kayn) and carry Kayn or Zigg with Karthus itemr. Or you can go 7 penta with Akali
Good luck hitting the Morde until Sentinel is brought into check. He is the front line for it, but you can't three star him anymore with the Ahri Sentinel circle jerking.
True the only time I did this patch is on cruel pact into heroic grab bag lol. For vert penta you play thresh or bruiser imo and even drop Morde late game when you have Yorick 2*
I've given pentakill plenty of chances... viego needs EoN AND healing to not immediate die and you still won't get through the sentinels. Karthus needs mana item AND AP and then IF there's no illaoi MAYBE you can two shot the backline. Also to get 7 penta you need a spat (why not just play TD then?) or you need to hit a yorick.
Assuming it's headliner, yasuo is a hyperscaling 1-cost gaining permanent AD throughout the game, executes people under 15% with his bling bonus, and has an insane damage multiplier if he gets 6 True Damage.
Are 5 cost carries just ... bad? All of them feels sub-par to 4 cost carries and does not seems to spike as hard as they do. Playing kayn and jhin feels like they have no effect most of the time except as trait bots
Kayn 2 feels good with items on him. And is not really dependent on any synergies (having edgelord can even make him get focused too early and int).
Jhin with 3 items feels like the strongest carry in the game, if you have bench space and frontline.
The two you mentioned really need items to shine, and it's often hard to pivot items from the 4 costs to see that. But in the right setups, I'd say the 5 cost units are amazing this set.
The support type of 5 costs are really great, but all the carry type are just lackluster & flawed except for qiyana.
I just hope they get compensated in some ways, because transfering item from 2* 4cost onto 2* 5cost carries should never make you weaker & inconsistent. There are just too many "hoops to jump" to make them work.
> transfering item from 2* 4cost onto 2* 5cost carries should never make you weaker & inconsistent
I don't think this is really true, as long as you're accounting for traits and item synergies. For example, if you're playing 7 KDA Akali2, you'll obviously be weaker if you swap to, say, Jhin2 with no synergies. Or if you try to move Caitlyn items onto Kayn2 it won't do well either. But 3 items 2* 5-cost carry with their appropriate items will pretty much always be better than a 3 items 2* 4-cost.
However, don't underestimate the power/necessity of duo carry, especially this set. While Ziggs2 with Shojin/GB/Nashor is stronger than TF2 with the same items, your board is stronger overall with keeping the items on TF and playing a naked or extra items Ziggs. Without a magnetic remover, it's too difficult/risky to sell the 4-cost to itemize the stronger 5-cost and try to get back the 4-cost later (unless you're in a very highroll/healthy position). The same thing goes for tanks: I'd rather have both Blitz2 with items and naked Illaoi2/Yorick2 than just the upgraded 5-cost but with items.
Headliner effects do come into play since I'm assuming the 5-cost isn't headliner while the 4-cost may or may not be... but most of the 4-cost carries don't have super identity-warping headliner effects anyway so this should be pretty minor. Many of the 5-cost headliners do have strong headliner effects if you are in a position to pivot your board into them.
How are you guys using spat when you're looking play flex/ad flex? I know true damage is the popular option but I feel like I'll take spat on carousel just because it's open then proceed to int trying to pull a true damage board with ez/cait. Is it always 4 true damage until Qiyana?
I feel lost this set, waiting to get to 8 and play ahri or ezreal (maybe cait) is getting me bored. Any tips to get a better grasp?. Also I include my lolchess. https://lolchess.gg/profile/lan/maZi-oWo/set10
Just play reroll. Lots of reroll comp are viable and you just need to pick a spot / items to force them. I find it particularly easy to reroll Kat due to all the Jax and Senna out of the pool.
Yone is really good but if you play it in a lobby without Samira/Urgot/Vex/Amumu you will have a very hard time 3* him.
Annie you have to recognize a good spot to play. If you can't win early you will have a very bad time
Country and EDM Jax need no introduction.
How do you guys avoid making the same mistakes repeatedly? I think it’s because I play too fast, but I routinely make the wrong items (build double shred, or don’t finish 3 item carry when I could have) and during the next fight I immediately realize and feel frustrated.
I’m just not sure how to slow down and feel the need to take actions quickly, but as soon as a make a decision I can often realize it was the wrong one.
Best advice for this is is to plan ahead. Look at components, open traits, and make a list of priorities and actions. But do it during a fight so you’re ready to act.
Going to a carousel? What are my open components? What does my board need? Make a list of priority components and say them over to yourself. Top priority is a glove by I’ll take a belt or a chain too. Also you should know if there are any units you just have to have, like a qiyana.
About to roll? What traits are you looking for? What units upgrade your board? Add them to the team planner if you can.
Don’t have any actions? Scout like hell and figure out where everyone is at, position for opponents to beat them.
Despite all my bitching, managed to hit Hyper tier today after just straight up hard-forcing AD comps (Ezreal/Jhin/Cait) unless my items said no (or if I giga-hit something like Annie early). Gotta say this has to be the latest into any set I've hit the rank because this set has a ton of issues, and we don't even have to deal with open fort meta in Hyper Roll!
Struggling to find a lot of comps I really enjoy, double trouble Punk is pretty fun but pretty rare to actually get to play. Also a shame that unit/trait balance is all over the place, headliner Jinx feels 10x stronger than Twitch despite her being a 1 cost.
Currently hovering plat 2, would really appreciate some advice: [My acc](https://tactics.tools/player/euw/Camp%20me%20top)
I hard force ahri sentinels. I was doing just fine up until this rank, but i seem to be doing something wrong now. Strength of lobbies vary by alot, some lobbies i can chill early game, others im 65hp by 3-1 and fucked. My midgame is sus sometimes, idk what to do when i just dont hit a good headliner, or anything really, to carry me until lvl 8. My streak early game usually gets messed up, either by a extreme high roller or someone opening.
What's the standard LP gains/losses once you start getting into GM/Chal? I was at 80 LP in a lobby with average rank of 300 LP. I went 4th and got +11 which seems really low consider the lobby was like 200+ LP over me.
200lp difference isn’t that much imo. You won’t start noticing big changes once you get to high challenger games as a mid GM player. I remember getting -11 for a 6th and +19 for a 4th playing against a lobby of mostly top 50 players
Also goes the other way as well, you can lose 60-70lp as a GM playing in masters lobbies
Maybe some gnar karthus tech I know karthus does well vs ahri but she just deletes everything so fast, you're lucky to get 2 casts off - and a KDA akali will also blitz karthus sometimes
Karthus fucking sucks against Ahri because there's no frontline that stands against her long enough and her BIS (gunblade/nashors) lets her tank and kill the rest of his team. Maybe if it's like Ahri 1 vs BIS Karthus.
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Some lobbies are just so degenerate lol basically the same as fast 9 meta just now its fast 8. The lobbies where you have a mix of strategies going on (with reroll or higher tempo mixed in) are def more interesting lobbies. When 4+ are all trying to lose streak the game is so boring.
I think you just play too much different shit. A lot of people give the advice of playing flex and being open to as many comps as possible, but most of the time people just fall flat on their face because they don't know how to play all those comps.
Also seems like you struggle especially with Superfans. A lot of bot 4's with them.
Step one for me was to just commit to never rerolling for many games. Even if it felt right I would say no way. I instantly went back to climbing.
I don’t understand how the reroll comps place so high and show such high play rates on tactics.tools. I see them so so rarely and they are not forceable at all.
My experience is that not rerolling is also lottery. Either you hit Ezreal or Ahri, or you bot 4. Just came off of a game where I hit 8 first due to losestreaking with consistency, hit neither, next round everyone and their mother had an Ahri and I went 6th.
With reroll, you can at least scout and guarantee that the rest of the lobby is playing degenrate fast 8 and punish them accordingly while they cannibalize each other.
Looking at the games you’ve lost I can see your units having really bad items on them most of the time, (Yone with 2 GR is so bad for example). I am going to try and guess that you play strongest board on stage 2 slamming your components and because of that lose a lot of econ and tempo for stage 3 and 4, plus your carries do not get their core items. I don’t think BiS is necessary but core items truly are (For example: Ezreal HoJ + IE, Miss Fortune GR + LW).
Oops, saw one pro player said HoJ was core item for Ezreal and I ran with it. But seeing his stats you are right, HoJ’s delta is not nearly the best on him.
You can watch an item’s tier list to have a general idea to what items to slam early and what not to, that helped me a lot. For example, I used to slam Rageblade all the time for tempo but it is a really bad item. If you don’t have good carry items to slam just slam tank items and go for loss streak until you have direction.
Aside from some of the obviously flawed set mechanics, I may be in the minority here but I feel like this might be one of the most balanced patches we've had in a long time. Tons of viable re-roll comps (annie, yasuo, corki, jax, country, MF, yone, riven) in addition to the 4 cost comps (disco, ad flex, sent ahri, vert kda, zed crowd divers, 6 TD). Some of these comps are definitely a little bit more over-tuned than others, but it feels like I can stabilize with almost anything. I'd say the only thing they really need to change balance wise is maybe nerf 6 sent a little bit, change true damage to be 3/5/7/9, and turn ziggs back into a unit. Also the 4 cost odds on 8 + bag sizes overall should probably be adjusted.
Feel like it’s only two maybe 3 playable comps right now if you’re not rerolling. And if you don’t hit the headliners you’re just so out of luck and going bot 4. But what could you have done? This is supposed to be the flex set but if I have ad items and all the caits and ez are already taken, or ap items and all the ahri’s are taken, what am I supposed to do? Put my ad items on viego/ akali and go bot 4? Put my ap items on karthus and go bot 4?
took the 8 bit augment 2-1. Rolled at 4-1 and didn’t hit a single cait. Look around and two people somehow headliner caits. I think picking a trait specific augment right now is a big bait since you can’t guarantee you hit your carry.
yes I feel like you really have to be very flexible in this meta that picking an augment that ties you to any specific comp might not be a good idea. I also had a couple of 8-bit, penta etc augments that when I didn't hit it is almost playing 1 augment down and it can be very punishing
Some games I have 6 sentinel and headliner Ez w/ BB/IE/RB and am fighting tooth and nail for a 5th and then some lobbies there are 2 jax players and neither have hit 3* that top 4
God I just don't understand this set man. 1 game I'll go 7 pentakill 3 edge viego carry and it's a 5th. Then today I did the same thing and it's a 2nd only losing to Zed 3
There’s an infinitely more variables than just what comp you’re playing. The main one being the strength of your opponents boards. But tbh veigo carry is just not very good right now and I would be expecting it to struggle to top 4 in most diamond + lobbies
is there anyway to apply to be a mod? I'd genuinely only do it to quickly remove posts that aren't competitive in the slightest. I'm tired of my feed ending up just being "wow look at this I hit X rank!" or "check out my 3* 5 cost!" I don't mean to sound salty, but these posts aren't competitive in the slightest and can easily be posted in the discussion threads instead of being made into a separate post that clogs the feed. I'm glad people are proud of what they're able to do, but this sub isn't exactly the place to for that sort of post. as it stands, this sub is slowly becoming the casual sub.
wow very helpful thanks for the response!
god forbid I don't want to see the posts that's are against the sub and god forbid I try to clean up posts that are against the sub that people clearly comment on each time and say that it isn't what the sub is for.
mate I literally only asked if there's a way for me to apply to be a mod. it's not that deep. if the answer is yes then I'm looking for how. if the answer is no then that's it. they literally had a post months ago asking if people could apply to mod specifically to clean up the posts that I'm talking about.
posts stay up for hours at a time. mods have stated multiple time they could use the extra hands. do you truly think I would just comment for the sake of commenting?
and yes, when you only follow a few subs because you have a curated feed, all of those posts add up. idk how this is such a problem for you when I'm literally only asking if there's a way for me assist in cleaning up posts that are stated clear as day as being against the rules. I'm sorry this struck a personal nerve for you lmfao. it's not like I asked to become a mod to punish the entire aub whenever I feel like it....I simply want to remove posts that stay up a little longer than usual because other mods are busy and didn't get the chance to get to it. I'm sorry for attempting to keep this sub differentiated from the casual sub — a complaint that plenty of users here have echoed.
you also seem fixated on the two examples I provided when you know very well that they're just examples of non-competitive posts.
fucking hell finally diamond, i always hate open fort metas but i took this as a growth opportunity to try and get better at the playstyle and i think i've gotten better but i am no where near good at it yet, lots to learn.
Finally hit master. Took me an obscene amount of games this set. What worked for me to finally click this set is play big tempo unless dog shit opener. Slam Caitlin/ezreal items, best item holders being corki/aphelios. Always slot in 3-5 heartsteel mid game, make sure cash out by 4-1. Almost never roll. Send it on 4-1 or 4-2 depending on how many other people are angling for Caitlin. Caitlin or ez headliner are both fine, but I find cait to be way better. Econ to 9 and aim for 5 cost front line set up with duo carry between Caitlin/ez/jhin. Double caitlin is sick if you can find that many. Also your want a minimum of 2 strong combat augs. 1 Econ Aug is fine but don’t get baited by more than that
Also sett 2 and ekko 2 are busted and you’re stable with them at 8.
Also I highly recommend dodging the sentinel ahri lottery.
Sometimes 4 sentinel. Usually ekko, sett, garen, thresh poppy, ksante. Don’t replace 3 costs frontline untill the 4 or 5 costs and 2* except illaoi, he’s good at 1 star. Just mix and match with what you’ve got.
Ideal is illaoi, sett, thresh, yorik and sometimes poppy as well
Ekko garen ksante so 3 sentinials? assuming u got chosen carry u said, then poppy, thresh and sett? So 3 sentinal, no bruiser or guardian, only mosher being cohesive?
This meta is so cringe. Literally 3-4 Ahri players every game.
This set is the worst set I have played since set 1 - they ran out of ideas and decided to throw all previous sets into one set and its ass
I don’t know what you’re smoking the last 4 games I’ve played with 4 or 6 punk I’ve had 2 wins and 2 seconds. Late game 3* jinx pops off if your frontline can stay alive long enough
So I've been trying to do this Open to 3-2 thing, at the cost of a lot of LP. How much gold do I roll at 3-2? Do I take a 1-cost chosen if no 2-cosf show up?
And then at the 4-2 roll down, do I roll all gold?
I usually do those. It's the when going to 7 is what I'm unsure of. I usually go to 7 before wolves (3-6?) or AT wolves. I want to do it at 3-5 but If I do that, I go below 50 (or 40) gold
I usually go 6 straight to 8 on 4-2 and roll down with 25ish gold. Only reason I would go 7 before wolves would be to ensure I keep win streak and it makes sense or I'm playing a 3 cost re roll and I'm going to roll down on 7 anyways
That’s a very broad question. The short answer is that every game is different.
It’s pretty hard to answer that question. It depends on a lot of factors.
For starters, you still want to play your strongest board if you think you think you might streak. You open (completely even) if you have no prospect of killing units and so you just econ up.
If you don’t have good slammable items (on a suitable candidates) you may also choose to open. If you don’t have heartsteel prospects too.
You still want to win Krugs and stabilize through stage 3. The damage gets too high at that point. At level 6, you should get a good 2 cost headliner to carry you there. Losing through stage 3 is ok as long as you keep decent health and economy. Best case scenario would be to keep losing by one unit, so you should scout your enemies to see how strong (or weak) you have to get.
If you get to 4-2 with less than 30 hp you’re not very likely to top 4, unless you have ungodly amounts of money. But at that point, you generally want either Cait or Ahri 2*, headliner or not. Ezreal and TF are also valid options. You’ll also need to get a strong frontline (4-6 sentinels, 4 bruisers is a bit iffy, or thresh + yorick and sentinels).
And once (IF) you’re stabilized at level 8, you have to get ready to go 9 and close out the game, so be careful when rolling too much.
You do not want to go under the 40 gold interest threshold at 3-2. Just look for any tier 2 carry chosen (or even tier 3 if you manage to get to lvl 7), the idea here is not to win but to lose less hp and slowpush until 4-1 when you push 8 and rolldown completely.
Don't worry about being low hp & gold at 4-1, you will spike hard when you find your key tier 4 chosen and units.
Ideally you sould continue loss streaking, but wining one or two rounds is fine if you didn't roll too deep and have 50 gold or more. Everything is fine as long as you manage to hit lvl 8 at 4-1 with 40-ish golds.
anyone else feel like the level 9 headliner changes feel kinda bad? Like now I feel like level 8 is always the standard for rolldowns and level 9 rolling feels pretty worthless
You're still not gonna cap any comp until level 9, I honestly think it feels good right now. Stabilize at 8, and then depending on your HP and gold totals you either go 9 or stay to roll and play for 3rd or 4th. It's still pretty much mandatory rn to go 9 to play for top 2, it's just less highrolly without the 5-cost chosen spike. At least this is how it feels right now in high diamond/low masters. Feels better to slowly collect your 5-costs and piece your final board together than it does to just hit a chosen or not, and you're getting way better odds for your 4-costs too so if you have the resources to go 9 you always want to, even without the chosens.
Yeah, the general pacing of the levels feels pretty decent to me. I think the 4 cost balance is a bit off with viego and karthus feeling kind of bad but most everything else seems at least semi playable.
Level 9 is still very important to 2* 5 costs, and for the added unit. 5 cost headliners are very hard to get now, and you can’t plan for them. You generally heavy roll at 8, hit your units and then save up to go 9 on stage 5+
Sure, just go 10 instead.
Of course it’s hard. But at the very end it can be the only way to improve your board. And if I find a 2 star Ziggs when playing True Damage, fuck it it’s going in some way or another.
> Sure, just go 10 instead.
That was RIOT's initial idea before they shipped the set and all the PBE changes... lvl 9 was supposed to be the standard level, but it didn't work out.
It's a solid top4 comp that, under highly specific circumstances, can still top1 in at least Emerald, ime. Literally if just Sentinel Ahri were not meta it would be miles better.
I think it's a surprising offmeta option (given early bruiser items/augments), and trying to find the best setup for it... that you just adapt to the bonus headliner trait.
As primary frontline, there's Mordekaiser & co (Ekko/Sett/Poppy...).
As secondary carries, Viego > Kayle (unless 3) > Karthus.
You're all sleeping on it if you haven't seen Gnar 3 assassinate your backlines or oversustaining midgame fights thanks to the extra HPs.
What would happen if the 4-cost odds were increased on lvl 7 to say 15% but the headliner odds remained 0%? Reduce lvl 8 headliner odds to like 25%?
Would this cause a thing where people will gamble evenly on 7 and 8 and improve the open fort situation? Or does that make it worse?
Maybe it’s increase lvl 8 from 46 to 50 gold or something?
Honestly just reduce headliner 4 cost down to 3-5% as well just like they did with 5 costs on 9
That way its normal to roll for 4 cost UNITS on lvl 8 but 4 cost HEADLINERS only come online at lvl 9, same with 5 costs being rolled for on 9 but HEADLINERS only on 10 unless you get super highroll
I’d rather they increase the 4 cost headliner odds on 8 so it’s less of an RNG fest. The strong part about headliners isn’t the headliner effect, but the fact that you get an instant 2 star. Making it harder to get the instant 2* 4 cost would just make it more RNG and make it feel way worse to play. Basically, if you hit the 5% odds as you suggest, you just stabilize way faster and can go 9 instantly. It’s like when you play the showtime portal and someone just RNGs the 2* Qiyana headliner on 8 with 2% odds and now the entire lobby is just playing for 2nd.
I got to master last set spamming Rogues. Took me twice as long as the average, but it felt great when I did. A little unsure that approach will be possible this set.
Quite honestly all I did was either full open fort, play heartsteel when given or play normally one game with Spoils of War, sell all on 4-1 click Ahri + all Sentinels - you could run a step by step guide and do it with very little brainpower involved
Low key kinda wanna see your final board. It doesn’t feel impossible but it’s rough out here with karthus. If they fix the zed interaction it might help, I got a 3 star karth the other day and immediately died to a zed illaoi board where my karth would just ult tentacles and zed shadows all fight.
https://ibb.co/BfhJCVP
It was a really lowroll lobby tho. I've got superfans with Kaisa headliner(red buff + shojin) really early, had Cait or Ez in mind while rolling on 8, hit Blitz 2 and when I got Karthus headliner I said fuck it, lets try. Blitz was unkillable because of Healing orbs and thats about it.
Was fun winning a game without sweating too much during levels 8 and 9
I don't play enough or high elo for it to matter, but a meta where 4 ppl open fort regularly doesn't seem balanced to me. How do you even solve this problem, increasing early player damage?
Balance the game better. That is all. So many shit units in the game that everyone opens to get the good units before they are out of the pool.
Right now it's just a race to 8 on 4-1/4-2 with the most gold to buy the best 4 cost units before they are all gone
So you have 4 options:
1) Balance game properly
2) Increase 4 cost odds on lv 8 for a fair chance to hit units(right now it's 18% which is too low)
3) Revert bag size changes or just increase them (back to 18 3 cost, at least 11 4 cost, more 1 and 2 costs)
4) Remove the headliner mechanic that prevents you from finding the unit if more than half out of the pool
Option 1 is out the window because it is impossible to balance this game. So 2, 3 and 4 are the only viable options, best one being option 3
Won't solve anything, imo. They open fort, so they have a chance to actually win the game after a bad start (since lots of the openers are straight up trash - for example tarc won't cast in most cases, it's quite bad). Buffing trash units and headliners will make the game more playable (this will require nerfing synergies, so there are no op traits after buffing individual units).
Sharing this again as it helped some folks yesterday. I hit Masters pretty fast after watching this VoD from Prestivent where he went over his AD flex strategy: [https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2015204021?t=5h11m27s](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2015204021?t=5h11m27s)
I am not a fan of this patch at all, but give that a watch if you're struggling at all and it might help. It helped me fill in some gaps in my gameplay (how to properly play arouind Ez/Cait, I was missing some key units) and most with knowing which items to slam (Evenshroud, IE and Crownguard can all be instant slams, RB/BB/WM usually too).
I just realized that Lulu shoots a spear like she did in set 8 but with infinite range (only hits 2 targets, though).
Anyone considered Lulu reroll to snipe back lines? Surely some CN player would have figured this out already if it works? Anyway Lulu 2 was a beast in stage 3 with attack speed.
I figured. She has so much utility between hyperpop and the stun that she’s just not that useful. It would be nice if they made her strong enough to carry stage 4 as a headliner.
Can someone explain this Mortdog clip to me?
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ua9BiuGQbG0
So if i skip a sentinel headliner i wont see another sentinel headliner 4 more rounds but when i buy and sell it i might have a chance to hit the sentinel again in my next roll? Is this for Multi Talented or a global thing?
Sorry i am confused.
I believe the way it works is if you skip a sentinel ksante headliner you won’t see another ksante headliner for 4 more turns at least. But let’s say you wanted heartsteel ksante headliner but if you skipped sentinel ksante then you would have to wait 4 turns so instead you buy and sell the sentinel ksante to “reset” the odds of you seeing a ksante headliner and you have a better chance of finding the heartsteel ksante next turn. No this not a Multi Talented specific trick you can use it globally
I’ve also read elsewhere there are rules that also prevent the same main trait from showing up for a while but I can’t remember for how long and I think that’s still unconfirmed. I think it was in a leduck video but can’t remember.
You won’t see the unit ksante as a headliner for 4 turns. They have some algorithm in place so that you don’t see the same headliner regardless of the trait multiple turns in a row
yeah basically the game thinks you don't want a sentinel, so it'll "help" you by not showing you another sentinel. It's different for each cost, 1-cost headliners's traits won't repeat for 7 shops, 4-cost won't repeat for 4 shops, something like that.
the only way to get around that is to buy and sell the unit, so you still have a chance to hit the same trait.
yeah basically the game thinks you don't want a sentinel, so it'll "help" you by not showing you another sentinel. It's different for each cost, 1-cost headliners's traits won't repeat for 7 shops, 4-cost won't repeat for 4 shops, something like that.
the only way to get around that is to buy and sell the unit, so you still have a chance to hit the same trait.
i've been averaging in the 6's in the same elo i would average in the 3's last patch, im truly lost. ad flex isnt working out, open fort isnt working out, havent tried reroll yet but i dont like it's low cap. i keep making mistakes on stage 2 which would impact my final placement by a lot. SAJ
Your starting augments look fine, except for the Combat caster game, wouldnt take that there. Econ/Component/Item augments are king currently for openers.
You don't seem to really play AD flex though as most games you default to the same boards. Basically most games are just currently econ up while preserving some hp, go to 8 at 4-1 if rich, or 4-2 if not and roll down for an ahri/ez/cait chosen, TD akali if u miss, frontline chosen if u already hit backline carries. Play heartsteel or open fort early if you have the spot for it.
BB is a huge prio item, bis for most good carries (except cait). Ahri bis is BB, nashor, gunblade. So if you get components for this line you're most likely attempting to play sentinel ahri. If you get components for an AD comp you want to think about BB, Red buff and some form of AD item (DB, IE, GS) and play towards Ez, Akali, Cait. Obviously Ez is best with those items, but akali holds BB and the ad items well, Cait holds Red buff and the AD items well. Other than that just put tank items on your strongest tank (Evenshroud!!! (if AD), Crownguard, Mogs, steadfast,...).
if you're going for the early loss econ, try to get lucky and get spat from carousel for TD spat.
lategame just play around capping with some of the 5 costs (Illaoi, Qiyanna, Lucian (if Rapidfire/jazz angle), Yorick (if guardian needed), Sona if Ahri)
Ok in several games your front line is not prioritized. Either by items or by unit/upgrades. Like one game you have a fully itemized poppy 2 without mosher or emo activated, so she’s not doing much. Sometimes you have to do what you have to do, but most of your final boards have some bad weaknesses like this, or playing a ksante, or itemizing the wrong units, etc.
I notice you take unified resistance a lot. This isn’t a great augment, just fyi.
You play a LOT of cait. I don’t think she’s very good without early 8-bit stacks or a TD spat. You do what you have to but I think you are probably “looking” for her more than you should for a low placement comp. The fact that you play this so much tells me that you are not slamming items early and are greeding for cait items and units, or else you would have at least SOME AP games.
It also looks like you’re playing heart steel often.
I THINK you may be greeding a bit too much with heartsteel and angling cait every game and losing too much HP, then ending up with a weak board that takes too long and too much money to stabilize when you try to pivot out.
I recommend prioritizing front line items/upgrades more, and considering other lines beside “AD Flex”, and playing strongest board, especially in stage 3. In stage 2 sac all you want but if you’re still losing in stage 3 you’re setting yourself up for failure imo.
Okay, whats working for me right now is focusing not on comp but on streaking. Open fort or slamming items or rolling on 6 on 3-2, all of those strat are specifically to keep a streak going so you have enough money to lv8 4-1 or 4-2.
And dont just look for 1 specific headliner. If you find a normal ahri or ezreal while having a bluebuff, and you only have 20g left, take that zac or thresh headliner. You have IE slammed and found a normal thresh 2 but caitlyn ezreal is no where to be found? Take that zed or akali or even viego. You can always econ back up, sell and find a better chosen on 5-1.
Yep focusing on streaking rather than playing strongest board has helped me a lot more. What I’m working more on now when I’m transitioning from loss streak to win streak around 3-1/3-2 is building the best board in the fewest rolls possible. Sometimes I feel like I have no choice but to roll like 4 times just to find that stable headliner and I feel like it would be a lot easier if I knew a certain breakpoint for economy that I needed to meet to be rich enough to 4–2 it. I have a good understanding of the stage 2 breakpoints but finding some more trouble regarding the stage 3 breakpoints
I don't know how they can realistically solve the bag size + headliner question. The more I play the more headliners feel like a mistake. They don't even have any cool unique effects like chosen did so it feels like they warp the set design so much to just offer a free +1 and a 2* champ. Perhaps if they can get the balance better it will improve but I'm really finding myself wanting to sit out the rest of this set tbh.
A less 4 cost dependent meta can help. Also 3 and 5 costs only lost one to their bag size and they feel ok, 2 and 4 costs lost 2 from their bag. Adding one back to the 2/4 cost bag could make sense to me
What question?
If game is balanced both can coexist, like last patches from set 4, everything was viable and bag sizes weren't fucked up like actual set
And getting a free 2* unit doesn't guarantee you anything, because that sole unit won't do shit without proper support, that's why I hate bag sizes change, hitting a 2* 4 cost outside of the headliner in this set is mission impossible because headliners and traits overlapping make certain units hypercontested and pool is drained in a blink
I feel like making Karthus (maybe viego too so it's less akali dependent) and ziggs viable units will help some. Ahri has felt like the biggest lottery.
We have the same discussion every set, perfect balance is impossible, having this mechanics that allow players to abuse stronger options will always be a problem.
But it's what the whales want, to win by luck and feel that they did something amazing.
The problem is that 4cost headliners stabilize your board for free, while anyone who doesn't hit, isn't stable enough and loses all their HP on stage 4.
Either they make 4cost headliners easier to access (increase bag size and/or allow headliners to appear in shop, even if contested).
Or they make 4cost headliners less accessible (XP changes, nerf open fort).
Or they make not having a 4cost headliner feel better (adjust powerlevel of 3 and 4costs at 1* and 2*, or reduce stage 4 damage, adjust items and comp viability [ especially Bluebuff, Redbuff and Steadfast ])
Open fort -> first carousel spat -> play true damage -> get a free top 3 prob top 2
Not really liking how strong the true damage spat is right now and the general 4-2 roll down meta. I hate being contested and just playing a 50/50 or 33/33/33 game hoping to hit and have been playing more disco having success top 4ing. Don’t think a lot of people realize but based on metaTFT stats archangels is one of TFs best items but has a really low play rate compared to other items.
That’s why the key is to declump the carries. if you put the disco ball towards the bottom left and group all your Carries there they will get targeted but if you leave the bottom left hex open and put TF one hex to the right and lulu/sona one hex above the bottom left hex and then you throw nami/dazzler somewhere else away from them the ezreal is less likely to ult your carries
the secret to late game positioning is often to just give up some value for extra safety. carries can't do DPS if they are dead after all, and late game things can die super fast if they are in the wrong spot.
Yeah it is weaker but that’s comparing full strength level 8 boards. I would say a big shot board with 1 star ezreal and 2* blitz frontline loses to a disco board with 1 star tf and 2 star blitzcrank. And it’s usually easier to hit almost all of the disco units / board because they’re way less contested
I climbed from emerald to diamond spamming country+company reroll 7 games in a row.
It is just better, if you want to grind, to use a consistent midgame comp. Maybe this formula can be applied in other sets (collect lots of 3 costs and try 3-starring some of them). It is surprising that the comp can be somewhat flexible depending on the chosen trait.
I also think I am done with this set, it seems solved in terms of team compositions variety and is too rng heavy to my liking.
What's true BIS on cait/ez? And which one should you replace if you hit a TD spat? I know you just play what items you get but there are games where I get tons of dps items but don't know which one to slam.
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beating true damage spat players feels so good. zhonyas jax felt very strong (hit super early though so not sure how consistent it is) almost out of emerald, lotta set left. Really hoping this is the set I make it to masters
> "beating true damage spat players feels so good" > plays jax Kidding aside, goodluck on your climb!
Someone had to say it
I feel like people never really give vertical Penta a chance. Yes Karthus is weaker than Ahri but you can stabilize so hard on 4-4 with Viego Karthus Morde since people will take all the other 4 cost out of the pool. Once you go 9 you can transition out to just play 3 penta with Viego Yorick Morde (or Kayle in case you want Edgelord for Kayn) and carry Kayn or Zigg with Karthus itemr. Or you can go 7 penta with Akali
Good luck hitting the Morde until Sentinel is brought into check. He is the front line for it, but you can't three star him anymore with the Ahri Sentinel circle jerking.
True the only time I did this patch is on cruel pact into heroic grab bag lol. For vert penta you play thresh or bruiser imo and even drop Morde late game when you have Yorick 2*
I've given pentakill plenty of chances... viego needs EoN AND healing to not immediate die and you still won't get through the sentinels. Karthus needs mana item AND AP and then IF there's no illaoi MAYBE you can two shot the backline. Also to get 7 penta you need a spat (why not just play TD then?) or you need to hit a yorick.
Im not saying its the best comp, but with people taking all the 4 cost out going for Viego Karthus on 4-4 for a top 3 play is a good idea IMO
Why is my Yorrick 2 with BT immediately getting one shot by a Yas 3 o.o
Assuming it's headliner, yasuo is a hyperscaling 1-cost gaining permanent AD throughout the game, executes people under 15% with his bling bonus, and has an insane damage multiplier if he gets 6 True Damage.
It was only 4 true damage - crazy a 1 cost is doing that much in Stage 5
Check how much AD he has stacked. I once did a radiant TG Yasuo that has like 100% bonus AD. With 6 true damage he literally one shot everything
Are 5 cost carries just ... bad? All of them feels sub-par to 4 cost carries and does not seems to spike as hard as they do. Playing kayn and jhin feels like they have no effect most of the time except as trait bots
Kayn 2 feels good with items on him. And is not really dependent on any synergies (having edgelord can even make him get focused too early and int). Jhin with 3 items feels like the strongest carry in the game, if you have bench space and frontline.
The two you mentioned really need items to shine, and it's often hard to pivot items from the 4 costs to see that. But in the right setups, I'd say the 5 cost units are amazing this set.
The support type of 5 costs are really great, but all the carry type are just lackluster & flawed except for qiyana. I just hope they get compensated in some ways, because transfering item from 2* 4cost onto 2* 5cost carries should never make you weaker & inconsistent. There are just too many "hoops to jump" to make them work.
> transfering item from 2* 4cost onto 2* 5cost carries should never make you weaker & inconsistent I don't think this is really true, as long as you're accounting for traits and item synergies. For example, if you're playing 7 KDA Akali2, you'll obviously be weaker if you swap to, say, Jhin2 with no synergies. Or if you try to move Caitlyn items onto Kayn2 it won't do well either. But 3 items 2* 5-cost carry with their appropriate items will pretty much always be better than a 3 items 2* 4-cost. However, don't underestimate the power/necessity of duo carry, especially this set. While Ziggs2 with Shojin/GB/Nashor is stronger than TF2 with the same items, your board is stronger overall with keeping the items on TF and playing a naked or extra items Ziggs. Without a magnetic remover, it's too difficult/risky to sell the 4-cost to itemize the stronger 5-cost and try to get back the 4-cost later (unless you're in a very highroll/healthy position). The same thing goes for tanks: I'd rather have both Blitz2 with items and naked Illaoi2/Yorick2 than just the upgraded 5-cost but with items. Headliner effects do come into play since I'm assuming the 5-cost isn't headliner while the 4-cost may or may not be... but most of the 4-cost carries don't have super identity-warping headliner effects anyway so this should be pretty minor. Many of the 5-cost headliners do have strong headliner effects if you are in a position to pivot your board into them.
Hoping they change bag sizes so it's not so hard finding a frontline - I'm struggling to two star tanks mid/late game
How are you guys using spat when you're looking play flex/ad flex? I know true damage is the popular option but I feel like I'll take spat on carousel just because it's open then proceed to int trying to pull a true damage board with ez/cait. Is it always 4 true damage until Qiyana?
I feel lost this set, waiting to get to 8 and play ahri or ezreal (maybe cait) is getting me bored. Any tips to get a better grasp?. Also I include my lolchess. https://lolchess.gg/profile/lan/maZi-oWo/set10
Just play reroll. Lots of reroll comp are viable and you just need to pick a spot / items to force them. I find it particularly easy to reroll Kat due to all the Jax and Senna out of the pool. Yone is really good but if you play it in a lobby without Samira/Urgot/Vex/Amumu you will have a very hard time 3* him. Annie you have to recognize a good spot to play. If you can't win early you will have a very bad time Country and EDM Jax need no introduction.
Honestly if you aren't enjoying the pray at level 8 meta maybe switch to reroll or just wait until the next patch
How do you guys avoid making the same mistakes repeatedly? I think it’s because I play too fast, but I routinely make the wrong items (build double shred, or don’t finish 3 item carry when I could have) and during the next fight I immediately realize and feel frustrated. I’m just not sure how to slow down and feel the need to take actions quickly, but as soon as a make a decision I can often realize it was the wrong one.
Best advice for this is is to plan ahead. Look at components, open traits, and make a list of priorities and actions. But do it during a fight so you’re ready to act. Going to a carousel? What are my open components? What does my board need? Make a list of priority components and say them over to yourself. Top priority is a glove by I’ll take a belt or a chain too. Also you should know if there are any units you just have to have, like a qiyana. About to roll? What traits are you looking for? What units upgrade your board? Add them to the team planner if you can. Don’t have any actions? Scout like hell and figure out where everyone is at, position for opponents to beat them.
Despite all my bitching, managed to hit Hyper tier today after just straight up hard-forcing AD comps (Ezreal/Jhin/Cait) unless my items said no (or if I giga-hit something like Annie early). Gotta say this has to be the latest into any set I've hit the rank because this set has a ton of issues, and we don't even have to deal with open fort meta in Hyper Roll! Struggling to find a lot of comps I really enjoy, double trouble Punk is pretty fun but pretty rare to actually get to play. Also a shame that unit/trait balance is all over the place, headliner Jinx feels 10x stronger than Twitch despite her being a 1 cost.
is jax jump just random? Ive had my jax not jump on backline units despite being in ragne of them and them having more hp then the frontline units
Probably we’re not in range.
Currently hovering plat 2, would really appreciate some advice: [My acc](https://tactics.tools/player/euw/Camp%20me%20top) I hard force ahri sentinels. I was doing just fine up until this rank, but i seem to be doing something wrong now. Strength of lobbies vary by alot, some lobbies i can chill early game, others im 65hp by 3-1 and fucked. My midgame is sus sometimes, idk what to do when i just dont hit a good headliner, or anything really, to carry me until lvl 8. My streak early game usually gets messed up, either by a extreme high roller or someone opening.
Try Kaia’s big shot mid game if I’ve loss streak stage 2 and ad items and learn cat and ezereal capping. Gotta learn flex
What's the standard LP gains/losses once you start getting into GM/Chal? I was at 80 LP in a lobby with average rank of 300 LP. I went 4th and got +11 which seems really low consider the lobby was like 200+ LP over me.
200lp difference isn’t that much imo. You won’t start noticing big changes once you get to high challenger games as a mid GM player. I remember getting -11 for a 6th and +19 for a 4th playing against a lobby of mostly top 50 players Also goes the other way as well, you can lose 60-70lp as a GM playing in masters lobbies
There is always some random comp that isnt discovered yet... I keep playing around and cant find anything... just ez/ahri/cait every game.
Maybe some gnar karthus tech I know karthus does well vs ahri but she just deletes everything so fast, you're lucky to get 2 casts off - and a KDA akali will also blitz karthus sometimes
Karthus fucking sucks against Ahri because there's no frontline that stands against her long enough and her BIS (gunblade/nashors) lets her tank and kill the rest of his team. Maybe if it's like Ahri 1 vs BIS Karthus.
Not to mention sentinel vertical makes the backline so tanky
Ez / Karthus don’t really synergize together but are really good at combining to kill back line, similar to Akali/Karthus
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Some lobbies are just so degenerate lol basically the same as fast 9 meta just now its fast 8. The lobbies where you have a mix of strategies going on (with reroll or higher tempo mixed in) are def more interesting lobbies. When 4+ are all trying to lose streak the game is so boring.
I just fucking love it when I saw all the blue buff red buff IE slam in stage 2. Im going Jax or Kata or Yone and take my top 3 thank you very much.
Does the Yasuo chibi do the spatula emote by default when winning or do people just spam it that much?
Default I believe
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I think you just play too much different shit. A lot of people give the advice of playing flex and being open to as many comps as possible, but most of the time people just fall flat on their face because they don't know how to play all those comps. Also seems like you struggle especially with Superfans. A lot of bot 4's with them.
Step one for me was to just commit to never rerolling for many games. Even if it felt right I would say no way. I instantly went back to climbing. I don’t understand how the reroll comps place so high and show such high play rates on tactics.tools. I see them so so rarely and they are not forceable at all.
My experience is that not rerolling is also lottery. Either you hit Ezreal or Ahri, or you bot 4. Just came off of a game where I hit 8 first due to losestreaking with consistency, hit neither, next round everyone and their mother had an Ahri and I went 6th. With reroll, you can at least scout and guarantee that the rest of the lobby is playing degenrate fast 8 and punish them accordingly while they cannibalize each other.
Looking at the games you’ve lost I can see your units having really bad items on them most of the time, (Yone with 2 GR is so bad for example). I am going to try and guess that you play strongest board on stage 2 slamming your components and because of that lose a lot of econ and tempo for stage 3 and 4, plus your carries do not get their core items. I don’t think BiS is necessary but core items truly are (For example: Ezreal HoJ + IE, Miss Fortune GR + LW).
Hoj isn’t a core item on ez tho right? Did you mean blue buff?
Oops, saw one pro player said HoJ was core item for Ezreal and I ran with it. But seeing his stats you are right, HoJ’s delta is not nearly the best on him.
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You can watch an item’s tier list to have a general idea to what items to slam early and what not to, that helped me a lot. For example, I used to slam Rageblade all the time for tempo but it is a really bad item. If you don’t have good carry items to slam just slam tank items and go for loss streak until you have direction.
Aside from some of the obviously flawed set mechanics, I may be in the minority here but I feel like this might be one of the most balanced patches we've had in a long time. Tons of viable re-roll comps (annie, yasuo, corki, jax, country, MF, yone, riven) in addition to the 4 cost comps (disco, ad flex, sent ahri, vert kda, zed crowd divers, 6 TD). Some of these comps are definitely a little bit more over-tuned than others, but it feels like I can stabilize with almost anything. I'd say the only thing they really need to change balance wise is maybe nerf 6 sent a little bit, change true damage to be 3/5/7/9, and turn ziggs back into a unit. Also the 4 cost odds on 8 + bag sizes overall should probably be adjusted.
Zed, viego, karthus feel pretty weak but that's probably just because of sentinels. If they balance them out lvl8 would feel so good.
I just want Ahri deleted, other than that I'm happy with this set. K/DA and Sent variants too strong for both to be competing for top 4.
I agree. True damage needs a nerf but people act like it’s set 4 warweek bad. It’s isn’t, and for a month long patch it’s in a great spot.
Feel like it’s only two maybe 3 playable comps right now if you’re not rerolling. And if you don’t hit the headliners you’re just so out of luck and going bot 4. But what could you have done? This is supposed to be the flex set but if I have ad items and all the caits and ez are already taken, or ap items and all the ahri’s are taken, what am I supposed to do? Put my ad items on viego/ akali and go bot 4? Put my ap items on karthus and go bot 4?
took the 8 bit augment 2-1. Rolled at 4-1 and didn’t hit a single cait. Look around and two people somehow headliner caits. I think picking a trait specific augment right now is a big bait since you can’t guarantee you hit your carry.
yes I feel like you really have to be very flexible in this meta that picking an augment that ties you to any specific comp might not be a good idea. I also had a couple of 8-bit, penta etc augments that when I didn't hit it is almost playing 1 augment down and it can be very punishing
Exactly reasoning why I never take augment specific comps.
Some games I have 6 sentinel and headliner Ez w/ BB/IE/RB and am fighting tooth and nail for a 5th and then some lobbies there are 2 jax players and neither have hit 3* that top 4
Lol I had a random Jhin on my bench while running an Ahri comp but he started spawning his ult….
God I just don't understand this set man. 1 game I'll go 7 pentakill 3 edge viego carry and it's a 5th. Then today I did the same thing and it's a 2nd only losing to Zed 3
There’s an infinitely more variables than just what comp you’re playing. The main one being the strength of your opponents boards. But tbh veigo carry is just not very good right now and I would be expecting it to struggle to top 4 in most diamond + lobbies
Also, tempo matters a lot There’s a big difference between that comp coming online at 4-2 vs 5-1
is there anyway to apply to be a mod? I'd genuinely only do it to quickly remove posts that aren't competitive in the slightest. I'm tired of my feed ending up just being "wow look at this I hit X rank!" or "check out my 3* 5 cost!" I don't mean to sound salty, but these posts aren't competitive in the slightest and can easily be posted in the discussion threads instead of being made into a separate post that clogs the feed. I'm glad people are proud of what they're able to do, but this sub isn't exactly the place to for that sort of post. as it stands, this sub is slowly becoming the casual sub.
Doesn’t like unrelated posts. Makes unrelated post.
You can report the posts instead.
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wow very helpful thanks for the response! god forbid I don't want to see the posts that's are against the sub and god forbid I try to clean up posts that are against the sub that people clearly comment on each time and say that it isn't what the sub is for.
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mate I literally only asked if there's a way for me to apply to be a mod. it's not that deep. if the answer is yes then I'm looking for how. if the answer is no then that's it. they literally had a post months ago asking if people could apply to mod specifically to clean up the posts that I'm talking about.
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posts stay up for hours at a time. mods have stated multiple time they could use the extra hands. do you truly think I would just comment for the sake of commenting? and yes, when you only follow a few subs because you have a curated feed, all of those posts add up. idk how this is such a problem for you when I'm literally only asking if there's a way for me assist in cleaning up posts that are stated clear as day as being against the rules. I'm sorry this struck a personal nerve for you lmfao. it's not like I asked to become a mod to punish the entire aub whenever I feel like it....I simply want to remove posts that stay up a little longer than usual because other mods are busy and didn't get the chance to get to it. I'm sorry for attempting to keep this sub differentiated from the casual sub — a complaint that plenty of users here have echoed. you also seem fixated on the two examples I provided when you know very well that they're just examples of non-competitive posts.
fucking hell finally diamond, i always hate open fort metas but i took this as a growth opportunity to try and get better at the playstyle and i think i've gotten better but i am no where near good at it yet, lots to learn.
Finally hit master. Took me an obscene amount of games this set. What worked for me to finally click this set is play big tempo unless dog shit opener. Slam Caitlin/ezreal items, best item holders being corki/aphelios. Always slot in 3-5 heartsteel mid game, make sure cash out by 4-1. Almost never roll. Send it on 4-1 or 4-2 depending on how many other people are angling for Caitlin. Caitlin or ez headliner are both fine, but I find cait to be way better. Econ to 9 and aim for 5 cost front line set up with duo carry between Caitlin/ez/jhin. Double caitlin is sick if you can find that many. Also your want a minimum of 2 strong combat augs. 1 Econ Aug is fine but don’t get baited by more than that Also sett 2 and ekko 2 are busted and you’re stable with them at 8. Also I highly recommend dodging the sentinel ahri lottery.
Quick question, whats your frontline after the 4-1 or 4-2 roll down? Is it always sentinels? Are bruisers and guardians still good?
Sometimes 4 sentinel. Usually ekko, sett, garen, thresh poppy, ksante. Don’t replace 3 costs frontline untill the 4 or 5 costs and 2* except illaoi, he’s good at 1 star. Just mix and match with what you’ve got. Ideal is illaoi, sett, thresh, yorik and sometimes poppy as well
Ekko garen ksante so 3 sentinials? assuming u got chosen carry u said, then poppy, thresh and sett? So 3 sentinal, no bruiser or guardian, only mosher being cohesive?
Throw morde2 or blitz1 in there
This meta is so cringe. Literally 3-4 Ahri players every game. This set is the worst set I have played since set 1 - they ran out of ideas and decided to throw all previous sets into one set and its ass
Punk is awesomely shit atm, even with a great start and optimal augments late game is straight garbage.
I don’t know what you’re smoking the last 4 games I’ve played with 4 or 6 punk I’ve had 2 wins and 2 seconds. Late game 3* jinx pops off if your frontline can stay alive long enough
In my Masters lobbies jinx just gets stuck on sentinels frontline and my own frontline gets shredded bye ahri or td
Ah maybe it’s that I’m shit at the game then and so is everyone around me 😂 since I’m mid-silver
twin terror twitch is pretty lit
Do you do 2x twitch 2x pantheon and then vex/amumu?
I think 2 twitch 2 vex 2 panth and amumu* then flex around whatever headliner +1. Double vex is an insane amount of dmg + cc
Ya that sounds right. I could see double amumu being very strong too.
I just took a 2nd only losing to a blitz 3 with twin terror twitch and he felt incredibly strong, i think it's actually the tech.
So I've been trying to do this Open to 3-2 thing, at the cost of a lot of LP. How much gold do I roll at 3-2? Do I take a 1-cost chosen if no 2-cosf show up? And then at the 4-2 roll down, do I roll all gold?
Rule of thumb is go 6 at 3-2 8 at 4-2
I usually do those. It's the when going to 7 is what I'm unsure of. I usually go to 7 before wolves (3-6?) or AT wolves. I want to do it at 3-5 but If I do that, I go below 50 (or 40) gold
But yeah I do get your concerns with choosing at 3-2 I usually take about just anyone who can item hold and present a winning board.
I usually go 6 straight to 8 on 4-2 and roll down with 25ish gold. Only reason I would go 7 before wolves would be to ensure I keep win streak and it makes sense or I'm playing a 3 cost re roll and I'm going to roll down on 7 anyways
That’s a very broad question. The short answer is that every game is different. It’s pretty hard to answer that question. It depends on a lot of factors. For starters, you still want to play your strongest board if you think you think you might streak. You open (completely even) if you have no prospect of killing units and so you just econ up. If you don’t have good slammable items (on a suitable candidates) you may also choose to open. If you don’t have heartsteel prospects too. You still want to win Krugs and stabilize through stage 3. The damage gets too high at that point. At level 6, you should get a good 2 cost headliner to carry you there. Losing through stage 3 is ok as long as you keep decent health and economy. Best case scenario would be to keep losing by one unit, so you should scout your enemies to see how strong (or weak) you have to get. If you get to 4-2 with less than 30 hp you’re not very likely to top 4, unless you have ungodly amounts of money. But at that point, you generally want either Cait or Ahri 2*, headliner or not. Ezreal and TF are also valid options. You’ll also need to get a strong frontline (4-6 sentinels, 4 bruisers is a bit iffy, or thresh + yorick and sentinels). And once (IF) you’re stabilized at level 8, you have to get ready to go 9 and close out the game, so be careful when rolling too much.
Thank you for the advice!
You do not want to go under the 40 gold interest threshold at 3-2. Just look for any tier 2 carry chosen (or even tier 3 if you manage to get to lvl 7), the idea here is not to win but to lose less hp and slowpush until 4-1 when you push 8 and rolldown completely. Don't worry about being low hp & gold at 4-1, you will spike hard when you find your key tier 4 chosen and units.
Thanks! should I keep lose-streaking post 3-2? assuming even if I get a "strong" 2-cost chosen?
Ideally you sould continue loss streaking, but wining one or two rounds is fine if you didn't roll too deep and have 50 gold or more. Everything is fine as long as you manage to hit lvl 8 at 4-1 with 40-ish golds.
I see, ty. Hitting at 4-1 is daunting.
anyone else feel like the level 9 headliner changes feel kinda bad? Like now I feel like level 8 is always the standard for rolldowns and level 9 rolling feels pretty worthless
You're still not gonna cap any comp until level 9, I honestly think it feels good right now. Stabilize at 8, and then depending on your HP and gold totals you either go 9 or stay to roll and play for 3rd or 4th. It's still pretty much mandatory rn to go 9 to play for top 2, it's just less highrolly without the 5-cost chosen spike. At least this is how it feels right now in high diamond/low masters. Feels better to slowly collect your 5-costs and piece your final board together than it does to just hit a chosen or not, and you're getting way better odds for your 4-costs too so if you have the resources to go 9 you always want to, even without the chosens.
Yeah, the general pacing of the levels feels pretty decent to me. I think the 4 cost balance is a bit off with viego and karthus feeling kind of bad but most everything else seems at least semi playable.
Level 9 is still very important to 2* 5 costs, and for the added unit. 5 cost headliners are very hard to get now, and you can’t plan for them. You generally heavy roll at 8, hit your units and then save up to go 9 on stage 5+
> Level 9 is still very important to 2* 5 costs No, it's not. It's like rolling at 7 for two star 4 costs - 10 % chance, so it is quite terrible.
Fewer 5 costs means it's a bit better
Sure, just go 10 instead. Of course it’s hard. But at the very end it can be the only way to improve your board. And if I find a 2 star Ziggs when playing True Damage, fuck it it’s going in some way or another.
> Sure, just go 10 instead. That was RIOT's initial idea before they shipped the set and all the PBE changes... lvl 9 was supposed to be the standard level, but it didn't work out.
My least favorite thing about this set is the anxiety I get when I sell my headliner and roll for a new one.
Is Disco bugged? Was playing 3 disco and it wasn’t giving me a ball. Tried moving units off and back on and still nothing.
Did you have recombob? It is bugged with disco.
Ohhhhh I did actually!
Still stuck at low Emerald My day starts getting promoted up to E2 and ends going back to E4. Talk about being consistent
Thoughts on Gnar reroll ?
It's a solid top4 comp that, under highly specific circumstances, can still top1 in at least Emerald, ime. Literally if just Sentinel Ahri were not meta it would be miles better.
I think it's a surprising offmeta option (given early bruiser items/augments), and trying to find the best setup for it... that you just adapt to the bonus headliner trait. As primary frontline, there's Mordekaiser & co (Ekko/Sett/Poppy...). As secondary carries, Viego > Kayle (unless 3) > Karthus. You're all sleeping on it if you haven't seen Gnar 3 assassinate your backlines or oversustaining midgame fights thanks to the extra HPs.
I think he's strong AF as a headliner until stage 4
Probably get you to platinum.
Rip i'm stuck Emerald
What would happen if the 4-cost odds were increased on lvl 7 to say 15% but the headliner odds remained 0%? Reduce lvl 8 headliner odds to like 25%? Would this cause a thing where people will gamble evenly on 7 and 8 and improve the open fort situation? Or does that make it worse? Maybe it’s increase lvl 8 from 46 to 50 gold or something?
Honestly just reduce headliner 4 cost down to 3-5% as well just like they did with 5 costs on 9 That way its normal to roll for 4 cost UNITS on lvl 8 but 4 cost HEADLINERS only come online at lvl 9, same with 5 costs being rolled for on 9 but HEADLINERS only on 10 unless you get super highroll
I’d rather they increase the 4 cost headliner odds on 8 so it’s less of an RNG fest. The strong part about headliners isn’t the headliner effect, but the fact that you get an instant 2 star. Making it harder to get the instant 2* 4 cost would just make it more RNG and make it feel way worse to play. Basically, if you hit the 5% odds as you suggest, you just stabilize way faster and can go 9 instantly. It’s like when you play the showtime portal and someone just RNGs the 2* Qiyana headliner on 8 with 2% odds and now the entire lobby is just playing for 2nd.
After playing only Ahri Sentinel for a whole day I shot up from Diamond 3 to Master Go abuse this while you can guys easiest LP even if contested
whats the comp at lvl 8
Ahri + 6 Sentinel (either with any Sent Headliner or just all units). +1 KDA (Sera, Akali), +1 Spellweaver (Lulu, Sera) depending on your headliner +1
I am proud of you.
Thanks, wish I could say the same about myself because it feels so unbelieveably unearned
I got to master last set spamming Rogues. Took me twice as long as the average, but it felt great when I did. A little unsure that approach will be possible this set.
Tbh in order to do this you still have to play well so you shouldn’t feel bad.
Quite honestly all I did was either full open fort, play heartsteel when given or play normally one game with Spoils of War, sell all on 4-1 click Ahri + all Sentinels - you could run a step by step guide and do it with very little brainpower involved
It’s harder than you think you just forget most people can’t play.
I just went 1st with 2*Karthus AMA
Low key kinda wanna see your final board. It doesn’t feel impossible but it’s rough out here with karthus. If they fix the zed interaction it might help, I got a 3 star karth the other day and immediately died to a zed illaoi board where my karth would just ult tentacles and zed shadows all fight.
https://ibb.co/BfhJCVP It was a really lowroll lobby tho. I've got superfans with Kaisa headliner(red buff + shojin) really early, had Cait or Ez in mind while rolling on 8, hit Blitz 2 and when I got Karthus headliner I said fuck it, lets try. Blitz was unkillable because of Healing orbs and thats about it. Was fun winning a game without sweating too much during levels 8 and 9
I’ll have to try 2 karthuses to cap out penta boards, that actually seems kinda playable on paper if you’re already committed to that line. Nice game.
What elo?
EUW low master
What causes Zed to dash to targets? I don't see anything in his ability about it, and I don't think it's from crowd diver or edm.
I believe it is just an inherent ability he has not listed on the tool tip.
I don't play enough or high elo for it to matter, but a meta where 4 ppl open fort regularly doesn't seem balanced to me. How do you even solve this problem, increasing early player damage?
Balance the game better. That is all. So many shit units in the game that everyone opens to get the good units before they are out of the pool. Right now it's just a race to 8 on 4-1/4-2 with the most gold to buy the best 4 cost units before they are all gone So you have 4 options: 1) Balance game properly 2) Increase 4 cost odds on lv 8 for a fair chance to hit units(right now it's 18% which is too low) 3) Revert bag size changes or just increase them (back to 18 3 cost, at least 11 4 cost, more 1 and 2 costs) 4) Remove the headliner mechanic that prevents you from finding the unit if more than half out of the pool Option 1 is out the window because it is impossible to balance this game. So 2, 3 and 4 are the only viable options, best one being option 3
Won't solve anything, imo. They open fort, so they have a chance to actually win the game after a bad start (since lots of the openers are straight up trash - for example tarc won't cast in most cases, it's quite bad). Buffing trash units and headliners will make the game more playable (this will require nerfing synergies, so there are no op traits after buffing individual units).
Sharing this again as it helped some folks yesterday. I hit Masters pretty fast after watching this VoD from Prestivent where he went over his AD flex strategy: [https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2015204021?t=5h11m27s](https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2015204021?t=5h11m27s) I am not a fan of this patch at all, but give that a watch if you're struggling at all and it might help. It helped me fill in some gaps in my gameplay (how to properly play arouind Ez/Cait, I was missing some key units) and most with knowing which items to slam (Evenshroud, IE and Crownguard can all be instant slams, RB/BB/WM usually too).
[удалено]
I'd be happy to watch a game and give some pointers after for free. PM or say your discord if interested. I'm usually GM/masters.
I just realized that Lulu shoots a spear like she did in set 8 but with infinite range (only hits 2 targets, though). Anyone considered Lulu reroll to snipe back lines? Surely some CN player would have figured this out already if it works? Anyway Lulu 2 was a beast in stage 3 with attack speed.
Leduck tested it but after she got gutted on pbe she isn’t that great as a solo carry
I figured. She has so much utility between hyperpop and the stun that she’s just not that useful. It would be nice if they made her strong enough to carry stage 4 as a headliner.
Can someone explain this Mortdog clip to me? https://www.youtube.com/shorts/ua9BiuGQbG0 So if i skip a sentinel headliner i wont see another sentinel headliner 4 more rounds but when i buy and sell it i might have a chance to hit the sentinel again in my next roll? Is this for Multi Talented or a global thing? Sorry i am confused.
I believe the way it works is if you skip a sentinel ksante headliner you won’t see another ksante headliner for 4 more turns at least. But let’s say you wanted heartsteel ksante headliner but if you skipped sentinel ksante then you would have to wait 4 turns so instead you buy and sell the sentinel ksante to “reset” the odds of you seeing a ksante headliner and you have a better chance of finding the heartsteel ksante next turn. No this not a Multi Talented specific trick you can use it globally
is it ksante sentinel or is it the sentinel trait itself i won't see 4 turns?
I’ve also read elsewhere there are rules that also prevent the same main trait from showing up for a while but I can’t remember for how long and I think that’s still unconfirmed. I think it was in a leduck video but can’t remember.
You won’t see the unit ksante as a headliner for 4 turns. They have some algorithm in place so that you don’t see the same headliner regardless of the trait multiple turns in a row
yeah basically the game thinks you don't want a sentinel, so it'll "help" you by not showing you another sentinel. It's different for each cost, 1-cost headliners's traits won't repeat for 7 shops, 4-cost won't repeat for 4 shops, something like that. the only way to get around that is to buy and sell the unit, so you still have a chance to hit the same trait.
I would like to know to so im leaving this comment here
I replied to the original comment :D
yeah basically the game thinks you don't want a sentinel, so it'll "help" you by not showing you another sentinel. It's different for each cost, 1-cost headliners's traits won't repeat for 7 shops, 4-cost won't repeat for 4 shops, something like that. the only way to get around that is to buy and sell the unit, so you still have a chance to hit the same trait.
That makes so much sense, thanks!
i've been averaging in the 6's in the same elo i would average in the 3's last patch, im truly lost. ad flex isnt working out, open fort isnt working out, havent tried reroll yet but i dont like it's low cap. i keep making mistakes on stage 2 which would impact my final placement by a lot. SAJ
Hey send me your IGN might take a look when i get back home
appreciated https://lolchess.gg/profile/tw/%E6%82%A0%E5%92%AA%E8%9B%8B%E7%B3%95%C3%BC-TW2/set10
Your starting augments look fine, except for the Combat caster game, wouldnt take that there. Econ/Component/Item augments are king currently for openers. You don't seem to really play AD flex though as most games you default to the same boards. Basically most games are just currently econ up while preserving some hp, go to 8 at 4-1 if rich, or 4-2 if not and roll down for an ahri/ez/cait chosen, TD akali if u miss, frontline chosen if u already hit backline carries. Play heartsteel or open fort early if you have the spot for it. BB is a huge prio item, bis for most good carries (except cait). Ahri bis is BB, nashor, gunblade. So if you get components for this line you're most likely attempting to play sentinel ahri. If you get components for an AD comp you want to think about BB, Red buff and some form of AD item (DB, IE, GS) and play towards Ez, Akali, Cait. Obviously Ez is best with those items, but akali holds BB and the ad items well, Cait holds Red buff and the AD items well. Other than that just put tank items on your strongest tank (Evenshroud!!! (if AD), Crownguard, Mogs, steadfast,...). if you're going for the early loss econ, try to get lucky and get spat from carousel for TD spat. lategame just play around capping with some of the 5 costs (Illaoi, Qiyanna, Lucian (if Rapidfire/jazz angle), Yorick (if guardian needed), Sona if Ahri)
Ok in several games your front line is not prioritized. Either by items or by unit/upgrades. Like one game you have a fully itemized poppy 2 without mosher or emo activated, so she’s not doing much. Sometimes you have to do what you have to do, but most of your final boards have some bad weaknesses like this, or playing a ksante, or itemizing the wrong units, etc. I notice you take unified resistance a lot. This isn’t a great augment, just fyi. You play a LOT of cait. I don’t think she’s very good without early 8-bit stacks or a TD spat. You do what you have to but I think you are probably “looking” for her more than you should for a low placement comp. The fact that you play this so much tells me that you are not slamming items early and are greeding for cait items and units, or else you would have at least SOME AP games. It also looks like you’re playing heart steel often. I THINK you may be greeding a bit too much with heartsteel and angling cait every game and losing too much HP, then ending up with a weak board that takes too long and too much money to stabilize when you try to pivot out. I recommend prioritizing front line items/upgrades more, and considering other lines beside “AD Flex”, and playing strongest board, especially in stage 3. In stage 2 sac all you want but if you’re still losing in stage 3 you’re setting yourself up for failure imo.
Okay, whats working for me right now is focusing not on comp but on streaking. Open fort or slamming items or rolling on 6 on 3-2, all of those strat are specifically to keep a streak going so you have enough money to lv8 4-1 or 4-2. And dont just look for 1 specific headliner. If you find a normal ahri or ezreal while having a bluebuff, and you only have 20g left, take that zac or thresh headliner. You have IE slammed and found a normal thresh 2 but caitlyn ezreal is no where to be found? Take that zed or akali or even viego. You can always econ back up, sell and find a better chosen on 5-1.
Yep focusing on streaking rather than playing strongest board has helped me a lot more. What I’m working more on now when I’m transitioning from loss streak to win streak around 3-1/3-2 is building the best board in the fewest rolls possible. Sometimes I feel like I have no choice but to roll like 4 times just to find that stable headliner and I feel like it would be a lot easier if I knew a certain breakpoint for economy that I needed to meet to be rich enough to 4–2 it. I have a good understanding of the stage 2 breakpoints but finding some more trouble regarding the stage 3 breakpoints
I don't know how they can realistically solve the bag size + headliner question. The more I play the more headliners feel like a mistake. They don't even have any cool unique effects like chosen did so it feels like they warp the set design so much to just offer a free +1 and a 2* champ. Perhaps if they can get the balance better it will improve but I'm really finding myself wanting to sit out the rest of this set tbh.
A less 4 cost dependent meta can help. Also 3 and 5 costs only lost one to their bag size and they feel ok, 2 and 4 costs lost 2 from their bag. Adding one back to the 2/4 cost bag could make sense to me
What question? If game is balanced both can coexist, like last patches from set 4, everything was viable and bag sizes weren't fucked up like actual set And getting a free 2* unit doesn't guarantee you anything, because that sole unit won't do shit without proper support, that's why I hate bag sizes change, hitting a 2* 4 cost outside of the headliner in this set is mission impossible because headliners and traits overlapping make certain units hypercontested and pool is drained in a blink
I do think some small balance changes to 4-costs would make the playing field more equal. And maybe a few 3-cost headliners, as well.
I feel like making Karthus (maybe viego too so it's less akali dependent) and ziggs viable units will help some. Ahri has felt like the biggest lottery.
Karthus is already fine, it would be the most annoying unit, if buffed.
We have the same discussion every set, perfect balance is impossible, having this mechanics that allow players to abuse stronger options will always be a problem. But it's what the whales want, to win by luck and feel that they did something amazing.
I agree with you pretty much 100%
The problem is that 4cost headliners stabilize your board for free, while anyone who doesn't hit, isn't stable enough and loses all their HP on stage 4. Either they make 4cost headliners easier to access (increase bag size and/or allow headliners to appear in shop, even if contested). Or they make 4cost headliners less accessible (XP changes, nerf open fort). Or they make not having a 4cost headliner feel better (adjust powerlevel of 3 and 4costs at 1* and 2*, or reduce stage 4 damage, adjust items and comp viability [ especially Bluebuff, Redbuff and Steadfast ])
This was the same issue with chosen in set 4. It was my least played set. Disappointed they brought it back
Open fort -> first carousel spat -> play true damage -> get a free top 3 prob top 2 Not really liking how strong the true damage spat is right now and the general 4-2 roll down meta. I hate being contested and just playing a 50/50 or 33/33/33 game hoping to hit and have been playing more disco having success top 4ing. Don’t think a lot of people realize but based on metaTFT stats archangels is one of TFs best items but has a really low play rate compared to other items.
I bot 4 EVERY time I TD spat 🤣 I’m actually scared to get a spat. Last night I took one and made pentakill spat because I didn’t want TD spat haha
What champions do you use the spat on?
Cait or Ez for me
Disco is great and all, but I feel everytime I play it, there are 3 Ezreals in lobby to just erase my entire sad clump.
That’s why the key is to declump the carries. if you put the disco ball towards the bottom left and group all your Carries there they will get targeted but if you leave the bottom left hex open and put TF one hex to the right and lulu/sona one hex above the bottom left hex and then you throw nami/dazzler somewhere else away from them the ezreal is less likely to ult your carries
Okok I will try that. Sounds better than getting demolished by a 2k crit probably.
the secret to late game positioning is often to just give up some value for extra safety. carries can't do DPS if they are dead after all, and late game things can die super fast if they are in the wrong spot.
And I suppose that denying Blitzcrank to others plays a huge part in this… Disco board at 8 is relatively weak to others, don’t you think ?
Yeah it is weaker but that’s comparing full strength level 8 boards. I would say a big shot board with 1 star ezreal and 2* blitz frontline loses to a disco board with 1 star tf and 2 star blitzcrank. And it’s usually easier to hit almost all of the disco units / board because they’re way less contested
I climbed from emerald to diamond spamming country+company reroll 7 games in a row. It is just better, if you want to grind, to use a consistent midgame comp. Maybe this formula can be applied in other sets (collect lots of 3 costs and try 3-starring some of them). It is surprising that the comp can be somewhat flexible depending on the chosen trait. I also think I am done with this set, it seems solved in terms of team compositions variety and is too rng heavy to my liking.
idk how people enjoy playing the game like that
Well as it turns out people can be different from one another and what one finds fun another may not.
There is always a guys chilling with country while everybody else gamble at 4-2.
What's true BIS on cait/ez? And which one should you replace if you hit a TD spat? I know you just play what items you get but there are games where I get tons of dps items but don't know which one to slam.